WENTWORTH SCRIPT-WRITING MASTERMIND

Welcome back to TV Reload. My name's Benjamin Norris and on this podcast I'll be going behind the scenes with the biggest players in television. This week, I've been celebrating the return of Wentworth for twenty twenty one for its

This week.

My podcast recommendation is the podcast Unpopular with Jack Peterson and he has Janet Roach on the podcast. Check this out because Janet spills more tea on the Real Housewives of Melbourne than our entire tea range. As for what I've been watching on the box, I've been watching American Crime The Impeachment, which will be out on Binge September eighth. It goes into the Monica Lewinsky affair with Bill Clinton and it's absolutely riveting. Sarah Paulsen is back in another

Today.

I've also been watching Clickbait on Netflix, which has already dropped, so if you want to binge watch that, you can do that, and I'm going to feature that on TV Reload coming soon, so keep your eyes peeled for that one. This week on the podcast to have Marcia Gardner, who is an Australian screenwriter who's been working on Wentworth for nearly its entire run. Marcio has worked on shows like The Doctor, Blake Mysteries, Paradise, Beach, Medivac, All Saints, Heartbreak,

Wentworth has been really unique in a way because I think it's punched well above.

Its weight and a TV week Silva looad he goes.

To went work.

People always ask me that, and they're always shocked. Your Frankie door, aren't you?

Yeah?

A lot about you.

What sort of prisoner character would kind of you know, might have some of these qualities.

My name's miss Ferguson, but you can call me governor.

So yeah, we were really lucky to get that last commission of twenty episodes. I felt like a really appropriate way to finish.

How are you made of you?

Well, I'm very well, thanks, Benjamin.

Just so exciting and so exciting to chat with you at the end of such a successful run of a television series.

Yes, it was a long run, nine seasons or you know, eight part al part B. However you want to look at it.

Well, I remember watching the very first series of Wentworth and being absolutely blown out of the water. You know, it was the first time I thought an Australian show could be seen internationally and stack up against you know, those big shows of the time, you know, like Gray's Anatomy or Breaking Bad or even Game of Thrones. You know, do you think that that was a particular turning point for our industry?

Oh?

Look, I think Wentworth has been really unique in a way because I think it's punched well above its weight, Like compared to those shows you mentioned, we're sort of operating on a fraction of the time, a fraction of the budget. So yeah, I think it's done exceptionally well.

Since its premiere on Foxtel's Soho channel back in twenty thirteen, where Worth has become a global franchise, syndicated around the world and a proud recipient and countless awards.

Well, what were your thoughts on Wentworth after watching the first series, because you did join in series two.

I loved it when I first watched it.

I was really attracted to it because what I loved about it was the grittiness of it and also the fact that you know, it was largely female driven, and it was also it was also unique in that it was about women, but women in an environment where they were isolated from the men in their lives. So that was a completely different look at women and how women would behave in the absence of men.

Well it's interesting though, you know, trying to pitch shows all about women used to be very difficult because they would always have the studios having a lot of men there saying, you know, we need to have more male characters. But what do you think were your most noticeable changes between series one and series two when you came on board.

Well, I guess the first thing we did was bring in the character of Joan Ferguson, because that was a character that really appealed to me to bring in the notion that she was a psychopath and all that stuff. So I mean that was a huge game changer. I think that introducing that character that sort of turned everything on its head and it kind of gave the show, you know, a slightly gothic aspect to it as well, which I don't think had previous.

So my name's miss Ferguson, but you can call me Governor.

Were you a fan of the original Prisoner and how much did that show and that original run influence this series.

That's hilarious because people always ask me that and they're always shocked to learn that I've never.

Actually seen even one episode of Prisoner. You sadistic bitch.

I have quite a production line going Birdsworth, on the booze, Hunt, on the gambling. Oh you were set up by the way Smith. But then I suppose you've already realized that. Now, where was I? Oh, yes, Stevens.

I'll be looking after the drugs.

And when I got this gig, I deliberately then didn't watch it because I didn't want to be at all influenced by it, and I just wanted to maintain that notion of taking a completely fresh look at the characters. So I just completely did not want to be influenced in any way. So yeah, I have never to this day still watched an episode of Prisoner at some point to go back and have a look and go, oh my god, is that what it was about?

Well, yeah, because there's similar names, you know, like there's characters and names of characters that were from Prisoner that found themselves in Wentworth. So I always felt like there had to have been some influence, and.

Indeed there was, but it was it wasn't through me. It was through Pete mctire, who was the very first writer. He wrote the pilot, and he wrote a very large number of the episodes in season one and so, and Pete was a massive fan of Prisoner, and so he was like the depository of everything Prisoner. And you know, whenever we needed a name for a new character or whatever, you know, I would always turn to Pete and say.

Oh, so, you know, who can we use, Like what sort.

Of Prisoner character would kind of might have some of these qualities or so we would That's how we would work.

Just dig it up from the archives.

Yeah, he's like a hard drive of everything Prisoner.

So well, there was a time where fans were divided over Orange is the New Black versus Wentworth. What did you think Wentworth's point of difference was from that show?

Definitely tone.

I think I only watched the very first episode of Orange is the New Black, and tonally it was quite different. It kind of trade a fine line between comedy and drama, and I don't think Wentworth.

I mean, although that's not to say there is no humor in Wentworth.

Certainly there is, but I don't think I think it's a much darker show than Orange.

And I guess this is a bit of a tough question to ask because you know, we don't want any hits put on this person. But who made the decision for this series to be the last.

I think it was probably a mutual decision. The network worth thinking of canceling the show earlier, and indeed they did, but I think there was such a such an outcry from the audience that they sort of rethought that and went, oh, there is.

Still an audience for this show.

So so yeah, we were really lucky to get that last commission of twenty episodes, which has gone to are two groups of ten, so this is sort of part two of the eighth season, which is why I said initially about eight or nine, depending on which way you

Yeah, well, I Reckon.

I signed I Reckon about four different petitions over time, so I'm assuming that the show had a lot of lives, yes, just from being asked to sign those petitions, but you never know, there could be a movie. Would you ever make a Wentworth movie?

I probably wouldn't, but that's not to say others might not.

Yeah, well, you know what things are like these days. We get them rebooted, we get them restarted, so there's different ways to bring it back. But it couldn't come back without you.

I'm going to say, well, I think I've probably contributed all I possibly could to it, So I think it's you know, that's now it's up to the next person that take that on. But interestingly enough, though we lost characters, we as favorite characters, we as favorite actors playing those roles,

So yeah, absolutely, Well over the eight seasons, which actor was the most different do you think from their character? I mean, obviously these characters are criminals.

That's easy. Definitely, Pamela Rave is nothing like Joan Ferguson.

It feels great to play such an iconic role, I have to say, I mean because of the way I look, and I don't always look like this, but I've been casting a fair amount of nasty, powerful people in my time, and given that Joan Ferguson aka the Freak, is got to be one of the most iconic nasty people in Australian television. When I was approached about this, I just I squealed with delight.

I remember being on Breakfast Radio and interviewing Cecilia Ireland, who played Lizzie, and I swear that I was talking to Lizzie when I did that interview, like there was obviously the character wasn't there, but sort of there was some essence there that definitely carried through. I think I think she was doing the laundry while she was talking to me, and it just sounded like Lizzie was in the laundry room having a chat.

That's a bit scary, I know.

I just what a great character though, absolutely so.

Lizzie's journey from series one to series two. I think the main shift is that she goes from really caring for the women to actually hatching a plan to make a change.

Was the decision to kill be because Dannielle Cormack wasn't coming back, or what was the decision in that that happening.

No, no, no, it was Look, it was a decision that was purely based on the drama and the show. And we felt at that time that we came back with a plan for a further four seasons. So that

And even though even though it.

Was a really difficult and scary decision to make, because considering the popularity of that character obviously by the same token, we felt that it was dramatically the absolute right decision to make, and that we had confidence that we would be able to create characters that would be embraced by the audience that would replace it and give the show that longevity that we wanted from it.

I don't think anyone was expecting that it was such genius television making.

You know.

Also, the other thing that I thought was interesting was or was keen to know the answer to, was their characters that you created specifically for actors, because I thought with Sicred Thornton on the show that might have happened. You know, actors sounded like they were just wanting to get themselves into some of these meaty roles, and so they must have been putting their hands up, you know, were you creating specific characters for actors?

Well, in that in that case, that's absolutely true. Although there was a permutation of that character that that had been floating around in some forward planning documents, but it was definitely when we knew that Sigrid had agreed to come on the show, then we definitely modified that character for her with her specifically in mind.

Well, she was a great character, Like even her face without any words, Sigrid was just delivering.

It was so good.

I think Sony is very well aware that someone was out to get her, and I'm pretty sure she knows exactly who that is. She has to double check, but I think she comes in with a fairly strong sense that Liz was taking her own revenge.

The story arcs are actually so brilliantly activated along the entire eight seasons. What was the longest point of trying to forward plan a story?

I mean, we actually had at the beginning of every season, before we blotted a single episode, we had a massive forward planning session where we would figure out in quite a lot of detail what we were going to do for the entire season, so we knew where it was going to end right from the word go. We knew in broad strokes each and every character journey for all the characters exactly what they were going to do over

So that was all extremely.

Well planned out, and so when we came to plot the individual episodes, that was much more of really teasing out the detail of that story in those scenes. We absolutely knew where it was going to all fit into the grand plan.

I can imagine that sometimes though that you know, for someone like Pamela Raye playing the Freak, you know, there was two seasons that Pamela was missing. You know, do you end up saying to Pamela, by the way, you're coming back, or did you just bury her and then wring her up and ask if should do the role later?

Like how did that? How does that work out? Is the actor in the loop?

Oh?

Absolutely.

In fact, when we buried, when we buried Jane Alive, I said to Pamela, we will bring you back. We need to rest the character for a couple of seasons because you know, it was just kind of becoming.

More and more and more heightened.

And we've sort of I think we needed to we needed a reset to ground the show again. And so but that was always the plan was to rest the character for a couple of seasons and then bring her back. Having said that, it was like, God knows how we're going to figure out a way, a way of you know, making this work and making this at all believable. But and you know, it was only really being able to figure that out that allowed us to bring her back.

Well, I don't want to give anything away from the second part of series eight, but it's really clever writing that has allowed for this final ten episodes, for her character to be there and for it to all make sense. I think that was really clever because you had Pamela back to play the role last year, but was she really there or wasn't she You know, that was a big mystery. But then she is going to be allowed, I believe, you know, to play the Freak the way we know her for this last ten episodes.

Absolutely, and that was absolutely all by design because we just thought, you know, if we're coming home, we've got to come home with the Freak in a full stretch.

Well, who was your favorite character to write for? Because I know this is like me asking you to pick you know, your favorite children, but surely there's some characters that stood out for you.

Oh, look, yes it is. It's like going you know, which is your favorite child. I mean I loved writing The Freak, absolutely love writing the Freak, which is you know why we wanted to bring her back.

I think we all did.

But you know, by the same token, like I just love Rita and Ruby, you know when we brought those two characters in at the top of season six, Just love those characters. Murray, you know, fabulous character. We're just really blessed. You know that we've we had such a cast of amazing actors too, that could actually pull this stuff off, because there's one thing to write it, but then you've got to find actors that are willing to throw themselves into what's being asked of them.

And we've been so fortunate.

That it's been matched.

And then you can write something so creative and so amazing, but then it can be matched. There wasn't a bad I mean you can't say this in other television series, but there wasn't a bad character. There wasn't a bad performance in this entire run.

Exactly. We've been extremely fortunate.

Was there ever a time where you guys fought in the writer's room? Because I also can imagine that these characters would be quite sacred to everybody, so I guess people would be very passionate. Was there biff ups in the writer's room?

Look, I would say that we robust discussion was probably a key feature of the writer's room because we worked together for so long, and you know, these characters are all kind of grown with all of us.

We were very much on the same page.

So it wasn't like there was bitter disagreement about big issues, but we certainly had robust discussion about smaller things. And you know that just defending the character, the character's truth is always really important, I think, and you know, you can do the most outrageous things as long as you maintain the truth of the character.

And so that's what most of the discussion would be about.

I think of it from my point of view being a viewer, and I can't even remember the time the amount of times that I said to myself, you can't do that as.

Long as it's character truthful.

Yeah, when scripting some of these exciting or dramatic scenes, did you get to be on set to watch or which have to sort of wait until it was done? The good scene that I could talk about was Sally ann Upton's performance of Juicy Lucy. You know, with the tongue removing scene. One thing to be in a writer's room and to put that down to paper, but another thing to watch it. Are you ever allowed to be on set to see them?

Oh?

Look, absolutely, We could go on to set whenever he wanted to, but very infrequently did because unless, you know, unless there was something where I was needed. But just because we were so busy, we were just we were just flood out doing you.

Know, doing our own job.

But funny, you should mention that particular example because as soon as the tongue cutting scene was shot, Sally came running up to the writer's room and we've got a fantastic photo of us standing with them, with her in our arms around her, you know, in the writer's room she's governed in blood hysterical.

Did you ever have to turn away? Because you know, second episode of this last season, I actually turned away, and I turned away for ninety seconds because I ended up going back and rewatching how long this moment went for it hasn't planned on telling, so I'm not saying what it is. But episode two of the final series, I definitely looked away? How many times, Derek, can you looked away?

Or probably is the grizzliest scene that we've ever done. Oh I'm so screamish. I'm unbelievably screamish. I turned away all the time, and I.

We came up with this stuff and I can't actually handle watching it.

I think our makeup team were just heard by the way, you know, they were just managed to do some of this stuff so convincingly.

And oh yeah, just some of the bruises, you know, or the aftermath and the healing was so cleverly done because it was never forgotten. It was done with amazing continuity. That's what I thought was quite impressive.

Once they do like doing all the makeup for that, and also Megan has did it has made a beautiful tone that all of that's made out of sugar syrup.

This season does feel like the final series does look like you're farewelling people with integrity to their characters. Did you feel like everyone was getting their moment?

Yeah?

No, we were very conscious of that, and as I was saying before about character truth, to try to main that to the very end and to not allow character to serve as plot no matter where we wanted the story to go, we'd always just would determine not to manipulate the character to service the plot. And so yes, I think that character truth was maintained right to the very end, and we made sure everybody had an outcome that befits their character.

Yeah, I think the essence over the whole run of the show, and the one thing that I really enjoyed was sort of questioning yourself, now, are they a good guy or are they a bad guy? You know, like I really enjoyed that as a viewer because some people like Jake the Snake is a good example of that with him. You know, he did some wicked things in the show, but then he'd become good for so long that you'd forget that he was Jake the Snake. And I thought that that challenge with us as an audience,

We don't tend to think even in terms of ore they good or bad characters. We're just we tend to think in terms of their humanity. And they can do bad things, and they can be very bad and very black, but we always try and find the humanity and the character and find the dimensions. And the other thing that was so fun to do was to have a character that we knew the audience really hated and then go, Okay.

Now we're going to make you love them.

And then and then just like sort of deliberately try and challenge that character in a way that it brought out a completely different side of them or the opposite.

I felt like that with Kas Procter. You know, I just was like so confused the whole time. You know, I really loathed her at times, but then I really loved her.

Do you see strength as your defining quality?

Is that why you're top dog?

Probably?

When I was a kid, I was the victim I was, but I refused to let that be my story.

Yeah, So that particular character made me feel like I had bipolar Like I just I just couldn't put it all together just quickly. I would say, though, with Bernard, Bernard's in Big Brother at the moment, being in Big Brother VIP, how do you think he's going to go in that show?

Oh my god, I didn't even know that. See, that's how out of the loop I am.

I didn't even know that he's in Celebrity Big Brother as we speak, which will be seen on television, you know, the fourth quarter of this year.

So I just I wonder how he'll go.

Well, if he channels Jake, he'll survive.

It's some great advice.

I wish you would have seen him before he went in to say that to him.

One of the best words used to describe Jake came from Marcio, a headwriter, which is duplicitous. So he's kind of got that ability to be charming and to you know, to kind of be sort of light about things, but then you know he's able to cross the line.

How involved were the writers and the actors? You know, like how involved with the writers were the actors? Should I say? Because were they allowed to come and talk to you about what they felt?

Absolutely, and we worked very closely together, so we would always the door was always open. We would always discuss things if anyone had any issues or just wanted to talk about stuff.

Where's this storyline going for the character or whatever. Yeah.

Absolutely, we work really closely together. And that was fantastic too. And that was by virtue of the fact of having that fantastic studio in Newport that we were all under one roof, so we could just walk in, you know, they could just walk into my office and have a yak, which was great.

Were you ever shocked to the guests by watching the scenes being played out? And the reason why I asked that question is sit a separate to the gruesomeness of some of it or some of the elevated storylines, But were you ever shocked by the actors performance where you thought, wow, that was just given a different dimension.

I don't know about a different dimension because we're generally always on the same page, but certainly I've sat there and cried at stuff that I've been so intimately involved in plotting and writing and all that, yet they've been very moving.

Oh yeah, I can imagine what was the biggest obstacle to write around, because there's been a few obstacles, you know, like sets no longer being there, or maybe act is not necessarily being available again, or you know what's been the biggest obstacle for you to write around?

Oh?

Well, certainly COVID.

I mean this last season that's about to go to air was shot entirely, almost entirely during COVID, and so that was a huge process to I mean, sadly, all our location component had to be ditched, so we lost some fabulous, some fabulous story material that just had to go because we couldn't shoot on location. We were confined to our building and our sets. I mean, the audience will never notice because what we've got is fabulous, but

But the actors were incredible, They were amazing.

The whole crew just worked so diligently to just to not have it show on screen, and I don't think it does, so yes, but that was tricky, but that was all tricky behind the scenes stuff.

Can you tell us a scene that's not that you couldn't do? Is there anything that you can reveal that you didn't shoot?

I think yeah. Probably.

There was a whole storyline in the second episode which involved Rita's character, because as you know, Rita's on the run from witness protection and so we had a whole location storyline that took place back in her hometown that was just fabulous and was such a wonderful Rita's story. And yeah, almost all of it wasn't possible to shoot it I.

Think what's interesting as well is there is the writer's room, and you know you're in control of sort of making sure all of this happens, but then you've got individual writers that own those each episode. Is there a common piece of advice that you give to that writer when it's their episode to then take over. Is there something not?

Really, because we've we've always we have quite a unique way of working on Wentworth, which was that we work as a team, so we forward plan everything together, we develop everything together, we plot everything together. So the only thing we don't do together basically is the actual writing of the script.

But it's so.

Well planned out in advance that we're all pretty much on the same page.

And all across the story.

And I think that's what gives it such great continuity, because we all sort of feel creative ownership over the whole thing. It's not really telling everyone else do it this way or do it that way.

We all we developed, the whole team, develop it together.

I was talking to Michael Lucas, who's on the episode prior to yours, and it was just interesting to talk to him about killing off Patrick on Offspring and then working on killing off being responsible for some of the biggest television deaths of all time, and he was saying he wasn't his idea to start with, but he felt so impressed that he was. He felt he felt right about having the opportunity to write those those episodes, and it must be hard to hand that over in some way.

Yeah, yeah, Well, we actually have to have a ballot because about who writes what, because we're just like so attached to some episodes and some character journeys and everyone wants this one then, so we actually I've even abligated responsibility.

For telling people what they're going to write.

So we just literally draw numbers out of a hat and go okay, because that's the only equitable way of doing it because we're all so desperate to write certain things.

You know, wow, I mean, do you do that for every episode or is it just the episodes that you've got too many people asking you to take on the whole season?

So we always just like go okay, you get first choice, you get second choice, you get third choice, you get fourth choice, and we share the choice, you know, so who ever got fourth choice last time gets first choice this time.

And that type of stuff.

That's pretty impressive going into your career, which television shows writing have you admired the most? Maybe looking at coming into the industry, but also maybe even now, I.

Probably gravitate to shows that have very strong female lead characters, like I've just loved Mayor of Easttown recently, but I loved Homeland for that reason.

Two were the best actresses in the world, Claire Danes and Kate Winslett, just absolutely amazing. But then it also Kerry Russell in The Americans, so absolutely. But what about getting into television. Was there writing that had inspired you to be a television writer.

Well, I went to film school, but originally I guess my idea was to be a director. But you know at film school you kind of have to write something first before you can direct it, right, So that's how I started writing. It really wasn't my intention to be a writer, in fact, but yeah, I started writing and they're like, oh, you're a writer, you can write. So having left film school, then I got a job as a writer and sort of never never really stop.

Has there ever been in your career a mistake that you've learned from? Is there anything that's gone to air that you've gone on that was a big mistake from.

I mean, the great thing about mistakes is that you do learn from them. You absolutely do learn from them.

You try something, it doesn't work, and you see it on air and just go, oh, cringe, that was a really bad idea.

I won't do that again.

And then also with the research for these sorts of shows as well, I can imagine that would be fun to do the research. I mean, did you for this show, did you go and see what the women's prisons were? Like?

Absolutely?

Yeah.

That's one of the great things about being a writer is that you get to sort of enter into all these different worlds of the shows you that you work on, and I really love that aspect of it. You get to see how other people live their lives. But yes, we did. We went out to the women's prison here in Melbourne and spent some time out there talking to prisoners and and talking to prison officers and talking.

To the governor. And it was nothing like Wentworth.

I was going to say, other governors like this in real life, because Vera, as much as we love, Vera's making a very questionable governor at times. What about storylines though? Did you manage to steal some storylines that are real like as in was there ever steal Wentworth storylines where people at home are be thinking, oh my god, that's fast fetched, but was actually based on some truth.

Oh, probably not.

A storyline per se, but certainly lots of the detail, certainly lots of detail of prison life and you know, things that happen. Yeah, we try and try to include as much of that authentic detailers that as.

We could find.

And I can imagine you know, Kevin Carlin has brought a lot to the role, you know, as serious director over the years. What do you think Mark's his signature work on the series?

Oh, Kevin's amazing.

Kevin was the setup director at the very beginning of the show and he shot the last, the final episod so quite rightly and has been an absolute mainstay of the style and the tone and style of the show. And what's so fabulous about Kevin is that he's just so incredibly script literate, and so he just instinctively.

Knows exactly it was.

It was kind of like he knows instinctively exactly what the intention of the script is and the drama and the characters objectives, and so it was so fabulous to work with him for that reason.

Both of you had bought such a consistent and amazing level of work to this show over the whole series. So that's the reason why I was excited. And he did Big Girls blouse back in the day, so he understood humor.

Oh totally, totally.

But you know, and the other thing too, is that Kevin's so thorough like he will interrogate the meaning of something, you know, so thoroughly, and he's so well prepared and there's not a question he can't answer for the actors on the set, and because he just makes it his business to understand absolutely everything about the material.

And yeah, which is just brilliant. I love working with him.

Yeah, he looks like he's a lot of fun. And you know, working with Joe and Penny must have been a lot of fun. You know, both exceptional executive producers. You know what was your favorite memory back, you know, looking back over the series collaborating with these amazing women.

Look, they are fabulous, and what's so great is just that the enthusiasm and the trust that they gave us as a writing department was really outstanding, really outstanding and unique and allowing us to have the time that we needed to develop the show because traditionally in Australian drama you don't get very much time at all to throw something together. And we kind of said from the beginning that, well know, we need this amount of time to do

Well.

I think in lots of ways, that's what's interesting about these shows these days. It's better to have, you know, back in the day to have a TV series that order like twenty eight or thirty two episodes of the year, and so you're stretching yourself quite thin where we've thrown that out of the window now and that's not happening. You know, you're getting the opportunity to tell you know, maybe eight episodes or ten episodes and do it well.

Certainly. I mean it shouldn't be a luxury.

It feels like a luxury, but it shouldn't be a luxury because in the US it's quite different.

I think it's The most important.

Thing for a successful drama is development time, and if you short change that then I think that's a reason why a lot of things aren't as don't really live up to the potential of the concept.

And you're working at the moment. I heard that you're quite busy working on a show at the moment. What's the show that you've got coming up?

I can't talk about that really.

Surprisingly, I've signed an NDA, so I can't tell you. We know it's going to be good. Is it for Foxtel? Can you tell us that much?

I don't know. I don't know if I can or not.

I said to Brian.

I had Brian Walsh on the show a few months back and I interrogated him about Wentworth coming to an end and he was like, look, I think it's time. It's the bow that we wanted to put on the show, and he had a nice way of talking about it, and I was like, please tell me that you've got the writer, you know, lock the writers in to do more shows for Foxtail, because you'd be stupid not to.

Yes, well, I will say that we would be very delighted to work with Foxtel again because it was a fabulous experience, and so yes, and with Joe and Penny.

Well, I always ask this question to everyone that joins us on the show, and that is what is an amazing story from behind the scenes that we as an audience would appreciate. Maybe something you know that happened that we didn't get to see.

Probably what's really outstanding about Wentworth is the camaraderie between the whole production, all fat you know, all the departments, all the cast, everybody involved in the show. Every lunch time we would always sit down in the catering area together. We always had lunch together, so the whole crew and everybody cast and crew all together, people past dressed up in their costumes, all bashed up, you know, with bloodbreading out of their head and all this sitting down.

Having lunch with you know, we're just having a nice conversation over lunch, and you know, he's beaten up people around you and all this type of thing.

But Robbie Megaceva made it his business to discover when everybody's birthday was, and.

He would he would just he would, he would.

Put on a performance, increasingly elaborate, well thought out performances for everybody's birthday, and as it went along that they just became more and more elaborate, and it was just fantastic, just fabulous, you know, and everyone would get up and sing happy birthday to whoever it was, and it was just the most wonderful camaraderie that you know, you would ever hope to come across on a show. And we were just like this massive, big family by the end

But you know, we had that on went so it's just you know, very very happy.

But the warmth and generosity you know, that existed between everybody and you know, and Robbie really.

Drove that it has to be the reason why the show's resonated so well, though, Is that that's their hope. Lightning strikes twice and three times and four times for you and you get to continue to work in these amazing environments and tell amazing stories.

Yes, well, we we as a writing team, and you know, and producers are very determined to work together again. And you know, having established all these fabulous relationships, why wouldn't you want to continue to just not just not just not went Worth the movie, just the movie. There'll be something else, something else, equally fabulous, fabulous.

Well, I just want to say thank you so much for taking the time to have this chat with me today on TV Reload. I've been a huge fan of the show the whole way through, been lucky enough to see the first few episodes, and the show is setting itself up to be a cracker. So I want to say thanks for doing such an amazing job and I'll always be in your audience.

Oh, thank you, thank you, And I hope you, I really hope you enjoy it.

Are really doing