We a tree speech strive to bring you insightful stories about trees and those who engage with them. As we continue growing we ask for your support. We now have a patreon and every dollar helps us continue to produce this podcast. Find the link in our show notes or a tree speech.com, every contribution supports our production. And we'll be giving gifts of gratitude, including an invitation to Treehouse our new virtual community for patrons of all levels.
Please also consider passing the word to tree-loving, folks, and rate, and review us on Apple podcasts. Every kind word helps. I'm feeling unsettled and uncertain. My emotions are strained by the Discord, and separation in our communities and world. At a time when it seems crucial to be able to work together to help solve the challenges of our present life. Never before have. We been so interconnected through technology yet seemingly?
So distant from one. Another the precious interconnectedness of all life can so easily be lost amid. The hustle of The Daily Grind and the weight of continuous tragic events. Intuitively. I look to the wisdom within trees for answers trees as a key to the ailments of our world. Probably sounds nonsensical or hopefully optimistic. But what if there was a guidance system of sorts that use the themes of Nature and the unity of all things to create Equitable peaceful and just
ecosystems. I'm Robinson. And this is tree speech. A podcast where we practice hearing the forest through the trees. This week's episode was written and recorded in Massachusetts on the native lands of the wabanaki Confederacy, Penacook massachusett and Pawtucket people in New York on the lands of the Lenape tribes as well as the lands of Edinburgh. Tree speech is co-written and produced by Jonathan's out, Nur and Delight theater guilt this season.
We have been examining in ways that people commune with and find answers from trees in our quest, to uncover solutions, to the problems that we Face both personally and as a collective whole, today's guest John Philip Newell is an internationally acclaimed Celtic speaker, teacher and spiritually minded author of several books including his latest sacred Earth, sacred soul in, which he utilizes the Celtic spiritual tradition to call on the During World to reawaken to the
sacredness of Earth, and every human being to heal ourselves and our modern world Newell speaks of himself as a Wandering teacher following the ancient path of many lone teachers before him in the Celtic World, seeking the well-being of the world, he has been described as having the heart of a Celtic Bard, and the mind of a Celtic scholar combining in his teachings, the poetic and the intellectual.
Boil the head, as well as the heart and spiritual awareness as well as political and ecological concern. His writings including 15 books have been translated into seven languages in 2016. He began the school of Earth and soul and teaches in the United States and Canada as well as leading international pilgrimage weeks in Iona in The Western Isles of Scotland. When we spoke he was in his
office and bra. Surrounded by books and wearing a turquoise and indigo scarf, which accentuated his Bright Eyes. Even more striking was his grounded presence soon. My own harried Pace, slowed down to match, the steadiness of his deep breaths. Much of what we spoke about. Involve the concept of what is sacred. The word sacred can be translated as hallowed. Revered or made Holy by association with divinity or Divine things by religious
ceremony or sanction. I always considered sacred to be distant and lofty. Yet, John Phillips perspective allowed me to engage with the word sacred in a new way as something, which feels close to home to the self and most of all to the Earth, Here is our interview with John Philip Newell. Well, first of all, thank you so much for joining us today. Thank you, Dory.
It's great to be with you. And Jonathan, thank you for the invitation, our pleasure Celtic wisdom is intuitively available to everyone yet as a global Society. Society we have largely Fallen away from what it offers. How do you find your own connection to Celtic wisdom? Where did that start for you? Yeah, looking back on it. You know what? At the sort of conscious of intellectual level? It was something that I became aware of during the time of my university studies.
And I remember first hearing a great Celtic teacher speak in public. He was by that stage, she was 80 years of age and I was about 20, and to hear this Celtic Christian teacher, speak about the sacredness of Earth, and to speak about the way of non-violence, is the way of true relationship and interrelationship. I realized, I was hearing what my soul was was longing for, and I did, I hadn't even quite known that I was so longing for it.
So I think that's that's when things Began to sort of happen after more, conscious level, looking back over my life, I think that much of this stream of wisdom, it was conveyed to make it quite naturally and, and much more in daily life, through through my Scottish, grandmother who lived with us for a while when I was a boy. So, I came very close to her.
And I think she communicated with me much of the Central vision and spirit of this tradition without even being aware herself, that she was necessarily conveying, a tradition that had a lineage and a particular paths and particular, writings and teachers are associated with the day. So I think I was breathing in some of that quite naturally through her.
I think the other thing I'd want to say is that I think part of the Grace of this tradition and not just this tradition, but by many other great spiritual Traditions, that pay attention to our innate knowing of sacredness of Earth. And sacredness of every human being, I think these these Traditions set free or give some language to, to a type of knowing that I think is ours in childhood.
But But often it's attack of knowing that the desire either suppressed, or denied or covered over when, when other sort of cultural National Religious themes, find that sort of instinctive knowing of the Sacred inconvenient to nationhood, or to religion or culture. So I think that, that, that much of this way of narrowing in this is part of what I try to convey. Communicate in the new book is about Awakening to what our soul already, at some level knows.
So I would speak to that in terms of a tradition that actually just gave me some articulation for what I and what I believe we early on already know that actually leads beautifully into my next question. I was going to ask that say Earth. Sacred soul is a book of Celtic. Wisdom for Reawakening to what our souls? No. Can you tell us? What has caused this need for Reawakening? Meaning how did we as a collective lose sight of these truth?
Yeah and I think one of the interesting things and we want one of the important characters in the new book is is the fifth century. Irish Saint Saint Brigid who's very much at type of icon On of sacredness of the feminine and sacredness of Earth. And these two, ICS Inseparable and tragically, what we've done to the feminine. We've often done to the Earth in terms of subordination or abuse. So one of one of the features of Bridget that I find.
So so interesting and related to your question, is that Bridget is sort of rising in people's Consciousness, all over the place I miss her. Been in the Celtic world. And why is she rising in our Consciousness now? And I think she's rising in our Consciousness because we need her, we need to sort of wisdom that she embodies.
So, I think that in times of need and especially in times of urgent, need and we are in such a time in our relationship with Earth and my relationship with the feminine at that voices. Do emerge in a time of Urgent, need for those with ears to hear, and I think many of us are are eager to hear wisdom that
has been neglected or lost. So I think the urgency of the moment is part of why we're hearing these themes Rise Again within us and Among Us and, and is never just a matter of regurgitating or repeating wisdom from the past. I think it's always were always being called to hear ancient wisdom and new Ways how I love, what the the Jewish Mystics speak of when they speak of new ancient words because it's never just a matter of recovering. Ancient wisdom.
It's matter them finding new expression, new application, and new Enlightenment for now. So, I think that's very much to do with why, why this is rising, in our Consciousness, and a new way part of What I explore in the book is more to do with also with well, why was this wisdom tradition suppressed and I explore that quite a bit in relation to what was happening
in the fourth century. When Christianity overnight almost got into bed with Empire move from being Quite A persecuted minority within the Roman, Prior to almost overnight occupying, a place of great Prestige and power and privilege and that didn't come with how to Christ and the the price that Empire required and the price that Empire always requires. And you know I'm not just speaking about the Roman Empire.
Speaking about how the British Empire has behaved, historically or about how the American Empire behaves? Any nation that tries to dominate the world or to exploit the world's for its own well-being. Rather than for the well-being of all five, often finds ways of hijacking, religion and and making it convenient to Empire. So we need to be very suspicious.
We need to be asking lots of questions but what on Earth was happening in the 4th century and Any of the doctrines that were put forward when Christianity became Imperial religion were doctrines that were highly convenient to Empire and one of them was a doctrine that formerly was called the doctrine of creation ex nihilo creation out of nothing. In which the Imperial church was I think Under Pressure to teach
that matter. The universe Earth was created by God out of nothing because if one neutralizers matter in a sense by saying, well, it was created out of nothing, then we can do whatever we want to it. Instead of seeing that this stuff, the stuff of the human body is sacred, how we handle one, another and relationship, how we care for the most physical needs of those who are hungry and homeless and seeking sanctuary and our nation's. These Are Holy Martyrs and how
we handled. The matter of the body of birth is is a holy matter. So the Celtic teachers at that stage were increasingly seen as inconvenient to Empire and they paid the price by being excommunicated by being judged, by being condemned, by being written all, because what the Celtic teachers at that stage in in the Celtic world were teaching is creation. Was not made out of nothing.
And they were instead speaking about creation coming out of the very substance of the Divine, which is still somewhat shocking to our dualistic, Western ears, you know, with divided Spirit from matter, Heaven from Earth, to Divine from the human.
So that's that's part of what I traced in the book and it's it's important that we do some critiquing of what happened in the journey that has led us. To follow that relationship with her truly is, you are already alluding to this but there have been so many terrible things that have happened, even just in the last few weeks in the news and in our world. And in your most recent book you say that the crisis that we are
in the midst of today. Whether ecological, political or societal stem from the fact that we treat the Earth and one another as less than sacred, how can people start to see themselves? Selves and the Earth is sacred, especially given that so many people see themselves as separate from the earth and the environment session important question and, you know, over my years of teaching and leading
Retreats and is it for me? It's never it's never just a matter of teaching I always try to accompany teaching with spiritual practice and meditation so that, Not just a matter of becoming conscious up here, but it's trying to pay her tensioner to deeper level as well. So, you know, when I'm teaching, I just never agree to go straight from teaching into discussion. I always either myself or with colleague lead us into Times of time of meditation, sometimes. Very simple walking meditations
outside. I mean, if I'm on my favorite island in the world, the island of Iona out, in The Western Isles, you know, I immediately put aside for a while to pay attention within, but all should pay attention to the wisdom that the Earth is forever, trying to speak to us. And then out of that time of Silence, meditative practice, I believe we we approach a deeper place of knowing which is which is more of a balance between head and heart.
Two type of equipoise between head and heart and I think that's a deeper place of knowing and experiencing the sacred. So that is not just a matter of hearing about it.
I mean, I think a lot of our religious tradition has been based on statements about the sacred rather than an experience of the Sacred or opening ourselves to an encounter with the sacred within us and within one another other and within the Earth. And I think that one of the main challenges are around knowing sacredness and one another. And in Earth is that many of us have been sort of paralyzed by doubting the sacredness of our own being.
So, one of the one of the meditative trance, I have worked on in collaboration with the musician. Except two words from the Quran. And the words are whichever way you turn. There is the face of God. So sometimes when we're using that, you know, I encourage people to look into the eyes of the person next to them to see this light that comes from from within. But at the end of that exercise, our practice, I always say now, the most challenging thing now is to go, go back to your room
and look in the mirror. And get in touch with the sacredness that you are that is at the very heart of your being.
Because I think one of the one of the obstacles to knowing, and being receptive and being attentive to sacredness and one, another is, they're often filled with doubt about about the sacredness that we bear the heart of our own being, that's an important aspect in in Reawakening to what is within us. Personally, As well as one another and that's why these personal spiritual practices are very much part of the way, the way forward collectively as
well. One of the things that I love to remember, from John Muir, who, in many ways, is the greatest prophet of ecological Consciousness and in the modern world at one of the things he says, is keep, you know, keep returning to the mountain, have a key. Keep going. Keep going back into the wild back into the, the Untamed sacredness of Earth. And he says, you know, when we go back, our ancient Mother,
Love of Earth will rise again. And I've had that so important because he's not saying, you know, we don't have to instill a love of Earth in one another, our role I think is just to awaken that what? Your calls that ancient mother loved us is something were born with, we're of Earth, and our love of Earth is something deep within us, but it's often been ignored or covered over smothered and it's a better.
It's about Reawakening it. So, how do we keep enabling ourselves to fall in love again with her? And I think this is so important in our in our ecological activism and And such important movements for change. We sometimes undercount undermined the efficacy and strength and passion of a movement. If we don't allow ourselves to keep falling in love because love is the great fires, the great energy, it's the great
Passion for for change. So let's let's keep making sure that we're being nourished and we're set on fire because that that's what holds the greatest. Shoot for change. That's an incredible thought that falling in love, is what we need in order to bring about change and what we need in order to nourish ourselves. So you mentioned before, John, Muir and you mentioned that in your book, you walk through the lives and teachings of John Muir.
And we have been examining John Muir and all his complexity this season. Can you expand a little on why you chose to include him in, sacred Earth, sacred soul, and what is your connection to him? Yeah, well he was we claim him in Scotland here as Iris but I do, I am prepared to speak of him as an American count. He was born just down the coast from Edinburgh where I am. So he's much celebrated here and, and just over the top of the wall from our property.
Here is the Edinburgh botanical gardens with the John Muir Grove of redwoods. And every year I'm in, In California and doing some teaching and when I'm there, I always visit the Muir Woods and my goodness, it's this natural Cathedral of the Divine and when I come back to the mirror Grove here, I realize who these these red was, I'm in their adolescence compared to the Sequoia out and in the Muir Woods so-and-so mirrors, much celebrate.
Here. And, and interestingly, he is one of these characters who has been rising and in our Consciousness, more precisely because we need his voice again. But at, you know, as you say he is a person of considerable complexity especially early on. And, and part of what is rightfully been drawn to our attention is the racism that he Gave expression to an embodied as a young man.
And part of what I do in the book is trying to say two things in relation to that one, is that he was expressing a racism, that was very typical of the Fairly narrow closed Society of Scotland in relation to not having much encounter with relationship with native peoples. People of color. And so on that, the so-called other was was sort of still quite strange to the narrow culture of Scotland at that stage.
So what he was evidencing was very typical of his generation and his culture that in no sense excuses it but it's to place it in context as a disgraceful feature of of 19th century Scotland at that stage, the other thing I point out, Out in the book is that he evolves. He he unfolds and thank God in very beautiful ways in relation to his openness and closeness to Native leaders, especially in Alaska. And I think there's there's been a bit of forgetting of that.
And I think that the overall Readiness to, to just announce with without linking that also to a Thanksgiving that the Became more than that, and that in his only pollution, he is a sign of hope. He's assigned of the evolution that we're all being invited into individually and collectively. So I think that that's one of the reasons why I was glad to include mirror in a book that was coming out at this point in time that I could I could try to
say two things. Because I think the to always must be said and just the acknowledgement that people can evolve and people can change is so important. So do trees have a place within your practice and spirituality? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I've just mentioned the potential Gardens just over the wall and they botanical gardens for so close here that I sort of see it as an extension of my own
property. I'm sure it's a dangerous thing to be. Enjoying the gardens without actually having much responsibility for them but I get em to the gardens almost every day that I'm at home here in Denver. And and what a Grace it is to move among the trees and especially I go to the, John, Muir Grove of Giant Sequoia and that for me, is it is The day after day, here it is. My place of sanctuary.
It is my place for prayers, my place of meditation to commune amidst the trees and I mean I've had a journey in relation to my own religion of inheritance. Hi, I trained the illogically as
young man. I became a minister of the Church of Scotland and about two years ago I realized Need to relinquish my ordination with the church of Scotland realizing that that what is most sacred to me which is what I'm most passionate about my the Church of my inheritance does not speak this vision of Earth, sacredness and the sacredness of every human being. So I think at this stage in my
life I'm I'm even more. Attentive to aware of what the Cathedral of Earth, sea and sky including these, these great, this great Redwood Grove is so close to me. Again. I mean, looking back on my journey, I think in many ways what I'm doing by going to the Grove every day for my prayer and meditation.
I think I'm just sort of returning too much of what I knew as a child, I was Grew up in a context where we are on farmland and I know looking back that that's where I was receiving much, my strength walking in the woods and in the valley but my my religious tradition hadn't given me language to be more conscious of that being an experience of communion with the sacred. So Absolutely.
And one of the features of the Celtic tradition that I draw out, and the new book is that there's really a lot of radical continuity between the Celtic Christian mysticism and the pre-christian, druidic wisdom, and, and the word drew, it just means Oak nor and so the the pre-christian context of Nature mysticism was happening, you know, again, and again an Oak Grove's or in the presence of great. Oak trees. These massively strong trees.
Often upgrade edge with roots, reaching deep into the Earth, and branches, reaching up to heaven very much. This, this important connection between the above and the below of Heaven and Earth there. Very much. So, what advice do you have for anyone who is looking to continue to reawaken to Celtic wisdom and to heal the world in our environment? Where do you suggest a person? Begin. One of the important chapters in the book is the one on P are tired to Chardon.
The 20th century scientist, Mystic Jesuit, priest, who like many of his Celtic teachers paid the price. For trying to speak truth from the human soul and was silenced for much of his life by the Vatican and then thank God, plus the end of his life. He agreed to an act of Disobedience and sometimes disobedience is the holy path. I think to, to give voice to an attempt to suppress it.
And so, he signed over his writings to his personal assistant in Paris madam I sell more ta, which meant that when he died, all of these writings that the Vatican had not allowed to be published were hers, rather than the churches. And she began to reduce them part of what tared writes about in in a work, called The Heart of the matter in which he says that the deeper we move in in the matter of Earth.
The closer we come to the Divine, one of the things, one of the transition points in his life. There was so important was when he realized that that he could not only sort of stand in front of a tree and love the essence of the tree, love the life within the life of the tree. He realized that in standing before the tree he could experience being loved by the life within the life of the
tree. So he realized it was radically relational and that is that Radical relationality, they were being invited into not only to love Earth but to allow ourselves to know that we are loved our birth and to allow ourselves to know, not only the love of Earth, but the mercy of Earth. I believe that we can know that the Earth will have mercy on us if we choose and seek to be To her. That was one of the things that John Muir said, Earth has no Sorrows that Earth cannot heal.
So, let's allow ourselves to be in this sort of radical relationality with the planet and with everything that has
being. So, I think one of one of the things that I encourage again, in terms of spiritual practice, when I'm, when I'm teaching on Iona, pilgrimages or teaching at the school of Earth and soul, is to encourage people to go out, literally, understand, and before a tree, or to stand before some expression of life form and to, to have that two-way communication to to, not only allow our hearts to try to express what we're feeling towards the essence of the tree,
or the essence of that life-form and then, to move into listening posture, and to allow ourselves to be addressed Because that, you know, that's that's the nature of love. There's no to it's it's mutual and it's not just our speaking. It is that it's about listening and to allow ourselves to be
changed by what we hear. Of course, you know, that in a culture in a western world that had said of neutralized matter and didn't allow any any sort of spiritual energy or presence, you know, that that just sounds Madness. To allow ourselves to listen. But I believe that is what we're being called to do. And we're living in the in the tragedy of not having listened for hundreds of years and its creators brought us the impasse that we're at now.
But hopefully, we can with your wisdom and with the wisdom of the trees. Allow ourselves to be changed by what we hear and not allow ourselves a chance to listen. Yeah, even when things look dire, you've shown that there is always hope always an intuitive guidance. That leads us towards trusting our innate wisdom, a new way to see things in our world, and to go deeper into the truths of our sacredness and the sacredness of everything around us. We are so honored to speak with you today.
Thank you so much for this conversation. Thank you. Doris been so good to be with you and Jonathan, thank you so much. Blessings to you. The wisdom that is the heart of John Phillips. Book comes from the Celts. Well, today we imagine Celtic land, as inhabiting Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Cornwall. When first referred to historically around 500 BCE, the Celts were actually a collection of tribes spanning the whole of middle Europe.
Ranging from what is now turkey to the Atlantic Coastline of present-day, Spain? In fact by the 1st Century ad, Celtic territories had become part of the Roman Empire and by Circa, 500 Celtic culture had mostly become restricted to Ireland, Western and Northern Britain and Brittany between the 5th and 8th centuries. The Celtic speaking communities.
In these Atlantic regions emerged, as quite a cultural entity with a common linguistic, religious, and artistic Heritage that distinguish them from surrounding cultures. The Celtic spiritual Traditions are rooted in peace. Aiming to facilitate three conditions and opening within the human heart, a Sheltering sense of Solace and the world.
For those who struggle and an ongoing sensual celebration of the beauty of Life. The early Christian Celts were able to see a divine presence in nature, one that stressed humanity. And dignity for all one way in which ancient I'll take practice, Incorporated nature, is that rituals were all conducted outside near and Wiz sacred trees oak trees. Specifically called Mehmet.
Ons, nemeton is a Celtic word and means holy Grove, nematodes can be found across the Celtic world, including Spain, France, Ireland, and Scotland, the Celts have long been a people who appreciate the mysterious nature of the space between where one thing ends and another begins. Begins transitional periods of any sort are considered sacred because they provide a gap or window into higher dimensions. And even include the time of death dusk Dawn, the time between day and night are seen
as points of mystical power. Within the liminal places is where we can most easily access. The wisdom of the spiritual World. John Phillips. Strikes me as someone quite Brave to engage with these liminal spaces. Studying and teaching with those of various faiths challenging himself to work outside of the designated Church structures and putting himself in places where he can ask questions rather than simply sit with answers using
this Celtic wisdom. John, Philip reminds us that it is each one of us who decides what is sacred and that sacred simply means to set apart for each of us to actively. Fate that, which is truly special, from what might be pedestrian or mundane. It was interesting that John Philip explain how certain voices speak to us and gained prominence in times when they are needed.
Most for example, John Muir as well as Saint Brigid the patron, saint of many things including poetry learning, healing, protection blacksmithing. Livestock and dairy production. She is also celebrated for Generosity for the poor Bridget's. Feast day is February 1st which was originally a pre-christian pagan Festival, marking the beginning of Spring next year. 2023 for the very first time st.
Brigid's day will be marked as a public holiday in the Republic of Ireland. The first named after a woman, it's remarkable that at a time when we need her words, the most she is celebrated by the entire nation. They chose to honor her and her wisdom and to set that day apart from others. It seems difficult. But to recognize something in this way is fairly simple. As British writer Stewart. Wild once wrote, how do you make something sacred? You say this is sacred and you
treated that way. Thank you for joining tree speech today.