Welcome.
It is Vertical Center, Ted Cruz ben Ferguson with you. It is very nice to have you with us. By the way, this episode is also going to be up on YouTube as well, so if you want to watch the episode, you can watch it. Hit that subscribe button there so you don't miss an episode on YouTube that we do. We've got a lot centered to talk about, including this headline, the Department of Justice Task Force finds quote numerous instances of anti Christian government bias under the
Biden administration. This is a massive story basically about the government going after Christians.
Well, the facts are deeply disturbing. During the Biden administration, we saw the federal government target people of faith, but in particular believing Christians, believing Christians were persona non grata under the Biden administration. And when President Trump came in, he created a task force chaired by Attorney General Pam Bondi looking at instances of religious discrimination within our government.
This was the preliminary report.
From that task for force, detailing how multiple government agencies under the Biden administration targeted Christians for persecution.
We're going to break all that down.
We're also going to talk about a very sad development, which is the spiral down of Tucker Carlson. Tucker Carlson continues to get more and more extreme, and this week he decided to say that he wanted to apologize to Osama bin Laden's family, and he also said astonishingly enough, that he didn't know if Hamas was a terrorist organization. He's just asking questions. Gosh, what has Hamas ever done to us? It really is sad to see what has happened to someone who used to be a conservative stalwart.
He used to be not nuts all that on today's pod.
If you've ever listened to the show before, you know I'm a big advocate for the Second Amendment and I've shared on numerous occasions how carrying a firearm literally saved my life from a gang related attack. But many of you out there may not feel comfortable carrying a firearm.
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this story. And this task force that was put together to a dedicate anti Christian bias in our government is actually chaired by the Attorney General Pambondy, and what they have found is under the Biden administration, they weaponize the quote full way of the federal government against Christians that according to Trump's leadership, they laid out a new report where there are numerous instances of past anti Christian bias and recommendations to protect faith in America, especially when it
comes to our federal government going after people of faith.
Well, as you noted, Pambondi, the Attorney General, chairs this task force. We've had Pambondy as a guest on this podcast right at the beginning of her tenure, and let's break down what the task force found.
Here's what Fox News reports.
Quote, the Biden administration weaponized the full weight of the federal government against Christians, according to Trump leadership, laying out in a new report the numerous instances of anti Christian bias and recommendations to protect faith in America. This report, the task Force had a clear mandate to ensure that quote, any unlawful and improper conduct, policies, or practices that target
Christians are identified, terminated, and rectified. And here's what the task Force says in the overview the damage that can be done when religious liberty is not protected and preserved for all Americans. The Task Force makes this commitment. The federal government will never again be permitted to turn its
power against people of faith. Under President Trump an Attorney General Bondi's leadership, in partnership with all members of this task Force, the rule of law will be enforced with vigor, and every religion will be treated with equality in both policy and action. And the report adds the days of anti Christian bias and the federal government are over. Faith is not a liability in America, it is a liberty. And I want to go through their numerous instances of
anti Christian bias that the report lays out. The report concludes Joe Biden weaponized the full weight of the federal government against Christians and trampled on their fundamental First Amendment rights. The task force founded the Department of Defense, the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, and the Department of Labor all quote deprioritized, mishandled or denied requests for religious exemptions to the Bide
administration's COVID nineteen mandate. So that's one aspect where you had believing Christians that wanted an exception to the COVID mandate and the Biden administration. If you're a Christian, you
need not apply. The task Force also found that the Department of Education, under the Bide administration quote, attempted to impose record breaking fines on some of the nation's largest Christian universities, including Liberty University fourteen million dollars and Grand Canyon University thirty seven point seven million dollars.
By the way, let's just stop there and talk about Liberty University. So if people understand the history of Liberty, Liberty University has been a front end center university that is of Christian faith, Christian values, Christian students. They have had many, by the way, political people come there to speak, Conservatives obviously among those. That is a clear attack on that university, trying to hurt that university.
In my opinion, your thoughts.
Look, as you know, in twenty sixteen when I ran for president, I launched my presidential campaign at Liberty University. Speaking at that convocation in March of twenty fifteen, it was incredible. We had about ten thousand students there. Liberty is a tremendous institution, but it is a Bible believing Evangelical Christian university. And to the Biden that meant it was an enemy, that mint it was someone to be persecuted,
to be targeted. And this pattern of animus it really combines two things, one the deep distrust and hatred of evangelical Christians, with two the weaponization of government. The willingness of the Biden administration to say, we've got the Department of Justice, We've got the FBI, we've got the Department of Labor, We've got the Department of Education, We've got the irs. We are going to use government to go after our enemies. That is a pattern we saw for
four years. I'm really glad this task force is laying out the results because the results. But by the way, the Department of Homeland Security, here's what the task force found that Customs and Border Protection omitted Christian perspectives from a directive for detainees, but deliberately noted accommodations for Islam sects of Judaism and Rastafarianism. In other words, under the Biden administration, and if you're a Rastafari and Yaman, that
was fully protected. Yeah, but God forbid you're a Bible believing Christian. They never heard of you. Sorry, no one here, no new number who.
This Yeah, well, and you look at this, and it goes back to there were a lot of I think suspicions, right, and the suspicions were that the administration was anti Christian. If you brought up, of course, everybody in the media is like, that's absurd, that's absurd. We're now getting the documentation to show that, yes, these groups and organizations, universities, actually felt like they were clearly being targeted, were right and now vindicated. The question is, how do we make
sure this hasn't happened again. That's part of what Pambonding and the trum administration are trying to accomplish here.
One of the most powerful tools is sunlight.
And one of the things that I've urged PAMBONDI, I've rged just about every Department of Justice official who has been confirmed.
I've verged urged.
Cash Mattel, the head of the FBI, is engage in radical transparency. I've urged Bobby Kenned at HHS, engage in radical transparency. Shine a light on what the Biden administration did. Make it public. Look much of this abuse of power. It's like cockroaches. It thrives in the darkness. It thrives when it is hidden. There is power to just shining a light on it. And by the way, if anyone violated the law, if anyone committed a criminal act, they
ought to be prosecuted. That's the next step of this inquiry. But the very first thing is just exposing it. So, for example, let's take a law, the Face Act, the Freedom of Access to clinic entrances, Act. The task force found the Department of Justice under the Biden administration arrested and convicted approximately two dozen individuals under the Face Act for praying and for demonstrating outside abortion facilities. And let me stop and repeat that. They arrested approximately two thousand
dozen individuals for praying. That was deemed a criminal offense. Praying and demonstrating. Well, there is that whole thing called the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, the first Amendment that protects the right to free speech. But not under Joe Biden. If your speech was in defense of the right to life, if your prayer was in the defense the right to life, they viewed you as a
criminal defendant. And yet, the way the Face Act is written, it is written to prevent to protect the right of access to an abortion clinic, but it is also designed to protect the right of access to places of worship and crisis pregnancy centers. Here's what the report founded. They would not enforce it for churches or crisis pregnancy centers. It was a pure double standards. If their politics agreed
with you, then bring out the jack boots. If you're a little old lady praying, get ready to be in handcuffs. But if it's a church, if it's a pregnancy access center. By the way, we saw radical pro abortion forces fire bombing ignancy access centers, and yet the Department of Justice did no arrests. It was simply not a priority. At the same time, the task Force lays out that at the FBI, the FBI specifically targeted quote radical traditionalist Catholics
as domestic terrorism threats. As treasury, the task Force points out that many quote pro Christian groups have been debanked.
This was a pattern across the board.
The State Department quote limited humanitarian relief to Christians relative to other populations and offered muted response to attacks on Christians compared to other groups. And at the State Department, the task force said it discovered evidence that quote preferential employment practices were afforded for those of non Christian religions,
while Christian employees quote were disfavored. And it continues to say it was particularly concerning that employees were less likely to be permitted leave for observation of certain Christian holidays as opposed to non Christian holidays.
All right, so you hear that center, and then here comes a million dour question. We've exposed it. Right, that's great news. We've found it. Is there going to be any accountability now? I asked that question, also asking this, The task Force says they had a clear mandate again Pambini in charge to ensure quote that any unlawful and improper conduct policies or practices that number one target Christians they're identified, then terminated, and then they say it will
be quote rectified. So I hear that, I'm actually a little bit hopeful. Does that mean, and I want you to put your lawyer hat on here, does that mean that there's a real chance people could actually not only lose their job, but actually be charged with crime.
Well, I very much hope. So the first step is just transparency, making it public, cataloging it, giving specific instances. This report, this reports a preliminary report. They're planning to put out a more fulsome report with extensive details and as much as they can catalog it and build a public record that is valuable. It is important not just to have it abstract, but to identify who the decision
makers were. Some of those decision makers are going to be political appointees from the Biden administration who are gone.
Who are out of office.
Other decision makers are going to be career government employees who eagerly participated in the persecution of Christians. At a very minimum, any career federal government employee who persecuted Christians should be terminated. They should lose their job. It is important for that to be a firing offense because unfortunately, at some point in the future we're going to have another Democrat administer and the pattern we've seen from Bill Clinton to Barack Obama to Joe Biden is we've seen
each Democrat administration get worse and worse and worse. And so whenever we have the next Democrat administration, if we don't do something significant, we can anticipate it will be even worse. One of the significant things is if people lose their jobs. If it becomes clear if you target Christians, if you violate the law, you will be terminated. That is important as a deterrent. It's also important for accountability, and then if anyone violated the law, if anyone committed
criminal conduct, they should be prosecuted. And the most likely instance of criminal conduct is if they lied under oath. And you frequently have individuals who testify before Congress or otherwise are lying under oath. That's the most direct way of criminal liability. You know, we rememberer back to Lois Lerner, who during during the the Obama administration targeted Christians at the I R S. And Lois Lerner ended up pleading the fifth in front of Congress. She ended up refusing
to testify. She ended up being held in contempt of Congress, and then the Obama administration refused to do anything about it. The Obama Department of Justice refused to prosecute the contempt finding. That's a pattern that should not be replicated, and so everyone who violated the law needs to be accountable. That's important both for holding people accountable for past conduct but also for deterrents going forward.
All right, Senatra, I want to move to another issue, and this one deals with Tucker Carlson. I was actually genuinely shocked by the audio when this broke. I really couldn't believe what I was witnessing when this audio broke. Tucker Carlson is now coming out and he's, like said sang, he wants to give condolences to a Sabin Lauden's family, and he says he's not even sure the Hamas is actually a radical Jihadis organization.
Those are his words. What in the hell is going on here?
Yeah, Ben, you and I both know Tucker Carlson well, and something is wrong with Tucker Carlson. I don't know what the hell is wrong with him, But look, Tucker is someone He's very smart, he's very talented. During the COVID lockdowns, Tucker's monologue every night was destination TV. He was unloading on idiotic practices that were shutting our country down.
I called him the midst of COVID.
I said, Tucker, you're the single best thing on television every single night. Thank you for doing what you're doing. I look at the Tucker today, he is unrecognizable. As listeners of this podcast know, I went on Tucker's show. I knew Tucker was going to come after me. I knew he was going to come after me, and sadly do so dishonestly. In the course of that two hour by back and forth, it was a lot of firefight. It was a bloodbath. I think on both sides. You
saw Tucker engage in bizarre counterfactual assertions. He said, for example, Iran's not trying to kill the president. What do you mean no, no, no, no, no, Iran. There's no evidence Iran's trying to kill the president. That is, of course absurd. Multiple people have been indicted for being Iranian agents, trying to kill the president, trying to kill former US senior officials.
But but and and.
Tucker bizarrely said, you know, if Iran was trying to kill the president, well then we should nuke them, which which was a really bizarre proposition. No, we should not be nuking Iran or anyone else. But I got to say, the week that I did the Tucker interview was the week right before the President launched the bombing attack on
Iran's nuclear facilities. And and Tucker was was spiraling at the time because he was attacking Donald Trump and saying, if the United States bombs Iran, he said, it will be World War three. Number one, Yeah, he said, thousands of Americans will die. Number two, And he said America will lose. Number three, that Iran will beat us in World War three.
Yes, every one of.
Those, so he said at the time it was shocking when he said, everybody was like, what are you talking about.
America is going to lose to Iran? Are you kidding?
Me. Every one of those predictions we now know the truth. They were laughingly, entirely totally false. And I got to say, for some reason, when when Tucker tried desperately to convince President Trump not to bomb Iran's nuclear facilities and Donald Trump disagreed with Tucker Carlson, and Tucker put out his newsletter and said, well, you're not America first if you bomb Iran, and Trump responded, no, I'm the one that decides what America First is, and I'm telling you right
now defending America is America First. I gotta say it just started Tucker on this downward spiral. So in the weeks and months since then, he had some loon professor on talking about Hitler and saying, you know, there's a very good argument the United States should have intervened in World War Two on the side of Hitler and the Nazis, and Tucker kind of nods, no, there is not a good argument America should have supported the Nazis. The Nazis
were evil period the end. I gotta say, any commentator, if you're sitting around thinking, you know what I need to do. I need to go out and embrace Adolf Hitler. Defend Hitler. Just pause right there.
Think about what you're doing.
Right.
There are very few ironclad rules in politics, or history or life, but I'll give you one. Adolf Hitler always, always, always bad. Just trust me, this is a safe ground to be on. Yeah, Hitler bad.
Let me add number two to the list real quick, because if you go Hitler first in there next for especially for people that are I don't know, forty five and under, the most evil guy that we probably saw in our lifetime in real life, and that was a guy by the name of Osama bin Lauden, right like, throw him out there nine to eleven if you were alive, if you remember it. Osama bin Ladd's another one. Don't
don't side with Adolf Hitler. And if you were my age, I'm forty four now, don't whatever you do, don't side with Osama bin Laden, which brings us to this unhinged Tucker point number two.
Yeah, okay, I just want you to listen to what Tucker had to say about Osama bin Laden.
Give a listen.
Let me just say I would be totally comfortable sharing condolences with Osama bin Laden's family. I hate Osama bin Laden. On the other hand, if somebody dies, it's okay to say I'm sorry to his family that he has a murder. That's what I'm saying. Yeah, that's immaterial. I would say that to the family of an executed murderer in a prison. It doesn't mean I support the murderer or the murderer. But this is family, Like, that's okay. That's called like human decency and anyone who's against that.
Yeah, and.
This, let me just be clear, if I meet any of the Osama bin laden family members center, I'm not gonna walk up back. Let me give you American hug, real quick thoughts and prayers like, No, that's not gonna happen.
Look, this is a bizarre position that that Tucker says he's okay with giving condolences to Osama Bin Lauden's family. By the way, on his same reasoning, he'd be just fine giving condolences to Adolf Hitler's family. Let me tell you right now, I am not remotely sorry that Osama bin Lauden is dead. I'm not remotely sorry that Adolf Hitler is dead. By the way, I'm not remotely sorry that Jeffrey Dahmer is dead. I'm not remotely sorry that
Ted Bundy is dead. I'm not remotely sorry that Charles Manson is dead.
Yeah.
If people are evil, psychotic mass murderers, then society celebrates that they are no longer with us.
There is justice.
I believe in the principle of justice and understand. Osama bin Laden led out Kaita. He planned nine to eleven. He executed nine to eleven, in which case nearly three thousand people, most of whom were Americans, were murdered. On September eleventh, You and I were both alive. I was in Washington, d C. Heidi was in the White House at the US Trade Representative's office on nine to eleven. She evacuated the White House because those terrorists were murdering people.
I lost a friend of mine, Barbara Olsen, in the plane that crashed into the Pentagon when the two towers collapsed in New York City. That was a grotesque act of war. By the way, I'm also not sorry that the kamikaze pilots in Pearl Harbor who murdered American sailors, I'm not sorry that they're dead. There is something bizarre.
There is a moral relativism to saying, well, we should number one carry out an incredible military act that takes out Wasama bin Laden, But then number two express condolence to the family, to the toddlers, We're so sorry we took out your psychotic daddy who murdered nearly three thousand Americans. No, we're not sorry. And this moral relativism, I gotta say
it is a weird thing. Yeah, when someone who considers himself calls himself a conservative sounds exactly like Ilhan Omar, it is a weird thing when a supposed conservative sounds like Rashida Talib, sounds like the AOC and says, gosh, we ought to be saying I'm sorry to Osama bin Laden's family.
No we should not.
By the way, it's also weird that he goes in this way like attacking America in our foreign policy in essence and anybody that doesn't feel sorry for Terris, while also giving propaganda out there on behalf of Vladimir Putin and Russia with the interview that he did with him, and then going shopping at the grocery store saying how great life is in Russia, which if you go twenty miles outside of Russia, in any direction of Moscow. It's very different than what it looks like for the elite
that are in Moscow. And everything in his trip was, by the way, also controlled. They only let you see what they want you to see. It's not like he can roam freely and decide, Hey, I don't want to go to your sure, you send me too. I want to go to another one that ain't gonna happen. And then you go from this to what he had to say about a terrorist organization that has killed countless Jews and is said from the river to the sea, they want to take out and annihilate all all Jews in Israel.
They want Israel to cease to exist. And he's like, well, hold on a second, maybe they're not a terrorist organization. Maybe they're just a political organization. We should think about that. It's like, what the hell's going on?
Yeah, give a listen to what he said about hamosbus because this is utterly bizarre. This is where Tucker has gone full on woke leftist and don't take my word for it.
Listen to Tucker.
No one can plausibly claim that a Christian family or in Hamas Okay, So, like, what tell me, you can't claim that they're in Hamas will simultaneously claiming that Hamas is uh you know, grupugie hotties, their Islamic extremists, which they also claim constantly, which I don't know if that's true. By the way, it seems more like a political organization. But whatever it is, they're telling us constantly they're al Qaeda, So it can't also be true that Christians are a member.
Of al Qaeda.
Sorry, yeah, yeah, So then we know they're not an Amas. So why did they get killed? Why was their church book?
I go back to this and I again it's like he's become an apologist for a terrorist organization, and he's saying, well, they're not really a terrorist organization. They there, and then the Christian aspect of this intertwarting that they're going, well, then why do we kill them?
We kill people that are terrorist centered, that's what we do.
Well, what he's saying there is bizarre. I don't know that Hamas is a terrorist organization. Let me be very clear, Hamas is a terrorist organization.
He'll tell you that, by the way, Am I wrong? Like they'll actually tell you they're a terrorist organization. They're happy to tell you this and show you how good they are at it.
Al Qaeda is a terrorist organization. ISIS is a terrorist organization. This is not just a question of opinion. This is a question of facts. So let's give some fact. Article eight of the nineteen eighty eight Hamas Covenants states quote Jahad is its path, and death for the sake of Allah is the loftiest of his wishes. This is who
Tucker Carlson is defending. Globally, HAMAS is designated a terrorist organization by the United States of America, that as a matter of federal law, by Australia, by Canada, by Paraguay, by Israel, by Japan, by New Zealand, by the United Kingdom, and the European Union. Now HAMAS is not formally designated by Arab countries. But HAMAS is a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood. By the way, I have legislation in the Senate right now to designate the Muslim Brotherhood as a
terrorist organization because they unquestionably are. Article two of Hamasa's charter describes them as quote one of the wings of the Muslim Brotherhood. In Palace Stein, the Muslim Brotherhood, the umbrella organization is designated as a terrorist organization in Bahrain, in Egypt, in Saudi Arabia, and in the UAE. They have always been a terrorist organization if you just look at Wikipedia. No no friend of Israel, no enemy of Hamas. Here's what Wikipedia says.
Quote.
From two thousand to two thousand and four, Hamas was responsible for killing nearly four hundred Israelis and wounding more than two thousand in four hundred and twenty five attacks. According to the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, from two thousand and one through May of two thousand and eight, Hamas launched more than three thousand Casam rockets in two thousand,
five hundred mortar attacks into Israel. And of course, Hamas is who carried out the October seventh attacks, who sent death squads into Israel, where they systematically went house to house, murdering every person in the held, targeting them because they are Jews. They murdered elderly people, they murdered women, they murdered children, they murdered infants, they murdered toddlers, They raped women and little girls, and they murdered over twelve hundred Israelis,
many of whom were Americans. It's one of the worst terror attacks in history against American citizens. And Tucker says, well, I think they're a political organization. He bases this on the weird fact. Yes, it is true that in the Gaza strip when they had elections, Hamas won. The fact that the voters elected a tort terrorist organization does not make them a political organization. They were in elected office
when they carried out the October seventh terror attacks. And so I got to say, look, this bizarre statement wasn't in the course of an episode where Tucker was interviewing this disgruntled State Department employee who was fired hired by the Trump administration, yep, and he was giving him an opportunity.
And by the way, he was also slandering uh a young man who works for the State Department, works for Mike Huckabee, the President Trump's ambassador to Israel, works for Marco Rubio and and and Tucker did an entire segment attacking this young man. Why because he's Mark Levin's stepson. I gotta say, it is grotesque for Tucker to go after Mark Levin.
He does, And let's explain why real quick, because I'm look Mark's a dear friend of mine in yours as well. This is a relative Mark Levin. Mark Levin is clearly an advocate for Israel. He has stood there and for America, let's be clear, and for America America. And so now since Tucker Carlson, I guess is like, all right, well, anybody under that I don't like, right, Mark Levin a family member, Let's just hammer that person to somehow make
it hurt. I wish she had this much animosity towards Vladimir Putin when he was interviewing him.
And by the way, not just Flatimir Putin, he yet the president of Iran. And I mean it was a love fest. I mean he practically spooned with the president of Iran. I don't know if he was big spoon or little spoon, but there was no skepticism.
And by the way, he's.
Literally interviewing someone who is actively trying to murder Donald Trump. And this is a weird game. So listen, Tucker recognizes that the folks that listen to him will get very mad at him if he explicitly criticizes Donald Trump.
So what does he do? Instead?
He just criticizes everything Trump does. He blasts. He has a whole segment on how Mike Huckabee is terrible. Well, who is it that appointed Mike Huckabe the ambassador to Israel? That would be Donald J.
Trump.
And everything he attacks about Ambassador Huckabee, he is doing on behalf of Trump. But Tucker is unwilling. He doesn't have the courage, you don't have the backbone to actually attack Trump, so he just attacks everything Trump does. He attacks bombing Iran. Well, who was the commander in chief who made the order? And by the way, that was
an incredibly successful military operation that made America safer. I gotta say listen, if you say something publicly and the words you said are indistinguishable from something said by Ilhan Omar or Rashida Talib, that ought to be a sign you've got a problem. And I don't know what's going on with Tucker. I don't know what is driving. It's one thing to feel kind of isolationist and to say, gosh, you know, I don't like wars. Okay, fine, that is a view. And to be clear, Donald Trump doesn't like
wars either. Joe Biden and the Democrats get us in war. President Trump has gotten us out of war. But getting us out of war you do it through strength, and getting us out of war does not mean that you refuse to defend America. Fine, if Tucker wants to be isolationist, knock yourself out. But this are apology and defense of Osama bin Laden, the defense of Hamas, and defense of
the president of Iran. That is, there is something unhinged, and I hope people around Tucker go in and say, come on, man, yeah, come come on, let's say we love America and we're not gonna lie.
To the American people.
Yeah.
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