It's in the news today, but it was actually on TV Reload the podcast last week. Don't welcome back guys to TV Reload. My name's Benjamin Norris and on this podcast I go behind the scenes with the biggest players in television.
Yeah, great questions. The show's about the game. There's a lot of great television out there in Australia.
But I've also got to go behind the scenes with writers. The truth is, when I started writing it, it wasn't had nothing to do with the news and casting agents.
They know from a casting point of view what they need, and.
Editors because that's what we do as editors where storytellers. Not to forget some incredible executive producers who are making some of the best TV in Australia.
I have been on the program since the beginning and it's kind of in my DNA.
So thanks for joining me each week and I hope the podcast continues to give you real insight into the magic of television today. On the podcast, I have Aaron Vincent, who is the executive producer on Q and A. I've been a fan of the ABC show for many years and what Aaron brings to Q and A is her natural love of good journalism from working behind the scenes
on some of the best news broadcast jobs. It's been this program that has allowed Australian audiences to hear much needed conversation from which Aaron manages to orchestrate from behind the scenes, networking her panel, preparing audience questions and rotating hosts. This format allows us as an audience to be educated and to feel like we're a part of the conversation.
I will ask Aaron on what to expect this year on the show in twenty twenty two, why the change to Thursday night needed to happen, and if the current government has any influence on the current landscape of the show. There's plenty more on the Chat and I hope you like this week's episode. So without further ado, I'm going to bring Aaron Vincent into the chat as we unpack the production of Q and A. It's all happening on this week's podcast of Tivyload.
Everyone's entitled to their view of Q and A. Everyone has one.
Tonight, a panel of leaders discuss power.
If you're in command of the conversation, you know when it's time to shut it down. People talk about Islam without knowing anything about it. I honestly think Q and A is one of the most high wire acts. Can you explain why although you talk a good game about standing up against social justice warriors? I think I can honestly say curiosity drove me to journalism. Have you and Grace Taye made contact since? And have you discussed that
with her? You just never really know where the conversation's going to go.
Hi eron, how are you?
Hi Ben? I'm good. I'm good. There's always a bit of a Friday folk after the show, but I'm good.
Well.
Congratulations on the first episode of twenty twenty two. I was going to say, what was your favorite moment from this week's series premiere?
Oh, that's such a hard question. It was such a magnificent start to the year. What a wonderful mix of Australians and voices on that panel, Dylan all Caught, Rosy Battye, Tom Kalmer, Katie Allen and Tanya Plibsek, who had been up half the night. I think the first question was probably the most fascinating for me, and I think it's everything I love about the Q and A format, the idea of bringing different opinions together and challenging people to
think differently. And I just truly think that the contrast and almost complimenting views of Dylan and Rosie and Tom Kalmer as well about those speeches from Grace Tame and Britney Spears and the way Grace has handled herself and the commentary around that. I thought the way Rosie so articulately expressed that that has made her reflect on the way she has behaved as Australian of the Year and
the different ways of advocacy. You know, she's freely admitted that some of Grace's behavior has made her uncomfortable and that's made her question whether you know, she's sort of been socially conditioned as a woman of her age to act a certain way. I just think the way she expressed it was so thoughtful and I'm sure it would have got people thinking at home.
I love that about her. I remember seeing her do a speech in front of it was a corporate event, and I remember as soon as she took the stage, I was like, Oh, that's Rosy and started saying to my partner her story and the thing I've always appreciated about her is intelligence, Her own intelligence to pivot when it comes to making up her own mind. So many times you see people you know have a profile that can just stick and say this is how I'm supposed
to say it. But you can really see that she takes the time to think about what her answers are going to be. And that's an intelligent woman.
She really does. And she's unafraid naturally, you know her life experience and the circle she's been able to mix in since winning that award, which you know she expresses her gratitude for because it's completely changed her life and allowed her to achieve social change. But you know she actually sort of Virginia asked her if she and Grace have and she said that they have, and Grace was
hurt by her comments. But what resulted was a really fruitful conversation about something that they essentially a topic and an idea that they come at from very different ways, but can so respectfully disagree. And I think that is the essence of Q.
And eight exactly. It's a good debate. I think it's when you get people to have a conversation and be honest about who they are and what they feel, and then share their own opinions on the topic without ever saying anything to put the other person down. Do you know what I mean? Like, I love a good debate where there's no conflict unnecessarily it's where you say something and you go, oh, that's a aha moment. That's probably changed the cycle.
We had some really big moments last night. It is
really hard to choose one. I mean, another one for me where I think, you know, everyone in the control room was quite a gape, was when Virginia was asking Katie Allen about crossing the floor and Virginia asked her how that felt, And I think we all sort of expected her to talk about the tension and how that was difficult, and she was positively beaming, and you could see a real personal pride in herself that she has stood up for something, And that was essentially what she said,
How did it feel crossing the floor with your colleagues in defiance of your prime minister he's personally very wedded to this legislation.
Well, you know, I actually feel it's a very interesting mix of emotions. To be fair, it's hard to explain it. You look happy, I do, yeah, good, yep, I feel like I've stood up for what I believe in.
Good job.
So that was a really powerful moment. And you know, twenty minutes later she was giving credit to Bill Shorten for the NDIS and the success of that scheme. So we had some really unexpected moments, which is another great thing. You just never really know where the conversation's going to go.
Well, Dylan talking about I thought was really important because it's something that people go, oh, I feel uncomfortable. You know, it's almost like another show on the ABC. You can't ask that. There's questions that you would love to know, but you feel silly like you can't ask. But the way he explained something so simple made me see something so different.
Anybody can have sex or being a relationship in any way that they can have sex or being a relationship. Right, it's not the same as you or you or anyone I don't know, and I'm sure not it does it the same way. Well, it's different for everybody, and that's okay, you know what I mean. But my advice is to any nondisabled person, if you see a good looking person that with one arm, who's autistic, in a wheelchair, whatever, go up and take it.
Hey, so simple and so personal. No, no one can imagine what that would be like unless you live with a disability, and the impact I think that that conversation will have for people is exactly what he is striving to achieve, to be seen to be having those conversations, to be representing people with disability, and to help people
able bodied Australians understand and empathize what that's like. I also thought our questioner Joshua, who freely admitted that he had to let a staffer go because he didn't have the resource to train the person with a disability up to the standard his business required, took such courage and such bravery.
I'm a business owner in the construction industry. A year ago we had someone trial with us with this disability. We had to let him go to it to the fact that we just simply didn't have enough resources to be taken up. I still feel guilty about letting him go. People with disabilities have really good qualities, but due to the financial ramifications of the extra resources, we just couldn't make it work.
I'm sure that other employers in the country share that experience, and it started another important conversation and again goes to the sort of change Dylan hopes to achieve in his role as Austrain of the Year. I also really loved Dylan's story about his Nando's experience on his date. He did.
He went into a really personal story about an awful experience that he had when he was at Chadston on a date and how someone's religious beliefs informed their views about people with disability, and he basically told this person told Dylan that he was a spawn of Satan, which is just the most horrible thing you could think of.
But Dylan, at the end, in classic Dylan Allcott style, managed to have a laugh and said the date was a success and there was Nando's involved, so that was another great moment as well.
And you know, I can only imagine and I would love to see you in the control and I'd love to see a little face as things like that take off and you just be rubbing your hands together, going this is good, Telly.
Is the end of it all. You know, we're viewers too, and it's unfolding live for us. There's a lot going on, and you know you're sort of executive producing, but you
are viewing it as well. And I am constantly trying to put myself in the shoes of the audience and really sort of using my instinct to guide the conversation, you know, and finding that balance of giving a topic enough coverage and enough air, getting to enough questions, allowing time for the conversation to breathe, and knowing when to move on as well. Well.
It would be unfair of me to ask you who your favorite host has been over the years, and with a fabulous lineup this year with three amazing hosts of the show, but can I ask you what makes a good compare of Q and eight.
I've worked on a number of television shows. I've worked on a number of live television shows. I honestly think Q and A is one of the most high wire acts that a television host can take on. I think you need to have is a real confidence and self belief to do the job and to be able to handle anything, because anything can happen, and you've got to
be on. The host just has to be on. There is no moment to miss anything, the follow up questions, and also understanding the balance of when to just sit back and listen and when to challenge and when to fact check. You know, we do have times where people say things and they're inaccurate and we have to correct them and we're help to account if we don't. So it's a really high wire act. But at the end of the day, you're driving compelling conversation live on television
and the exchange of ideas. So it's a really unique set of skills. And the hosts we have make it look very easy, but they're the skills I think you need to pull it off.
They make it look really easy, like watching last Night just seems so simple and everything's fine. And I've done live television before where they've got people talking in your ear and talking and listening. That's a skill.
It's a real skill. And I really try and keep the communications in the air to a minimum and really only dive in when I feel like I need to, because they know what they're doing, and you know, we always discuss things and have a program plan and sometimes things go to plan, and some of the best moments are when they don't. But yeah, they all do a wonderful job.
When it comes to picking the panel each week, you know, how strategic are you getting certain people on board? Do you table what you're going to tackle based on sort of the questions that you're looking at, and then start as a collaboration of producers, work at who are the best Australians to answer those questions.
So it actually works that we assemble the panel first. So we assemble the panel and then that generates the
interest and the question. So it's an interesting combination. And we do a mix of what we call general news of the week shows where we really diving into the big conversations that are being had and what's making news that week, and then we do sort of more focused themed shows like we did a great one last year with Grace Tame and the head of the AFP, Rehees Kershaw, Marcia Langton and Rustin and Penny Wong and it was a preview of the Women's Safety Summit and that was
the whole show start to finish. Sometimes you have the luxury of doing that. Other times the new cycle dictates that there's a topic that you just can't ignore. But we assemble the panel and then we advertise who's on the panel, and then from there the audience really helps shape the conversation and takes the conversation where they want it to go. And I should point out Q and
A is the only live program of its kind. There's a version of it in the UK BBC's Question Time, but that is pre recorded, and there's a version of it in New Zealand as well, also pre recorded. So Q and A in Australia on the ABC is the only live format where Australians can put questions to people in power in a live format.
It's so succinct. Though in real life we pivot and we go ohen or we lose our mind or we lose our point, and I just think it's so amazing that these people are so succinct. I'd love to know what preparation you offer these panels before the show, because if I was one of those panels, you'd have to say, Ben, get to your point, don't go on and on.
We have conversations with them about how to keep the conversation moving, and you know, I think the biggest piece of advice I give is have your main points that you want to get across, but have two or three and don't come in with ten or twelve things, because there's only an hour and the conversation has to keep moving.
But you mentioned the panel. I'm always so blown away by the audience and the courage it takes to ask a question on live television, and sometimes there are some really personal stories that go with those questions and that
is driving those questions. They really shape the show and having the audience back, you know, we had to do more than a dozen shows last year with no audience in the room or video and you know, whilst it's great to get video questions and they came in their hundreds from around the country, it's so it adds such another dimension and an energy to the program when you have that audience in the room. So we're just so delighted to have them back.
Well, we might dip back into asking a few questions about the audience in a little bit, but I just wanted to ask, you know, for you personally taking on this job, what's been the biggest surprise in being the executive producer of this show?
The pandemic and the challenges that would throw at me. But while talking about the pandemic, I would have to say the thing that surprises me still is seeing very accomplished, very experienced media people agreeing to come on the show and the impact that the platform itself has on them. Pre show. We do see people getting incredibly nervous who you wouldn't expect, And it's just a reminder for me really that the power of the brand and the program
and the discussions that we have. It really surprises me still to see people pre show, you know, really pulling themselves together, asking a range of questions and showing, you know, the pre show jitters. But it is a big stage and there's a lot of people watching, and they know what they say will have impact on Q and A.
Did you always set out to work as a producer well as a producer, I mean, as you set out in your career to work in the commentary of politics.
No, I didn't. I think I can honestly say curiosity drove me to journalism. I've always had a curious mind and a love of storytelling, so that seemed like a natural fit, and I began my career front of camera as a reporter. As a journalist, I started in regional television at WIN and did my time there, and then moved back to the city and worked at some of the commercial stations and then landed at the ABC, which was as surprising for me as it was for anyone else.
I always sort of, you know, I think I grew up as a Channel nine household and I think back to when I started at the ABC, it's evolved and changed so much for the better. So yeah, I haven't really looked back since I've landed at the ABC. It's just been one opportunity after the other. But I did hit a point where I started to crave something more big picture, I think, rather than just you know, one
single story every day. And that was when I really sort of crossed over into the production side, and I think that's where my love of politics really grew. And I was lucky enough to work at Insiders, filling in as the executive producer there for a period of time, which was an amazing experience, and there was so much happening in Australian politics, so that really cemented my love
of politics. But you know, Q and A gives me a wonderful mix of both, and as my previous role did at News Breakfast, you know you get to do a whole range of topics, not just the politics. Yes, that's the backbone, and that's there the shows that I think the audience love and love to hate, but we do nice, we do great shows without the Polley's as well, But there's no doubt that there's a real level of accountability that go with those shows, and I think that's what the audience loves.
About them absolutely. And do you sometimes find it hard not to have an opinion or to pick sides?
You know?
I guess it's a producer you would be needing to be fairly neutral. And I don't know about you, but I can easily warm to somebody, but I'd love to know if you stay neutral. Do you walk away at the end of the show and you're like, well, I'm on this person's side.
I think as a journalist, you know, the fundamental core of your job is not to pick a side and to be open minded and to see both sides, which is, you know, everything I love about Q and A. Yeah, And I genuinely believe that the greater range of views and perspectives you bring to a debate, the more intelligent and high level the conversation will be. So it's yeah, I think as a journalist, that's you know, that's in
your blood, it's in your training. The minute you sort of put the blinkers on or let the blinkers go on, you'll miss something in a story.
Has there ever been a question while you've been the executive producer from the audience that's gotten out of hand or has gotten too heated.
That's a good question. I think there's definitely examples where the question perhaps hasn't been satisfied with the answer, and so you know, they want they keep wanting to push the politician. I think I wouldn't say it's ever gotten too heated, but I think there's definitely been some robust back and forth.
I guess, you know, if the question is getting out of control, how do you shut it down?
I think that's where the experience of the host comes in, and that is one of the challenges of the role is to let the conversation flow, but always be in command. And I think if you're in command of the conversation, you know when it's time to shut it down. And I'll be, having no doubt relaying messages from the control room if I think it's gone on too long or it's you know, appears to be getting out of hand.
But no, I think that the hosts very much are capable of controlling the conversation or navigating the conversation over time.
Have you worked out what audiences or who audiences want to hear more from on the panel. Do you find politicians or business owners? You know, comedians. I could go on, because you actually do have an eclectic group of people that join the panel. But what's better.
It's really interesting because anecdotally, you know, people say to me, oh, I love the shows you do without politicians, they're the best shows. But I think that the ratings data which suggests that it's the ones with politicians that bring more eyeballs to the screen. So we do a healthy mix. I think about sort of two thirds of our shows have polleyes, and then we do some really great shows collaborating with various festivals and bringing a whole range of
talent to panels through different collaborations. So yeah, I think it's nice to have a break from them from time to time. But we do sometimes get audience members writing to us saying you should suggest this person. We do get people putting themselves forward to be on the panel. So yeah, we have a range of people, a range of methodologies I guess of landing on panelists, and you know,
the show's got a great history of discovering talent. A lot of the panelists that we've discovered have gone on to be nominated for Austrai of the Year or their state representative Australian of the Year. You know, I look at Yasmin Pool and she appeared on Q and A as such a young, you know, ambitious, intelligent woman and has gone on to do such a such wonderful things. And it is a real sort of platform, I guess to build your profile on, and the program has a great history of that.
I love it when you sort of are engaging with younger people about politics though, I think that is important, but it makes me ask the question, you know, do you think that politics in general is less aspirational these days and sort of less enticing for young people to take on these sort of leadership roles.
It's an interesting question. That's when we put to Dylan last night, because he's sort of signaled that he would throw his hat in the ring for politics one day, and then he sort of said that he looked at what are unfolded in the last week, and you know, he's leaving the door open, but he's not sure. So I think definitely it's a career that people question, and you know, a lot has been revealed about the culture
at Parliament House in the last couple of years. So you know, Yasmin Pool has spoken about that herself as a young woman and questioning whether that's a career she wants to go down. I think what we're seeing with the Independence is really interesting. I think we're seeing a
real kind of movement there. There's certainly a number of independent candidates who are going to be challenging sitting members for their seats, and I think, you know, that's really sort of taken off since the Seat of Indie and Kathy McGowan and the campaign that she ran, and you know, we're now seeing Simon Holmes a court funding some of these people. So that's actually an issue we're going to look into next week and we're going to be hearing from voters who feel a bit left behind by the
major parties. So it will be interesting to see if that has any impact on young people's ambitions to run for politics. But it's a pretty brutal business at the moment.
I liked the joke last night about the Deep Clean.
It was very good, wasn't it.
It was very funny, you know, as mentioned you know earlier in the podcast. The latest series premiered last Thursday. What are you going to do moving forward with this series? I mean, when you're looking at it, it could so easily leave it so formulatic, But what are you going to try to do this year to sort of keep it fresh?
Look, I think you know, the biggest thing we want is the return of the audience. And when I say the audience, I mean the audience as we know it. Like, so, we had thirty people in the room last night, and in pre pandemic days we would have two hundred and fifty. You know, we desperately want to get that back, and we desperately want to get the show back on the road.
That's something that we're working towards, and hopefully by the election campaign we will be able to do that because that's where you get a real range of diverse perspectives and you hear from all kinds of different people and different communities with different challenges and problems, and I think, you know, that's really what makes the show seeing. So
we can't wait to travel the show again. It takes the movement of a lot of people to get Q and A on the road, So I think, you know, the ABC is very cautious in keeping us all safe while we have to continue broadcasting. So the minute we've got clearance to travel the show, that's really what I can't wait to be doing. But really I think we just want to be having relevant and intelligent conversations that people tune in for.
Well, it is an election year and Q and A is a big player in getting political opinion across. What kind of interest do you get from politicians to want to come on the show. I mean, obviously they've got an agenda that they want to get across, or they're wanting to win over the Australian public. Do you get a lot of politicians coming on within an agenda?
I mean, I think there'll be certain politicians who'll be falling over themselves to come on Q and A, you know, to use that platform and to speak to their constituents and the people voting for them. And naturally we get such the ABC as a whole gets so much interest in our content around election time, so there's no doubt
our programs will be more politically charged. I think, you know, it's going to be a really tough contest and as we've seen at previous elections, I think anything can happen, so you know Q and A. I think it makes for good discussions, it makes for good content, and it makes for good debate.
I was reading TV tonight yesterday and I saw the question I think it was, you know, you know, do you think Scott Morrison will come on the show this year? Do you think he will? You know? I think there was a bit of a oh, you know, we can't have people on more than once or twice, but is there anything in plan to have him on the show soon?
We would love to have the Prime minister on the program. We certainly have invited him on in the past. The previous formats have seen one on one specials with prime ministers and opposition leaders, and we will be extending the invitation to the leaders of both parties in order to answer the questions from the Australian public.
Well, I want to know. I spoke with someone from the left and someone from the right yesterday, two politicians currently in power, and I wanted to ask them what they thought of Q and A. And I got these responses. And I'm not going to say their names or what party. You can guess try and guess which party the first
one was. The show was great and I watch it based on the selection of the panel, and the other one was a good quality current affairs program needs to be serious, but unfortunately it would only attract a smaller audience. These days, Q and A is trying to be sexy, which means that it's kind of very unserious. I guess there's a bit of a question that without trying to get you to a guess if that's a left or a right politician, do you think that the show has moved away from being more serious?
If anything, I fearl like our conversations have been too serious. We've had a pandemic dominate this show for the better part of two years, and you know, there have been weeks where we've been desperate to talk about anything else. I don't agree with that view. All views are welcome, that is the essence of Q and A. But I think, you know, looking to our program last night, we had some very eminent Australians on who either have made or
are making very significant social change. So everyone's entitled to their view of Q and A. Everyone has one. But you know, we'll just continue to do what we do and you know, take the audience cues on what they're liking. And not liking and just use the platform to have conversations that we think Australians want us to have.
Well, people asking these questions all the time. I can imagine you being at the top job. You would get you friends and family even sharing their opinions or offering what they think. Did you think that the Monday time slot was better? I know lots of people felt that it was event television and they didn't miss it on a Monday night. One of my good friends said that they would move things around to be there to watch it, and that the move maybe to a Thursday timeslot they
felt was almost burying it in a way. What do you say when friends and family come up and ask you those sorts of questions.
Yeah, look, I get a lot of questions about the timeslot, and look, I can understand Monday night became a habit for people. But the reality of it is our numbers were declining in the Monday night time slot and we were on air, you know, nine thirty five, sometimes nine p forty, depending on how our neighbors in the schedule were running for time. So we were getting on air some nights at twenty to ten, and the audience habits are now so that that is the absolute peak of streaming.
You know, people are streaming their favorit content by that hour. There's not you just only have to watch on any night of the week. The audience declines the later into the night. So when the ABC presented us with the opportunity to grab a primetime slot of eight point thirty, we jumped at it. And I think that the combination of Foreign Correspondent and Q and A is a really solid new offering for the ABC. It's a whole second
night of current affairs, you know. I think the pandemic also has kind of thrown out the patterns of typical audience behavior. I think in twenty twenty we all benefited from this huge thirst for knowledge and information. People just wanted to know what was going on, and by twenty twenty one, people didn't want to hear about it anymore. So we all sort of all programs really experienced a bit of a drop off. So we've lived through some unusual times, and no doubt the time slot change has
been big. But we've always said that this is a long term strategy, and the reality of it is that Monday nights we're getting harder and harder to pull in big audiences too.
Well, I think that's a very amazing answer, to be honest with you, I was unsure as to what you're going to say about the Monday night times like change.
I'm happy to talk about it. I think people are still getting used to it, you know, and I think these things take time, and it amazed me, you know, the commentary five weeks into the change that are we changing back to Monday night audience have its take time, and of course we want people to be watching. We want as many people to be watching as possible. But I have to say our iView numbers, you know, are up seventy percent on last year, and people consume our
conversations and our content in all different ways. You know. We release highlights and you know, kind of bite sized clips of the show the next day, and a lot of people catch up on our content that way. Any show these days is bigger than just it's broadcast audience. And one of the things I think that Q and A has not lost in all its years is the impact that it makes with the conversations that it has.
Do you think that a particular government in power at the time would have anything to do with how the show is produced, Like, do you ever worry, Okay, well, ABC's government funded organization. We have to swing a certain way or we have to be careful in a certain way. Does that ever become a factor.
No.
I think it's our job not to be influenced by any government of any party. That's the job of any program, host, producer, journalist at the ABC. Our independence underpins everything we do, so you know we fiercely guard it with everything we have.
Well, my last question to ask you on the podcast, which is something I ask every single person who joins, and that is, you know, what is something from behind the scenes that we're as an audience did not see but we might appreciate about hearing from the makings of Q and a.
Ooh something from behind the scene. I mean so many things, Like we're a live program, so everything you know, you see is what you get, but there's so many things behind the scenes. I mean, I'm thinking of you know, panelists that have missed flights. I'm thinking of a very rainy night in Sydney where traffic was just hell and truly I really wondered if our questioners were going to
make it on time. That was particularly you know, there's there's a part before the show where I go out and I talk to the audience, and I basically.
There was no one there, stuck at the traffic in the rain.
I honestly think at that point more than half of our questioners weren't in the room at the time when the floor manager was handing me the microphone saying it's time for you to go out, and one of the things I do is I clarify and confirm how to pronounce our question names, because it's so important we get that right.
And I looked at him and said, there's no point to me doing this. Half the show is not in the room. And yeah, honestly, like within the dying minutes of the show, they all turned up and somehow it all happened. But that was probably the closest call we've had.
I just want to say thank you so much for joining me on this podcast and giving people an insight into the makings of one of Australia's best shows on television.
Thank you, Ben, thank you for watching, and thank you. Thank you to your partner for watching. I hope you both keep I.
Don't know if he wants to watch every week. But it was so funny because I said to a girlfriend of mine, I said, oh, Ben doesn't watch the show, and she wrote back, what And she said, Q and A. It's poor player me and my partner