I'm Tamika d Mallory and it's.
Your boy my son.
In general, we are your host of t M.
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Listen.
So we gotta move quickly today because we have the guests coming up that's gonna educate us, and you know we're gonna learn a little bit or something something.
So I want to talk about my thought of the day.
So there was an interview that I did a while back where I was talking. I was on TMZ and Kamala Harris was selected as the vice presidential pick.
And I remember I was in the car.
I was on my way to Brooklyn to a photo shoot, and while I was talking to the folks on TMZ, they asked me, do you think that Kamala Harris can become president?
Right?
Do you think she can also be president?
So she's vice presidential pick, but do you think that she can run and ascend to the presidency? And I said, I don't know. I said, because you know, racism is terrible, so that's already bad enough, and sexism, when you bring that into the equation, it's even worse. Right, So if you listen and I and a couple of people started attacking me. They went crazy. Not a lot of people,
but you know, there's a certain segment. A couple of people called me up, like, I'm just trying to understand your perspective because a lot of people are very sensitive about that racism and then comparing it with sexism, and it felt like I was including all women, white women, this woman, that woman or whatever, over black people and what black people have experienced, and specifically black men.
And so I was explaining it to a good friend and He.
Was like, why are you, Like, are you seriously trying to explain to me what you meant? Like I'm stupid, Like I understand exactly what you're talking about. It's not that I was saying that racism is not the most horrific, horrendous, disgusting atrocity of American culture. That is not what I was saying. What I'm saying is when you are black and then you had maybe let's just use it another example.
You black and you have a disability, or you're black and you are I don't know, you're black in you're trans, you're black in whatever, poor, you're black, and that makes what you experience already as a black person worse because you're adding another element onto it that really sort of deepens the hate and the oppression and the disgust that a person has to endure. And So when I look at Kamala Harris at that time, this is prior to
right now, this is years back. Like a lot of times, we are ahead of ourselves when we speak on issues. So I'm looking back at that time and I said that sexism is even worse. So what I was saying is that as a black woman, not as a woman in general, even though you see Hillary Clinton, also more qualified, didn't win the election. But that's a whole different set
of circumstances. But when you look at Kamala Harris as a black woman, she's going to deal with being black and then having on top of that her being a woman as another way for people to disrespect, discredit and even our own people, even our own people.
And let's just keep it. A hundred men.
In our community and women, men and women, but a lot more men who are unwilling to support her just because she's a woman, right Like there's some people who have policy disagreements with her, there's some people who are They look at it and they're like, listen, I have issues with Kamala Harris with things that she may have done, or things she said, or things the positions that she supports right now, and I'm not arguing with any of those.
But when I have.
People on my page calling her a thing, calling her a wench, calling her all these disrespectful names, and then I also see that there are people who could be helping her, But because of the way that you watch them treat women in general, you know why they are unwilling to support her because they never when I'm asking certain people, they like, oh no, I just don't think.
I just don't. They don't really have a real answer.
Okay, So anyway, I just want to say to myself, right like how Snoop said, I want to thank me. I just want to say to me, I was not wrong in what I said. And it's playing out for us to see it happening in real time.
And I know that.
When I spoke on it, I spoke on it not just as a black person, but as a black woman who I even know in spaces where we are doing, you know, in civil rights spaces and social justice spaces, in business spaces, I know that I am treated a different way than some of the black men who are my counterparts, or black men who may not even be as effective or as progressive or as whatever as me.
But just because I'm a woman, I deal with another layer of disrespect and of the sexism that is also ingrained in American culture.
Well, I have to agree, man, you know, I've said the same thing, and I think shout out to applies man. He had to give apology to black women because he didn't even understand the level of hate that Black women have experience, and I've listened to dudes just tell me, yo, she's a woman. She just shouldn't be leading you know what I'm saying, And she's nobody's gonna respect her and this and that, and it's like, wow, why I respected my mother? My grandmother was one of the strongest people
I know in my life. So when we have these conversations, there is definitely a facet of America where men do not respect women, and nick definitely do not respect Black women. Malcolm said it, the most disrespected, unprotected, and neglected woman in the world is the black woman. So person in the world, not just the woman, the most neglected person in the world is a black women. So we are able to see this in real time. So like, when you said it to me, I understood.
Exactly what I was.
It was Mark Thomson. He was like, like, why are you explaining it?
Anybody with good sense knows exactly what you're saying. They are trying not to know, or they're emotion. And it's funny because some of these same people.
Always are like, oh, let's not move with emotion.
And then when I speak to something that is my experience as a woman then it's emotional. That's cute. But anyway, let us move on. This is a point we're not going to do t because we gotta go. So you go see a music segment, all right, So.
We're gonna go to my music segment. Shout out to Marvin Being. You know, we was out.
In Detroit, super organized.
Marvin King Being Man, he put us all together. You know, you had a panel in Detroit with Ice Wear, Vessel Killer, Mike Push your T, Beanie C.
Freeway. You know, it was so many.
Different Nipsey Hustle's brother. The brother's name, it always escapes me, but I love.
Him so much, Black Sam, Black Sam, and we had a beautiful panel shadow.
To take the eating. We can't be leaving people out.
Since you want a name, pastor, Mike mc Mike McBride, what's our other brother's name?
Oh lord, but.
Listen, it was a dope panel.
And there's a soundtrack and the first song off the soundtrack is called still Here and it's the Vote or Else soundtrack and it's featuring Benny the Butcher, is featuring Jae Electronica, Freeway, Black Thought, Metal Feet, and Joe taking Eadie.
Shout out to Joe Taker.
You know she wasn't singing on this, but you know she she out here. She thinks she a singer.
Yes, she definitely thinks she can sign.
She's actually the song is dope and it's really touching, so make sure you go.
It's on all platforms.
Still here, his vote or else and is featuring all all this side this name and shout out to.
Phil Agnew was Agnew?
See I knew it was somebody important and feel is our brother.
That is yellow pain Yellow. It was a powerful it was a.
Very very powerful discussion. My boy Smoke Dizzer was on there.
And so much music came out. I mean, music is coming out of here.
It's going to be a dope. I'm going to be on the soundtrack, so it's gonna be on the.
S king bing king bing ing, not me king.
Make sure that you go and listen to that song. Still here. The soundtrack would be out very soon.
And still here, Still here. That's what's up. That's what's up.
And today we are joined by a super friend who has some information. I mean, as we've been saying, this election is really important for us.
We don't really care who doesn't like it, right, We don't.
Care who is not interested and who's mad at us, and who said we shouldn't be and don't this and that, go talk to somebody else, because we we're really deeply into this thing. And tm I has really been turned into a show to discuss all the elements of the
election for the next several weeks. And so in our super friend world, l Joy Williams, who's joining us today is somebody who of course is very special to me, and now you know, over the years she's become special to you as well, President of the NUBACP Brooklyn Network and also she and I serve on the board of Higher Heights, which is an organization that does a lot of political education and raising funds for black women candidates.
We do so many things.
She's a consultant, super brilliant, you got all the things in this one woman. But what's important for why she comes here today is because Joy has created. Joy is an educator, an educator, and so she's created a guide for the it says, a journal for the empowered voter, call Get Vote Ready, Get Vote Ready. And so today we're gonna be hearing from our sister l Joy Williams and I'm excited about that, just.
Her story, just when we're talking about the kids, Like.
Even though she's doing all this leadership in the community, she also is fostering several children at the same time.
That's why I love doing this podcast, right, because we get an opportunity to interview and highlight our friends who are doing so many dope things. So shout out to el Joy for educating us about civics and about what it looks like to vote in which we need to know about voting. And they're also educating us about humanity.
You know, right, it is humanity when you like, I'm gonna take Not only am I out here fighting for our rights, but then I learned that children needed help, and like she said, out of a.
Personal situation came her story.
So when people asked me, well, what's the first thing that I should do, I'm like, look at your life, look at the things that are near and dear to you, and make decisions about how you can get active based upon that. Because people who jump into stuff that has nothing to do with what they're really interested in, or because they get in it because they're like, oh there's a check, or oh there's you know, or everybody else is doing it.
I think I do it better.
Then you're in an area that does not really really make you feel like you're you're getting to your passion, like you're serving your purpose.
So there's that.
Yes, we definitely do have our sister el Joye. She is an educator, she is a friend. She is one of those individuals that when you think of her, she's always smiling, but you know, she's about business. So we have our sister, the one, the only El joy in the building.
Yeah, man, I love that, and I gotta come here more often.
That's it.
Thank you for both of you for inviting me today. I appreciate it.
Thank you for being with us.
Joy tell us you know, first of all, let's just get straight on in DOUAA CP Networks Chapters branch French. Oh my gosh, Okay, listen, we did not have a rivalry.
If nan right.
You know, it's just you know, we birthed everybody.
You see shade and shot already. That's what I love so much about you, Joy, Like I think so.
Many people feel like in the movement we are just stoic and boring and we're not like we enjoyed one another. We make jokes. We snacked like we did at the house back in the days when we were kids, and we have a good time. And you know, you're one of those people who, like my son says, you're always smiling, but you'd be serious as hell.
You'd be scaring me.
You say that in the elected say that too. Sometimes they don't know the difference between if I'm coming and being like, hey, how you doing, and like hang out to like, oh no, what did I do?
Well?
You're coming in the tradition of our queen mother, which is Mama Duke's Hazel and Dukes. Who is the president or the former? I saw somewhere the other data. I guess she's kind of like kind of she's cheat.
She's ninety two.
Yeah, you know, she said that she's not going to do it anymore. State NAACP Conference President.
Chargeah okay, got it.
So tell us about your book, This guide for you said, a journal for the empowered voter. Yeah, and I love the fact that you're speaking into people because I don't be feeling like people that empowered. So, you know, but talk about what your journal is all about.
Well, you know, one of the missions of what I do sure with Sunday Civics, which is every week, I sort of use what's happening in the political landscape to empower people with the knowledge to get involved and engaged in politics, because, as you know, part of our work as organizers, the first thing we do, particularly when we're going into spaces, is helping people understand how the system has worked, where you know who the decision makers are and then what you can demand, what you can do.
And in starting Sunday Civics, I realized that was a lot of Even in working inside government, I would still go into spaces, whether it was in the Controllers office or the city hall or whatever, and I would do the back door and I'm like, Okay, this is what you need to ask for, this is what is possible, this is what can happen. You know who, this is
the person you need to push. And I realized that that is something we take for granted a lot that everybody knows like who the decision maker is what I should be asking for. And that's why I started Sunday Civics with the Get Vote Ready Journal. You know, notice as we go through the journal, there's nothing, there's no emotion in it, there's no you know, you know, one party over another party. It is helping you make a strategic decision for you to prepare yourself and make sure
you have the information to engage in the election. And then too, starting with yourself and not with the candidates. You start with in the book, what what are the issues that matter to me? You know what moves me? What is the you know, kitchen table issue that I'm most concerned about. Then you go to the candidates based upon those issues to determine okay, now which one most aligned?
So based on this book, you know what was like the what made you say, you know what, I really need to make this book?
What made you sit down and say that?
Two reasons. One, you can always go to family. So this is for my cousin who call and text me on election day to ask me who were voting for or to ask me when is the election again? Or oh they got there. They may know okay, I know who I'm going to vote for mayor I know who I'm going to vote for president. But then they get there and they be like, it's some questions look like that I don't know nothing about. And to my dad,
you know, God bless his soul. Who literally he would call me to me from the voting book, right, And I'm like, Dad, you can't call you.
That's actually illegal, right.
And then I hear him arguing with the people in the like the pope. But I'm like, because they're doing this job, right, you're not supposed to do that. So this is for them.
I sent it to somebody. Is that I'm waiting, like, text me back what I'm supposed to do, and that's like illegal.
You'll take a picture of the ballance. I bet you you didn't know that.
This is for them. This is for you know, my cousin Candae and them, you know, so that they have Okay, this is my journal. This is my guy to prepare myself before I go into the voting booth. And it's designed and meant not for me telling you what to do, but for you to put together's prompts and questions and spaces there for you to contemplate. You know, what matters to me might be different than what matters to you, right, and so it's space for you to put that and
to you know, teach you. This is how I should engage in a political process, in the election process, you know, not so much to be swayed by celebrities, and I know that's the thing that everybody, well my favorite celebrity endorsed this person or did not write. But no, they're voting their own interests. They're voting their own money in their own pocketbook, Like this is how you vote and make your decisions for you.
I had to really get into the book. As soon as I saw you promote that it was ready, I called immediately got listen because I know it's necessary. Because even though this is a very contentious time. And let me tell you, I am so ready for November fifth to come and go. My spirit and my stomach and literally my body cannot sustain two or three more months of all this arguing and people right and crazy, and you're fallen out with friends and family. My cousin and I was in a big blow up about at a
family occasion. We end up being back love, but still we had to go through this like really difficult conversation. And the one thing I've realized is that civics one oh one, like basic understanding of politics and electoral politics and all of that, a lot of our people don't have it. And it was done on purpose to us and we have to really understand that it's not that you don't know just because you weren't paying attention or you're not smart or whatever. It's literally that it has
been designed that we would not know. And that, for me is it almost makes this moment, while it is incredibly stressful, it makes it like, I'm glad that we have this type of race where people get to pay attention and start asking the questions, even if it's the most ignorant conversation you've ever been involved in.
Yeah, so I know you had to be like.
Oh, no, we're not gonna do this, we gonna learn something because this ridiculous.
Yeah.
Well, not only that, and that this shouldn't be the only one that you do, because the work that you all do right and until freedom and talking about the district attorneys, talking about governor's races and things, those are where we need to get engaged. And that's one of you know, I said to someone recently, it's something I
say all the time. When we throw back to the modern civil rights movement and talk about the right to vote, particularly in the South, you know, people just like, oh, we got the right to vote, and you know, that's it That's what our ancestors died for the right, and I think we do a disservice by not following that, not giving contexts and qualifying them and saying they weren't just dying to be able to go in the boot, that's right.
Right.
They wanted to elect sheriffs, district attorneys that would protect their communities that they were building, that weren't members of the KKK, that weren't members of the White Citizens Council, and would actually prosecute people if someone came through and lynched their brother or their cousin.
Right.
They wanted you know, just think about Brown v. Void and the original cases that led up to that. They wanted they were paying into a system that weren't properly providing resources for their children's education, and so they wanted the ability to be on the school board to say, okay, our district, our schools need a bus, our schools need
proper books and materials. Right, And so they knew that generation knew that it was tied to their vote to be able to elect people that were making those decisions. And we lost that, as you said, it was deliberate. We lost that knowledge that these things of depressing. Our communities were tied to these elected positions, that we needed to be in those rooms, and we needed to have our voice in those rooms, even if we weren't the
ones elected. And so that's what I try to do with Sunday Civics is so to remind our communities, right that this isn't just about electing somebody popular that looks like you. This is electing someone that will listen to you, that is responsive to your advocacy efforts, that has the wherewithal to come back and engage with the community or be within the community, and understanding those tools and how to exercise right that civic bone that we all need. I think it's really really important.
So I want to ask you this just based on local levels, right, Like, what do you think the most important elections that people don't even really focus on, because I know there are certain elected officials that control so many different things financially, the resources within the community, the programs,
all those things. What do you think just on a local level, because everybody's going to talk about the president, Like, what do you think as a person that just goes to work every day, that lives inside the community, what are those jobs that.
You think civics that we should be focusing on voting for.
I'd like that you brought up that point, because it depends on where you live and that you know, and that's the and why I provided the space for that, because you know, in some places, depending on how your town, how your citory is incorporated or structured, the power of the budget, you know, may be with the county executive, right, not the not the city council or the you know,
or the mayor. The mayor may be a ceremonial and he sell carpets on the weekend right right, right, or you know, right, and so that that he's just there as an administrator or she's just there as an administrator. So part of that education is also understanding that you start local, don't start at the top, don't start at president, don't start at governor, start local. How is my town incorporated? And where is the seat of power?
You know?
Is it the city council? Is it the state legislature? Who has control over the issues that I care about and about my budget? Like who makes those decisions? My brother lives in an area over in the Poconos incorporated a little differently than like us here in New York City, and he sits on a board that makes decisions about the town's you know, money, on whether or not they're going to do sidewalks or they're going to invest or whatever.
Those things are important. And once he got on there, he was like, Oh, I guess the.
Way the rue like something really has. This is not rules that does come from the sky.
They're people, right, And there's regular people that are my neighbors that are sitting around the table making a decision and no one's ever there, right, but they're making a decision. And he may be at a barbecue or something and hear people complain about something and not realize that, oh, that is a decision I made, you know, or didn't make. And so that's I think what's important is looking at
how your town, how your area is incorporated. And I provide examples of that in the book of like how you can find that, how you can find that out, and learning what what is the seed of power in that instance, because particularly nationally, everybody focuses on the big cities Chicago or New York, the top one hundred cities, and more than likely a lot of them are incorporated the same or organized the same there's a mayor, there's a city council, or there's you know, some balance or whatever.
But people live in a lot of different things, and you could work in one area that's a town or a county and live in another one that's rural, and it's a group of your neighbors who are making those decisions. And so that's why I think it's important for you to understand. And it may not be that you're gonna engage daily, right, You're not gonna be me and Tamika, and you're gonna be like every event, every protest and
things like that and every town meeting. But at least the issues that you care about and things that you care about, and understanding who makes those decisions, where the money comes from, who's it directed to, is important. And you can look at some of our poor estates, like Missis be a place like that. If you look at how money and contracts bounce back and forth, it's like the same people just it's like, oh, you got it for two three years and then we're gonna vote for it.
Like over here. Meanwhile, you have some of the worst education outcomes, you have some of the you know, most violility, all of that kind of stuff that are depressed, and so that's why it's important for people to understand that.
So what is there a portion of the guide that the journal I want to call it a guide so much, but the journal that because I guess the journal the guide tells you what to do. The journal gives you the opportunity to like write things and think through the process. So I got it, trying to get it right so
it sticks. Is there a part in there or at least can you speak to when you don't like either candidate, right, and you're like, I don't want to vote for none of these folks, but yet somebody gonna be in charge.
So what what would you say to that? Or is that in the book?
Yeah, that's a very very important part. And it's something I just talked about on Sunday because that's one of the things that people give pushback, Right they both crooks, Like I'm not voted for neither one of them. Right, But elections and if again, you take the emotion out of it, and even those of us who are celebrating you know that it's the first black candidate or the first black woman or whatever. Let people experience that that's right.
You don't need to. Yeah, it's not okay, let them experience. That's perfect time. If you're on another wavelength, that's cool, right, But then it's what candidate and I lay out for ways to decide to pick a candidate for yourself. But ultimately you're deciding where can I push progress forward and do the least harms.
In my community harm reduction?
Right?
Like that is the that is the thing. But I lay out my four steps of picking a candidate. One again, you start with yourself, what are issues that matter to me? And then looking at that the candidate's records, not who you want to be on the ballot, but who's the.
Actual is actually on the back right and who can really win?
Yeah, and then decide, okay, which of these candidates you know most aligned with my values because nobody is going to align one hundred percent unless you run it.
That was that was.
Nobody align And even then you might have disagreement with self, especially when you realize that a big part of politics is about compromise.
Exactly, and that's knowing that it is important. So after you you know, right, you say, okay, based upon what this person said, what their track record, is this is who most aligns, this is what their record is on the issue. The other thing is who are you more likely to move or your advocacy efforts be receptive, like are you going to elect someone that's just like I don't care, I double down, right, like, this is what I.
Believe the access to anything?
Right, And when we say access, we're not saying like going to the White House right, right, Like we're not talking about that.
We have people inside the administration that actually got hired to do jobs that you can have a communication with and say hey, that's close inside of that administration and say hey, look these are the issues that we're dealing with our community, right and they know you, and it can relay that message to your elected officials and probably gets you some type of meat or get something to actually materialize from you know, you actually making this vote.
Yeah.
Well, and sometimes because you're speaking as a person who's very close to the top of the food chain, so you can make the call. But if you're Johnny and you live in a certain community, you might not be able to make a call ever that gets to the people you want. But you can be a part of joining with others that have that power.
And pushing because there's power in numbers.
So when we say we going to Washington about gun violence, or women's rights or whatever, whatever cease fire, whatever the issue may be, you need to be able to say, I can send out tweet, texts, a mail, chimp, whatever, all the different things, phone calls, and there's gonna be one hundred, two hundred, one thousand or more Johnnies from a particular community that.
Will be there. That's how we build power.
And a lot of people because they don't see themselves being able to call Kamala or call whoever Joe Biden, whoever you know, even if it's your mayor, because they can't make those phone calls, they feel very detached. Now, one phone call you can make, and one place that you can walk into any time you want is the campaign office and or the district office of your city.
Council person in your state, your state legislator exactly.
The congressional member.
You can walk right in the door, and the squeaky whell gets the oil because we know you go in there every other day, send letters, write. They will have to respond to you because you are a constituent in their district versus you trying to talk to President Soul and self.
And I think that's important because you're evaluating is this person responsive to those rights? Yes? Are they doing a press conference and they're saying, I don't care how many people come to my office, I'm voting this way, or are they like after set deliberation with constituents in my community, you know.
After I got my ass kick right, got barrassed or.
Even you know, or even got better understanding of right, because we assume that politicians know everything about the issue, and they do not.
They we went to Washington, you know, we walked two hundred and fifty miles from New York City to Washington, d C. Where Carma pres and our family at the gathering for justice Justice League And.
Why did you join us? You did?
You came somewhere You was at the beginning that no stat No no no stat. Nyland is where most people met us. Okay, So when we got to Washington, the last part of the march was to do our advocacy Day, where we went and talked to all the legislators and these are congressional members.
I'm not talking about. We went down, like you said, to Alabama to talk to no no, no, no. We were in Washington, D C. And the Congression.
Baby, we were having to tell congressional members what their colleagues in Congress have on the table in terms of bills.
They did not know.
They had to be educated. They were like, oh, we were bringing them together.
We've done that. I know you've done it in Albany, in the state capitol of New York.
Especially around for us it was around raised the age. Well we had to go shut it down, like completely busting to the meat and like, what is the problem up here?
Two in the morning.
Yeah, so people think, I mean you were basically living up there dealing with these issues. People really think that these folks know and that they're smarter than you, or that they know. They just had the courage to go run. Yeah, and they could raise the money.
And if there and if they're experts on an issue, it's probably one or two that's not on it.
It's not all of us are in that situation. Although the Internet would have you thinking you know everything, you have.
Everything right, That's what I want to ask you.
Does it frustrate you just watching misinformation, just being secivically engaged in knowledgeable does it frustrate you on the internet, just seeing people just say things that are so outlanded and seeing people grab onto it like it's actually fat.
Let me tell you something, This is when I feel the most old. Yeah, because I scrolled through and I'll see stuff and the old woman responses come out of me. Now you know that don't make me Benny, you saw it?
Sound like.
Right, and you know I'll tell again my cousins or other people calling me and I'm like, use your comments comments, now, why would that? Like now, why would some why would that happen?
Just think like, just let's think that through what you're saying.
Right, And you know, it's the same thing I use on my kids, you know, And I'm like, let's think about this a little bit, you know, and play it out and see how So that kind of thing does absolutely frustrate me.
But it's also for you a person that you can't take stupidity. It's like it really doesn't. It aggravates you to the point who.
Knows, And it's I'm come from a long line people that my grandmother who I'm actually named after, Joyce, would say that, like you say something or whatever, just why would you just bring stupid into.
The house.
Like it was and it was a cancer or something. And so that it makes it extremely difficult too, because it's there's so much things that are true to fight against, to like to engage that when you make up stuff, it's just like you don't even got to make.
It, have to make because that all the time, Like I could find you five things that's true that we should be challenging about, which at the candidate, including kam La Harris, I got five or six things, and you want to make up some story about you talked about celebrities and their impact.
We just finished talking on the show about Janet Jackson and like how she's like, well, I heard you had our daddy's white like this, what right?
What are you?
We heard some things about you and your family too, and we still wrack with you, and we also try not to spread it as intelligent people who have the best interest of all of us in mind. Yeah, And you know one thing I say about you know, uh as you're seeing issues that you even want to address with a candidate that you support, you know, and.
I always say, you know, I say it to lectus today face. I look forward to protesting you.
Right like.
You're visiting right, because it's part of and literally I have said that's a common land. She was like, come on, because that is your role, right, Like, that is your role to educate me on the process. Every photo line that I've been in, I've talked to her about like something else, and she has said she's like, every time you come in here, she got something else. Some other
people so so whatever. And to people like her that are committed to public service in that way, it's just like, that's your job, that's your role, right, Like I understand where you are coming from where, and it's not coming from a malicious place, it's coming from That is your role. My role is here and often we intersect and we may be on different sides on different issues, and then
we can come together on you know, on different things. Absolutely, and I think that that's we have to think about those we elect as our utility players, right and that you know, you pull them in when you need to, you rally against them if you need to. But going back to that harm reduction as you mentioned, is really important, and the last one is thinking about the political landscape.
What is happening in the country, what is happening in your state, what is happening in society, and based upon who's running their record, their disposition, is this the person I want to lead during this time.
That's the realist thing. And I want to just say we always say that, we say we're not fighting for allies, We're fighting for a better opponent.
Right, that's what we elected.
We want to elect the best appointed because we understand that in government, you're going to make decisions. The government is gonna have different you know, ideologies and understands and have different point of views and needs that they think, and we represent the people will have to make sure that we argue on behalf of the people all of the time. So if we understand that process, then we should always feel like we have to challenge our government
officials always. But what I want to say is this this whole ideology, Like you know, I've I've just become civically engaged in like the last ten years. You know, I'm from the hood, so I really didn't pay that much attention. But there's this ideology in the streets that either we shouldn't vote, right, we shouldn't vote, or you know, just mainly we shouldn't vte. I'm not even gonna say to all, because that is that makes actlutely no sense, even though shouldn't vote makes.
No sense to me.
But what do you tell the person that says they're gonna sit home and just not vote.
Yeah, so we're not gonna vote for the third party?
Because there was a whole thing, like the was a thing today where you know it's been. It was on a breakfast club when Angela Roe I was talking to Jill Stine and she asks her a lot of questions and.
There was both pushed back.
So I want to hear your perspective on another party, you know. And then the people that say don't vote.
Okay, this is where I might get a little nerdy. So you know, I mean in community all the time, you know, in Brooklyn, and I get that question all the time either I don't do politics or voting doesn't matter, the system's rigged and all that kind of stuff. And it's something that I address all the time out in the street. One I never start with as an organizer, I need you to come out and vote. I never started that way. I always started where people are like,
what you know, what do you need? What's you know? Like, what's what's your concern? In that way. But even when I do get to the point where someone says, I don't do politics, we shouldn't vote anyway because it's you know, all raised, then I asked the question, then.
What do you do?
Like, you know, what do you do right? And more often than not, you know, people might say, oh, I volunteer here or things or whatever, and I was like, what is the reason you have to volunteer for kids to have food for lunchtime? Because there isn't someone making a decision that those kids don't need the resources for them not to eat. So you not doing politics, meaning those kids don't have another advocate to make sure that they are eating and their bellies are full for them
to learn. So you're depriving those kids of your voice.
Yeah, you're actually you're actually going against what it is that you actually want to do right.
And then talking to people, which is I think you
talk about, is deliberate of taking civic education. It's also deliberate that we took the word power and political power out of civic because civic is like, oh, let's go like volunteer at the library or pick up trash or like it's like these passive actions rather than it's about control and wielding your political power, right, me, you and others in our community coming together are a powerful voice to push back against money grabbing landlords, right like us.
So they diminished right, So local we're diminishing because people are afraid of the power. And that's what you're doing with voting, that is what you're doing with organizing. You are collectively coming together to wield your political power. And in Brooklyn and DOAACP, I go a step further where I tell people we're doing an action in Brownsville and
stuff like that. I was like, come with me, let's build black political power, right and see what we can do with that collectively in the state, in the city, on the city level, and then you know, on the national level that is scary to people that people would come together to build back black political power. We've seen that all throughout history. And so helping people to understand that that this is about power and part of your vote. That's why when I talk about that political landscape is
where will I have the most power? Right not only in pushing this elected this you know, advocacy or what have you. So then when you get to the third party, will I have power if I vote for a party that can't get the two hundred and seventy electoral votes.
Do you believe like we do, that it's time to create other options, like viable options, to open up our This.
Is where I get a bit nerdy because this is part of the problem. I don't have a problem with like folks like Joe Sein and others or whatever running
like like you know, do you whatever. What I have a problem with is that there are because these are state by state processes in terms of ballot access getting on the ballot, and we have defaulted to two parties not only on the national level, but on the state wide level, and so you have to break that stronghold of two parties in order to get to more viable options. There's absolutely no reason why Hillary Clinton and AOC should
be in the same political party. There's absolutely no like like from a political idea.
Depends on how you're feeling, you might want either one of them.
Depending on whatever. But there's no reason why Bernie Sanders right, and you know, Barack Obama are in the same political party. It does it's like it doesn't work, like.
It really turns people off because the messaging is mixed, and it seems like there's a fight going on like internally.
Right, And that is because we've defaulted as a country to a two party system, and in order to get to a more representative thing, we do need to break that stronghold and that comes with changing state laws and changing the national process. And that's hard work that people don't want to, you know, accept. So you know, you could say the third party option, but that is hard
to do. That takes much more money. And the person that got the closest was Bernie Sanders, right, but he also did it using a two party, using one of the major political parties. He didn't use the third.
Party because we know that.
Listen, I know we have to wrap up. We could do this for a while because it's so much. Yeah, there's so much to learn. When I want you to tell folks where they can get your book, But when you do that, the next thing I want to ask you about is your own advocacy. Like your personal advocacy with your husband has been to take children into your home who are in the force se care system and
all of us. That's why I always tell people we don't have to do things the same way you don't have to sit in your home right now and say, well, I'm not gonna do what Tomik Mallory does.
Well, I'm not gonna do it. Aljoy and MASANDU. You can figure out.
Your own ways to impact so much of people's lives who need help. And you all have taken on children who who need homes, and I just want you to talk a little bit about that process and why you all decided to do that.
Yeah.
Yeah, So, first of all, you can get get Vote Ready on Amazon journal, the journal for the empowered voter, And I say empower voter because you are already empowered, right, you have to give you power. You already have it. You just have to learn how to harness it and use it for yourself, your family, and your community. So you go to Amazon and search get Vote Ready Journal. It's actually number two right down and it just debuts
the number advocate. It's a great thing for someone who may be voting for the first time or not a regular voter or even a prime voter, you know, like it. It's a really good exercise I think into Okay, let me go through the process of making sure.
That I'm engaged.
And it's for any election, not just this one, you know, so it's something that you can use for that. The second piece, in terms of what my husband and I do, it started from a personal space. It started from, you know, a family member needing care and the government, you know, acs showing up saying we're taking a baby, and I was like, taking who baby? Like not like you know, and it's said, no, you know, we're gonna take care.
And then, you know, once my husband and I started that process and realized how many other you know, young people are caught up, particularly black and brown children right are in the system. And a lot of it is because of poverty. A lot of people children are taking because of privy, because I love the child, because of and they classified neglect as oh, you don't have enough food in a refrigerator, or do you have a stable
place that just because you're CouchSurfing or it's something like that. Like, there's so many different reasons why children end up in the system. And it's not to say that there aren't very real cases of neglect and abuse, because there are, but for there's a large portion of it it is because of issues of poverty. And then after that family member, who's now you know permanently with us, we kept our license open and so far we have fostered children their parents are under twenty five or twenty.
Five, And so you chose that area what it just so.
Happened to be. And you know when I talked about like one of the things I say in a photo line to the Vice President every time I talk to her about foster care. Right, and even though it is a process that is governed by states, it is a national crisis certainly that was exasperated by COVID that needs to be addressed in terms of the resources because it's
an ongoing cycle. Just our brief time of ten years doing it, we've seen the vicious cycle of a young person in care, they not having the adequate supports or resources, They then become parents sooner than they need to be, and then they don't have basic supports to be able support, so now their children are taken and it's so sort of an ongoing cycle from that standpoint, And so we really have to focus not only as a state, but as a nation and how we are addressing the needs
of people twenty five and under in this country. Because we for a lot of things, we leave it up to just the parents. And what happens when those there are are no supports or the parents need additional supports in order to continue to raise them and engage for their livelihoods.
Well, Donald Trump said, you just need a day to purge and just beat them up when they still, you know, just beat the kids up they still, You rough them up real, real violently, and then everything go back to normal.
So that's how you do that.
That's not you know, I wrote on your page how I feel about that.
Definitely, there was definitely some what we call explotives.
Because I'm just so tired of it. But I I just want to thank you, el joy who are coming to be with us today. Get this book. It is the get Vote Ready Journal, the journeys you got to do, the empowered Voter.
And I hope that everybody who's like, what do I do? How do I do it?
With a instead of us becoming so anxious that we disengage because you just overstimulated. There are actual tools and I believe that your book is a tool. Let me touch it so I can feel it and put a little bit of a blessing that I.
Have on it.
You know that there are real people who have sat down out and said, let me help you so that you are not anxious, but you're actually ready, ready to go. Well, you know, she's a super friend, a super friend, l Joy Williams, the president of the NAACP Brooklyn branch, but also so so so much more and also an author here. Okay, that's what I'm talking about. Thank you, thank you so much for thanks.
So with that said, we're going to go into my I don't get it since we're talking about civics, you know, and I haven't really said anything about the Eric Adams charges because I don't really know a lot of it about it, right, But I read the indictment and then I read the article that I read today just talking about you know what there he's being accused of and just getting a breakdown.
And I don't get how.
Someone who is an elected official, right, and they have lobbyists. I've heard about having lobbyists, and they lobby for certain things, and they lobby on behalf of certain things. And you know, the elected officials, the campaigns are funded, they have dinners, they raise money, and all of these things are supposed to be that you build a relationship with the elected official that you know that you advocate on behalf of yourself.
And now when it seems to me, right because I've heard this a few times that every time there's a black elected official, those things become criminal, right, And I'm not saying it is because I don't know all of the intricate things, like we don't know all of the evidence, we don't know all the things, but it actually it seems to me as if you being close to an elected official, you know, raising money on behalf because you want to see that person in power, that you believe
in that person, and you having a relationship which puts you in a position to where you could say, hey, these things are wrong in our community or these things we need in our community, and him be able to advocate on behalf of you now with something that's ilegal, it's it's a bribe.
So I'm glad you're being vulnerable and.
I'm not listen to me and I don't know, and I don't agree with Eric Adams on a lot of things. And we, like we just said, we pushed back and I've had you know, if you look at I would drink Champs interview.
I sat down and I explained him to things.
I didn't agree with, but as a man and as a black man, I understand that it's hard, especially in politics.
I've watched this situation happen. This is not the first.
Time, this is not the second these this same situation I've seen happen to like four elected officials black elected officials.
Right right.
So I'm really don't get why the you know, the the threshold right right, Why the criteria for advocacy and in fundraising and things seem to change when black officials are.
In Yeah, it doesn't. It doesn't change.
And that's why I said, I'm glad that you asked, because I think, as you said, that TMI is a forum and should be for us to educate people.
But also sometimes we just don't know.
And when we don't know, we should not feel like, oh, we can't talk about that because we don't know. No, it's okay for us to say I don't know. And so here's the thing. First of all, yes, there is an attack on black elected officials.
We see it happening all over the country.
What's our sister's name in Maryland, in Baltimore, and Marilyn Moseby, she is on.
House arrest right now.
For something that is completely asinine, right, using her own money in the purchase of a home, her own money, not stealing from the taxpayers, and making a mistake on the application. Even if the mistake was something that some people will say it's intentional, she says that it wasn't. In fact, she says that it did not even happen the way in which it has been portrayed, especially in the media. But now she's on house arrest, and you know,
I think it's asinine. You now see that Angela Asselbrooks, who's running for senate in also in Maryland, she is being accused of not registering her grandmother's property the right way, which looks very to me as an oversight. But nonetheless she's also experiencing this. You see Brian Benjamin, who has never even purchased marijuana. Okay, this is a man who Brian as our friend. He's probably the cleanest clean person I've ever ever ever met.
In my life.
I know Brian, and you know Brian, and we've looked at his evidence, and we've looked at all of that, and this young man's life has been destroyed, even though he's rebuilding it.
He will be fine.
Before the moment, Brian as the lieutenant governor of New York State who was about to go on and become the governor. Right, he was definitely going to be the governor, There's no question about it. He could raise the money, he had, the relationships, he had the posture of not being like a He'll say I'm a black capitalist, right, and that's something that he and I have gone back
and forth on. Nonetheless, when he says I'm a black capitalist, I know there's some people who like to, you know, who are looking at more their interests in politics.
They're like, okay, I could get with him. He's not the.
Liberal, super progressive, you know, against people making money type of person. So he did all the things right, he checked all the boxes, and still they took him down over something that when you look at the evidence, first of all, they've had to walk back some of it, and second of all, the individual who was accusing him was a white man who's deceased now. But also he was somebody who was a criminal already in charge in
trouble for some other things. And Brian seemed to become the fish that he could give to the prosecutors and to the United States.
The FEDS basically to why can't.
I get the US Attorneys Office to get them to maybe back down off of him, or just to ingratiate himself with the system. So this goes on and on and on, and we could keep going, Kim Fox this people running for office and people in elected office all over this nation, black people, so cool.
The charges for Eric.
Adams, if there is evidence for those charges, real evidence that sticks on him, they are charges that are serious because number one, it's not that it's just people advocating for themselves the way that you and I do.
These are business folks. These are not.
Community advocates who are like, oh, you know, I want to see more community centers and whatever.
These are people who are making a lot of money.
And by the way, Turkey specifically is not on a good list with America. I don't want to give the wrong title, but I know they're on some list of like not being our friend or not being a nation that America has a strong relationship with. So when you're in relationship with them, and then they are able to
do business with the city. And then they said that the fire codes in the building that they wanted were not up to par and it was like ninety different issues, and they claimed that Mayor Adams called the fire department over and over even after they declined to give them the building, and they made it happen. This is what
they This is what they're saying. I'm just you know, so if there's evidence to prove that, if there's evidence to prove it, then we will be able to see whether he was actually involved in these things that they say happened for ten years or a longer period of time.
The main thing, though, which is the same kind of issue or the same charges that they bought against Brian Benjamin, is the Straw donations, which is the ten million dollars that they speak about where they say he stole ten million dollars, and it's also the way that the media talks about these things. It stole ten men million dollars makes you think that he siphoned it off or put it in his bank account and spent it on his
family and friends and was out partying with it. But what they're saying is that these connects that he had in Turkey, they had relationships, they took their relationships with other people, gave them money, and then those people made donations on their behalf to boost their support.
For him, so that he would be indebted to them.
And so I look at that, and if there's, like I said, real evidence for it, I can.
See why he would be in real trouble.
Now he says that the allegations are lies and it's a bunch of slander and things that's being made up or that is being blown up to make it look like he's running some type of criminal enterprise, which, by the way, it is all kinds of investigations flying around
his office for different things. A couple of things I know is when I look at people who are also in the administration, like David Banks, who's the chancellor of New York City Public Schools, and also sheen or right, and just a bunch of people there.
I could go on with the names. These are people that I know.
I know, especially the two that I named, I know that they would never be involved in a criminal enterprise. I know that there are many people within that administration that they would never. Ever, that's just not their character, it's not who they are. And I could say that, and if I was ever proven wrong, I would have to come back and say I apologize, But I know, I know that these are people who just that that's just not with it. That's not what they do. The
bank's family is just not what they do. So with that being said, we have to before we start talking about step down, resign all of this, we really do have to be able to see whether or not this evidence is true and is tried and tested in the court.
Because my perspective on this is, even though Eric and I have many, many different things that we disagree on many his support for Israel and unfortunately the way in which he either will not even address the palace in their community or the way in which it's almost like he mocks it. I don't like that. I don't support that. I don't like his consistent support for police officers that we believe are rogue and disrespectful and harmful, very dangerous in our communities.
So there's enough.
There's a list of things that I could sit here, like we said, you don't got to make anything up because there's a list of things. But I also want to challenge those people who jump up and they're like, oh, that's it, you out.
I want to challenge those people.
You want poky though, who goes through who gets arrested and all of that to be able to go before a court a law.
And for the evidence to prove they're wrong.
But then when it comes to him, we want to have a different standard, And I just that's something that you can be mad or you want with me, but I just don't support it. I'm not mad at anybody who says we don't like Eric Adams.
Never did and therefore we.
Feel that this is a moment when his leadership has been shown to be like ineffective and he needs to step down.
But I do think that there is something to be said.
About these investigations that happen to be going on all across the country to our or black elected officials.
I just I'm not with it.
So there's a side of me that understands what you're saying. But then there's also a side that we have to be very clear that the charges against him are not a joke.
They are serious charges.
No, And I understand what you're saying. I'm just saying based on what I was reading when I read the article.
The article you're talking about, you're talking about an article that says that the charge like it's an overcharge, like it's an overread, which is the same thing they did to Brian.
And because it basically described what exactly happened to Brian Benjamin. So when I'm listening, I'm like, well, this is the same thing that happened to Brian Benjamin.
And it's like, how do in what they say?
The main thing that they say about these cases that there has to be quid quote pro.
Quid pro pro quote fault. I can't never say quote quid pro quote, quit.
Quit pro quote.
The main thing they say about these cases they have to be quit pro quote. And that means that there has to be an established agreement between two parties that if you do this, then I'll do that, right, And that's what has to be established and.
Based on this, and they couldn't establish it for Briant And.
There was no not really at all.
All they had him doing was actually just given the grant organization for him to do what he does with the kids. There was nothing that you do this and I'm gonna do that, right. So, and what I'm saying is this.
And the judge said that, let's just be clear judgment qui pro quo.
Yeah, That's what I'm when I'm reading this article, they're saying the same thing.
It's okay.
Most of the time people do things for elected officials. This is the elect official that you're trying to get in that you're going to try to get But the law, the law said that you would.
Have to know.
That's that's where quid quote pro quote comes in. Well, I would have to be aware that something's happening. If you decide you you're one of my constituents, right, you want to make sure I'm running for men, you want to make sure that I get it, And you go to all the whole block, like, listen, we need to donate to my songs, and you get everybody and you rallying off and they all donate and they come from you and this and that right, and you decide I don't have any well.
Like the promise.
But the problem is, well, I mean, but still again, it's all about evidence, because if you alleged that someone knew or that there was conversations between a staff and team members where they were coordinating, that it's one thing to rally up your community.
I remember one time I said to an elected official.
I can't remember who it was, but I said, oh, okay, you want my mom and dad. I didn't know. I was very I didn't know. So they said, oh, my mom and dad. I said, oh, well, I'm not going to make them spend their money to donate for you.
I'm going to give them money. And the elected official, I can't remember.
I know it was a man, but I cannot remember who it was stop me immediately and said it might have been Jamiani. Stopped me immediately and said that is illegal. You cannot do that, absolutely not. And if your parents are to give me, it has to come from them. You can ask them to donate to me, but that's fundraising, but you cannot fund them giving me money. So again, that would be something where they would have to be
evidence of it. Now we can speak to it as it relates to Brian, because we with Brian we know from talking to him directly. We ain't talk to Eric about this. Eric Adams, the mayor, but we have talked to Brian. We know that he had if it was done, he don't know a dang one thing about it, was never involved in anything like that.
So I'm sure that that is this.
Maybe maybe that's I don't know where Eric's I'm not going to try to deliberate his faith. But that would be a problem that you cannot give people money to give And it's not just being around somebody my son, it's also a person. Like one of the things I saw in the evidence is they're saying, like, Okay, you wanted to get you want to go to on a plane a plane and instead of you paying fifteen thousand dollars, which is the cost of the ticket, you're paying one thousand dollars.
Now should people And it's a lot of people that don't.
Even care about that because I don't care about that, Like that doesn't move me at all, because I do understand it. If I'm in relationship with you and you have the ability to give me a deal on a plane ticket, I don't see anything wrong with that.
But the law says that that is illegal.
See I didn't know that. I didn't know that the law you take on somebody funding you.
Affair, yes, you can't do it. And if you no, no, now you can. Like you can't even go out to dinner, I cannot take you know, we have many friends in their administration.
When we go out to dinner, they have to pay for themselves.
They cannot even take a dinner from us, if then they could take it from me as a friend. But you know, you applied to the city for which ultimately puts me in it. But you applied to the city for the youth centers and all of the youth operations that you do in Newark. You're trying to do it here in New York. Well, when you as soon as that application is in, you no longer because now that
would mean that you are providing favors for something in return. Now, because I'm friends with these people and there's clear evidence of us partying together YouTube, hanging out. They know we are friends, I might pay the bill at dinner and that's okay.
But even then, depending on when.
It is what the conversation at the table was. Cause if the next person who's sitting at the production crew, this gentleman is sitting there and he said, oh, they're over there talking about whatever, you can't even do that. So it has to be very very You could be talking about twerking and whatever you think, and that's cool.
But soon as you say, well, you know, we put this application in for the city.
Da da da da da, and we're trying to figure out the dada that becomes that that elected official has to pay for it, and then the reason why they do that is to cut back on people being able to pay the play.
So well, that makes sense, you know.
So what I what I will say is that that's I'm.
With you with the everybody black, but.
It's it's definitely everybody black. I said, I said this the other day. Black man got bad black man, damn bad man. It's like when when we look at the news, it's just being from were just being taken down from all angles man. And I want to give the benefit of the doubt, right, I want I want everybody's case to try out in court. Right, I'm not convicting anybody. People like, why you don't speak on Diddy? Why you ain't speaking because I don't know what happened with Diddy.
I know I spoke when I seen what happened with Casie, I spoke about it.
I said that it was Carol culture. I said that I didn't condone that.
I said, whatever he had to deal with that he's needed to be held accountable for everything else I don't know anything about. And I'm gonna let it play out in the court of law. And I would think that's what men supposed to do in this situation.
Just like with Eric Adams, I don't know what he did.
I don't and I'm not gonna sit here and pile on another black man who's dealing with whatever he has to deal with, because I would want somebody I went to trial for my life, right, and I was facing a bunch of time and I blew trial crime I didn't commit, and I had to deal with that right.
So I understand those realities. So don't ask me.
Don't come to me and ask me to pile up on another black man about something that I don't know about. I'm gonna let that man have his then court and if he's found guilty, then he'll be held accountable. But he's not gonna be held accountable for me because I'm not the judge or the jury in those situations. And that's why I have this segment called I don't get it because I didn't get it.
So you gave me some education about certain things.
Well, there are some people who will say, well, what about Tory Lanes and why was that different?
Right?
And what I would say is, first of all, we had we're looking at the case, or you were looking at the case. So we knew a lot more details than most people knew because we were actually getting We were like out there looking and calling around trying to find like because for a woman to like lie on a man and say that he shot her.
That was something that really disturbed me.
Like I was really like, Nah, this can't this can't be but what I and so we were looking at it. But one of the things that I I did, if you ever go back and you look, I never said he did it or didn't do it. I just said stopped lying and saying that she wasn't shot because she was and she was being antagonized. And after I did my due diligence and my research, it became very clear to me what was going on and what happened to her.
But what I can appreciate about you is that you did say after you first was like he did it.
He did he did it?
Because you know, sometimes we get passionate and over zealous. You said, you know what, actually I'm wrong for posting this that I'm gonna take it down because it was wrong for me to even come out here saying these things without this man being able to go through his dand court.
Yep, and that's you know, and it was wrong.
And I said that as a man, and I learned from that situation, even though that's how I felt in my heart, even though I knew certain things about the situation, and we watched things play on in court. It's like, you know, a man got caught with the gun. He did this, and I heard the videotape, I mean, the
audio table was happening. I like, there were certain things, and then I watched when he said a friend did it and then said she didn't do it, like I literally watched and said to myself this, I've seen this behavior before. So I made my decision based on it, and I was willing to stand by, but I still didn't want to come out publicly and say what I said.
I was frustrated and I was watching.
I felt like the woman was being attagonized and I was trying to stand up for her, and I moved in a way that I normally.
Wouldn't move, and I apologize for that as a man.
So moving forward in this situation, I'm giving everybody the same grace because I have way less information about these cases than I even had a boy.
Because we literally was online digging for a court document, a dialogue with Tori.
And just explained to him and just the way, the way that he carried it to me was wrong. And you know, I don't wish jail on anybody. You know, I'm here a lot of things that he's he's doing things for inmates and jail, donating to their funds. You know, hopefully he comes home, he's he's more successful, he's learned
from whatever mistakes he's made in the past. I do not wish jail on anyone in the world, but I understand that there are consequences for your actions, right, and you need to be held accountable.
And if you did something, then you got to deal with it.
As men, we fall down, we realize we made mistakes, and we get back up and we move forward. So you know, I just want everybody to just moving up. Just understand, we dealing with a lot of dark forces right now. There's a lot going on, and black men are under attack, and I keep saying black men are damn bad. So I'm just saying, just hold the complete judgment, right.
You cannot like somebody, say that you don't like somebody, but just hold off from paling on right, because when you pile on to somebody you know and you don't know what's going on and you just completely convict, it's hard to eat that crow you.
But and I mean, you know what I feel as a woman, I feel many different ways. And this is not something that I have not said directly to puff to others that are close to this situation. After not just watching the video or Cassie, but also listening to some of the stories, It's disturbing. That's it. It's nothing else.
It is disturbing. It's painful. I you know, my heart goes out to Cassie because even in the midst of all of this, while it may seem like, you know, justice is coming, she still suffered and experienced something that I watched happen with my eyes on that videotape.
That couldn't have been the first time. It just couldn't have been.
That's the way I feel about it, and I have no problem saying that in public. Nonetheless, I know how these prosecutors work. When they give you an indictment. Baby, the charges got stuff in it that you're like, WHOA, what is this?
How is that?
Oh?
And they make it you know, because even having a thousand big bottles of baby oil and lubricant or whatever. Now, while that may give you some type of thought about what could be happening, it's not illegal. And I don't believe that a jury is gonna be like, oh, that's it, that's the convicting thing. So this but that's and that's also. But that's how we know from reading indictments. That's how
it works. So when you actually get court documents and you are in court and you can hear what is being said and how information is being translated, that's when you start to understand like what it boils down to what is the real truth in the end of the day. So that's what we all will see and have to wait to see, not just in that case, but it's a many of them life.
We got this case.
It's a lot going on. But anyway, so we out of here today.
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