Welcome to today's edition of The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show podcast.
Welcome everybody. Tuesday edition of The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show kicks off right now. We are here in our nation's capital, probably the best it's been in a long time.
It is pretty spectacular. It's very beautiful.
Unlike during the inauguration, it is absolutely perfect weather here. So I am not clearing the icicles from my nose and my eyes this time. But we have a lot to talk to you about, and we'll dive into some of it. We're all so excited to be setting up some pretty important interviews and sit downs and chats with the people who make this town run and this White House,
which is doing a phenomenal job. Clay, You're going to have to make sure that I don't go over too much of the territory when I was on a flight yesterday that you cover with these LA riots. Here's what I've got for the latest marines, seven hundred marines order to assist in lost Los Angeles. They are expected to arrive, well, they have been arriving. We've got Mayor Adams of New York City saying that there are anti ice riots in
LA that would be totally unacceptable in New York. So they're drawing a pretty hard line on that when you've seen some other places Austin, Tampa where there are reports of some gatherings beginning. We're very clear on this. I think everyone's very clear on this. The right to protests obviously protected under the First Amendment. The right to loot a foot locker or a CVS or whatever is not
in fact covered under the First Amendment. And this whole fight over illegal immigration enforcement is absolutely critical for the administration and Clay I'm happy to see so far they are taking the law and order perspective and not backing down one inch, because this is setting a tone for the rest.
Of the four years as well.
Yeah, what I was talking about yesterday is I do think this is a really concrete difference between Trump one point zero and Trump two point zero. And you remember very well everyone out there does. In the summer of twenty twenty, the entire nation came unglued, and I think a big part of that was Tim Walls, governor of Minnesota, refusing to call out the National Guard in time to bring peace to Minneapolis. And then what happened in Minneapolis.
Skyrocket had spiraled everywhere, and for many people it was the end of the COVID restrictions, as you well remember, because doctor Anthony Fauci suddenly came out after telling people that they couldn't be in any groups at all, and said, well, hundreds of thousands of people can actually come out in the streets in March. And many people said, wait a minute, you were telling us that we couldn't go to the kids, couldn't go to school, we couldn't have non essential remember
that phrase non essential business is open. And suddenly you decide that everybody should be able to go out in March in the summer of twenty twenty. And I think in retrospect, Trump wishes that he had called out the National Guard in Minnesota and tried to nip this in the bud. And so I think this is Trump two point zero saying we're not going to allow these protests
to flourish and take root like we did in twenty twenty. Also, the difference being it's not an election year, which means that whatever the impact is of the Trump response is not immediately going to the ballot box, which is why I think they were apprehensive and I think quite frankly slow on dealing with those riots back in twenty twenty. So this is Trump saying I learned from the first term, We're not going to have this happen.
That was one of the biggest mistakes I would argue in the Trump first term was people often talk about Fauci looked very hard in that moment to understand all the implications of the CDC and allowing them to set these policies. And I mean, I remember I spoke to Trump in I've told you about this, I've talked to the audience about this, May of twenty twelve, talk to you about all this, and he said, look, we're going to leave this to the states.
There was a lot that was.
Unknown then looting and rioting. We knew that was bad, and there was a period where there was not nearly a firm enough response in twenty twenty. I think that that was a lesson learned for the administration. I think this time around, they are showing that it's very easy to draw this line here. Yes, you want to gather lawfully and protests, that's great, that's America. The moment you start blocking highways throwing rocks at cops, breaking into stoes,
stealing things. You are in violation of a number of statutes, and the law still apply to you, no matter how upset you are on this issue of a legal immigration. It's interesting, Clay, I've seen a shift in the conversation on the right from what about the big beautiful bill to this is an all or nothing issue meeting. We either enforced sovereignty and begin to deport some of the ten million that Biden brought in, or nothing else matters.
I agree with that.
I think if we don't establish secure borders and interior enforcement, we just have a de facto open border. And all the implications of this. I mean what you're seeing in southern California, the massive expense that is born not just by the taxpayers of California, but by the federal taxpayer as well. There's all this money that is that is funneled from federal dollars to medical which is like California's version of Medicare medical Medicare medicaid rather medical. And the
apportionment issue with members of Congress. You have far more Democrat members of Congress, and the estimates, I think it's a couple of dozen nationwide.
Seemed to twenty at least. And this is important. I think.
I don't think a lot of audience even understands this because I didn't know it. Illegal immigrants get counted for purposes of congressional districts. So when you say roughly seven hundred thousand people are being represented, if there are twenty million illegals, that is helping Democrats because they're overwhelmingly clustered in sanctuary cities and otherwise there would be less Democrat representatives. Enormously important, and it also is a reminder to everybody.
As we'll talk, we'll go deep into the law and order aspects of all this and why it's so important that Trump is following through. The administration has to see this through. This is just the beginning of it too. But Clay, this is something what happens in Los Angeles. I think there had been an idea that a lot of people had. Oh, that's not really my problem. You know, I live in Nebraska. That's not really my problem. I live in a nice red state. You know, I live
in South Carolina. And so if California wants to have two or three, I'm sorry, Los Angeles County alone wants to have two or three million illegals in it, that's their problem. No, it's actually your problem in South Carolina too. It's a problem for the whole country. It's a problem because of the balance of power that it is affected
by with Congress. And it's a problem because the whole point here that the Democrats are pursuing is to make sure that there's a pathway to voting, not just citizenship voting for all the illegals who have come here, which would make a day facto one party state. So this is everybody's issue.
The days where we would tell ourselves, oh, it's just a blue state, red state thing, I think that has passed. I think everyone understands. Biden let in ten million plus illegals on purpose. People keep telling me, I don't know, No one knows. No one knows. I mean, the administration doesn't know this. One doesn't know what the full number that came in under Biden is because it was so out of control that it's impossible to tabulate. We just
know that it's officially at least ten million. That's a massive state of illegals that have been added to the US tally.
Totally I mean, it's more than the people who live in I think it's all but like fifteen states. I mean the population of the state of Tennessee, where I live, I believe is around seven million, So more than the state of Tennessee has been let in in four years, just in illegal.
And also keep in mind there's now some focus on the Reagan Amnesty, which I've talked about here in the show. Back in nineteen eighty six, what happens probably the worst thing that Reagan did as president. Unfortunately, Reagan did great things, defeated communism, defeated the Soviet Union, but that was bad, and it was much worse than I think anybody, even Republicans at that time realized, because not only was the amnesty far larger.
Than it was supposed to be.
We're signing this law, right, this is back in nineteen eighty six, and now we're going back now forty years. We're signing this and we're going to get border security. And what you got was an amnesty several times larger, millions of people, larger than what they thought it would be because of the way the courts went, and you know, everyone was trying to be covered under that amnesty. They were hearing challenge lenges I think into the early two thousands.
So think about that in nineteen eighty six Ambassy. There are people in like nineteen ninety nine who are saying I'm covered under that too, And then it was a massive incentive for more illegal immigration for the years and years to come. Can you think about it this time? Right? If we just said, you know what, we'll take the ten million who came under Biden, does any serious person believe that there'd be the political will to stop the next ten million from coming the next time there's a
Democrat administration. No, if anything, it would just become a political inevitability. It would be codified that there'd be another ten million coming, and our immigration laws are just a joke.
Well that's why whatever Trump does, they have set in place two different, diametrically opposed systems. One is, if you come, you are allowed in with virtually no court oversight. It's going to take years for your hearings, and in the meantime you get to live here. And the second part is if you're trying to deport, you have to have massive court hearings and it's going to take a substantial
amount of f to get that done. So I think they are gaming the system because they're applying two different rules. Let me also mention this too, as the La riot continues four days and we see the Apple stores getting rioted, and unfortunately I saw a jewelry store owner interviewed, and we'll play some of that for you throughout the course of the program. In fact, at twelve thirty, so in about twenty minutes from now, we're going to talk with
Steve Hilton, who's running for governor. He was out on the streets of Los Angeles last night what he sees and is experiencing there, what he saw with his own eyes. I think that this is another impact of Evon Musk buying Twitter, because when Maxine Waters and other Democrats are coming out, I saw another Democrat congresswoman say, well, this is not much different than a sports celebration when a team wins a title. And then you juxtaposed those videos
side by side. It is we talked about yesterday. I want to get your read on this at some point. But when you've got cops with cars burning and you've got the video of the bricks being thrown at them, it's hard to argue it's a mostly peaceful protest. I think that the fairness of X to allow the full scope of what's truly going on to be seen makes the lies more readily.
Apparently, also the videos and the photos which I was consuming just as you were all weekend long and yesterday on the flight up here, as I was doing research for today's show, Clay the notion that you would, as a person who claims to have a right to be in America, you would be standing around burning cars and holding holding up the flag of a foreign nation.
That is a person who does.
Not belong here, who does not deserve to be here. And I'm not even getting into the legal status that they may or may not have, but you clearly do not have the kind of love and allegiance for this country and for the rule of law that we want for the American people. It is also shown, and we'll get into this, the data very clearly so far supports what Trump is doing. As a matter of public opinion, let me say, if there was eighty twenty against Trump on this, I don't care. This is a rule of
law issue, but it's not. In fact, Trump is operating with a majority support of the American people, and the more of this that we see, the burning cars, the rioting, the looting, the madness on the streets and people waving Mexican flags and saying, I'm so American. I would wave a Mexican flag. Could you imagine? I mean, if I stood in front of a building that was burning in New York City waving an Irish flag, first of all, the Irish people be like, you haven't been Irish in
hundreds of years. And second of all, they'd say, what are you doing that has nothing to do with us. There's something deeper here, and specifically in southern California, this is very this is a very precarious issue because you're talking about a group of people who, unlike any other migrant group, really the only migrant group we have here in large numbers that have come here illegally that can walk back home and sometimes do drive and go back home are people from Mexico. This is not true if
people from from Europe, from Africa, from anywhere else. And so there's something unique and uniquely destabilizing about individuals who think that they can have it both ways. They can maintain this separate Mexican identity while getting all the benefits of being in America and make demands in this country while actually having citizenship in another country that is right
next door. This is something that anybody who's looking at the national security and political implications for this country has to reckon with that. In southern California there is a and I know that this exists in some other places too. Different in Texas because it's a red state, but in southern California there is Look, you can see this with people going on CNN saying, well, you know this was part of Mexico. You say, hold on a second, this
is this was part of Mexican. It was part of Mexico for like fifteen years or something, and it's been part of America for a couple of hundred. It was a Spanish colony, okay, and the Spaniards aren't dancing around saying, hey, this is actually still ours. So it was Mexican for a short while, and then they lost that territory in a war, which is a thing that happens, you know, That's something that they need to just get used to. So there's a lot going on here that I want
to continue to dive into. And Clay, I think this most important fight in the country right now, and I think it's more important than concerns about the debt. If we lose on this, we lose on everything else. If we don't have a country with sovereignty and rule of law and immigration, we don't really have a country. And I think that's what people are seeing on the streets of California. You know, sixty seven thousand lives were saved last year by the efforts of the Preborn staff.
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very thankful for it. To donate securely dial pounds two fifty say the keyword baby. That's pounds two five zero say baby, or visit preborn dot com slash buck preborn dot com slash b u c K sponsored by Preborn. We got Steve Hilton with us. You all know him from his time at Fox News. He's running for governor of California, which is a job that needs somebody much more competent in the role than what they currently have, that is for sure. He is in LA right now, Steve,
thanks for being with us. Are you out on the street. I know you've seen a lot trying to give everybody a picture of where you are. So you're out on the streets in La. Bring us up to what you have seen up to this point, what the reality has been on the ground.
So I mean, I've just popped indoors, so it's not so loud. The thing is very clear. It is a total breakdown of law and order and civilized life and civilization. It is just absolutely shocking to see what's been going on here. The smashed up businesses, most of them by the way, owned by working class Latinos whose lives are now being completely wrecked and not going to get insurance. No one cares about that, and Newston doesn't care care, Baths doesn't care. All they care about is pandering to
their far left activists. So you've got the sort of total lack of care about people's lives being destroyed. But in a way, the most shocking thing, And I put out a video of this just last night. I was walking around after they'd cleared the main riot scene and disperse the crowd somewhat, and you saw the aftermath, every single surface covered in vile, disgusting graffiti, And there's something
so shocking about the scale of it. Literally everywhere you look, f Trump, by the way, f Israel a lot, so like what's that got to do with anything that's going on here? That tells you the kind of people we're dealing with here, And it's just this collapse of standards of civilized behavior. You know perfectly well that not a single person who did this will be held accountable by California authorities, will be prosecuted. All of these things are crimes.
I've spoken to DA's and sheriffs very clear that what we've seen happening here they're felonies. Is anyone going to be prosecuted or held accountable? No, not by California authorities. And so this is why we need to turn this around. This is a real moment I think for everyone in California to realize we've got to go in a different direction. We cannot have this weakness and pandering to political activists instead of standing up for the decent, law abiding majority.
Western sus Steve, I appreciate you coming on, and certainly, if I were in California, you'd have my vote next year.
But when you see so many people running.
Around waving flags of foreign countries while they are burning down WAYMO vehicles, or when they are raining down molotov cocktails onto police vehicles, what does it say not only about the United States and California, but also you've come from England, where this is a global struggle for the legitimacy. It seems to me of Western civilization. What you see here is happening in London, It's happening in Paris, it's
happening in Rome. There is when, many ways, I think, an attack on the entirety of Western civilization and values. Do you sense that people in California feel that?
Yes, but they don't even know it. This is the thing because it's now the product of years and years, decades of creeping in doctrination in this ideology, I mean, whatever you want to call it, wokismo with a whole sort of peace on it. On my Fox show we probably discussed it Clay, you know, one hundred one hundred years ago and the Frankfurt School in Germany and the Marxist philosophers and all out war on the institutions of a civilized Western society, the family faith, all of those things.
So this is that this has been part of a long burning plan, and I think because it's now so commonplace throughout started obviously in academia, but now throughout the public school system and so on, they're not even aware that this is what they're spouting and that these values are what they're upholding, even if you can call them values. I mean, it's just it's a very serious situation. But the good news is that we're confronting it finally, that
we're standing up against it here in America. That's not happening in England, it's not happening anywhere health and so that is really encouraging. And just as you see these appalling scenes and I completely agree with that, it's so shocking. I put that in one of my videos. Yes, I was walking around in the daytime, in the in the in the in the in the protest zone, Mexican flags, other Latin American flags flying. The best I could find was one young guy on the roof of his car waving.
It was fifty to fifty. It was the Mexican flag on one side, the stars and stripes on the other. That was the best I could find. I had. I taped a little interview with him. I'll be putting out later today. Nice kid, but completely unaware of, you know, the sort of background to this leftist indoctrination. But as I say, look at what's happening to fight back against it. Look at the success of you know, movements, you know, the turning point for example, and the youth vote in
the last election. You know, we're not letting this go unchallenged.
Steve, It's been amazing and kind of horrifying at the same time to see some of what these Democrat leaders, from the governor Gavenusom down to Mayor Bass of Los Angeles and other officials as well. Their responses to this range from the outrageous to the entirely incoherent. You have, on the one hand, they'll say things like don't be violent.
That plays into Trump's hands. I don't know, I think they should be opposed to political violence and assaults on officers and destruction of property, regardless of what that will do to the poll numbers. And then beyond that, it's completely unclear what their objection is, or rather, I should say, I think it is clear that their objection is not to anything other than the enforcement of American immigration laws. There's no claim that federal authorities have done something that
is not lawful. They just are saying, whether it's the mayor, the governor, others, we don't like the enforcement of federal law.
No.
And you know what was completely right, And the thing that really illustrated that was the almost you know, like like like revoltingly predictable way that when the first news broke of these enforcement actions, one by one up popped on social media the pandering statements from everybody in charge in Los Angeles. And I use that word advisorly, of
course they're not really in charge. One after another up popped the statement saying we at this time, we're thinking of our community, all this bladder pandering to the activist left.
And it was the mayor, which is totally predictable, and it was the governor, which was totally predictable, but shockingly and disturbingly, it was also the police chief and the DA, every single person in authority in California putting out pandering statements instead of saying very clearly, if you break the law, you will be prosecuted and we will hold you accountable, and we will not tolerate lawlessness and disorder. None that nobody said anything like that. It was all to the left.
And that tells you the rot that's gone on for so long in California. And that's what we need to change. And the majority of people understand now what's really going on here that we have people who are, as I say, not really in charge, with the people at the top, who have no interest in protecting the interests of the majority of regular working people who are just being let down all the time by this far left ideology.
Steve, this is not standing alone either. January thirty first, I think it took several weeks you'll know better than me, to put out the fires that were burning all over
Los Angeles. I'm not an expert in arson, but thankfully lighting things on fire intentionally in Los Angeles seems like a bad idea given the history that we just went through But also to me, there's a connecting thread here, and it is of Mayor Karen Bass and also Governor Gavin Newsom being unable to make rational, reasonable decisions for the people of Los Angeles and the people of California. Buck and I have talked about this a lot. Buck
lived through it. In New York City, things got so bad that people finally said, we need law and order, we need Rudy Giuliani, mayor Bloomberg. They fixed New York City in many ways, and they had to do it from an outsider perspective. Do you think that's what you could bring in our Californians? Are things getting bad enough? Or Californians say we can't keep doing the same one party decision making.
Yes, that is one hundred percent the central argument. We can't that I make it. We cannot go on like this, And you can look at it's all of the peace the fires of course that were and there's a similar pattern here, right, which is that the extremist policies caused the problem. So with the fires, it was the environmental extremism that meant that you have this tinderbox situation. They
didn't clear the brush, they didn't do anything. You co residents were fined for protecting their own property by clearing the brush. So they have the extremist policies that caused the problem, and then their response to the problem is totally incompetent, and then they just lash around blaming someone else.
Similar pattern here. It was their extremest policies that caused this problem, the sanct you remember, it's the sanctuary state policies that caused this whole situation because there's no cooperation with federal immigration enforcement and law enforcement, which means that these kinds of enforcement actions are necessary. You don't see this in other states where you've got cooperation between the
FEDS and state and local authorities. So they caused the problem in the first place, their response is completely incompetent and inadequate, and then they blame someone else, in this case obviously Trump. But there's another point I want to make, which is about the pattern. Just a couple of weekends ago in Los Angeles, you sought very similar scenes to
what we've just witnessed this week. Last past few days, on a smaller scale, you had an illegal party, the roof party that got out of control, the warehouse building hundreds of people spilling out into the local community, boarding around, smashing up businesses, vandalism everywhere, literally setting cars on fire. They commandeered a police car, jumping all over it, derafiting
the police car. What did the LAPD do? Nothing? Literally nothing, They stood back and just watched while all this happened. There was not a single arrest. That's what's the problem here. You have people who will not enforce the law and uphold standards of civilized behavior, which is the first responsibility of people in government. And that message I'm drumming home loud and clear, and I think there really will be changed in California in twenty twenty six because we cannot go.
On like this.
Steve, real quick before we go. Is it dying down or is there a concern here that this could continue or maybe even worsen.
I think it is, and I think the president is dying down and that's good to see. And I think it's the direct result of the President's tough response, because I mean, everywhere you go is the National Guard holding the line. And so I think that that has clearly made a difference. And last night was better than the weekend.
And you know, let's hope tonight is better. It's early morning here still, so there's not nothing going on particularly, but I think that it looks like things are getting more under control, and of course that's something we welcome, but it's it's exactly I think, thanks to the tough federal response, which of course all the politicians here that's there.
I mean, for goodness sake, the governor of California spending his most of his time yesterday, you know, posting on x you know, anti Trump, trolling things and filing lawsuits.
It's protect madness madness.
Yeah, he apparently he has neither read nor understood the Constitution, Steve, but that's that's not news.
We're aware of that one.
Steve Hilton, what is your site for the governor's race?
Steve Hilton for Governor dot com fo R Steve Hilton Next Governor dot com.
Well, we encourage everybody in California who wants things to change to go to Steve Hilton for California dot com. Keep up the good work and sorry yeah for governor, and stay safe out there.
Fantastic great to read you guys. Thanks.
That's Steve Hilton.
He's hopefully going to be the next governor of California, because God knows they need a lot of help. Tunnel the Towers Foundation makes a lasting difference in real lives, like the lives of the Clark family. US Air Force Sergeant Jesse Clark's military service came to an end after a chemical exposure caused a large tumor to form in his brain. As a result, he's paralyzed on the left side of his body, legally blind, prone to memory loss, and in a wheelchair for the remainder of his life.
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We're up here in Washington, d C. Visiting with many of our friends in Congress as the big beautiful bill wins the wines, I guess is the correct word. Its way through the halls of Congress. It's in the Senate right now and senter Ron Johnson of Wisconsin is with us and we are going to do a deep dive on spending the bill, what should happen from his perspective,
and where we are headed. So for people out there that really want to dive into some of the nitty gritty about the economic policies in place, we wanted to bring you in because I would say you and ran Paul Center, I think it's fair to say, are probably at the forefront of we are spending way too much money, and your argument has been that essentially, and you correct me if I'm wrong on any of this, but I'm trying to lay it out and then let you make
the case. Essentially, we have embedded the government spending that started with COVID, that accelerated at a rapid level, as the default basis for budgets going forward. Instead of, for instance, after World War Two, drastically dialing back spending, we have allowed that spending process to become the basis upon which all budget bills since COVID have been crafted.
Is that correct? How do we fix it if it is correct?
Well, first of all, welcome to this alternate universe. Thank yes, Washington, DC. You know why.
Both were former residents here, so we we're like reform swamp creatures.
But you're smart enough to move out and oh yeah, okay, I come here part time. But no, I mean you you stated the case pretty well. We spend four point four trillion dollars in twenty nineteen, pandemic hits spent six point five and we never looked back. And I've probably said this on the show. I don't know of American family if they got ill, somebody got ill, they had to borrow fifty thousand dollars pay for medical bills. If
they got well. The next year, they want to keep borrowing fifty thousand dollars and keep spending at that level. That's exactly what we've done. So four point four this year will spend over seven trillion. That's a fifty eight percent increase next year about seven point three. And I know these are a lot of numbers, but that's why I do charts, yep. And you know what's what's kind of depressing about my charts is it lays out of
a pretty depressing reality. Let me throw some more numbers under the Bush administration eight years, they average death sus to two hundred and fifty billion dollars year. Obama came in his first four years one point three trillion. I mean that sparked the Tea Party movement. That's why I came into town. The Tea Party movement had an impact. And those deficits in his last term was were five hundred and fifty billion dollars. Trump comes into office, had
to do deals with Democrats. His average deficit was eight hundred and ten then COVID hit one year three hundred three point one trillion dollar deficit, and again with responsible leaders like we had in World War Two. Okay, pandemic's over time to return to pre pandemic levels. Eh, it's not what Biden did. Biden continued to span again this year about seven trillion. His average deficit for four years was one point nine trillion. Okay, wait, so let's let's.
Jump in right there, because I think that's very important, and we have the charts to work with. But all of our people all across the country or were they're trying to visualize these numbers as we go where Yeah, he's holding it up.
I wish we had.
Oh we're really small. But tell me this, where is the additional money going? Because here's what happens every time we talk about cutting. And I also have to bring up some of the objections to the objections to the big beautiful bill, and I want you to address those in a second. But first, anytime we talk about cutting, we could light up the phones for three hours straight. Here, how dare you you want to touch my social security? How dare you you want to touch my medicare?
Well?
Hold on a second, if those things weren't being touched. At eight hundred billion or a trillion a year, where's the extra trillion dollars give or take that now? Is the post pandemic spending norm what's that money going?
It's literally across the board. And that's why I've laid out with my pre pandemic levels of spending that analysis where you take actual total atlays, you exclude social Security, Medicare, and interest, spend what you need to spend, and then you plus up all those other outlays by population growth inflation. And if you do that for twenty nineteen, for example, this year, you'd be spending six point five versus the seven. You know, if you go back to Clint or a bomb,
you'd be spending five point five to six point two. Okay, So again it's across the board, which is why one of the solutions is we need to forensically audit every line, every program, like dose is done.
Okay, So you're telling me then that there is of of that spending increase, if it's coming from these is it and you're not going to touch it? Sounds like me like you wouldn't touch the non discretionary spending, right because that's that's you're taking Medicare, social Security, and interest.
You see, that's right, that's part of mandatory. But you also have Medicaid and we've got to fix the Obamacare portion of that. Got a trillion dollars of other mandatory spending.
This is what I mean, where's that other trillion dollars? That's it's it's medicaid and then just everything else.
So what they've done over years because nobody knows they're doing this, because you have these omnibus spending bills and just magically they move discretionary spending into the mandatory accounts. So during COVID, that other mandatory now social cared to Medicare or even medicaid. I think we're up top to about two point two trillion dollars. In twenty nineteen was six hundred and forty two billion, went to two point two. It's been ramping down. Last year I think it was
one point three trillion. This year would be about a trillion. That's a trillion out you mean discrationeray spending is about one point seven.
You were a business guy. Trump was and still is in many ways a business guy. When you say this to him, what does he say, because he wants this thing passed with with gusto. He wants this big, beautiful bill, he believes. I'm sure you've talked about these numbers, right, I'm sure you talked.
I was.
I was in the White House, uh last Wednesday, and and when my time to talk, I'd pulled out my chart.
He said.
By the way, way I've seen your last ten appearances, you're too negative. Run One of your charts saved the president's life. So you're so this is a different chart than.
Actually actually saved his life. Yes, so one chart saved saved the president's life. I'm hoping this one saves America. Okay, so what so?
He he says, what because the argument here is that they would like to get this bill passed by July fourth on the Senate side, it's already passed the House side. Where are we do you think that's likely? How does this get reconciled?
What? How? How does how does this senate?
Because it's not just you, it's Ran Paul, it's others that have this perspective to not a huge majority, how does this get solved?
So again, just so he told me I was being too negative, and I took that to heart. I have been pretty.
Generally a very jolly fellow. I will say I.
Smound my face. Okay, but you gotta lay out the reality. So I had a great meeting just a couple of hours ago the Vice President to Fance and Kevin Hassett, and that was kind of what we arranged the White House. Okay, let's let's get in the same page. You know, I worked all weekend long. I wrote this report myself. These are all my own charts. I'm the account here, right, But we're gonna let Kevin Hassen his economic team go
through these, you know, check out the numbers. I'm not sure when we're released this, but that's the first thing you have to you have to get in the same page. And I told the President the White House is the first step in solving any problem, so you have to
admit you have one. So again, I have I have been too too negative because I've been focusing on the macro problem and I haven't been talking as positively as I should on all the good things in the big beautiful bill, because there are a lot of good thinge things. We fund the border, we fund defense. This House did a pretty good job of identifying about one point five
trillion dollars in spending reduction. That's that's good. We extend current taxile, we take an automatic tax increase off the table, we avoid default. Okay, those are all great things. My only point, and I'm sorry I have to make it. It just isn't enough. Okay. So what I've been asking for always is a commitment to a to return to a reasonable pre pandemic level spending and a process to achieve and maintain it. Now I'm throwing into the method
because one and done won't work. I mean, this is great progress that we'd be making with one big, beautiful bill. I don't deny that, but it doesn't solve the problem. So I'm looking for a forcing mechanism. So we come back in this Congress. Not wait, tell winning an election.
You're telling me this is politically realistic, because that's the next The next question is because because this is what's being said, And you know, Stephen Miller is a very smart in this White House.
He's been out.
There making the case that the objections to this are more about people making a philosophical argument than operating within the reality of what is possible, and that If you don't do it this way, you're gonna have to work with Democrats down the line who don't want to work with you.
So can you address that again? We can use another reconciliation process using the fiscal twenty twenty six budget. I have gotten just basically positive feedback from President Trump's art and supporters and also my supporters. Again, Republicans. We realize we have a massive debt and death problem. Are they say, had.
Republicans who won't go along with what you want to do?
Here is that?
I mean, where's the problem. It seems so logical to us. I would say part of it is marketing. Okay, the House was all folks on getting this thing done, and you know they pulled literally they pulled one point five billion dollar out of the air. It really wasn't in context.
You know.
When I saw that, I said, you guys have said the bar way too low. We need the trillions of dollars in long term to get this thing done. But then they assigned more than half of that to e NC the committee. All they can do is medicaid, so
they just open themselves up. You're gonna slash medicaid for and you did make the case, you realize that what we're trying to do is fix the Obamacare portion of Medicaid called Medicaid expansion that pays when a state puts a buck in for a single childless you know, working age able bodied adult, the federal government puts in nine bucks versus a dollar state puts in for a disabled child tetal government kicks into dollar thirty three. That has
led to all kinds of distortions. There's a great artic on the Wall Street Journal. A father of a seventeen year oldartistic child can't get home care for ten years because he's being crowded out by single adults.
That should be worked on in welfare for a Medicaid just the big giant.
And so you literally are putting it risk the benefits for the people that we want to help, both in Medicare and Medicaid. So you've got to root out these things. But you have to make the case, and you can't make it in five months. So the game plan here, so as Ice time and Vice President is okay, it's
going to take time. I propose a budget review panel, hire forensic auditors, take the DOGE team, transfer them over This process a House of Senate, a White House effort to forensically audit every all more than two thousand lines of federal budget, more than twenty six hundred federal programs. We've never done it. We've never done it. And even this process, you'll notice they've exempted most spending, most programs. They focused on a couple They get slaughtered in the
public opinion because Democrats. It's easy pickings for them, because they have the press behind them. I mentioned on the Sunning shows, it's so easy to be a Democrat. You spend your mortgage, kid's future, you never be held accountable by the media. It's hard doing what we're trying to do. The good news for your listeners is that we're all pretty much on the same page. We want to fix this problem. We just are dealing with something that's very difficult to do.
What's timing and how significant is timing from your perspective? Because the White House has said they'd like to have this done in the Senate by July fourth, we know that we don't have a very big majority in the House. So Mike Johnson, Speaker is going to have to go back and work through whatever conciliating bill is going to come out.
What to you does this timeframe look like.
Well, I think most people thought the House right of the House passed the Senate would water down. I think the absence is true. I think we're going to make it more conservative. I think we're going to be doing even more reductions in terms of spending. And again I've got colleagues that are demanding it so.
And there's some people who agree with you. Chip Roy for instance, a friend of ours on the House side wants way more spending, right, I mean this was an issue for Mike spending cuts.
Yeah.
I mean, I mean they've voted for it because they kicked can over the House or the Senate hoping we'd make it more conservative.
So this part that you talk about the marketing, I'm just going to say this. You know, we've had Senator Ran Paul on the show. We've talked to him, We've heard about on this and so many issues, and a lot of the time I just think he's making great arguments.
But in this moment, to talk about how there's too much money going to the border after ten million illegals came in under the Obama i mean Bob administration, and to say that that's where we're gonna We're going to start to make the savings happen in a meaningful way, even if numerically you could start to make I just think it's malpractice because people and this is about saving the country, and you know, just to save money when
you're trying to save the country. I think people view the urgency of the border and the illegal immigration issue as you know, the policy equivalent of a war, meaning if we don't do this thing right, we don't have the same America going forward.
Well, I'm a really frugal guy, and I don't mind sharpening my pencil on any spending. He has chairming Homeland Security, he should be doing oversight on this. Again, in the first administration, we've spent six point six billion dollars to build four and four and fifty miles a wall. Now they're asking forty six and a half million a billion just for the wall.
It's gonna well, we didn't have enough money to finish the wall though, I remember that was a problem.
But there's not there's not three thousand and four thousand miles to have to be built. So again I think he's got a wall guy here. He's asking the questions.
Can you stay with us a little bit absolutly because there's some more questions, but quickly as and then Buck's got to do a read here time frame July fourth, any chance in your advice, I.
Think that's I think that's ambitious. I think I really think in the Senate we're looking more before August recess.
Before August, and it has to be done before August recess.
Well, the time just you know, DESSI is going to expire sometime mid August to late September. So that's part of the pressure. I mean, that's part what they do. One of the reasons they bunded this all up is, yeah, I don't want to see taxes increase. I don't want a default on the death. So let's just put pressure on us. So I've been very upfront. I nobody should be surprised. I wrote my first column on a reasonable pre pandemic level spending and options to do it in
the Wall Street Journal on January first. So again I've been I've been beating this drum.
For a while.
Ron Johnson in the hot seat. He doesn't like it hot. He prefers it cold. He's from Wisconsin, but we'll keep going. Look, we're not dealing this debt. You know it, I know it, which means that there's those long term issues of governance and issues with the dollar, and owning gold is just one way to prepare for that uncertain future. I've been a gold guy for over a decade. My dad gave me my first gold coin when I was in my twenties. He said, you know what, he's a big gold believer,
and I've been a big gold believer ever since. I've been building up my gold reserves, and man, the price of gold has seen great appreciation in just the past year, up forty percent. I'm also a big history guy. Clay likes refer to us as history nerds. What has there ever been a time when there's been a civilization in society? They said, you know what, you know what, I don't
need gold, no value in that. Yeah, there's a reason for this, all right, And that's why I think you should call the Birch Gold Group.
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Trump administration is doing a lot to try to write the ship, but they're not going to able to do at all. And there's a lot more that we have to look at in the future. In terms of the spending gold makes sense. And by the way, you can invest in gold or you could just have part of your savings in a gold ira or four oh one k. Very solid moves. One of the best ways to protect
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Clay and I in Washington, d c our Nation's capital, but you're always with us when we're on the air and off the air. Clay I was getting a salad yesterday right from the airport, you know, trying to stay healthy, trying to be beach ready over here to the that I can. You know, Clay and Hi are trying to be trying to be fit radio hosts, which puts us into.
A that's certainly by the way in Oxymoron, you know what.
Usually radio hosts like our bacon cheeseburgers. But I was in there and within a few minutes of setting foot in DC, some of our wonderful listeners came up to me and they said they love the show and they were visiting here. They were not swamp natives, but they were visiting our nation's capital. So it's great to be here with all of you. As you know, we've got a whole bunch of meetings lined up with the people calling the shots here. Some at their request, they said
they want to spend some time with us. So we're here doing our DC tour so we can touch base with everybody from the President on Dowd who is running things. And also over the weekend, Clay. You know, we've talked a little bit here about how it would be fun to get you and Laura. We all know Laura is going to be a fantastic shot if she isn't already do a range day. So my brother Mason and I completed the NRA Pistol Instructor Certification course over the weekend.
Had to call had to actually go through a bunch of a bunch of range qualifications in order to do it.
But we came through.
You are wondering, it's fifteen yards steel sites, twenty shots. I know a lot of you are instructors, and I know a lot of you are instructors, you know, black belt with three stripes on and all that. But for those who aren't instructors, it was fifteen yards iron sights. That wasn't a requirement, but our guy wanted us to make sure we were dialed in, so it was fifteen yards iron sights at least I think it was sixteen or seventeen out of twenty in that six inch target.
So yeah, so Clay, we can set up a range day for you now. It'd be absolutely fantastic. NRA certified and ready to rock and roll big timers. Yeah, that would be a lot of fun.
Because my wife is pretty fired up about the need for firearms training.
So I mentioned this on Mother's Day.
She had the kids and me out on the range getting trained in firearms. I know, I loved it. I saw the photos, I saw the video of it was I don't know how many people wanted to spend their Mother's day that way. My wife was that was brilliant. I was so pleased to see it. I'll just tell you though.
It was fun. During there were about twenty people in this class. We had an excellent instructor down in South Florida. But we had about twenty people in the class, and I'd say about half of them. It was only two days, right, it was Saturday and Sunday all day. But at the end they all came up to like, hey man, love
the show. So we had a lot of I was like, I think we're in a pistol class in South Florida with NRA members and these are people that shoot a lot, a lot of law enforcement, a lot of a lot of people who guns are something that they're caring for part of their job who were in the class. And we had a lot of Clay and Buck people in there. So it was unsurprised. Yeah, I was like, I think we're with our people here. I looked around and was like, oh, we are with our people. I think there's also I mean,
this is not going to surprise. We were up here for Inauguration Day. But I do think that there are a lot of people that the Trump team has brought into DC. Even though DC is ninety two percent or whatever it is of a Democrat stronghold. You know, I lived here during Republican administration, and I lived here for during at least part of a Democratic So I was here for the Bush years, basically second Bush term. I
lived the whole second Bush term. I lived in DC more or less, and the first two years of Obama, I think I was here. And then when you have that transition from one party to the other, it feels like a very different town just based on who's here and the vibe.
I was a kid, so it was less noticeable to me, meaning I was in college. But I came in at the very end of the Clintons and then the George W. Bush era, and then left right before nine to eleven, which obviously changed things tremendously for the worst in so many different ways. I mean, one of the reasons we're up here now is obviously to get as many Senators in as possible. You heard from Ron Johnson yesterday. We
had Tommy Tuberville and Marsha Blackburn in here. We want to talk to as many newsmakers as we can in person. A lot more. We're going to have Marco Rubio in studio with us on Thursday for a couple of segments which I think you guys will really enjoy. Secretary of State will dive into some of those Ukraine questions that so many of you have, and also what's going on in the Middle East with Iran. A lot of different
things we can talk about with Marco Rubio. But my seventeen year old and his friend, I'm in charge of him, and I was telling you yesterday we were in Georgetown. I am so thankful that I've got a seventeen year old boy, because if I had a seventeen year old daughter, there's no way she's gonna be I said, hey, guys, just make sure he and his friend, Hey, make sure you're back by by dark, and you guys can run around and you can be in Georgetown.
I'm gonna be honest with you, Buck, if I had a seventeen.
Year old daughter, there's no way on planet I would be letting her run around in Washington, d C. I would be nervous about her because because you have obviously you know I have this with my wife. Yeah, where you have the location finder on your phone. Yeah, my wife Kerry knows where I am at all times. She knows where she were, you know, and vice versa. But I know you have that with your boys. Yeah, of course,
you know immediate family. If you had a seventeen year old daughter, what do you think she have to carry a GoPro around? You know, kind of like a like a cop, Like she has to wear a body cam just to make sure everything is on the up and up. I was glancing down just to make sure, you know, like, hey, where are they when we were having drinks and and.
That's what I was like. I mean, if I had a seventeen year old.
Daughter, there's no way on the planet I would be like, hey, just go wonder around. And you and your teenage girlfriend just go wonder around in Georgetown, have as much fun as you want.
Just make sure you're back by dark.
No, Dad, they would, they would, Unfortunately for them, they would have to do every meal with dad. And and I'm not as much worried about the boys running around. Maybe that's a poor decision by me on parenting, but who's the disciplinarian of you? And my wife is way tougher than I am. That's probably not gonna surprise you. But but I actually I think I think Carrie is gonna be for you, young James. I think Carrie's gonna I'm gonna be visiting life, buddy. You don't want me
to turn this over to your mom, right. I think Carrie's gonna be the law and order in our house. She's pretty tough on him sometimes.
It's kind of funny we both are in that position.
I'm gonna be the one.
That's like, you know, stuff happens.
It's I already feel a little bit sorry for the girlfriends of these, uh, these boys, because I don't think that my boys that I don't think she's gonna go too easy on them. So anyway, I give thanks every single day that I've got three boys instead of three girls. And I was thinking about that yesterday as as we were rolling through enjoying.
Let's Dive and you know this one better than me. I saw some of it over the weekend. I know you talked to Riley Gaines yesterday. There's some updates to this. The Simone Biles, who I remember, I got all that you got. Crush, I mean, Crush might be a little struck. There were some there was some sour leftists out there saying some mean.
Things things because you said on the show that you have gotten ripped for harder than by like national media figures, very like your takee. I'm sitting here, I am like to port them by the millions. And no problem, Hey, I don't think we need to celebrate Simone Biles stepping away from her team during the Olympics.
I didn't say that.
I wasn't like, oh, she's a coward, you know whatever, And she's an incredible shape and I'm not, and she's a world class gymnast. I just said, you know, if you pull a hammy and you can't finish the injured list, you go on the exactly. That's all I was saying. And I got all these people are so so so there's a little little history here, a little history here, and I got actually got, I got tagged by a few national media figures on that one. But anyway, update
everybody on the latest here. Because she said, as I said, along too. Look I saw this from her fart Riley gains to say, Riley Gaines looks like a man. Every guy in our audience is like, nah, sorry, and every gal I think, but I just you know, every guy's like, no, it doesn't look.
Like a man. Nice dry.
It was a tough argument out of nowhere, though, for those of you missed it, Riley was on yesterday talking about this. Simone Biles just ripped her for saying and all Riley had done that set precipitated this was Riley shared a photo of a Minnesota high school softball championship team and a was on the girls team, which is
absurd and way taller. And all she said was they've turned the comments off so people on social media couldn't react, and out of nowhere, Simone Biles decided to tee off on her and then said you look like a man, which again, I mean, Simone Biles has done all these body positivity things. Riley is five, you know, she measured herself like five to five or five six. So now, after multiple days of just getting attacked like crazy for being on the wrong side of this issue, I wonder
you haven't seen this. I want to read Simone Biles has some sort of strange pr apology up and here's what she posted just a little bit ago. I wanted to follow up from my last tweets. I've always believed competitive equity. First of all, buck competitive equity. Competitive equity is not a thing. Competitive equality is a thing. The entire point of competition is to eliminate equity. We don't want everybody to be the exact same, but I always
believe competitive equity and inclusivity are essential in sport. The current system doesn't adequately balance these important principles, which often leads to frustration and heated exchanges. And it didn't help for me to get personal with Riley, which I apologize for. These are sensitive, complicated issues that I truly don't have the answers or solutions too, but I believe it starts with empathy and respectful Well, this is written for her by some PR crisis team.
One hundred percent. We know that you and I have been in this game long enough to know that.
And she's still going, Oh, I'm sorry, No, no, no, the PR team wrote this ridiculous statement. I was not advocating for policies that compromise fairness in women's sports. My objection is to singling out children for public scrutiny in ways that feel personal and harmful. Individual athletes, especially kids, should never be the focus of criticism of a flawed system.
They have no control over.
I believe sports organizations have a responsibility to come up with rules supporting inclusion while maintaining fair competition, which is actually impossible. We all want a future for sport that is fair, inclusive, and respectful hugs and kisses, Simone. Yeah, okay, so that was written by a PR team. Yeah, but she realizes there are a few things here. First of all, her position, first and foremost, her position is not just
on her real position. I don't mean the PR thing, the thing that she said about Riley, her position on men and women's sports is irrational and indefensible. And then to add on top of that, to go after a honestly anyone's appearance based on a political issue like this, you've always really lost just to start off with, I mean, to do to the like you look like a man thing.
Fortunately Riley, you know, would have to get into this, but no one thinks Riley looks like a man. I mean, she's a very very lovely woman in very good physical condition. And I just think that she realized that she did real brand damage here on top of the political issue.
You don't attack somebody's appearance.
Especially somebody who's really good looking, like that's just insane.
I think she lit herself on fire here. And it took three four days for her to put out this Mealy mouthed jumbly, not particularly well. Even with all of the PR dollars that she's spending, that was just a jumble of nothing. And when you just type out what somebody tells you to say, I would have more respect for even though I would disagree with her completely, if she just said I said what I said, I'm right now.
Yeah, you own it.
At least I know I wouldn't.
Agree with to play Travis Speescher right there, I'm doubling down, tripling.
I'm not saying that I'm not gonna say at some point in my career something that I didn't intend to say, but in twenty years it's never happened, So you should apologie. I've been married twenty years. Look, you should apologize if you do things that you don't intend to do and that that that are not reflective of your intentionality.
But that's not this.
Also, she could have written she she could have just written out and said, you know, and we would know it was from her, meaning she actually did the writing. Someone Biles could could write out on her Twitter or Instagram or wherever this is.
And Riley that was that was wrong.
You know, you're a beautiful young woman and a talented athlete, and I'm sorry that I would.
I'm sorry that I would cross the line.
There's a heated political issue and I just want to have respect for all people or whatever, something where she doesn't even have to get too deep into the politics of it, but something that's a little bit heartfelt. This is my PR team came in and cleaned up my mess, which to me is once again inauthentic, Like I just don't believe that she wrote this herself, and clearly of course, but so that's what so it's it's not an authentic apology. If it's an authentic apology, you write it yourself. You
just say, look, I cross the line, my bad. I wouldn't do that again, and you know, and you could move on from there. But to me, this is just I still wonder, Buck, what is the intent here. She's not that active on social media, she's not that political. Did someone pay her to attack Riley like this? It doesn't make any sense to me that you would suddenly decide based on a photo of a Minnesota she might have seen someone else that she respects and likes or
that wants the approval of. This is just me surmising or analyzing this, and and she thought that there was an opportunity here to score some points with someone or some group that she wants the admiration of, because I agree with you, this is not you know, they're they're like when when Keith Albburn's chirping at you, it's because he's always chirping and everybody, right, I mean that's his job, right, That's what I'm saying. You disagree like most people, I think,
like someone Biles and now they don't. Yeah, I mean, Keith Olberman has a constituency miserable, childless, sixty five year old women that he represents, and.
That's just the way it goes. And he looks more and more every single day like a five year old lesbian true story in front of mine. Just got back from a trip with his family to Ireland. Do you know who he bumped into on the street in Dublin? And he bumped into Rosie O'Donnell on the street, And as a fellow American, he's obviously conservative, he was just kind of.
Like, wait really, and he asked her, he said, how do you like it here?
She said she doesn't like it.
She's gonna come home.
Of course she doesn't like it. I mean, America, the Irish don't like her. There may be this would be a fun debate. If you're super wealthy, as Rosie is. There are only a handful of countries that would be actually better than the United States, even for the self super wealthy. Ireland's not one. She lived in La Weather's perfect. You know, she's super rich. I'm not surprised she does.
The reason why people look the way we do, you know, not a lot of sunshine, a lot of booze, you know. So I'm just saying the Irish, yeah, you know, it's don't send me that stuff. You know, It's true. Look, Father's Day is this weekend, and I've got a great gift idea for you, No, truly, truly a fantastic gift idea. I'm going to settle your Father's Day gift concerns right now and get on it right now so we can
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