Lani: Authenticity as an In-Betweener

allowing herself to grow. Lonnie and I met back in about two thousand seventeen while I was performing a solo piece and she was photographing the event. When you see Lonnie, she's like one of the coolest people in the room kind of thing. She is not that tall, but feels tall, you know, like she's got that energy that's super tall, super present. She's tattoos on her arms, on her legs, she's got a couple of face tattoos. Even the moment I got off stage, she came up to me and

introduced herself. I make friends very easily because I'm willing to just say, hey, I like you, we should be friends. And I have literally said that to adults. In the last year, probably in the last month. You were one of the first people who I met who was just like super direct. Yeah, and I like to give that. I love giving a compliment to somebody on the street. There's so much joy in that, and it's free, and

we can just be loving and kind to people. I was just like, WHOA, this person just lives very authentically, or at least that's what I perceived even early on. I think sometimes we think of confident people and loving and outgoing people and we don't necessarily consider everything that's led them to that place. And some of the most

brilliant lights have been through the darkest times. Something that jumps out to me is Lonnie not only dealt with a lot of outward forces of perception, but she was also often unseen and had to make decisions for herself in order to move forward in her own life. No one was going to save her. You're going to hear things from her youth, from her teenage years, and her adulthood and all the things that have made her who she is in her strength, her power, and her joy.

Just as a warning, we are going to talk about abuse and sexual violence. Briefly in this episode, So please take care of yourself the way you need to. Welcome to When You're Invisible. My name is Maria Fernande. In today's world, we love to tell stories about people who have reached the top, like people who have achieved positions of cloud wealth power. On this show, I won't be doing that. When You're Invisible is my love letter to the working class and others who are seemingly invisible in

our society. Helped to build a community here that will inspire you to have generous conversations with others that are different from you, conversations that might help you see life in an entirely different way. What was young Lonnie like? Where did she come from? This is like an incredible, full human who has this pursuit of authenticity with kindness and generosity that I'm like, what was the origin? My grandparents on my mother's side are Southern Baptist Christian missionaries.

My mother she was in Korea from the time she was four until she was fourteen with my grandparents. She was the oldest of six. They adopted to have Korean boys. Then they came back to the States and she went back at twenty four and was there from thirty four. She's white. The background is like Irish Scottish, but she was raised with so much Korean culture, spoke Korean fluently.

She was a midwife and Korea. She worked with expats there, She dated Korean men, and she got pregnant with me at eight and had me at twenty nine, and she knew the person that she was having me with was not going to be a part of my life in that way. They had dated whatever casually. I think I'm like a diet for him. Fail I expeculate this is what happened. No, I think she told me at some point.

I just don't remember for sure. I could be wrong, but anyways, she didn't put him on the birth certificate. She knew that it was not going to be something that was okay in his world. It was a very big deal that I wasn't going to be fully Korean and that he had gotten a white woman pregnant. Basically, and still to this day, there's only one person that knows about me in his world, one person in forty years wild that's it. Have you met his sister? Have you met him? I have met him. He has children

that are probably late teens, early twenties. Now he got married later, so you know, it was weird. I was like, how am I supposed to grow up and look like anybody? Because there's nobody that looks like Race played a huge part in my life, Like, right off the back, had I been Korean, it might have been very different, right. It was a very big deal that I wasn't going to be fully Korean and that he had gotten a white woman pregnant basically, and so did you grow up

in Korea? So I lived there till I was about six. Then we moved to d C. And we lived there for a couple of years. My mom had a boyfriend there. I traveled all over Asia as a kid. I had an incredible childhood in the sense that I lived so many places before I was even ten years old. I got to see so many different cultures. I got to see true poverty and be a part of life in such a different way than we live it in America.

I got to see like a dentist on the side of the street in Pakistan doing dental work and that was just normal. And I was left alone a lot to like play and imagine, and I wasn't heavily guarded. I just did ship, and that's something I feel like we miss out on as children here because of like safety concerns and this and that. So I got to live in Hawaii on a farm. I got to live in Pakistan during the Gulf War. It was that like. I was there with my grandparents. They were on a mission.

It was beautiful. I remember the way that the lightning would hit the mountains and they would all light up. I got to see really incredible things. I can't speak for all people. I just know that I don't believe in going to other countries and telling them that their culture and their religion is wrong and that they're going to go to hell, you know what I mean. It's their job. That was their job, and they believed deeply

and passionately about it. Do I agree with how I got there or why I was there, No, of course not. Even as a small child, it was very confused by all of it. I would get left with my grandparents for three months at a time, which is unusual at seven eight years old, and I think with all of that ability to travel and see the world, I'm grateful for in some ways, but it also left me with the desire first stability, a home base. I have never

lived in a place for more than three years. To this day, I've lived in New York for eleven years, but I have never lived in one dwelling, one space for more than three years. So having that experience as a kid, whether it was changing schools constantly, having to make new friends constantly, which all gave me personality traits that I have today, I relate to that a lot

because I spent summers with my family in Mexico. My parents would ship us partially because they are like, we don't know about our visa situation, so if you ever had to leave with us to go to Mexico, we don't want you completely fish out of the water struggling. So I spent time in Mexico, and then we moved from Ithaca. And in Ithaca we had three different spaces, so I was there until always seven. We moved around three times and then always apartments, and then when we

moved to Minneso, it was another three homes. And then I moved to New York, and then in New York, I've had like how many places, which is an adult right? As an adult, it's insane and so like something to me, I've always been like grateful for like the ability to have seen some of the world in a different way, But there's a feeling of being more of a nomad

than having roots. And I think there's also for us, there was a lot of financial insecurity, and so even though there was a lot of travel, some of it was work for my mom, some of it was childcare for my mom, And I think that anxiety that she felt definitely came down to me too. And at some point she built her business in Seattle and she's done actually really well for herself now and it's amazing to see.

But yeah, I think that definitely affects that feeling of like are we going to be okay versus just we know we're okay. And I think that that has played and does play into how we manage money and live

our lives as adults. Remember travel, laying as an adult for the first time and only being able to like afford ninety nine cent bread and tomatoes for nutrition, and being in hostile and then realizing I'm like my parents made it seem like we were super stable and like we had spam sandwiches every single day of the road. Trip and cereal. My grandmother was notorious for stealing like bread and having a jar of nutella in her purse.

I remember one time I was thirteen, we were in Amsterdam and we split one piece of pizza between the three of us, and then my grandma had this packet, like the sugar packet of like soup with hot water. Yeah. Getting to talk to Lonnie about our economic situations felt really good because there's some similarities between our upbringings that

I haven't really vocalized too many people before. Both of us also relate on the facts that depending on where we were, our race was perceived differently and our ethnicity was perceived differently. Honestly, we wouldn't have thought about our race the way we do had it not been for other people putting their perceptions on us. So just thinking about it too, I'm like, you grew up with like your white side of the family, and then they were from the South Mobile Alabama, So what is that like

being biracial with that? The race thing is weird because it's both sides. Like I was rejected from my Korean side and then I was fetishized and sexualized and abused by my white side. For my Korean side. My grandfather fetishized half Korean kids, so that was a thing. So I do not speak to anybody on that side of my family except for my mother. At this point in my life. I want to take a moment to acknowledge

the fact that Lonnie does mention her abuse. We don't get into it, and I think it's important sometimes to give people the space not to dwell on it. We're just going to allow it to breathe and just acknowledge that it's part of the fabric of who she's become as a person, and ultimately she's connecting it back to how she perceived her identity around race. It's really interesting because I don't feel my race here in New York City super often, like I just exists amongst our people.

There's a lot of mixed people in different ways and capacities here, But when I travel in the flyover States, I do feel it more. But I felt it most heavily as a child, and I didn't have the tools or anybody working with me as to why I was different and why I felt the way I felt and why people were talking to me the way they were. I also recognize, like the huge amount of privilege I

have in many intersections. Yes, I'm not a percent white, and I definitely don't look white passing in any capacity, but I'm also not black, and I'm also not dealing with a lot of those stereotypes that are so insidious in our culture. But as a kid, it was like, we're did you get her? My mom would be like where do you think? You know? But like, I look nothing like my mom. I'm darker than my mom and my dad, Like I just came out like a little brown I don't know, well, yeah, so toasty side up.

And then you know, being in the South, like what is she Mexican? You know, like people just wanting to know what I was and you know why I was with them, So you know, in that way, yes, I was treated differently than my cousins. And eventually, you know, that all came out at some point when I was about fifteen, and that's why there's a huge divide in our family and I don't speak to you know. And then I was very confused and thought that I was just going to grow out of my little brown body

and hair, and I would draw pictures. I really thought that I was going to grow up and like I was going to be like a blonde, green eyed teenager, you know, because nobody really talked to me about it. And then I ended up in public school, which was so good for me, you know. I was able to

have a variation of people again. And we lived in a predominantly Native American not predominantly Native American, but a lot more Native and Indigenous people than in most parts of the country right in Seattle, and so I would school a lot of Native kids, and like I was very Native passing, that was what people assumed when I

was younger, more so than Asian. And so then that felt good to just have people that looked like me around and my representation because again, remember it was early nineties, late eighties, there was nothing on TV that looked like me. There was nothing on a magazine that looked like me. My like little cousin got like a Hawaiian barbie and was like, oh my god, it looks like you. That

was my first moment of representation. Representation is super important, it's necessary, and then there's the lifestyle of being constantly like doing the work internally, but like even representations, when you think about a child and how they mimic behavior and then we as adults, like you were saying, with bias, we place our bio or what we even think is possible. You know when you look at like docmic Stuffin's the

Little Black Doctor. Yes, you know what I mean, and like the difference and how many little girls decided they might want to be doctors because of that TV show. There's just crazy statistics to show that when we show women and women of color or people of color in roles that they don't usually see, then they start to see themselves in those roles and start thinking I've got shows, start thinking it's possible to do some of these things.

And I also just love the idea of just having representation in fantasy worlds and also where we don't have to talk about our struggles. We can just succeed or we can live out these crazy lives. And getting to talk to Lonnie about representation helped remind me of how much we make those choices for ourselves and that we can decipher what others are saying and be like, yeah, that's what you think, but this is who I am. And I'm really lucky to have met Lonnie I did.

It's incredible to be her friend, not only because we get to explore ourselves in a safe space, but also because she's constantly on a journey and going through a lot and so open with where her life is today. So we'll talk about how she is as an adult in this present moment. After this break and we're back, I'm pregnant. I'm like burping. I keep thinking I'm going to cry. You are building and creating another human being, and even if you weren't. As you all heard, Lonnie

is pregnant after a very difficult miscarriage last year. She's having a baby boy, and with that comes a lot of joy, but also some complicated emotions. I'm really in tune with my body, you know. I've had a lot of health stuff that I think makes me even more like in body mind awareness. It took me a while to get did about the pregnancy, which surprised me, especially after having a miscarriage. I was like, Oh, why am I not over the moon? You're really wanted to get

through this summer. We got married, this summer, his mom passed this summer. It was just a lot, and I was sick, like I wanted a little bit more time with my partner before stepping into this next spot. You know, but I also believe in the magic that is whatever is happening is happening, and that's okay. But it's like you're human being who had plans and ideas, and I think that's something too, to like allow space for so much. I do want to talk about your Only Fans and

all of that into for those who don't know. Only Fans is this app that started off for artists to post behind the scene footage for their followers and then eventually became or always was, in tandem, an app for sex workers to share their work and create a following in subscription base. Lonnie's Only Fans is pretty spicy and sixy you are mom, You are an incredible woman, and like this is also a world that you wouldhabit and that I think not a lot of people talk about

that intersection. Yeah, and it's so like weird because like I like how to Creampie and got pregnant? Come on, right, it's so weird, like we literally have sex to make babies and then all of a sudden, you make a baby and you're supposed to like not be sexualized, but then you better keep having sex with your husband or else, you know, like this weird fucking thing. Right. We started the Only Fans last year and I stay a week because he was definitely helping behind the scenes for me.

And we did it because I thought I was pregnant and I was like, let's make some money. I've been toying around with the idea for a long time, so we did and it was really fun, and then it was hard when I had the miscarriage and like keeping up with it, but I like dropped off when I got pregnant. This time, it's a lot of work, right, and I love making making content, but there's all the other steps like editing and posting and you know, and

then I still have another job and other responsibilities. And then if I'm not feeling sexy or sexual or whatever, it gets harder emotionally to get into that headspace and create that content and do that work. Wow, that isn't really interesting to think about, yeah, because it's like it is emotional labor in a big way that I don't know that I realized before the sex work I had done previous too Only Fans was I danced my way

through photo school, so I was a stripper. I just like weird foot fetish porn before I was even eighteen. Not so healthy situation. That was like literally like recording stuff and putting on VHS tapes, building an HTML site and the mailing people there VHS tapes like that just dated me. I love how Lonnie talks about her sex work and her sexuality and everything under the sun in regards to that. Because I grew up Mexican Catholic, which means it's super conservative, we may or may not talk

about sex. My sex talk was sex as fund but only with the person you marry, and kind of implied that the person I should marry should be a man, and so like that was it. While that's changed, I realized there was a lot of difficulties when it came to learning how to love and respect your body and its own pleasure, and it wasn't something that was ever

talked about, especially for women. Hearing Lonnie talk about how she enjoys her work and the work she's done, and the way she talks about all of this so matter of factly is super free. I grew up very sheltered. Oh yeah, I was on the run. What is that like? I don't know anything other than that, right, so like I was out of the house at fourteen and then back for a minute, and then I left at fifteen or sixteen with my thirty year old boss from Seattle

to Florida. My mom has like a going away party for me, like by I was like, okay, looking back, it's very bizarre. She's sorry. I mean, like she does some work too, right, but yeah, And that was super controlling and definitely abusive and definitely staged for a rape to We were like living with his mom. We moved his mom to Florida, and she was like, okay with this teenage child that wasn't I wasn't allowed to drive

or have a job. We lived in this like cul de sac in Florida, and I didn't leave that cul de sac for like a year, So what made you leave? He and I moved to South Beach and I could get a better paying job than he could, as like a cocktail server, and so I saved up. I knew I wanted to leave. One night, he got drunk enough that he like actually hit me, and he hadn't hit

me before. But I knew a cop and I was able to call that cop and they put him in holding for three days, which gave me time to move out of the apartment, and I got my first apartment in South Beach under someone else's I D and then worked at Opium, like a big nightclub, as a bottle service girl under somebody else's I D. Wow. I was a mess. I ended up in rehab more than once. It was rough, but I like, you know, my childhood was rough, like it was beautiful in some ways, but

it was also like really dark. Even at a young age, Lonnie was able to make really important decisions to move her life forward and herself out of bad situations, and I admire her for that, and so it makes sense to me as an adult woman now, I was scratching for anything to fill the void and make me feel whole. I remember that first rehab journey at nineteen and the counselor being like, if you don't fix your ship with men, you're never gonna stay sober, and I was like, fuck you.

And it took a long time. I don't have a part in the abuse, but I have a part in figuring out how to heal the parts of me that want and seek out the abuse, if that makes sense. After that, I saw myself getting to another relationship that wasn't necessarily abusive but was still controlling. You know. I was like, wow, I'm lying constantly. Two people, please to prevent discord, to keep the peace. I like, not just two men to friendships in every part of my life.

And I was like, WHOA. Then, like I swung really hard the other way, and we're talking about that brutal honesty, Like I got kind of brutal. I was honest, but without any kid gloves, without any like ability to see what was appropriate. But in doing so, I started to like really honor myself and see, like what the fund

do I want? What do I like? I started realizing, like, if I get rejected right and I've showed up as my whole self, that's such a blessing because it's not about like me not being good enough for great or whatever. It just means that they know something about themselves and they see something in me that they know isn't a good fit. Awesome, cool, how great? Oh? I sincerely very

much relate to what you're saying. I'm not for everybody, but my whole life before that I needed men to be like it makes not like vomit, but like she's like girl from material. She's wife the material. I needed to be seen as like the prize, the one that you like, work hard to get and whatever, you know, And you know, I shifted and contorted and twisted myself in ways to make myself that and then was miserable in that role. I was like, why am I doing everything? Ye?

Why am I doing everything? You are drowning me. But I literally asked for that. I literally set it up, like, look at me, I'm fucking superwoman. I'm gonna do everything in my current relationship. I'm like, I'm doing shit, I'm tired, I'm pregnant. What are you doing? And I know, like you saying that you're still a generous person doesn't mean

you don't show up and do the work. Oh of course, it's just you're like, I'm also acknowledging the realities of my boundaries and my abilities, yeah, and my desires, Like I feel like cooking tonight, I don't feel like cooking tonight. I don't force myself out of some stereotype that I'm supposed to, which I did for fucking years of my life. I did things I didn't want to do, seemingly nice things, loving things that I did not want to do. I was resentful. I was angry. Yeah, you know, and I

I don't do that now. This morning, I was like, if I finished loading the dishwasher, I'm going to be late. I will come up. I said, Hey, can you finish loading the dishwasher before you leave? Okay? Bye? I love you? You know what I mean, Like I didn't take that extra step. I completely connect with Lonnie on this point because it's something I've had to learn and untangle, and

it's partially due to culture. Right for me, I feel like the expectations and the layers placed on women, both on my Mexican side and the American side I have been so clear and we don't always think about the walls we put up in order to be loved, but that ultimately make us invisible. I'm thirty nine right now, like this should hit me like last year. Not only is Lonnie growing and discovering her boundaries in her personal life, but she's also thinking about what her work life looks like.

She is also a photographer, and she's worked with Playboy, She's worked at Fashion Week and various others. She built an incredible career in her twenties and thirties and is now reflecting on that. I love photography, don't get me wrong, right, but I also had so much of my self identity and ego came through my work. I had this hustle in to work because it was what I wanted people to see in me. And now I'm a good friend, right, I'm a loving partner. I take an ability for myself.

What do I care about if you saw I did this shoot for this brand like American culture, and like the identifying with your career so huge, and then you are also very talented at what you did or do that, plus your work ethic got you to where you were. But then it's yeah, there's a whole world outside of that.

Like my brother this weekend, I saw him and I was like, very overwhelmed with all the work I was doing, and he was like, I just want you to know you can get off this train at any point in time and you can get on a bike and ride through a field and that will be just as valuable. And I was like, this is so important and so beautiful.

And I think as women, as women color, as Americans, as all of these added layers of trying to prove yourself ends up feeding into some sort of external especially capitalistic Western perception of valid having success young and having a lot of commercial success. And I might still be on that train had I not needed major surgery in two thousand and sixteen. I have something super rare called

appropriate spinal my colonists super rare. It's in the like movement disorder family, which is like Parkinson's is a movement disorder. It's not degenerative, so it's not something that I have to worry about getting worse and worse like Parkinson's or MS. But it's not coming from the brain like epilepsy. So I was undiagnosed for ten years and in and out of hospitals trying to figure it out. I have a lot more control over it now. I would say that my body was so dangerous for me to live in.

It grounded me. I don't mean grounded in like this beautiful, earthy way. I just mean like I was no longer allowed to fly. Um, you know, it was like, sit your ass down, you're not doing anything. Because it's a chronic condition, she has to make sure she's doing little things every day to manage it. So it includes eating well, making sure that she's getting enough rest and things like stretching every day and knowing how much weight to carry

on her when she's out and about. Because there was such a break in my career, I would have had to work really hard to get back to where I was at after a few years of being home. There's nothing wrong with it, and it's beautiful and I'm glad I did it for all the years they did it. I love a lot of the things they did. I also see a lot of the things I did and how stereotypical they are to like body stuff and all

of the things. Right, But I want to do something that means something to me now as who I am today, and this going back to the only fans thing, and I'm trying to decide what I want to do about that right now. I always thought that I would want to make pregnancy porn, like I think pregnant women are so hot. I do not feel how. I do not feel sexy, I do not feel in my body. It was something I feared about motherhood, was losing my sexual identity and also all the repercussions with society about my

sexual identity as a mother. Yeah, like I'm curious as to how do you reconcile that internally and then to have something that's like such a public forum of it, and then now how you're perceiving yourself and then wondering how the world perceives you. There's stuff. It's terrifying. I think what I want to do is, well, haven't announced my pregnancy online. We want to find a fun way

to do it. But I really want to start making content and start talking about this stuff, you know, and that like vulnerability hangover is so real and so big. I wanted to ask. We've talked about a little bit of like the craziness of perception and then needing to be seen. When do you feel most seen? Currently? Right now, I think I feel most seen with my closest people.

My partner is very good at hearing me and seeing me and not having to fix it or me and just holding speed for I have a wild set of emotions right now. I'm like everything is like Toddler big, feeling like I feel very seen by our couple's therapists and she'll point things out and that is really good for me. My closest friendships, those are the places where I feel perceived accurately, and I feel like that's really

lacking on my social media. I feel like there's very little depth of who I actually am there, and I want to be brave and show that more. Lonnie speaks of this dissonance between social media and the self, and it's also surprising because me, myself, I got caught up in the I think this is, you know, a solid presentation of a part of Lonnie, and she was like, no, it's actually still a watered down version of even that

side of me. This is a good reminder of what it means to look at someone's content and also what it means to actually look at the person when I post that miscarriage thing at the miscarriage video was my partner's letter to the baby that we had lost. Because I have mostly a male following, so a lot of men reached out and shared their grief and their experience, and you know, we don't really hold a lot of space for men in those ways. I think something about

you is you're very accepting of all people. More. When we come back from a break, welcome back to the show. Lonnie is about to become a melf with a baby, and she's excited and so confident and leads with so much intentionality. It's been great to get to talk to her about what the future looks like to her and what it means to be a mother and what kind of mother she wants to be with her full range

of humanity. How do you feel like as a woman who has experienced abuse and not great situations with men, how does that factor in when you raise him? I think the biggest component to that is how me and his dad interact. We have a very healthy relationship. I'm very grateful I waited this long to have a baby. Yes, I love him, Yes he's great because he's very cute.

But at the end of the day, even when things are hard, we are not unkind or abusive, and so I think that starts out with the way he sees us interact, even if we choose not to stay together in a romantic capacity. I really do believe that he and I both have the capacity as people individually to show up and be kind and loving and be each other's friends. And I think it's impossible for me not to want to talk about everything with him as it

becomes aga appropriate. And also big stuff is like starting off with his own body autonomy, like he doesn't have to kiss anybody, or hug anybody, or or be held by anybody. Even as an infant. A baby can lean towards you and tell you that they want to be held or not held, and we don't respect that. And we can also with me, Hey, this is my body. I don't want to be touched right now. I love you. We can kiss and cuddle and whatever in a little while.

Right now, Mommy doesn't want to be touched like stuff like that just being the norm in our home. He's going to have that out in the world where he gets to use his voice and say no. And I think little boys that also get body autonomy are less likely to disrespect somebody else. I want to learn a lot more and obviously move my content towards like sex positive parenting and all of that stuff too, which I think is like really important because I don't have some

body positive sex positive like it was just absent. Sex is normal, and our kids should know about sex and the fact that we have sex and why we have sex for pleasure, for connection, for release, for like all of these reasons for making more babies, for not making more babies again, age appropriate information and normalization of these things. Do you have any reservations of having your only fans out there and having a kid. No, I don't know that it will be like up and running when they're older.

I barely know if it's going to be up and running like next month. Again, that comes to that place of authenticity and honesty and just being like, yeah, it was something fun that me and daddy did and it was good for us, and we made money and we enjoyed it, and that's it. You're gonna want to watch porn, and you might want to make porn like cool good a model release, like I really want to continue to have my full range of sexuality as a grown up person and be his mom and be able to hold

both beautifully because is I'm meant to. I was built this way. I was literally built too have great sex and orgasm and pleasure and then also derive similar pleasure. That's also oxytocin, same hormones that we get when we have an orgasm, or the same hormones we get when we breastfeed. What do you feel like I would make the world a better place. Authenticity just being able to feel safe enough to show up as themselves, because that's

really what it's about it. Just stop fucking judging everybody. So that's what I would wish on people. But that's a big wish, right, is that they feel safe enough to be themselves. And then when we are ourselves, we give other people permission to be themselves too. We create that safety by leading by example. When I'm a big fan of leading by example. I think we all know we're living in some really dire times and hearing her

talk about raising the next generation was inspiring. This whole conversation honestly reminds me that there are incredible people out there who are living with intentionality and a desire to learn more and to grow and to connect. And to me, that's what community and change is all about. And so this conversation really made me feel in love with being alive and being able to be in community and in

pursuit of community. That like, even though I might be invisible at times, even though people might perceive me wrong, there are people out there leading with generosity and we can all be that way. Next up on, when you're invisible, it's getting up close and personal with a new member of my family. Jen is my sister in law, sister, and we're very different, but we also do share some

really important things. She happens to be from a white role working class background, and it was a really interesting melding of the two families. This was a growing moment for me in a different way of realizing what life looks like in a part of the world that I know very little about. Tune into the next episode to learn more. Thank you so much for listening to one Year Invisible and for joining me on this journey. Don't

forget to like, comment, and subscribe. You can find this episode and future ones on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm your host and creator Maria Fern, with executive producers Anna Stump, Nikki Ittour and producer Dylan Hoyer, with associate producer Claudia Martha Corena and post production producer Daisy James. Original theme

music by Tony Bruno. When You're Invisible is an I Heart podcast Network production in partnership with Michael Toura Podcast Network.