We thought that in describing this particular episode, we would give you updates on the lawsuits happening against the ICOC and the ICC cults. First, the Los Angeles ICOC and the ICC said they were “Shocked and Appalled,” and that if any ‘alleged’ abuse happened, it was a long time ago and they knew nothing about it. Which were blatant and cowardly lies, as so many of the leaders in the ICOC & ICC have been involved, or had multiple cases of abuse reported to them over the course of decades....
Jul 18, 2024•47 min•Season 2Ep. 24
Well, the WTF crew has been gone for a minute due to all of the lawsuits against the ICOC/ICC cult that Chele was in. In this episode, Chele and Justine discuss these particular lawsuits, which are all based on rampant sexual abuse (of mostly minors) and failure to report and systemic cover-ups within both iterations of the cult. Even after the law team has received over 2000 phone calls of abuse from survivors of these two cults, it’s interesting to note that both the ICOC and the ICC have used...
Jun 08, 2024•58 min•Season 2Ep. 23
Whaaat?…Did the ICOC even claim to be saving leprechauns in India?!! Well, listen in to find out!! ☘️ Welcome to the second part of the conversation about the ICOC pyramid and how it was used to control and micromanage every single thought and action of its members. But here in part 2, Chele & Nixie discuss how the leadership structure was weaponized & mobilized to deploy the rules and regulations of the ICOC cult—Which masqueraded as the only true church of disciples on the planet. Yep,...
Nov 03, 2022•51 min•Season 2Ep. 22
In the next several After Hours episodes, Chele and Nixie are focusing on the group they escaped from, the ICOC. Chele felt it was important to take a deep dive into the control & mobilization structure of the cult, which the ICOC called a “discipleship tree.” It’s not by accident that even religious statisticians labeled the ICOC as the ‘fastest growing church in the world’ for three years in a row. There is a reason the ICOC, which masqueraded as a church, was able to accomplish this: Look...
Oct 26, 2022•54 min•Season 2Ep. 21
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Wow, we are at episode 20 already, so Hoyt and Chele wanted to spend the time to discuss some of their own take-aways from the WTF podcast thus far, as they have interacted with our amazing guests! And this episode’s quote, once again, sums things up perfectly: “To live in the body of a survivor is to never be able to leave the scene of a crime. I cannot ignore the fact that I live here.” By Blythe Baird. Anyone who has suffered trauma, and in our case ...
Sep 15, 2022•41 min•Season 2Ep. 20
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Our quote for Part 2 of of the conversation with the delightful Will Allen perfectly sums up one of the key resources that Will has brought to the table for all of us to partake in— “Rarely, if ever, are any of us healed in isolation. Healing is in itself, an act of communion.” By Bell Hooks Will’s documentary Holy Hell has been just such a tool for healing, for so many—Which in itself, and collectively, has functioned as an ‘act of communion.’ This fil...
Sep 15, 2022•47 min•Season 2Ep. 19
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland We think you’re really going to enjoy the treat in store for you with Ep 18—the first part of our two episodes with the incomparable Will Allen—Creator, Producer, Director (“everythinger”) of one of our favorite documentaries about indoctrination and cultic relationships, titled Holy Hell. If you have not seen this documentary, we strongly recommend it to be on your ‘must watch’ list! Chele remembers watching Holy Hell, and it being one of the crystalli...
Aug 16, 2022•46 min•Season 2Ep. 18
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Welcome to part two of our discussion with the exceptional Ashleigh Freckleton, all the way from Australia! In last week’s episode, Ashleigh sets the stage for what happened with a narcissistic and mentally disturbed “yogi guru,” whose main goal was manipulating and controlling women, for his own disturbed sexual desires and needs. So in this episode she eloquently brings us full circle, as to what broke things open for her, and how she escaped him and ...
Jul 12, 2022•49 min•Season 2Ep. 17
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland What a treat to introduce you to Part One with the lovely and impressive Ashleigh Freckleton, all the way from beautiful Australia! We instantly fell in love with Ashleigh, and not just because of her bubbly & adorable qualities—But because she so eloquently and precisely painted the picture of how someone as dynamic as herself could be duped into a yoga cult, led by a maniacal supposed guru. Yes her story contains all of the salacious and juicy det...
Jul 06, 2022•45 min•Season 2Ep. 16
So happy to share Part Two of our conversation with the unforgettable Tracy Nusbaum. It’s Chele here, personally writing this blurb of Episode 15, as I felt the need to share about how deeply touched I was by our intimate discussion with Tracy. I was so enthralled with our conversation, that it’s the very first episode where I literally forgot to read the quote of the day. Being reminded of what happened to Tracy and all of us that have escaped from the ICOC‘s prison bars that incarcerated our m...
Jun 28, 2022•1 hr 19 min•Season 2Ep. 15
So excited to introduce Tracy Nusbaum to you in Part One of a two-parter “After Hours” episode. Of course, our “After Hours” episodes are more informal, and usually involve ‘no holds barred’ dialogue AND several glasses of wine! And good Lordy, there was no holding back in this conversation! Chele, Nixie, and Tracy hadn’t all been together for over 20 years from their old ICOC (cult) days, so the memories, stories, outrage, (and wine) was flowing generously! The types of mentally, emotionally, p...
Jun 21, 2022•1 hr 3 min•Season 2Ep. 14
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Welcome back to Part Two of Matthew Wolpert’s conversation with us about his experience in the ICOC cult. As we learned in part one, Matthew bravely leaked the whistle-blowing letter from inside the London group. After one of Matthew’s best friends in the group committed suicide, it was the last awakening he needed. One of our favorite parts of this episode is near the very end where Matthew helps isolate the fact that the ICOC claims that they “have ch...
Jun 16, 2022•54 min•Season 2Ep. 13
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland We are so thrilled to share Part One of our two episodes with Matthew Wolpert! Matthew joined us from across the pond, from a lovely town outside of London. Matthew was a part of the ICOC in England for 15 years, the same cult Chele was in, here in LA. The ICOC still boasts an international membership of over 120,000 people. Matthew’s story is illuminating for many reasons, but maybe most notably because he spurred the whistleblowing op-Ed type of lette...
Jun 07, 2022•47 min•Season 2Ep. 12
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Welcome to our Season One Recap! Hoyt and Chele answer questions and comments from Season One, and talk about what they have learned about their evolving understanding and appreciation for creating a safe space for all types of survivors of cultic relationships. They highlight questions such as: How do you know when you’re ready to talk about your survival story publicly? Answer: You know that you’re ready to share your story, when you’re able to “wear ...
May 03, 2022•1 hr 6 min•Season 1Ep. 11
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Our episode 10 is Part 2 with the inspiring and courageous Spanky Taylor and Tory Christman! Two of the earliest whistle blowers and escapees from the Scientology cult. The events they share while inside of, and during their escape process, sound stranger than fiction, but are painfully true. The types of things that Scientology has gotten away with for almost 6 decades is nothing short of criminal—and riddled with hideous human rights violations, unlaw...
Feb 01, 2022•1 hr 5 min•Season 1Ep. 10
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland We were thrilled to have the incredible Spanky Taylor and Tory Christman on to talk about their many decades in Scientology—Spanky was also a key figure in the successful whistleblowing documentary on HBO titled “Going Clear: Scientology and the Prison of Belief.” She was indoctrinated into the group around age 13, and Tory entered in her teens as well. It was hard listening to their stories, as Spanky shared about the group’s version of prison camps, d...
Jan 25, 2022•47 min•Season 1Ep. 9
Join Chele and Nixie as we introduce our new “After Hours” bonus segment titled Deep Thoughts. In this more intimate format (usually accompanied with some good red wine), outside of the normal podcast studio, we create the space for an even deeper dive into the more sensitive and difficult topics to discuss. Especially concerning painful experiences and memories, and how they now play into the trauma recovery process. What most cult and abuse survivors find, is that you truly do have to “get it ...
Jan 18, 2022•59 min•Season 1Ep. 8
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland We are excited to have Debora Giannone as our episode 7 guest! Debora was featured in the Starz docu-series titled Seduced, with India and Catherine Oxenberg. Seduced was a short series highlighting some more in-depth info and accounts of what happened inside of the NXIVM cult. Debora was one of the original whistle blowers and bravely shares parts of her experience and trauma inside of this group. She shares some great and fresh insights, that will be ...
Jan 11, 2022•58 min•Season 1Ep. 7
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Our guest on this episode is Dr. Steve Hassan Phd, who is not only highly educated, but also a pioneer of sounding the alarm to the epidemic rates of indoctrination around our world! He’s a sought after cult expert and has made endless media appearances on programs like CNN, making him a trusted source of information and advice on anything and everything to do with cultic activity and authoritarian control. Including undue influence, coercive control an...
Dec 21, 2021•58 min•Season 1Ep. 6
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland After 12 years of not publicly speaking about what she went through inside of, and after escaping the ICOC cult, Chele realized it was a giant can of worms. But it was also a bottomless pit of worms, and the more she spoke about it, the more she embraced what still needed to be said. That’s the thing with trauma recovery, once you peel back one layer, there are many layers underneath that still need to be dealt with. Trauma recovery takes a lifetime, an...
Dec 14, 2021•31 min•Season 1Ep. 5
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland In this episode, Chele brings in her best friend Nixie (which is a fictitious name to protect her identity). Nixie didn’t want to be filmed and wears a hat and glasses. And you’ll have to listen in, to understand the butterfly references. Together, they begin the first of many discussions about their indoctrination into the cult they were in together called the ICOC. Their ultimate goal is to make sure people don’t feel alone, and that others have a saf...
Nov 16, 2021•1 hr•Season 1Ep. 4
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Join Dar Dixon, as he and Hoyt dig deeper into the Doomsday cult they escaped from called Eternal Values. They awakened together, to the fact that the Doomsday group they were in, was actually a dangerous cult! Dar’s vivid storytelling illuminates the fact that these cult leaders are calculated, manipulative, and relentless. The only thing that we didn’t like about this episode is that we ran out of time. So many more stories and nuances to tell, so we ...
Nov 09, 2021•1 hr 3 min•Season 1Ep. 3
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland We interview the no holds barred Betsy Chasse, who is the writer, director, and producer of What The Bleep. (And keen cult sniffer-outter). #IGotOut Visit our website at https://whatheflok.com Find out more about Betsy at https://betsychasse.net Follow us on Social: Tik Tok - https://www.tiktok.com/@whatheflok Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/whatheflok Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/whatheflok Twitter - https://twitter.com/WhaTheFlok Youtube ...
Nov 02, 2021•55 min•Season 1Ep. 2
Hosted By Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland Welcome to our inaugural episode! Nobody ever sets out to join a cult, but cultic relationships are lurking everywhere! You might think that this could never happen to you, but we’ve all been affected at some point by a controlling or abusive group or person. Our hosts, Hoyt Richards and Chele Roland, are perfect examples of what it means to go from “victim to survivor to thriver!” In this first episode we get to know our hosts: During his time as the w...
Oct 26, 2021•1 hr 3 min•Season 1Ep. 1
Hosted by Hoyt Richards & Chele Roland RAW | DISTURBING | INSPIRING Cultic relationships are EVERYWHERE! We’ve all been affected at some point by a controlling or abusive group or person, and Hoyt and Chele are the perfect examples of what it means to go from “victim to survivor to thriver.” Our hosts were both leaders in their different, but equally destructive cults, and between them, they have 37 years worth of harrowing tales and vantage points. Not only will they bring on experts and co...
Oct 24, 2021•1 min
