Warning this episode contains scenes that may be disturbing to some of our listeners. In the eighties and early nineties, Pablo Scobard and other well known drug lords cause an instability similar to a war, not only in Medegin, but in nearly all of Colombia. This period of narco terrorism left a trail of pain that its victims still suffer from. The Inflexion Memorial Park has forty six thousand, six hundred
and twelve holes. Each one represents a victim of narco terrorism in Colombia between nineteen eighty three and nineteen ninety four. Those small holes represents Captain Umberto Coral, a memorial for this victim, one of the thousands who lost their lives in this war. Among so many deaths, the majority are often not remembered, especially not as heroes. Here Jennifer Corral Beto's.
Sister Aki in Colombia and Saklum Mucco's Saka Mucco Tomnahaka Mucco's dogument balis i sin om nahis a think said he is as intol.
Here in Colombia. They have made many tributes, documentaries, they make series, They do everything for certain people, but my dad has never ever been mentioned in the history of Colombia. In fact, many people ask me about people they might know the story about, but not because I tell them, but maybe because they follow my brother and they asked me, what happened to your dad? They asked me, so I tell them, but they say, oh, your dad wasn't in this thing or that thing. No, no, I mean he
was super important. I mean nothing is known.
Jennifer is not mistaken. There is a Wikipedia page called filmography on Pablo Scoar. On that page you can find thirty three productions, including documentaries, series and fictional films, in which the most famous Columbian drug lord appears Porkiquinustasista.
I mean, my son asked me why they don't honor my dad more, Why he's never mentioned, Why he's not in Colombian history, my twelve year old son. Imagine if my twelve year old son, who didn't live what we lived, and he said that.
Jennifer and above all her brother Beto have thought to prevent Captain Carrals story from falling into anonymity, into oblivion because the story of Paulos Cobard is known almost worldwide. But where are the anonymous heroes who helped put an end to him. Where is the thorough investigation to clarify the murder of those who did not participate in the corruption and perhaps died from it, like Captain Corral, m.
Were die locajoe Kreo is.
Colombia and the truth is. I believe that my dad was killed by the Colombian state itself, according to what I know, what my brother has told me today. I say that, being more aware of the reality of what he did, that maybe he knew a lot of things at the time and maybe they wanted to silence him.
In Colombia, the state insists on hiding the truth. However, society is increasingly active in demanding to know that truth. It has taken too long while people witness a trustities without really knowing what happened.
In Colombia, that in Colombia they would tell the truth, the whole truth, not just the truth that's convenient to the state, not the truth that's been covered up, but the full truth about everything.
This is Transportista who murdered Captain Corral Episode nine, a link between suffering and hope. As we have reviewed in previous episodes, Colombia has been emerged in a very complex armed conflict for over six decades. Complex because it has involved multiple actors who have exerted violence against the population of the wrong country, drug traffickers, guerrilla groups, paramilitaries, and
even agents of the state itself. Given the complexity of the conflict, the Colombian government created a commission tasked with preparing a report that would account for the context that led to the armed conflict, as well as detailing the cases that occurred within it. The Truth Commission for Clarification of the Past Coexistence and Non Repetition. On June twenty eighth, twenty twenty two, the Truth Commission published its final report.
It took three years and seven months, during which nearly ten thousand victims voluntarily participated in individual and collective interviews. Additionally, illegally armed groups in das reigenous communities, businessmen, politicians, police officers, military personnel, and even former presidents among others, contributed to the report. Jesuit Priest Francisco Rue, the commissioner's president, presented the report.
Nun ten dierum keulr de armalo.
Communias keleian prote Helo la destruya Hladja paramilitarios.
He pointed out the violence perpetrated by different actors who tore down entire communities while ironically claiming they were there to protect them. At the ceremony, the then President elect Gustavo Petro also participated, but incumbent President Ivan duqu was absent. Discovering the absolute truth referred to by Jennifer Corral in the previous segment, has been difficult, but there are Colombians who have dedicated their lives to it.
Me no, but it's Mariae Emma wills Or Regon Yosoi of UIs professor inn a Parte the National and Odra thens.
My name is Mariaeima Willis Oregon. I am or was a professor for many years at one part of the National University as well as a University of Los Angeles. I was at the Institute of Political Studies and International Relations and as a department director and associate professor in other institutions. Oh, I'm sorry, sorry, I missed a.
Part an important part. Mariaema was involved in establishing the National Center for Historical Memory. It is an initiative to the develop a multi format archive of the memory of the most painful events of the armed conflict in Colombia.
Itami, papel digamos, the media, the articular or institutional.
Memorial speak.
I also have a role, let's say, as a meviator, as an institutional coordinator with the security forces that want to remember their victims. So I also know something about the memory processes undertaken by the Colombian police and army, especially.
In the context of the violence that plagues are continent memory begins to play a fundamental role.
Is eunopienza and America Latina and the Ituras and Odrospa isis last week mastanac memoria.
If we think about other countries in Latin America that come from dictatorships, well, at that time, in other countries too, victims remembered as a way to fight against impunity and to claim the dignity of their death or their missing ones. Let's put it in that way.
Colombia did not come from a dictatorship. It was a democracy with many areas of opportunity, but it was not a dictatorship. However, its society had thousands of victims who wanted to tell what was happening in the conflict.
In Dos Lalai. The victim.
And dos Milsinko established cass A you recons tru itial conflict last dynamic as a conflict TORMO.
So the Victims and Justice Law and Peace, which was approved in two thousand and five, establishes the need to reconstruct the conflict, the dynamics of the armed conflict, and this responsibility falls on the National Commission for Reconciliation and Rehabilitation. That commission has multiple tasks and has to reintegrate former combatants, provide reparations to the victims, and narrate the conflict.
An ambitious commission with a painful but indispensable task to narrate the truth and recount the mistakes and horrors of the conflict, even if they are uncomfortable for the state.
Locyo Coures delalais established.
Reconstruction de las Amas conflict ormo so retos paramilitaris is a los actors legalis.
The law establishes the reconstruction of the dynamics of the armed conflict, especially focusing on the paramilitaries and illegal actors, but it does not mention the Colombian state with equal force.
What the group does is appropriate those articles and expand the group's mission and so the group begins to reconstruct the dynamics of the armed conflict, including all of the actors, not ignoring the role that the state has played in the Colombian conflict, but on the contrary, including that role.
Because the Colombian state also committed atrocities in its mission to eradicate illegal subversive groups. Let's remember the Viatina massacre in which a group of twelve hooded policemen killed nine people in Medigine, and there were many more incidents like that. In order to include the state as a participant in the armed conflict, another law was approved in twenty eleven, the Victims and Land Restitution.
Law zum cambio fum yes last Victims and Victims las victimari victims.
Entring in sally.
That is a fundamental change in perspective. It allows the victims, the victims of the state, the victims of the paramilitaries, the victims of the gerias, to enter into that law and be recognized by it. And also the state enters not only as a victim of the conflict, but also as a participating actor in the armed conflict.
Because this participation of the state is particularly difficult to define.
Parte location conflict is.
Part of what an armed conflict does is a raise complexity, eraise the complexity of actors, alliances, and dynamics, and establish a view of good and evil, a very binary view where for some the state is a bad guy and pure citizens are the good ones. For others, the geriga is the bad one and the state is the good one.
This binary perspective, explained by Mariaima Wills, is also reflected in how the Truth Commission was received. Some defended as a democratic process to achieve peace, but some reject it. It is a matter that generates deep feelings in a divided and wounded society due to such a bloody conflict. And just as some consider the state as good or bad in black and white terms, talking about the state as a homogeneous force where everyone thinks the same is
also risky. Like everywhere else you can find everything.
Businesses are you democratic?
Al pic issues institutionists peroyotra sector is suprememento retarius verticalis.
There is a sector that recognizes the need to democratize the country and its institutions. Still, there are other supremely authoritarian vertical sectors that basically defend a very authoritarian.
View of order.
Yes, so I believe that understanding the role of the security forces in the armed conflict requires those nuances.
An example of this is the peace agreement with the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Columbia People's Army or PARK EPPE, one of the most feared and bloodthirsty guerrilla groups in the armed conflict. After four years of negotiations in Havana, Cuba, the Colombian government and PARK signed an agreement for the demobilization of this guerilla group with a series of conditions. The fact is now a political party, a decision that
continues to polarize Columbian society. According to Mariaema, the Truth Commission was created to continue the peace process. It's a way of understanding the context in which the armed conflict was possible and clarifying those episodes of violence that characterized it.
La comisionescucho alas victim as busco logos de were.
The Commission listened to the victims from all regions. It sought to make contact and also have truthful dialogues in the regions. In some cases, it also brought perpetrators face to face with victims and made them account for their actions.
It was not an easy time. Ask try to imagine it, gathering thousands of people from all corners of the country to talk about what traumatized them for life. It is a process that obviously evokes strong emotions, and while some approve it, there are those who reject it. As difficult as this process was in Colombia, the reconciliation initiative rounds were achieved and the Truth Commission published their final report. In the eleven volumes that make it up, chilling figures
were published. For example, four hundred and fifty thousand, six hundred and sixty four people lost their lives, sixteen thousand, two hundred and thirty eight cases of forced recruitment of children and teenagers were registered. There are four thousand, eight hundred and eighty four civilian victims affected by land mines, and one thousand, two hundred and ninety four were victims
of sexual violence, among others. However, the Truth Commission was also rejected by more conservative sectors in Colombia, such as former President Albaro Rive who said the Truth Commission has a license to lie. For Mariaima Wills, the presentation of this report is essential because.
Jan Capsula Alsufrimiento and Colombia.
It brings to the forefront and encapsulates the suffering experience in Colombia for so many years through the voices of the victims, but it also highlights the efforts being made to overcome the armed conflict. It's can link between suffering
and hope. It's like a bridge to say, look, this suffering has not been in vain because now we recognize what we have experienced, and that recognition allows us to think about the future differently and think about what should not be repeated in this country, to break free from the cycles of violence.
Cycles of violence that unfortunately are still active and ongoing. Because the armed conflict has not completely ended in Colombia. There are still active guerrilla groups like the Alna, paramilitary groups are still present, and obviously drug trafficking still exists. These cycles of violence have involved different actors, as in the case of Captain Krral's murder, there was a combination
of factors that made this tragic out come possible. Let's remember, according to Beto, a police officer named LUs Maria Roolella Maso deceived Captain Corral into going out with her on the night of April twenty one, nineteen ninety four, and in collision with other men who assaulted him. They shot him three times, ending his life. Days after the murder, the police washed the car in which they intercepted Captain Corral,
thus erasing substantial evidence. LUs Maria Roleva, the mysterious woman, attended Captain Corral's funeral, but quickly disappeared.
Quando la fria or douglas en.
Resafree When I went to approach her, the lady left, she disappeared.
Took callicari as a cero or qualata intention? And what did you want to ask?
Or what were you trying to domke? No person?
In other words, I think the first thought one hans when people die is to ask how, why, what happened? That was what I wanted to ask her, But it didn't happen. I did not have the chance.
The authorities confirmed to the Coral family that she had died, but Beto Corral discovered years later that she was still alive. He found her on social media and tried to get in touch with her, but she blocked him.
Sim that's grimy marimbres Berta Corra, Yes, I made that mistake.
I sent a message to her and I said, Hi, lose Mari, my name is Umberto Corral. I am the son of the police Major Umberto Corral. I want to talk to you, and I never got a response. Then I found her on Instagram. She ended up blocking me on all social media.
Upon receiving the judicial file of the case, Beto learned that she had fired a fourth shot that none of the witnesses heard. She tested positive for gunshot residue, confirming that she had fired a weapon. This led Beto to conclude that she had participated in his father's murder. The file indicated inconsistencies in LUs Marii's testimony, but she was not called again to testify, and that lead was never pursued.
Lasigeno avident lets Parolian yes, alien stoiment We're looking for it.
Evidently that woman did fire at someone, and I'm certain that someone was my dad. I've determined that missus LUs Marie bole Maso, a member of the police, with the help of those men, murdered my father.
According to Beto's own investigations, before or being murdered, Captain Korl planned to expose his superior in the search block Colonel Ugaguilar for stealing hidden statues of money or drugs belonging to the drug lord Pablo Scovard.
When Sara contesta Sola la la Henria colam.
Well, that answer speaks for itself. The relationship that he would have with my father's death dates back to a statement made by a police officer in which he claims that Major Uguaguilar ordered my father's murder because of the complaints he wanted to make about the calettas that Aguilar seized and did not properly report to the National Police.
Over time, Ugaguilar faced justice for his involvement in paramilitary activities, but he completed his sentence in twenty twenty two and is now free in Colombia. On the other hand, according to beto inquiries, Los Maria roolela Maso is also free and living in the United States. Despite the evidence that Beto has publicly presented, the case crossed the statute of
limitations in twenty fourteen and remains unsolved and closed. Beto has dared to speak publicly to make brave accusations, and for this he received threats that forced him to leave his country and to seek asylum in the United States. Beto was not part of the Truth Commission's tables, but ten thousand other people came forward to tell everything.
Is only historicasa historica case more impression.
Fatalis So the Commission does is if you will give an extra push to a historical wave. This historical force is very impressive because the war has been devastating and fears in this country. But amidst that ferocity, the citizenry has organized itself. Well, a part of the citizenry has organized itself and a part of the institutional framework and pro democracy political sectors have allied themselves with this great
force so that things don't remain in total impunity. I know we have problems, but I also acknowledge those.
Struggles individual and collective struggles to progress and build bridges that lead to peace in Columbia. We'll be back with more after a break. As mentioned in the previous segment, the Truth Commission published its final report almost a year ago. In June twenty twenty two. Catalina Sanrancisco bar the lawyer and scholar who explained the metaphor of the black boxes through which the Colombian state keeps secrets that could get them into trouble explains.
And vintioch unla commission blesto allow the entry was informed in a e who stament and arcotraffic continuing capitulo important ns informed.
On June twenty eight, the Truth Commission delivered its final report, and precisely drug trafficking has an important chapter in that report. And let's say that part of the recommendations first gives us a narrative about the relationship that drug trafficking had with armed conflict, how it permits and infiltrates all social, economic and political spheres of Columbia, but also a series
of recommendations. And within those recommendations, it will be very difficult because it acknowledges that annoledging mistakes is costly, especially when it entails human rights violations and the infringement of people's dignity, that is.
To say, when the state itself is involved in human rights violations. When state actors like those whom Beto points out as the ones responsible for his father's murder remain free, they remain free taking advantage of the institutional black boxes that continue to cover up their secrets.
Okamos and esperdios and inaustar mucho poporquela.
Construction a memory is voluntario is pontani.
Here we have some missing links in that chain, and it will take us a long time. Why because a construction of memory is voluntary and spontaneous, and we have to depend on the will of many people and above all institutions.
This is precisely why the Truth Commission's report is important, because it helps advance processes of justice, of preventing certain cases from remaining in impunity, trusting that victims and perpetrators speak about what they know.
Yea, in Columbia.
Construct vantozes as informous importante at Penalo Samos and.
In Colombia it may be late, but memory is being built. So the report is important. We are just beginning to understand it. The idea is for processes of socialization and education so that we understand what it is about, especially because some people still don't even know who the commission was and what it did. To come and talk about the report now, to.
Prevent people who have information of interest to the victims from staying silent because some do not see the present in such an optimistic way, like Betro and Jennifer Coral with.
K is.
Well, I believe that it's getting worse every time. I mean, I feel that people are being silenced more and more. There's more silence every time, and about these times, I feel like we're still the same, We still have the same violence. It's still the same, and nothing has advanced, and I don't see any thing happening for us to move forward.
Jennifer is not the only one in the family who does not see with optimism that drive for change in the context of the peace processes that currently takes place in Colombia.
Look Sclaros Scala, polysias Pa.
What is clear is that my father's death and the death of all those police officers has served absolutely no purpose, and the only way to stop this bloodshed is by changing that. Beyond drugs, which I detest, but I detest even more the stupidity of the world trying to fight it with blood and fire, and above all, those deaths are only in our countries, so it was odd for nothing. My father's death was also in vain.
In cases of human rights abuses, victims can receive reparations, but despite legislative reforms that acknowledge the participation of the Colombian state in the armed conflict and also acknowledged that they were involved in human rights abuses. Betu and his family have not received any form of reparation, neither symbolic nor economic. The state also abandoned them in the pursuit of justice and did nothing to clarify and punish Captain
Korral's murder. However, Betho continues to fight, perhaps from exile, but he is increasingly active on social media and other platforms to prevent impunity in his father's case and to seek justice in many other cases in Colombia. In the next and final episode of Transportista Who Murdered Captain Corral, you will hear a different episode a conversation to learn
more about Beto Corral. Transportista Who Murdered Captain Corral is a production of Exiled Content Studio and Detective in partnership with Ihartz Michael Tura podcast Network, and is hosted by me Alvaro Stes. Production by Diego Livares and Alvaro Sespenes with the help of Sabine Jansen, Anna Isabel, Octavio, Veronic Carnandez Reynolds Gutierrez and Stella Emmet. Written by Alvardo Sespenis edited by Carmen Ratterol, fact checking by the sire Jeppes.
Adaptation to English by Magalis Transki. Thanks to the voice actors who contributed in this episode. Beto corral Is, Razio Manzija, Jennifer carral Is, Andrea Sebaios, Mariaeima wills Is, Paulina Garcia Fontees, Teresa sifuenttees Is, Carmel Gratterol and Catalina sanranzzcobard Is, Veronica Hernandez. Executive producers are Carmel Gratterol, Rose reed Iszak Lee and the Eendriquez Sor. Sound designed by Uga Mendoza and Gonzalo Messi.
Original music by Sebastian Leon Daniel Batista Overseas Audio at Exiled Content Studio. Our executive producers at iHeart are Gisel Bencees and Arlene Sentan. Research by Mano Larios and Emma Friedland. Production supervision by Julio Gonzalez, created by the Eendrique Osora. For more podcasts, listen to the iHeart Radio app or
wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. The views and opinions expressest in this episode do not represent the producing companies and are solely the product of Franklin numberto Coral Garrido's own investigations, known as Beto Coral