What must people think? What must people think? Hello and welcome to a breaking news episode of what most people think. Of course there's always going to be one today because Little Keir made his big trip over the pond. to see Donald Trump and I say little Keir because on the face of it I don't know if you saw the very first moment where he arrived at the White House and the sheer difference in size of the two men I think Keir has sort of got off lightly for how short he is
You know, in an age where Rishi Sunak had a whole Huffington Post piece on how diminutive... he was that definitely wasn't offensive right definitely wasn't like height shaming him uh Keir Starmer I think he's like half an inch taller and no one really talks about it but uh look broadly speaking
It went well, but it went well set against what could have gone wrong. I don't deny that it's reasonable to view this as a success, but a lot of that is based on people thinking, oh my God, what if Donald Trump just pulls his trousers down in front of the world's press? Big win for Britain. So we will be talking about that. In fact, that is the subject of this week's breaking news episode. I just want to say that I had some dental work this week.
That was a big one-show digression there, Jeff. I had some dental work this week, a root canal. And is it a sign of middle age, right, that I was finding the prospect of it relaxing? Because I was sort of going, that'll take about an hour. Oh, there's an hour I don't... have to do anything and with airpods right not only that i can listen to the radio or podcast in the event i listen to uh i listen to
England batting, right? England batting against Afghanistan. Cricket, you think, you know, it's quite a relaxing thing, but it turns out that is way more stressful than, that's way more stressful than the root canal itself. So I was sort of like wincing and... contorting myself she's like you're right I'm like it's just Josh Butler you know what I mean he just still haven't found our best 11 England batting in fact this was like
the patron okay so if you are a patron you get the podcast early ad free and with bonus content but also every month you get a patron only episode and we would so that came out yesterday so if you want to hear that just join up and you can hear it and one of the things we were talking about there was about You know, the fact England are even playing Afghanistan. And why, like, when countries do apartheid-style stuff on women, that's not like an international issue, you know?
Like if you said that there were countries effectively that were saying that, you know, men, you know, if they were saying that black people couldn't go to university or black people couldn't drive, there would rightly be outrage in the international community. But for some reason, when it's women, we kind of go, oh. you know, what's on between a man and a wife. You're like, well, yeah, it's not about interfering in actual domestic.
issues here we talk about sort of like national policies so i guess this might be the most feminist thing i'm ever going to say on the podcast is i think we should boycott play in afghanistan i think we should say that It's a kind of apartheid based on biological sex. Boom. No one was expecting that today, least of all me.
All right, as ever on what most people think, we will have a thank you and a fuck you before we get into the main bit of the podcast. The thank you is to, well, I did a corporate last night and it was an interesting... it was an interesting gig uh but not least because i was following the starma trip
backstage so I had to go on and off stage to start the night go back on to do a charity appeal actually it's funny thing with the charity appeal because one of the prizes was two tickets to see Henning Vane at the G live in Guildford so I got taken away with the moment and the feeling of being charitable and I said I'll tell you what look I've got a show here in Guildford on May the 12th it's a sold out show but I'm going to do my bit I'm going to
I'm going to do a couple of free tickets too. And the, well, the crowd went mild. The crowd went mild. I was like, in the end, I just had to say, yeah, look at it as a consolation prize if you didn't get tickets for Henning. But it's interesting doing... Doing corporates, you know, one, I was kind of like waiting for the news to break that, I don't know, like Trump had given Starmer a wedgie or something. But also that, you know, you're kind of doing things.
for, you know, it's a premium rate, so they say wear the suit, I wear the fucking suit. But the pressure, the pressure of a corporate is totally different to any other gig because there is this situation where there's a lot of people there that are kind of getting together for the awards, you know, for what they do. They're getting there to network. They're getting there to see friends. And then there is this...
where someone they don't know gets up and does jokes about them their industry but you know what generally they go very well and I'm always kind of like the pressure of it not going badly I did feel a little bit like Keir Starmer last night where you know success criteria and I enjoyed the gig but there's also all the other things that could go wrong you know up to and including
being slow hand clapped by loads of people in uh dinner jackets um the fuck you now this this podcast uh will be you know brought everyone know you know everyone who listens to this will know my feelings about star monster but this podcast will be broadly positive about him i've got to say PMQs this week, there is this increasing feeling that he is patronising Kemi Badenock. Now, some of you listening will go, well, he's not patronising her, she's just really bad at her job. However, right...
Fine, if he is reacting to her genuinely as he thinks her abilities merit... Fine. I'm just playing it around the other way in my head, right? So say, for example, say, for example, that the Tories are in power. Just imagine, throw your mind back. It does feel like a long time ago and a distant future possibility, but throw your mind back, right?
So the Tories have got a straight white male leader from North London and the Labour Party have got a black female leader. And the Tory leader spoke to Baden-Ock like Stamry speaking. to Baden-Ock I'm just saying I'm not saying that I think he should moderate her language because she's a woman or because she's a woman of colour. You just know damn well. You know damn well that every single time that that Tory leader spoke down to that person or dismissively, it would be given as a sign.
of misogynoir and all this stuff. So I just think for Starmer's own sake. And the other issue was, was that this week... I mean, she did one thing that was really daft, was that she'd suggested that UK should up defence spending. And then a couple of days later, Starmer did up defence spending. And she said, well, I'm glad to see you took my advice. You go, yeah, I mean, it's kind of like...
Yeah, I mean, like, I think that was more to do with what Trump had told them needed to happen than what Kimmy Baden-Ock was saying in an editorial. But it just kind of lobbed up a little half folly for him to actually smash out of the park quite funnily. And he was like, well, just... Even though she said that, it's a desperate search for relevance. And I kind of thought, hmm...
There is a point where this goes too far, right? Because it's very easy for him at the moment, PMQs. He's got loads of MPs behind him. She's got hardly any, not the hardly any she's got. I think about half of them aren't sure that she should be leader. So I'm just asking a question, open-ended, right? If there was a white male Tory... leader who's speaking to a black female Labour leader in the way that Starmer speaks to Pader Dock would there be a ruckus? I suspect there might.
All right, let's get on to talking about Little Keir and his trip to the Big White House. I mean, that literally could be a children's book. So like I say, I was watching this backstage. Very tense. Very tense on behalf. Look, at the end of the day, I'm not a Keir fan, but he's my Prime Minister. This is my country. I don't want to see the UK humiliated. And that was definitely at the worst.
case scenario outcome of this is that just Britain, our lack of power in relation to our relationship to America is exposed even more than it currently is. I was sort of tense the whole time. I guess it was a bit like... When your parents are meeting like a girlfriend or partner, you're just thinking, oh my God, just don't say anything. Don't say anything dodgy. Don't say anything dodgy. Every time he opened his mouth. I mean, there wasn't too many...
Dodgy Donald moments. The only one was when he was talking about Starmer's wife. He seems to be a bit taken with old Vic, but he said... What does he say? It's beautiful, so beautiful. And he goes, all right, leave it a beautiful. And he did, there was a respectfulness there.
And then Starmer came back with a gag, which I thought was good. In a couple of times, Starmer did manage to come back with gags. But there were other times, man, like when they were first pressing flesh and was it pressing and grinning? of the cameras outside the White House. Starmer sort of looked, it'd be easy to say that he looked like David Brent a bit. He did look a bit like David Brent, but he also...
Do you remember Extras? I mean, not remember Extras. It was a huge show. But he looked a bit like that Andy Millman character meeting David Bowie. He did. He did. But he calmed down a bit. He calmed down a bit. And they got into the first bit. So there's like a pre-meeting bit and then there's a press conference. after and the pre-meeting bit is a bit more informal and Starmer was still very nervous there was a lot of touching
There's a lot of touch in there. And the thing about, right, he's obviously been briefed, and Macron does this too, is touch Trump. Just touch him. I don't know, you know, maybe his parents weren't that tactile as a kid. There's something weird there. But just touch him. Touch the Trump. I mean, that does sound like something that Trump might make his staffers do when the doors are shut. Touch it. Touch the Trump.
And Macron makes it look quite natural, right? And in fairness to Macron, he's been doing it a lot longer. But Starmer, there was a couple of times, it was literally like his brain went, oh yeah, touch him. on the shoulder but he sort of touched him a bit too high so he was kind of reaching up which looked weird and made him look like a little boy again but we've had a whole week of men touching each other and I was sort of wondering is male flirting now a thing
You know, straight men flirting with each other on the basis of power dynamics. And this is, you know, where Donald Trump never fails to amaze people. Has he unwittingly ushered in quite a progressive craze here, which is straight men touching? Straight men touching. Old woke Donald, eh? In the pre-meeting, there was a little bit of back and forth with J.D. Vance, right? So J.D. Vance, obviously the free speech thing is, that's his thing.
You know, he's decided that's the thing I'm going to say. Oh, JD. But what he did was instead of just talking about it as a cultural issue, he tried to tie it into a commercial issue about American interests, which seemed to be... maybe under instruction maybe someone said you can't just make a general point about the uk but you know there's all these things are choreographed there has to be some sort of agreement here and and starmer actually shot back quite
defensively assertively depending on how you feel about him and we've actually had a very long history in the UK I mean it was almost like the only time that he asserted the UK it was sort of like saying we've been around longer than you no no no no no
So, you know, this plays out on right-wing social media very badly. I think, look, this is what I think. This podcast is called What Most People Think. It's not, I mean, the online world comes into it, but it's about how real people react to things. I think most people, if they saw that, if. would have thought, yeah, you tell him, mate. But that's what I think most people would have said. In the online space, and certainly in the online right space, they would have looked at, you know,
that issue of that woman being doorstepped by police, you know, certain people serving excessive prison sentences for Facebook posts, and they would have maybe scoffed a little bit at that. But I just... I don't really know what Starn was supposed to do. At the time when he's having a kiss arse with the big guy, it was almost like the slightly smaller guy tried to have a dip and he's like, I'm not taking that from you. I'll suck up to this prick, but you could get back in your box.
And then Starmer, you know, he couldn't wait to get out his little letter from the king, could he? I mean, what must the nerves of being like that? Just of like, don't let me forget the fucking letter. He couldn't wait. This is his Trump card, right? It's a visit from Trump. And it kept saying it's unprecedented. Second state visit. I mean, one of the reasons it's an unprecedented second one is because he's won another election. No one was really expecting that.
unprecedented and look and Donald did seem genuinely happy I mean he must have known it was in the offing but I guess maybe that was the one thing that the UK was holding back The one, it did seem like the one thing we can offer in this. This is it. It's this fucking letter from the king. You get to come.
You ride around in the carriages, do a bit of waving. There'll probably be a protest. Sadiq will probably let a few balloons go off. You know what I mean? A couple of Labour cabinet members will get fired for talking about it. But broadly speaking, you'll get to have lunch with the king, right? And Trump seemed genuinely happy. You know, it's almost like, OK, what do you give the guy who has everything? An unprecedented second state visit. So, look, the way that Labour are running the economy...
and how things are going, I do suspect that there'll be an unprecedented third and maybe a fourth, possibly a fifth. There were also questions. I mean, this is one thing you can say for Trump is that he does open it up to a lot of questions, you know? Just take questions. I mean, like anything. And the...
The reporters are quite candid, and it was actually our very own Chris Mason from the BBC who asked the question about Zelensky. He said, you said that Zelensky's a dictator. Do you stand by that? All words to that effect. And I don't think anybody could have been prepared for Trump's response, right? You think he either kind of goes, look, you know, what I said was technical. I was exploring an idea. No, Donald, he does things differently. He went, did I say that? I don't remember saying that.
What? He just said, that is genius. He just said, did I say that? I don't remember saying that. You're like, what? As is so often the case with Trump, no one knew what the fuck to do next. He literally did like a shaggy. Do you remember that song? It wasn't me. It wasn't me. Instead of saying it wasn't me, he said, was it me?
That's an evolution. Not only has he got the genius to do it, but he's evolved the shaggy principle to say, was it me? Did I call him a dictator? Was it me? Did I say I'd invade Canada? Was it me? Genius, absolute genius from Donald. I doff my cap. You are a true innovator.
Just a quick hype here. Remaining work in progress is so a reminder that the main tour announcement will be coming up next week. But in the work in progress leg in March and April, I'm trying to go to some places that I don't often go. So Grimsby.
Grimsby, Grimsby, have I said some shit about Grimsby in the past? It's okay, you know, but like the last show that I did there, it's a bit, if you've got any mates in Grimsby, tell them I'm in town and to check Live Nation. Sheffield, also Sheffield, I've already sold my most. Tickets in Sheffield, which, let's be honest, we're starting off a low base, but I'm looking forward to that. Also got remaining tickets in Luton. Luton, sorry. Luton. Luton.
Bedford, I think he's sold out or nearby sold out. Whitehaven. Barnard Castle. I think that's it. I think all the rest are sold out, but do come and see us on the Work in Progress Leg Tour. Just remember, if you're new to the podcast, my special basic bloke is on ITVX to watch for free. And then also, if you really need to hear more of my voice.
Friday night on Times Radio, 7 till 10. Friday night with Norcott. I'm really, I'm sorry, I'm trying to stop having a radio voice, but it's happening. I always used to take the piss out of these guys, but fucking please tell me, please call me out if I start going a bit smashy and nighty.
So, picking it up. So they have their meeting, right? And they come out and they do their press conference. And it seems to have gone well. In terms of what actually happened, what got agreed, there was loose... Starmer got loose backing for his Chagos deal. Now, this isn't me commenting on the substance of that deal, whether or not it's the right thing. There was a lot of talk on the right that Trump was going to kibosh it, and it seems like he's not.
I guess we've had, you know, before the meeting, there was a softening of language on Zelensky. There was even talk of a trade deal. And there was other things. I suppose there was, you know, loose commitments to... Well, I suppose what... Basically, when it came to Britain's defence against Russia, Trump sort of basically alluded to, look, if it was absolutely up to shit, yeah, we'd help you out. You know what I mean? We really don't want to.
But there were some funny moments, which ultimately, you know, which is the main meat of this podcast. There were some funny moments to get into. Particularly when Trump said that Keir Starmer had a beautiful accent. He had a beautiful accent. Well, as he said, if I spoke like that, I would have been in power 20 years ago. Wow. I mean, you are possibly the only person in history.
Donald, who would compliment Keir Starmer's woefully insipid way of talking? I mean, look, I think finally, you know, that speech coach... But took a lot of stick, let's be honest, when she came out and said that she coached his speech for four years. A lot of people were talking about a refund. Finally, validation for her. that Donald said that Keir's got a beautiful voice. Keir should have said, well, there's plenty more where that came from. Now, he also said...
Trump, about Keir Starmer. You've done very well. Very tough negotiator. He sort of said he asked me to leave the UK out of tariffs. He said, well, he tried. You know, it's those funny moments where... Trump does say things that are in the patterns of normal speech that people expect. It's such a simple art form and yet so few do it. It must be harder than people realise.
And he called him a very tough negotiator. I would say this, right? That kind of like Keir looked all proud there and his little barrel chest was puffed out. I would say this, that if I'd got most of what I wanted from someone, I'd give them credit as well. do you know what i mean like if i was an estate agent and you know i was haggling someone offered like you know 300 grand for a property
And, you know, I was like, oh, it's going to need to be 310. And they went 305. And I was thinking, fuck, I would have taken 300. You go, oh, you, you, this guy, don't get in the ring with this guy. Very tough negotiator.
A couple of tricky moments. I can't remember whether this was before or after the actual meeting when they were asked about Trump saying that he would annex Canada and they sort of threw to... starmer starmer started to answer and then trump just went enough enough of that okay right okay daddy's home now i just uh let's remember i mean part of the
the sort of breathtaking transparency of this is that there has always been this power balance in between the us and the uk right well for a long time anyway certainly since the first world war really and increasingly so ever since And we end up giving them stuff, don't we? We're like, hey, do you want an atomic bomb? Yeah, because we've sort of got a half a day, but you guys, you could take it over the line and maybe we could still hang out.
There's been a lot of things over the years. Yeah. We're going to invade Iraq. Yeah, we'll be there. We'll be there, bruv. Hey, when will we ever let you down? There's been a lot of stuff in the past. So we always... what is it the old rule is uh find out what america wants then offer a little bit less that's the kind of rule of transatlantic relationships
But just to see it laid bare where Trump's like, okay, I'm going to be nice generally, but no, you ain't saying that. Next question. Okay, that was a bit embarrassing. Could you take on Russia by yourselves? That was a proper dick move when they were talking about... the US support for Britain, as I mentioned, you know, if push came to shove. And Trump just looked at the start and went, could you take over Russia by yourselves?
And Starmer, luckily, and this is where he did well, he just did the right thing. He just went, he just did a very British kind of chuckle, awkward chuckle. Well done. That was literally the only thing you could have done diplomatically there. It's the awkward, the power of the British.
chuckle it was deployed like a fucking nuclear weapon um and this is like it's what trump did was that was a reminder he's like i'm playing nice but this is what he does he goes we are the biggest economy in the world We have the power. So this week, everyone's going to come to me and tell me what things you're going to do for me in order for me to still be friends with you, right?
It's very naked. It's very transactional. It makes me feel uncomfortable at times. He doesn't feel like he has the world's best interest at heart. But, I mean, America First is his policy. He's just kind of doing. what he said he was going to do. He has a mandate for this stuff, so there's no point arguing about that now. This is what...
the American people voted for, and now they've voted for it twice. What most people think. And when it comes to, like, I suppose the biggest issue on the table, you know, the Chagos deal is one thing, a UK-US trade deal is another thing. The big... issue is about Ukraine and what happens next and how there's a deal that doesn't exclude Ukraine.
And he's workable going forward. I've got to say, the more I think about this mineral thing, right? So the mineral thing, Ukraine apparently has got these huge untapped resources of minerals. Now, Trump's saying... And I don't think, and Russia are alluding to that, they wouldn't want US troops there, right? So this idea is that the US have a huge commercial investment, like an investment fund almost, right? where they help Ukraine develop very graciously.
We're going to help you get these incredibly valuable minerals out of the ground. Yeah, look, we just wanted to do that for you. It's the least we could do. By the way, just a slight sidebar here. I wasn't aware, and please correct me if Trump was just chatting shit here. But he made a point that the European Union had made loads of loans to Ukraine for them to help them keep fine, which are going to get paid back.
If that's true, right, and David Domain helped me out here, if that's true, that is classic EU, isn't it? It's kind of doing exactly the same stuff as Trump, but just doing it a little bit out of view. Okay, it's like, we're just, look, we are going to help you, but it needs to work for us as well, you know. But whereas Trump goes, look, we're going to help you. We're going to help you, but we need some money back. That's the closest I've got to doing Trump, isn't it?
I'm getting there. But I'm just wondering, is this mineral thing actually fucking genius? Does it kind of mean like everyone sort of is okay? Like, right, Ukraine sort of get this idea that if Russia do come across, the Yanks are going to go, you can't... You can't park there, mate. Right? And the US, like, Trump can sell that back home.
He does need to be able to sell this deal back home. People in this country often forget about that. We often mock the fact that the US has very few people with passports and they're completely ignorant about world affairs. All right, if you take that at face value, then how hard is it? to sell to the american people who are and i'm going to keep repeating it 37 trillion dollars in debt and with a debt to gdp ratio of 125 how do you sell that right
He has to be able to sell it back home. So he says, this is a deal. We're getting something from this. And people don't like the transactional nature of current politics. Well, you know, this is where he's moved the dial to. Is this genius? I just, I'm starting to think. It might be. And look, if the lefties listening, I've said some nice things about Starmer, I think. Don't make out like I'm suddenly getting back on board the Trump train. I'm just wondering, is this like...
You know that bit at the end of Lockstock, where I think Nick Moran's character goes, if I'm not mistaken, you've got the guns, you've got the shooters, right? This has gone a bit, Michael Caine.
right you're only supposed to blow the bloody you've got the guts you've got the shoes and we're in the clear right it's just there is a possibility that trump has triangulated this in a way that could work for people i don't know if you look if you if that really upsets you uh patriots can get in touch direct or email what most people think uk at gmail.com
Okay, that is it for this breaking news episode of What Most People Think. I'll be back on Monday as things stand. I've got Pierre Novelli coming back on the show after a lot. He should have been on more recently, but I'm so excited that he's coming back on. And look, Keir Starmer, I'd imagine.
If I was him, I'd get absolutely fucking smashed on the plane on the way back. Just the release of tension. I have no idea how many beta blockers that man was on to do that trip. He probably had the heartbeat of a fucking hibernating... Gorilla. Did I even hibernate? I don't know. See you next week.