Hey, and welcome to What Future.
I'm your host, Joshua Zapolski, and today we have a very mysterious, very spectral, very creepy, very unhinged, unsettling, spooky show. It will leave you feeling spooked and unsettled. I'm trying to think of synonyms for things that make people feel uncomfortable and creeped out. I can't really think of any. That's my problem though. That's because I didn't graduate high school. If I had done that, I would have a larger vocabulary and I'd be able to communicate more effectively to
the listener. Unfortunately, you get this dumbed down, third grade ass version of the show, and you know what, that's on me.
That is on me.
But today we do have a really fun show, and I've been excited to have this conversation. I've been listening to a podcast called Hi Strange, which is hosted by a man named Payne Lindsay. And Paine does all these different shows. He's done a bunch of true crime stuff, and he is kind of fascinating guy and super fun to listen to, and I wanted to talk to him because the show is the show he's working on now that he's just done, is about you know, a boy UFOs,
but UFOs as I call them. Nobody else calls them that, but I like to. And as a lifetime lover of science fiction and creepy shit, I found what he's doing to just be super compelling, and so I wanted to talk to him about what the hell is going on with UFOs and aliens and if we're being invaded? And so we got him on the show. So let's get
into this conversation. Have you ever considered doing a late night like radio show where you take calls from people and give them advice and it's called something like bring the Pain.
Have you ever considered?
No?
But now I am the concept rights itself. Sorry, I just had that very dumb idea night. Do I owe you anything if I use that?
I mean, honestly, I would just I think it'd be cool, Like if you did it that, then I might want a little something like a couple of points on the backhand or whatever.
Right, Well I did say it first.
Yeah, Yeah, it's just I mean whatever, you know, just I could be maybe I could come on sometimes it's like a sidekick and give my take on the advice, like i'd be give like the counterpoint, right, that's that would be fair, right, you bring the pain that. I'm like, just Josh and I come on and I'll make a joke about the whole thing. Now, we're like, yeah, our names are confunction as words, at least audibly.
We're gonna get into it.
We're gonna get into UFOs, although they're not called UFOs anymore correct.
They're called what are they called it?
They say UAP. Now, yeah, like UAP sounds more credible. It's like an unidentified airborne phenomenon.
Is some what it is? Aerial phenomenon? Aerial phinness?
Okay, welltty, that's pretty close.
Same.
But before doing High Strange, which is your latest podcast, which explores UFOs or UAPs depending on who you talk to, you've done a ton of true crime stuff and the stuff you've done is pretty heavy, some pretty heavy shit. So how have you How did you end up in that world? Like what led you there?
I was in my mid twenties and I was doing freelance video work, commercials and music videos, and I was just getting burnt out creatively and also financially, and I wanted to create my own thing, a big endeavor to tackle. And I had this crazy idea one day in my apartment, having watched numerous true crime documentaries, like what if I made one of those?
Is that possible? How would you even do that?
So I just went down that path and eventually decided to make a podcast instead because it was really as a proof of concept. I wanted to make a TV show or a documentary, and I was like, well, I can make a podcast in my apartment for one hundred bucks versus you know, a fancy TV show, and maybe if I can get this off the ground and it works, then that would lead me to the next step. That was a simple idea. That was it, and then from there I just.
I guess I've been doing it ever since, right You're like, oh, hey, why don't I just do this? Yes, instead of whatever I was doing, And then you just did it and it turned out to be pretty successful. I mean, people, a lot of people have listened to the stuff that you've done. But you're not your background's not and like you didn't like go to school for investigative journalism or I did not.
You didn't.
You're not like a active like you don't you don't have a badge.
I'm not a real investigator, right, well, I mean play one.
I mean, if you were to an investigation to identify the perpetrator, you couldn't arrest them because.
That's snitch full of cops, right, you have.
You couldn't do a citizen's arrest, which I don't even know, Like citizens arrest is not even a real thing?
Is that it ever real? I mean that was like an idea, right.
I don't know. It's interesting, like we I don't know about you. I've lived my whole life thinking that there was a form of this thing called a citizen's arrest that a person could do where they go, yeah, I mean they grab somebody and they're like, you've committed a crime, and now I'm you're under arrest, and I guess hold you until like hold on to you until the police get there.
Like what did you do? Yeah?
Yeah, doesn't make sense really be able to carry cops around unless they're doing this. Yeah yeah, right, I don't know who's doing it. Hey, listen, here's a topic for your next investigative podcast. Citizens arrest up. Put that that's an.
Easily ten and I'm doing them.
And then the first one I do, I get arrested and you're season you.
Just exploring the concept of doing a citizens The rest is me for jail saying this. I knew this was a bad idea, but I didn't think it would be this bad.
Right right. I like that. I love that.
In fact, you've got to listen, there's so much new material to work with now. I'm glad to just be a place where you can generate new ideas.
Oh hey, this is great, this is I needed this.
I lived to serve. So okay, So High Strange is your latest show. It centers on alien phenomena, like whether it's abductions or encounters or a lot of it is about like sightings of some kind of like flying objects. There's been a ton of like noise about that lately. There's been these like videos released by the I guess by the Navy or the Air Force from like pilots from like pilot's planes where they're just seeing like crazy shit.
So tell me how you ended up deciding to do I mean, obviously there's a big mystery here, so you clearly like mysteries, But how did you land on Like, Okay, I'm gonna go from doing like a show about you know, a serial killer who you know, kills children to what's up with UFOs?
Like that's sort of a.
Not a hard pivot or anything, but it's not you know, it's not exactly like, it's not exactly true that like a person who's interested in like a true crime story about like an unsolved murder might also be interested in UFOs, So like, yeah, how does that happen?
I mean I always love the topic as a kid. Just the idea of you know, what if you know, are we alone? That kind of thing was an exciting
thought to me. And I was just a fan of sci fi genre and you know, Steven Spielberg all that stuff, And you know, I've seen all these recent news stories and just seeing the conversation around UFOs in general kind of taking a shift and kind of heating up a little bit, and you know, different perspectives are entering the room and new accounts and it's like, okay, why is this like coming back? You know, it'd be a cool
idea to do a podcast on that. And then it wasn't until I started really poking around and looking into it more seriously than I realized that there actually is something really meaty here that is unexplained, and that seemed like it was worth trying to crack. You were like, maybe I can finally solve this. If I can find the aliens, then I'm rich. Well yeah, obviously, I mean, or you're dead or you're dead.
Yeah, I mean if you could find dead Pain, I think you're either rich or dead or people are like no, one believes this guy.
He's a crackpot, Like.
I'm dead, someone else is rich. Off the documentary they made about me doing.
No Then you're the subject of a true crime documentary about who killed Pain?
Who really killed Pain? And that guy's right?
Was it the aliens? Was it the government? Here you go, another great idea. You have to die for that one, But I think it's it'll on the long run, it'll be worthy.
Only get one should only die once. So that's that's true.
Well, I don't know, maybe the aliens have some technology we don't know about. But like so I've been listening to I've listened to a bunch of it and actually was just listening to the roundtable you have like this, uh, I guess end of season sort of roundtable conversation about the episodes.
And you know, let me just say a couple of things.
I was listening episode after episode after episode, like and by the fourth or fifth episode, I started to be like, you know, this is fucking bullshit, like like like like this is not not because of your not because of the way you were doing it, but like I was like, first off, the way you do the podcast, and it's very good.
It's really engaging in super entertaining.
It's really like it feels like to me, if you're like a fan of like shit like the X Files, or if you I assume you know who Art Bell is. Like I used to listen to art Bell like back in the day, and I was like, this is the greatest shit. Like you put it on, like you're driving late at night, art Bell comes on it. It's like the vibe ultimate creep fast while you're on like a fucking dark road or whatever, right, and that's the vibe
of I feel like of high strange. It's very art Bell, not like bullshit like Cloud Cuckoo laand but like kind of that stylistic it's like kind of scary. It's kind of scary, like there are parts of it that are really creepy, and I enjoy that.
But there was a part of me.
That's like, you know, having been in like music production obviously, like I have a podcast, I'm kind of like, all right, Like they're like bringing up the fucking growling synth sound here, and like the guy's talking about the fucking bright light hitting them and shit, and I'm like, yeah, this is all very compelling, like from a dramatic perspective, we get it, get I'm but like but like I'm like, but what
the fuck is this guy really talking about? You know, like do we really are we really supposed to believe that in in Snowflake with Arizona, is that where it is? No, yeah, right, yep, this is my prevailing thought. That's where the Aliens decided to touch down. They needed to go to Arizona to this like logging region and abduct like some dude who jumped out of a pickup had to do it right, And a lot of this stuff is like it's weirdly
very American, Like a lot of these sightings. I don't know if you've full it feels that way, like on the surface for sure that it's you know, could quite possibly be some American folklore thing, right right, but but it really actually it isn't. Uh, it's it's been happening everywhere in every country for a long time.
It's just right.
You know, we have our own sort of memory of it, and our own sort of American history of you know, ros Will and all these things that happened since then, but those versions of that too, in every big country out there.
It listened.
I mean, it's not just that it's the American or whatever, but it is. I started to think, like, Okay, well, I'm listening to these these stories, and these people are like sound very like you interviewed this guy who was abducted or says he was abducted basically, and and you know, he doesn't sound like he's having a good time. Like it doesn't sound like he's doing it because he's trying to get rich and famous.
He sounds like pretty upset about it.
So like, you know, and as you listen to someone talk about that, you go, okay, well why would anybody you.
Know, Yeah, so what's the alternative to you? Like, what's the what's the rational alternative?
Yeah? I don't know, Like they fucking those guys actually like took some acid. They were having a good time, They like dropped some acid they had a shared experience, like a shared hallucination. Dude went wandering in the forest for five days because he was like still high or whatever, and then like felt like he had I mean, the human mind. This is where I come back to with
all of this stuff. It's like the human mind is capable of very wild leaps, like you know, like love sure like on its own right, due to lots of different reasons, for lots of different reasons, whether it's like a chemical imbalance or like you know, if you don't if you don't sleep for a certain amount of days, or if you don't drink enough water, like you can really like get pretty out there.
But I'm not trying to.
Accuse these people of like re videos and having to But I'm just saying there are explanations.
The thing that seems like the least likely explanation.
This is where I was like, there are parts where I'm like, Okay, this is very compelling evidence.
This is very interesting.
Like you'd hear these Navy, the Air Force guys or whatever talking about m H these like these things they saw and they're like we had to tell people, like we had to get the word out like this is crazy or whatever, and you're like, okay, yeah, fair, Like these guys are up in the planes like they this must be really fucking crazy to them, and who else is going to tell us like if something seems weird up there, like they're the guys, right, But then I'm like,
I don't know, like how come this is all we've got basically right, like like we have these like weird shreds of and I know, like it could be the government's hiding it because you do this whole thing on Roswell and but like you do you really believe? I guess what I'm saying is do you really believe?
This?
Is my roundabout way of just grilling you on like that there are extraterrestrial life forms visiting planet Earth? Not just Arizona obviously, but parts of Arizona and like the skies above. I forget where the planes were flying, but like Hawaii or something. Maybe Is that what this is is that the explanation these are actually like some kind of creature, some being some intelligent life form that's like zipping down to Earth to check shit out.
I think it's more than one thing.
I think that on some accounts there may have been live extraterrestrial bodies in some sort of craft that came on Earth or in the Earth's atmosphere. I think sometimes it's probably some sort of drone, the same way some unmanned thing that isn't from Earth per se.
You think the stuff that those pilots are seen are basically drones.
Those I think are drones.
That the way that they've kind of they looked and they're behaving, it doesn't look like there's anything inside them, like I mean, there could be, but right, you know, it just kind of begs the question of Okay, well, then whose are they? Is it our blunder of a national intelligence.
Like is China it's just trying to have a really advanced to us by like fifty years, like how when? But see, that's a much more likely explanation, isn't it?
Is it more likely?
Or is it more that's a much more likely explanation, I mean like likely or familiar. Well, I mean, let's just think about the facts like digestible. Well, it's like kind of like God, right, Like, I mean, you could make an argument that there's some phenomena that occurs or like what the reason the seashells have the you know, whatever pattern they have is like because that's God at work.
But like the more likely explanation that we can actually get some evidence on is like, well, that's like a you know, series of like things that have happened over millions of years, like to like the physical properties of
this evolution of this thing or whatever. You know, we can look at like the science a bit and say is it if you ask me, like, all right, more likely the Chinese have invented or some other country or someone or even our government has invented a super sophisticated drone to spy on things.
I mean that I think they have done that. I think that sometimes they.
Have the ones that we know about, but there are may be ones we don't know about that they're fucking with now, right, Like they the stealth like the stealth bomber right for a long time was like this kind of like myth mythical thing that they said like they
weren't doing or whatever. Yeah, but is it more likely that it's like some super advanced piece of technology that like our government is testing maybe even on their own pilots to see how they react, or it's a alien being sent down a drone just to probe Earth in this particular way, and there's not a lot of other evidence, you know, like why are they around the planes at all? Like would be a question I get, Like maybe they're
trying to say why. It's a tough to if you're going to swallow the pill of okay, it's this.
Yeah, we can't think about it through the lens of how we're thinking necessarily. I mean, you're so advanced that you're coming from a place that we cannot see or debating it on a podcast today whether or not it's even real, then clearly we're the small.
Fry here, like right or like one hundred.
I mean, sometimes we don't get too or there's a lot of other things we don't understand either. Yeah, there are other explanations that are fucking crazy that I might actually say are possibly more likely, Like, for instance, is it more likely that the aliens are sending down a probe that we is just so advanced, or we're living in a city simulation and the probes are like some
glitch in the fucking program. Or Now, by the way, I don't necessarily subscribe to the simulation theory, but like I don't know that in some way seems more likely to be and I don't know why. But then again on the why if if it was a simulation, why don't we have aliens? Like why don't we have aliens? Like why aren't there like real good aliens showing up like Independence Day stuff?
That's like the that's like the why me?
Like, is it like what if it was so vast that we were literally nothing?
Like what you mean?
I'm saying, like what if billions of other planets that had life like ours, maybe on a podcast saying the same shit right, Like.
Oh, for sure, there's some fucking tentacled aliens doing a podcast on their planet and.
It all like why aren't you coming to check us out?
Well, they don't even know we exist, because we're like a planet, like a rock somewhere that they are not even interested in. I mean, that is the question is like what is the nature of this thing? It is like they're obviously not visible to us in any meaningful way if they were some other creature. I mean, to your point though, about what if we're like one of
billions of like intelligent beings in the universe. I think correct me if I'm wrong, But the going concept is that's most likely, right, we can't even fathom the vastness of space and all of the things.
Yeah, it's all.
The statistically, that's realistic to a degree that it exists.
Well, the other.
Explanation is a religious one. I think the alternate explanation is like, we're put here by a special being who wanted us to exist. Therefore we're the only one. I think if these are aliens, I would say it's bad news for religious people.
Generally speaking, it is, and I think that's kind of a problem. I think that's that's why it's so touchy for some people. And it's like, even if you're not super religious, if you just you know, you have a certain way of thinking about the world and how you operate on a daily basis. This definitely pokes at the and that it's uncomfortable, you know. It's like, I don't want to reshape the way that I view the universe and my existence, right.
Right, I mean, I think without question, the single biggest moment for us as humans would be to discover that there is like it have to be right, Yeah, something like us that is in us, that exists in the universe that we have no awareness or control over it.
I mean, and maybe that's like to the point of a lot of the stuff that you talk about on the show, Like maybe that's why people can't get at this information, like you know, but I feel like, listen, I mean, you know, didn't they have to brief Trump on this shit? Don't you think Donald Trump, if you got briefed on the aliens?
I don't think the presidents know shit really, be honest, I think the absolutely not.
Now you don't think Biden is down there in area fifty one?
Like I think maybe some presidents at some point one time were briefed on little nuggets of things here and there. Right, I think the biggest uh like misconception is that the government knows everything. I think that they're realizing that we like they don't know. Like, I mean, maybe at one point they did know more than they did, and those guys died right with that information? What did the grave with it? Wouldn't at this point if it was like
and maybe I could be wrong too, if it's total bullshit? Right, are we just so creative and so have just such good imagination like that we keep it alive? Like shouldn't it be dead by now?
Well? I mean right. I don't know.
People love a good mystery, as you know, I mean as a man who's producing and being a part of these like true crime podcasts and now this one about aliens.
Like the Bigfoot there is, right, I mean maybe it is. Well.
I mean there's like been multiple TV shows about big like recently, I think, like Bigfoothunters was a thing, but like other more believers like every day Yeah, but Bigfoot is actually a way worse story because it's like is the thing walking around or not? Like it's like, oh, we saw this guy in the forest and it's like
either he's there or he is. And now we've got like drones and GPS and all this shit and like fucking phones like where we can take video and people He's not popping up, you know, Bigfoot's not popping up grabbing people's like sandwiches out of their hand at this at the campsite.
Right, He's just the ultimate hide and seek player.
People love this idea of the unknown. I mean, think about how much of our life is arranged around these I mean, religion is a big part of it.
Is this idea of this unfathomable, unknowable.
Thing lined faith and an idea that you can't necessarily prove.
Basically, you could make arguments that things prove it, but like they're not house either one more or less real. Well, someone would say something else, but but then they're still they're applying the way they feel and about it. I mean, you got more evidence of aliens than you do of God at this point, technically speaking, you do for sure, right, Like like I don't have there's no like video of God like shooting a round up near a fucking F one whatever the jets are called.
I don't know what they are.
You know, I was gonna say, f he doubly drives an F one fifty there, right, he has to do. No, they got there's around the F one definite. Yeah, what are the jets? They're F fifteen's or something, F sixteenss F eighteens. All right, they've gone up to eighteen now,
they've gotten very advanced. But yeah, if we think that's the best evidence we have, I mean, there was this story the other day that Tucker Carlson has been talking about, which like you know immediately is problematic probably, but there's like some the government has alien bodies, Like what is your take on that so it's all based on this guy, this whistleblower, guy David Grush.
I think that's how you say his name.
Yeah, who's highly decorated with tons of clearance. And he's coming forward saying that we have a alien crash retrieval program and we have like twelve different crafts. We've collecked it over the years and have studied this and that. When you hear him talk, he sounds like what a do you believable human being?
Right?
You start to wonder, Okay, what is this guy's motivation to lie to Congress? I think that he believes this, right, So what is it? Yeah, I mean, what is it? I think does he have any evidence? So the problem is with this particular story is that he isn't the guy who has literally witnessed these things with his eyes.
He is a guy who has been told this by like dozens of people in a private sector of the government, right, right, And so if he was the guy with the pictures and the stuff, it would be a little bit different. So this guy believes what he was told, and I think he was told this stuff. Question is, Okay, why was he told this stuff?
Right?
Well, that's sort of like the like I was saying about the drones could be some test of some technology or some test of some security.
Is that guy the twelve crafts from off world vehicles? Yeah?
They're like, who are going to be the leakers in our work? Like let's put out a really shocking piece of am and we say this is top top secret. This cannot be known by anyone. It's an issue of national security. And they're like, where are the weak links? Maybe that's the extent of it, and they're like, who cares of this guy's story is out there? Because one, we know this guy's a weak link and we can't
trust him with real information. And two, no one's going to believe it because it's a ridiculous story that he
has no evidence to back up. My mind always goes to the what is the more likely explanation, because like I guess, I want to find like what makes sense, not just like what's exciting to think about, Like it's exciting to think he's right, but if I step back and look at the cold, hard facts, like maybe somebody's just fucking with him, you know, or it was a loyalty test, totally possible, but what maybe they're doing programs now way more often to find the next Reality winner
or Ebwett's notte like you know who's inside here who could like damage us. Well, what's odd is there's people in Congress who are taking it seriously right, They're.
Not are any of them Democrats?
So this is also a very kind of odd observation, especially for right now right. I mean, there's been some big stories that have been you know, on both sides over the years, but as of recent it seemed it seems like a very right centric story.
Yeah, And I really think.
That's probably because it's it's kind of part of the ideology a little bit that like, you know, the government's got the secrets and you know, it's kind of like up against the man and don't trust the government. So it really kind of, yeah, one it plays into that, and with a Democrat in office, it's like that mentality is kind of a good one to have if you were trying to like, you know, replace them. And I think on the left, it's like they're probably sitting there thinking like what is going on?
Is this shit real? Like truly not right?
But we're not going to like make this a political debate for the presidency, are we It's interesting, actually I can imagine this kind of thing in a previous era of our government. Not that our government has ever been like the most functional or whatever, but I think if you went back like fifty years or something, you might find that if somebody was like, hey, we've got evidence
of a UFO, you might find some bipartisan conversations going on. Right, like you might find these old school the people who are like the old school, like congressmen and women, and there were not that many women.
Fifty years ago.
But I do think that it's notable that there is a lot of right or Republican support for it. To your point, Yeah, it plays into this like the government is like weirdly like the governments against us. The government has like secrets that they they're not going to tell us or whatever. But it also is feeds into all of the a whole bunch of stuff, and which makes which gives me pause actually when I think if like they're embracing it, because it's like it's like the QAnon.
It's like a conspiracy.
You know, Biden stole the election from Trump, and you know that the dominion machines and all this like stuff that you draw the line right, yeah, Well, and it is a little bit suspect. I would say, like if somebody's like, you know what, I don't. I think vaccines are deadly and you can't take them because the government engineered them to destroy your body and mind or whatever they think about vaccines. And I think QAnon is real.
There's like a child sex cult that the Democrats are running and shipping children in wayfair fucking you know dressers or whatever, like you know, dominion, the voting machines were rigged for Biden. Oh and also UFOs are real, Like I definitely my spidey sense tingles a little bit about like who's believing it? You know, it's like if if that group, if every one of the things they believe is bullshitting for the most part. And I'm not saying
everything in Republican believes is bullshit. I'm saying in that there's a bunch of conspiracies theories that now swarm.
It makes you wonder why that is the case.
Right, Yeah, it's either either they're more open we say they're more open to.
I think they're more open and took taking risks.
Well yeah, but also maybe more open to anything that kind of chips away at like the foundations of like democracy and stability that angle, I mean, right, like like anything where you can say the government's hiding it from the people, then you kind of chip a little bit away at like whether we should be really getting behind these people or get behind the people who say.
Well, it's really the government hiding it from the government. At this point, that's what's being such like that's what that's what's being alleged.
Yeah, they won't they won't let Marjorie Taylor Green into the vault where they have the alien bodies.
And that is why we don't have to she already she she knows, She's sorry, No, born know. I'm like, you know, I'm not trying to make it.
I'm not trying to like say it's a political thing, but it is unusual.
Yeah, it's uh, I mean, I will say this as an observation.
It has stood the test of time a little bit though.
You know, it's like the COVID vaccine stuff, and you know, the shipping the people in the wayveraranddressers is like those are like newer.
We don't know if they're gonna stick around the way that aliens will.
Right, like eventually they're kind of like, Okay, well never mind, but this is kind of it hasn't become less likely.
Really, there's also like a lot of history of it. I mean, we know the government hides things, like that's true, yeah, right, Like our government, for lots of good reasons and also for non good reasons, hides things from the American people, right, don't. They obviously are not telling us everything they know about everything. It's like this shit with Trump, like he had these documents, it's like here's how we'd invade Iran or whatever.
And it's like, yeah, like they're probably not.
They don't want to go out and be like we have a plan to invade a foreign country and here's how we do it. So yeah, you know, like we all know they are keeping secrets from us, The question is like how many and how crazy are they?
Right?
I don't think the government's smart enough to keep a secret like this forever. That's why I think it's really there isn't a lot of people who really know.
Well, right.
But the other thing is that has the narrative about UFOs evolved, like forget about like obviously we have this footage and we have like new people coming forward and saying we think something's going on, But does it feel like the nature of these encounters or what people are witnessing has evolved from like Roswell or the sixties or seventies to like today.
Did you get a sense of that?
I mean, yeah, I mean I think that one not every sighting or claim is true. I would say probably a majority of them are not right, But the ones that have the most evidence and are the hardest to debunk, I think some of those probably are true. So that the a level of influence I'm sure from other stories in the past that's kind of shaped this trope idea of what aliens are and what a flying saucer is.
But what's more compelling to me than even some of the Navy pilot stuff today is going back to the sixties or seventies or eighties even and looking at some of the physical evidence of like pictures and stuff that have been confirmed by Kodak.
It's not photoshop.
You knew where technology was at the time. It makes you say, okay, well, what is it for real? Like right, it's easy to say that this thing, this tic tac thing is from China today because yeah, that's probably very that's.
More likely than not forty years ago though, right? Right? But is it it's not a tick tac forty years ago? Is it?
Some of them look like that, to be honest, they do. So that's what I kind of what I was asking is like, it's also not one thing. I don't think it's it's like, right, you know, like the the trope is like, you know, aliens are from Mars, and it's like it's like one like set of beings and they're more advanced than us, and we're us and it's us and them. What if it's just literally thousands or tens of thousands of different things.
Yeah, but like they're all just hiding, like like does this only one of them will be a little bit shining?
Isn't necessarily you know, like going behind a planet? Right?
What if it's more of a like you know, it's like we learn more and more every day about the idea that maybe the universe itself is like straight up infinite. At this point, it's just like, right, you know, just fast going this way. But what if it was like almost the same thing this way where it was like you know, I.
Mean, you're saying they could be like it could be like us in another dimension. Actually it could be stuff that we're doing, Like a.
Version of that is more likely than anything.
I mean, right, it's like a very advanced drone from a different version of America, from a more advanced version of our reality. Like that would be that would be very fitting actually with us. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean that would be like it would make a lot
of sense. I think if we know that, like our country is like doing all the surveillance and shit, and like if you can imagine that there's an alternate reality or dimension version of Earth and there's an America or some version of it, like it would make a lot of sense that they've created some drone that's trying to probe into like other dimensions.
I mean, isn't that what we're doing. Aren't we working on shit like that?
Like if we could do that, we would do that, so right, means that we would eventually do that. You know what, Here's the thing that gets me, Like all this is really exciting and interesting to think about, and I'm like, man, this is such like a it's such a fun thought exercise to go through, Like all this is but like you know, and and maybe tell me if you feel this way, like lots of crazy things happen have happened in our lifetime and in the in
the you know, years and decades centuries before us. You know, it's never been like a dragon that showed up like just a fucking like a godzilla. Never like the shit that happens in movies, which is the stuff we're talking about.
M h.
It never really seems to happen like my thing that one of the things I get stuck on was to us sometimes is is I mean, life's pretty straightforward, pretty like understandable, and pretty boring in a lot of ways. I'm not saying I'm bored, but in the grand schame of things. We like to watch like the Marvel movies because they present this fantastic world where unbelievable, unimaginable things can happen. In our actual world be very rarely more predictable,
we very rarely see them. I mean, I don't even know. I couldn't even tell you one that I've experienced. I mean, nine to eleven. It is probably like the closest to something in my lifetime that I experienced where I was like, this is like something from a movie. This isn't supposed to happen. This is like some kind of event that's occurring that feels like otherworldly.
You know, I don't mean like alien.
I mean it just felt like not to not trying to make it a nine to eleven episode, but I'm just saying it's like an wildly impactful to break with reality.
Like and by the way, that has.
A totally explainable human element.
But how long is your scope here? Is it? Well?
I mean, I mean I guess for your lifetime, right, I get yeah, from my lifetime. But like, but a dragon never attacked like the Old West, that's true. Yeah, there's no like story about how like some giant grasshopper like destroyed a town in the in the Old West or whatever, like you know, or something like that is totally outrageous. It's like, yeah, Buffalo Bill, like did he
was a really good shot or whatever? Or like there was a lot of crime in the before you know, America was you know, I just say, like, it's not any of this, It's never this well. Strangely enough, though, there are there are stories that go way back that that.
It sound like aliens, like like from the Old West. I mean, you could even look at the Bible like that if you'd like to.
But it's listen. I mean, I've read the book Fingerprints of the Gods, which is basically I don't know if you know that book at all, but which is about like there is a intelligent life on this planet long before the light where we thought life began. And there are all these maps, detailed maps they had of like underneath glaciers, of the land underneath glaciers, and like if you look at these like Aztec drawings of people, they appear to be like people sitting inside of a craft.
Like it's actually pretty interesting, pretty compelling, but like there's no like wing of a ship.
There's no smoking gun, right, yeah, Like there's where's the part of the point. What would be the smoking gun to you? And would it only be to you? And like, well, you know, what would the smoking gun be?
I think if if Biden came out and was like, listen, I've read all these I've heard these stories. I said, I want to get to the truth.
And we went in.
There's been a program and we have collected alien ships. We don't know this, we don't know that, but that's what's going on. We're working on it, you know, TBD, like like we'll let you know what happens. I'd be like, okay, that's I'd be like, that's.
Really how many people would believe him and how many would.
Know The Republicans would immediately be like, okay, there is no such thing as aliens. That's this is a trick. This is to get Biden's trying to get you get it re elected. I mean, I think if I think if we had had a nine to eleven type of experience with like an alien with an unidentified spacecraft, you know, if it like blew something up or landed somewhere and people were like, okay, there's fucking aliens here, Like I'd
be willing to believe it. I mean, I think if somebody pulled out like a body, unless again it was Joe Biden personally dragged an alien body onto State within and was like it was like here it is, okay, check it out. By the way, Biden, I feel like might do that, Like I feel like it's not posh. I wasn't supposed to grab this. Yeah, okay, So where do we go from here? Where do you think we're going in terms of uncovering this mystery?
Mean I think that we're finally at a point with the with the government itself, like people in Congress taking it seriously enough to investigate it internally, right, you know, And why is there a UAP task force? They're referring to off world vehicles like that's what they're Wait, do they actually refer to off world view?
They do refer to them as that, Yes, they do.
Okay, Well, Union, there's like a doc there's documented like government officials.
They have used these terms. Yeah, it's wild.
Yeah, I mean that's definitely, that's definitely a little disconcern.
There are people in power who don't think it's stupid, right, sure, now maybe they're stupid.
I don't think it's stupid. Yeah.
So, like I think that there we're going to try to get to the bottom of something, but I think that we end up in the same place. I think anyone who's crossing their fingers for some disclosure, if there was something revelatory to disclose, it wouldn't be disclosed anyways, right, It's not going to happen that way. I think there's too many cold war games going on too with it. I mean, really, I think because sciences only seem to further support the idea of et life over time and
not you know, cross that off the list. If someone like Russia or China did have spacecraft, wouldn't that be something you'd want to know? And so I think that if you did, you're not going to show your hand and do that, or maybe you don't, and maybe it's like what's going on?
Right? Right?
This is just like Independence Day. It really kind of is iconic film, I mean, perfect movie. But the idea of like the government kind of hoarding these like crafts or any evidence to like try to use it obviously for like military purposes or just under to understand it makes would make perfect sense. And yeah, you wouldn't want to tell like the other superpowers of the world, like, hey, we have this thing, because like you know, it's either
open season or who knows what like exactly. I mean, I also think it is the panic a part of it. Do you think that there's still this idea that if you tell people like there are beings from another planet that are visiting ours like that we don't understand and can't control, right, do a lot of people fly into it.
People in the government probably are concerned about that obviously because there's so much religion in our country. Yeah, but I think that that is waning a little bit as well. I think that the younger generation doesn't give a shit. They're like, yeah, we already thought they were real anyways. Yes, but you know it's it's old pop pop who is like, doesn't want to rethink his belief SYSM at ninety years old, right right right, He's trying to get to heaven.
He doesn't want to be like there's a fucking spacecraft waiting up there, but like or.
It's or goes deeper though, And I think that's what it might be too. I think it's it's.
Not as cut and dry as that. I don't think it's just like, oh yeah, there's entities out there and you know sometimes they're here. It might be more intimate than that, and it might be more alarming in that way.
Huh to me, Like the idea is so fun. I want to believe now, I like, I kind of don't know how I feel. Like I think in my like you said, people kind of accept it now. I think in the back of my mind, not even in the back of my mind. If you ask me point blank, like do you think there are aliens. I'd be like
one hundred percent. There's definitely alien life out there. There's there are intelligent beings that are as intelligent as us, if not more, and probably lots of them in the universe because we don't we just can't understand the vastness of it the place, you know, where if we kind of started on this is like whether they're here or have been here, or are looking.
Or maybe that's the biggest that's the unknown.
I mean, like it's both unknown, but that is the bigger mystery of right now.
Well, one it's easier to guess on is that like, yeah, in the infinite universe, are there more planets like Earth?
Like that?
I feel like there has to be. But then the are they coming here? As anybody is anything coming here? Like I think we want it to be true. I think we want to understand something bigger than than humanity. Like I think we want something And I don't mean just just I mean I think that religion sometimes that's what that's what religion is. It's a higher purpose, right, It's like a thing that you can't touch and understand.
Do you have to just kind of blindly, you know, lead with and it's but I think that, But I think we also want to like understand the universe better. Like I think that humans generally speaking, are you know, there's a huge amount of our time that's been spent on this planet trying to figure out the planet, you know, trying to figure out like what the fuck.
We are, where are we going? How does it all work? You know?
Like, and I think that we have an innate curiosity, And I feel like the alien thing is in some way, even with two people who do not consider themselves to have like a exploratory or scientific mind, I think it's a little bit like what is it? Like, what does it mean if that's the real thing? And I think, yeah, High Straine definitely gets into that the human aspect of it, where people are like on a personal level saying like I want to understand this. So what happens now with
the show? Is there more like do you keep going on this? Like is there more to do? Like how does this for you personally? What happens next? If anything?
I mean, I think the conversation, I think is is never going away. Just how it might be unbelievable to imagine that there's going to be some smoking gun that appears.
I think the same.
On the opposite end, there's nothing that's going to come at this point and just say it's not possible, right right. I think we're far away from that too, So the conversation is not going away, and I think we'll learn more every single day with technology and you know, the government taking different approaches and different people in power, and hopefully learn and dispel some of the myths and rumors
and conspiracies over time. So for me, this was kind of just a one of one installment, but I really do feel like we should make a second season that actually explores the sightings that are outside of the US.
Yeah, are you considering doing that?
Oh?
Yeah, absolutely. I mean that would be also great because you get to travel, right, Like that'd be fun. Yeah.
Yeah, Like I mean, do do people see UFOs in London? I know that there have been sightings in South America, and yeah, it's everywhere.
It's like every major country they have their own like UFO files, are they? Uh, they're all kinds of things, just like cars are common threads.
I think that's one that I get kind of like, why aren't they all one thing? I think we want some uniformity to this exactly.
It's like it's impossible to put it into a box, right, It's like like like, you know, it's like the thing with the cows.
You know, there's like these cows that were like dissected or exploded or whatever. And maybe that one has been debunked. I don't know, but maybe there's one alien that's like interested in the cows and it's like exploding the cows. And then there's a there's another alien, another thing that's like wants to know how our planes work and that's
why they're up in the sky. And there's another one that's like we got to probe these humans, so they're abducting the guy in the the forest or whatever, and they're.
Not all the same.
Like that to me is actually like it's not terrifying, but it is a kind of fucking crazy idea, right because we're all like, oh, they're the little green men with the big eyes.
That's what I think it is.
I think that's the reality is it's so many things and that, and it makes it more confusing and it is more alarming that way.
It's way more I mean, I think, if like if Biden came out, this is my scenarios. Biden comes out because I just love the idea of him talking about aliens just seems.
Like it'd be fine.
But he comes out, he's like, we got aliens or whatever, right, and then he's like, here they are. But but if he's like, we got aliens, but there's a whole bunch of different ones, and they got different they do different. Yeah, there's like some with like tentacles. There's one that like we don't see but it like gets into your brain or whatever. I'd be like, Okay, this is like fucked up like this, and now I'm concerned. Yeah, this is crazy.
But we'll never know because Biden doesn't fucking know. Like you said, he's not he's not being told the truth. And I mean, no, I don't know how we solve this. Maybe we never solved it. This could be I think. I think a lot of time that has to go by.
It's inevitable if the science itself keeps prevailing and we don't like stunt that, then we're going to find something as a species.
Right, I mean, like, if there's a good chance that once we get our technology advanced enough, we'll go out and find it basically, right, Yeah, then we'll be the aliens exactly, like what the fuck is this weird tic tac object invading our space?
And then it's like it's like why do they come here?
And the next thing I know, we're doing like little vacation tours of other planets where they don't they don't.
Know who we are. We got to be real quick to get out of that.
They're like probing the beings on that planet to find out what's up with them.
Yeah, I mean, it's all just a cycle.
This guy has probed like one hundred different aliens somewhere and it's not for.
Science or somebody doesn't citizens arrest on him, you know, we can bring.
Yeah.
Okay, so wait, so, so what's next for you? If you're not doing a high strange season two? You got anything else cooking? So I am doing season two?
You are? Okay? Yeah?
First things first, I'm working on my next season of Up and Vanished right now. Okay, Actually going to Alaska tomorrow for one of the cases. Wow, So back and forth all summer, but that'll come out later this year. Oh awesome. Okay, cool, Well maybe you will come back. We can chat about that like some more real world yeah or maybe I get abducted out there and I have a different stories, and that feels like the kind of place where that happens, right, It feels like the fucking Northern lights.
And I actually don't know what's up in Alaska. I've never been so weird. Shit, Yeah, a lot of space.
Well, painting this was super fun and fascinating, and I just want to say, like I have enjoyed, like digging into the stuff that you do. All Right, next time you investigate a murder or an alien, you could come back here and talk about it. An alien, Oh yeah, that's what you definitely have to come back and talk about, doll, I'll tell you.
But thank you so much for doing this. Man, I really really enjoyed it. Thanks so much. I appreciate it. Well, I think I've I think I'm convinced.
I think I'm convinced that aliens are real and they're they're here, and it's a bunch of them, like a bunch of different aliens, and they're just all vaguely visible, slightly visible.
I don't know, it's a tricky one.
I'm I'm compelled to believe that there are beings out there that want to get in touch with us.
I want to probe us.
I want to check us out, want to check out our planes, our trains and planes. But on the other hand, I'm kind of like, I don't know, man, that seems like bullshit, you know, not not not what pain is doing. Like I think that's he's like trying to dig into it. But then I'm like, you know, the guy got abducted. Did he you know, did he really get abducted? I
don't know. I feel like I'm grappling with wanting to believe, you know, like like Fox Molder on The X Files, you know, played by the Great David Duchovny, one of America's national treasures.
You know, dude wanted to believe. He seemed to believe.
Actually a lot of episodes he believed pretty strongly about all kinds of stuff. I mean, were wolves, vampires, space vampires, space were wolves. I mean it's about all kinds of stuff on that show. Godzillas, dragons, weird fish that could talk, guy could melt if he wanted to. A monkey with the two heads. I don't know that didn't happen on The X Files. But at any rate, I want to believe, and I'm going to try to believe, and that's where I'm at with this whole thing.
Well, that is our show for this week.
We'll be back next week with more what future, and as always, I wish you and your family the very best, though unfortunately I'm concerned that your family will be or has already been, abducted by aliens