Welcome it as verdict was Sentator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you on what we're referred to as an emergency pod. Senator, it's one o'clock in the morning central to Eastern AM. You've just landed and the world is still talking. At this hour. People are waking up around the world realizing that the United States of America has made history by indicting Donald J. Trump. This is a I think, a sad day, a dark day for our country. I want to get your thoughts on this for everybody that I
know is listening well, Ben, I have conflicting emotions. Part of me is angry, it is outrageous what happened earlier day. Part of me is sad because it is tragic for the rule of law. This indictment is utter and complete garbage. This is not law. This is not a prosecute Hian based on the facts. This is a political vendetta brought by a left wing partisan Democrat who was elected by George Soros, a billionaire who spent over a million dollars
to elect Alvin Bragg as district attorney. And Bragg is motivated by one thing, and that is partisan hatred on the merits. This case is utterly baseless, it is frivolous. It is a case that will most assuredly fail in court. But Bragg doesn't care. The Democrats, the media partisans who are exultant right now, they don't care. They love the fact that Donald Trump is being indicted. Never mind the fact, never mind the law, never mind guilt or innocence. They
hate the man. They are exultant for the political theater of the mug shot that will happen in the coming days. Any is there any downside to brag doing this center because there have been a lot of people saying that he overstepped here right that this was a complete overstep. There were Democrats basically begging him not to do this publicly on TV, saying he should step back from the brink. They were saying that on CNN. But if you look at New York, can you look at where's where he
would run for reelection. He's looking at becoming the governor. And that's what we've been told about him in New York. Even if he loses, even if all this is thrown out, is it still in his mind to win for him? Because it's such a partisan attack on Donald Trump. Well, look, I don't know the man, but everything about him says that he is a Zelliot said that, he says that he's an extreme partisan. I'm a conservative and I'm heartbroken today because this is such a blow to America. It's
a blow to rule of law. Our constitution was designed. Listen, they're countries all over the world. If you're in Russia, this can happen to you. If you're in China, this can happen to you. If you're in North Korea or Venezuela or Cuba. This is what banana republics do. This is what dictatorships do. If one party takes power, you'd better hope you're not the prior party because they're coming after you. They're gonna lock you up, and they may
put you in front of a firing squad. I feel confident at least Alvin Bragg won't take it to that. But America's different. We're built on rule of law. We're built on the law applying to everyone, and so as a conservative, this makes me sad, but I gotta say the irony then, if I were a liberal Democrat, I'd be horrified right now because even while this is devastating to the rule of law, to the confidence the American
people will have in our justice system. At the same time, I think this is an enormous political gift to Donald Trump. If I were a Democrat, I might well report Alvin Bragg to the Federal Election Commission, making the single greatest in kind contribution to a presidential campaign in history. This is there's a reason. Look, Trump put out almost two weeks ago that he was about to get arrested, and he said he was going to get arrested the next day,
and Bragg delayed and delayed and delayed. A lot of national Democrats were freaking out, were pressuring Bragg, don't do this, don't do this, don't do this. This will help Trump. And you know, as you know, he sent the grand jury home for a period of time. The press was reporting the grand jury had been sent home for a month. Turns out that was false. That was either misreporting or
deliberate misinformation from Brag. But I think the delay you and I speculated, we talked on the pot it may have been Bragg getting cold feet, but I'll tell you I said on the podcast that there was a very good chance Brag was going to say screw it. I hate the guy and I'm going to indicte him and all the rest of you can go jump in the lake. And sadly, that's what he's done. And you know, this is not going to be the last salvo. There's going to be more presidents indicted. This puts America on a
road that is a very very bad road. You know, you look back in history Richard Nixon, who committed multiple crimes. As you know, I'm not a Nixon fan. My latest book, Justice Corrupted, there's an entire chapter detailing the crimes and obstruction of justice and abuse carried out by the Nixon White House. But I got to say, when gerald Ford pardoned Nixon, it probably cost gerald Ford his election. It probably elected Jimmy Carter. But gerald Ford did it because
he believed he was helping the country. He believed that having a trial of the former president, even a president as corrupt as Nixon, he thought, would be deeply harmful for the country. You know, my sentiments are similar to what they were when the Democrats impeach Donald Trump, not once, but twice. And that's when verdict started. Verdict started, as you now, on the first night of the first impeachment trial against Trump, and I said at the outset, they're
starting a new chapter. This will become routine. When one party controls the House and the other party controls the White House, we will see presidents get impeached. That's not good for America, that's not good for the rule of law. And this has now escalated it even further. These are radical partisans who don't care about the rule of law. It is war by any means necessary. That's how Alvin Bragg and George Soros and the radical left approaches that.
And that's a really tragic day for America. What do we What is your hope for Republicans now, because there's been a lot of as I was watching earlier tonight just some of the reactions on TV, they said, get ready because now what's going to happen is there's gonna be a tit for tat and you're gonna see uh district attorneys start going after maybe Biden family members for
the Biden crime family. And what we've seen has come out with the millions of dollars coming in from the Russians and the Chinese, this is going to turn into we open Pandora's box. There's no way to stop this. Now, it's if you're gonna do it, We're gonna do it. I worry that we go down that road and there's
no way to turn off the Spickett. What is your your your hope and how concerned are you that maybe Republicans say, Okay, well, if Brad's gonna do it, by Galli, I'll make a name for myself and I'll go after Joe Biden and all of his allies. Well, look, that is a very real worry. Historically, the less has been more willing to do that than the right, but escalation is a very real possibility. And we've talked on this podcast before. I believe Merrick Garland. I think the Biden
DOJ is going to Hunter Biden. I think they planned to indict Hunter Biden. They've leaked it to the press, which DJ should not be leaky. But I think they planned to indict Hunter Biden for drug charges or maybe tax charges, for something that is personal and unique to him. And I think they want the public narrative to be this is a poor, tortured soul with serious substance abuse problems, and and we should our hearts should should break for
the trauma he has served. They are not, i believe, going to indict Hunter Biden for anything related to corruption from his father, which is which is the relevant public matter. It's the relevant issue of public interest. Is the sitting president engaged in corrupt business dealings? Did the sitting president as vice president engage in corrupt business dealings? That is a legitimate, important concern. Look, I'm not saying that it
is always illegitimate to indict prosecute a former president. For a president commits crimes, serious crimes, that president should be held accountable, but it shouldn't be ticky tack nonsense. And this is where and look, we did a podcast last week that went into the details of it, so I'm not going to repeat all of it, but let's do this briefly. We don't know the exact grounds on which the district attorney is indicting Trump. He has not yet
released the indictment publicly. I assume we will know in the next couple of days. But in all likelihood, the statute that he will be basing it on is New York Penal Law one seventy five Doto five. What does that do? It makes it a misdemeanor when an individual makes or causes a false entry in a business record or alters, erases, obliterates, to leites a true entry in a business record. In other words, it's a bookkeeping error.
If you write something in the books of a business enemy that is false under New York law, that's a misdemeanor. So that's the claim they're basing it on. But it's even more ludicrous than that, because it's a misdemeanor under New York law. The statute of limitations is two years.
This alleged crime occurred in twenty sixteen. The alleged crime is that, in the heat of the presidential campaign against Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump sent his personal lawyer, Michael Cohen, to pay Stormy Daniels, a porn star, one hundred and thirty thousand dollars, to cover up that she had allegedly had an affair with Donald Trump. I don't know if any of that's true or not, but that's the allegations.
None of that's illegal on the face of it. There's nothing in what I've just described it violates New York law. So what is Alvin Bragg hanging his hat on. He's saying, well, when one hundred and thirty thousand dollars was paid in the accounting ledgers, Trump recorded that one hundred and thirty thousand dollars as legal fees when it was not in fact legal fees. It was hush money, It was payoff
to Stormy Datas. Now, as I mentioned, that's a misdemeanor under New York Lasso, the statute of limitations is run, which means the prosecutor can't charge him. So how is he bringing this indictment. Well, there's another provision of New York law, new York Penal Law one seventy five point ten, that makes it a felony if you create a false business record in the furtherance of in order to commit another crime. So he's trying to bootstrap another crime to
transform a misdemeanor into a felony. Let's pause for a second and reflect on the irony. Alvin Bragg got elected. George Soros spent it over a million dollars to elect Alvin Bragg because he is reducing felonies. Every day, he's reducing felonies to misdemeanors. He's releasing violent criminals from jail. He's refusing to prosecute violent criminals. He ran on a platform of let the criminals go. But in this case, it's a bank robber, it's not a rapist, it's not
a murderer. It's Donald Trump. And to a leftist, Donald Trump is the worst thing on the face of the planet. So he's got a ridiculous legal theory to elevate a misdemeanor into a felony. And we don't know if we're sure of what alleged crime he's trying to piggyback on because he hadn't released the indictment yet, But in all likelihood it is some sort of campaign finance violation for
mischaracterizing the payment. Now, if that's the crime that is being used to bootstrap the misdemeanor to get around the statute of limitation to prosecute Trump, to the h Trump a number of true. Number one, the Federal Election Commission just declined to bring a case based on this. They looked at it and said, we don't have a case here. Number two, The Department of Justice declined to bring a
case on this main Justice. Number three, the Southern District of New York, the US Attorney in Manhattan, declined to bring a case on this, looked at it and said there's nothing here. Number four, the previous district attorney in Manhattan, Sivance, who's a hardcore liberal, looked at the facts here and said, we can't bring a case here. Everyone has looked at this and said this ain't a case. What happened? Alvin Bragg said, who baby? I hate Trump. I'm indicting me
a Donald Trump, and nothing's gonna stop me. This case will get thrown out, all right, let's walk through that, convicting him. Yeah, it's not about convicting him. I couldn't agree with you more. Let's put people so they understand because no one I have seen this anywhere Center, and that's why I want to ask you this. Lastly, no one has explained what will happen. And by the way, CNN is reporting tonight, and they have pretty good information from liberals and New York City, so that's why I
think they're probably leading this. They're getting great leaks. They're saying Trump faces more than thirty counts related to business fraud. Sources are now telling CNN he's expected appear in court on Tuesday, as the first former US president to be crimply charged he will be fingerprinted, he will have a mug shot. You just said this will be thrown out. Explain the process. Donald Trump's gonna have to lawyer up. If there's thirty plus counts here, He's gonna have to
defend himself. Obviously, just said it's going to be thrown out. Walk us down this so people understand what really happens next. Will there be a trial for example, Well, the first process is going to be Donald Trump being arrested, which is what he tweeted just under two weeks ago that
he was about to be arrested. Now because he's the former president of the United States, because he's protected by Secret Service, You're not going to have NYPD come kicked down the door of our lago and dragging away at handcuffs. The Manhattan District Attorney is talking to Trump's attorney and they're reaching negotiated terms for him to turn himself in. Now he has said publicly he's going to turn himself in. He's going to cooperate with him. So what will happen.
I don't know if it'll be Tuesday, I don't know if those leaks are accurate, but in the next several days, Tuesday is certainly plausible that that's roughly the right time period. It could be tomorrow, or it could be any day in the next week that Trump presumably will present himself in Manhattan and will turn himself in. When he turns himself in, he'll be booked. I think it is certain that they will fingerprint him. I think it is certain
that they will take a mug shot. Frankly, that's a big part of the reason Alvin Bragg wants to bring this case is to take the mugshot because it's a political attack. It's not a legal case. It is a political attack, and he wants the mug shot. How many times have you seen ben on Twitter leftists engage in fan fiction porn where they cut and paced Donald Trump's face onto the body of someone in an orange jumpsuit in prison. Yeah, countless the mug shot. They are so
excited as a political matter for that. Now, by the way, my prediction will see if this is true. My prediction is when Donald Trump takes his mug shot, he will be in a Chris blue shirt with an impeccable white Chris blue suit with an impeccable white shirt and a bright red Donald Trump tie and he will be smiling ear to ear. That's my prediction. I don't know that, but we'll find out in a few days if that's
right or not. Then it will proceed to trial. Now, before trial, there can go all sorts of pre trial proceedings. The defense can make motions, they can make motions to suppress evidence. There will be the disclosure of what called Brady material, which is the material the prosecutor has that is potentially exculpatory, that potentially demonstrates Trump is inocent. And so they'll be a back and forth. You know, Trump
will make bail. I don't know what the bail will be set at, but he's he's going to make bail and be released after his booked, and then it will proceed towards a trial. It is possible that the defense council will make a motion to dismiss the indictment. And I don't know who the New York trial judge is that the case will be assigned to. It will be
a New York state trial judge. New York trial judges tend to be quite liberal, so it's possible you'll have a judge that will allow this to linger on for some time. I gotta tell you, any judge worth his or her assault would throw this damn thing out because it's a ridiculous case. And let me get it. Two data points that are important to know, and they're data points that you're probably not going to hear on CNN.
You're not going to hear an ABCCBS or NBC. Number one, a theory similar to this was tried against John Edwards. John Edwards was the Democrat senator who ran for president, who had an affair, who had a mistress, who paid hush money, and he got prosecuted for mischaracterizing the hush money, and the case blew up at it lost, it did not succeed. That's the most on point precedent is an
absolute failure of a prosecution. But number two, and this is the fact that his studying, which is the entire predicate of the Manhattan DA's case, is that recording as legal fees a payment that was not in fact legal fees. He is a crime and a crime worthy of indictment and prosecution. If that is true, do you know who else could committed the exact same crime at the same time.
That would be none other than Hillary Rodham Clinton So all of this conduct occurred during the twenty sixteen campaign, during the general election, when it was Trump versus Clinton. That's when Michael Cohen allegedly paid Stormy Daniels one hundred and thirty thousand dollars and they characterized it as legal fees. At the exact same time, Hillary Clinton's campaign paid over
a million dollars to develop the Steel Dossier. You remember the infamous document that is filled with things like the petain, the allegations of lurid sexual activities from Donald Trump that the media was so excited when it broke it just happened to all be garbage and made up fiction. The Hillary Clinton campaign commissioned the entire thing. They paid for it. They paid over a million dollars. And you know what, the Hillary Clinton campaign called the payments to fabricate the
Steele dossier legal fees, the exact same thing. So the identical conduct characterizing something as legal fees that was not legal fees occurred in the identical jurisdiction Manhattan at the exact same time twenty sixteen. If this is a crime, then objectively, Hillary Clinton not only committed the same crime, she committed it ten x Trump allegedly did it at one hundred and thirty thousand dollars. Hillary Clinton did it at over a million dollars. Not the truth of the
matter is neither one of them is a crime. It's a tikie tech book. Keepee would prosecute Hillary Clinton or zero because he supports Hillary Clinton, and that's not how
a prosecution should proceed. Last question for you, I want to ask, and this is I think a bigger Just step back and think about this from a different perspective of how much damage has been done for the future of this country today because of this indictment, the fact that in twenty twenty three, we have lost our way to the point where we're indicting on garbage charges as you described it, former Presidency United's America. And is there any way to get this back in the box afterwards
or is the damage that's been done? Will it ever go away? Look, it is very very hard. As you know. I've been concerned about this for a long time. Several months ago, I wrote my latest book. My latest book is on exactly this topic because I saw this happening.
My latest book is called Justice Corrupted. How the Left is weaponized the legal system and it describes how Barack Obama and Joe Biden have corrupted the Department of Justice, have corrupted, the FBI, have corrupted, the IRS, have corrupted, the CIA, have weaponized the legal machinery. It talks about Alvin brag It talks about George Soros. DA's elected with millions of dollars from George Soros to undermine the rule of law. And listen, I did not. I wasn't happy
writing the book Justice Corrupted. I love the American justice system, I love the rule of law. My entire life has been devoted to the Constitution, literally since I was a teenager. When I was thirteen, I was part of a group called the Constitutional Corroborators where we memorized the Constitution in shortened amountic form. Yes, Ben, I was one heck of a geek. You were a jock hi ass in high school. But that was me. You are a pretty geeky jock.
I will give you that. My assid high school. But look, my entire life, the Constitution, the Bill of Rights. It has been the pinnacle of human liberty in the entire existence of mankind. And I wrote Justice Corrupted because I saw these hardcore partisans these leftists, these Marxists, willing to use the machinery of justice just as a cudgels as
a club to beat their political opponents, and I was horrified. Look, I'm going to encourage everyone go on to Amazon right now buy Justice Corrupted if you want to know what happened here. This book details exactly what led to today's indictment, and it, unfortunately, I think it only gets worse over the next two years under Joe Biden. I can promise you one thing. We're gonna keep you update on this.
I have a feeling this is going to have a lot of moving parts, and the weeks and the months ahead, it'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. We will let you get you behind the scenes and let you understand the legal aspect of this, which I think is one part that's lacking. And I appreciate you center explaining what is going to happen next, just in
the short term, because people want to know. They're afraid that the present is going to be ineligible, that he can't run, that if there's a trial, he's not gonna be able to run. All that is also not true. Even if this goes forward, he is not ineligible. It
is completely false. The only way that a president can be ineligible to run is if the president is impeached, which takes a majority of the House, and convicted, which takes two thirds of the Senate, and the Senate imposes the penalty of making him ineligible to run for office. That is not going to happen. That has not happened, and so the fact of an indictment has zero effect
on Trump's being able to run. It has zero effect on his being able to win the primary, It has zero effect on his being able to win when the general, has zero effect in his being able to serve as president. This is an effort by Alvin Bragg and radical Democrats to steal the election. The irony is all of these Democrats who have clutched their pearls and said, defend democracy, defend democracy. Well, you know what, they're all full of
crap because they don't believe in democracy. Look, if you don't like Donald Trump, vote against him, but don't abuse the justice system by trying to bring bogus charges because you're afraid that the voters might actually vote for the guy. That's not democracy. It's the opposite of democracy. And these Marxists don't care. They are carrying down American democracy and it's why as I sit here at one sixteen in
the morning, I'm pitstocel Yeah, Center, thank you. I think this is one of the most important podcasts that we have done, and people want to know what's happening, and I think this will help distinguish the bas and the spend from the reality of the situation. We will be back with you whenever big, big news like this breaks, even if it's at one twenty in the morning, and we'll be back with you obviously in a couple of days as well. We'll see you then. Everybody pray for our country.