None. It's been a while. Mike Eden, thank you for joining me in the trenches. German. It's, it's great to see your face and to be speaking to you. My wife and I, we watched pretty much all your interviews. So you're, you're a really key guy for us. Well, Mike, you have been a key guy for me, ironically. Let's just quickly go back just a little bit of history. I think you and I were introduced around late 2020 by our mutual friend Rana.
Filmish. Shame lot's happened to him also, but what's happened since then? Oh my word, we've been through the washing machine and you know, several psyop campaigns and jabs and whatever, but but it's good to see that you're, you're still smiling. One of the reasons we like to listen to you is that your voice is, is a good voice to listen to. And you can't help but smile very often, which is it's rare enough. So it's infectious too, as you
can see. Mike, I get that from Bob Moran, he said Once Upon a time that you must treat everything as if it's satire. Yeah, it's, it's there is something I'm not, I'm not any good at that kind of stuff. But I think I try to treat what's going on as lightly as I can whilst not hiding from the seriousness. Because otherwise you just become Doctor Doom, you know, a
depressed person. Somebody said to me the other day, if you, you know, if you hold strong negative feelings inside you without any, any release for them, it will corrode you. And I, I think that's probably true. And I, I've managed to not let that happen because I basically I focus as much as I can on objective things. I, I don't, doesn't bother me which, which particular actor is doing what particular thing. I, I don't get excited about individuals very much.
You know, who cares whether Bill Gates is Bill Gates or somebody else's? They'll be replaced periodically by other marionettes dangled in front of us. So yeah, it's the I try to stay focused on what's happening, to be clear about the biggest risks, occasionally delving into detail to try and bolster the idea that I'm not completely mad because a lot of people think I'm completely mad. Yeah. And, you know, my wife keeps me saying as well. And we, we, we're good at
laughing. So, you know, let's follow your lead on that too. You know, life, life's a mixture of some horrible seriousness and absurdity at the same time. So I'm I'm with Bob and it's absurd. I remember when when, when Rana introduced us and, and he said in his email to me, there's a scientist. I really, really want to introduce you to him. And it got me thinking. Mike, is science dead? No, it's a very good, it's a very good question.
No, I wouldn't say it's, it isn't dead because doing science or, or looking at things scientifically is, is a process anyone can learn to do. And a friend of mine describes it as never pretending to know something that you don't, you know, in a recent interview, I pointed out that that we've got at least two kinds of knowledge, maybe more. But these two are very clear to me. Things you know because you've done them yourself.
You've put your hands on them, you you've wrestled with whatever The thing is. You may fire a gun or planted A crop or whatever it is, cut some wood up. You know those things from experience. And then there's all the rest someone told you and you chose to believe them. And I've challenged people and I've said that I've had to be honest with myself and accept that probably like 95%, maybe more of what I think I know
belongs to that second category. And I can't, I haven't got enough processing power to go and examine everything that's in there that I think is knowledge. But when I Draw Something that I didn't, you know, out of the library of Mike's memory and I'm trying to apply it to some problem, I think, do you know that? Or was that a story which you've accepted uncritically? And that's one of our biggest problems. I recently came across the phrase preferred. Is it preferred reality?
Some, I think it's preferred reality. It's a NATO phrase. And I saw it in the context of some disclosures that NATO had essentially been running in the EU or large numbers of countries we would think of as in in Europe. And they were given instructions to say this is a public health emergency, but it's going to be run as if it was a military op. It requires these kind of capabilities and we're going to tell you what you need to tell
the people. And we've all got to do the same kind of thing just to keep the, the, the story straight. And they said it's for good reasons, but they use the phrase repeatedly that when we tell you these things and you're to tell your population these things, it's to impose our preferred reality. And I thought, God, that's, that's the, that's the difficulty I face when I speak to somebody who believes the narrative.
They're, they're living in a, in a, a different plane somehow because they, they, they may know 50 or 250 things that I know are lies or I've examined many of them and discovered that they're false and but they don't know that. And so when I pop in and say, you know, things like there, there wasn't a pandemic, just a lie about it and a deliberately inappropriate diagnostic test to to give the numbers.
And then unfortunately, people died in care homes and hospitals and they, their deaths were attributed to this disease. And there's your pandemic and they go nonsense. I know lots of people who whatever, you know, I have people who worked in hospitals. They'd have told me if that was happening. But The thing is, the people in hospitals, I've heard from other people who are, who worked in intensive care, who were not trained intensivists.
They were, they were like General Medical staff, but they got assigned to these newly opened intensive care beds and they came in as plastic sheets hanging from the ceiling. Everybody's gowned up with gloves and CBRN suits. They look at each other and they can see terror in the other staff's eyes and they're signalling what to do next on the protocol and then nipping out of the room again. So I'm sure when they came home, it was eerie.
There were 12 people in the room, all silent because they'd all been sedated, intubated and ventilated. All I could hear was the history of the machines and one by one the heart traces went off. Just imagine how terrifying that would be. We were doing all we could, we followed all the instructions and they were just dying. When that person comes out and tells their partner or their friends, they're reinforcing the preferred, preferred reality.
But in practise, none of those people should have been on ventilators. It's I don't know if I explained this last time. So I'm a, I'm a research scientist, not a doctor, but I've worked in the field of respiratory for pretty much 40 years, just under 40 years. Yeah, 40 years. This year my PhD was in respiratory depression and opiates.
So I just classified. So when we breathe in, we draw, our diaphragm is contracted and so it falls downwards towards your abdomen and we swing our chest muscles forward and upwards. And those two things together make your chest into a bellows. There's negative pressure between the inner wall of your chest and the outside of your lungs. So and so as a result of that reduced pressure, air flies into your airway, through your open airway all the way down. So here is my contention.
Germans for the listeners, no patient with an intact unobstructed airway. So a hole all the way from the mouth down to the bottom of the lungs and with an intact chest wall. They've not been crushed, shot or stabbed, paralysed or hit on the head, so they're able to produce rhythmic respiratory movements and the air will go in and out. No person like that should ever be sedated, intubated and ventilated. Why? Because when you ventilate, you
do it naturally. You produce that negative pressure and the air flows in nicely and inflates your lungs gently, and then the reverse happens on exhalation. It's not true with a ventilator. With a ventilator you're being
blown up like a balloon. Now it's not as gross as you heaving away on a birthday balloon, but that's what you have to do. You have to mount a considerable intra tracheal pressure, the opening pressure to begin to inflate your chest and lift your chest up against its weight and keep pumping the air in until you've got whatever the required tidal volume is, which is usually half a litre or so. And then when that machine goes off, then your, your chest
collapses and outcomes the air. Well, when you do that, it's an incredibly aggressive act on the human body. You're pumping it up, letting it collapse, pumping it up, letting it collapse. That's the reverse of your normal Physiology for your entire life. That process of pressure and then collapse tends to produce lung injury. Eventually water starts leaking out of damaged blood vessels and you get an edemitus lung.
It's called AC lactase. It's gradually the most peripheral areas of your lungs start to fill with water and what happens is the pressure required to ventilate you steadily rises and rises and it's you're on, you are on a one way tickets to death. So and you need very skilled internists. They call it flying the patient because they're measuring they're monitoring the volume, the rate at which they inflate you, the pressure at end expiration. When you breathe out, you don't
breathe out fully, right? If I breathe out, I can breathe out another litre easily. So you don't go to the bottom. But if you're lying on your back unconscious and the machine just goes off, your chest collapses. So you need to apply a positive end expiratory pressure, it's called PEEP, and that's adjusted by the internist in whatever intensivist. So there's multiple dials you're playing with.
It's a very complicated machine that they cost, I don't know, 10s of thousands of dollars, maybe hundreds of thousands. They're built by hand at the race of a few a week and a couple of factories in Germany, in Switzerland. So you could never have ordered 30,000. That's a joke. I knew that. I knew there weren't that many in there weren't that many in inventory anywhere in the world, nor could they be provided this side of the following year. I know this, I've seen these,
I've used them. So if you take a person who might be having a panic attack, maybe they have got a cough and they're hyperventilating, their eyes are rolling in their heads, their heart rate's ready and 200 or 150 and their blood gases are all over the place. You don't sedate, intubate and ventilate because they'll probably die, which is what happens in 95% of them. What you should do is calm them down, take a proper examination, you know, tapping their chest,
listening to their chest. You know, it's auscultation, I think. And they use a stethoscope and they, after a while they'll conclude this person is not injured, but they're clearly in a state of heightened anxiety. You might prescribe the lowest dose of an anxiolytic one time. It's amazing. If you've ever had a panic attack, which I did as a 30 year old, the tiniest dose of an anxiolytic just dissolves your anxiety.
And 20 minutes later, you're looking at the ceiling and everybody looking at you and you go, what? It's like, what? And they're going, are you all right? It's like, yeah, what's going on? It's like, well, you were off your head, Mike, you, you were crying. You're rolling around on the floor. He said you couldn't breathe anyway. So this is what happens when you if you're if you lose it and you're whatever, you get overwhelmed by events.
Sometimes it can be fear or grief or, or the television's told you you could catch this virus and die. And people were rolling up at hospitals and I think a lot of them were in a state of panic that the people assessing them thought, Oh my God, they've got COVID. Look at this. Their heart rates, heart's racing, can't calm. They're breathing down. They're telling me they can't breathe, they're short of air.
Get them on the ventilator. What they should have done is take a proper history, if appropriate, the lowest dose of an anxiolytic cup of tea. Kindly hand on the arm or come and see you later in 20 minutes, dear, you know, and then, oh, I'm feeling. And then if, if you need, if you're feeling a bit breath, just take a breath of this little mask. It's got like a little extra oxygen for you and we'll come and check you again. I reckon 95% of the patients, 90% would have just gone home.
But these people were recruited into a preferred reality. And I think initially, and I always thought this, I think initially most of the medical staff were also induced into this preferred reality and and therefore went on unknowingly to kill their patients. I'm sure the senior pulmonologist damn well knew because I knew as a non doctor that this is wrong. You know, I knew as a non doctor this is wrong. People might say this is crazy. It doesn't. Might know that these
ventilators are life saving. Yeah, of course they are. You know, if you've had head injury or drug overdose. So you're not breathing properly on your own. Your normal respiratory rhythm is gone or threaded. You don't get them on a ventilator. They're gonna die. If they've had a chest injury, Pneumothorax, it's called, where you've got a RIP in that chest wall. So you try and breathe in and air just goes into the through the slit in your chest.
So if you've been stabbed, you know, you've got to cover that. You won't be able to breathe in. If you just leave it uncovered, you'll get this air whizzing in and out your chest and you'll just die. So yeah. And then if you want planned surgery, you know, I think most people who have complex coronary bypass probably go on a ventilator, or at least it's available for them during the 24 hours of recovery. Major surgery anywhere in the body, that's going to take 8 hours.
You're going to be so deeply sedated, you're probably going to be ventilating you. And then the last category I think of is people who've come in with such appalling injuries, like all four long bones broken, you know, after a fall, a parachute accident or they've been burned, you know, a third of their bodies burns second or third degree. And the only thing you can do is sort of to try and relieve them of pain if you deeply sedate them.
And then you might put them on a ventilator until they can be assessed and so on. Other than that, yeah. And don't take walk in patients who've got an unblocked airway and then attack chest or you don't sedate. Incubate ventilator, ladies and gentlemen, in every hospital, every major hospital in every country in the West. That's what happened to your relatives when they went in.
So that's part of the fraud. And I, I only referred to because, Jim, we were talking about a new phrase for me that I learned from someone who'd been reading the NATO Population Control Handbook or whatever. It wasn't called that, but they were describing instructions given to ministers of all of the like the major countries. You may find a video of I think it's the defence minister or the home secretary of the Dutch
government. And the lady is at the microphone saying I didn't want to have to do the things I have to do. But yeah, but it was for the best and and I didn't feel good about it. So what the NATO people had said was this is a major emergency. We need to run it like a military op.
We need to impose on the population our preferred reality and the reason I stuck in my mind, I think I only read it a day or so ago is my God, that's where your friends and family and relatives that you can't reach there in this preferred reality that was imposed on them by through the media and through governments and and these screens and everything. I escaped it because by at most late spring 2020, I just thought, hello, pops and all your houses.
And I turned off all, all news media, including alternative news media, because I concluded quite quickly that a lot of those, voluntarily or not, weren't really on our side. They were, they were revealing some information that was true. They generally didn't lie, but they would hang back on, for example, no one would have told you what I just did, you know, no one medical would tell you that.
And yeah, so that people ended up in a reinforced preferred reality if they escaped the A grade, which is watching the BBC or Reuters, if they escaped from that because they were suspicious, they fell into the net of the Level 1 alternatives who were not lying to them mostly, but they were not telling the whole truth. And only the few people, difficult people like you and me, just thought this doesn't make any sense. You know, I'm going to go and
explore. We've jumped out of the basket and I don't know how far you fall, but there's another level, which is what's his name, David A Hughes, who's a international relations scholar or was before he left university, professor position. He was interviewed by James Tellingpole recently and he was describing the the rather depressing third category. And I think James at this point quipped it's a small club and there's hardly anybody in it. It made me. Made me laugh.
It was a typical telling Polism. Because that's the point you get to the point where you realise you can't trust, you can't trust any kind of large scale media organisation, whether it's one that was established before or what. Basically, once it's got money swirling through it and lots of stuff. I, I, I struggle to think how you would avoid being infiltrated and controlled. At some point, you know, people would just come in and say it's
a nice studio you've got here. It'd be ashamed if anything would have happened to it. Or the same about your family or your, your job. And quite quickly, I think people will just do what they're told. And the only ones who won't, they're in this third category. That's it's not a very big category. But good thing is, I think it includes whatever percentage of the world population knows they've been lied to, that we're
fellow men and women with them. I don't know if you remember a few years ago, you and Matthias Desmond both appeared alongside each other on my on my show. And Matthias has spoken about the number he generally refers to about 30% or around about a third of all people at any given time can see through it. And I've, I've often wondered, Mike, why us?
Why are we part of that third? My bet is it'll be something about your your nature and nurture and upbringing, you know, it'll be something inherent in each of us. And then something about upbringing. So my, my by nature and people often got me wrong on this in my career. And when it happens, I always used to smile because they see me as mild mannered, pretty gentle, easy going, cooperative and so on.
And they, they thought, well, we don't need to pay any attention to what he thinks, you know, when they're working on whatever their Machiavellian plan was. But later on when basically they've trod over one of my red lines and I just literally would not move, you know, to the point that this project ends here. If you're going to insist on that, you know, or this is the end of this company, I'm not going to raise money if these are the terms, you know. Oh, crikey.
And I, when I get to one of those points, I, I, I am incredibly stubborn. Just a tiny family story. It must have been, I must have been like this when I was tiny because my my two sisters are both older than me. So when I was like 6 or 8, they would be much more powerful than me. And I remember at the weekends, quite often we'd be wrestling in front of the TV or whatever. Maybe all in wrestling was on the TV at the time.
My dad was a fan and my sister would often get me in a chokehold and my dad would say, you have to, what is it? You have to bang the floor or give in. And my dad said, MM, give in, you know, bang the floor and I wouldn't. And he said there was at least one occasion where you went blue and had to go over take the sister off you and more or less swing you upside down. I would not give in to the point of unconsciousness.
I wasn't even in, you know, I know it's dumb, but I'm just trying to answer the, the question. So I think that's inherent in me. And then upbringing. I've, I've always been just incredibly inquisitive. I've been one of those annoying kids that would say, well, why is that then? How does that work? Why is that?
Then how do you know that? And I, I think I worked out quite early on that we don't know that much about anything because even people you ask, they get to a point of irritation and, and they, they might snap, but then they would say, look, the honest truth is this is, this is the best explanation I have of this. If you want more, you're going to have to go and ask an expert. And I'm like 10 or something. It's because it's not because I'm clever.
I just keep saying, oh, that's interesting, how do you know that? And then they realise they don't know how they know that. So that combination of, yeah, I'm, I'm very cooperative, but not if it goes over my red line. If I get to Mr Stubborn, there's no moving me because it's wrong. You know, I'm not going to change until I know why I should move to action. And then, yeah, just a link to inquisitiveness. Those things let me play.
Devil's advocate for a moment. You spend the greatest the greater portion of your career in the pharmaceutical sort of lanes. How did you? How did you not see anything then? I'm, I think I must be naive. I'll tell you, I was aware that I think maybe there were three major, you know, criminal cases involving my employer. It was two or three anyway, because I've worked with two or three large companies.
Welcome. Then blacks are welcome briefly and then Pfizer. And so there were a number of cases where, you know, Pfizer was fined, I think $2.3 billion when a billion was a lot of money. Now we weren't being fired, fined in research for anything we in research have done wrong. The corporation was being fined for we didn't quite know what, you know, it's like mis selling or hiding safety, you know, hiding lack of safety
information. And I, I think naively, I never attributed it to the company, but say over keen sales forces because I know, I know there was one fine for I think it's called, is it called off label promotion? So if you've got a drug and it's approved for a certain migraine headache, you can't start saying, oh, it's good for all headaches. If you've no data, you haven't got it approved with the FDA for all headaches.
You are not allowed to imply or say that it's not just migraines, Dr It's all headaches. You know, something like tension headaches as well. So it's, but you can imagine how, how easily a sales Rep, I don't know whether they still exist, but they did in the 90s and 90s. You're visiting 5 doctors a day. You're trying to pitch this drug. That's how it worked. And you try and persuade they I not that I did this. This is what I understand.
They would try and persuade the doctor to prescribe your product more often than the competition. He'd leave little mementos, little desk ornaments, a reminder, and he'd want to hit them with the key points. But you're only allowed to. You're not allowed to say things that aren't true, that were beyond what you've negotiated with FDA. But I bet you people just went a little bit over. But all the time. It's probably what they did.
And I imagine there was a team leader and then a captain of all the team leaders that said we need to push on Viops or Viagra this quarter. We're short and people wouldn't know what that meant. So I'd just go a little bit, you know, don't lie, but just hint. And I assumed eventually that it was, you know, basically the attorney general said you guys have systematically and persistently failed to comply with what you agree with. FDA fine, guilty, you know, it's
criminal. You're not allowed to do this. So you I didn't know. Now, I mean, I don't know for sure, but looking at what the corporation's done, knowing that the CEO is a respondent in various court cases, it's not this person isn't. I'm not just managing the corporation. They know what's going on. They know that what's been shipped out of their organisation were not vaccines. You know, the Albert Baller is, is a veterinarian, but he's a clever guy.
You know, he's been in applied science for decades. I would say to people, he knows what I know, right? I, I've never had to use anything more than basic knowledge in my field, like the ventilation stuff. If you, if you had, if you were to have lectures on how to ventilate a person, it'd probably be in the 1st chapter. All this stuff, how Long's work, why ventilation is necessary but inherently dangerous. So you have to watch out for these things and then we'll get into the practise.
So there's no possibility that he doesn't know that if these injections did what they said on the tin, that is there were genetic code that made your body form a protein according to that code that it wouldn't trigger autoimmune attacks in every cell. He knows that he's a clever guy. So whether that's what went out or not, he was the captain of the company that shipped 10s of well known billions probably of
doses in this material. Also, he knows that you cannot, you know, the expression, politically incorrect expression. You can't make a baby in one month with 9 women. My head of chemistry used to use that expression because it's, it's one of the better ones, you see. And they said, oh, you can't say that. He says, we'll come up with a better analogy then. Anyway. So The thing is, it doesn't matter how much results you throw at the process of development and manufacturing of
a complex product. It can't be done in 10 months. Whatever it was a friend who works his whole life in manufacturing quality. You know the the the tests for evaluating whether you've made it each step, what you intended to make and what the impurities are before and after purification. Each step has to have all of those tests validated. So you have to check that things don't interfere with them, that they're very that they're
precise and reproducible. And you negotiate with the regulator and you show them what they're doing and they go, that looks a reasonable protocol. Or we don't think you should use gas chromatography because of their very large molecular weight species. You should use or in addition mass spectrometry or something. It's a negotiation. And he said the manufacturing methods of validation and agreement with regulators would take between one and two years.
That's just for the measurements, what tests you do and then how to show that those tests are being done properly and capable of telling you, steering you through the manufacturing process so that you can believe quality control. At the end. He said one to two years. Well, they have a few weeks. So I know they did not do what they said. You can't do it in 10 months.
And they didn't do when you, when you develop a drug, you make a small amount, you do some initial animal toxicology or whatever test you're going to do in test tubes, if that's OK, you make a bit more. And then maybe you'll dose your animals for what's called regulatory tox. So you might dose them for three months, something like that. You might make various measurements.
That process alone that I've just described is way more than a year's worth of work, even if you go to the most professional contract research outlets. I know I did it as recently as 2016 as CEO of a biotech. I had to negotiate these with my colleagues. You can't do so. That's just the tox. And then phase one, you have to, you have to do single dose dose escalation in healthy
volunteers. We would reckon that entire process of getting ethics approval, getting the protocol, getting ethics approved approval, either recruiting centres, they might be hospitals or if you have an in house unit, you might do it in house. And then doing the dosing, getting all the measurements you're looking at safety, toleration, pharmacokinetics and writing that up. That alone is about a year in big pharma with its pedals in the metal, right? I know that.
So you could you shorten it. Yeah, you could probably shorten that even to three months, but you haven't got three months. I've just told you, you need one to two years just for the manufacturing methods. So I knew, ladies and gentlemen, and I maintain to this day that what they've told you they have made is not possible in the time they made it. So either A, they made it before the event, which is not good, is
it? If they made it before the event, then they've simulated the event, or they've released something at you which we could come back to. But neither of those are good, right? Or what? They didn't make what they said, but they've jabbed 6 billion people. I'm not sure whether you should like either of those two things. You don't need to be highly sophisticated to know that what I just tell you told you is true.
It's verifiable. You could, if you've made some notes, you could go and even ask Grok or something and it will tell you the same thing. What's the typical time to do XY and Z? So I, I, I've told people I'm, I'm kind of almost bored with talking. Not, not that you can tell from this, but giving these interviews, I have nothing new to say, but it's obvious thoughts as a pandemic. I always refer to Dennis Rancour, who I think you've spoken to. Yeah. And he's, he is one of the more
scientific people. I'm capable of being a scientist, but I always say I'm trying to investigate a damn crime scene, not trying to write a paper. You know, I'm just like an ordinary person. I'm just using what the skills and knowledge I've got. But then this is in addition to that is working with colleagues and painstakingly writing hundred page monographs, you know, And so there was no pandemic.
There's no hints of 1. And the, the, the recent thing I say is that you can't declare a crisis unless there's a sign of a crisis somewhere beforehand, which you might not be able to see, but someone level up might be able to see. So if someone's saying there's a forest fires coming towards your city, someone's got to smell smoke, smoke or sea flames. If there's an imminent shark attack on a beach, someone's
seen the fin. If there's if there's a supposed pandemic coming, some people somewhere have got to have been ill in greater numbers and died. And when they didn't anywhere and then they said there was a crisis and then they started dying so that no vaccines, no pandemic. And then it just gets worse from there. Yeah, I'm with you. I mean, I I was pretty much red pulled after after chatting to Denis.
By the way, it's Denis with a silent S because he's Canadian and French. So you must you must sound fancied Mike. Well. I yes, I usually do both so that people can spell phonetically. But yeah, Denis Ancour. But it's it's I'm also bored of talking about COVID and the mechanics of it. I mean, I agree with you completely, but it does create the framework for something that a previous guest of mine, Jessica Hockett, very funnily said.
She said, I started looking at the, the the New York hospital data in 2020 and I found myself asking if man actually landed on the moon. That's precisely, yes, that's precisely my journey also. Quite. Quickly you realise that, well, I'm not being told the truth here, I'm not being told the truth there. And I've listened to somebody else who sounds like he knows what he's doing and he's revealed two other dirty great lies. So it's like what is true?
My general rule of thumb now, which has nearly got me into trouble. I'll try it with you. Anything that is of at least moderate importance, I know that's a bit of a fluffy one, but we know anything that's of least moderate importance in that everyone's been told is a lie, yes. Yeah, so my, my in inversion. Yeah, my good friend Nick Hudson, he he he said something very similar. He said anything that's big is a lie. Yeah, I remember him saying
that. Yeah. The Hudson conjecture, I think it was that anything that's declared as a global emergency that's only susceptible to global solutions and census competing voices is a scam. I think that that may have been roughly his first use. And it's just so beautiful because when you point it out to people, you know, they would say, oh, well, you know, surely there must have been alternative voices. No, there weren't. You know, you weren't allowed to
have an alternative voice. And just immediately you either complying or what are you a conspiracy theorist? I'm a proud conspiracy realist now. But yeah, you get, I get bored even when spotting them. I don't care what the shape of the world is either. I mean, you know, let's see that one is 1. Where, ah, does does that mean Mike believes in Flat Earth? Because we say that. Well, because the shape of the world, I think is apparent. Well, what they want you to
believe is apparent. BBC even has a spinning globe as a logo. They used to anyway. BBC at the bottom, so it's of moderate importance at least, and everyone's been told so by my own definition, it's a lie. But The thing is, the opposite of a sphere is not a flat plain, so I don't know what shape it is. Could be a moatless strip, I don't know. It's not. Just give me. Before we go any further, Mike, there's a strange humming or buzzing sound. Is it coming from your side?
I think it. Might be the fan. Yeah, it's the fan. Oh, OK. All right. That's fine. I wonder whether it's because I've got it sitting on a hard surface and if I put it on two blocks to allow it to, it may be I'm suffocating. It's killing capacity. Hold on, I've got it sitting on a box. I don't. I haven't got anything as sophisticated as a computer stand. What the COVID era showed me, Mike, is the ability to question everything that we think we know.
But it's an extremely uncomfortable process. Yeah. Yeah, it's, I find it less uncomfortable now because I've had years to be aware that the world isn't the way up. I thought it was, you know, on all the, all the things in it. But I'm no longer frightened by it in any way. I think I was very, yeah, I was very upset by the end of 2020. And then I had my religious encounter in the middle of 2021, which was, I don't know, a belief that I, what I was doing was looking into the face of
evil when I was speaking out. And that's why I was doing it. But on the other hand, it was important to do it. And really I was getting the spiritual equivalence of a kick up the backside. Really it was, you know, here's a, here's a gift of courage and resilience. Get on with it. So, and then since then, I've been, I haven't been, I wouldn't say I found it particularly disturbing. Mostly. A lot of people do though. Yeah, yeah, because I was about.
To ask you, knowing what you know now and and using the idiom ignorance is bliss, would you go back to 2019? Not if not if the situation that we are discussing was as it is, I no, I wouldn't want to go back and be ignorant of it. I wouldn't mind going. If I could be in a time machine and go back to the time where this wasn't happening, yeah,
that would be great. But The thing is, I think what has gone forever probably for me is the sort of belief that, you know, my faith is my own and to be what it'll be, which is quite a nice feeling in early retirement if you're, you know, in reasonable health and comfortably or financially. It's not. It was a nice feeling to, it's almost like I've made it to the end of the race now. I can run if I want but I'm not required to.
And then I'll just sort of like meander on through and then be found one day in the workshop or something, you know, with a bunch of carburetors half assembled. But then it's like now I realise they really are after us and I don't know whether we've got three months, 33 years.
That's not nice. And, and also, I don't know whether you feel this, but living where I do in southern England and criticising the people I do, it does cross my mind occasionally that if I was in their shoes, I think I would have got rid of me quite a long time ago. And, and, and I did hear from, I did hear, I did hear from someone who gets about Parliament, should we say that they were definitely discussing my name in the summer of 2020? Oh, they know who you are, right, Mike?
You know, that's sort of said like that. And they presumably discussed what to do and and there might have been some that were like keen to, they'd be adding, I'll take him out, you know, knock him off the road in my, you know, large car. They could follow me out next time I'm riding a motorbike, just run me off the road.
Nobody would know. They could have they didn't have to pick me up in a black windowed suburban and do horrible things to me, although they could do that if they wanted to. But I just wonder. I don't know. It makes me think they just
don't care. I just, I don't want to be murdered or arrested, but the fact that I'm allowed to move around freely means I think TM honestly, they believe they've, they've got me sufficiently circled that I'm not a problem because if I was, and if I was them, I would, I would have done something. So that I think is a reasonably logical conclusion that they're not worried what I'm doing is not bothering them, which is a bit depressing.
Mike, I'm sorry for this interruption, but that sound is is coming through like a motorbike in my in my earphone. I know I. Can hear it do you want to should we take a break and. Why do you think it's so difficult for scientists to to rethink what they think they know? Yeah, I think that's not too difficult to answer. It's if you're honest, you're when you do your as it were your best work, you know, as when I
was ACEO of a biotech. And what do you think, Doctor Eaton, when I'm pontificating, I'm I'm saying only a few sentences, but it rests on like 30 years of thinking and experimental work and reading. Yes, it's so if you, if a scientist is then challenged say, excuse me, I think quite a few of those foundational pieces like that one there and those right at the bottom, I don't think they're correct.
I think people are well aware that if they go fussing around down there with a crowbar and a pneumatic drill, the whole thing's going to go over. It's like they're aware that if it is true what you've said that these foundational pieces are are wrong, then it doesn't take them long to realise that everything that rests on top of that is potentially null and void. And I think a lot of people are not willing to not willing to do the work.
So it's like this guy can't could be right, but it's just that far too inconvenient. So in just in case he's right, I'm going to ignore it, I think. I think it's because of the way you operate. It would be like being told as a sportsman that your training regime has always been wrong and you've been doing it for like 10 years. You wouldn't you'd know that you would not be able to undo the effects of that training that you've adhered to for 10 years.
So you don't want to know. You don't want to be told at this point you are where you are in terms of physique and and fitness and so on. But there was another one. What was the other one? Yeah, there's, I saw, I saw a YouTube video maybe four years ago. I've not been back to it. And it was called, I think it was called the staircase of disbelief or it described something called the staircase of disbelief.
And the ground floor that we we stand on initially is the the preferred reality as to what the imposed reality. The first step is something you you're sure in your mind is, is a deviation from what you've been told. So in our case, you could speak to many English people and say, do you remember when we went to war with the Americans and
invaded Iraq? And they go, yes, I'll say if you remember in the weeks before that, we had various politicians coming on the television telling us that Saddam Hussein has weapons of mass destruction that he could unleash in 45 minutes. Do you remember folks, the 45 minutes claim? And then then I think a couple of days before Parliament was due to have a free vote and dossier was submitted.
I, I don't know that we saw this dossier, but apparently it had been put together by, by advisers to the politicians. So they're not military people. And it contains numerous claims that people said were just simply not true, including the,
the 45 minutes claim. And so you when you take people through that history, I'll say, so would you accept that our government lied to us, lied to us through the television so that it could send, you know, many material to Iran, Iraq, after which they killed them and that a million innocent men and women and children and they, they don't know what to say at that point. It's like that is what happens.
You know, it wasn't a mistake. It wasn't justified in, in the in the terms they gave us. They lied. Our government lied to the House, lied to the public. The Prime Minister lied, the BBC lied every day. So I'll say all I'm telling you is the journalist again, that's all I'm telling you. They're doing that again. And but people don't don't want to take people they know they could take that first step because they already know.
They disbelieve. They know that narrative with people's jokes about it. There's Auntie Dossier, they called it so, but they won't put their damn foot on it. That's the strange thing. And it's also like JFK obviously happened when I was 3. So I don't really know anything about it. But the idea that this one, whatever 1 gunman with, with one manual loading rifles did all of that, everybody knows. That's just nuts, isn't it?
I don't know what happens, but I do know we we were lied to because that was the official conclusion and anybody who said otherwise was a conspiracy theorist. 9/11 too. That was a big one. And yet, yeah yeah 9. 11 I. Didn't I? Didn't. I didn't question it until like 2016 or something. Oh God. I didn't. I didn't. I only questioned it in the same way that Jessica Hockett said she started asking about numbers of people in New York Hospital and then started asking if we'd
gone to the moon. I, I, I realised that 911 must have been an inside job during early parts of 2020 because I rapidly realised that almost everything I looked at that was important wasn't, wasn't true. Yeah. So when you get a whole, a whole line of things just not true, yeah, then it makes you think, well, what else are they lying about? And it's like, well, pretty much everything. So. Well, I'll tell you what, it's only recently I've. I've never spent any time on on 9/11.
Why? Because I concluded that they must have destroyed them in some way. What does it matter to me how they did it? And then somebody said you should watch Judy Woods. Where did the towers go? And I watched a bit of it. And I thought, oh, shit. Because what she did very elegantly is show you pictures, show you wreckage. Just keep asking where do the towers go? So you, you know, you ask any person for the 110 Storey steel frame building clad with masonry and so on.
If you managed to allow it all. So let's say you could soar up all of the structural members and allow it to fall in the heat, right? You maybe you could hit the bits of masonry, really big sledgehammers. How big would the pile be on the floor at the bottom? And they, they reason for a bit and they go 10 floors. I'll say I don't know, but yeah, maybe a pile, you know, a 10th. How big was the pile? And they go, I don't know. I'll say it was about a floor high, about a floor and a high
floor and a half high. And then they, they go, where did it go? And I go exactly. So the the only conclusion I drew from that scientifically, because they don't know how they did it, but I know they didn't do it using methods I understand because all methods I understand would have produced a socking great pile of of waste and it wasn't there. So that's and then here's the next thing. So something was used that we
don't know about. I think you would be unwise to assume they ain't going to use that again or have not already used it again. For example, as a child. I like reading, sorry. Hawaii. Yes, yes. I don't. Yeah, Could be. Could be the same technology, a different manifestation. But when I was a kid, I used to read like, strange tales, you know, things that have happened in the world that are all grouped together in a book that makes you go. Isn't that interesting?
And I remember reading one about what was thought to have been a meteorite, which in 19 O 8 exploded over northern tundra of Russia, I think over a place called Tungusta Tunguska in 1908, Tunguska meteorite. And until a week ago, I thought that's what it was. Some sort of dirty snowball came in obliquely, blew up and flattened, I think 8 million trees or 80 million trees. Even decades later, you can still see all these matchsticks, all these trees flattened over a
decade, many miles. But then I was reading something else that said that it may be possible to use scalar waves in combination using more than one projector and create something that was described as an energy bottle. If you have if you have three sets of scalar waves, you can form A3 dimensional shape that could contain energy of some
kind. Most of us know that waves, if they impinge one on another, they can either amplify each other if they're in phase and they can cancel each other if they're out of phase. Most people have seen that when they've been swimming, even you see it in water. It certainly happens with sound and it will certainly happen with radio frequency and all sorts of other electromagnetic
phenomena. And so the idea I think you know, I have an Ola Bado level in physics 40 years ago, but I think the idea was you have multiple machines that are producing these waves and the point where they all insect is a potentially controllable 3 dimensional structure. And the idea was perhaps they were experimenting with this technology in the Northern hemisphere in 19-8 and that's that was the result of it seems possible, but we'll see.
But that's. That's the beauty of the last few years, Mike, that it's it's opened up a whole world of thinking, of critical thinking that we previously didn't experience. Of course many around us will will just call us clowns and they carry on believing everything that they are told. But I quite like the idea of of thinking about stuff you. Probably saw me enjoying that. That move from it was probably a meteorite to it could have been something that humans did on Earth.
Wow, It could, you know, it could be either of those and it could be 1/3 phenomenon. I, I'm not, I don't know, but I, I, I basically widen the solution set by quite a lot. So I think that Judy Wood's work is is terrific and it's it's an awesome as well for us all. Just adding.
Adding to what you're saying earlier about that third camp, so Nov, Chomsky Once Upon a time said something along the lines of the one of the most powerful ways to control people is to create the set of parameters within which you will encourage fiery debate. And even within those parameters, people are arguing and disagreeing. But it's outside of those parameters where the greater truth lies. Yes, and and that's that's effectively what you're talking about.
It is. Exactly, that is exactly right, yes. It's to create a, a controlled dichotomy and encourage vigorous debates inside that so that the the additional solutions, one of which is the truth is not even touched on. And if it's raised, it's censored. And that's, that is where we
are. But there's a, there's a slow trickling, I think there's a, it's just quite, quite reassuring that even if I'm watching, you know, videos about my hobby or motorbikes, that quite often people are now putting comments which sarcastic comments like whatever, and you know, it's this that's, you know, whatever they, they realise we were lied to over the last five years and they're not being censored now. They're, they're not very
precise comments. But whereas in the first year people were very very twitchy, or at least the the algorithm, the the platforms and the algorithms are very twitchy. You literally couldn't deviate from the received proper narrative and now it seems sort of softened. My concern is that if people only after 5 or 6 years start to realise that one thing might have been told to them incorrectly, they haven't got very far right just because.
Because we were told about a bombing Iraq in when it may have been 2001 or something. I don't know. I don't know. Japan. Yeah, Japan, absolutely, that's fascinating. So yeah, I. So there you go. You can you can be intellectually fairly sure that you've been lied to, but it doesn't change anything because the imposed preferred reality dominates.
And so I fear that not very many people have got to the point of realising that it's, it's all an inversion, that it's not good enough just to say, oh, I'm going to refuse the next kind of jabs. And it's like, you know, at that point there might be nothing in the shops and only digital money. So have you thought about that? And have you planned for that? Because if not, you'll either starve or get jacked so people don't don't think very far down
the road. No. Well, that's what I wanted to ask you. So let's just say you have woken up, so to speak. What now? Yeah. Yeah, Well, I won't give, I won't give away the details of my planning because it's not very sophisticated, but I've taken certain steps. That means that unless they come out and arrest us on mass, it won't matter what they do next because I've got I've got certain provisions and means that means I'm not dependent on them for a for a decent period
of time. But, yeah, if they say you're not allowed to travel and if you're seen outside, well, it'll be considered a, a breach of quarantine or whatever, then yeah, that would be very bad. But we're not going to starve or be immediately poor. I've taken steps to make sure that's very, very unlikely. But I, I don't think I'm hoping more people wake up, that there'll be more people woken up by the time. Yeah, but I do think more people are waking up. And I don't think it needs to be
very many. If you imagine them wanting to impose a digital ID on everybody, and even if 5% wouldn't go along with it in Britain, that would be three and a half million people. And that's, yeah, 70 million odd. So 5% is 3 and a half million people. I don't know whether 5% would decline it, but we are already quite, we're quite primed to reject it because Tony Blair early in his prime ministership in the 90s tried really hard to impose it.
And I think people realise that the very least we'll be going to, we're going to be asked to account for our whereabouts and who we were when walking about peacefully. And we've never had that culture in Britain. It's not a papers pleased society and I think so people have been and we managed to fight him off whatever politically journalists. So I think if they come at us again, I think it'd be quite difficult. And so if 5% rejected it, it doesn't really work.
You know, if 5% rejects it, some people then are going to be selling food on the black market. I'm going to be buying, you know, that's so that's the answer to the question. If it's so few that there's no black market, then the answer is I'm going to, I'm going to pray and then I'm not taking it. I'd rather starve than I'm not going to use digital ID. I've said to people, well, why don't you do that? You just don't have to be jabbed. It's like, I think that's the
first step inside. I call it the human abattoir, or it's a digital panopticon, digital gulag, whatever it is that you don't need a digital ID, you can already identify yourself in multiple ways to whomsoever needs it. So I keep saying to people, why do they want you to have it? And the answer is it's not for you, it's for them. It's controlling everything about you. And they go, well, it isn't. We've got loads of digital IDs.
I said you haven't got any that are updated in real time, which contains rich information about who you are, where you are, what you're trying to buy, what else you've bought recently, where you are geographically in relation to some 15 minute community boundary with you've said hearty words on the Internet. All of these things can be instantly modified in your political ID and I think will do that's what I always do. If I was the I always think if I
was the evils, what would I do? And that's what I would do. And they have told they have wounds, that you will be eating less meat, you know, but they've warned us that you won't be travelling by budget airline on holiday and that ladies, you won't be able to buy more than three items of clothing a year. My wife and daughter get that money through the through the door every day. They mostly take them back. But this is part of their living.
They both of them like buying. They compare notes, take things back. If you buy quite a lot, use them for a bit more. On the comment of meat, I go hunting, so they're not going to stop me. They're not going to stop somebody with guns. Yeah, exactly. So if you you've got access to the wild places where where you may be able to secure something that you could cook and the means to take it down.
Well, yeah, I don't probably, but I have, I have started making friends with with people who are who are in the butcher trade and in the farming trade. Have a really lovely, that meeting last weekend to go and meet. There's about 40 people that it's like an informal farmers market and they do a lot of it by barter. There's not, it's, if there's any money, it's cash and a lot of it is just pure barter. And also trust, you know, I bought you 7 lbs of beef last week.
You brought me all those, these cherries this week, whatever. So they're, and they're all awake and they knew who I was. So it's quite embarrassing and just going into like a village hall and there's all these people looking at you, pointing at you. I just go, hello. So that was quite fun. So we, we started because we didn't do any of that. We were too busy buzzing around the world. We went to Spain and Costa Rica and America and France. And so I didn't really.
And then we moved house. So we don't, we don't know that many people. And so it it occurred to me recently, I thought we better start making some connections because if they do impose some event, we won't know anybody and we'll be eating baked beans until we run out of baked beans. Hang on, Mike, you just mentioned a whole bunch of countries that you were travelling to. Have you been to my neck of the woods? No. We, no, we didn't. My wife just said. My wife is very keen on the
idea. She does like the idea. One of our, the main impediment I have and we both have really is that both of our adults, children, I think they're like late 20s, early 30s, intellectually they know quite well what's going on, but their lives are busy and day to day they just get on with their normal lives. One is raising two small children, the other's just bought a house and is going to be remodelling it. What else are you supposed to do? They're getting on with their lives.
So they have not, They haven't given any thoughts really down the road. And when I've said, I think the only kind of places in which we would have a reasonable shot, not a guarantee, a reasonable shot for continuing free life would be either a place that we used to call Third World. And you'd have to be in the rural end of that. And they they roll, they just wrinkle their noses. It's like what, no warm water and, you know, no mod cons.
I said pretty much, yeah, that's where you that would be pretty safe. I mean, it's not. That bad? No, I. Know, but I haven't considered South Africa because I think. I don't I don't shower in Mike. I don't shower in cold water. The. Point is, I think of it as first world. And so I think why aren't you as almost as vulnerable as Paris and London and New York? I mean, why aren't you? I mean, I think you told me or you sent by email and you said that we do not have guaranteed
electricity all the time. Which was, I think that was, or at least it's in the city or in the suburbs. It's everywhere, the entire country. That's polite. That's amazing. So that is important that you can't really run a full on techno control grid if you don't. No, you can't. No, in South Africa they, we, we will never get onto that 15 minute city control grid anytime soon because it's just too chaotic. Yeah, right here, right here underneath my desk.
I've got backup power just in case the main power goes out right. Yeah, No, that's OK. That's important. So you've got there are, there are very, there are, there are some attractions, many attractions. Well, that's. But that's exactly right. So when you have, when you have an inept government, a completely useless state, it forces you into a mindset of prep, into a mindset of self reliance, Yes. No, I really like that.
I I'm going to mention it to both the girls again because I said, look, you don't you, you're here because you, you were born here and that's our fault. You know, you don't really love it here and it's awful, isn't it? And it's getting worse, so. But I mean, to be fair, I'm not suggesting you move here. I'm simply asking when you come in to visit and more specifically, come to the Kruger National Park and I'll go with
you. I Yeah. I'm not, I'm, yeah, I, I don't think that as it were, running safety is, it's not really for me, I don't think, I don't know. I, I also think the end comes at some point. I'm, I wouldn't say I'm, I don't really mind, you know, if it happens to happen tomorrow or if it happened in 25 years, it's, it's not that important. I've had a lovely life. I'm still enjoying it. If it ended tomorrow, it would be all right. So you know well.
Just just so that we're clear, you say you have a lovely life, but the last few years you are one of the pivotal people, at least in my life, who had positive impact. Yeah. My child who was born, my child who was born a year ago, just under a year ago. Wow. Is not vaccinated. Thanks to people like you. Good. Fantastic. And there's no reason ever to and as you know, no reason ever to feel any guilt. Did I did I leave them unprotected?
No, that's that's, that's a, it's AI didn't realise until relatively recently that that's all just a story. The whole thing is just a story contagion. So yeah. But yeah, anyway, I think we'll OK so. Mike, let's let's come in for a landing. Give me the moral of the story. God, the moral of the story? What? Which story? You might want to provide some, or at least a possible structure. Which story? Well, OK. What is the moral of your story? The moral of your story?
Yeah, I think it's, for me, it's, I feel quite strongly about this. If you have an opportunity to do something that's that's good for other people, you should damn well do it. Because I see, I, I sense it must be true that a large number of people could have helped and didn't, and they could help now and aren't. And I think we could honestly, we could roll them over. People who have information, they're not going to hang, draw
one call to you. If you say I detected this lie, you know, this is unequivocally a lie. And I'm going to tell everybody I know, even if they laugh at me, do it. Plant the seed it it does work. There's a friend of mine who's made QR codes of, of the video I made before the one that just was released. It's called so called silver bullet and he'd written it.
COVID was a big lie. It's in English then the QR code and they've they've appeared all around the world every now and again, I guess a picture from a bus bus stop in Bogota or something or someone sent a picture from I think it was the highest points in a Swiss mountain, Swiss ski resort recently. It took a picture and there was one of COVID is a big lie QR stickers on the roof of this thing and that that does fill me.
But I actually get quite a lot of joy out of that because it's not just what I did, it's that other people saw we can do something. We could make a difference here. That's all it takes. Enough of us. If you can do something good, do it. Mike, how can I follow you? Well, I cannot that I've got I've got 2 locations due to good friends of mine. I probably would have just crumpled in a heap because I'm
not very good with social media. But I use Telegram, TELEGR AM, and you can find me on Telegram. But you must look out for the channel that says Doctor Mike Eden Solo. You'll know it's me because it starts with a video saying this is my channel and this is the title of the channel Doctor Mike Eden Solo. All of the others won't have the video. They may have my picture and my name, but they're fake. And there's at least two or three others. So that's one.
And then the other one is sub stack, where as yet there are no fakes. But if you go to the sub stack, one word, SUB stack Doctor Doctor Mike Eden, I don't write very many pieces on the sub stack. So I think each of the small numbers that are there are quite powerful. So if you were approaching me or recommending someone approaching me for the first time, probably
sub stack first. Just sort of read the articles because they're not that long and they cover probably all of the all of the material I've covered at some point has been covered in words, you know, that are easy to comprehend with you believe it or not, it's up to the reader, but that that's where it is. And that's that's where I reside mostly because Twitter still doesn't like me. You know, YouTube doesn't like me even when I'm logged in as a cedar net to do with my bike hobby.
It knows damn well who I am even with AVPN on. And so if I write something it doesn't like it and I refresh the screen, it's gone. So it's still continuing in the year 6, but I don't mind anymore. Just, you know, I just go places where that doesn't happen. But just to remind people that the censorship of the people they don't want you to hear from is just as strong as ever. And as that little meme goes, this is A2 frame meme. You know, who is it that's telling the truth?
And the other one is the people that are being censored are telling the truth. That's right. So why would people censor me early in 2020? It could be because I was talking nonsense and could have put people's lives at risk. But it's six years on, they're still censoring me because I'm telling you things that they don't want you to know. I also point out that if you search for me using, I don't know what the right terms are. Search engines, browsers, What is?
What is Google Chrome? What? What category of thing is it? That would be a browser browser, so. If you put Optimi even in Google Chrome or Apple, is it Safari? And then there's Safari, Microsoft Edge is it? I don't know, no. Anyway, if you use any of the big ones, just click return and just like, Scroll down and have a look at a couple of pages, see what kind of material it returns. Because mostly it's Yeadon's a conspiracy theorist.
And here are some nasty articles from Reuters to tell you how wrong he's been. If you put the same search term in a small browser, and the one I use a lot is Yandex. Yandex gives a completely different set of hits. And I put it to people in conversation that do you regard search as a sort of generic property of the Internet? And they go, what do you mean? I say, well, if you put the same search term in in any of these different windows, it should give you roughly the same information.
And they go, yeah, I said, well, that's what I thought too. So if I give you an example that does not conform to that, what would you make of it? And they don't, they often don't know. And they have to tell them. I'm saying someone's digging with the results and they're selectively digging with the results because if you put in uncontroversial terms, they all return the same thing. I've done the experiment basically.
So if you put in my name, I get very different search results in the mainstream browsers from what I get in the other ones. And if I use other controversial terms, they will say so in a way that's proof, you know, I think. But it it that's only any good if someone is willing to be persuaded that I am being censored and therefore probably has something dangerous to say.
So, yeah, there you go. But yeah, keep on keeping on, Joe. I think that's all I would say, both to you, my friend, and anybody who's doing the same. Well, on that note, Mike Eden, thank you for joining me in the trenches. It's been great fun. Again, thank you.