CONTENT KINGS -PHIL LLOYD - POPULATION 11

It's in the news today, but it was actually on TV Reload the podcast last week. Hey guys, welcome back to TV Reload. Thank you for clicking and downloading on today's episode with Phil Lloyd, Creator, showrunner, executive producer from the latest stand original series Population eleven, which is now out on Stan Australia. Phil Lloyd is an Australian actor and scriptwriter and partner in the production company Jungle Boys.

You're so kind, Thank you. Papa.

Evan's a little bit of a hall cleanser compared to those shows, for sure.

I also want to start by talking to you about how much I loved The Moodies. My partner will walk into the room and see that I'm rewatching it for like the hundredth time, and he's like, what is it about this show? You're obsessed? I just loved it.

I'm so excited when people text me at Christmas time every year, you know it comes around it's that seasonal show, so and you know what, I particularly love it when people haven't seen it before.

So people see it for the first time.

But it doesn't matter who you are. It's such an accessible story because it's so accurate about Australian Christmas. Is just so accurate about Aussie's you know.

Yeah.

I think it's an amalgamation of a lot of people's families really, certainly from me and Tryin. It was sort of a compositive various people in our lives and relatives and those kind of awkward Christmas dinners and stuff. I think that's probably why it's relatable. People have been there.

It's so relatable. I feel like it's like a porthole into time really. But you know, Ian Meadows, Patrick Brammel and Jane Harbor, just to name a few. Everybody's so fantastic in it. That's crazy.

Oh yeah they are. They're brilliant. It was such a treat, such a joy to work with them, and you know when you shot that. So we had this house Moody Christmas.

We had the house for about three months and so we kind of moved in and just hung out there. We actually became kind of like a family because we were just rehearsed there. We'd hang out there all the time, even when people weren't shooting on set.

They just go and hang out. The landron on the couch is and that.

So it kind of felt like we were kind of a mini family living in this house.

You know what. I have to admit, though, this is going to sound really strange from someone who's watched the Australian version of the Moodies, I have not seen the US version.

Well, I'll be interested to hear what you think. Obviously I'm biased. It's different, it's not quite the same, but that happens with remakes. I mean, it's so hard to get a remake right. Obviously, the Office, the US Office did it very well. I think that's only because they ended up making their own show.

I was just curious, how does that translate though, particularly with that particular show, which felt so Australian centric, you know, hard to translate that to the US it was.

I mean, Trent and I didn't end up ended up not being the writers on that. We were EPs. But in the end it's sort of had a few go rounds and like it took about six years to finally get up, and by that stage we kind of moved on to other things. So it was actually some US writers that sort of took it over. And it's kind of like it uses the framework of the Australian one and you know, the same characters and rough storyline and stuff, but definitely different.

I'll hit you up on socials and give you the I'll give you the debrief on what I alas do. This is not what we're talking about today though, we're talking about Population eleven. But I just what an opportunity to talk to you about that particular show. You know, what's interesting about what's happening with streaming services, particularly with STAN Australia is you know, we're seeing a lot more

I think times have changed.

I think there was a time ten twenty years ago where it was quite like Americans, specially I use the example of America's they're the biggest market, I guess, but in general international audiences there's pretty bit less of an appetite to see shows from other places on TV. Like I think it would have been to get an Australian show up on a network in America was pretty hard because there wasn't really a It just didn't sort of

I think that's definitely been my mindset.

I found myself laughing a lot, but I found myself laughing a lot while watching this because it felt very accessible. Being Australian feels less colloquial. Like I think what had happened for a long time where in Australia we were sort of just writing either, you know, like very dark themed shows. We've now moved and sort of progressed to telling more of a broader story that I think is a little bit more accessible.

I agree with that, and I think that's some Yeah, I guess in many ways, I think TV in Australia and TV writers and that have sort of matured and style and taste and everything, so that hopefully shows are.

I mentioned Home Away before, and I was thinking, when I have you today, I want to ask you this question because you wrote on that for I mean, you were in and out of jobs on Home and Away for a while. Did you have a favorite character that you wrote for while you were there? Do you end up liking a particular character more than the others?

Yeah, for sure, the USO your favorites you write for. For sure, there's always particularly a show like that. I mean that you get so used to them and and you know, some characters you can be better at than others, Like you can you can write that dialogue a bit better than others. I found the trickiest thing on Home Away was, you know, writing teenager dialogue without trying to sound like and all the white guy trying to.

Talk how the kids would talk. It's something I found that the biggest challenge.

But probably it doesn't sound like a cliche, But I loved Alf.

I mean I love Alf just because he was he just is that show and He's iconic.

He's that character. And I love Ray, Like, Ray's just so lovely, Rama's so awesome. Yeah, he's being able to write stuff and hear him just come out of his mouth.

It was really fast.

How often? How tempted are you to put flaming hooligan or whatever it is, you know into his mouth? Like is it too much of a crutch?

It can, but you got you can't.

You can't do too much because you know he'll just take it out of it's it's too much, that's that's too many firemens in a row.

There, I'll get to that kind of get to find where the level Isn't that? But yeah, he's great. Well.

Population eleven is inspired by true events the Missing Case of Patty Moriarty, which you know was the focus of that Netflix documentary Last Stop at Larima, which by the way, was such a bonkers documentary.

Yeah, you know, I haven't seen it yet.

Oh I know all about obviously, I know all the stories because I've read, you know, I got the audi for Population eleven to reading you know, original newspaper headlines and that. You know, I started watching and then I stopped and when you know what, I'm not going to watch this yet because I'm still in the middle of making our show and I don't want to. I just don't want to be mentally comparing it or be influenced

I feel like I want to watch that with you. This is crazy. I was like wanting to ask you about you know, what did you think of this documentary? I remember watching I stumbled across it and it felt very like Australian Tiger King, Do you know what I mean? Which, you know that genre at the moment is really fascinating to me. There's something quite comedic about the story, but the fact that they're all true stories is also kind of disturbing.

The thing about that struck and like, I get all that you don't have to have seen the documentary to get and that was the thing that attracted me to this idea is actually not that someone went missing, like the whole people living in a tiny town and someone goes missing obviously shocking and harrowing and horrifying and just an incredible mystery because he's still missing and no one knows what happened. I mean it's just bonkers and.

How could no one know anything? I find that incredible.

It's kind of like the Missing plane, you know what I mean, like.

Yeah, no one knows anything?

How can know?

No one knows nothing?

It's the big thing that hit me was like the characters and like, what kind of person chooses to go and live in a place like this in the middle of nowhere in a really hot, harsh environment.

Not particularly beautiful.

I mean it is, it's got its own rugged beauty, but come on, like it's so isolated. It takes a particular kind of person to do that. And that's what fascinated me. And the kind of people that go and live in these places. Often they're just they're running away from something, or they're trying to dis appeared themselves or whatever. So that that whole thing is really what I wanted to capture and Popo eve them.

Yeah, it reminds me of that Radiohead song how to Disappear Completely? You know. But the story, I guess was begging to be mined for a limited series in my opinion, But how did you decide to take the comedic group with this? I mean, not that this is a strict comedy, Like I don't want to say that, but straight away we've got Katrina very funny in your opening sequence, it's very funny, but here we are laughing at something that's kind of a little bit disturbing.

Yeah, it's we always wanted that to be the tone, which was it's kind of like dark but comedic, sort of dangerous, dangerous and dramatic, but funny, like with comedic edges. We like that, you know, that's that's the stuff we like to make, and that felt like the best way to tell the story. But also I didn't want to make like another like you know, like Mystery Road, those kind of shows. You know, I love Ministry Road. It's such a I feel like, such a masterpiece in many ways.

I didn't want to make that thing.

I didn't want to make like an outback noir or really slow moving, sort of moody kind of I really wanted it to be sort of pasty and a bit nuts and crazy, and really with these funny, weird.

Edges to it.

I feel like that's just a different way to tell a story in the outback, because I feel like we've seen a lot of outback shows obviously in Australia. But Tom even with the music and that the choice of music, it's a bit punk, it's a bit sitt of out there and it's a bit off pudding at times, and that's the kind of vibe we wanted to go for, just because it felt a bit fresh to us.

I always think of the desert. The outback of Australia is quite scary to me, Like it's almost like the ocean, you know, you don't know what's underneath, like there's something very mysterious and very I'm actually frightened by it. I'm frightened by the outback.

I get.

I get that it's have you been to the territory or wa or yeah, out back places?

Yeah? Now, I mean my family we always went on family holidays and so we sort of would mix it up. But I guess it's my child brain that I'm going back to. But I was quite scared of those places, like it was uncomfortable to me.

Yeah, it's so vast, because it's so vast and there's just you can go.

I mean you can drive.

I've driven all around the East Kimberley in that and you can drive for an hour or two or not see another human or another car. It is kind of freaky, and so it is kind of a place where we feel like anything could happen, and we certainly.

Wanted to capture that vibe. And I think that's why people do go there. I mean, when I first went to.

The territory, I was really struck by how many people were from somewhere else. Like I would say fifty percent of the people I met were not from the Northern Territory. They were from all the other states of Australia and overseas, and they come there.

It was a bit like the wild West. They come there just to make a go of things.

And I think the speed limits back then we're still like open speed limits like one hundred and thirty.

Or something like.

Well, who's finding it?

We go its outside the city. You could go as fast as you wanted to.

It's a bit nuts, and who's going to stop you because it's so vast there's not many cops around, So it's you know what I mean, Like it's yeah.

Apart from Katrina who's asking you to breathe in her face, you.

Know, yeah, And that's why she is the way she is, because she's she knows that. She says, this is my little fife tone. There's no I can kind of do whatever I want here as a cop. There's no one here to really police me. I can get away with it.

Having Trent's hands on this, you know, is amazing because he's had such huge success with Hacks and Brooklyn ninety nine. I guess that would open a lot of doors in terms of international audiences now checking this out. Is that why you brought him into this project?

No, I've known Trent for decades, Like we went to UNI together, and you know, we're very close, and I've made a lot of stuff together, and you know, I always wanted to Trent to direct this just because he's such a great comedy director and he's you know, we work very closely.

We've known each other for a very long time and have done so much stuff.

Together, and we just have a we have a real shorthand together in how we make comedy. So I always wanted him to be a part of this and to direct direct the first few episode. But the fact that he's been so successful overseas is also great. I hope people do tune in because he's directed so much great.

Stuff we'll put that on the poster. I mean it is on the poster. Yeah, did you get any good stuf Alreway's out of him about Gene Smart or Andy Samberg?

Not really just just their total pros.

I remember him saying that, you know, like on Brooklyn ninety nine, like everyone's.

So good, Like all the actors are so good at their job.

He said, director, he's kind of easy because you just sort of rock up and they do a take and they sort of rip and they that's all.

It's really funny and it's kind of like, Okay, well that was great. Do you want to try one like this? He said? It's pretty pretty easy because they're also good.

I watched SNL for Andy Samberg's era of SNL. I tapped back in. I think it was like series forty or something when he came on and watched like a good six years of that SNL just for him so funny.

So yeah, he's so good.

How did you secure Ben for this for this role? And what made him right for this role? Like what was what was the journey with finding your protagonist?

Well?

Ben, I mean I've always liked Ben. I've always liked the characters that he's played. I first came across him in mad Men. I know he's one a lot of other stuff, but that was when I first saw him in Madmen, and I don't know, I just kind of liked,

Really captures that. He's a really good actor. He's done some beautiful.

Performances dramatically, but he's also got a great sense of humor, really funny, and it feels very organic and natural, so he can sort of blow between the two quite easily. So Yeah, I was so thrilled when sent him the script and he read it and he said yeah, I was looking for reasons to turn this down, but I really like it.

I really want to do it.

And I was like, yes, when people say that sort of stuff, I always get like, is that insulting? I'm looking for things that are you know, to turn this down.

Well, I think I think the prospect of coming to Australia for a few months was like a big obviously, that's a big ordeal to leave his family for a few months and come over here and had all these plans and that. But Tom ultimately he said, oh, I just can't. I've been waiting for something like this and I don't think I can turn it down. So he creatively really wanted to do it, which was awesome, and he was a really great creative partner. He was like right into it, the whole thing.

So, well, it's a lot of heavy lifting. You know. He's in nearly every scene, so it's all about him. I always find it's really strange with him. He's exactly the same age as me. I tapped him with him with Mad Men as well, and I remember looking him up and reading about his backstory. At that point, I'm exactly the same age as him, but he looks ten years younger than me, it's crazy.

Well, you don't live in Hollywood.

I guess imagine what I would look like if I lived there. Actually I did live in Los Angeles and.

Did obviously not long enough. I guess during that twelve months you would look fantastic. Need to go back down now, by the way.

But yeah, I was going to say, you know, with so many of these brilliant comedians that are in this we mentioned Katrina but for but also Stephen Curry so fantastic, when you're shooting a comedy, is it hard not to laugh? Like have You've got a lot of crew with gags and gags in their mouth because these guys are so funny. If the smallest things, how do you keep the laugh track out of out of production?

Oh? Well, yeah, that's just professionalism.

I mean obviously there are often the crew are sort of sicking to themselves or whatever. But Tom, but also, you know, everyone's there for work, and everyone's everyone knows what we're trying to get in that. But yeah, definitely, Like I would look over at here in our DP sometimes and he'd be like biting his lip trying not to laugh, and which was which is always a good sign.

What was the rationale for the length of each episode as well, because I mean it's quite a long series to what we've been used to kind of seeing on a lot of these streaming platforms. This is a little bit longer and the episodes are shorter. What was the rationale with all of that?

I don't know.

I feel like very often we do six you know now, like the UK model is six, and we've sort of yes a six or eight. I'm certainly used to doing six or eight half hours. Look, I just wanted to tell a longer a mystery with a longer tail. I mean it's called Population eleven, you know, I kind of really wanted to lean into all of these characters and you know, roughly spend approximately an episode on each it

So I don't think it would have allowed you to get that sense. And that's what you do. Get to kind of get lost in the outback, and that's, you know, very cleverly crafted. And I guess if you were to try and make that shorter, you'd sort of you lose that almost claustrophobic feeling. Whilst it's set in the outback, which is like an open space, do you know what I mean? It allows to create the perfect environment for the viewer.

Totally, and it is that thing of like once you spend time there.

I mean, it happened to me like when I would go over you know, from I live in Sydney, but when I would go over there, over to Derby, and it'd take about two or three days for my city brain to leave my head. And then now now you're sort of in the outback and everything kind of slows down and you sort of get used to the heat and

What's your take home from making this series? Like, what did you learn while putting this together?

I learned that writing mysteries is really hard but really fun. I love it, and I want to do it again because I've never done like a mystery thriller show before. Certainly want to do that again. Shooting in remote outback is hard. Love it, absolutely love it was that you know, the you know, I wouldn't have gone there otherwise and it was a real amazing experience, but really tough because like, again, you're not.

In the city.

You can't just oh, we need another you know, sheet of tin or whatever. You can't just go down to the local miight of ten and get it or whatever.

You're going to shut it in.

So there's all that stuff.

All the logistics, I would say probably, and I knew there were a lot of logistics, but I think having done it and now, oh yeah, okay, I know how I'd do it differently this time.

Phil, Did you get bitten by like snakes, termites or what?

I think I didn't get bitten by.

You know, we saw a few snakes or a lot of termites or a lot of crocs, got close to some crocs, but fortunately escaped without any injuries from other nature, which is good. Far from sunburn, fascinating place.

Something I ask everyone who joins the podcast is what is something from behind the scenes, something of a story that maybe we kind of like a funny anecdote from I guess the production of this. Is there anything that happened that was a good yarn from behind the scenes?

Oh yeah, actually there is. I mean there's plenty, and you put me on the spot. Luckily I've thought of one. But so, the big thing in Derby is is an up around room and that people go crabbing catching crabs because I have these huge, massive, like mud crabs in that around Derby, Like they're like the size of a dinner blade, Like they're huge, and there's so many of them. One part of the storyline, we've got people catching crabs

It had caught his thumb.

And it's pincer and his pincer was pretty huge, about the size of my fingers.

I was pretty massive, and it was going blue like.

It was going purple like it wouldn't let go, and he was going and so he rushed over and couldn't prize it open, and eventually I had to just get up, get the pair of plies and like snip the snip the claw off the crab and then break and then break and then use them. And we still wouldn't open. We so snipped the claw off and it was hold on onto his thumb and eventually just had to like crunch the whole claw off his farm because we thought he was going to and I thought, oh my god,

That sounds like I was being cruel to the crab.

No, not at all. You know that they put.

Their pincers off, they grow back.

I don't think crabs have feelings, but maybe the animal cruelty people are going to come for me. I absolutely delighted chatting to you today, Like I just am so impressed with what you've been able to do with your career and this show is so fantastic. So I hope people that get a chance to listen to us talking today goes to stut Australia and watches this. It's something really fun to binge watch. And yeah, congratulations on this. I think it's really exciting.

Thanks so much, Beeron. It's been an absolutely treat to talk to you, and I'm so glad you enjoy the show.