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You are now listening to True Murder, the most shocking killers in true crime history and the authors that have written about them. Gasey Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker DTK. Every week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host journalist and author Dan Zupanski, Good Evening, A successful young mother, Kelsey Beareth, vanishes on Thanksgiving Day twenty eighteen. The FBI is afraid they'll have to do a deal
with the devil to find her. Kelsey, a pilot's so good she taught the military how to fly, goes shopping at a Safeway store, and simply disappears. Her fiance, Patrick Frazzi, says he doesn't have a clue. In fact, he says they broke up just a few days before. He's as mystified as everyone else. But Kelsey's mother, Cheryl, is afraid she knows what happened to her daughter. A task force of FBI and the Colorado Bureau of Investigation agents believe
they also know what happened to Kelsey. They have cell phone records and more, including surveillance video and DNA, but they have run into a roadblock. The agents have to get someone close to the killer to flip and turn state's evidence. Are they going to have to do a deal with the devil to find justice for Kelsey Beareth? The murder of Kelsey Beareth a shocking true crime story is a riveting story of a young woman's disappearance, her family's will to find out what happened, in a twenty
first century police investigation that nearly cracks the case. Why open nearly? Will the FBI do a deal with the devil to solve this crime? The book that we're featuring this evening is The Murder of Kelsey Beareth, a shocking true crime story with my special guest, journalist and author Rod Cackley. Welcome to the program, and thank you very much for this interview.
Rod Cackley, Hi, Dan, thanks for having me. I appreciate it.
Thank you so much. Thank you for coming on and talking about your latest The Murder of Kelsey Bareth. Let's start right away. I won't ask you why you decided to write this book because it's just obvious. This is such a compelling and incredible story that had a lot of media attention. Let's talk about how you open this book. This is November twenty second, twenty eighteen, and we taught we introduced Patrick Frazzi, if that's the pronunciation of his name.
But there's a Thanksgiving dinner November twenty second that they planned. Tell us who all attends this dinner and just tell us a little bit about Patrick and his relationship with his mother. Tell us a little bit about the characters, Sean, his family, Sheila. Tell us a little bit about these characters that are assembling for November twenty second, twenty eighteen.
Sure, Dan, glad to do it. We've got Sean Prosey or Prazy. I've always pronounced it crazy, but I don't know for sure, but Sean Frazy. His mother, Sheila, and Sean's wife are going to be in a Thanksgiving Day dinner. They're waiting for Patrick. Patrick and his mother, Sheila. They live together on a ranch. It's quite a nice ranch. They have horses. They are horse ranchers. Basically, Sean is married, he has a wife, kids, and he lives where he
works in Colorado Springs. He's a Colorado Springs police officer. Patrick, on the other hand, is single, but he's hooked up with his and Kelsey Barraf we met online. Sheila lives alone with Patrick. Sheila's husband, Patrick and Shawn's father died in August, just a few months before this dinner. And as we look at the dinner, they are waiting for Patrick to show up. The dinner was supposed to begin at about three point thirty and Patrick's not there yet. It's already four o'clock.
Right now, so they decide to carry on with dinner. And during the dinner, Patrick calls again again. He lives with his mother and he's expected to be there, so people are surprised that he is not there. And also he's supposed to show up with his fiance and his daughter's one year old daughter, Kaylee. So tell us about the phone call during dinner, what does he say?
The family without Patrick, Kayley and Kelsey, they sat down to have dinner. Thirty minutes after they sat down, the homes Landline rings Patrick. He promised to join them, but he says, I will be late now. Sean's eyes roll. Sean is a family man, he's a police officer. He thinks Patrick's behavior is just outlandish. This is Thanksgiving Day dinner, after all. Sean says he's already late. After Sheila, his mother, tells him that Patrick will be there, but he'll be late.
He's already late, says Sean, saying he'll be here as soon as possible. Sheila says, and he's bringing little Kayley, the one year old daughter. What about Kelsey, asks Sean's wife. Sheila looked her way and with a slight mod smile, rolls her eyes and says, no, Kelsey won't be here.
Now. You talked about a little bit about the relationship with Sean and Patrick, and you right that they had been slightly estranged for many years and had gone different paths. Completely. Tell us a little bit about the relationship between Sheila and Kelsey, and also what Kelsey's mother felt about Patrick.
Yeah, Patrick, Well, to begin with, let's talk about Kelsey's mother and Patrick. They don't get along. She can't understand. She doesn't think that Patrick is treating Kelsey right, can't understand why they don't have a place together. They live separately. Even though they're engaged, they live and they live separately. Shell his mother or her mother, Kelsey's mother thinks they should be living together. The relationship between Kelsey and Sheila,
Patrick's mother is worse, much worse. The first time they meet, Sheila calls Kelsey a prostitute. Then she calls her a hooker. This is bad right now. They were able to work this out a little bit, but they have a bad relationship. Kelsey wants to be part of the family. She can't understand why she was treating her like this, but Sheila just does not want her in her house. She does not want her with her son Patrick.
Now, regardless of the family animosity there, and Kelsey still wants to make this work and believes that this is the man that's going to be in a relationship. They have a child together, and in fact, on November twentieth, a couple of days before Thanksgiving, Kelsey sends a text to her boss at Joss Aviation. What exactly does he What's the gist of the message to her boss.
Basically, she basically on November twentieth, two days before Thanksgiving, she tells her boss that she couldn't be happier and she's very happy, in fact, because Patrick has agreed to go to the company Christmas party with her, something she wasn't expecting.
Right so that it's for all accounts, And she tells her friends as well, whether they believe it or not, that this is she's in love and that she feels very confident about this relationship. Right now. You introduced another character, and her name is Crystal Lee Kenny, and she's a nurse from Idaho. Now she has also had a relationship before Kelsey became came into the picture. And tell us about this relationship she has with Patrick.
Yeah, and tell Crystal and Patrick go back a long way for pretty much a decade. Crystal met Patrick and started playing around with him. Well she was married. Patrick got Krystel pregnant, told her to get an abortion, which she did. Then he told her to get a divorce, which she did. All with the promise, sometimes explicit and sometimes implied that they would get married and have a life together. They never got married, they never had a
life together. They split up, They didn't talk to each other for a couple of years, but still bumped into Patrick and it all started over again. Even though by the way they got divorced. She a Crystal and her husband Chad. Even though they got divorced, they still live together and raise their kids together, which presents another interesting dynamic in this story.
And the thing is too, is that he had asked her to get divorced and they hooked up again. But then he told her, listen, I have a meta woman. I'm now going to be I'm engaged to be married, and I have a child. And this is all from the woman that he has to be divorced, asked her to get a divorce, a bored a child, change her life. Just to show just a state of mind that for of Crystal Lee Kenny to some degree. Now, let's talk about it.
Go ahead, Oh, I was gonna say. The thing is, she knows it shouldn't be this way. She knows this is a bad relationship that she just can't say no to.
Patrick m let's talk about at the same time. It's this November twenty second Thanksgiving dinner a neighbor of Kelsey, and this is across the street in the same neighborhoods as Kelsey's condo. And this is Leslie Jackson, and she has had a situation where she believes that she needs surveillance camera, so she has a sophisticated three camera surveillance set up. But one of the cameras is focused on
her neighbor's door, which happens to be Kelsey's condo. Now on Leslie's at her mother's house on Thanksgiving, but the phone has the app connected to this surveillance. So tell us a little bit about what Leslie Jackson just notices while she's at Thanksgiving dinner with her mother.
The phone is on the side and it starts buzzing coming indicating that there's activity on the camera and it's taking pictures. What's happening. As you said, one of the cameras is focused on Kelsey's front door, and so Lethie knows something's going on at the neighbor's house or at her house. But then when she checks the film, she finds out it's the pictures are all firm Kelsey's front door.
That's where the action's happening. It's Thanksgiving Day, so she doesn't really look at it too much and doesn't get too concerned about it because it is Thanksgiving Day and she doesn't want to interrupt dinner with her mother, but she can tell that something's going on at Kelsey's s front door at her turn door.
Now, this is November twenty fifth, three days after November twenty second, and Kelsey's mother, Cheryl, and her brother Clint. Kelsey's brother Clint had sent texts but hadn't heard and then called but hadn't heard from Kelsey since November twenty second from Thanksgiving from a text that they had received at that time, and I well, Cheryl had spoken to her daughter earlier, and they'd spoken about making cinnamon buns
and talking about Thanksgiving itself. So November twenty fifth. Now it's December first, and mom Cheryl has not and Clint have not heard from her. So what's the conversation December first with Cheryl and Clint and what do they decide to do?
Well, Cheryl and Clint are very close with Kelsey. This is a very tight knit family. But they know they have the fealing something's wrong. But then again, see, remember Kelsey is a pilot. We haven't really touched down there, but she's a pilot, so she often flies and is often gone from her turndal for days at a time, so they have to so they don't automatically assume something's wrong.
But still they are concerned. So Cheryl reaches out to Clint. Clint, from his home near Tacoma, Washington, goes to Cheryl's place in northern Idaho. Together, they fly to Colorado and then drive a rental car to Woodland Park to her contra Kelsey's condo to see for themselves what's going on? Now?
What do they notice right away? Some of the things that they notice right away unusual for her, So tell us all the things that they notice, just obvious things that they can deduce from going into that condo and taking a look around.
Yeah, they have the key. So they go into this two bedroom, one bath condo and the first thing they noticed right away is the thermostatus set of seventy two degrees. Cheryl and the brother Clint, they wonder, now, why would anyone set their thermostad at seventy two if they knew they were going to be gone for a few days. Then they look into the kitchen and they find out
they find rather a plate of cinnamon roles. Remember, as you said, Cheryl and Kelsey had talked about Chelsea making a plate of cinnamon rolls to take over to Sheila and Patrick's house for Thanksgiving Day. The plate of cinnamon rolls is sitting on the counter in the kitchen. No, it's not covered, nobody. Why would Kelsea do that if she was leaving for a few days and the cinnamon rolls are rock hard. They've been sitting there obviously since
the morning of Thanksgiving Day when they were made. You could hammer nails of these things, Cheryl thought, and Clint said, they must have been left out for days. You know that she was making them Thanksgiving morning. Then they go into they look at the floors, the chen. It's perfectly clean. This place is spotless. What young mother, a working mother with a one year old girl, is going to have
a spotless home. It's obviously they had an intense cleaning in that condo sometime between Thanksgiving Day and the day December first that they're there. It's just not like her at all. But at the same time, there are piles of dirty clothes everywhere, So there's this real paradox of what they're finding. They opened a closet door in the hallway and they find Kelsey's luggage. Why would she be gone for a few days a week and then leave her luggage in the closet. They go into the bathroom,
they find her toothbrushes. There, they find her makeup kit. Is there all of these signs they're showing you that, or showing them rather that if Kelsey left, she certainly didn't plan to leave and didn't plan to be going for a long time.
Now you say that Cheryl doesn't like and doesn't get along with Patrick, but she thinks her next move certainly should be to call Patrick and see what he knows and talk to him, so she certainly gets him on the phoney answers. Tell us about this quite odd conversation.
It was a very odd conversation because Cheryl thinks that if nothing Elseatrick at least must know where Kelsey is. He doesn't have a clue. As a matter of fact, he says, Cheryl, I would not know because we broke up. And Cheryl says, no, wait a minute, she told me you were going to get married. She was very happy. I talked to her in the morning of Thanksgiving Day and she gave me no clue, and she actually said that you were going to go to the Christmas party,
the company Christmas party. And Patrick says, no, I haven't seen her for a couple of weeks, and I haven't talked to her for a couple of weeks. I have no idea where she is.
Yeah, and so, but she can't believe his response, but she says things like, come on, Patrick, you haven't seen her in two weeks, and neither have I or anyone else. All right, but he still she implores him to help her in searching for this woman that he said he loved just and everyone thought they were ready to be married.
Right.
What does he say, no, sponsor that? Yeah?
Yeah, Cheryl says, can't you at least reach out and call her, call her and find out where she is, call her and find out if anything's wrong. And Patrick says, I don't think she's gonna want to talk to me. And Cheryl says, please just call Chelsea, the woman you you know, the mother of your child. Can't you call her? He goes, Okay, okay, I'll call her, but I'm going to take care of my talles first.
Yeah, sure, m hm.
Now it was time to call the police, as far as Cheryl.
The absolutely, So she calls h Woodland Park Police and she talks to a corporal Dina Curran. So what does Dina Kerran do in response to this?
Well, remember too, when they were in the condo, we should mention if they found blood in the bathroom, stocks in the bathroom, and so now it's definitely time to call the police, uh Kurran. Corporal Curran says, well, she calls Patrick and talks to Patrick about Chelsea and can't understand either why he want Paul Kelsey. Patrick admits that Cheryl called him a few days ago and told him that she couldn't find Kelsey. Chelsea was not replying to
any texts or phone calls. And then Patrick admits to the corporal that we were engaged, but we aren't anymore. We had a real heart to heart before Thanksgiving, he sighs, and you know, he gives her the impression that Chelsea dugged him and the relationship just wasn't working, or from different backgrounds, it just didn't work out. He says that really it wasn't a lover's quarrel. He returned everything that
Kelsey had in his home. He'd given back a gun, an extra car key, and even this handgun to Chelsea. So this raises a flag with corporal current. She asks if either one of them had been depressed. We've got a gun in the mix now, he says no. He explains that they've met online on a dating app and send her a text. He says in November twenty fifth, and he was looking at it on his phone as he was talking to the police corporal and he wrote,
he texted, do you even love me? But he says, told Cheryl he hadn't heard from Chelsea for a couple of weeks. Well, now I'm telling the police officer that he texted her and was expecting a response on November twenty fifth.
Right, let's use this as an opportunity to stop for these messages.
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Now Rod, we are now December fourth and twenty eighteen, and Ray Seabring is the boss at dos Aviation and Kelsey hasn't been at work, but he had received a message in November twenty fifth something about she couldn't come in because grandma was sick. What does he believe when he talks to Cheryl when what does he believe about that text?
Yeah? Yeah, he's not totally suspicious because, as he says, people do get Now she called in, say or texted in six I guess I guess you could say called off. And you know, he says, people do get sick. But then he looks at the text, the wording of the text, and Ray says, look at this. Kelsey never puts a comma after my name in a text. She always uses an exclamation point that wasn't in the text. So right away she's thinking something's wrong because she wrote her text
to him was Hirayama, it was a great day. Dot dot got happy Thanksgiving to you too. Read the message again, no exclamation point, and she put a comma after his name, So he's thinking that something's wrong there and again and she always put the little smiley faces in that people put in their text. Sometimes in this text there are no smiley faces. So again that's kind of a red flag to him.
And Cheryl had received texts and again she didn't believe that it sounded like her daughter at all.
Did she write again again, there are we all have the way that we text, and it's almost like a fingerprint in a way. Uh, the Kelsey's texts suddenly I'm changed. Cheryl's noticing things that are wrong with the text. She received a text, for instance, from Kelsey's phone which read I'm tied up. I'll call you later. But Kelsey never once told me that Patrick, and never once told her rather that she and Patrick were having fights or problems.
Mm hmm. Now, the Woodland Park police had been inside Kelsey's condo in it presented some problems because they never really found anything very enough. There wasn't enough aside from the small drops of blood on the toilet, you say, but there was no forced entry or sign of struggle. But they did research the place, and you say that they left with an iPad, a notebook with passwords, and a Safeway receipt purchased November twenty second. But you say
that you write that there. The Colorado Bureau of Investigation joins the case, right.
This is where the CBI gets into the case. And this is where it gets really interesting because they bring in technology that was not available to the Woodland Park Police. And part of this technology isn't really technology. Has dogs. They bring in some Cadine dogs to sniff through the place. They want to there's a two thousand and six toiluret of Corolla and their red Chevy Silverado pickup in the driveway of Chelsea's house or Turndo, and so they want
to do a dog search. Our dog train defines human remains and they also talk to sh Cheryl. Of the agents Greg Slater and Kevin Torres. They talked to Cheryl for the first time and she tells them that even when she was younger, she never ran away from home. Kelsey, I mean, I'm referring to Kelsey here. So the fact that she has disappeared is totally totally, you know, you know, out of bounds for her, but she talks to them too about the text messages that she has been getting.
She tells the agents that the sentences were all wrong. Kelsey always writes her texts in complete sentences. These messages have incomplete sentences or the messages have incomplete sentences with the live abbreviations that Kelsey never used. So the CBI rather is getting a little more concerned about this. They
go into the Corolla. They don't find anything at the pickup truck, but then they go into the Corolla with his dog and Lucy is her name, the dog's name, which is like in the ninety to ninety five percentile among her CA nine colleagues accuracy. This dog just doesn't make mistakes and she drops right down on the pavement. The dog picks up something from outside that Corolla that shows her that either you've got that human remains here of some kind is what the dog minds.
Yeah now still December fourth, twenty eighteen, Patrick's brother Sean, he's a police officer. Even without that, he knows something is wrong with Patrick. He Patrick had called him to meet, which was in himself unusual, and the day before they had a weird conversation and he told Patrick told Sean that Kelsey is missing, so they have a conversation. Tell us about the gist of this conversation between Patrick and Sean.
Yeah, Patrick tells call Sean the day before the December third and tells he just drops his bombshell that Kelsey has missed out of nowhere. So they arranged to meet. They don't meet at a home. They don't meet at Sean's house, They don't meet at Patrick where Patrick lives with his mother and the family home. They meet in a parking lot, of all places. So Sean, being a
police officer, his suspicions and raised right away. Patrick tells Sean that he and Kelsey have broken up, and Sean says, well, if you've broken up, how do you know that Kelsey's missing? If you haven't talked to her, if you haven't been around her. Her mom called, He's explains, and Cheryl said, no one's seen her. Says Thanksgiving. But no, wait a minute, Sean says, Thanksgiving, didn't you see Kelsey when you picked up Kayley? Remember that was the story on the phone. Okay.
Then Patrick's quiet, but he starts breathing very heavily, and you know the police officer. Sean knows that this guy is lying. Well, her grandmother was sick. Patrick said, I know that, so she's going to visit her. And Sean says, wouldn't your mother have known that? I mean, this is really a a brother, the brother's sibling interrogation, if you will, Michean can't help himself. He's a cop. This is what
he does. And Patrick, you know the old saying that you know the tangled web we weave when one persons begin to de see. This is what Patrick is finding out. Now, He's getting stuck in this web of lies, in this web of deceit that he started spinning from Thanksgiving Day. Then another police officer shows up. A Woodland Park police officer shows up. He's been looking for Patrick if he wants his cell phone. You know the cell phones. I mean you're always being watched that you have no privacy
when you're holding a cell phone. Okay, people can find out where you are by your phone calls. The Woodland Park police officer wants Patrick's phone, doesn't have a warrant, but he says, this time I'm asking next time it'll be different. Sean is a brother police officer, and he advises Patrick just to turn over the phone.
Yeah, December fourth, twenty and eighteen. You're right that Patrick needs a phone. He needed to make a call. So he goes to see his friend. And we didn't introduce his friend yet, Joseph Paul Moore. And he's a cattleman as well, and he considers Patrick like a little brother.
Yeah, he calls him a step kid. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Joseph Moore and Patrick go way back years and years, even longer than Patrick's relationship with Crystal. Okay, And so he goes to Joseph's house to borrow a cell phone to use his phone. He says, I need to use your phone. Got to talk to somebody about some horses. Joseph, because they're such good friends, this is unusual, but he still doesn't hesitate. He hands over the phone to Patrick.
But again he's wondering, who doesn't have a phone these days? And if you lose the phone, don't you just go buy a burner or just get another phone to the place it Who walks around the metal phone and asks to borrow a phone these days? So he gives Patrick the phone anyway, and then walks away to give him a little bit of privacy, but he does overhear Patrick say, if I get arrested because they had taken my phone,
I'm going to have my friend here call you. It'll be from this number, So come and get these horses. And of course he is referring to Joseph because he's on Joseph's phone, right. The person on the other end is a lot more talking than Patrick, so Joseph can't hear that, but obviously he's getting more and more suspicious, and minutes are clicking by on Joseph's phone. Finally, Patrick slaps the phone shut and gives it back to his friend, says thanks, Buddy, gets into his fluck and drives away,
and then that's it. He doesn't say anything more than Joseph. So Joseph starts thinking, who the heck's he calling on my phone?
You know?
So he looks it up and he doesn't recognize the number, but he does recognize the area code two eight Idaho calling somebody in Idaho. Yeah.
Now, the next day, December fifth, twenty eighteen. Now we're at the Credit Unions in Woodland Park and Patrick is there. He wants to speak to the manager. Now, what does he want to speak to the manager about December fifth.
Yeah. Now this credit union, the Federal Credit Union on Paradise Lodge, laying at Woodland Park. This is where he and Kelsey have accounts. He walks in. He doesn't look nervous, but he wants to talk to the manager. And what he wants is He asks her, is it possible to get a copy of what your surveillance camera recorded on November twenty second? The manager, Patricia can't understand why you would want that. They looked at her and says, you know who I am? I mean, who says that you
know who I am? Yeah? And she nods yes. She says, well, I use the ATM that day and I need to get a copy of the tape show the police where I walk us. That way I can prove that they should stop thinking of me as a suspect in Kelsey's disappearance, he says. And Patricia just can't believe this. She's trying to get this guy out of her office as smoothly and quietly as possible, So she tells him that. She says,
why would she want that tape? Why would you need to show the police where you were on November twenty second, if Kelsey had talked to her mom three days after that on the twenty fifth, because he told her that Kelsey called her mom on the twenty fifth, And so she knows something's wrong here. She's really tense and she sees this rage flash through Patrick's face. Now other people have mentioned this too, that he just flips the trigger,
flips a switch and pulls the trigger. He just gets intensely angry, and she sees it, and she backs up, and she all she wants now is to get him out of there before she gets hurt. And she explained to him that the tape is no good. They recycle the tapes every day, so there's no evidence of what was happening on November twenty seconds and finally he leaves. He slams the you know, slams the door, Pulson door open, yanks the door open, let it slam behind him, gets
in his car, slams the door shut. He speeds off. Well. Patricia, the bank manager of the credit union manager, she calls the police right away, and as soon as the detective picks up, she says, you aren't going to believe who was just here?
Yeah, now you talk about still days later Tanya Atkinson, the crime scene analyst from Colorado Bureau of Investigation, spends the afternoon looking for bloodstains in the condos. There's also she realizes the bath mat is missing, the fridge has been wiped down, then does various tests in the washroom itself, bloodstains found throughout the bathroom, blood everywhere basically, and determine that it's likely foul play. Now on December eleventh, Patrick
now is again desperate. He goes to the Verizon store and again he says, do you know who I am?
Right?
And what does he ask the people at the Horizon store to do?
He talks to a guy by the name of David Feller. Can He's staring the heck out of this guy, just like he did with Patricia. But what he wants to know is if you smash a cell phone up, does that ruin it? Does that make it so that nobody can tell who you've talked to? Does that ruin the system that records who you talk to? And David says what He says, well, can I see your phone? And Patrick says, well, I don't have the phone with me.
The phone's not here. David says he says. He tells Patrick that he can't do anything without the PIN number. But now David knows who Patrick is too, He knows this is a guy. Everybody knows everything in Woodland Park about this case. And so Patrick says, now I had a busted up phone, if it was broken or damaged like somebody smashed with a hammer, would you be able to get information off of it, like a call record or something. And David says, I really can't tell you
anything without that pin. So then he says, will you excuse me, David, this is David says, will you excuse me? I have to use the bathroom. He just goes into the bathroom and locks the door and sits in the door in the bathroom, praying that Patrick will just leave, which he does. Patrick finally gets tired of waiting and
just takes off. So David grabs his phone still in the bathroom, mind you, and calls to the police and says, Patrick frazy was just here and tells the cop what happened the cop on the phone, and the police officer says, well, you'll be getting a call from somebody at the district's
attorney's District attorney's office I can guarantee you that. So again, Patrick, you know, he's trying to get out of this, he's trying to build an alibi for himself or or you know, but every step he takes, he's just in deeper and deeper into this problem.
Absolutely. Now, meanwhile, we talked about this twenty first century approach with the FBI and the CBI, and you write about this Celebrate technology. Tell us about this technology and what they do to be what they are able to determine as a result of this using this technology.
The Celebrate is from an Israeli a digital intelligence company. It's a subsidiary of Sun Corporation in Japan. They've got a US division. And what this Celebrate technology does and let's police get into cell phones, drones, computers to pull out info. Okay, so nothing again is private. Now they've got patrick cell phone and so they can use this Celebrate technology on this to find out who he's been calling,
but more importantly where the phone was used. So they can look at November twenty first, for instance, there's an indication of movement or they're looking at the cameras too. They also have cameras from the neighbor's homes and they're looking at the pictures there. But this deelibride technology shows them exactly where Patrick's phone was, and it will show them too where Kelsey's phone was.
Now with that as well, they they have found some interesting things about the location of of Crystal's phone and of Kelsey's phone. So tell us about what they determined from this about those phones and their locations.
Yeah, with the with crystals in Kelsey's phone, they find that somehow Kelsey's phone is going toward Idaho, you know, with the with the towers that it clicks off of, they see that Kelsey's phone is going toward Idaho. And it was last used in a in an area that is totally isolated, totally remote, and would have had to gone off of a gully, so she would have had to make this call and then just simply vanished from the middle of nowhere.
And she had also said that she was having a conversation, that Crystal was having a conversation with Patrick or the part of me it wasn't having a conversation. That they had spent the day together on the twenty fourth, and then on the twenty fifth they had departed. She had she had left, so that lend no credence to what
they were saying. In in fact, that they we're putting the phone, Kelsey's phone with Crystal, putting those two people together, whereas obviously Kelsey and Crystal were not together in the same vehicle, and that obviously she was not able to be with Patrick on November twenty fourth and actually be on the telephone at the same time.
Yeah, right, you see the thing is she said that this is let's jump over to December fourteenth. The FBI is talking to her. They're very interested in Crystal and what she remember about the twenty fourth of November. Now the FBI, there are two FBI agents in the room with Crystal and they're interviewing her back and forth, back
and forth. So she really is unsettled. But she's got this story that she and Patrick worked out together that just is not making any sense because it doesn't jive with what they've learned about the phones from the cell
phone towers as to where she was. For instance, she says that she was on the she was with Patrick in his house most of the day, but they have phone records that show she called Patrick and they had a phone conversation and when was the last time you had a phone conversation with someone you were in the same house with.
Yeah, she was asked even if she ever had met met Kelsey. What was her response?
Yeah, she said she never met Kelsey, didn't even know anything about her, didn't know her name. As a matter of fact, as she put it to the FBI in Oh, no, never. I didn't even know she existed until I started reading the stories about her disappearance. One of the fbiations said, but you knew Patrick had a daughter with another woman. Sure, And then another agent says, and you never thought even once to ask the man you love to tell you the name of the brother of his child. So again,
they're getting her. They're trapping her here. You know, this is a very pleasant conversation, but the questions get nailed deeper and deeper. I mean, the coss nails just go deeper and deeper every time she answers.
Yeah. So they get her to lie and mislead police completely, and then she's wedded to those statements after this interview though. It was a masterful I believe, because Crystal thinks and tells Patrick, what about the interrogation, She's a question.
No, worries. She says, she aced it. They've got nothing, no worries. She said that she handled it beautifully. They let her believe that she handled it beautifully. But you know, the agents say, point out that Patrick and Crystal spoke on the phone three times the morning of November twenty fourth,
and two more times that afternoon. However, Crystal told the FBI that she and Patrick had been together in his house that day, and again the FBI says, now, when was the last time you picked up a phone and called somebody who they were in the same house with you. It shows Crystal's phone was connected to the tower at the Colorado Utah border at four thirteen am, at four seventeen am, and four to twenty three am on November twenty fifth. And guess whose phone was connected to the
same tower way out in the middle of nowhere. Patrick's, no Kelsey's, So she had Kelsey's phone on her way out in the middle of nowhere on November twenty fifth, even though she told the f the are she had never met Kelsey, so the two of them couldn't have been in the black car. She borrowed the car a black cart, so the two of them could not have been in a car together. They couldn't have been with
each other. She didn't even know her on November twenty fifth, supposedly, but actually they were out in the middle of nowhere at the Colorado Idaho border. At least Chelsea's phone was out in the middle of nowhere at the Colorado Idaho border.
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com slash murder to start your Ritual today. Now, we talked about the law closing in on Patrick and Crystal, and so there was other people that came forward and in their investigation and that was they spoke to somebody the ex husband of Crystal, and that's Chad Lee. What did Chad Lee have to say to officials and authorities about his wife?
Chad, this is a really interesting dynamic because, as we said, he's or sees the ex husband, but he and Crystal and their children all live together. They raised the kids together, so he obviously has quite an interest, maybe more of an interest than the average ex husband would have in the ex wife. He knows that something's going on, and that's why he was more than happy to talk to the FBI. And he says, Crystal lied to me about what she was doing those two days, November twenty fourth
and November twenty fifth. The FBI guys are very interested now. Crystal told him that she was going to a friend's house for a birthday part of those days, but then she changed her story and says she was going to another house, the home of Megan Garrison, another friend. Both of these women, all these women live in Idaho, Okay. And that's important because remember where the cell phone was. And then this is where Crystal borrows a car, and for some reason she needs another car. She can't use
her She's always coming up with new stories. Chad says, she swore this was the truth. She told me that she was really in Colorado looking at a horse with Patrick. So again she said that she was with her friends, but now she says she was with Patrick looking at a horse, and they own this horse together. Chad says, so that part is believable. But Cristel also told him
that somebody had set her up. And what she mean by that, She says, there's a whole new set of lies, you see that Crystal is telling, just like Patrick is telling all these lies. Cristel is telling all of these lies. But that really isn't that unusual for her? That, Chad says. And then we get into the.
Go ahead.
Then we get into her phone and the fact and whether she has a Verizon phone or a Samsung phone. There's all these different flags of suspicion that are being raised for the FBI.
M M. Yeah, they realized that the same day the agent seized Patrick's phone, Crystal had used that phone while speaking to an FBI agent about case, about the case itself, So she was busted with that phone, and she purchased a new one on December fourth. So right at that odd timing, now you write that it is time to bring now that the authorities have much more information. They've spoke to Chad Lee and they've also spoke to Crystal, and they know what's true and what isn't. Basically, it
was time to bring Crystal Lee in again. So how do things change this time in the interrogation or interview?
Yeah, yeah, now this time, you know, December twenty twenty eighteen. They have a lot of evidence, but it's all circumstantial. They really cannot and they don't have a body. That's a really important part of the story. They do not have a body, which makes it even tougher to prosecute a homicide. Obviously, the FBI is ready to do a plea bargain. But to do a plea bargain, they have
to get Crystal to admit to what happened. So they sit down with Crystal and her attorney, wondering, of course, how forthcoming.
She will be.
But this is where they really show Crystal that they under that they know she lied. This is where the FBI lays more cards on the table, and this is where they get her to talk and talk not only about what she did, but her history with Patrick and Kelsey.
What does she tell I mean, They've they've hearing things from other witnesses as well. They have a Michelle Stein that has said some things. And as the investigation goes, they're hearing about what Patrick had said to Crystal about the potential murder of Kelsey. What does she Crystal tell the authorities about Patrick asking and requesting for her to kill and some of those details.
Yeah, Patrick Patrick at least twice, probably three times, asked Crystal to kill Kelsey, according to Crystal. One time he told her to buy a cell phone that couldn't be traced back, called it a Burger phone. He explained how he could kill how she could kill Kelsey. One idea was to put poison in Kelsey's coffee. She loves Starbucks coffee, and so they figured as long as she had a coffee, and Patrick figured as long as she had coffee, she
would drink it. Crystal couldn't do that. Then he gave her a pipe, a steel pipe to beat her to death with. And she actually went and sat across the street from Kelsey's a condo and watched Kelsey get out of her car and go into the condo. But Crystal just couldn't bring herself to go over there and beat Kelsey to death with a metal pipe. Then, so she
brings the pipe back to Patrick. He gives her a baseball bat and says, do it with the baseball bat if that makes you feel better, And he says, after you use the bat, just dragged the body out to the dumpster or figures some other way to get rid of Well, Crystal didn't do that. Again. She goes to Kelsey's house and she's got the bat. She sits on the curb across the street from the front door, and all she can think about is how did I get
into this mess? How did I get here? She goes back to Patrick explains that she couldn't do it, that she couldn't kill Kelsey, and he says, well, you must have a softer heart than I have for a businesssion I have.
Yeah. What is he referring to in terms of what were the reasons for Patrick wanting to kill Kelsey? How did he justify the reasons for killing her?
He said that Kelsey was abusing Kayley. Crystal told the FBI that he told her that Kelsey had actually hit Kayley with an iron, you know, a clothing iron. Yeah, And so he is saying that she's abusing the kid, and he has to get that kid out of there to save her from this abuse.
Now part of this plea agreement if they're going to have a plea agreement, and they need her for this plea agreement because there is no body they need this kind of witness, and they know, they believe that they can get the information from her. And that's what this plea bargain is that the attorney has met with her and she has revealed certain information to that attorney. Now they want to know and they need to know details
of the actual murder itself. And so she gives a graphic account of what actually happened, the actual murder to these police at that time, doesn't she?
Yeah, because Patrick holds her what happened. No, Patrick wanted her to go clean up Chelsea's condo where she found all kinds of evidence. But yeah, she Patrick told her that what he did was to put a sweater around Kelsey's face and say that they were going to play a game, that he would light different scented candles and that then she would say what scented was or what candle it was. Kelsey. Again, this is a case of
Chelsea thinking something's wrong here. That's kind of weird, but she doesn't say no to Patrick, because if there's anything that Kelsey has in common with Crystal, it's that she can't say no to Patrick. So Patrick puts a sweater around your face to blind your eyes, lights a candle, then steps back. Kelsey steps back, comes back in with a baseball bat and starts beating her to death with the baseball bat.
When he was beating her with this baseball bat previous for her to find this information out, Crystal was a signed to go to the Kelsey's condo. She knew where it was, obviously she'd been outside go there with the complete outfit to clean up. She knew that she was going to clean up something like murder. She was a nurse. She knew from all the blood that was all over the place. But he had instructed her, because of the baseball bat beating, to look for something specifically that he
may have lost. What was that and what did already SEEBI and FBI agents already have in their position?
Yeah, now, he told her to find a tooth. He was afraid that one of the teeth that he had knocked out of Chelsey's head had fallen down in air vents and and Fristol did find it, as she says to the FBI, she found the tooth of root and all, so, I mean just he knocked it completely on of her head.
The agents believed that because they had searched the house, Sheila's house where she and Patrick were living, and now Chayley, by the way, he is living there too, and they found an envelope with four teeth in it.
Yeah, now with this plea agreement, it's amazing the restraint that these you know, the district attorney has, these authorities have when they're listening to this tale. They're asking her for again clarification that they are going to have a deal, and she is crying and she's emotional, but they are trying to find out how on earth and why on earth she didn't go to the authorities before all of this. How could she have lived with this? Don't they?
Yeah, they do. They can't understand that. And Crystal composes herself and looks at them and says, but I left you clues, she shouted, as a matter of fact, as she stood up from her chair. I left blood on the toilet and on the rock face around the fireplace. Didn't you find it? I left you clues now.
Also December twentieth, twenty eighteen, week go back to Joseph Palm and while Patrick is in is still in his desperate state, he contacts his good friend Joseph Paul Moore and maybe this is the time now for what he does say to Joseph Paul Moore, and then Joseph Paul Moore contemplating some of the bizarre conversations he's had since twenty sixteen regarding Kelsey.
Yeah, he to begin with, he starts babbling. They're driving together, about an hour and a half drive to see some horses, and Patrick says she might have gone up north to Pike to kill herself. And Joseph says, who what Pike? What are you talking about? Where did this come from? What do you think? I'm saying that she could have driven up to Pike or even Isabel National Forest and
killed herself in the woods. You could die in the woods and they wouldn't find you for years, for hundreds of years, maybe a thousand years before they found you. And Joseph doesn't understand what he's talking about, but then he knows. He's been reading the paper. I mean, they've had reports on this the paper of the TV and Joseph says, the cops got a ping off her cell phone from a cell tower in Idaho. Why would Kelsey go to Idaho and then back to Colorado and go
into the forest to commit suicide. Why didn't she just end it all in Idaho? And you know what was different there too? He mentioned he called her Kelsey. Now that was the first time. Back when Joseph and Patrick would talk about Kelsey, they never used her name. Patrick would only refer to her as Kaye's mother or Kaylee's mom, and so you know, Patrick is just And then Patrick looks at him and says, you know, her blood might be on me, Kaylee Joe's mother, I might have her
blood on me. And Joseph said, okay, well, why wouldn't her blood be on you? Well, she had a nosebleed. She started spitting out and she had a nosebleed and got her blood on my pants and shirts and boots. Head to a nosebleed, right, And then he says, can the cops find blood in clothes after they've gone through the washer and dry And Joseph says, you know, the cops can find blood anywhere, and he was more than right about that than he knew, because that's exactly what
they did with their new technology. He says to Patrick, with their new technology, cobs can even find blood where people can't see it, and you know that is exactly what happened. And Joseph said, I just hope we find Killy Joe's mom and that she's okay. There were silence. Patrick didn't say a word to that, but then he turns to Joseph and says, why is the FBI even on this case? Why the investigation? There's no body, how can there even be a crime, and why are they
even after me? What do they think they're going to find a Couple of days later, he's still frantic. I mean, he's friended. He's totally paranoid, and he calls Joseph and says, do you think our phone calls are taped? Are we being recorded? And Joseph says, why would we be doing that? And then Patrick says, now this is a weird question. Is anything disrupted by the red Barn just says disrupted? What are you talking about? So you can see the conversation.
He's getting so frantic, he's losing touch with reality.
In a way.
Yeah.
Yeah, And he also said a very important quote at the end too. Man, if I'd known it would have blown up this big, I never would have And he just didn't continue. He just that was the end of it.
Yeah, right, exactly exactly.
Now December twenty first, we have Crystal is now going to show investigators how she and Patrick on the family ranch and Fluorescence's disposed of Kelsey's body. So now there is more information to find out on terms of the disposal of the bar of the body. So they take her. She's taken to the farm Patrick and well, Sheila's farm, the family farm. What does she show them there.
Yeah, she shows them exactly what they did. She shows them the spot where Patrick they had a black bag, a black tote bag that was holding Kelsey's body. And Crystal says that together she and Patrick picked that black toate bag up and took it over to a burntrop and she tells her top She says, I could feel
the body in there. She knew there was a human body in that black coat bag and Patrick told her in the and she also knew that the baseball bat that he used to kill Kelsey was in that thing as well, the tot's about five feet long, weighs at least one hundred pounds. They set it on the ground, and then the six garbage bags of evidence that she took out of Kelsey's condo, the crystal took out of Kelsey's condo, they put that in the burn trop as well,
and they liked the whole thing on fire. It's a galvanized steel tank about two feet wide and four feet long. They picked up wood from a pile of strap and they use that for kindling. They pour some gas. They have a few drops of gas in a gas can, and then they dump some motor oil on it and they like the thing up. Now here's the problem. It just explodes on them. The flames are way too high. The last thing they want, now this is all on Patrick's family wrench. Okay, this is the crazy family wrench.
The last thing they want is for anyone to see flames and black smoke. You how motor oil burns. They don't want flames and black smoke to be seen from the road. Obviously, somebody's gonna think something's wrong on the ranch and they're gonna call the police or the fire earth At the very least they're gonna come over to investigate.
So then Patrick and Crystal find some big pieces of corrugated metal kin, you know, the unite fat on top of a pole barn, and they use that to kind of tamp the fire down at least to keep the flames from shooting up in the flame and the smoke from shooting up.
Yes. What's most disturbing, though, and it's right out of a horror scene, horror movie, is that Crystal looks around and realizes somebody as actually you just mentioned, you know, they're trying to evade anybody seeing what they're doing, but somebody does see who is that?
Yeah? Yeah, Crystal looks behind her and she sees a woman. Somebody is looking at her, at the woman, and you're never going to believe who it is. It's Patrick's mother, Sheila. She's watched the whole thing.
Credible, credible. You take us now to the agent's escort Crystal to Kelsey's condo, and there they have seventeen minutes of a graphic description of events there and as you write, by that time they've had enough. But there is one other thing where the body was kept, and we talk about that red barn again. What was said by Crystal and what was verified by Lucy and her doghand.
Yeah, actually this time it was another dog radar And I'm a dog owner, so I want to get the names of the dogs correct here. But yeah, Patrick told Kelsey or a Crystal rounder, that he had stored the body in a red barn, on a red barn that he leases on a different piece of property. And this was quite a thing. Now, remember this tote bag is five feet long at weighs one hundred pounds. He put it over his shoulder, climbed up some ladders and put
it on top of a bail of hay. And so she tells the CBI and the FBI that they get the canine dog radar out to look, and it was his handler said he had quite a problem following the dog because the dog scrambling up the ladder in the hayveil like nobody's business, and he had a tough time. But the dog had a hit right on top of that hayveil. So they knew that that the tote bag holding Kelsey must have been on top of that hay bill and that's where he stored it.
Yeah, now there is time for an arrest, and the prosecutors are able to convince the judge that Kelsey was indeed dead, even though they couldn't produce a body, and then Patrick's officially suspected a first degree murder and in another week he's charged with he would be charged with tampering with a deceased human being a human body. Now, just tell us a little bit about the arrest, and you say that there was no media there was that a surprise for Patrick.
Yeah. Patrick clearly thought that because of the the attention that this in case it garnered in national story. He wasn't surprised when the police showed up and arrested him. He was surprised when he stepped on the front porch of his house and there was not a single reporter outside. He almost seems to be a little bit just a pointed that that there wasn't a crowd of reporters outside.
Right now as well, this is unusual for this Teller County. You say, it's the first murder in the community since twenty thirteen, so it's a big deal there.
Yeah, right, You would think that the local paper would show up, but nobody has shown up. Actually, the reporters are all waiting for a press conference. A press conference will be held and they'll get the information there.
Now, you say, you're right at this time that the biggest challenge for prosecutors is what what's the biggest challenge for the jury And for this trial itself.
They don't have a body to present to the jury. That's the biggest problem. They really cannot at this point. They still can't prove that Kelsey is dead, and.
As well, they also have to the hurdle because he's giving We haven't mentioned the details of this plea bargain, but her culpability in this is going to be open for criticism. So her credibility at this trial as the star witness is crucial, isn't it.
Yeah, Crystal is going to get off with three years. That's the plea deal. Now Patrick, we should say too that Patrick is looking at death. He could get the death penalty to make de fide not to go that way. They decided to go with wipe about parole. But Crystal
is getting off with three years. So obviously, excuse me, Patrick's attorney, a public defender, is going to point that out to the jury and make the point and try to make the point that the only reason you're testifying is to get off with the three year penalty.
Patrick meets with his attorneys and he's totally surprised that there is no wiggle room for him. They say, well, okay, the death penalty's off the table, but you're going to be looking at life without parole, so as you right, you're right. After that that, he decides to take the initiative and make sure his lawyers have more ammunition to win this case. What is his planned and who does he meet?
He meets a fellow inmate at the Teller County Jail by the name of Jacob, and who has a excuse me, figures has gang connection or knows how to get it done. And he wants Jacob to kill the witnesses. He wants him to kill Cheryl, and he actually even wants him to kill Crystal. He wants him to kill anyone who might testify against him at that trial, right, And you
know his attorneys also, I wanted to mention too. His attorneys told him that they were not going to present any witnesses in his defense, and Patrick says, well, what about character witnesses? And the attorney the attorney looks at him, and says, honestly, we have not been able to one person in Woodland Park. He doesn't believe that you're capable of murder.
Yeah, incredible, And what does and how does he communicate? Like they have a conversation somehow in this prison and so he tells them, listen, you're my best shot. He believes that this gang member, because he is a gang members, is unlike the other guys in this little Teller County. He's not in a federal prison. So he has to look for people that he believes have the ability to do this kind of murderous conspiracy for him to take out all these people, and he's even offering them, well,
whatever I can give you. He's also claimed to this Jacob Bentley person. When the guy asked him, did you smoke your wife? He says, no, no, I'm innocent. I didn't have anything to do with I don't know where she is. You have to help me. It's me and my daughter. So but how does he communicate with this Jacob Bentley which ends up being for two It is for the prosecution.
He passes in notes. He's like a kid in school of passing notes. But the problem is he's written everything down on the notes. So it's all there, and I've seen pictures of these notes and it's all scribbles and stuff. And he definitely wrote out instructions to Jacob Bentley of how to do this. He not only gave him a list of the people to kill, he wrote down ideas on how to dispose of the bodies and how to take him out to the desert. Yeah. Now, and so Jacob,
I'm sorry Jacob keeps all these notes. Not only has he experienced criminal, he's an experienced convict who knows what it takes to get off or to get a penalty, a flee deal of his own.
Now you write that it takes about a year, almost a year for this trial to come to or for it to get to trial, and we're talking about November twenty nineteen. And of course, as I mentioned, Crystal is the the star witness for this. And on the fourth day of trial she takes the stand. What does she say and how does she fare on the stand during this trial?
And this is a rough appearance. And I remember, the only hope the defense has in this is to poke holes in the prosecution case. They have no witnesses, they have no character witnesses. All they can do is poke holes. And the prosecution's case pretty much is based on Crystal lead Kenny and her testimony. They don't have a hope, so, you know, and the defense attorney just puts it to her saying, the only reason you're doing this is to get off, isn't that right? And if you are so
bothered by Kelsey's murder, then why didn't you call the police? Again, he's putting it to her, why didn't you call the police? It's a rough time on the stand for Kelsey or for Crystal rather.
And they also have before this and during this trial, they've also shown the video of Crystal helping out authorities tell them how they burnt the body, disposed of the body, every graphic detail has already been shown to the jury. And then she goes up on that stand and has to repeat that and face cross examination.
Yeah, I'm sorry, go ahead.
Well how does she fare on the stand during that kind of questioning? Relatively?
Well, you know, she relatively she did enough to convince the jury that she was telling the truth that she thought, but she really this is where her morality really came into play, and questions of her morality and she had a tough time on that witness stand. She really did.
Now, was you talk about Jacob contacting prosecution? Was this This wasn't as important to prosecution? But what did it help them in any way other than just adding to further charges other than the murder itself and charges related to the murder?
Right? No, it really did not help them as to charges related to the murder because he didn't admit anything. But Jacob being the experience, earned it criminally. He was he says he knew that he could tell now that Patrick had killed Chelsea.
Yeah, and he was also contracted to kill the district Attorney Dan May, several members of the FBI and CBI. He was Crystal, Chad Lee, Michelle Stein, Joseph Moore, his partner, Wendy Clark, and along with Cheryl Barrath, so many people he wanted killed. And he believed and he was deluded, mind you, but he was he believe believe that there was the ability to do that. As his desperation grew and grew.
Yeah, you know, that's a good word, desperation. That's what you see developing through this story all along, and just Patrick becomes more and more desperate.
Now what happens with this trial itself. It was four hours of deliberation, and that worries the defense attorneys. They didn't call any witnesses whatsoever. They made their summations. It was a you know, a fiery tirerade I guess or summation to the jury. However, four hours deliberation means usually not it doesn't fare too well for the for the defendant, does it.
No, it doesn't, And in this case that's the truth. Six men and six women. They left after less than four hours of deliberations, and that includes a break for lunch. So it was way less, probably three hours of deliberations and the jury back. The excitement was palpable. I mean, this is the biggest case Teller County has had him like forever probably and so Patrick is very emotional through this trial. Through the days of this trial, he was
very unemotional. He really fixed his gaze on the witnesses, on the jury. I mean, he tried to use this resputant s Bengali kind of attitude that he had, his ability to get people to do what he wanted. He tried to use that that psychology on the witnesses and for the prosecution and on the jury itself. And here now when the jury comes back and he's told to stand for the reading of the verdict, he almost loses it. He almost starts crying, but then he just pulls himself
together and gets control of himself again. The tension in the room is just incredible because remember they don't have a body. There's nothing guaranteed here.
Yeah, Thus Jesus is an opportunity to stop a second for these messages.
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Now you talked about his stoic attitude towards this sentencing, not wanting to show people that this bothered him. He is going to be sent to Colorado, Colorado prison. His appeals of course we'll go through. But what about Kaylee? Where did Kaylee go? Who has custody of Kaylee? Tell us about that.
Cheryl has custody of Cayley. If there's a you know, one of Cheryl's big concerns was that Patrick's family would get Kaylee. She did not want that to happen. The prosecution did not want that to happen either, So Cayley went to Cheryl, and Cheryl will raise Kaylee.
M and you say, the worst one of the worst things about this will be that someday she'll realize that her father killed her mother and that she was present for that murder.
Yeah, that's what Cheryl said. She said that, you know, the child is years away from understanding what's happened to her mother now, but some day she will have to explain, excuse me, what happened. She says, Uh, Kylee will eventually. And the thing is too we didn't mention this, but when Kelsey was beaten to death with that baseball bat in her condo, Kayley, little Kayley one year old Kayley was in the next room, and then Patrick took her
and drove her to his ranch. So and Cheryl says, some day she's going to have to know, she will realize that she was in the next room. Well, her mother was beaten to death.
Yeah, and the judge admonished for his crime said, you burned you know, Kelsey's body like trash. But also you mentioned Prosecutor Danny May said, we did a deal with the devil, and I'm not proud of that, but he wouldn't have had justice without it.
You're right, You're right. I think that's the way it is is. You know, plea bargains are never nice things and no one's ever happy with them. But in this deal, in this case, rather Kelsey would would not have had justice. You're right, Cheryl and her family would not have had justice. As Dan May put it, we did a deal with the devil, and I'm not proud of that. But Kelsey would not have had justice today without making that deal with the devil.
And you know, the for their to their credit that the defense did negotiate a very good deal for because I think knowing all these details, as anyone that's listened and anyone especially that reads this will know the culpability of her. She could have walked away many many times. Seems quite convenient that her responses and her sobbing and all that, it doesn't seem as genuine when you realize all of the things that she was privy to and
didn't do a damn thing. And her only excuse can be that I couldn't say no to Patrick, which is pretty weak. Now in that vein, she was sentenced to three years in custody, and you say, likely won't even do that. But after sixty days, what did she remarkably incredibly attempt to do. Well?
She was moved to a half wayhouse sixty days after she got good in jail. Back then, she tried to get out early because of the COVID nineteen outbreak. You know, she said, being held in close confines of a prison cell, the COVID nineteen is more transmissible that way. And remember she's a nurse, so she said, being a nurse, hey, I should be one of the frontline workers here. I should get out of prison so that I could help
these people. But you know, you said a lot about Crystal there, Dan, You know, she could have dropped a dime at any time. She was so involved with her, she could have dropped a dime at any time. And the thing is that really gets me about this story is Chlsea did not have to die. And I'm not
talking about just from November twenty second on. I'm saying that those three times that Patrick wanted Crystal or yeah, Crystal to kill Kelsey, if she had dropped the dime back then, none of this would have happened.
Yeah, And Joseph Moore actually, by the time he calls police, he has heard some bizarre things that should have well more than raised flags. The kind of statements that Patrick said regarding his child and his wife. Oh yeah, yeah, not that you would know, but there certainly were certain things that most people are definitely most people would not say. So there were warning flags for sure.
Yeah, exactly exactly. Now, let's not forget about Sheila. I mean, let's not forget about Sheila exactly. His mother watches the burning and she knew what it was too. I'm convinced that she knew exactly what happened.
What we didn't mention was again a bizarre, very vivid scene in here is when investigators were looking into this and possibly anyone else's role. They investigated a Facebook post with a Wizard of Oz theme. What was it about the Wizard of Oz that interested investigators.
Because Sheila posted yay yay, the Witch is dead and it was posted on November twenty fifth.
Yeah, was there any I mean, you don't write about any talk about any action towards Sheila for what she may have known. I mean after Cristal said that she did see Sheila witnessing right, No.
I didn't find anything related Sheila at all. I mean I went through all the search warrants, all the information that's in the search warrants, every single one of them, and there was never any mention of Sheila being culpable in this. Yeah.
Incredible, And you write about too as well as that. When Crystal was applying to go to a halfway house Kelly of a woman named Kelly Shofstyle launched a change dot org petition drive to support the block of Kelly's transfer a part me Crystal's transfer. Forty five people signed initially in forty eight hours. You write, by the end was eighty seven hundred people in the four days objected to Crystal Lee Kenny getting out earlier, and then she
will already be eligible for to get out. What is when is she eligible for placement in the halfway house again?
By the end of twenty twenty, So obviously that could have happened now and I don't I honestly don't know where she is now.
Well, it doesn't mean she did get parole, but she does have that ability to go to a halfway house, only that potentiality by the end of twenty twenty. So yeah, so she who knows, right, But public pressure always helps in this regard, doesn't it when people?
Yeah, and you know, and the thing is, Cheryl, the way that Cheryl I've written so many books where the mother is in this kind of a situation and just keeps pushing and pushing the police. And the response to the police I think in this story was from then just as well Dan May and the prosecutors of the district orney, and what they did in the story I think is laudable as well. And they were right there too when they argued to keep Crystal in custody and not to let her out. Yeah, you know.
And the thing is, it's uh, it's amazing as well, because you you really have you really have this, Uh, the potential between these two people for further mayhem was you know, you know, it's interesting that they are almost acted like a partnership, Crystal and Patrick and him being sociopathic easily to be determined, and yet when there was a deal to be made, I thought a lot of
her excuses were very convenient. We easily could have been doing a profile on two psychopathic serial killers if we were to take some of their own rational rationalizing for the murders itself, for the murder itself, if we took that out of the equation.
I think you're right. I think either of these people. I think both of these people, Patrick and Crystal. I think they both have those tendencies. They just can't appreciate the pain that others feel, which I think is kind of the foundation of a sociopath, where you just can't They can't empathize with that kind of pain. They just don't get it. They don't see anybody except themselves in what they want. Even Jacob Bentley thought that Patrick was nuts, to tell you the truth.
Yeah, it's very interesting for somebody again, you know, Patrick totally misjudge this character and thinking that because he had gang affiliations that he would go along with this again. At the same time, he wasn't facing anything very very serious, but it looked like he wanted to put this as a little assurance or insurance for himself down the road as a criminal.
He thought he was facing a fellowe quite honestly. But then when he talked to was attorney, they found out did charge had all been dropped to your this demeanor, but he had turned in the evidence already, so it's like, okay, Carlo Locke, here we go.
Yeah.
Well, it's been a fascinating interview. Thank you so much, Rod for talking about the murder of Kelsey Bareth, a shocking true crime story. For those that might want to find out more about this story, do you have a website as there an Amazon page you might want to look at.
Rodcacklei dot com k A c K L E y Rodcackley dot com. That's the best place to go.
Okay, thank you so much, Rod, It's been an absolute pleasure. You have a great evening. Talk to you again soon. Good night, Save to.
You darn Thanks a lot.
Good night,