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You are now listening to True Murder The most shocking killers in true crime history and the authors that have written about them. Gasey Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker VTK Every week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and infamous killers in true crime history, True Murder with your host journalist and author Dan Zufanski.
Good evening From the cornfields of Nebraska to the top rung. As a rising star of the adult film industry, Timothy John Boham had everything a young man could ask for, including a beautiful young daughter. The fall from the top of the ladder to the depths of prison was short and steep, as in one rash moment, with one wrong decision, Boham lost it all season. True crime writer Donna Thomas
spent countless hours with the subject Timothy John Boham. Thomas also worked for a period of time for the deceased victim John Paul Kelso. As only a gifted author such as Thomas ken, she takes the readers on this sometimes very perilous, but fascinating and entertaining journey of adult film star Timothy J. Boham aka Marcus Allen, as his thirst and hunger for fame and adulation explodes into chaos, love, loss, and murder. The book that we're featuring this evening is
intended for mature audiences. The Rise and deadly spiral of adult star Timothy J. Bohim was my special guest journalist and author Donna tom Thus, welcome to the program, and thank you for agreeing to this interview. Donna Thomas, thank you so much for having me.
I really appreciate it.
Dan, thank you very much. Finally, we have you on with this wild wild tale. Now you spent considerable time with the former Marcus Allen or the aka Marcus Allen Timothy J. Bulham. But let's take the audience back to where he grew up in this little town in Nebraska. Tell us about his parents, his family life so we can see how what his early life was and what really shaped this man that became Marcus Allen. So tell us a little bit about sure Timothy J. Buhem's life.
He grew up in Stuart, Nebraska, which is on the northern slope of Nebraska. It's about three thousand people. Even today there's only four thousand, so it's really really small even now. And he had, you know, very working class parents. His father was a long distance truck driver. He had an older sister named Catherine, and the mother and father were both very very religious, you know, fundamentalist Christians. And
his father was extremely abusive. He was an alcoholic and he spent you know, he had a very very difficult childhood, and the religion was you know, he had a real hard time with the religion. He told me that he always felt very out of place there in Nebraska. He was very small for his age, so he was teased a lot in school. He didn't gain his height until he was thirteen. He was always the smallest one in school. He was pushed in lockers, all of that kind of thing.
And then when he went home, his father, you know, would come home from a long trip and he was very abusive to not only him, but to the mother and the sister, to all of them. He was beaten terribly so and then the father, his Tim's father, died in a truck driving accident when he was only thirteen, and the mother, Susan Strong, Susan Bohim, met a man that was from Denver named Walter Strong, and she eventually would remarry him, and then the family relocated to Denver.
So then by the time he was in Denver. By the time he moved to Denver, he was just right out of high school. Now I skipped a little part there. He had a girlfriend that he was very seriously involved with, and she was African American and that caused a lot of strife in the family. That she was one of very few there in Nebraska. Even now there's very few black people. Then it was, you know, thirty three years back, thirty years back, it was really a big no no there.
I mean, they frowned upon those kind of interracial relationships. Not only did he have a girlfriend, he went ahead and had a child with this girl who was terribly addicted to drugs and wound up dying shortly after childbirth. Now this was he was in Denver, and then he got a pregnant. You know, he'd go back and forth
between Denver and Nebraska to visit her. It's not that far in the car to make the drive, and so then she got pregnant, and then he was left at that point when she died, there was no one else to care for him. So by the time he was nineteen years old, he was a single father with a baby. Now start at the wheels turning. Yes, Now, in terms of.
His future career, what was he what was his transformation like from this sort of smaller than normal sort of kid. How did he blossom? What did he look like? What was this transformation like? And when did this happen that he became this guy that you know that he wasn't when he was younger. Let's put it that way.
Right, in high school, he gravitated towards the theater because he said people in the theater were just more accepting, you know, they were more open minded. So he started to do plays in high school. He started to get into that. People told them, you know, you're really nice looking, you have a really nice look. And then he started doing modeling when he moved to Denver, because there really wasn't any anything and that small part of Nebraska would have had to go to Omah. He didn't want to
do that. He was already in Denver, so he started modeling in Denver, and so that's where he started. He found himself in the arts, modeling, doing that kind of thing. And then he really had to amp it up because after the girlfriend died, he had this child that he was responsible for. So that I believe, I believe that if he wouldn't have the child, you and I wouldn't
be talking right now. That's just what I think. I think that caused a lot of the roads that he took at that young age that he kind of was in a panic. He didn't know what to do basically, and didn't have a lot of support from the family. He just didn't have it. He was basically on his own with the child. That's hard for anyone, but a nineteen year old kid, that's a male. Very hard.
Now you say he was you say he was doing some modeling, and so tell us what type of modeling he started off with. And then when you say he became you know, he realized he was a single father at nineteen years of age and had to really was responsible for the child now and himself. That might have changed. That changed obviously. So tell us what kind of modeling he started off with and what kind of things he was entertaining as he became more desperate.
As you say, he was signed. He was signed in Denver with maximum talent and they're still there now, just doing you know, legitimate modeling runway where a catalog work for like sea years and that kind of thing. Lots. I mean, he's I mean, you see his picture there. He's very phologetic. He's a very good looking person, and he's tall. He was, you know when he got his hide, he was six' one. He's had a perfect model look. Back in the day. So that's what he was doing.
He was doing legitimate modeling at first. That's how it started. But you know, they told him, you know, Tim, people would tell him, you know, you have a really good look in Denver, but they said, to really get anywhere and to really make money in this business, you've got to be either in New York or in la I mean, you're not gonna really, You're gonna get as far as you can go here regionally, but to really get to a bigger place, you have to be in a bit
in one of those cities. So that's how that started. But he started to get into the escort business in Denver. He started he became a male escort there. That was before the porn So that's where the escorting and the kind of underbelly CD world that he found himself in started in Denver, which a lot of people think it's this small little city of Denver is a big metropolitan city with all of that stuff too, and between the people with the suburbs. So that's where that all started.
The the blue stuff that he was doing, it's harder than Denver, but it was mostly men that he had. Mostly it was male customers that he had. I mean, you know, women don't have to know IR escorts, so it with mostly men that he was catering to.
Sure was it what was his own sexual orientation officially?
And you know that's a great debate when the when the incident had, I mean, he was he had a girl, he had a baby, he had always had a girlfriend. But I think that's part another issue with what made him so angry. I believe that he's that. I mean, it's hard to get. It was very difficult to get a straight answer out of him as far as because we discussed that a great detail because when he went in did his porn, it was gay porn primarily, and he said that, you know, I think it was gay.
I mean, to do what he did, you have to be gay. That was a big issue and when it went down, everybody said that he hated gays, and it was there's a whole a lot of stuff with that. I don't think he hated gays. I think he hated the fact that he was gay. That's what I think. I mean, he probably would say he was bisexual. That's what he's going to say, right, I just leave me. I don't say I don't say what he is or
what he's not. I mean, if you watch some of his movies like I have, it's hard to see this person as a straight man when you see what I've seen that you know, that's up to the reader.
Now you talk about the CD element of this, and really you really do bring the reader into that CD element at Underbelly, no matter how legit it may look at anyone's viewpoint. But we're what we're talking what kind of money were we talking about when he's doing escorts and this is before he gets to California, so we're talking about Denver kind of money we're talking about with this.
Scene hourly, right, he had hourly clients when he was an escort, so it was probably around one hundred and one hundred and fifty was an hour. And we're talking about, you know, years back here. He was maybe nineteen twenty when he was doing that, when he was an escort, so we're going back, you know, fifteen sixteen years, so it's about one hundred and twenty five dollars an hour.
And then he said he had overnights like with he would stay overnight with someone and it was you know, but it was a lot more than he could make doing a regular job, you know, and a straight job is what he called it. He said he just could not make enough money in doing any kind of straight work to sport a child. He couldn't do it, That's what he said. And just you know, reporting what he said.
Now with this is he's making good money and he's making steady money. How does he handle that money? What's his lifestyle like? Is he is he an arrogant person with via this money? How does he what's his personality was going?
Right now? He drove a pickup truck, you know, the same pickup truck that he had all through high school. He got himself a little tiny apartment. His family did he I mean, his mother helped a little, his sister helped a little, but you know, they all had to work. Nobody in that family was independently wealthy. Everyone worked, so they all had to work. And to have an infant, a small child is a full time thing. Nobody could really sit there and say, okay, here, I'm gonna watch
the child. Either they couldn't or they didn't want to. And you go work, or you go back to school, or you do whatever you have done. And no one really said that. And he said when he got down to looking at daycare what daycare would cost for an infant, he said, he just felt that he needed to make a certain amount of money. He got himself a little tiny apartment like a studio for himself and the baby, and he went and did he did modeling, and then
he did his escorting. And that's basically he just was to pay the bills. He didn't go and buy himself a nice car. He didn't go and do a flash and desh. He lived very simple, meager lifestyle, just to support his child in the beginning. That's what it was.
Did he have a history in high school developed at some point a drug problem? Was this an issue?
No, there was no drugs or alcohol. The girlfriend was a drug addict, which was interesting to me when I was you know, because you would think he wouldn't be involved with somebody that was a drugs and he said it was a term. I mean he would he said he would drink, he'd go down and have a beer, but no drugs. And he begged her every which way and Sunday for her to stop, to go to rehab, and she would stop and she would get cleaned up.
She managed to stay clean enough while she was pregnant through most of it, not to you know, transfer anything, because the baby was born healthy. But right after she delivered the baby, he said, a few days later, she was doing drugs again. And we're talking about hardcore drugs, cocaine, math, crack, all of that stuff. She was doing dust. But he didn't do that. He never He did not have a drug or alcohol problem him ever and never had any kind of legal problems, never was arrested. Never.
Now, when does he make a decision to go to California and why does he make that decision? And based on what well, there were.
A few things he's really hated himself, and for being an escort. He hated it. He hated being an escort, so he felt and everybody kept telling him. And he was still doing the modeling when he was an escort. He was still a model, so everybody was telling him in the industry that if you just go out of LA or New York, you can do better. So that's why he did it. He wanted to get out of being an ascort. He was trying to, you know, be an actor, be a model and do it successfully in
a legitimate market, but just make more money. He just wasn't making enough in Denver as a model. So that's when he decided to go. And he decided to go to California because it was it was old, that geography, it was closer, you know, if he wanted to make it. The drive, it's a twenty four hour drive, it's you know, it's an hour and a half playing my versus New York. It's further so. And he had a few friends that were living in Las that he met while he was a model that went on to LA to model, so
he knew where. He had a few places where he could stay. So he just thought it would be easier from the Goats to LA. So that's what he did. He went to LA.
And then how old was he at that time? Roundabouts?
How old was he. He was twenty one when he went to LA, twenty one, so he was in LA. He settled in West Hollywood, which, if you know LA, that's kind of a predominantly gay area. A lot of gay people live in West Hollywood. I asked him why he lived in LA, why he would go to West Hollywood. I mean, there's a lot of places you can go because I've lived in LA for a long time too, And he said, well, that's where I knew someone that was living there. So I went there, went and stayed
with them. And he said, I gave myself three months. That's all I could manage, So all I could get a commitment for to watch his daughter was three months. Because he didn't have money to go back and forth for the three months. He had to stay there and work, you know, and try to work. So he said, I gave myself three months to make it, to get some kind of work in a movie, a TV show, get some modeling work, get any kind of work that I could make money with. So he gave himself three months.
So he tried. I mean, he went on auditions, he went on cattle calls, he did all of that stuff that actors and models do and got nowhere. He parked cars, he tried to work in a restaurant. He did have an anger problem, no drug problem, but a very bad anger problem. And he wouldn't last long when he tried to get like a job to supplement his acting or whatever he was doing. He wouldn't last at a restaurant
or driving or whatever it was. He just he would have flare ups, and he would have those kinds of problems. Now on the last part of the three months, like the last few days when he was getting ready to go back to Denver. There's varying stories of what happened next. So that's another thing. I mean, I know my side. You're gonna ask him what he says. It's a different side than you ask a third person. It's another story. It's very hard to corroborate this particular story because him
has a problem with the truth. You know, a lot of it was helpful to me in this particular case because I knew the victim. That then we're getting back to when he's back in Denver. But I wouldn't have been able to get at the truth in this case of what actually happened with the murder if I wouldn't have known the victim. And that's only because he's such a liar, this kid. He lies like it's like it's nothing,
like it's drinking water. I was only able to tease together what happened in this particular case because I knew the victim, Because I personally knew the victim. If that makes sense right, well.
Well you'll be able to explain that, because that's a fascinating, fascinating element of this story, just adding another incredible twist to this. So now I wanted to ask about this, and I think the audience would ask this as well. This guy's a real muscular guy. Part of the industry is that these guys got to look real buff. Maybe back in the day they didn't, but I think they
always had to, as he's always had to. So this rage, these these fits of rage, they have anything to do with steroid juice?
Was that him?
I asked? And he's not. You know, if you see him in person, I mean by the time I saw him in person, you know, he was out of the porn business for a long time. But even if you watch his films, he's not like roided up on steroid juice. He doesn't have the very very sand I mean, but moscular. I mean he worked out in a gym and he's he's mu sure enough that you can buy that he's going to a gym, he's working out. He's not. He was never Arnold Schwarzenegger muscular or even slider than that.
I mean, his didn't look fabricated. His muscles they looked real from working out, and he worked out every day and twice a day, and a lots of protein and knew how to lean. I mean, but I don't think it was any kind of I think there was some mental illness, and the mental illness was part of He was abused, he was beaten, and then a lot of those types of people grow up to be very violent people themselves. And I think that's what it was a matter of why he was so violent. That and a
lot of self loathing. But I think why he was so angry and violent was a lot of different relations and things that he did was because that's what he saw when he grew up. That's all he saw was violence when it was growing up. That's it. So a lot of those types of people grow up to be violent too.
Now, was there when you talk about mental illness? Was when was he first diagnosed? Was there any diagnosis before this this incredible crime?
In high school? He was diagnosed with bipolar. He was diagnosed as bipolar when he was in high school. The mother who took him to therapy because of his anger issues. That was when they were still in Nebraska, So he was bipolar.
Was there any instances that involving police or any No, there was.
Never in just the way he just the way he interacted with family, with friends, they felt that he was, you know, angry, that he was an angry kid. Always he would throw things. There was never anything where he would be arrested or come to the police attention, but he would throw things. He would break things when he was in anger, that kind of thing. He never hit anybody or beat anyone. Never any of that. No child to anything that I've talked to, people that you know,
saw him interact, his family, his mother's history. He never was abusive towards his child either.
Any of these fits of rage did he Again, in retrospect, it's always easier to then remember something that might fit, you know, somewhat into behavior. But is there anything that was there? These fits of raids characterized by anything that people would say later that you know, sort of lost control and didn't know what he was doing, couldn't stop fighting or anything.
No, No, he just is angry. He just most people that I talked to and from what I personally saw him, because I had a lot of interaction with him myself, he was just a very angry, angry Hey.
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I lost the terms conditions eighteen plus would snap very quickly and get angry, lose his temper, mad, that kind of thing. It didn't take much to set him off. That's what it was, I think. Not that he was in a blind rage. He didn't know what he was doing. He always knew what he was doing. But that's what you mean, right, That was what you mean? Yeah, you know, he's just a very very angry person, not a mellow person. Angry, very very angry type of person. You don't think of peace.
And then when you see someone like that, sure you just think angry. It's hard to picture when you watch his film, because I've seen a lot of his films. He was a pretty good actor. I think he could have done very well in regular if you just would have had the opportunity regular film, because he was a decent actor. That's the kind of films. Those porno films
that he did. I know, I'm getting ad but they're very they're known the type of films they did for more dialogue than a lot of the other porn because of the director that did it. But he was a decent actor in them if you actually watch the films, and I think that he had a lot of potential to be a good actor, because what you see on film is very, very different than what the real person is like. That's why I'm saying that.
Extremely Now, you say, you talk about the ninety days that he gives himself this window to make to see if that he can make it, and then he has to go back. So tell us about his mood after days.
Yeah, he was bad. He was frustrated, he was mad, he was upset. You know, he was felt very defeated, he said, because he didn't feel that. You know, he was trying every day, he was out there making the rounds, doing what he had to do but getting his head shots out. But he wasn't getting any homebags. I mean, he would go on auditions, but he just didn't get anywhere. He would go on several additions, but he didn't get anywhere.
He wasn't making money. He couldn't stay there. I mean, the plan was if he made it, he was going to move his daughter out there with him. He was trying to do that to get his own place. It's very expensive to do in LA. You really got to have you got to do something. You can't just be sleeping on someone's couch, especially in his case he had a child. I mean, everything would have worked differently had he not had the child. That's why I said that earlier.
He could have maybe stayed there a few years and tried to do legitimate work. But he was on the timetable because of the child, because he only had a commitment from three months from the family members to watch her while he was out there auditioning. That was the problem, and the child was a problem in this scheme, in the grand scheme of things. I mean, this is just my opinion, but that's what I think. I just think
it would have went down a lot differently. Many people that break into the movie business and the modeling business, it takes them years. Sometimes, you know, they're working in a restaurant, they're driving a cab, they're doing what they have to because they don't have kids. They can do that. You have that luxury when you're just worrying about yourself. You can go sleep at the beach. If the web's nice, you don't really have to worry about it, if it's
just right. Well, a lot more that you can do. Yeah, there's a lot more that you can do when you don't have when you're not responsible for a child. And that's in that instance, under those circumstances.
So no, he didn't give himself. He only gave himself that ninety days. And like I say, it seemed to be resentful after that. So how does he proceed after that?
Well, you call his Mommy told me. I mean, I think there was a lot of resentment for his family. There was, and it could be you know, he's blaming, but he's the one that got the girl pregnant. I even told him that, you know, I can't blame the whole world. But he would call his mom and he would say, you know, mom, can't you just watch for another week and I think I might get a call back?
Can't isn't this something that you can do? And they said no, because then and then I asked the mother because they spend a lot of time with his family, and she said that she was afraid to do that because he was the type that would take advantage. And then she had a job and she didn't want to get fired from her job. She had to be able to work. I mean it took a lot to be
able to watch her for three months. Everybody had to, you know, they didn't they just because we were afraid if we gave him another week then he would then he would say, Okay, I need another week. So they stuck by that three month window for him.
Now tell us about the go ahead?
Sorry, yeah, yeah, And he was like to say, he was very resentful. He was very, very frustrated by that point. Okay, you want to know when he met chee chee.
Yes, please tell us about the film.
Okay. So he was just about he was all packed and ready to go back. He had three days left of that and they were serious on the other end of Denver because his mother actually gave him an ultimate um and said John Naol called him by his middle name, which is John. They said, John, if you don't come back on the point to day, we're coming La with Jasmine was his daughter's name. Where coming with Jasmine? And where you let us know where you are and we're
dropping her off. That's how I mean. They were very strict with him about that. So he knew they weren't playing games that he had to go back. He knew that so by the third day, by the before on this when he had three days left. This is what he says. This is his story that he says. I believe it's kind of the truth from what I know because I've talked to you. He said he was walking down Santa Monica Boulevard in West Hollywood, just say after he went and had something to eat and would just
like to see the movies. Chee Chi LaRue, who is a very prolific pornographer in the not only in the gay pornography, but in straight I mean he's handled Jenna Jamison and he's done all kinds of pornography, but he's very well known in those quarters, was walking down the street, not in drag because Chee Chee is his stage name. But he was just stressed as a man because he dresses as Chee Chee, which is his woman alter ego. But he was just stressed as a man walking down
the street. And he said he saw him and he turned his head and he said, are you in actor? And he said no, I'm I do some modeling. I'm I do I've been trying to be an actor. And you see a lot of those types in La like him. I mean there were diamond dozen that were roll over the place. So he said that to Tim and it was with and and he gave him his business card and he said and he said, what do you do? He asked Chee Chee? Tim, Tim asked Chi Chee. He said, well,
I make movies, adult films. And he didn't beat around the bush and he didn't lie. He told him straight up. He said money and chee Chi LaRue. It said che Chi LaRue on the card, not his real name, which is Larry Pacodi, that's Cheechee's real name, but it said Chee Chi LaRue without Falcon Films, which is his film studio. And he said adult films, Like, what what do you mean?
And he said porn out porn porn films, and he said, oh, okay, So he took his card and then he went back to his room where he was staying, and he said, I'm not gonna call him, but then he called him because he said he was desperty. He was trying everything in the world not to call him, but finally called him and had dinner like the next night or something, and they were discussing his film practice. He didn't tell him that it was that it was gay stuff that
he was thinking of him doing. He just said he does porn. He didn't say it was gay porn, but he said and I said, say, you never heard because even I heard of him before. I mean, and I never knew about porno, but I have heard of cheating the rue. I knew who he was way before this. And I said, you never heard of cheating the room. He said, no, I never watched pornography, and certainly not that gay stuff. I never watched. I had no idea who he was. I never heard of him before, That's
what he said. And it's possibly who was twenty one. He didn't know who he was, and then that's how he got into the porn business. From that point forward, he just he said he thought it. Well, he said he thought about it, you know, And he said, well, I have sex with people, why not, So I'm gonna have sex with people again, so might as well get paid and then I don't have to go back to Denver with my tale between my life. That was his attitude.
That was his initial attitude about actually going and doing it, because he really didn't want to go back to Denver defeated. And then he said, well was he going to do when he got back to Denver. He would need a job there anyway. I mean, when he got back to Denver, he'd need a job. He'd have to make money to poor as child. It was just that they could watch her and not think taking. I mean, he had to go back and support her. He had to have money, no matter where he was. That's what he told me.
No matter what city he was in, he had to be making money. So that's he said. It was. I never thought in a million years if he would have told me a week before even that that would have been my fate. On that day, that night that I'm sitting there even with him, contemplating that I'm going to go to and do porn. And he said whether it was gay or street. Did it really matter at that point? You're selling your soul. Once you do that kind of stuff,
you're selling yourself. Doesn't matter if it's a cow, if it's a person, if it's a woman. He said, I didn't think it really mattered at that point. That's what he told me, because I said, he didn't tell you at dinner that it was going to be gay porn. Right now, he said, show up at Van Eys, because that's where a lot of the you know, North Hollywood Van Eys, that's where a lot of the porn that was made, probably ninety percent of the porn that any
everyone watches is made in the valley say. He said, you show up at a house and tell you where to go. You walk in, it's people all over the place moving around. And said the thing that really surprised him at the whole thing, as a matter of fact, you going, you do, you think, you leave. It's not a big deal. It's not any of that stuff like you would think that it would be. It's nothing. To them. They go in, they do it, and they just go have a pizza after. It's not a big deal. It's nothing.
That's what he said. His initial you know, orientation into the whole thing. And it's not you don't get you. You say, here's your person, you're gonna be doing a scene with, this is how it's gonna go. This is how it's gonna be, and that's it. You just do it. You don't make a big deal. You doesn't work like that like you would think that it would be this big, big thing. It's not. I mean, and she he said,
she's just very very rich. You didn't very control. I mean, he just he wants it this way, this way, that way, and you do it or or you don't work for him. There's no modely coddling. You don't want to do it. I got one hundred guys that will do it. That's his attitude that he has. You don't want to do it. I'm not going to model and coddle you. That's the kind of thing. He's not begging anybody to do it.
It's it's hideous and awful. As many people think that it is, there's many people that still want to do it.
Though certainly certainly, yeah, what what is his family, his sister and his mother's reaction to the to the deadline, him not making the deadline. Making the deadline.
Yeah, he didn't tell them anything, you know, he said, that's the whole part of this story. I mean, he told, oh, you know, I got a modeling gig. They go, that's great, And he said, so I could say, and he told Chreachy the whole thing with the deadline, because I got to have a cash advance. I've got to have some money so that I can go back and get set up there in Denver and get babysitter and do all of that so that dead her out of their hands and so that I can go back and forth. And
he did agree to that. He fronted him a lot more money than he would because he was under those conditions, you know, and he had a kid, and he took mercy on him and said he fronted him the money he was able to, you know, fly back to Denver, take care and stuff, get him to a place to get babysitters, due all of that. So what he did was he didn't tell his family any of day. He said, I got a really good modeling gig. He just made up some you know bs stuff about what he was doing.
He didn't say he was doing any of that. You know, they wouldn't. Never, they wouldn't. I mean they was very religious Christians that we're talking about here, that never missed church on Sunday and went to Bible study during the week, very very religious people. Because I met them, very religious. So I mean he didn't tell them the truth. He just said, I got a modeling gig. When we're gonna see it, Oh, I don't know. You know, it takes a long time till he get production, you know, make
up with all kinds of stories. But they were just happy that he got something. I never thought anything that he was doing that, never thought that. They were just relieved that he got something, that he was able to come back, relieve them of their duties and he was seemingly getting his life in order. They were relieved and proud of him. His mother said, I was so proud of John. I was very happy for him. I thought, maybe, you know, he'll be able to have a good life
for him and Jasmine. That's what she said initially. So he was a leading a double life, basically, it's what what what happened next?
Well, I was gonna say, is it you talked about how Chee Chee ran a film set? How did how did he how did he like working in the movies.
He hated it. He absolutely hated it. He hated it from day one and hated it every second of every day. That's when he started drinking. He never drank like that, I mean a beer here or there, but not like an alcohol alcoholic type level drinking. He said he couldn't do it sober. He could not do it sober, I mean like right after a rite before. He did it enough so that he could perform, but he was drunk most of the time when he was making those movies.
But he said, it's just very, very difficult to do it sober. It was very hard for him. He just hated himself. He said, I just felt so bad about myself. It was hard to look in the mirror doing that stuff.
Right.
And there were a lot of issues. I mean, if you read the book, you see what some of those issues were why he hated it so much. There were health issues, you know. He was very concerned that his daughter would one day find out that our father was making porno. He was very concerned about that. He said, it would have all been different. Maybe I wouldn't have been as embarrassed as I was. It was very embarrassing.
He was very embarrassed by it. Maybe I wouldn't have been as embarrassed if I didn't I wasn't somebody's parent, and I didn't have this child that was looking to me for everything. Maybe I can't tell you because I don't know because I was somebody's parent doing it. And I said, you know, I asked him once. I said, you know, there's lots of people that have children that are porn stars. Porn for many of them. Jenna Jamison has children. Many people have children, and some of them
have messed up children, and some of them do. He goes made but was not. I just found it very difficult as somebody's father to be standing there doing that. It's a very difficult thing to rationalize in my mind.
Tell us about, you know, him meeting Jenna Jamison in their relationship. Tell us a little bit about that. It's an interesting thing.
Well, you know, I don't really I don't think. I don't even know if because I have never seen all the films that I've seen him do were mostly with men, so I think they did some scenes together. I don't know if the scenes actually got into because I haven't seen every film that he's made. I've seen a lot of them, but not everyone. He made a lot of films and very short amount of times, and climbed up the torn old ladder very you know. He won awards.
He was on the cover of Freshman magazine, which is lots of magazine covers porno magazines that are for the porn industry. He made the cover. He was on the cover of play when he was finally arrested. He was on the cover of Playgirl magazine the day he was arrested and booked. He was on the that month he was on the cover of Playgirl magazine. I mean he rose very quickly up the ladder, up the porno ladder, very fast. Even Chee che said it was a very very fast climb. He just had that boy next door
look about him. He has a very he's very very nice looking, but at the same time, he has a very innocent look about him, which is a little different from a lot of them. That's why they believe a lot of them network with him, that he moved up that quickly. And I don't know with Jenny, he did
some scenes with her. I don't know if they actually made it onto tape and I know also that after he was arrested and in jail already, Chee Chi caught a lot of those movies and you know, release and some that were never released before were released after the fact after he was arrested. I mean, he made he did a lot of scenes with a lot of them that I didn't see the films actually, and I don't know where they are now. I don't know if they were ever released. He said that we're all really nice.
He said he never had any problems with any of the performers. It wasn't them, that wasn't the issue. They were just going in and surviving. Some of them, some of them liked it, but a lot of them just were doing it to survive. They were working and it was a way. It was a means to an end, he said. He told me that he never had any issues with any of the performers. I heard different stories from like Chee Chee, for instance, because I've had conversations with Chee Chee myself. He told me a lot of
very different diverging stories than what Tim said. Tim said he never had any problems with anybody. He got along with everybody on a porn set, never had any trouble with anybody, got along perfectly. Well, it's just a job. It was nothing for an with anybody. That's what he told me. But that's not what other people have told me.
Now, the other character in this tragic story is John Paul Kelso. And you talked about you working for John Paulso. Whenever, that's the most advantageous. Tell us what you did, what your relationship was with JP Kelso, But first tell us about John Paul Kelso.
Tell us about him John JP. Everybody called him JP so by his initials. Everyone did so. JP owned a collection agency called PRS Professional Recovery Systems, a huge collection agency in downtown Denver, and he had been in the credit and collection industry as whole adult life. I have a law background, a legal background, so in between, you know, writing gigs, I do like the life of a poor starving writer.
You do.
What you got to do is spot So I did some legal work for him, Like I would go and I would go through his file and see which ones had assets that they could sue to get ready for lawsuits. So that's what I did. I went through his files to see which ones there were assets to sue. Basically, that's what I did. So that's how I met JT. And just see they had ads out. I went and applied to do some part time like a freelancer with him.
That's what I did. And he was openly gay. Okay, he would be fifty if he were alive now, he would be fifty two. He was openly gay and very very flamboyant. He made a lot of money in the credit and collection industry. Very flamboyant. I mean, Denver's not La. It's not as flamboyant as La. You know, you see Rolls Royces in La. They're on every corner. You don't see it as much in Denver. But that's what he drove. He drove around in the Rolls Royce. He had a
rolex on his hand, he had a nice house. He was very wealthy and he flaunted his wealth. And he was openly gay, so it was not a secret. There was no fake marriages or not any of that stuff. Didn't care. That was the one thing if you read the book, that I had respect for him. I respected him because he was openly gay. He didn't hide the fact that he was gay. He didn't like it too bad. That was JZ. But he wasn't a very nice person.
He was mean, He was nasty, and he treated his employees like dirt, treated them awful, and he screamed and he yelled, and he made no bones about the fact that he didn't like women and had no use for women. He said that, he actually said stuff like that. I mean, you know, I got up, and eventually I got up and I said, you know what do we want to discuss that? How I left? I mean I just went in there and did freelance work group. I wasn't a nine to five employee, like, I didn't sit there older.
But it was just if you know anything about the credit and collection, just little cubicles and people would sit and the little cubicles make collection calls of you know, try and find people, skip trace, find people that were missing debtors that don't pay their bills, get on the phone and say, you know, you need to pay bill, or we're going to garnish a way. Just that kind of thing. That's what they were doing now. But how he made his money, he had a little interesting system
that he did. He would buy debt wholesale, Like he would go all over the place and buy debt that was written off. Like things that were written off is uncollectible. Buy them for pennies on the dollar and try to sit, you know, and then when he collected, he bought the debt for pennies. So that's how he made his money. That's how he did it. That's how he was able to do it and made millions and millions of dollars. But he had he was a very shady person though.
Before that he had a criminal record. It was interesting because Timboham, the mean, cold, hard, calculated porno killer, had a clean criminal record nothing, but JP Kelso had a long criminal record. He had, you know, embezzlement, fraud. He could even own the collection agency in his name because of that. You can't have a license to own a collection agency when you have those kind of crimes that
you did. He had a silent partner, the silent partner or the business was in the silent partner's name, but JP owned it. I mean he was there physically every day in the office. She never saw the other one. He was there in his office every day. He owned it and he operated it. But the other one legally owned it. And he the reason why because he had a criminal record. It was just a very difficult, mean, nasty person. I didn't like him at all. He was mean.
He was a horrible human being. And I don't know of any people because Denver was a big, small place, you know, especially in credit and collections, everybody knows each other. And I didn't never meet anyone at the time when he was alive, you know, I didn't meet anybody that knew him, that liked him. I never saw anyone that liked him. Most people did not like him. When you walked through the office he went in the day, everybody had the Denver post out or the Rocky Mountains. They
were circling one ants. That's what his employees were sitting there doing all day. They were looking for other jobs because they hated it. So but I mean, the tension was always so thick in that place. So that was JP. Always with young men. He always had like a young assistant was sitting there in the office. Always had males, and he always in his office was young, nice looking man in all. That's all you saw when you walked in. And he was over very short and overweight physically. He's
about five four maybe and fat, very very overweight. That's what he looked like physically.
That's what I was going to ask because it's it's interesting to have this dichotomy between this flamboyant gay person. That's why I want to ask the description, just to really confound the audience with this description where he's this bad guy. Yeah, but he's a bad guy with this criminal past and yet he's this flamboyant gay guy. Does he have this element of malice to him at all? Or is he?
I mean, he he had, you know, financial crimes. He didn't have violence, he didn't raise people, he didn't beat up, and he didn't have no assault, no violence, but he had financial crimes. That was mostly what he did all to just get money. Was greedy. He was a greedy greedy business people. We all know them, we all see them, those types of people. Unfortunately, that's what he was, and he was very very obnoxious. I would say, you know, I had a real moral lemma with his book too,
because a lot of people romanticize victims and death. It's very common that you see that. I have other crime cases I'm working on now too, wh that has happened very high pro Jodyarius is another one that I'm currently working on. I'm communicating with her, you know, the one she murdered Travis there, and they did that. They do that with a lot of cases. And so I'm sitting here and I had the advantage because I knew Jap. So should I write all these things that I didn't like, Yes,
because that's the truth. Just because he was murdered, that doesn't change the fact that he wasn't a nice person in that and that I personally did not like him. He was so mean and so nasty, you know. And I needed the ex tra income when I worked there, I really did. I had a child, suti feet, you know, I had a family, but did no money on earth is worth and walking in somewhere and dreading being there, you know, I would come home and I go, what And you know, I wrote him a letter and she said, oh,
I'm going to use my writing skills here. And I handed it to him when I actually resigned, And in the bottom of the letter it said, you know when these days you're gonna look around the island and the islanders will be gone, you know. And I handed him the letter. He wrote it. I watched him read it, you know, and then I walked to my desk, gathered my stuff out and walked in, and he goes, okay, sure, Donna, he said to Mecha, I said, you know, you're really mean.
You're a really mean person, and no one likes you. Do you understand it? He goes, I'm not here to win to make friends. I'm here to run a business. I don't care if anyone likes me. I said, I understand that you're here to run a business, but she don't. Don't have to be so damn mean. You're running a business, and this business takes employees to help you run it. If you need employees, then you need to treat them
with respect. It's that simple, if you I mean, I made really good money sitting there with him, but it wasn't it just I just couldn't stand sitting there anyway. He would scream at people and brake them in front of other people instead of taking them in the office and you know, behind clothes doors, he did it right and in front of it. It just was horrible. I just it was just such a toxic, negative environment. I couldn't stand it anymore. I no amount of money was
worth being in an environment like that. And he didn't even directly do it to me personally, he did it to other the way he treated people. I just couldn't stand being in that environment anymore. And I said to him, one of these days, and he was just so so snarky, you know, the way he looked at me, smiling like I was. I said, one of these days, James, he'd mark my words, one of these days, you're going to piss off the wrong person. That's all it takes is
one person, wrong person being pissed off. Mark my words, It's gonna happen. And it did. Five years later. He was done. Five years after I said that, he was gone. Interesting, isn't it?
Yes, ironic. Let's let's talk about his sexual appetites. What I wanted to describe is that he seems like sort of a even though he's this flamboyant, small, chubby guy, but he seems to be somewhat of an intimidating guy to a certain degree anyway, And at least part of his character is his sexual appetite. So tell us what how he can characterize his sexual appetites and how he goes about trying to satisfy that.
Tell us about well, he always said, young young man with him you know, like his assistant was his boyfriend. When I worked there, what I saw Seth was his assistant was his boyfriend. Everyone knew that that was his boyfriend. I mean, after the fact, people have selective men, but that was his boyfriend. I mean, he was openly gay. Nobody you never saw him with a woman. He wasn't denying that he was gay, so he was always so His assistant I'm putting up air quotes was his boyfriend,
and he you know, he had him. He put his boyfriends through college, He gave them, you know, cosmetic procedures, he bought them cars. It was all about money. And that's the very sad elements of this little tail here. It was all about money. If somebody was with him, you knew it was about money that JP was giving. It was never an equal relationship. You would never see someone like JP with somebody equally successful. You would never
see that. He had to have all the control. And I think because of the fact that he was just so mean and so nasty, Who's going to be with someone like that unless it's about money. He wasn't a nice person. And there's been people with this tery part of it, when you know they were talking about him like he was the nicest thing since slice spread when it was announced that he died. When it was and I said, well, talking about that is JT that I knew.
And that's even the news does that, well, they don't know who he is when they were reporting. When the news journalist is sitting in front of a teleprom through report and they don't know who it was, they don't know anything. They're saying. He was a philanthropist, he gave money to charitable things. Maybe he did. He needed tax right off, maybe he did. But he wasn't a nice person at the core, A kind warm, fuzzy type of person. He just wasn't. He was mean and he was nasty.
That's why I left the way I did, Okay. And as far as his appetite, they were never too young or too thin or too nice looking in a man that was JP. Always with young men twenty years younger than him. That's what you saw. This was around He was in his early forties when he met Tim Boham, but he was that's always in Tim was what twenty two twenty three when they met, and he was forty two, So you always saw him with people around fifteen, twenty
years younger than him. His men, they were never his equal always, you know, he was the one in control, the one in charge.
Now, tell us about the encounter. Tell us about the meeting between these two, because they don't they have an earlier encounter. So tell us about their first meeting and what that consisted of.
Tell us about Well, so Tim left left? Uh so Tim, okay, he is doing his porno, all right. So he's working in his porno, and then one day, on a dime, he just he was done. He looked in the mirror, he was called to the set, he had an early morning call. What Tim was doing was he was living a double life. He'd go out to La shoot his porno, and be here, be in La for a week or two, shoot his porno, and then be back in Denver for four weeks, go back to LA for two weeks, shoot
his porno, be back in Denver for four weeks. That's how he was living. And nobody knew. They thought he was doing acting kids. No one knew he was porn of. Not in Denver. They didn't know. They did not, not the people that he knew in Denver, like his family, his friends, No one knew. He didn't tell anyone in Colorado that he was doing that, but I elsewhere he knew. He was a big He was a major adult film star. I mean he was on the cover of magazines all
over the place. But his mother didn't watch porno. You know, his stepfather didn't watch porno. People that he knew his sister didn't watch porn. Unless you watch that stuff, how would you know who's to unless you're really looking at it, you wouldn't know. And also he used the name Marcus Allen. That was his professional name when he did his work, when he did his film work. And I said, why did you pick that name? Who gave you that name? He goes, you know, Marcus Allen. He did his thing
in football, he made his money, he got out. I was helping that some of that would rub off on me. So I picked that name. That's how he came up with Marcus Allen. And so he just one day he was supposed to be had a call at eight o'clock, calls to be on the set in the valley to shoot one of his flicks. And he looked in the mirror he was shaving, and he said, you know what, I'm done. I'm done. He didn't call Chee Chee, he
didn't call the studio, he didn't call anyone. He packed some stuff, stuff in his Porsche that he had bought at this point. He did buy a Porsche, but he kept it in California. He didn't have it in Colorado. So in California. In Colorado, he drove a pickup truck. He went to the airport, got on a plane, went back to Denver, didn't tell anybody in California that he was done, never called anyone. That's how he left the porn industry. He was very impulsive the way he did things.
When he thought he was gonna do it, he just did it. He didn't think. There was not a lot of thinking with him. He decided he was gonna do what he did it. There was no backing poors with him. He just thought, you know what, if my daughter or my mother find out that I'm doing this, I'd be mortified. I'd i'd be more respectful to work at McDonald's and to do this. He said he just couldn't stand it anymore, and he was done. And he never returned to it
after that ever. Again. After that, he was done, so so then he's back in Denver. He's trying to take he's looking for work, definitely looking forward because he knows he's not gonna do the porn anymore. So he's back in Denver. Left California. Sold stuff, you know that what he needed to look with it in California. So now he's back in Denver full time and he's trying to
raise his daughter and take care of her. And he's sitting in a cafe on Colfax Avenue, which is a major street in Denver, reading the one hands, looking for a job. And JP was in that place, which was very close to his office in Denver. He was sitting there having breakfasts and he saw him circling the heads and he recognized him. He recognized him from his films
because he watched him his films. There's diverging reports about this, but this is And he came over to him and he goes, you're Marcus Allen and Tim said, nom, nah, my name is John, because you know, he always went by his middle name. He goes, my name's John, and he said, no, you're Marcus Allen. I know your work. I'm a big fan of herts He goes okay, whatever my name is, John, I don't know what you're talking about, say. He denied it. He denied that it was him. He said,
is there something I can help you with? He said to JP, I'm trying to do something here. You know, he was very dismissive, but he said, I have a you're looking. I see you circling ads here. I have a company. I own a company, a collection agency a few blocks from here. Here's my card. If you need work, give me a call. Another one giving him his card, giving him a call. He said, give me a call.
I have a job for you. And he goes okay, And he called him after that because he desperately needed a job and he started working for him the same place I work, went up there and started working. This was years later though, this was like five years, four years later that he started working for him and he started doing the collections work for him. So that's how they met because it was over of the fact that he needed work.
And so how did that work go? He was what was he didn't go?
Well? You know, JP only gave him his card because because he was attracted him immediately and he was his fan and he recognized him as from his porn work. That's the only reason he had the people that did collections for him. That he had people that had been doing it for years, that were very experienced bill collectors sitting there and he never did it before. He just gave him his card because he was you know, he recognized him. Say he hated it. He said, he hated
sitting there, and he actually did. That was the lie. He said. He knew that he's recognizing him. He said, I know it was me. I know well that what it was about. But I needed work, you know, and if he had a job, I'm going to go try it. And he said he's lasted like three days the first we worked there two different times. The first time he lasted three days. He said he hated sitting in the desk, just sitting and dialing and looking for people and hounding
them for money. Wasn't his style, he said, hated it depressing. I said, which was worse, the porn or the bill collections? He said, the bill collections was worse than the porn. That people are so mean, you know, they hang up on you and they go, oh call here, I'm going
to kill you, and all this stuff. He's at least in not doing He did the form, so he lasted three days and then you know that's and then he was just buying his time after that, you know, he was taking him out to dinner and giving him money to be with him. That's what That's what it evolved into, because that's what it was all about to begin with for JP, like it was with everybody that he ever was in his life before him, it was the same.
In this brief period of time, in a short period of time, what does tim what does he what does he sort of determine about him in terms of this man's wealth, this man's character, what does he what does he see and what is he looking at and possibly looking for?
But yeah, he said it was just you know, that's another thing he told people, you know, publicly after he was arrested, that it was that they were really good friends and that he enjoyed his comedy. But you know, I was buying that. I knew that I knew JP, and I just knew that that I said, you liked him? He was such a mean best What was it that you liked about him? I mean, gaye strait. He was not very attractive to look at. He was twenty years older than you. What could you possibly have seen that
you liked about him? I said, I see that you're saying that you liked him and that he had a friend. And he said, you know, he couldn't lie to me. That's what I was saying earlier. He could not say that to me because I knew jay Z and I'm looking at him, you know, even this was after a few years after he was out of the porn because this is about two and a half years after the porn industry. That where we we're at in jail, you know, at that point in jail. So this was two and
a half years away from the porn industry. But I'm looking at him, and I'm thinking, there's no way that's true that they would He cared for him because he was giving him money basically, and he was helping him pay his bills, and he was buying his friendship. He knew he was well, he'd been to his house, he's been his obviously, knew he had money. He's very wealthy
by Coloraudzi any standards. He was a wealthy man, and he knew he was wealthy, and he figured he could get money from him and wouldn't have to go try and toil away, you know, for eight dollars an hour somewhere. And he gave him money constantly. He was giving him money. He would say, come spend the night, and I can't. I've got a kid to feed, you know that kind of thing. I can't spend the night with you. You got to give me money or I gotta go get a job. You know. It was like that. That's what
it involved. And he was constantly giving him money to go to dinner with him, he had to give him money to go sit and watch TV with him, He had to give him money. Would not be with him unless money was involved. That's what the relationship was. It was about money.
Now, both players in this tragic event know what each is expected of well, what is expected of each of them in this brief period of time. What exactly is JP's goal and what is Timothy's goal in terms of again, he's looking for money, but he understands what JP's ultimate goal is. And you said he got out of the porn industry because he not because he didn't get along with the other actors, but more so just his bothings. So tell us how much of an issue this is no.
I don't know that he thought that far in the future, Howard, and I think while he was with him, he was trying to figure out what he was going to do because he had his child that he had his support, and he didn't want to sit there. And then, you know, while all of this was going on, while he was, you know, spending time with JP and being compensated for he met a girl. That's another element to this. He met a girl and then he went to the bar one night and he met a bartender that was tending bar,
really really pretty girl. Her name was Christina, and he met her and they started dating. So then he has this girlfriend, and he still has JP that's looking to buy his affections from him. So at that point, when he met the girl and had started to have a relationship with her, he wanted nothing to do with Jada. I mean, he didn't want to keep you know, you could say we're having a sexual relationship. Obviously he and
JP were. I mean he was a paid boyfriend. I mean, I don't know any other way to say a paid escort. Whatever you want, a paid companion, however you want to say it. Because he's not going to give them all that money and not expect him to have sex with him, right, I mean there was, there was. I mean he admitted to that that they were having a sexual There's no way he's going to give him money and not expect sexual in him. I mean he was his escort basically.
But when he met Christina, and now Christina didn't know anything about the porn and eventually he admitted to him that, you know, was he couldn't deny it. I mean he saw those films. Actually one night they were sitting and watching TV, and he put one, Are you still going to deny that? That's you? He said it when they had his film in there. He said, now it's me. Now what so it's me? What do you want? It's me. I don't do that anymore. That's not who I am now.
It was in the past. It was desperate. I needed money. I don't do that anymore, and don't bring it up again. That's what he said. JP's over. I didn't do that anymore, And he really didn't. Once he left, he never went back, not ever, and he was called to go back and he didn't. He just didn't. He decided he didn't want to do it. Anymore, and he didn't that he was.
Over now, so is the sorry go ahead?
So then he meets Christine. He's dating Christina, and Christina doesn't know anything about any of that stuff, doesn't know that he does. Man doesn't know. He was still having relations with JP because he needed money. He had rent, he had, you know, to take care of his daughter. He had a girlfriend, he was taking her out. He had money, So that's what he was doing to get money.
He was seeing JP to get money, and he had this girlfriend who had no idea about any of it, didn't know that he was in the porn business, didn't know what he was doing. Men didn't know about any of that stuff, none of it. So that's why was going on there.
So what did he want to do with Christine in terms of what was his goal in terms of gaining money? And then what was his next plan? What did he eat?
No? I think that what happened. She got pregnant. The girlfriend got pregnant. So now he has another baby on the way. He's got the daughter who is now three or four at this point, and then he has the baby on the way. So now he's got these two kids. You know, he's going to have two to support. He just tried to. He was just trying to distance himself
as much. He was trying to get money, to keep getting getting money, keep him one those But JP knew that he had a girlfriend, and he would say, listen, I can't spend as much time with you because I have a girlfriend now. And so what happened long term? I have no idea what he was planning. I don't think he knew. He just knew that minute. He had a mad money. He was trying to get work. He was sending out his resumes, he said. He said he was going to maybe go into the National Guard and
do reserve duty so he get it checked. That's what he said. He was maybe plan looking at maybe doing the military as as a reservist so he could get a monthly checked. That way. He don't get very much. It's not enough to support a family, but that was one of the plans. He was trying to just get completely out of that kind of stuff, escorting, doing any seedy stuff and trying to, you know it, to live a straight life. But the terms that he used, he was trying. But then he was on the hook with JP.
Though he JP wasn't going to just let him go that way, and he said, I have a girlfriend. Now I don't I can't see you. She doesn't know, you know. And that was not gonna work with JP. When he had his hooks in someone, he just didn't take no for an answer. He didn't in this case. He said, you gotta come over, because he was very attracted and very attached to him at this point.
To a tim, okay, and tell us more about this meeting, he says, says, you have to come over, dude.
You have to come over. You gotta come spend time with me, you know. And he would come over and he'd want him to spend the night, and he couldn't explain to her where was he going, what was he doing? He couldn't explain because she didn't know any of these things. You know. That was bad bed call. They just cut it off completely. But then he was threatening him. That's when the threat started. That's when the course of events started. He said, if you don't come and see me, I'm
gonna tell her. I'm gonna tell. When they were getting along and everything was funny, he said, are you gonna tell her? You know? And he was making believe that he was going to just back off and let him live his life. And he said, you met a girl that's n I says, she know? Does she know about your past? Does she know who you are? And she said, no, I don't have to tell her those things. That's not who I am. Now that's in the past. I don't
have to tell her any of those things. So he knew JP had that, but that he didn't that she didn't know, and she was not gonna know, not from him. So that's what he used as his leverage to start blackmailing him. You don't come over here, I'm gonna call Christina. You know what that he yet, I'm gonna send her one of your porno movies. That's what he was threatening him with. You can constantly straight he would he was laying in bed with her at three in the morning.
They would be calling him on the phone. Who is that? Who's calling? I don't know, cranme, Pungle, I don't know, I don't know. He was constantly had to make up stories for who's calling him. That was going on constantly with him blackmailing.
Now by this time as well, Timothy knows the lay of the land in terms of JP's home, and so tell us about, say, the day proceeding or the day of tell us about the events leading up to this incredible crime.
Well, there was. There's there's another thing too with this, there's some different differing accounts of what happened. The story that's out there that there was a safe and JP's has which there was, There was a safe there, and the plan was Tim was just gonna go in there, rob his house, rob JP's house, get money, take Christina and go away somewhere. Go take Christina and his daughter and just leave and go somewhere else, to some other city. That's what he says he was gonna do. I don't
believe that that's what he ever planned to do. That's what he said to the police. That's what he told his mother. That's what he said to on the witness stand. That's what he said. He was well on the witness stand. It was completely different. I mean during the trial. I mean initially he said that, but then he changed his story.
That's what he told public. That was the public story, the public version of events that he gave that he was going to go in get him to open the safe because he didn't have the combination to the safe, rob him and leave. That's what he said he was going to do. That's not true. That is absolutely not true. It's all lies. Then I believe that he was going to go over there and just kill him, because first of all, I think, you know, if he would have done anything like charge to rob me, he would have
immediately called the police. If he was left alive. It wasn't gonna and he knew who he was. He wasn't going to just let him rob him and give him money, right, that's the first thing. Second thing, if he got him pissed off very badly, he would have told Christina. And he definitely did not want Christina or his family, his mother, or anybody to know about his past. He didn't want
anyone to know those things. No one knew, and he knew that he would tell, and he would have probably told if he had the chance, he would have told them. You know, he knew that he would tell, and he was very afraid of that. So he on the day of it was November two thousand and six when this happened, he went. He said he was going to just go there and rob the safe and that would be it. Okay, So what you want to know what happened now or.
Yes, I want what I also what I also wanted to know was yeah, no, go ahead, proceed, tell us about what what actually happens.
Well, he actually wanted to try to get him to stop, you know, blackmailing him. And you know why even asked him, why didn't you go to the police say that he was blackmailing Because you're not allowed to blackmail someone. That's a felony. When you're blackmailing someone, it doesn't matter who it is what it is not allowed to legally blackmail someone. You do this or I'm gonna do this, that's blackmail. Okay, you're not allowed to do that's crime. He said. I
thought about that. I actually did think about that, But then I would have had to say what he's blackmailing me over? So who they gonna take? Who is? The police can decide with the Porner store. He's blackmailing me because I'm a porn star versus the nice, overall good guy, philanthropic JP Calso, the well respected business Denver business. I said he had a criminal record, didn't He said he didn't know. Tim told me that he didn't know that JP had a criminal record because he JP didn't tell
that's of evil. He didn't say, Hi, my name is JAP. I have a criminal record. He owned a collection HC. He then never dawned on him that he had a criminal record. I think that's another issue. If he would have known that, maybe he would have went to the police he had a criminal record. Tim didn't. The other one did it. He was blackmailing him, so, but.
He also wouldn't have. He wouldn't have also wanted his wife to find out his new girlfriend, Christine. He didn't want her to find out, and that would have been another way for her to find out too. He's trying to silence this guy in a couple fronts, stop stop what he's doing, and also silence him from saying anything to anyone.
As well, exactly. And he wanted he needed money, so oh he needed money. Also he also desperately needed money.
So we won't give too much away here in terms of the trial, because it's like many cases, it's you think this is just going to be maybe possibly a plea agreement, or they're going to spare the family of the victims the cost and the burden and the and yet they go to trial and he takes the stand, which again is very unusual. Just tell us about the crime scene itself, and before we do that, what type of money were we talking about. He's thinking that maybe in that safe.
He thought there were you know, like at least thousands of maybe at least one hundred thousand dollars in cash in the say that's what he thought was in there. Because also you asked me earlier and then whether Tim had drug problems. He did, but JP did. JP had a very bad cocaine problem. He had a lot of drug problems. And he always had money in that safe because of that, because he bought drugs all the time. So there was a lot of money in the safe.
He was right about that. I mean he said he saw him opening all the time and he knew there was money in there. Right, he was at his house before many times, so he knew there was money there.
Now on the on the day of the murder itself, Brent Cox's Kelso's housekeeper. He isn't living in, but he has a key and he comes to work and discovers what tell us about the what is discovered at Kelso's home.
He's, oh, the housekeeper that found the body, is that what we're talking about. Yeah, the housekeeper, Brent Cox was also gay, see and he had a male housekeeper. He just didn't like women. This man, he really did. So Brad Cox came to the house on Monday. He was scheduled. He cleaned the house every day. Jap would go to work. He had keys to the house. He had keys to the house. He had keys to the house and Jay so he was supposed to be at work. When Brent Cox got to the house, he saw that the car
was in the driveway, which was rare. He would go and clean the house when JP was at work. That was the schedule. So he saw the car in the driveway and he thought, that's weird. Maybe he overslept. And then he saw there was a you know, no plates in the sink. It was a Monday morning. That would have been plates in the thing because he didn't clean over the weekend. He saw no plates in the sink. He saw that. It just looked weird to him. But the dogs were outside, and you know, it was cold.
It was November. The dogs were never outside in November, the three little dogs that were never outside. So when he went up, he went up to look. He started calling his name because he knew the car was outside. He knew he had to be home because the car was in the driveway. So he started calling him JP J. If he didn't hear anything, he led the dogs and he went upstairs. He looked for him and he discovered his body in the bathtub. He saw him in the booth.
He looked at him. He screamed, he was you know, he looked at me. He clearly could see he was dead. There was blood everywhere, and he ran outside and he called the police from outside of the house.
And well, then tell us what the police response was in terms of tell us what happens next with police.
Well, the police arrived and they, you know, questioned him and the JP was found nude in the bathtub with water. You know, he was found naked and he weighed over three hundred pounds. He found They found him and he had a pillow under his chin, naked, blood everywhere in the war, you know, the water was bloody, and that's how he was found. So the police came, questioned him,
called the CSI team and went through. Do you want to know how they discovered that it was Tim or what do we that it was Tim that did I mean they went through phone records, so they figured out that it was Tim through the phone records to see who he called last that initially, and there was no videotape surveillance. He had video cameras on the house and he was on videotape entering the house. Last person that entered the house before the housekeeper.
It was Tim, didn't they initially believe that they're because of the size of the man and how he had to be put in the bath so that they thought initially that there was more than one.
Yeah, they thought it had to be more than one per They took five cops, five different police officers to get his body out of the top after they drained the water. Took five of them to get him out, so they thought he had more than one person to get him in there. And they knew from the forensics in the bedroom, it was in the master bedroom that he was killed, but they knew from the forensics that he was not shot. He was shot, that's how he was killed, but they knew it wasn't he was not
shot in the bathtub. They knew that his body was moved into the bathtub after he was shot, so they knew whoever did. They figured that's why they thought it had to be more than one person to get him in. You know, rigor mortis sets in your heavy when you you know, the body's very heavy. It's a lot heavier than when it's dead. So they thought it was more than one person, for sure. They thought that at first.
They thought it was a very right when they saw it and they saw the conditions of the house and the forensics, they thought they called it a burglary at first. That's what they reported when they started reporting it on the news, they said that he was dead and that it was probably a burglary gone bad. That's what they That's how they reported it.
So tell us just we won't tell about everything because obviously he well you can tell us about his escape or or where his his flight was. Also tell us how in short order, within a few days, they they have the evidence to be able to.
Get a warrant. They got a warrant for him because first of all, they go through the phone records to see who he called less so they know who the last person that they called it was. And then he had video surveillance in his house, in the inside and the outside, both and he was on tape, so they knew it was him. They knew it was him that was in that he was the last person in the house before the housekeeper. They knew it was him. They identified him through the video. They knew it was him.
They were able to tell through the video that it was him, matched out with the phone records they put to into the you know, and they were able to That's how they got the warrant, right.
And he and he has an idea to take off south of the border.
And right after that he, you know, he got on a plane. He was going to go back to La because he had a motorcycle there. He still had a car there in La. He was gonna go to La. But that made a change. The plane made a change, and at the last minute he got off in Arizona and went to the border in Arizona instead of going back on because he thought for sure there's a warrant. He didn't know for sure, but he said, probably they know already that it's me. There's gonna be a warrant.
It's gonna be too hard to get back on to connect to another plane. He could get it at Lax when he goes through. He could get stopped, so he thought it was better to stay on the ground not get back on a plane at that point, So he got in a cab and went to Lukeville, Arizona, where the border is into Mexico. Over there, he took a cab from the airport. He claims also when he got the safe, has that there was no money in it. That's what he told the police, that he opened the
safe for no reason. But the cab right alone from the airport to the border was four hundred dollars from in Arizona to get to the border of Mexico. So he claims that there was no money in this at which I personally know from my own knowledge that that's not true.
But you know, okay, yeah, and he gets he'd buy some tools as well.
Not only that he went to Mexico, he actually went into Mexico after that, you know that, right. I mean, he was in Mexico for a while and then, you know, thought about what what am I going to do here? You know, do I want to go to a Mexican jail. He thought about that too, because the Mexican Mexico doesn't have the death penalty, Okay, So in order to actually duke someone back. A lot of times they have to agree to not seek to death. I don't think once
you're in Mexico. But then, you know, the other issue is do I want to be in a Mexican jail or a Mexican prison? You know? There way he was thinking about it. I mean, you know, he had a lot of money on him. He could have lasted for a while in Mexico because he was not in like he was in a little small little town in Mexico. It was very cheap to be there, so he could have lasted. But that's you know, he didn't. That's not
what he elected to do. He just felt it was very you know, do you want me to say what happens here or not? I don't know, because he voluntarily turned it. I mean he went back into Arizona and
went over to the border patrol agents. Actually what he did was, when he was at the border, he went and got on the internet somewhere over there, like in a cafe or something, and he saw there was a warrant for him, and so then he went over to the border agent and he goes, I want to turn myself in because I believe there's a warrant for me out of Denver. That was an Arizona and Lukeville, Arizona on the other side of the border. And they go, where is the warrant from and he said Denver And
they said what's it for? And he said murder. And they went and they looked and they just threw the guns up and arrested him right there on the spot. But he turned himself in at that point, after he got on the internet knew there was a warrant, he turned himself in.
Yeah, now we won't We won't go into the rest of it. We would have to have another hour to really explain the rest of this. And for me, the true crime readers, they think, well, it's a trial, this should be a slam dunk, and often it isn't. And so we won't give away all the twists and turns you're in. And of course you get to interview Timothy, and like you say, he's a notorious half truth teller, a lot of lies.
And pathological liar. He is. I mean, he eventually, you know, opened up to me, but it took a lot of a lot of doing and getting to know his family and gaining their trust. I actually did a television show with his mother to try and spend it a little bit different and talk about, you know, the jp that you know, it's not all what they're saying, and he's and I already was spending a lot of time with
him already at gym. I just thought I would discuss the case a little because they were spending it long way. I didn't really think that was right to do that. It wasn't you know, this was more than just writing crime. It was ironic because in this case I knew the victim, you know, and I felt I was it was the best, the right thing to do to get on there and say, you know, it's not always what what things appear to be. Basically is what I said. You know, he does. No
one deserves to die. I say that in the book. No one doesn't deserves it, no matter what they do. You know, you don't like someone, you stay away from them, like I did. I never had any dealings with him after I left. You know, I didn't like him. I stayed away from him. But you know, let's say the truth. Let's not distort what the truth was. I really believe that it's very important, and that's when I write I get a lot of heat for that sometimes because I'm
not a revisionist. I don't change what happens just because someone died tragically. I don't think that's right to do that. You know, I did it with my last one too. I had a gut took a lot of heat for that because my last one was about Scott Peterson, you know, and the victim there always lazy Peters and she's not perfect. No one's perfect, none of us are right. I think a lot of these stories I view them as cautionary tales.
A lot of them are let's look at maybe in the next case, maybe if somebody did something a little different and want to play it out that way. That's my thing. That's the way I view a lot of these cases.
Well, obviously you have to report on the obvious interaction between these people because not to say innocence or guilt or partly guilty behavior by a victim, but it's just a matter of fact that these situations arise and these characters collide, and we have this incredible murder and incredible
court case. And like I said, I won't want to give it away because we have, you know, the mother and the sister, and it's incredible who shows up at the trial and who's important that trial, and then we have an appearance by the killer himself, which is very very unusual.
So that's very rare. That's very rare. But when you're making the defense that he was he had no choice, I mean legally, and they say that, you know, you never, no one ever has to take the stand in any state, that's just that's the law. But certain defense it's kind of necessary because it's he just sits there and there's nothing left, there's nothing to go on if you don't explain your version in certain instances. And so he did
take the stand, and it's very very rare. You're right, it's less than three percent of these kinds of cases, these murder cases, less than three percent where the defendant takes the stand in these cases, So ninety seven percent of the time they don't do it.
And the other thing is to not all defense attorneys are prepared to. We'll say, take a fanciful tale from a defendant or something that would seem to be proven in the end to be you know, totally false anyway, and take that and trot that all the way in a trial.
That's a rarity, and I know that's what's really crazy in this particular case. It's like people are going to read it and think, oh my gosh, it's just like didn't happen, but it's a matter of record it happened. That's very bizarre elements this case.
Also absolutely yes, I want to we wont want to give any more away, but I want to say that this is a tale that as soon as you think you know what's going to go on, then there's something else that pops up and definitely absolutely surprises you. So very very interesting story tendant for mature audiences. I want to thank you very much Donna for coming on and talking about this book and for those that might want to connect with you or do you have a website? Do you do Facebook?
Well, yeah, I have a fan daily Dotti Infall. You can see a lot of my articles. I do a lot of exclusive interviews with you know, criminals. I write about pop cultural So, but connect with me if you have a story you want me to look at on Twitter ms ms Donna Thomas.
Best way to find me right, And you also have a book about Scott Peterson and you're working side.
That was my last book. Yeah, I'm sorry, I like you. It's a great, great book, it's a great read. I'm sorry, I like to you the Confession Scott Peterson. The only you ought to that wrote a book about him, that actually interviewed him at San Quentin. I'm the only one.
Well, then it sounds like I'm going to have to invite you back on to talk about that because we have not covered that case, and that's another one in the Annals of true crime history in American history.
Basically, it's a fascinating read. It's a fascinating case, it really is. I spent a lot of time with Scott so on death Row at San Quentin.
Yeah, well, we'll have to have you on and talk about that.
And thank you, thank you, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.
Thank you very much, Donna, and I hope to talk to you again soon. You have a great evening, and thank.
You for this interview you too, Thank you, Bob Bla.
Good night.
