Hello and welcome to another UK column interview. And as you'll see, I'm absolutely delighted again to be joined by Joy Warren. Now Joy Warren is the national Coordinator of the Fluoride Free Alliance UK and Poisoned chalice #1 that was our first interview that was screened a little while ago on the 21st of March 2024. So if you haven't seen that one, please be sure to check in with it because many of our audience were very interested in knowing more about fluoride and wanted
to have regular updates. So we've, we've brought Joy back today for a very good reason, because this is time sensitive and we need your help. And we're going to be talking about a public consultation that's due to end fairly soon. So please stay tuned and keep listening because you're going to hear more about this. But Joy is also an environmental scientist. She has been an absolute stalwart in looking at the whole fluoride agenda.
And if anybody, well, nobody knows more to be honest about fluoride than than Joy. But my question is, is we appear to be medicalising water. Do you know what is coming out of your tap? Honestly, I don't. And what is coming out of my tap today could be different from what is coming out of my tap tomorrow. So do any of us know what is coming through our tap and what we're drinking and potentially what many of us or perhaps all of us in England, we will be drinking?
So in plain sight, we're going to now bring it to your site for you to do something about it. So, Joy, welcome back. Thank you so much for agreeing to talk to us again. We're just so glad to have you back. Well, thank you very much, Debbie. You want me to talk about what's coming out of our taps?
I do. And you know, my first question I think is going to be, well, first of all, actually there'll be a little article beneath this interview and if anybody wants to find out more, and I really suggest you do the website to go for is UKF ffa.org.uk. OK, but we're all of those details will be in the article beneath, but joy for people that haven't seen poison chalice one and perhaps don't know the dangers or implications that fluoride has.
How big of a problem is this for us, especially in the UK? Right. So the last count is about 6 million people receive artificial fluoride in their drinking water, that's about 10% of England.
The proposal is initially to increase that to 40% and they've made a start, I should say, Department of Health and Social Care being they, they've made a start on doing a public consultation for the North East of England which stretches from the border between Durham County, County Durham and Cumbria, which is now Westmoreland.
There's a small area in West Malden which is caught up and there's also an area of about 23 villages in the North Yorkshire borderland which connects the North Yorkshire people to County Durham. Both small areas receive their water from Northumbria Water and because it's in the pipes anyway, they can't isolate these two areas, so they're caught up. They look as known as collateral damage.
If in fact the proposal goes ahead to fluoridate 1.6 million people, they are part of the 1.6 million people. The consultation going on at the moment started on 25th of March, ends the 31st of July. We managed to get an extension because it was the middle of the run up to the general election and you can't make political decisions such as validation proposals during the run up to an election. So we've got an extra six weeks added on to the original 12
weeks after the consultation. And if we lose it, in other words, if they want to go ahead and and fluoridate the whole of the NE, the next areas which are lined up by wishful thinkers are Nottinghamshire County Council. And we've just had a space of media reports about Blackpool wanting to fluoridate as well. They've incorporated it into their oral health strategy in the last few weeks. Other areas which are possibly targeted is Leicester City. Well, we haven't heard any, any
other stable rattling recently. The areas which are fluoridated at the moment are the the western seaboard of Cumbria, which includes Seller Field, still called seller field can't remember, but it's it's the it's the sea towns of of West Cumbria, part of Cheshire, Nantwich in particular, all of the West Midlands, all of Newcastle on Tyne, all of North Tyne side and Gateshead. Let me think there else parts of Lincolnshire, parts of Nottinghamshire, parts of
Derbyshire, by default, collateral damage that is. I don't think there are any. Yes, but The thing is about 6 million people are getting artificial fluoride. So Joy for people that don't know what fluoride is. And I want to come back to the consultation too, because I want people to try and join into that. So we'll, we'll come back to that.
But for people that don't know the dangers of fluoride, for people that think that actually fluoride is good for you, there's two parts of my question here. So #1 is what are the dangers of fluoride and #2 because this is such a big agenda, my question is why? Why do the UK government want to do this? What are the benefits for the government and what are the risks for the public? All right, the danger of fluoride is that it is an enzyme, poison.
It affects the endocrine system, which is your thyroid gland and all the other organs dotted throughout the body. It causes diabetes because the pancreas is an organ of the endocrine system. It causes hypothyroidism because the thyroid gland is the main organ of the endocrine system. It also has enough nasty effect on weakening our bones and we can move on to hip fractures later if you want to. But this is the one thing that I'm really concerned about.
It's such a damaging, painful, life limiting issue. It causes a reduction in intelligence when the unborn child and the infant are exposed, overexposed to fluoride during their developments. There's no blood brain barrier or very, very, very poor blood brain barrier in the unborn child and the infants. So anything can get into the
brain. It's not just fluoride, it's all the other toxins which pass to the unborn child via the mother's blood supply and passed to the infants via the fluoridated water which is used to make up baby formula. So those are the three main things, Hypothyroidism, fluoride, fractures of the bone, diabetes. And then the other one which is IQ reduced by fluoride overexposure. There are others, but we're concentrating on those four at the moment because they're much
more easy to explain to people. And obviously they they will be able to avoid drinking fluoride if they know that they're setting themselves up in the short term, but mainly the long term to ill health later on in life. So what, what are, what are the benefits to the government? Because there don't seem to be any benefits to us. I mean, this really is medicalising water.
And as everybody will know, I'm pretty hot on water and we'll probably talk a little bit more about other things that might be going into water. But why? What are the benefits for the government? How are they trying to sell this to people? Because compared to the risks that you've just said, it would appear to me that the risks outweigh any benefits. Or have I got that wrong? No, you haven't got it wrong.
The risks are terrible and in fact all the ill health the fluoride causes in adults is going to cost the NHSA lot of money. It does cost the NHSA lot of money, but somehow it doesn't seem to matter.
The touted benefits ever since 1955 when it first first put into our water in England was because it reduces dental decay in tiny tots who are disadvantaged, who do not clean their teeth, who do not refrain from or their parents don't refrain from giving them sugary food or acid forming food. It's been like this since 1955. They the resin deck for doing it is because it reduces oral dental decay.
But over the years, over the decades, the percentage claimed for fluoride preventing dental decay has reduced and reduced and reduced. People say, well, that may be because children are using fluoride toothpaste, and that may be, but I'm not an expert on whether fluoride in toothpaste reduces dental decay or not. My gut feeling is it doesn't, but we'll move on to that in a moment.
The idea is that over the decades with better oral hygiene and better food, better nutrition, the dental decay in in primary teeth and tiny tots has reduced. Not just because of fluoride. And it can't be because of sword fluoride, it's because of better socio economic factors. The problem with thinking that fluoride reduces delta K if you
swallow it is really flawed. But the governments of the world who favour fluoride never seem to ask about the age of the teeth when they have a 5 year old examination and we because we know it damages enzyme production and all the other physiological processes in the body. The the reason is quite simple that fluoride prevents the eruption of primary teeth by anything from one month to most
of the time it was 14 months. Not all babies have teeth grow at age 6 months, but there's no studies due into this and mums and dads don't think about it because they think, well my little baby didn't have her teeth growing till she was 12 months old. But that's OK, all children are different, aren't they? They're not thinking about any toxin disrupting the the, the actual development of the child.
So what we have to say here is that if they if the government did do some studies into age of teeth at age 5, they would find that the fluoridated children's teeth grew later than the non fluoridated children's teeth. And that means that the teeth have not been in the mouth for so long to be exposed to dental decay causing bacteria and acids. So they teeth at age 5 seem to be better. Simple smokescreen and livers I say. But there you go. Right.
So the most recent studies into dental decay were done in Cumbria and they had looked a cohort of fluoridated children compared to non fluoridated children and they also looked at a huge number of adults in fluoridated areas and non fluoridated areas. And what happened was they found that there was a reduction in dental decay across the board between children and adults of between 2% and 4%. There was less decay in fluoridated children and adults.
But the researchers described this as a modest reduction, very modest. So we're talking a lot about thinking about fluoridating 40% of English people or people living in England I should say, because of a modest reduction in dental decay in fluorid, in fluoridated tiny tots who are disadvantaged. Makes no sense at all, does it? I mean, there's for that percentage which is tiny and I would say is probably flawed anyway. And this is a huge, extraordinary expense that
they'll be going to, isn't it? Yeah, 2, four, 2% to 4% could be because of this delay in the eruption of teeth and fluids, but doesn't actually explain the adults and why there's 2% less in fluoridated adults compared to non fluoridated adults. So saying that the research has found, and this is so important, it seems to me forever that the Department of Health has been claiming that fluoride swallowed reduces oral health inequalities across social groups and it is definitely not true.
There are four studies, two systematic reviews which are the top of the research pile, and two ordinary studies which couldn't find any evidence whatsoever that disadvantaged children were brought up, levelled, levelled up if you like, because of fluoride in their drinking water. And it seems that this sort of myth is so difficult to kill because even if I've wrote about it, you know, the pro fluoridation people would probably not want to know.
They won't want to listen. You know, Joy, I'm, I'm seeing this constant, these constant attacks on children, on young people, and especially on pregnant women at the moment. And you've highlighted very eloquently your serious concerns about the dangers to an unborn baby and neurodevelopmental injury moving on in their lives. Say, for example, because I want to come back to the consultation because I think it's really, really important. We know we're nearly at the end
of it now. So the 31st of July, I believe, is your lot, your last day. And I want you to tell us what we can do, where we can go and what we can do. But before I do that, say worst case scenario and the consultation fails and they decide they're going to roll it out anyway. How quickly would you expect, because people all around the country are going to be saying, well, I live in that area. Yeah. Well, how, when, when is this likely to happen?
Is this likely to happen this year, next year? And then the consequences. How long will that take before it's rolled out, before people start to noticeably see detrimental effects? Well, for women planning to become pregnant, they would start having detriment effects on from day one of gestation if the rise of the drinking water. But we don't know when they're going to be putting in these
equipments. If they are going to be putting it in, there's no contracts signed with Northumbrian Water at the moment, but they have done a feasibility study. So the next thing would be to sign the contract with Northumbrian Water and then get the tenders out for the equipment to be purchased and then installed.
Once it's installed, it has to be tested, commissioned, I would probably say end of next year takes that, takes that long to install and Commission. Obviously they've got to order in more fluoridating acid. And yeah, there's a Commissioning does take time. Right, so people are going to be looking at this and going, well, we need to do something about it. And you've only got a few days left. So tell us about the website Joy and where people go to to find the consultation.
And people are going to be saying, well, what do I write? What do I, what do I say? Do I? Because I know that they're very particular in how you write things and how you phrase things. So before everybody goes to their computers and starts typing out, I really would advise that you go to Joy's website to to look because Joy tell us a little bit more about how how specific this has to be and how time sensitive this has to be as well. OK.
So we set up a new website two years ago in full expectation that this consultation was on the horizon. We we gave it a very interesting name of North East water fluoridationconcerns.org.uk, which shortened as NEWFC. So it would hopefully spark the interest of people who like football because the NFC, so NEWF c.org.uk, it's got a home page, but it leads straight into the portal into the bits and pieces to do with the consultation.
Now the Department of Health consultation pages are completely biased in favour of fluoridation. They're not giving anything away. They mentioned 2, the two reports I've mentioned earlier about two to 4% reduction in dental decay, but they haven't said why they've mentioned them apart from the fact they are strengthening the evidence base, which seems to imply that these two research reports are in favour of fluoridation. And they are not really in favour at all.
But we can quote them. They're perfectly fine for us to quote them, but we need to know why we're prompting them. And they're not actually strengthening the evidence base in favour of fluoridation. Now the page we have on any WFC, the consultation page, there's lots of little blue boxes. And as a case of starting here written, read this bit first read through, see, look at the steps you have to go through. And then we've given lots of information about each aspect
which we've shown. We had hold on a second, we had a leaflet flyer. It's a little bit blurred or perhaps we'll get, don't worry, we'll get us a screenshot of it and, and, and we'll make sure that we put the link in the article that will be beneath the interview. So this actually, this flyer is actually on the website and on the back they've got 19. Definitely can't see those 19 reasons why you wouldn't want fluoride in your drinking water.
Now on the website, we've also got underneath the 19 reasons, we've got 19 reasons repeated, plus all the references to research and the reasons why people wouldn't want to be fluoridated according to those 19 points.
So those are a good start, but you have to again go through the downloaded questionnaire to have a look at exactly what's on the road ahead in in the questionnaire, because there's no point opening the proper one until you know what's going to confront you later on. So if we've we've you accumulated all the pages from the questionnaire and put them into one file. Unfortunately, you still have to go from page to page and it tells you exactly what you need
to say. We've tried our best to to give as much good information with references, citations, research to to substantiate. Now the urination consultation law does explicitly say you have to be cogent. Why being cogent retake it does, meaning you have to say I don't want this because and then you have to give very good sighted reasons why you're right as opposed to wrong. So that's the important thing. Anybody who just says I don't want this full stop won't have any points.
Smarty points as it like, as it were. They have to be not, how can I say not wonderful with their English, but they have to be. Accurate. Yeah, they have to be logical. Yeah. And then, as I say, it's important to quote the references. Is it? It's also important, I think, to read the abstracts and the conclusions of these research reports so you know where you're going to. So that's a hasty overall thing. Once, once everyone's ready to fill in the console question,
question there. We've popped it down the bottom of the screen. It's in the purple box so it can go straight into it. And it's a case of if you're going to do any, any writing any, any report or any reasoning. And they've got this three chances of doing 3 lots of 250 words. It's best to write them first, check them over, do the word count, and then pop them into the boxes as opposed to trying to write them in the boxes online.
Is there? I'm just thinking when I was bringing up my five children, life's a bit chaotic and there's never enough time in a day to do anything. Is there by any chance a way of an easy way where people haven't got to? They take your word for it, they don't want fluoride, but they need to write something fairly quickly or they need something prepared for them rather than having to read through an awful lot or write an awful lot. Is there a quick way at all? They wouldn't need to read this
research itself. It's great if they could reach the abstract and the conclusions, but underneath the flyer on on screen, we have got a very long table with the reasons and then the reasons why you wouldn't want it and the references. So you could actually stop there. You don't have to go any further unless you want to, you know, show that you have actually read around the subject even more. And the more you read around it and the more you're convinced, the more value come is in your
response. This is incredibly important and I can't highlight it enough to everybody watching and listening is that this is medicine coming through your tap. You don't know. I don't know how much you drink a day, but you don't know how much fluoride you're drinking. It depends, I guess, on how much you're drinking every single day. And it's really important that we rise up against this. And you've got a time date now
on this, haven't you, Joy? It's the 31st of July so people have got to get cracking on with it right now. Including the 31st, right up to 11:59 at night. That's right, yeah. So everybody, please, we don't have much time. In fact, we have no time, Joy. We'll talk more about the consultation and we'll remind people before our interview is finished about the consultation.
But I want to just quickly ask you for a little bit of an update in Poison Chalice One, you were talking about America and legal suits that were going on. Could you explain for people that didn't see #1 just a little brief overview and where we are now with the the case in the United States with fluoride? OK. So it started in 2016, There was a petition by about three or four groups of concerned people where they petitioned the Environmental Protection Agency against fluoride.
But the EPA decided they weren't going to do anything about the petition and just poo pooed it. So a year later, the son of one of the group's leaders, Michael Connett, who is a solicitor and attorney, started legal action against the EPA. And the court case has been going on ever since. The final hearing was in March, April this year and the judge, his name is Judge Edward Chen, has adjourned as it were, and is now sitting back and considering his verdict.
We gave very, very strong evidence against fluoride overexposure in the in the child's environment and the unborn child's environment. The evidence centred on the reduction in IQ when you're unborn and when you're drinking fluoridated baby formula. In America, the level of fluoride added to drinking water is .7. It varies, but .7 is what is added and that showed a reduction in IQ points of between 5:00 and 6:00 IQ points,
which is significant. The male unborn child is more damaged in the womb and the girl infant is more damaged from drinking fluoridated tap water and fluoridated baby formula. The mechanism for this is something to do with the endocrine system, the thyroid gland, the the availability of iodide in the in the mother's bloodstream and therefore in the unborn child. There's also been 3 mechanisms detected of how the brain is damaged by fluoride when the
child is in the womb. And that also has a permanent effect in reducing IQ. So together with the iodide factor and the, should we just say disruption of neurotransmitters, I'm going to be in more detail, but that's the sort of thing that's happening. And then of course, if that child continues to drink fluoride via fluoridated formula, then the IQ drops even more. It's it's something apparent would probably not notice to begin with.
And it's something really that you only see if you look at a population as a whole. And if you look at all the fluoridated children going through school and you do an IQ test on them all, then you will see that there are going to be less geniuses and more educationally challenged children because of this. But children in the middle, the ones who would have been quite intelligent will be intelligent, and the ones who are intelligent will be a little less
intelligent. So it's not going to be obvious in the middle of a spectrum of intelligence. But you won't have quite so many geniuses, and you'll have far more children who need special education. And at the far end of the spectrum, you will have those who you would have called with threatenism. We don't like use that worthy anymore. It's not very nice, but you get the the drift. These are children who will never, never have any potential whatsoever. Wow.
Wow, that's quite shocking. Final piece of evidence we had, which was very strong, was what is known as a systematic review, where the US government's National Toxicology Programme looked at 55 research studies into IQ and fluoride and found that 52 of them robustly showed a correlation, strong correlation between overexposure to fluoride in the womb and baby formula and reduction in intelligence.
That's so strong. I mean, we're talking about, doesn't it, about whether the judge pronounces today, tomorrow or next year. The systematic review is the very strong piece of evidence because when you have systematic reviews, you're looking at every single piece of research and you're looking at the high quality research then. And then you're powering them down and you decide which ones are really very, very good. And you look at the very good
ones. And then you find 55 of them, over 5252 of them actually really, you know, laid it on the line to say that look, this is the problem. So we have to warn all women in this country who are fluoridated now, who are planning a family and all women will might be fluoridated in future if we don't win this consultation. And that is why the consultation is so incredibly important. And I have to remind everyone, and, you know, Joy, we're living in difficult times at the moment.
We're having an awful lot of thrown at us. The World Economic Forum tells us it's a Poly crisis. So there's one emergency after another. There's one new story coming out that's dominating the headlines and people get distracted. But I've always said water effects each and every one of us. None of us can survive without water. And, and I'll go back to my original question as of do you know what is coming through your tap? Because I don't believe that anybody does or perhaps will
know accurately in the future. For those of you that aren't in the United Kingdom, I'm sure you've probably realized by now that we have a new government. We have a Labour governments who have got big plans for water. They've got big plans for water regulation as well. So we had off what who I say do
what, pretty much nothing. And now we seem to have a new water regulator that's going to be formed, which is going to include off what's the water, the drinking water inspectorates and the Environment Agency. So we're going to get all three lumped in. Now, I know from experience that in each area there is a drinking water inspector that's allocated, but there's one inspector for large areas and they're not testing water. Water isn't being tested every
day in in a specific area. It's being tested randomly. So my question, I think, Joy, is if this rolls ahead and I really do plead with everybody, please, we have to row against this. This is water, this is medicalising water. It's going to be coming through your tap and everybody needs water to survive. And we'll come on to what we can do about fluoride in the water and what methods we can take to prevent us from drinking fluoride in a minute. But this is like super important.
But Joy, if if it is rolled out, what would you expect a drinking water inspector to do? I mean, how often would somebody in Northumbria's water be tested? I mean, could they just page into a website and see old today I've got certain amount of fluoride in my water and tomorrow I've got a different amount? Or will they never know what they're drinking? OK, the, but water companies have to do certain number of tests on each chemical per year. So they can't get away from it.
They have to do it whether they tell the truth or not, I don't know. We have, let's assume they're telling the truth. So most of the chemicals, we call them chemical parameters, by the way, they mostly are below the maximum allowable. And we're talking about ordinary drinking water here. If, if they rise above the maximum allowable, then the water company has to tell the drinking water inspectorate and then they have to try and mediate the problem when it comes to medical water or
medicinal water. And we have to accept that it is medicinal water because it's put in the drinking water to prevent a human disease. There's no two worries about it. The government won't accept that it's medicine, but we have got the drinking water directive on our side on this particular aspect. It's a medicine. When it comes to medicinal water, the water companies pretend that they're following the guidelines for drinking
water. They they don't sort of discriminate between the medicinal water chemicals and ordinary drinking water chemicals. It's all lumped in together basically. So they have to try and keep to the guidelines. But unfortunately, because it's a medicine, there are no guidelines for medicinal water because medicinal water does not come under the protection provisions of the Drinking water Directive because medicinal water is not drinking water.
So I would say that the guidelines are not not quality for every single chemical in the medicinal water. Now that's just going to one side. I'm sorry, I have to get on to that because it's so important to realise that if you're getting medicinal water, you're not getting drinking water, why should you pay for it?
So if you're going to be fluoridated, the first thing you can do is tell the water company as soon as the fluoride taps are turned on that you will stop paying for your drinking water, medicinal water, because it's not something you want. You have been paying for drinking water all this time and now it's going to be product substitution. Why should you have to drink a medicine when you don't need it? Don't pay for it. You can get away with it.
It's reasonable. And I've been refusing to pay drinking water for four years now. I still pay for sewerage. That's another subject we're not going to go into today. No, right. But I don't. I pay. I pay 50% but you know, 50% is still more than I would probably pay if I had a water meter. So what's coming at you What
what is coming at you tap. Well, you can easily check all the water companies have to publish the results of their analysis of each chemical online according to your post code. Oh, everyone has to now some make it more difficult than others. I think 7 trends are quite. It's quite easy you stick into your search engines. 7 trend water, water quality report and that's what you have to do.
Then you you come to a screen where it's pretty colours as it were faded whatever and you've got a post code box where you put your post code in press return and then you Scroll down the page and then you see all the list of all the chemicals which are in your treated drinking water or in your fluoridated medicinal water. You need to know that one column is the maximum allowable and these are measured in milligrams
or micrograms. You also need to know that that particular column is is separated from the minimum, average and maximum values found by the testers that who are employed by the water companies. So you need to know your way around the columns. Unfortunately, the headings don't follow down the table, so it's really difficult if you don't know don't know your way around. So you can tell that in most cases, you'll find that all the values are below the maximum allowable for ordinary drinking
water. So let's take a case of arsenic, which I'm pretty fond of. Don't eat. No, I distilled all my water so I don't have arsenic in my body. I hope. We'll come on to distillation in a minute, I promise. OK. The maximum allowable for arsenic is 10 micrograms, which is 100 times less than the amount of fluoride added to drinking water. Microgram is a billionth of a litre. A billionth. So 10 micrograms. Yeah, It's not not a billion, of
course. Yes. So it's it's a very, very tiny amount. Could we have any arsenic in our water, Joy? Yeah. I mean just the just the very name arsenic is going to send people going. Wow, Have we really? Are we really allowing that in water? Yes, in ordinary drinking water they have been below 10 micrograms. They can't get it any lower because water treatment is not capable of reducing it down even further. There's arsenic in the raw water which comes in from the
reservoirs and rivers and lakes. And although the water treatment process does remove some, there's still some gets into your tap. But because it's below 10, it's legal. OK. Now The thing is, when you're fluoridated, the fluoridating acid contains arsenic. And so it's deliberately added innocently, adventitiously added.
It's it's added by accident, shall we say, just to be generous to the government, It's added by accident with your fluoride and that will increase the amount of arsenic giving out your tap. It may not, it may never get to more than 10 micrograms because in your raw water you might get 2 micrograms and in your fluoride you might get 3 micrograms. So that's five and that's not going to be more than 10. But there's a possibility it could be over 10, right? Because you don't know, it could
go either way. We'll be hoping that the water companies are telling the truth when they do their analysis or the samples coming out of a tap which they provide water to. I just want to add to that that water companies, because they're private companies, although they're performing a public duty, they actually don't have to reply to Freedom of
Information requests. So sometimes even if you write to a water company and say under a freedom, they say, sorry, it doesn't apply to us and you don't get the information that you want. And a lot of the water laboratories that this water is being tested are the water companies laboratories themselves. So we I don't know is it is it ever tested at independence? I mean completely state independence laboratories.
I suspect the commercial laboratories employed by the water companies have to be truthful, but it doesn't mean that the analysis sent back to the water companies don't change, right? You don't. You don't want the drinking water inspected on your back all the time because you're over the maximum. But we're talking about going back to fluoridated medicinal water you've got. There are no guidelines because no one, no one has defined guidelines for medicinal water.
It's always been assumed that they're the same as the guidelines for drinking water. So if you've got 3 micrograms of arsenic in your drinking water per litre, then should it not be naughty? Yes, I hadn't thought of that. Right. So they're not, they're not the only things added to the drinking water when you have fluoridating acid added to treated water, the the ones which are heavy metals are antimony, arsenic, of course, cadmium, chromium, lead, mercury, nickel and selenium.
Selenium is OK. I don't mind that because that's beneficial. It's pretty bad though, isn't it? When you think about it, and this is my most important thing that I can emphasize is that the water companies are employed or are in business to treat water to make it potable. It should be absolutely crystal clear when it comes out of your tap and they try their best. They've got the technology, they can do their best. I mean, the chlorine, I don't like the idea of it.
They surely should have nicer ways of of disinfecting our water these days. All right, we'll move on 20 years. We might get some ultraviolet systems, but they are so constrained. They have to produce potable wholesome drinking water, but they have to obey the guidelines. They have to do it. They that everything must be as pure as possible, but when it comes to fluoridating, they add back in the stuff they've taken out. Wow. And now that is that is abysmal.
How can that be the case? It's insane actually, isn't it? It's. Outrageous. It's outrageous. Wow. But but you know, for all that we're saying here, and I'm very aware that many people watching will be in some of those fluoridated areas that you've just talked about. And I know that you're in a fluoridated area as well, Joy. And our intention here today is not to frighten anybody.
It's not to panic anybody. What it is, is it's here to inform you so that you know what to look for and you can take your preventative measures. This is for information, but it's also for action. We need to get people really on the ball with this now. And please, please, I can't ask you enough, please go and and look at the consultation. So for people that are living in fluoridated areas, I thought it was very interesting that you said don't pay your that side of
your water bill. And I'm sure a lot of ears are pricking up now because you're quite right. Drinking water is not medical water. It's not medical fertilized water. They're two completely different products if you like. So whilst you're agreeing to pay for drinking water, safe drinking water, what you're getting is effectively medicine
through the tap. So for people that are living in fluoridated areas and maybe are now only just realizing, thinking, Oh my goodness, I didn't realize, what can they do, joy, because they'll all be going well, what do I do to stop this? Or if I've got it coming through my tap, how do I distill it or make it fluoride free? Make it friendly and safe to drink. All right, so if you're not paying for your medical water, you can actually save the money and buy yourself some equipment.
Three good pieces of equipment are distillation, about 100 lbs hundred, and the last one I bought was 140, but I bought the top of the range stainless steel, a glass receptacle and it's really good. It's just 4 litres in four hours. Now it is using electricity unfortunately. So if you're income constrained then it's not the easiest thing to do, but it's going to save your health in the long term, not having all those chemicals going into your body. It's going to help your body
recover its vibrancy. The other one is reverse osmosis. That is the actual system. People buy so many places now online and we're again, we're talking about 100 lbs tops with their first filters included. Now you have to keep buying the filters and replacing when when you've got to a certain stage where the total dissolved solid reading for your filtered water is around about 20 to 30 TDs total dissolved solids, you can buy ATDS meter for about 5 lbs.
So always good thing to do that. Once it gets to that stage, then you change your filters. So it's not a straightforward thing. You just have to try and empty the reservoir and remove everything from under the sink because it'll leak a bit. Put towels down and then remove the filters and put the new filters in and then refill the
system. Pour off the whole system once because you don't want to be taking in anything which is in the first draft of waters that you like, and then you go to go for the next few months. Joy can I for people that don't know and they're watching for the first time they're going to be many people that are saying all sorts of brands and I can hear people probably going Berkey water distiller doesn't
it doesn't need electricity. I know that you've got reservations and we'll talk about that in a minute, but other people will be going, Oh yes, I've got a water filter. I put it in the fridge. But a water filter, a filter jug is not what we're talking about here. We're talking about distillation and we're talking about reverse osmosis. But I think many people will be
going, what's the difference? What is the difference between a water distiller, one that isn't electrically powered because something like a Berkey and I'm not advertising them in particular. It's just I know a lot of people will be more familiar with that make it looks a bit like a tea urn and it doesn't it doesn't need power. So it sits on your kitchen worktop and you pour water, water into it and the carbon filters and the fluoride filters will filter the water for you to drink.
And then you clean out the, the container, which I know you've got reservations because of course it's aluminium. And maybe you've got an alternative. But so the electric distillers, which you were talking about, which eighty to 100 lbs, which you can buy in a in a supermarket or in, in, well, pretty much anywhere on, on the Internet. And then you've got these more expensive systems which don't need power. So for example, a water distiller that I've got cost me
£400. So it's quite, it is quite a lot of money to fork out in one time. And then similarly, we've got reverse osmosis, which many people probably won't even know. Well, what, what does that mean? And if it's somebody that's elderly or maybe it's a young mum, are there people about that can come and do this? Is there, I mean, showers, baths, you know, how far do we
go with this? Could you simplify filtration, distillation, reverse osmosis just for people that aren't quite familiar with with all of this? Right. So the you talked about the jug filters, the only one in this country, as far as I know, which does remove fluoride is the 0 filter jug. And it is very good. And you can get away with cleaning the filter and putting it back into the jug into the housing of the filter. And that's quite good.
But it's reducing the profits of the company, which is the filter. Yeah. OK. Distillation is the only one I would recommend to anybody who is elderly because it's not as difficult to, to fill the distillate with water and then to pour off the water from the jug into your into your kettle. We've had it very careful to put the jug underneath the spout. Otherwise you flood flood the kitchen.
Zero filter jug is fine, but it's it's not so easy for people who haven't got full use of their hands. Reverse osmosis plumbed in. You do need a plumber, but once it's plumbed in it's the easiest to use. But you need to check it every now and then, make sure it
doesn't need changing. So then you have to bring along the plumber again to change the filters for you because if you haven't got full use of hands, then you do need somebody in your body to do it. It's not difficult to do it for anybody, but for an older person with we cans is pretty difficult and our policy and if they haven't got much money then but getting the plumber out every time is not so good.
And the temptation would be then to continue to use the filter without checking it and you're going to start increasing the fluoride overload in your body. Berkey from America, they've had bad press the white fluoride filter candles. The filtrate medium is made of aluminium particles, which attracts the fluoride atoms and ions if you like. But unfortunately the filtrate media does not stay in the filtrate. It actually gets into the
product water. So by the time you've drank the water, you've got the aluminium in the drinking water that you want to drink as opposed to the drinking water you put in the top. So we've gone from there to to buying similar filters from a company called Rican that's around the Rican WREKIN, which do actually not have aluminium in the filtrate medium. So you can keep your filter, you can keep your American Berkey if you buy the Rican filters. What about the UK? There's auk site for Berkey.
Are they are they the same? Are they all manufactured in in? Are they all? USAI would not like to say I have no idea. I don't. I wouldn't want to go there. Because I'm just thinking if somebody in the UK is ordering, they'll go to Berkey, UK. And I know that there have been some supply issues with Europe. I don't think those are applicable to the United Kingdom per SE. But I just wondered if there was a difference in product or if it was the same product if.
The UK Berkey filters are the same as the European Burke of felt. Then it should be OK. But I, I think some time ago there was some clones which were just kind of going to say pushing out the aluminium particles. So Turkey is great. I mean, it's a filth, it's a gravity system. The slower the water goes through, the better it is. But as I say, we have to be really careful about the
aluminium. Yeah. And I think it's fair to say as well that if anybody is considering buying a Berkey, you do have to buy the fluoride filters. They come with carbon filters, but they don't come standard with fluoride filters. And I believe when I last looked, I think they're about 140 lbs. So you could be paying 504 to 500 lbs for a full system. So that is a significant outlay.
However, in the case of power outages, which we may get in winter, then you're not reliant then on electricity because as you've said, it's gravity. And it looks very like a tea urn, doesn't it? That sits on your kitchen worktop. What do you do? Joy, because you're in a fluoridated area, so you're the experts. What measures do you take personally? I don't have a full house filtration system. I have sort of held back for some time waiting for the perfect one to come online.
I've got a few leads now. We're following that during this year. Glad you have a distiller. I just bought myself an all singing all dancing one for 140 lbs and that's stainless steel glass receptacle. A tiny little carb carbon teabag filter in the spout to Polish it off to make sure it's. Fine. Can I see the make of that? Because everybody will be going. Which one is it? Which one is it? I wouldn't actually recommend any at the moment, just just go online and find the one you want.
If you want stainless steel, that's fine. They're all stainless steel. Make sure they're not aluminium inside in the in the interior and plastic polycarbon receptacle is OK but I just bought myself one the glass receptacle and that's about £50 more than the the the low priced one. Then I've got the 0 filter jug. It was a devil to get the filter in really tight. The housing wouldn't wouldn't give way and it leaked.
But after time the housing eased and then we could actually screw the filter in properly and it works beautifully now. And with a TDs gauge, you can tell when you have to change the filter. Or as I said, you can actually dismantle the filter, wash it out several times in distilled water and put it back in again. Can you tell? Us what TDs a TDs meter is. Total dissolved solids. It just measures little particles in the water.
The more particles there are, the less efficient the filter is. It's coming to the end of its life. Where do? You get those from Joy. And how much? How much do you pay? Online, I mean I bought the I bought the bog standard 0 filter jug. I think about 30 lbs, but it can go up to about 100 and 5200, depending on how sophisticated you want your water jug to look. And finally, reverse osmosis. I've had the same system now for
four or five years. I don't change the filters as often as I ought to because I put the reverse osmosis water into my distiller so the distiller doesn't get so clogged up and doesn't have to be cleaned quite so often. So there you go. Let's talk about that actually joy, because I was shocked. I was genuinely shocked after I'd used my water distiller for a little while at the stuff that was inside. It was, it's not nice, is it, having to clean one out and that's what's actually coming
out of your tap. I found that quite alarming. I don't know what your thoughts are on the gunk. That. That sits in the bottom. It's dehydrated gunk, which is all the minerals and all the chemicals which are in your tap water. Some of them are beneficial calcium, you get hard water area, your kettle still gets third up. So that's what you're seeing in the bottom of your distiller plus all the other components, right.
So exactly fluoride in there is in there somewhere and all the heavy metals in the tap water, not very many, but over time it builds up. You just get your back out the cylinder and you clean the inside and where to go again.
Joy, you know, I would say to people, if you want to know even more, especially about children's teeth and teeth cleaning, etcetera, have a look at poison chalice one because Joy did an amazing interview with tons more information and parents, young mums, pregnant mums, really important for you to watch this. I'm keeping an eye on on the time Joy and, and I'm eager to ask you if there's anything
today that we have missed out. I know that we're going to be going to you for your last word, which is hugely important, but is there anything that we've missed out that you want to cover for today, especially with the consultation ending literally days away? That's right. I'd say that's the reasons why this is happening. This will be going into the realms of conspiracy theories, but that's OK, I'm happy with those. There's two reasons, as the main reasons is to try and reduce
decay. The hidden reasons are that the phosphate fertilizer manufacturers and the aluminium smelters are laughing all the way to the bank because instead of having to neutralize their waste, which is a fluoridating acid, they can sell it at a small profit. So they balance the books very nicely, thank you very much. It also solves the problem of having huge quantities of liquid waste piling up around their manufacturers facilities which make phosphate fertilizer, which make aluminium.
Those are the two sort of hidden reasons. Is there anybody in the establishment, in the government got money in those sort of industries? I have no idea, but you know, there'll be some sort of the
dividend. The really hidden issue about this all and this is where, you know, it's something I would not normally wish to discuss online, but I'm I'm fed up with having to pussyfoot around it. I've read a book by Population Scientist about three or four months ago called Kevin Gallery and it's called Killing Us Softly. And it's it, it does it gradually tells you that it's not anything to do with my industry or dental decay. It's to do with the global depopulation problem.
And because we know that fluoride has been used in the past in history to reduce population, reduce sterility. I'm sorry, to increase sterility and to reduce fecundity if you like. And it also does make people I'll, especially hyperthyroidism and diabetes and broken bones, that sort of thing. Then is it not hastiness of this mortal coil sooner rather than later.
The whole idea then would be a reduction in population and I that's theory as great merit as far as I can see when I read the book, everything I've been self doubting or doubting about fell into place. I just, I just couldn't see why, why they're so stubborn about reducing dental decay all this time when we know it doesn't work, it doesn't reduce oral health inequalities. It can't do that.
It doesn't help anyone's health. It causes dental fluorosis, mucky teeth, it causes brittle teeth, brittle bones a lot. And all the evidence I've been going through during my response to the consultation tells me there's a huge amount of research out there which, taken together and looked at in reviews, should tell the government they are barking up the wrong tree. Instead of doing this in secret, they should be persuading us not to have so many children.
If possible, they should be upfront. And you know, there is another issue as well in that I'm, I'm old enough to remember my mum taking me to the dentist every six months for a check up. It was really easy. I used to dread it, but I used to go and it was without question, the appointment was made at the, my following appointment was made at the appointment I was at. So it was all scheduled. But today you're lucky if you can find an NHS dentist, you're lucky.
Many people I know that have got my kids are grown up now and their friends, they're all having children. I've got grandchildren. It is virtually impossible to get a dental appointment for adults and children in this
country now. And anytime a dentist has got appointments open I see reports of people queuing literally around blocks to try, you know, at 6:00 in the morning waiting for them to open that there doesn't seem to be a dental service anymore in the UK. And make them private so those of us who you know, care about our to go and join that with den plan. And it was that way. And during COVID it was really not possible to have dental
plans at all. No, it was, I have to say, joy that you know, I, I can't, I can't tell people enough what a stalwart you are and how much work you have done.
You are a phenomenal campaigner and you have been literally the driving force of the fluoride agenda because without you and everybody that's working around and with you and without you keeping your eyes out on the rest of the world, we wouldn't know what's going on. And that's where I come back to my original question is, do you know what is coming out of your
tap? And if you were told that you were going to get medicine that could harm you and your babies, your children, would you drink that water? My suggestion is that you probably wouldn't. And without people like Joy, we might never know. So this consultation is incredibly important. Water effects all of us, and the agenda is changing where they're even thinking now of moving water from 1 area to another.
So even if you're not in a fluoridated area, can you be sure, 100% sure that you're not receiving water from another area? I doubt that any of us could. So water affects us all, every single one of us. So please, please take caution from both of these interviews and we'll be joining Joy again because this is an ongoing situation and we're going to need to know the results of consultation. So please do or go and make your comments known to try to stop this.
But like always, Joy, I'm going to throw to you for your last word, which I believe is going to be extremely powerful. And I'd just like to thank you so much for everything that you do and anybody watching, you know, whether you're a subscriber to UK column or not, if you like what we're doing and you find this information valuable, which we believe it's incredibly valuable, please share it.
Please pass it along and please spread the word and ask people to go to the website and make their comments known. You've only got a few days left, so thank you again, Joy, and it's over to you for your last word. Thank you very much, Debbie. I must emphasize that for the consultation, everyone in the UK can take part even though they're not going to be directly affected.
I think I've probably emphasized the points that if you are planning a family and you live in a fluoridated area, it's so important to be aware of what you're eating and drinking and even if you have a bath in your house. We really know that fluoride is absorbed through the skin and the skin is an endocrine system components. Not many people understand that, but each cell on this upper skin layer performs about the same function as the thyroid gland. It actually does produce thyroxin.
So if you poison the skin with fluoride because that means it won't be producing the thyroxin, then you would go into a low thyroid condition, which is not what you want to do if you were planning a family. Older ladies in this country, in the main, do get hyperthyroidism if they like their hot bars, and they should stick to showers if they're fluoridated. Pregnant girls, women, you know, you do need to understand also that you're not allowed. You're discouraged from drinking
alcohol. You're you're discouraged from eating this, this, this and smoking or whatever, but nobody ever tells you not to drink tea and tea. The Indian tea, black tea, the tea, the cup, the cheers is all of fluoride. And if you're in a fluoridated area, making your tea with fluoridated water so you're easily getting to the maximum recommended by the World Health Organization per day of 6 milligrams of fluoride.
And if you're pregnant or you're planning a pregnancy, be be aware that fluoride could affect your cucundity, your ability to conceive, and can also then damage the intelligence of your inbound child. It's so important to avoid Indian tea, avoid fluoridated water, avoid bathing in fluoridated water and only having brief showers if you can manage it. Now there are other foods on the market which contain fluoride and you're not going to know because it's never on the list of ingredients.
But to assume that anything that comes in from Ireland, the Republic of Ireland is going to contain fluoride, including Guinness. So don't have your Guinness, it's doing really good. And anything coming from America, you don't know which parts are fluoridated or not. And a good 60% of the area of America, USA, which has no natural fluoride of drinking water is, is fluoridated.
So a lot of the foods over there contain fluoride from irrigation water or whatever unwise food the animals have been given. It's a case of looking at not looking at labels because fluoride is not on labels. Just consider where the food's coming from and whether it's likely to have been watered with fluoridated water. And some plants accumulate fluoride because that's where they are. Tea is one and blueberries is another, and I think spinach
also. So if you can get your spinach from an organic farm or which isn't in a fluoridated area or it's all well and good. OK, So the NHS is not going to tell you about this and you just have to look out for yourself.