#64 BONUS Doting Mum Kat Clark

Hey, and thanks for joining us on this bonus episode of Two Doting Dads. We are extremely privileged to share with you Cat Clark's story.

Cat Clark, she's a successful business owner with millions of followers online. She's a thriving skincare business that she co runs with her daughters, Letitia and David.

It's called Kalade.

She found a lot of success on TikTok with her healthy recipes, gaining popularity and a supportive community.

She's got about six point two millions at all on TikTok. It's one of those situations that at a glance, I remember when I first came across Cat Clark. It's when she won TikToker of the Year of the year. Yeah, and I thought, gosh, this woman's got such an amazing life. She's got all these opportunities, she's killing it. How good.

She gets swamped in the streets.

People literally, she can't even go to the shop without people coming up to her and be like, oh my god. She's like the newest form of celebrity in Australia. But her life wasn't always this picture perfect. She felt pregnant at the age of sixteen with her her first child, Letitia, when she was living in Brisbane, and she found herself in an abusive relationship with the father of that child. Luckily, she summoned the courage to leave her abusive partner and

On average, one woman dies every week at the hands of a man. Those numbers aren't going down. In fact, they're going up, with a thirty percent increase since last year.

We're immensely grateful for Kat for her bravery in sharing her experience, including her journey through domestic violence. If you or someone you know as in need of support, please don't hesitate to reach out to one eight hundred. Respect We will also.

Put further resources in the show notes.

Welcome back to two doting dads and one doting mum. I am Maddie, Jay, I'm Ash and I'm Cat. This is a podcast all about parenting. It is the good, it is the bad and the relatable. And if you have come winning advice, hang on a second, whoa it may come today. Cat. Normally we don't give any advice.

But you never know.

You see that far wiser than myself.

I don't know about that parent longer than I, so I'm sure there's something you can teach along the way.

Default you are the most experienced.

Yeah, that's true. It goes cat and we're on a similar level.

It's it's a murky second and third and ash. I do want to start off and say congratulations on Colade, thank you, which is, by the looks of things everywhere, a roaring success.

Yeah, it's been awesome. It's been really good. We're very lucky. We have amazing supporters.

How did it come about?

I mean, I mean for everyone looking in, it's sort of just unless you're really avidly following your family for us and see it pop up and like whoa, look at this thing come out of nowhere.

And I know, you.

Guys really hero your own success. And you see a lot of it.

You know it's sold out and people are going give us more. Where did it all come from?

I was shocked, if I'm being honest. A lot of people like as if you were shocked. I was, honestly so shocked. But the reason we came up with skincare was because my daughter actually struggled with exma for so long and I've logged about her journey for ages. She was getting bullied because her skin was like getting discolored. And we went on this journey trying to find like organic skin care and we did find really good stuff, but it wasn't like perfect, and so we decided to

So it took like nine.

Into twelve months for us to actually get everything together.

Yeah, it was a really long time. And to keep that secret for so long. Oh my gosh, it was crazy.

But did you just do it out of your house?

I saw, Yeah, there was like a shot of you guys in the living room. Yeah, like packing orders.

Yeah, And I was.

Like it was insane. And we live in a townhouse. So when we moved to the Gold Coast, we downsized because we wanted to be really close to the water and so and it worked well for us because Tisha was about to move out of home and we only had one child at home and then we're like, let's start a business. And yeah, we were in our downstairs area with you know, six or seven friends of T Shirt and mine, like floating in and out helping pack orders, get everything sorted.

But yeah, it was an experience the videos.

Of your husband carrying big boxes.

Because we had to like walk to the garage get the product, bring it into the house.

For us so that we could pack the orders. So yeah, it was crazy.

I want to talk about you growing up. What was a young cat like, even if as far back as like primary school.

I feel like I have different stages in my life. But primary school I was. I went to this Catholic school. Me and my cousin were the only Asian people at our school, and it felt very isolating and we were bullied quite a bit for the color of our skin and stuff like that. So I was actually very I don't know what the word is like, I was very timid and didn't have a lot of friends. I had like one close friend. Yeah, it was quite sad my primary school.

I bring, if I'm being honest, Brisbane in Brisbane.

Okay, did that ease off when you would transitioning into high school or is that something that stuck with you.

No. When I went to high school, it changed, Like I remember going because I went to a private girls school.

Got kicked out of that school.

That's why, just a little brief reason, I was a really naughty girl.

Okay, great.

I don't know if you've heard that saying strict parents raise sneaky kids.

Well, now I just know that.

Well, I was a very sneaky kid because I had very strict parents. But anyways, I was kicked out of that school and I went to a state school and it was filled with so many different ethnicities and it was a weird experience because I was kind of used to being like in these private schools where I didn't see that part of the world.

And then that's where I really went off the rails.

Was it nice to be in that state school environment where all of a sudden, yeah, your heritage wasn't something that was unique.

For sure? I loved it. Do you know the Brisbane area?

You do?

I grew up in Kenmore.

Oh, okay, so your north side. Immediately I'm on the south side of Well, I grew up on the south side.

Yeah.

It was just really cool to kind of go, oh, there's other people who were Filippinas and other kind of ethnicities.

And so how was it then, trying to like live a double life with your parents and if you were like talking about being sneaky.

Yeah, me and my parents had a really tough relationship. My mum was very religious and it kind of made me this rebellious child that didn't want to do anything or live by her rules. So I would sneak out of the time, I would wag school, I would you get into things that I wasn't supposed to be getting into, hang around with people that I wasn't supposed to be hanging around with.

It was tricky.

Thankfully, me and my mom have a good relationship now, okay relationship, but back then it was Yes.

I'm assuming that your mom wasn't welcoming to boyfriends.

No, she hated all my boyfriends. She didn't want me to have anything to do with men at all, guys at all. Yeah.

And I suppose falling pregnant with with T Shirt at sixteen, Yeah, well, I mean that probably wouldn't have been surely wouldn't have loved that, you know, she.

Definitely did not. It was a really Yeah, it was very hard. It's weird though, During my pregnancy, she was actually quite nice to me, so, you know, for Mother's Day, she bought me like a little gift, and I was like heavily pregnant. But it was after t Sha was

And that's what I don't think she liked.

Do you remember the moment where you told your mum that you were pregnant.

Yeah, well I didn't actually tell her, so.

She still doesn't know.

So, because my mum and I had this really difficult relationship. Every time I would go to speak to my mom, she would just lecture me, and I just didn't feel comfortable going to her about anything. So when I found out I was pregnant, I was like, crap, I kind of have to tell her. I'm starting to get morning sickness, Like I need to tell.

Her how many weeks?

Roughly that was around six weeks I started getting sick, and so I started writing these letters to tell her. And every time I would write a letter, I was just like, oh, this isn't making sense, and I'd scrunch it up. And I eventually gave up and I went for a walk and got back home and.

My mom was like, get in the lounge room right now. And I was like, what the hell? And she had gone through my bin and read all the letters.

What did you say?

So we sat down in the lounge and my dad was kind of sitting where you are and my mom was there, and my mom was bawling her eyes out, obviously because this is like every religious mother's worst nightmare. Yeah, and my dad was kind of like I could tell he was disappointed, but he was more like, what are you going to do? That type of thing, like very I don't know, he's just always being philological. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like, oh wow, I just can't imagine that feeling.

Yeah, at this point, were you set in your mind that you're going to keep the baby or was it discussion of potentially aborting?

It was.

I didn't know what I was going to I mean, I'm sixteen, just found out I was pregnant.

I was so like lost in what to do, and there's.

Everyone kind of giving me their opinion about what I should and shouldn't do. I think deep down I knew that I didn't want to go down that route. And it actually partly has something to do with how I was saying. My mum was a very religious lady, so I was brought up you just don't do that.

You don't get rid of your child if you feel pregnant.

And you know, I was scared about getting rid of a life, like there is a life in me, and it really like freaked me out that I you know what I mean like it was just left a.

Bad kind of feeling in me.

So it was something that it was a conversation that we definitely had, but it was something that I don't think I would have ever done, even though I was so young and.

Your partner at the time. What was his reaction to the situation?

Honestly, I block a lot of him out. There was just so much trauma there.

We were so immature, so immature, and so stupid. I don't think it was a big deal to him. I mean he was nine, no, he was eighteen at the time.

Slightly ignorant.

Yeah, you don't really know anything at that time. Yeah.

Yeah. So it wasn't like he was like like, oh my life is over or anything like that.

He was just like, oh yeah, sweet, And how long are you being together for at this point?

So we weren't together for long at all.

I would say, we're probably together for like three to six months.

Wow.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's such like you don't really even know each other, especially at that age, and you don't really know yourself at all.

Yeah.

And I was actually going to break up with him a few weeks before I found out I was pregnant.

Oh wow, yeah, the breakup or the potential breakup. Did you just think it wasn't that he wasn't the right guy for you or what was the reason behind that.

Well, I was just like I was sixteen, you know, you get a crush.

On like, yeah, five different people, you know what I mean. So it wasn't anything serious to me.

It was just like I didn't really think it was going to work out with us, and I started getting feels for another guy at school and.

During the pregnancy. Was a supportive Yeah, he.

Was really supportive.

I mean as supportive as an eighteen year old can be. He actually grew up on Thursday Island. Do you guys know who that it is?

Yeah?

I heard of it.

It's like the very tip of Queensland, so very secluded little island.

He grew up there.

He actually moved to Brisbane to study and be closer to me.

So he was supportive.

You've decided you're going to keep the baby. Your mom is being more I guess warm to the idea of you being a young mum. Yeah, things are going well or your partner's being supportive. Was it all smooth sailing then up until Bert?

Yeah, it was pretty good, like the pregnancy was really good. I had a lot of support, which was amazing. My school was incredible. They let me stay at school till I was two weeks due. Oh my gosh, because I was like so determined. I was like, I need to finish grade twelve, like I need to make my life, you know, I need to make something of my life type of thing.

What was that experience of it? It was horrible, crazy.

Yeah, it was horrible.

I mean, obviously the bullying was just crazy, but not only from my own school but from the other surrounding schools.

So there was so many rumors going around.

We would go on these excursions where other schools would go on the same day, and that would just be like yelling out and obviously like there's a pregnant sixteen year old who isn't going to say something.

It's like shocking, right, It's brutal.

Yeah, it's probably the most brutal place you could you could be pregnant. Do you think the workplace is the workplace for and like how hard it is as well, just you know, just mobility wise and getting around and then also like how people treat you in that area.

But imagine being a teenager.

Yeah, how do you, like, how do you support yourself in that environment where you are copying so much from so many other people? Like do you just boil it up? Or was there someone who was helping you through this?

Oh? My friends and my my actual teachers. So I had a drama teacher.

Teachers are always.

That he hosted my baby shower for me.

Yeah, and every time I'd go into the classroom he'd actually have a seat for me so that I didn't have to sit on the ground like.

The rest of the student. You remember his name, mister Edwards.

Yes, yeah, I had like amazing support, like my teachers and my friends, but obviously outside of that it was quite difficult. But yeah, I'm just very lucky that I had a good network of friends because it was tough.

And then you gave birth in Brisbane, Yeah, on your birthday, on my birthday.

Yeah, and you know what, going back twenty one years ago, people in the hospital were not nice with me being a team.

It was like like the nurses and midwif Yeah.

Really so I had one nice midwife who brought me a little piece of cakee and like helped me and whatever. But because it was my birthday, after I gave birth. I was terrified of taking Tisha home. I wanted to stay in the hospital for as long as possible because I just didn't know what I was doing. Like, I was just like scared. The lady was like, okay, so you've been here for three days, you don't need to be here. Your babies latching perfectly, like everything was fine, you need to go home, and I.

Like begged her. I was like, couldn't leave anyways. They ended up moving me to the psych ward. Okay for how long?

No, they were obviously filling up, and so they moved me to that ward so that I could stay there for longer. But I was like, did it really have to be the psych word, Like, for real, I.

Can't imagine that. It's like it's probably not a safe place for Yeah. And so then after that, you went home to your mom and dad.

Yeah, So went home to my parents and my partner, then went back up to Thursday Island.

Yeah.

It got really tricky between me and my mom, and I ended up sneaking out when Tsha was six weeks old and flying up to Thursday Island with Tea Sha.

Yeah, with teacher, Oh my goodness.

Yeah, because I just couldn't meet my mom. Was just my mom and I were just fighting and it was like causing me so much stress, especially with like having a little baby. It was a lot to take on.

So I just left.

Ye.

Wow, so you're seventeen, your new mom, You're now on Thursday Island, Like, how is that trying to raise a child?

Oh my god?

It was hard because not only was I dealing with what you just said, but I've also left the city life to live.

On an island.

It's really hot, yeah, but it was like Thursday Island is very secluded. Indigenous Australians live on there, so I felt very like out of place. I felt like I didn't belong there, and it just was like, you know, I didn't know what to do type of thing.

So it was like a huge.

Culture shock because I was like this city girl, you know, used to dressing up in crop tops and heels and you know, just being that type of person. And then all of a sudden, I'm on an island where people are fishing every day.

Like what at this point, were you're thinking like this is where I'm going to be forever?

Yes? But I also.

Yes and no, because a lot of people on Thursday Island kind of go back and forth from Cans, so they because all the main workers in Cans, you know, all the good schools are there, So people aren't on Thursday Island for a very long time unless you know you've retired or you've got your job there. So part of me was willing to kind of accept that's where I was going to be. But then there was also part of me that was like, I need to get back for me.

Like my youngest is three, but her newborn phase a pretty much like blurred it all out because it was bloody heart. Yeah, how was it for you figuring out motherhood at the age of seventeen when you're going through like sleep regressions and teething and moving on to solids very scary.

I remember one day T shirt she because I had to put that kid on her dummy because my god, she was just driving me insane. So and it was my big biggest regret, gret putting her in on a dummy, because like, taking that dummy off her was just crazy, but it failed me. I used to give her a dummy to kind of help soothe her, and one day I gave her the dummy and there must have been like a little grain or something on that dummy, and she started choking and it was the most terrifying day

That, feel worthless, do what's best. It's worked for you, because it might be completely different for someone.

Else, exactly. Yeah, so it was challenging for sure.

And how is the relationship with your partner At the stage.

It was actually okay because at that point we were living with his parents. So when I moved up to Thursday Island, we lived in this tiny little house. It was a one bedroom home with six of us in the house. Holy shit, yeaes six or yeah, seven actually seven including Ta Shir, my partner Titsha, and I had that room and they would sleep in the lounde room. It was good because it was kind of like family gathering every single.

Yeah.

Yeah, So it was fine then. But when we moved out of that home into a larger home and we were given one section of the house where we had our own privacy, that's kind of when our relationship started to go downhill.

He drank a lot, and he would.

Come home a lot of the time wasted and get quite physical and violent.

So, yeah, do you look back and do you think there were any warning signs that that's where things were leading?

Definitely, I didn't know at the time, but looking back now, for sure, I can definitely see that there were signs that he was like very controlling. But back then it just actually felt like he cared about me in some stupid way. But looking back, it is definitely him being controlling.

And when you say controlling, in what kind of way, who I.

Was speaking to, who I was hanging out with, If I was like five minutes late, he'd kind of lose lose it, that type of thing.

So a lot of manipulation. Yeah, someone's that controlling.

It must have made you feel even more isolated, considering you're already removed from you know, your family, your friends, and he's starting to control what you're saying, what you're doing, who you're talking to, where you're going all the time. And sometimes it's really hard for I mean I hear all the time. Sometimes really hard to see what someone's

Definitely the financial side of things as well, a lot of people that really got me by surprise. So he would often say that I was really bad with money and that he would have to kind of look after the money side of things.

And so it got to a point.

Where were you bad with money?

We know, I'm like the best with money, I'm like so good at saving.

And all that sort of stuff.

But he had made me think that, oh, it's better for me to kind of give him full control of all the money that's coming through to me, so that you know, he can be in charge and it got to a point where I didn't even see the money that would come into our lives. So that is definitely something that I should have been more aware.

But he wasn't like that in the beginning though. No, this is over an extended period.

Yeah, for sure. So a lot of people say, like, why didn't you just leave?

But you for me personally, I can't speak for anyone else, but for me personally, I was always thinking, but what if he can change, what if he can go back to how he used to be? And you know, he's promised me so many times that he's gonna, you know, be a better person, and I always believed that when he's told me so. For the first year, he was amazing. He made me feel like I was the only girl in the world, like you know.

Ticked all the right boxes.

It wasn't until I kind of left home, left my family, left my friends where things started going downhill really quickly.

And then what was the process then for you deciding that enough's enough? I need to leave this guy.

So there was one main incident for me where.

Tisha would have been, like I'm going to say, nine months old, was when they start crawling right around, so she was around that age, and she was sitting at this damn tissue box like pulling the tissues out like.

They still do.

So she's doing this thing in the lounge room and my partner at the time walked in and he was wasted, and I was like, oh my god. So I moved her into another room with a tissue box so that she could keep herself busy in the room, and we started having an argument and it got heated really really quickly, and he actually grabbed my throat and held me up against the wall, and at the same time, Tisha had

I've hurt themselves, also when they've hurt themselves, when they've really hurt themselves.

Y pit stop breathing, yeah you yeah, it's like a language that parents just go right. Well, she crawled out, and she screamed a scream that I had never heard before.

Like ever in my life.

It was like pure terror, and it just made me realize, like, what the fuck am I doing?

Like I don't want my child to why, why what am I doing?

Like it was just like a fucking you know wow moment for me, like I'm terrified, but so is my child. So that's kind of when I thought, I need to do something.

You're on Thursday Island right at this point, so then how quickly can you get out?

It took a long time, so not only did I have to have that realization, but I also had to to build up my self worth because at that point I was I don't even know who I was. At that point, I had no self confidence. My anxiety was through the roof, like I was just in a really bad place mentally. I had no money because at that point he was he had all control of the money.

We were fighting every weekend like it was bad.

What I did was I would actually steal like a dollar or two dollars from his wallet every few weeks, and I think I saved like fifty or fifty five dollars at.

The point at that point, and walk down.

To the Telstra shop bought like a prepaid Sagam you know those little crappy vines.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I brought one of those phones and then started getting in touch with my friends again. And then maybe like three months after getting that phone, That's when I started to believe, like, Wow, I can actually leave, I can start a new life. I'm not some you know, single mother that nobody's gonna love, Like there is another chance for me. So it took a lot of time. It wasn't like it happened and I just gained all this strength and I could kind.

Of believe in that moment. It was a long time build.

The courage up too.

I could imagine that that in that moment, if this, if this guy's already put his hands on you while I was going to stop HI from putting his hands on you again, when he finds out the year trying to find an escape route, I can't imagine having to build up to that.

Yeah, with the friends that you were reaching out to, was there feedback as simple as well just come home? Or were they saying go to the police? Were getting mixed information on how to act?

Yeah, they were telling me to go to the police. So I don't know why, but it was so scary for me to call the cops. So the only the thing that I did a lot instead of calling the police was actually call women shelters, which were incredible, Like they literally saved my life. So many times. But yeah, my friends were like, you know, go to the cops, and obviously telling me to just leave.

They did say those things.

But I think the thing that made me actually want to go back is just having those friends miss me and say come back, like we want you back home, that type of thing, and just made me realize that I can still have a life outside of what I currently was living.

Do you remember what it felt like when you you did leave, when you step foot outside of the house and you close that door behind you and you had in your mind that I'm not coming back.

It was the best day of my life, like the.

Best as soon as you could tell.

Honestly, can I share the story, It's like my favorite story. I was living with him in cans at that point, and I said that I really wanted to go back to see my mum because t Sha wanted to kind of you know, see her grandma or whatever. And I was like, and you should go back up to Thursday Island and see your parents and we can go on like a mini separate holiday whatever. Anyways, he wasn't too keen on the idea, but he was like, Okay, we'll

It would make me come back. So we psychotic.

So that night he fell asleep and I turned off his alarm for the next morning because that next morning I was getting on a train to go back to Brisbane. So I turned off his alarm and I waited till he was asleep, and I searched the whole house for those items, found them, put them in my bag. And then the next morning, I waited like five minutes before we had to leave, and I woke him.

Up and I was like, we slept through our alarm. Let's go, let's go.

And so he didn't have time to check anything, the items or anything, and we were out the door.

So we get to the train station.

I've got and then you've got You've got them in your bag?

Yeah, they're in my bag.

So we get to the train station and he hands me a phone because he doesn't know that I have my segam at this point, mate, your lifeline. So he hands me a prepaid phone one that he's purchased and He's like, I want you to make sure that you answer this every time I call you, otherwise I'm coming to get you.

And I was like, yeah, of course, babe, I'll answer it.

So I get on the train and we The train is like twenty four hour trains, a long way.

I see, this is what I was saying.

My anxiety was so bad I could not even get on a plane.

So I have a fear of flying.

But at that point, I legitimately could not even step foot on a plane.

So I had to get on a train to leave him.

That's a long way.

So we get on the train. He's given me five dollars for the twenty four hour generous, very generous. Yeah yeah, we stop off like every hour or so. But I just kept in contact with him until we got to Townsville, and I remember sending him this text and I was like, I'm never fucking coming back, and I threw the phone in the bin, and then I got back on the train and went to God because I needed to give it enough time so that he couldn't catch up in the car.

I can't imagine your feeling while you're riding. We've all written a text to someone where we're like, whether it's an angry text to someone.

Or something that you're like, how is this going to go down?

And the adrenaline behind Yeah, you can imagine the adrenaline behind that text. Yeah, never fucking come back. You must have felt after you've done it like some sort of superhero.

Oh I felt invincible.

It was that's crazy almost, like I want to tell someone on the train.

You just did.

Yeah, I mean what was What was it like getting to the other end and essentially seeing a loved one or a friend.

Was it just out of relation? Oh?

Yeah it was. But there was also that fear of is he here? Did he follow me?

That's that feeling stayed with me for like a month or two months, like is he going to come after me? He knows where my parents live, he knows where I am, So there was still fear, but it's a long way from cans.

Did he ever?

Did he ever try?

And he did? But I had my friends with so I never kind of was. I met up with him like twice because he wanted to see T shirt, which obviously I didn't want to kind of beat that parent where I didn't let him see his kid. But I always had friends with me in.

Those moments where you did see him. Was he trying to convince you it or had come back?

Oh? Yeah, definitely, did you consider it? No?

No, I broke up with him months before I actually left, and that's what helped me kind of leave. I detached any sort of feeling or anything towards him, like three or four months before I actually physically left.

Wow.

And so when you're back in Brisbane, are you living with your family again for a little bit?

So again, like me and my mum have a very tricky relationship. So I stayed with my mom for about three weeks and then I went to live with my best friend.

Yeah.

Wow, Wow, that's such an amazing story having to rebuild after that. I mean, you've you've recognized that I could have a life that's better than this. You've escaped, you've got down, you're living with your friend, You've got letitia, Like.

What happens next?

Yeah. I wasn't really focused on guys because I was more focused on being a good mum for Teaser, like that has always been my goal. Like remember when I was saying I went from a d student to an A student like she has always been. Yeah, one hundred and I know this. You know, stats for teen moms aren't the best.

So I was really.

Determined to kind of not be the stereotypical teen mom. So I came back to Brisbane. I actually tried to finish year twelve again through tape. I got a job, and then I ended up getting promotions within the job, so I gave up on the idea of finishing year twelve and just kept working my ass off and never stopped.

When you think back to that time, we got that and you're able to make contact with your friends back in Brisbane, was there anything that they did or way that they behaved.

That really helped you my friends?

Yeah, I'm just thinking if there is anyone else out there who may have a friend who's going through something similar and they're unsure of how they can support them.

Yeah, I think my friends were really patient with me, because when you're in a toxic relationship, you can you

And like not kind of give you the time of.

Day song you just want, you just want someone to hear, not try and give you the immediate solution. You know what the solution is really deep down, but it's kind of like someone who can stick by you.

That's pretty powerful.

Yeah, aod friend. Yeah.

So that's why whenever I talk to my girls about this. The biggest red flag for me is when a partner starts trying to cut your friends and family out. Because I needed that, I needed my friends, I needed my family, and that's something that he literally physically flew me across the country, you know, on the opposite side of Queensland to kind of get me.

Away from that.

So whenever I hear someone saying, oh, he doesn't like my best friend, I'm like, why because you like your best friend, right, keep in touch with your friends, Do not cut them out whenever you in a new relationship.

Always make time for your friends.

Yeah, because I think we've all had friends, you know, male female that when they get into relationships, like where are they gone?

Yeah, the energy becomes invested.

In there, and you don't know if it's just they're all their energy because they all want to really just want to be with each other and they really enjoy each other's company, or if there's any any hate towards friend groups or whatever it might be, or if it's that because so easily be disguised one.

As one or the other. Yeah, it's a scary thought.

I mean both Matt and I have Matt's got two girls, I've got I've got a girl and a boy. And even for even for a boy like them growing up, it's like, you know, when they start to date and stuff like that, it's like, what do you do as a parent when you see when you see that happening?

Is it is it just? Is it love? Or is it manipulation?

Yeah, it's really tricky.

Like I remember when t Shirk started dating and she's dated some interesting characters. There was this one particular guy was giving me really bad vibes. I think this is why it's so important to have a good relationship with your kids where they feel like they can talk to you openly because they tell you things that happen within

To be that.

A little bit.

Yeah, So it's like a it was a weird I remember having this conversation with Tsha and just being like, look, this is what I think is happening. Obviously I trust your judgment. You're a smart woman, but I want you to know but this is what I can see. And within a few weeks she broke it up with him.

It's nice that she took on what you had to say and probably took some time to think about it. So just been like, well, I hate you now because you hate him, you know. So yeah, I mean we've spoken about that before, about being able to communicate with the kids, but not just with those things, but also the.

Good things as well.

Then it might give them a bit more encouragement to come to you with things that aren't so good.

Yeah, for sure.

What's it like trying to get back into dating when not only have you come from such a traumatic experience, but I guess you've not really even experienced a really healthy relationship because one of your first ones, you know, was when you were sixteen and seventeen. So how do you start trusting men again and starting to get back into dating.

It's funny you say that, because after that incident and I did start dating. I actually started dating one of my best friends. So but I think that's because I trust.

Yes, we trusted.

I already trusted him. He made me laugh.

You know, we had a good relationship already. I think that's a great foundation to finding out who makes a good future partner, right, making sure you can have fun with them and that you're their friend.

I think that's what helped for me, probably dating one ofever my best How to build your confidence.

It's a good way to start. I mean, how long did that last?

It wasn't like serious serious.

We made clear guidelines where we're like, we're just going to be friends with benefits.

Okay, and then it works out.

Yeah, it was only like three or four months and we decided we're still friends now.

So and you, I don't want to skip too far forward because we go through your whole dating life, but your husband Jonathan.

Yes, so you've been with him for sixteen years?

I know I've been yeah sixteen Wait what month? Well yeah, sixteen years?

Wow?

Yeah crazy?

That is crazy?

And what was it about Jonathan that you thought this could be the guy for me?

Obviously when I first saw him, I was like, damn, he's cute. But then like getting to know him, he was just a really nice guy. Like I remember when I went on my first date with him and I was like, so, I've got to tell you something and he's like, do you have a boyfriend?

And I was like, I just have a kid.

He was like what, But no, he was just a really cool, fun guy, and like I was saying before, he felt like my friend.

And then how was it going back into the world of being pregnant again for a second time?

It was so different because I actually so when Jonathan asked me to marry him, I actually said I will, but just so you know, I'm not having any more kids, because yeah, I was so traumatized from my experience.

Did he say okay, sure, Yeah, he was.

Fine with it.

Yeah, he was like, Okay, if that's what you want, then that's that's it.

Which makes a lot of sense. I get it.

Yeah.

But then when did you When did the thought creep into your mind that maybe I could go back for a second.

Five years into being married, and my grandma actually passed away and I was sitting at her funeral and my granddad was sitting there with his two sons on either side of him, and I was like, I think I want to have another kid.

Oh yeah.

And so after because I didn't want my husband to like obviously he brought up tshirt like his own, but I just wanted him to have his own too.

So and that relationship between him and t shir is that always been rock solid?

Oh yeah, they're besties.

Oh that's great. Yeah.

And then was there was there anything that you learned as a first time mom that came in handy second time round? Or did you just completely clean the slaves?

I think what I loved about being a mom the second time round is I didn't have so many people giving me their unsolicited advice and I just ran with being a mom.

I wasn't so.

Crazy about sleep schedules and you know, feeding every three hours. I kind of just did what felt best for me, whereas with T Shirt, I felt like I was bombarded with so much information and it was very overwhelming, and I didn't give her the dummy. Thank god, the dummy.

Ruined my life.

So yeahs both didn't latch onto it.

Yeah, well, there was one point where I was like, oh my god, just give Dasia the dummy, and it was too late at that point.

She just spat it out and I was like.

And then, do you remember when you first publicly told your story?

Yeah, so it was actually really random when I started. I decided to share my story because at that point on social media, I was just sharing like recipes. People were slowly learning more about me through those recipes. So they were like, wait, you have a seventeen year old daughter, Like what the hell am I the math?

Yeah?

Yeah, and like questioning in the comments, and I was like, maybe I'm just going to give these guys like a little bit of a story time about my life. And I remember posting it and it just blowing up. People friends like from primary school, from high school were like, oh my god, my child is watching your video.

That's so crazy, And I was like, what the hell?

Anyone who you were like you used to fucking bully me?

Yeah there were a few of those, but.

Have anyone apologize or no?

No?

Once your life blew up in terms of your story, and then I mean, you've built this essentially, You've built this empire being a mom and being a business person. You do everything with your family, Like You've got a really successful podcast with Letitia, And it's like, what's it like working so much with your kids?

I mean, for me, I'm not.

There yet, but I love it.

I like working with T shirt Is. I know this sounds corny, but it is literally like working with my best friend, same thing as Dansa.

And sometimes I have.

To kind of remind myself I'm the mom, like I need to be more.

Mature, you know what I mean. It's a whole heap of fun.

There's obviously some ups and downs where we spend so much time together, but this is what I've always wanted, Like I've always wanted to be really close with my family, And yeah, it's great.

And how does it feel now that she's flown the nest?

Oh? You know what?

The first like month was really hard. Nobody prepares you for this, nobody.

Do you remember how the conversation went about when she said, I think I want to move out of home.

Well, the first conversation happened when she was working at a nightclub and working like six hours a week, and she's like, I'm moving out with my friends.

And I'm like, you make like fifty dollars a week, Like are going to do that? And so I convinced her not to. And then I was like, why don't you just save?

Like you have no rules at home, Like we're pretty chill parents, Like, you know, just stay at home, save, and then when you're ready, you can buy your first home. She really didn't want to, but she did. And then when she finally bought her unit, she it was still really hard for me to kind of let go. And I remember the first night her, like we were all in her house and we're like, okay, we're going to go now.

She's like, Mom, can you just stay?

It's so lonely here, and I was like, and I remember like walking out the door to the car and her just like closing the sliding door, and I was like pulling my eyes out because I was like, left her there home alone in this quiet little apartment.

From yours thirty minutes.

But still it's just like the thought of her being in a home by herself. She had hardly any furniture in there at that point as well, so it was just it's tough.

Yeah, I can't even imagine what that's going to be.

Like, I can't wait for minunder moon.

I used to say that too, I really did. It's tough, But now I'm like, oh, God, go home. She comes over, still eats all my food. I'm like, what are you doing here?

And then when there comes a time where Daye's not at home anymore? What do you want your girls to remember when they think back to the house that they grew up in.

I just hope they when they think back that they feel a lot a lot of love and that everything we did was for them, because it literally is. And I'm sure most parents can relate to that. You know, we work hard for our babies to have a nice life, for sure.

Yeah, well answered, I want to say thank you so much.

Thank you.

You tell an extremely difficult story in a really articulate way, and I can't even begin into imagine what it must have been like being so young, being so vulnerable, and having to escape someone so awful. But your story, Cat, it's nothing short of remarkable. You should be so immensely proud of just how brave and courageous you were when you were incredibly young. So thank you so much for sharing your story with us.

Thank you listening, guys, such an eye opening story to hear.

I mean, Matt and I don't often get to sit down with someone with a story like yours, and people that listen to us are really going to appreciate it, and we appreciate you and everything you've said.

Thanks for listening, guys, Thank you.

I want to give you a big hug. We are so immensely grateful to Kat for her bravery and sharing her experience, including her journey through domestic violence. If you or someone you know is in need of support, please do not have to reach out to one eight hundred. Respect.

We will also leave some further resources in the notes of this show.

Two Doting Dads podcast acknowledges the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia and the connections to land, see and community.

We pay our respects to their elders past and present, and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torrestrate Islander peoples today. This episode was recorded on Gadagal Land.