Happy New Year. It's 2023. And we are glad to be back today. Feels especially celebratory as it marks our 30th episode and we are so thankful to all our listeners and Newfound tree Community. It has been our pleasure creating this podcast and we look forward to many more episodes. To come when we began the podcast. We never could have dreamed of the places that are connections to trees would take us. And to the people, we would meet along the way.
In today's episode, we'll talk with Swedish American Author, Linda, okasan mcgurk, whose book The open-air Life, discover the Nordic art of free Lutz league and embrace nature everyday, shows us how to embody a free Loops leave Life by getting outside and embracing Outdoors, no matter the time of year or temperature, especially in these darker and colder.
January days. When it may be more appealing to curl up inside Linda writes about the many ways being outside strengthens our mental and physical health, builds community, and nurtures a necessary relationship with nature the passion for the open-air life, that she not only advocates for, but also lives herself is hiring and I have a new appreciation and drive to connect even deeper to Nature around me as the famous Scandinavian.
Saying goes, there's no such thing as, bad weather, only bad clothing. My name is Dori Robinson and this is tree speech a podcast where we strive to listen to the
forest through the trees. This week's episode was written and recorded in Massachusetts on the native lands of the wabanaki Confederacy. Penacook the massachusett and Pawtucket people and in New York on the lands of the Lenape tribes as well as the sapne tribe of Sweden, tree speech is co-written and produced by Jonathan Zellner with a light theater Guild The Norwegian concept free Lutz leave means open-air life or free are life or fresh air life.
The word was first published by the famous playwright Henrik Ibsen and a poem in 1859, which reads in the lonely Cedar Corner. My abundant catch, I take there's a heart and a table and free Lutz leave for my thoughts.
Free Lutz leave far predates this poem and Has been in the Norwegian Society for over 5,000 years, the Norwegian government defines this as embracing nature, and enjoying the outdoors, as a way of life, a possibility of recreation Rejuvenation and restoring balance, among other things, a way of returning to our true home, where humans and nature intersect and the value that is created in those meetings.
Linda okasan McGurk's previous book is a major centered parenting Memoir. There's no such thing as bad weather. A Scandinavian mom's secret for raising healthy resilient and confident kids from free leads. Leave to he gay and she and her books have been featured in several leading. American magazines newspapers and online sites, including the Wall Street Journal, the New
York Times Psychology today. Orion magazine tree hugger and many more Linda lives in Sweden, but had spent 15 years in Indiana where she sorely missed the relationship with land. She had previously had in Sweden with forests streams and mountains, quite nearby. That's part of what is so wonderful about. Free leads, leave it can happen in one's backyard. All connection with nature is valuable. This is the heart of Linda's work to continue to find ways. Both big and small.
To be within our natural environments jumping in puddles, digging, in dirt climbing, to the tops of mountains, conducting business meetings, while on a walk or sleeping outside under the stars, are all possible ways to lead to an open-air of Life. Speaking with Linda was an absolute pleasure. So many of my own personal values such as being outside communing with trees finding ways. Both big and small to learn about nature. Are what she speaks about and
lives every day. I hope you find our conversation as enlightening as I did. Let's listen. Hello Linda. How are you? I'm great. Thank you for having me on. Congratulations on this recent release of your new book, the open-air life, we have loved reading it and we've been really inspired by it. So thank you for taking the time to speak with us about it today. Thank you so much. I and that was the purpose of the book really to inspire.
So it makes my heart happy to hear that it's having the intended results. Very much so. And it's not a concept that is very prevalent in such a thoughtful put together way. So could you describe for our listeners? What the open-air life means to you? Yeah, of course, open-air life. So that's, that's sort of my translation, loose loose translation of the, the Swedish word, three lifts, leave, and that roughly translates to open air life and it ruined, Goes
back to to the 1850s. When people felt like, you know, it industrialization and urbanization, we're sort of starting to take their toll on people and they were sort of seeking out the countryside and trying to reconnect with the lifestyle that they used to have.
And so that's sort of very briefly the history of it, since then, it's been just a lifestyle here in the Nordic countries that I grew up with I think in The US were more used to thinking of outdoor life in terms of outdoor recreation. It's more sort of focused on activities and a lot of times, maybe more sort of exhilarating or adrenaline-inducing activities or hiking big month mountains or hunting fishing writing ATVs and things like that.
But feel if Steve is a little different in that, it can certainly involve hiking and The climbing big mountains, but it really emphasizes sort of nearby nature and connecting with nature in everyday life and whatever way you can. And of course this is going to depend like how you do it. It's going to depend on where you live and what kind of access you have to Green spaces. So to me it's something that I, like I said, I've grown up with it, I live in rural Sweden now.
So to me it's about being out there every day I have I have my routines and rituals and nature. Like I go outside every day, I have a walk that I that I go on and to do it every day, regardless of the weather, which is another sort of main idea behind fetus. Leave is to to really try and find something to love about every season and every type of weather. So that's the short short version. Wonderful answer. Thank you. You incorporate.
Prelude sleeve into your life and into Your children's lives. Can you tell us a bit more about that incorporation and that integration? Yeah, a lot of it is really about finding ways of being active outside in your everyday life, like for example, walking places or riding your bike places instead of taking your car and granted I live in a rural area so that's not always practical here.
But if I go to the city for example 2 Try and, you know, maybe Park not, not drive like all the way to the door, but to park a little ways away. And also do do some walking or taking public transit because that way you also get that sort of everyday movement in, I think it's important to sort of rekindle that relationship with walking. It's about embracing whatever you have nearby. So it's just about, yeah, embracing what you have? Embracing what you have in all four seasons.
Yes. And actually you enjoy doing like my kids are older now. So when they were little of course, then you know it's easy to to just go outside and play but now they're 11 and 14. So it's a little bit of a bit more about. They sometimes want more challenges or to them is more important to have a goal or a destination, but we we compromise and we usually we
have a good time. Feel if Steve is Of the main actually main ways that we spend quality time together on the, especially on the weekends, and it's a great even for a teenagers, it's something that you can do all life which you know I really want to emphasize that to you. Start them young and it's something, you know unlike boards for example which a lot of kids play when they're younger. Maybe through high school, possibly through college if you really good.
But after that, you know, let's face it. A lot of people don't perceive Sue that those boards anymore, but with the loose sleeve is something that you do build the foundation in the in the early years and then it's something you can do. If you're in good health, you can do it in your golden years as well, for sure. And it will help you stay in good health as well.
Very, very much so. I mean, that was one of the things that really stuck out to us about the book is that you have a chapter on how the outdoor is, play a part in bringing joy and health through all seasons of life and I do That there's a great emphasis on younger, rather than older. Yes. And we don't talk about that a lot. Yeah. And unfortunately, it was a lot of nursing homes and and
institutions like that. It is always hard to find the time and staff to provide residents with experiences, like that. But in in Sweden, sealer, Steve is such a strong part of the tradition here that they really tried to to provide The elderly with walks or being able to be outside and do some gardening, you're seeing like greenhouses and and they're out there grilling and they have all kinds of kinds of fun outdoor activities for the elderly.
And if it's a good it's just a good idea all around. It makes them happy but it also Studies have actually shown that you know, by bringing in more. Yeah like gardening and time for the elderly to be. Outside. They need less medication and their symptoms of stress and anxiety go down. So it's really a win-win. I think for everybody involved, do you remember when he first became acquainted with free Loops leave as as a concept or
was it always there? My grandparents took me to Swedish Lapland which is the mountainous area, north of the Arctic Circle. And so I think that's going like going back. Back through memories. That's probably the trip that has sort of meant the most to me. But I don't know that it's because of the memories that I have from that trip because I was only three years old at the time. But there were so many. There were pictures that we sort
of became, you know. We kept revisiting this trip, my grandparents and I and I was very close to my grandparents and I think it's because we know that not only spending time in nature, When you spend it with, when you spend the time with people, that you're close to that, you love that really amplifies the experience and that makes you even more
attached to the place. What an extraordinary thing that it's so multi-layer, that it's the memories of your grandparents, it's the memories of the land, it's the memories that come again and again through the photos. That's, that's sort of how life is, is you experience something once and then again and again, yes, motional.
A mentally. Yeah and eventually your memories and the pictures and it all kind of Blends together and you don't know exactly what what's memories and what's you know what came from the slide shows in your grandparents basement, but it doesn't really matter because the what matters
is that? You know, I have this place in my heart I just love it. It like every time I come up there and I see the same scenery that I had in those that my grandparents had in their pictures, like it gives me goosebumps every time and gives me goosebumps just talking About it. It's like it's that profound to me and it's giving me Goose Bumps just hearing about it. I mean those are the stories that really shape us. Those are the stories of our souls and yes.
Become who we are. Yeah. So it comes naturally to me to try and create those those stories for my kids. That's been the main driving Factor behind me trying to make sure that my kids to have this sort of deeper. Ship with nature because that's really what through the state is about really feeling that nature
is home. It's not just an abstraction in a textbook, it's a place the place where we came from and it's a place where, where we at least should feel at home and the more you practice view to see the more comfortable, you will be because a lot of people today, unfortunately, as we've been become alienated from nature over, Percent of us in the developed world at least live in cities today, and we spend so much time indoors and we're plugged into all our
devices, and there's just so much to gain from from sort of digging into that evolutionary past of being out there. That's something you emphasized in the book is, is that it's a practice which is such an important point. I mean, we, you know, the fact that we do Exotic, Sighs. You know, national parks and we think of Nature and these things as being far away and hard to touch.
And we forget that there is so much locally and there's so much we can do locally and ways that we can be involved locally. One story from your book that really hit me was the person who wanted to sleep outside once a week, every week, every week for a year and because of work he ended up doing. So not necessarily far away but fine. Being the Beauty and the open era life in within the city, whether it was backyards or playground or yeah.
And I think that we think it is far away always and we miss, what's beautiful right here? Yeah, I mean I've had some amazing campus when my girls without leaving our Deck with even you know, slept on our outdoor furniture sometimes and just because there's been a starry night. There was a night and just now in September, when my 14 year old looked up at the night sky, we were sitting in our living room and she said, mom, have you seen this guy tonight?
It's so beautiful. Just look out there. Can we can we sleep outside? And at first, I just didn't feel like it at all. Is like, you know, comfortably Seated on the couch, you know, watching a show or whatever. Not in the mood at all. But then I took a look at the of the At the sky at night sky too. And I was like, you know, this is really something it was so pretty. It was just so many stars out and I just felt like, well, you know, my 14 year old just asked me to sleep outside.
I can't like I can't deny her then, so I just pulled myself together and we ended up sleeping on the, on our couches on the deck that night and it was beautiful just to be able to go to sleep and have that sort of as your backdrop drop that alone, just it's moving and it's all inspiring for sure. Anytime, you look at the night sky, I think. And I'm, I'm not, I'm not a typically like a religious person, but I look at the night sky.
And I'm like, that's, it's so it makes me very, very humble and understanding that, I do not understand a lot of life's mysteries. And so that's that's what my so to me. Three, listen. Is very much spiritual to, it's a way that I, even though, I don't have like an affiliation with a church per se. I like being out in nature because it, it makes me feel part of. I mean, this sounds super cliche but it's so true makes me feel part of something greater than
myself. You know, something that's been there for eons before me and will still be there long after I'm gone. And That's there's something. There's something to that, that, that makes you humble very much. So I think I mean nature is so full of Oz for us, it's very much trees that are all inspiring. That's that's what we go to, and think of and treat you mentioned that trees have a special standing with the open-air life. Can you tell us about caring trees?
It's such a wonderful that goes back to the old. Sort of agrarian society when trees were so special, they they were seen as sort of the like a gathering place for a lot of the sort of supernatural creatures that people believed in back
then. And so in the countryside, people would often they would try to build their houses like near a large tree because they you know, they felt Like that way, they would be protected and if there wasn't a tree on the land to begin with, they would usually plant a tree. The idea being that if you took care of this tree and nurse, stood and kept all the supernatural creatures happy. Then they would look after you and and the farm animals as
well. So I have some ideas in my book for how you can benefit from the power of trees and one of them is tree-hugging It was actually my sister who introduced me to tree-hugging it. And at first, I thought it was kind of. Yeah, it was. It was I thought it was kind of silly at first but then I started doing it. And I was like, I like this, it's calming and soothing, and actually, I've noticed two, I
had an incident. When my youngest daughter when she was little, I think she was about five P. She often threw Tantrums when she was little. I noticed that one point that trees seemed to calm her down. And at one point, you know, She had a tantrum and we went outside because it does seem like going outside. Would diffuse the Tantrums as well? And I walked away for a few minutes because I had to cool off and I felt like she had to cool off.
And then I came back, I found her sitting at the at the roots of this. I think it was a birch tree and she had clasped her arms. She had wrapped wrapped her arms around this tree and she was just kind of leaning into it. And then I asked her what she was doing and she said, That I found a friend while you were gone.
I was like, okay, well tell me more and she told me that she felt safe around the tree and, yeah, like, I end up writing a whole blog post about it because I was, it was a revelation to me that that children like even young children, could actually feel very calm DIN and soothed by by a tree. And after that, we actually named the tree her calm down tree and, you know, we ended up going to it several times when
she was upset. So I think trees can definitely have can definitely help us in a lot of ways of just, for mental mental, wellness, and I know it in the forest bathing tradition, that being around trees, can actually, I mean that it even benefits, our physical health, I definitely feel that it does and I've always been a tree hugger in that story about your daughter is just beautiful because it's innately in us.
We find it doesn't surprise. I need that a child would say, oh wow, this friend who is rooted in the ground? Will give me some more right now. What a beautiful thing. Another natural element that you know, you were mentioning the night sky before and it makes me think of this concept you mentioned in the book Moon gotta moan got the idea. One gotta which is particularly beautiful. There's all these words that we do not have an English equivalent for.
Can you describe the word? Somos, en gotha, it literally translates to Moon straights and it's just a word that describes this reflection on water from typically, at full moon on a clear night to go down to a lake on a, on a full moon. You'll see this Shimmer kind of at like this streak long streak across the water and that's what Mom gotha is. And here it's just one of those beautiful Beautiful words to describe something that we like to observe in nature and we have
a lot of words like that. I have a long list of words that we use for different types of locks as well. And I think a country's language, I think it's a reflection a lot of times of the culture. So I'm not surprised that we have all these words to describe different natural phenomena in in Sweden. And and another one is I singing, which is another thing that it's a sound. The sound that ice makes when it contracts and expands. And it's the most beautiful
harrowing sound I've ever heard. And in the wintertime, one of my favorite things to do is actually just to go down to the lake here and sit there for a while and just listen to the ice saying. It's very, it's very powerful. It's quite quite amazing, it's just another one. Those simple ways of connecting with nature that that I do on a
regular basis. There's something about having a word for it. That is extraordinarily powerful because as soon as you said that about the ice, I knew immediately, I had a visceral reaction. Yeah. How wonderful to have a word for it so that you can make space for it in your world. Absolutely. It's So important today. I mean I feel like a lot of us feel like life is a little out of whack today. And American society is very
competitive. A lot of people complain that there's not enough balance between work life and family life, for example, and there's a lot of pressure and that pressure trickles down to our children. I think, I think feel asleep could really do a lot of good
here in that, it really. It allows us to just be I mean I feel it myself every day when I when I go outside that's when I can really just drop everything that has to do with work and I can just allow myself to just be in the present moment because that's that's what that's the only thing that nature asks of me is that I'm actually present I think and I think for kids today a lot of them I mean there's so much pressure even on
preschoolers to reach. Certain academic milestones and there's this emphasis on getting getting everything done like earlier and earlier for some reason instead of just letting them be and I think Felix need can sort of help bring that back
into into balance. Well we have barely scratched the surface of the content in this book which is filled with such interesting and informative stories and recipes and And is and truly serves as a how-to guide with everything that you would need to know, to practice any level of free leads sleeve, it's definitely pleasing to look at to hold to live through and to read cover to cover Linda. Do you set New Year's intentions or have goals for this coming year?
Yeah, I usually do either like a challenge or some intention for the new year and so usually I try to do something. Thing that is sort of meaningful and also something along the lines of making our lives a little more sustainable for this year, we're going to try and do the 1000 hours outside challenge my daughters. And I I felt like we needed maybe a little more motivation or that they needed maybe a
little more motivation. And so I told them about this Challenge and they actually jumped on it. So we're going to do that. Exciting. Well, good luck with that. Thank you Linda. It's been a real pleasure to speak with you today. You are an inspiration and you're a leader who so thoughtfully and gently is able to guide us from very young to older and age to live, our best possible lives. And to remind us, what is important spending time in the
outdoors? No matter the season, our weather and sharing that experience with the ones, you love just like this. 1,000 hours, challenge ahead of you. So thank you for your work and for being with us today. Thank you. I was my pleasure. What a joy it was to speak with Linda. Ultimately she teaches us that free loot sleeve is about slowing down in nature. No. Fancy equipment or distant travel is required.
No, specialized clothing and certainly no, motorized vehicles, simply finding ways to be outside at any age. This is part of what I found Most Fascinating about the book and my talk with Linda, despite my love of trees and going King, I Am by no means an outdoor expert, but actually free loot sleeve is inherently. Not competitive, it's not supposed to be elite or filled with pressure, or even done with
speed. It's for everyone at every stage, the images, in my head of extremely athletic Trail Runners, slowly melts away. As I read the book allowing me to savor my own relationship with nature just as it is. And just as As I am, it's important to note that for many people going outside everyday. Simply is impossible for many reasons, including disabilities or even safety. I want to recognize my privilege that I am able to do so, and that I have access to beautiful spaces and feeling safe.
When I am there. This time of year is always filled with resolutions and intentions, and it feels like we are at a clean slate, a noob. Beginning sometimes these intentions or resolutions can seem harsh and strict. But what if they were more gentle? And Linda's book. She speaks about how free Lutz leave can exist in different forms in any situation. She defines basic principles of open air life that are very simple being one with nature using your body, keeping it
simple. I think that one really speaks to me. What if this year for a clean slate? We didn't have to work quite so hard or Be so harsh. What if it was, just that simple to take in a little bit of nature every day. I think that sounds doable for me for 2023. What do you think? Trees features? How about for you? Thank you for joining tree speech. Today, we'll have more information about Linda okasan mcgurk, and her work in our show, notes to learn more about our podcast and episodes.
Please visit tree speech, podcast.com we're thrilled to be able to offer interviews, creative insights and stories about the natural world we live in and the trees who guide our way. Please also consider supporting us through our patreon. Every contribution supports our production and will be giving gifts of Grace. Attitude, including an invitation to Treehouse our new virtual community for patrons of all levels.
Please also consider passing the word to tree-loving, folks, and rate, and review us on Apple podcasts. Every kind word helps.