Unknown Speaker 0:19
Northern Power Women podcast for your career and your life no matter what business you're in.
Simone Roche 0:26
Hello, hello, welcome to the Northern Power Women podcast and this is our We Are More season. My name is Simone Roche and I'm going to be chatting to our winners, our commended and partners of the 2022 Northern Power Women awards doing what we do best doing what we absolutely love which is showcasing and spotlighting role models. Now if you're not quite up to speed the Northern Power Women awards are delighted and proud to be the largest celebration of gender equality in Europe and I created them to highlight the amazing impact that individuals, organisations, teams and services are having whilst accelerating gender equality and wider inclusion from the North of England. ANS group won the Medium Org Award at this year's awards and as an organisation that continues to demonstrate a forward thinking and innovative approach to recruitment, development and retention of talent to promote and create inclusive cultures in the workplace. And I'm delighted to be joined by Arlene Bulfin, Director of People Development at ANS, which provide digital transformation services including public and private cloud managed hosting services, security solutions, applications, DevOps and data services. That is some business card Arlene.
Simone Roche 1:43
Welcome, welcome. You've got over 10 years' experience in education in the technology business and Arlene leads the people development and tech skills programme. So, we were chatting about that just before we started recording today and is passionately responsible for the company's apprenticeship scheme and the learning and development programme of the ANS Academy and I love the fact that you've got that academy that sits alongside, within around everything that you do, it feels like it's probably part of your whole DNA.
Arlene B 2:13
It absolutely is. Yeah.
Simone Roche 2:15
Your bio goes on forever. But really, exceptionally you know, you're a qualified IT Business Studies teacher and again, I love this because this is always profaned that everyone's career goes in different directions no one has one you know straight line trajectory. So to go from Business Studies teacher, you know, to now Director of People Development you know, every single job you've done, you brought a passion for, for skills and education to life. Your mission is to bring more girls and people from different backgrounds, beliefs with different ways of thinking and different abilities into their tech world. Hallelujah. You know, this passion I keep saying this passion about you because I've known you for a number of years even though we've not seen each other for a long time. But this is we've seen you speaking at the House of Commons on apprenticeships, running the company's local school engagement programme, over 50 local schools and winning a Princess Royal training award for the apprenticeship programme. And then October 21, the apprenticeship programme led by you Arlene was awarded outstanding by Ofsted or 1 or 2 tech businesses in the UK to get this award. And this is what I'm always so thrilled to do to be highlighting and celebrating these massive wins across the amazing businesses that we have across the North. Welcome to the podcast. Arlene. How are you doing?
Arlene B 3:33
Thanks so much one intro my goodness, I feel like I need to lay down now.
Simone Roche 3:40
These are great these bios are so you know, because actually they're not they're the story of your world, your life, your passion, your direction and the awards which you won, ANS won earlier this year. I know they mean different things to different people. But what did it mean to you and also as an organisation?
Arlene B 3:58
It was such a fabulous recognition. And when I think about the award, you know what I think about is that night... As you can imagine we've been privileged to win many awards or be invited to many awards. But we got there that night. And it's something that we've never experienced before we had two full tables from ANS only women. No men dared come that night, no, it just it just kind of happened that way. And it was an incredible recognition for what is a hard slug sometimes in the tech industry, championing gender diversity, championing the women in the business, this change in business does not happen overnight, or with one initiative or, you know, with one person, it's always such a continued effort. So it was it was a really lovely award for us and a different one. I think that's what's really special about the Northern Power Women awards. There is no award really like it or no, you know, no work and like yourself and the team do that's really specific in looking at that gender diversity. So we were hugely proud and delighted to come back and encourage more businesses to get their names out there.
Simone Roche 5:02
Absolutely. You know, I had a call this week from someone who had been nominated. And she's like I won a few years ago. And I felt like I need to step out the way and I said, listen, you know, actually your business is evolving, you know, entrepreneurs and doing amazing things. I said, your story's actually, you know, superpowered and turbo charging, you know. Actually do you have a different story to tell?
She said actually what I prefer to do is to champion and showcase others and, and encourage other people to sort of nominate and welcome that recognition as well. So I just said whatever you do, you do you you know. So I think it's so important, because whatever way we can encourage organisations and individuals to share those stories, it enables other people to go, you know what I could do that. And I think about some of the initiatives that ANS have built to create this real culture of diversity. Do you want to share some of those with us Arelene?
Arlene B 5:50
Of course, there are many, you know, lots of people always been busy. One thing that's really done well for us, and that we've really got a lot of success out of is, every year, we nominate a woman in Tech Ambassador in the business. So that's our female representative across the business, who will champion us at events and come up with more initiatives. But we've worked as well with great organisations, digital horror, help people through some of the programmes, the confidence programmes, and some of the women in the team that always works really, really well. We've got some fabulous EDA groups in the business, and really lovely groups, because all organically grown in the last couple of years. And they just keep sprouting off, which is lovely. And two of those groups are the equality networks, we've got the 10 groups. So that's a Equality Network. And that was the first gender group that we had. And then there was a splinter group really exciting in that group. When we went through the objectives a theme became clear that that women wanted a women and tech group so they splintered off. So it was really funny because the gender or the equality network kind of said, No, this, we want to make sure that that they're the initiatives that we do involve, and all genders and men, and that's the way we want to do it. And the women's group said, No, we want to take this separately. So we also have a social group that kind of came from that as well, there was women who didn't see themselves necessarily as women in tech, but women in ANS in the minority. And they said, you know what we want to get together, we want to share experiences, we want to look at topics that are relevant to us, maybe family life, work life balance, confidence in work, impostor syndrome, all of the good stuff. So now we've got this, like women in ANS social group that has appeared. And it's just recognising I suppose the value that you can add in different ways to people, when they identify in different ways.
Simone Roche 7:42
And I think that's something that's really important about, like, whatever you call them, you know, employer resource groups, or, you know, sort of what I like the idea of a whole lot of splinter groups, I have a real passion that actually you don't have to be monogamous to one group, you can dip in and out of different groups, you don't have to solely identify with one group, right? If you've got 10 within ANS, actually, you can see what happens in different groups or actually, I'm really passionate about that, or I want to, or I can be part of more than one group. You know, it's I think that's something that's, that's really important. So it's great that you've got these opportunities. And I love the fact that when people own their own groups or their own conversations they want to have that they're creating these, they are going rogue and setting them up which is, which is brilliant.
But talk to me about the company's apprenticeship scheme and the L&D, the learning and development programme that you have the Academy because we talked at the start of this and the joy and the excitement that you have in your voice when you talk about your apprentices is just so tangible. And you know, just so critical to your business growth and development.
Arlene B 8:47
Oh, absolutely. And I think after nine years, I should be weary of this Simone but I'm not, thankfully I'm still just as excited. Like I said, we brought 20 apprentices in this weekend just to see them yesterday, I was so excited for them, and because I know the opportunities that well will give them and so ANS Academy is our apprenticeship arm of the business, we are Ofsted outstanding as you mentioned at the start, I never miss an opportunity to repeat that. Only Siemens is a tech business who is also a training provider like us who has that accreditation in the country. So we're really proud of that. We were rated a Top 100 Apprenticeship Employer in the last few weeks as well, which was fabulous. So that programme is for people, young people, usually we work with a lot of schools and colleges to come into our business and begin a career in tech. It's been going for nine years. We started out with four apprentices and one of those is still here nine years later, which we're really proud of. And we work with a lot of local schools, as I said in colleges to try and open our doors to young people and say look at this fabulous career because there's still so much work to be done to show people especially young people what career in tech looks like so yeah, the apprenticeship arm that that falls in my area and then learning and development as a whole. So we've got over 700 people in ANS now, Simone we want to go for that Large Category Award at some point as well. We're coming back for that big one. Yeah, like, it's a lot of people. And there are so many cool businesses out there. And in the North, we know, you know, there's some great competition. And yeah, you can have the slides and the bars and all that great stuff, or what's going to keep people in the business is knowing that they've got progression, that they've got opportunity, techies love to learn. And my job is to try and make sure as many people in this business, everyone feels like they've got a clear path to their next step. And that we can help them get there and that we want to help them get there, like you said, in our in our pre chat, so important that you can sit with someone and say, what's next for you? Where are you going next, I know where I want to go next, I had that conversation with my boss, I'm taking her job. That's really, really important. So my team we get, we get to work all across the business. And whether it's a finance person or a comms person or techie, how can we help them feel like they're growing, and we got really hung up on exams for years, you know, we have so many people, and we put them on exam pathways. And that's really important. What we learned in the last few years is people want mentors, that has a way of developing getting out of your business sometimes. And so we have a great mentor programme. We have people job shadow, go to other teams, see what another team does, how that impacts them. And they learn from that we have people do outreach with us. So people who have nothing to do with our academy team will come and they'll talk to apprentices that talk to school groups that we've got in and that can be part of their development support people to run events. And, you know, we realise development is so much more than a linear kind of exam pathway or whatever. So my team are responsible for all of that.
Simone Roche 11:46
I think mentoring is that space, where it's about you being the best version of you, and trying to overcome some of those barriers. And there are barriers, we have a lack of women in tech, fact, you know, there's also wider barriers, cultural, class barriers, you know, we're passionate about social mobility, and, you know, really kind of opening those barriers, give us some of the things that have worked for you. Because I think one of the things we always love on the podcast is the solutions, you know, and actually, what is it that other people can look and go, oh well we can't find the women, we can't find the people from this particular demographic, we can't do this. I mean, I'm always a bit like, look harder. But you know, what, what's worked, what's worked for you?
Arlene B 12:26
So we're fortunate that over the years, we've built great relationships with schools and Simone, you know what's been really interesting. And still now we work with unis, colleges, schools, but we've gotten younger and younger and younger and primary school, you know, it blows people's minds. When I say to them, right, we're going to do a little careers fair in a primary school, and they'll say what careers for primary school children, what we know is around age seven or eight children have already made decisions about that's boys jobs, that's girls jobs. And I said to her I've got I've got 2 kids, I've got a five year old daughter, I've got a two year old son. So I'm really aware of their age, what they're told from everything around them about careers. So we have grown and this was pre COVID. So we're planning again, to kick off in the new year, we've run code clubs with local schools, where we walk them over. And after school and little after school club into our business, our apprentices run a little programming club with a little Code Club, in our office, and there's just as many girls there as boys, because what we've discovered is as they get older, when we go into year, nine options students, that's a really key time we're planning a programme now for the end of the year for January, to target year nine girls and local schools to have them look at IT as as a career option or as an option for their GCSEs. Because when we get to them, post GCSE or in college, you've got a room with 15 boys and two girls. And that's, you know you're too late then, you can convince those two girls to get a job in tech, because they're there already. So what I think we've really learned and more and more we're really going to focus on is younger, targeting younger children and schools to show them what a career in tech is, and really open up that it's not just about sitting in front of a computer, but you can be creative and you can communicate and you can move around and that there's really good opportunities. I think that's where we know our work has to focus and I think there's a you know.
Simone Roche 14:30
I'm totally on the same sheet with that there's it's a video that's been around for many years that is in that classroom of 60 younger than six or seven year olds and we're going to draw jobs today kids and this there's three supply teachers as the kids think in the room three women and at some point the women go out and get change. One's a firefighter, one's a fighter pilot and one's a surgeon and, and I'm always dismayed that the little girl like goes, Oh, it's dress up day. You're like, No, you could be wherever you want to be. So you know I love the you know, the younger, the better. I would love to well, you know, we're a micro business but there's people across our community that would love to get involved in, you know, sort of is that storytelling, isn't it? It's sharing those stories and demonstrating practically, that it's not all about being in a lab coat. It's not all about coding it's actually a mixture of everything. And there's so many pathways aren't there?
Arlene B 15:23
Yeah. And I think that's why, you know, we always flung the doors open, in HQ, to bring in as many schools as possible people in the team used to joke, you know, God, it's like being in a zoo. Every Wednesday, we will come travelling up the stairs with 30 kids following us, you know, to look at people doing their jobs. Everyone loved it, though, because there's nothing more exciting than, you know, being on a serious call. And then 30 kids just walked by your desk. And but everyone knew the importance of that of showing young people, what their world look like what that world could look like. And it having a funky office really helps with the sale, you know, to the young people. So we're not sorry about that either, you know, dogs and slides and bright colours, because it engages them and gets them really, really excited. So yeah, we look forward to doing more of that.
Simone Roche 16:09
And that culture piece is so important that you know, from the, from the very start of their career to people at the boardroom, there is that real intentional effort to pay it forward, to pay it forward and give up time to pass on skills and knowledge to the generations coming behind. That's something that you live and breathe.
Arlene B 16:28
Absolutely, I think it's something we're really proud of. And the apprenticeship programme is amazing, I'm lucky to have been so involved for this long that I get to take a lot of the credits Simone. I get to sit and have the likes of you read me out with those beautiful bios. But I actually I said this area on this week, because our apprentices started, the success of our programme is built on a culture in a business that means everyone will share their knowledge. And we will have Paul our CEO come in and meet our new group of apprentices and say to them, you're going to have a great time here work hard, we look after you, you know, all across the business, everyone sees them as a really exciting power for our business. And everyone will sit beside them and take time from their job to teach them. You could have the most incredible programmes in your business that happened in a classroom, what if people then go and sit at a desk and nobody's willing to help them learn? Forget about it. Four days a week, they're on the job as an apprentice, and one day, you know, they're off the job learning. And we've got incredible teachers in the classroom, but if people aren't willing to say come and I'll show you this. And I love it. I love walking into our technical apprentices. And you'll see one of our ANS techies, and you'll be surrounded by three or four people of our new apprentices who are saying right, this is what you do here. And, and that's what it's all about. If you don't have that culture in your business, and I've seen it a few times over the years, sadly, you won't have an incredible apprenticeship programme, that culture has to come from everywhere.
Simone Roche 17:53
And it's the peer networking as well. It's those peons, you know, as well. So it's almost like swapping, you know, within themselves that, you know, across their peer group or their cohort, if you like, tell me about the work that you've done with PwC, obviously, a massive big four consulting company, I know. Yeah, it's, we were really excited. They're doing a fabulous initiative over the year, where they're kicking off with it with a brilliant big event. And they're bringing in some great companies, all the big names, Microsoft, you know, nationally great names, and we were so honoured to be pulled in with that group, as a comparatively much smaller business. And but we're well able for the big boys, Simone. So they've kicked it off with a big event, they're bringing in tonnes of schoolchildren, and getting them excited about careers in tech. But what's really nice is it's not just a one off event, what PwC have planned is, in order to kind of be at this event, you then need to commit to opening the doors of your business across the next year. So again, something that we've done for a long time, but they are really saying to other businesses now you have to do this too. So we will be back very soon to gaggles of kids walking in around our offices, you know, looking at people working but all the businesses that are getting involved are doing that. So and again, mentoring is a part of that. And that paying it forward, paying it back, Simone is so important. Yeah.
It is. And I think there's something around that, let's take the cover or the secrecy about what the world of work looks like, guess what, it's different everywhere. Because people are different everywhere. So we think the more that we can open those doors and open it, otherwise you're just having a career chat, you know, in a without context, so the more that you can bring it to life, the better for me, and you know, what is that one thing that you would say to that young woman listening to this podcast or being passed on, you know, some of these top tips considering a career in tech who thinks do you know what I'm sure this isn't for me?
Arlene B 19:52
I think that's the powerful part of that thought is I don't know if it's for me, the most amazing thing about a career in Tech is you will find what's for you. There are so many options and it's one thing I love about our friendship with them is they get to see so many different parts of our business tech, there are hundreds and hundreds of jobs in tech different things that look completely different day to day. You know, I always ask people in the business when they meet young people, tell them what your nine to five looks like. Is it a nine to five? Are you at home? Are you the office? Are you on the phone to customers? Do you not talk to anyone? Are you in a lot of meetings, like the breadth of opportunities is so exciting you can find your tribe and your job tribe, you know, your career tribe, and you can find something that really plays to your strengths. So if they think it might not be for them, that means it's definitely for them because they don't know what it's for them.
Simone Roche 20:45
And this is all driven by people just sharing their stories and just you know, because note because no two people are the same. And everyone's experience is different. Everyone's story is different. So you know, I think that's why this is so so important. And your enthusiasm is so addictive. And it's so amazing to be chatting with you here today.
Arlene, thank you so much for joining with me here today. It really is truly inspiring to hear and inspire is a big word at times isn't it but you know it just to hear all this just such impressive and that intentional work that ANS are doing. Thank you for joining me.
And thanks all of you for tuning in today. As you know, we transcribe our podcasts, we create cheat sheets, we want you to share them. You know this is a conversation we are starting we want you to join in please let us know what you think about our pods. Or if there's anything you want us to talk about rate, review, subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and it helps us the spread stories or role models who are accelerating gender equality and wider inclusion from across here in our fabulous North.
Reach out to us on all our socials at Northpowerwomen on Twitter and Northern Power Women on all the others. Join us next Monday when I'll be joined by another wonderful role model from the northern power and community. I'm Simone Roche, you've been listening to the Northern Power Women podcast a What Goes On Media Productions.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai