Networking 101 from Harvard & Stanford MBA Grads: EP 10

Have you ever walked into a room and been completely drawn into someone's personality? They were like almost kind of magnetic and so charismatic and you're like, what do they have? And how can I have some of that? This episode we're going to discuss. How to talk to? Anyone already? Let's dive in. Let's do it. Hi, I'm Jean and I'm Cherie and and we're the Tiger Sisters. Welcome to the season finale of

Tiger Sisters. Yay. I can't believe it's been 10 episodes. Yeah, it went by. Really. Fast. Yeah, it went by really fast. I am excited about the evolution of topics. Yeah. Discovered. Yeah, I think. I think like some of the more recent episodes have been a lot more like fun and not just like, informative. And hopefully the audience is enjoying that. Yeah, I think.

We've covered a lot of like, professional stuff in the beginning, mixed in some personal stuff and yeah, it's just been such an amazing season. You've done really well. Thank you. I know. Thank you. My first. Season your first season, first time podcasting. Yeah, and 10 kind of just like flew by. Yeah, and I feel like I'm also just getting more comfortable with, like, speaking on camera and being more candid and just being more, like vulnerable and honest. I love that for you, Thanks.

OK so before we go any further, please like, comment and subscribe if you haven't already. We have such an amazing season 2 planned out and if you haven't seen the season 1 episodes like they, some of them I honestly will say are so, so good. I'm so proud of them. Yeah, and then also Jean and I read every single comment that you guys leave on our YouTube videos.

And so if you have any suggestions, comments or questions, leave them down below and we'll respond to them and maybe even bring them into our next mailbag and our next season and episodes. Yes. So, Speaking of Mailbag. Mailbag.

Bag OK, so the inspiration for this episode, it actually came from a mailbag. So Jamie Coleron said I would like to see the Tiger Sisters talk about how to talk to anyone and how to be a better communicator for the next episode. You got it Jamie. You got it Jamie from. Riyad. Does anyone get that reference? Yeah, it's from Full House. Yeah, I don't know it. I I dabbled. You watched Full House? Yeah, I had the biggest crush on Uncle Jess. Oh, my God. Everyone did. John Stamehouse.

I'm kidding. It was like the definition of like 90s dreamy. Oh, for sure. OK. I think a good way to start out this topic is to focus first on, like, work and career aspects of

how to talk to anyone. Yeah. And then we can, you know, devolve into. Whatever our topic is podcast my attorney. But let's start with, like, what are some tips you have for talking to older people or more like, senior people, meaning, like, leaders in the company and, like, execs or maybe even people you feel intimidated by? I feel like you're a really good person. This is a big topic because you can talk to anyone. And, yeah, like, I feel like

it's one of your superpowers. Oh, thank you. Yeah, I think I really struggled with this when I first graduated because when you're like a 22 year old in the workplace and you're like, Oh my God, so much of myself worth is tied to what I say and how I present myself. It was really nerve wracking. But I think just getting more repetitions in and getting more

practice and talking to people who are older than you, who have more like years of experience than you and like getting those reps in really helps. But I think honestly, it's a mindset shift for me where you're just like, even if I'm talking to someone who's like 5 levels above me or the CEO of a company, at the end of the day, they are just a person. Yeah. And like if you can connect on a human to human level, like no sucking up, no like ass kissing.

It's like how do you connect with another person and genuinely be curious in them and what their story is and what they care about? Then I feel like that's where it becomes less scary. Well, on the topic of getting Rep, getting your reps in and like getting exposure, I feel like one of the ways you did that was through your internships and at Morgan Stanley.

I remember you interned there when you were in college and one of your specific assignments was to interview all these like VPS and other sort of leaders at the company. For the project that you're working on, you're making like an internal directory of information or something like an internal resource director. Exactly.

And as part of my internship, it was my like role, my job, my project to talk to a bunch of Morgan Stanley technologists and vice presidents in their very, like, specific domain. And a lot of it is just like asking questions, being curious, and then also knowing that you yourself have something to offer. I think that's like a comment I see quite often on social media. It's just like, Oh my God, like, you know, I'm in high school, I'm in college or like I'm a new

grad. Like talking to these people who are much more experienced is kind of scary because. Like, what do I have to offer? Well, but so like how when you were doing it, were you like, were you nervous or were you like, oh, it's just my assignment. Like I was told to do this. I was definitely nervous because I wanted to make a good impression. Like, I didn't want to like, sound like an idiot, but I think before even talking to the person doing, like a lot of

research, okay. And like every conversation, it

goes well because I'm prepared. Like I've done research on the person. I know what their purview is. And it's not like I'm asking like, you know, level 1 questions that I can just Google. I'm asking level 10 questions that only this specific person in this specific domain would have the answer to. Yeah. It's kind of funny because I feel like Cherie's Corner was like an evolution of like looking back on it now, right? Like have you ever had that song? No, I haven't.

That's what you do for Cherie's corner. So for Cherie's Corner, Cherie's other podcast that is wrapping up its. Last season, her other podcast. Was wrapping up its last season so she could focus fully on Tiger Sisters. Yeah, she has interviewed some. Like true, like Titans of industry, like people who are just like, I don't know, like single name people kind of yeah, in a way. And but you do a so much preparation. Yeah. And that's what I think people don't see is how much behind the

scenes goes into these. I mean, the podcast obviously, but then also just like having like one-on-one coffee chats with people, like never ever go into a coffee chat. Like cold bare minimum is spending 5 minutes on their LinkedIn profile to know more about them. And that's like the bare minimum I would say, especially if you're the person who is asking for the coffee chat and you know it in the like power differential is asking for help. Yeah. I feel like that's a very good

practical tip. Yeah. I think one of the most powerful ways to talk to anybody is to identify what your shared interests are or like, even

better, like, over time, like, cultivate some sort of, like, shared interests and shared experience together. Like, I feel like you have like, so much to say about that. When I was in school, one of the big things that I did and I would suggest that other people do as well, is like join clubs or get involved in groups where you can like find a common

interest. For example, in the last few months of my time at Stanford, I helped organize, Co organize the Stanford Women's Golf Clinic. And it was just, you know, a few of us ladies where we got together and we created a three-week series to bring other Stanford women in business to go all learn golf together. And we got so much feedback from these ladies that they're like, this was amazing. I've never played golf before. It's so safe. It was just like a good environment.

And then also, like, for example, we had like a mini creator club at Stanford. And it's just like common interest. And it's not just at school. Too, It's at work, right? And a lot of companies, they're different sort of affinity groups that you can join.

And even outside of that, like some of the things that I've done is remember like I've created this with my friends, like this annual retreat with my HBS girlfriends where we get together every year in Newport and it's about like 20 of us. And we basically like have this weekend of like learning and growing together, like reconnecting and bonding. It's like creating you can like you can actively create these experiences where you can like bond with people and like get to

know them better. Well, I think it also starts from like a shared understanding to like we all have a common something. And then from there you create the shared experiences where you dive in even deeper. And one way we were able to do this at Stanford DSB that I absolutely loved was going on trips together. Big proponent of traveling together to experience things in a new way. And Speaking of trips, you may

have seen that Cherie and I recently announced our Trova trip to Japan together, which we kind of put together because we wanted to create this opportunity to bond with and build community with all of you guys. So you can find more information in the description in this video. But basically it's going to be Jean and I as the host of this trip. But we will definitely have someone on the ground in Japan leading us and guiding us through all the different

points. We'll be in Tokyo and then also near Mount Fuji. And we'll have up to 15 people join us on this trip and like to spend time with you guys. I'm so excited because I've never been to Japan before somehow, but Sheree has been and she's like a total, I feel like, expert on Japan now because you've spent some Japan on fire. Yeah. And so I'm like super excited to like, get to know Japan and like experience it and also like have like her expertise and her personal experiences to guide us

as well. And I just think it's going to be a totally magical experience. And I can't wait to meet you guys and to, like, get to actually spend time together face to face as opposed to just like, messaging and like, you know, DM ING and like responding to comments. Yeah. So excited for this and check out the link in the description for more details. Speaking of exposure therapy, I feel like another way that we

had exposure therapy was just kind of the environment and neighborhood that we were in growing up. So Sheree and I grew up on Long Island. Well, actually, I grew up in Brooklyn and then I moved to Long Island in the middle of 4th grade. I was born in Brooklyn. Yeah. And then Sheree moved when she was like, I don't know, three or four years old or something. Really young, but we grew up in what was essentially like a very white and affluent community.

And so I feel like, yes, there were many, many times where I never felt fully comfortable because I was like one of one Asian people, like in my not just in my friend group, but like in my entire grade, maybe one of two actually. But and I always felt like I was very like defined by my ethnicity. But the, like, flip side of that is that I feel like I had to learn how to become very comfortable with people who were different from me.

Yeah, yeah. I have like, I have girlfriends who have told me who have grown up in California and they've like, grown up with mostly Asian people. And they're like, yeah, I just don't feel, I like to this day, I still just, I just don't feel like fully, fully comfortable talking to white people, like, or as comfortable as I feel talking to to Asian people. So that's something I feel like never really gets like talked about.

Totally. I mean, there's so much to dig in there, perhaps with a therapist for us, but like I, I loved. I have other higher priority. I know we have other things to talk about in therapy, but underneath the surface, that is one thing. But yeah, I mean it. There's both pros and cons. Like Gina and I grew up in a nice neighborhood. Even though we didn't come from that world, we were very much, like, exposed to that world and exposed to, I know the latter,

like, behave. Yeah, that world as a Christian. Still ways of speaking the expectations. Some people would see that as a Jurich though. For like oh you need a code switch. I mean, you know me, I'm like, the world is the world, right? Are you going to exist in the world today? And how can you change the world if you're not going to like? Be a part of it. Yeah. And if you're not going to make yourself into a person of influence in the world today in order to affect change, that's

my perspective. I agree. With that, but I I also see the other side as well. But I guess all of that to say, like it was a really good experience to be exposed to that. So then we can kind of. Yes.

Like looking back at it, like at the time, like did I enjoy being like feeling alone and being bullied when I was growing up? Like no. But now. Yeah. But now, now I like see the value of having been put into that situation. So maybe one take away out of all of this is that that wasn't something that we like opted into, but it is something that you can opt into. Like basically you can choose to put yourself into situations that are outside of your comfort

zone. Yeah. In order to kind of like learn more about different cultures. Yeah. And, and honestly, it just goes back to like how to talk to anyone. Like, I think that is a strength if you're able to relate to many different types of people, especially if it's outside of the environment that you're comfortable with. And I think it'll be good professionally. It'll it'll be good personally. It'll widen your worldview.

And I think like, yeah, like talking to some and this very this specific stories like some of our Asian girlfriends who are not comfortable with it. Like you can stay in the comfortable spot or you can like lean into the discomfort and like grow in different ways. And I I would argue it would help your career to do so. Yeah.

And one specific example I have of this is or like one or like one specific method you can do at work is you can seek out sort of like opportunities to interact with different people,

especially senior people. If you feel nervous about connecting with or you don't know how to talk to them, seek out opportunities to interact with them that are outside of your typical like meetings or like super like straightforward interactions where you're like presenting to them or like, you know, not the like cut and dry work interactions.

So like, what's an example? When I worked at Goldman, one of the things that my group did every year, I don't know why, but one of the things that we did was we put together this like a holiday music video. And do you? Still have access to it. No, but it honestly was so freaking good. It was like, I was like so proud of it. We and we like made ourselves like little awards for it too. But anyway, it was one of the things that we did and it was like day-to-day.

Like we thought we day-to-day, like the work was so serious. Like everyone. We literally thought we were doing God's work because that's what Lloyd had said to us. Lloyd Blankfein. Yeah, he he was like, we're doing God's work. And I was like, yes, we are because I was like 2021 and I was like, I'm doing God's work. Everyone took everything so seriously. But we had this holiday video and I like, volunteered or was volunteered, I don't remember, to become one of the producers.

And so my job was to help like write the scripts. It was like an SNL thing to like write the scripts and like help like direct and have and like make the MD's and VP's like lip sync to all these different songs. They're like it's. My job, you have to lip sync Taylor Swift. Yeah. And I would like, give them these, like, costumes. And it was just, like, so fun. And it was a way to interact with each other. Oh, I love that. That was not work, yeah, but it was work.

But like it wasn't work. No, it was, it was fun, it was silly, and you're able to like bring a fun side out of the VPS and MD's as well. Yes, and then they get to like see me for a person too, not just like a robotic minion got in the machine, the machine. But yeah, so like, I would just encourage even like other like now that I'm thinking about it, like other little things, like we had this annual baking competition and like me, like, you know, me, I'm not a Baker,

much less a cook at all. But for some reason, me and my my, my friend slash fellow first or second year, I don't remember which year this was fellow first year Christine. We were like, let's enter the competition together. And we made these sticky toffee pudding cupcakes. I will never forget this and we won. Yeah, I know. My God, I. Was. Shocked. I would have been shocked that you'd want a bacon.

But we like beat all of the like EAS and admins who had all these like amazing like pass down wrestlers. But anyway, that was just like another way for us to like like did we think we were good cooks or good bakers? Like no, but we're like, OK, let's just do it. And then it's like another way to like, interact with people and like, have connections and also, like, make little jokes, right? And like be and like. It also helps if you're the one organizing the event as well.

Yeah, because then you can bring people together and everyone can see you and then come to you because you are the organizer. Yeah, I organized a baking competition at LinkedIn for my larger like team and like org. Get copier. I didn't even know you won your your sticky toffee cupcakes. But yeah, I organized this baking competition and got like engineers on our team and like sister teams to like sign up and it really brought people together. We were able to vote and everything.

I've actually done it twice and they were mega successes. People loved it and it was a way for like us to engage. It was a way for me to engage with people who were not on my team but on partner teams and in different roles because it was super cross team, cross functional. So designers came, engineers came, data scientists came, and it was a way to also talk to people but then also be known.

Obviously it was for baking, It wasn't for like. She was known. But it was also a way to. Known for. It was a way to get known, you know? OK, yeah. Or I was like, I was kind of making fun of it. But you're right, you know, it is. It's a way, yeah. It's a way for you to like put your name out there that is kind of like low stakes or it's just

like a reason for. People to like know your name and also like talk to you to engage in conversation in the next time I was in the micro kitchen and someone who like I literally don't need to remember because since you're the organizer, there's like so many people you're dealing with. They're like, oh, you organized it. I was like, oh, did you partake? And like it was a conversation. They're like I for sure partook I. Was like, did you make something? Yeah, no, I first it was forsake.

Is. Anyways, yeah, those are good memories. Memories. It's funny how like I'm like, Oh my years at Goldman Sachs all I remember so fun music video and the baking contest. Yeah, seriously, those were probably like micro snippets out of your. I know it was like 1% of my time, but it is. I mean, it is, yeah. It's funny how that's what I remember about what I remember it, all right? What about communicating as a

woman in the workplace? This is a juicy one. To have thoughts. Yeah, I do. It's tough. It also depends on the environment that you're in and the workplace situation, like especially if it's a super male dominated field like finance, tech, I don't know, gaming, like those oil and gas. Yeah, they're super heavily male dominated. It's hard sometimes as a woman to be able to have your voice heard. And there's like many, many studies on this on like why that is, especially in like

workplaces with that dynamic. I would say if you find yourself there, my #1 tip is to find male allies who will be able to pull

you into conversations. These are the people. It could be your boss, it could be a mentor, it could just be someone who's in meetings with you that you just really trust. And for me, this was my my boss, Albert, who we had a very close like relationship and like we would be back channeling all the time. And then he would give me such good advice that like in a meeting, if it's like quiet and someone like ask something, he's like, it's jump ball.

He would like coach me afterwards and before it's jump ball, meaning like anyone can like chime in and like someone like lobbed a question in the air chime. Wow, like, you know, grab the ball and, you know, take it. So and then there be times where there be conversations happening in meetings and like I would have like specific knowledge on an answer, but I'd be like too nervous to speak up.

And then Alba would be like D Ming me on slack be like, go take this and you know this, blah, blah, blah. Like, wow, a male ally who is not only encouraging me to take the jump bowl, but then sometimes even putting like a layup for me anyway to like dunk it and then he'd pass it over to. Me. That's amazing. So it was not only him being a male ally, but it's also me wanting to have like that, wanting that exposure and wanting to speak up.

OK, but then how do you how do you cultivate that?

Like let's say didn't have Albert because I'm like, okay, he sounds like the best boss in the world. Like, not gonna lie, he really. Was Albert? If you're watching this, you're a homie for life. Living his best. Life I know he is. I need to I need to text him. But like, let's say, OK, Albert, decide. Let's say he was this, like outlier. Yeah. What? Did you have other male allies that weren't your boss? I do cultivate them.

Yeah, I would say for this, one very tactical thing to do is that, like, figure out who you admire in the workplace. It could be a woman, it could be a man. But if you're looking for male allies who are already in the room and already have influence, like find someone that you trust, like, and that can be through. You have coffee with them, you vibe. And then after you're in a meeting together, pull them aside immediately when the meeting ends and then ask them

for feedback. And be like. That sounds so scary. I mean, it's scary in the sense that like your ego might be. Hurt because you're like, oh, I'm like seeking feedback, but it's only for growth, especially if you trust this person. Not even that. Even just like I could imagine someone being like, Oh my God, like I couldn't imagine like going up to someone more senior and being like like even like pulling them aside, even like pushing them. But that's something you have to

like work up to I guess. It's something you have to work up to, but it's just like you're in a meeting together and you want to get better. You've already had a coffee chat with this person. Like they know that you have an interest in growing. You have like a growth mindset. And then like, you know when everyone's packing up their laptops and then everyone's leaving when the meeting's over.

Like you can't, you like you walk out of the meeting room with someone by your side and you have small talk. Yeah. So what would you say? Pretend it's be. I'd be like, hey James, hey Bert, I walk out. I'd be like, Hey, James. How that way, Cherie? Hello. This is based off of someone I know in the world, OK? I'll be British. Hello there. I'm like, hey, so do you have a second perhaps for you? Well, in this meeting, I just wanted to grab your feedback

really quick. If you had a couple of thoughts on how I presented myself, what I said and how you think I could, you know, perhaps have more influence in the next meeting. Like what do you think? What's a thoughtful question? I will most definitely give you feedback. Yeah, and and and, you know, if James is running off to lunch or has another meeting, be like, no stress. You don't have to answer this now, but if you can jot down like three thoughts, like I'll

catch you later. Yeah. OK. As as like a manager. Yes. Thinking about it now as a manager in a former like team leader. I would be receptive to that. Yeah. I'd be like, oh, wow, like what a thoughtful young person or just like, what a thoughtful person who, like, actually really wants to grow. I have some thoughts on it. They're not fully formed. About communicating in the workplace as a woman. Yeah, I think the like reality

of it. I feel like I'm like always the one that's like the cold reality of the world. The cold art truth. You don't. Know what this world is like? Yeah, like you don't. You don't. You don't even. Know you're not ready for the truth, but God no. But like I am, you know, I am like half a generation older than Cherie. So I do think the reality of it is that you may not necessarily to be in control of everything,

right? Like as a woman, like, you are still existing in a broader context, and you exist in the context. Of. Coconut. You think you just fell out of a coconut. Exactly. I think what I'm trying to say is that it's helpful to also be aware of how other people perceive you. And it may not even be specific to you. It may be like you as a category, right? Like you as a 25 year old woman, how are you perceived? You as a 30 year old, not single woman, how are you perceived

like? You know how there's been a lot of discussion about the idea of the Manic Pixie Dream girl? I feel like there's a version of it that carries over to the workplace as well, where like when you are a certain age and you act a certain way, you're kind of viewed as more of like the ingenue. Like you're like new to the world. Like you're new. You're young enough that people don't perceive you as a threat. And they don't take you seriously like you're, you're,

you're fresh out of school. Great. You have all this fresh energy. Good job, right? So that's like kind of, but also it's to your benefit, right? Because if you go up and ask someone senior like, oh, can you give me feedback, they will be fully honest with you and be like trying to help you. Yeah.

As opposed to when you reach a certain point, when you're no longer like viewed as the ingenue and you are like a little bit more senior in your career, like those same tactics may or may not go over the same way because then you kind of start to be viewed as like competition. Yeah, totally. So it's kind of like you get some beginners like leeway. Yeah. So that's just something that I've seen that I've myself and I and my, like, fellow millennial women, I feel like we've like

been working our way through. And I don't really have an answer to that, but it's just something that I can be like, watch out for, like be aware of it and like understand how you're being perceived by the people you interact with. Totally, I think. I mean, I goes it's especially we're talking on the context of women in the workplace, but I think like men as well, especially maybe minority men as well, like like are placed in some sort of like stereotype.

Yeah, I know one of my friends who worked in venture capital, he was one of like the youngest partners at AVC firm amongst like other people who are probably like 20 to 35 years older than him. And then he had gotten married. But then he, like, very specifically, like, wanted to get married and have a ring to seem older than he actually was. And he was very mature and like, But like, in that way, it's like understanding your reputation and how do you manage it?

And then perhaps surprise people if, you know, they have a stereotype of you and you completely break out of that in a good way. Yeah. And I do feel like that sort of benefit that men get in the workplace of like, being married and like having kids. Like just think about your own perception of like a man with kids, like you're automatically like, Oh my God, he's a great, he's a good person because he's a fun. Like he's responsible. He is, you know, like thoughtful

etcetera. Versus like women don't get that same sort of. Benefit of the doubt or like immediate? Positive shift in perception? I mean, if anything, it could be like the other way. Oh, yeah. True, true. That's so unfair. Yeah. So I I don't know that that wasn't like a. Fully, fully formed. Thought but it's like something there's something there. Yeah. I mean, so I guess the main take away is that like be aware of what how you may be perceived for whether it's fair or not

like in the workplace. And many times, perception can be reality. What? You weren't You weren't ready for that truth. Bomb, Yeah. So what do you think about

communication when it comes to dating and flirting? Thoughts. Thoughts I. Think OK, I think even the kind of like, precursor to explicit communication is like your energy. Because vibes. Yeah, because I feel like something. Why are you laughing? Communicating through energy. Well, more energy, more energy, more energy, more passion, more passion, more passion.

No, but I just feel like for myself and my own experience, I feel like in the last like few months, like something has shifted in my energy, whereas like I'll be going back to the same exact places and situations. But now all of a sudden like people are like approaching me and like people are like coming up to me and like speaking to me, you know. Oh, I. Love that. Yeah. You're like more. You're more open, I think. So you're like radiating. You're magnetic.

Or maybe I'm just not and wearing an engagement ring anymore. That might be that. That might be part of it. But no, I, I don't know. I think it's not, it's not just that. I think it's more like my energy has shifted. Yeah. And also it's like both my energy that I'm putting out, but then also like my energy within myself. Whereas now I am like more like aware of the world around me. I'm like almost like seeing the world through like a different perspective.

I love that. I think it's energy that you put out and then also the energy to receive as well. So that like if. People come up to you and talk to you. You're not going to be closed off. Yeah, Yeah. And I feel like for me, I'm like, very much like sometimes I'm in like a state of like mind or energy where I'm like, nobody better talk to me like I'm not here. I do not wish to be. I do not. Yes, exactly. Seriously. Really. Yeah. Whereas like you're different. Like you're.

Much and like perceive me everyone, you're more. Like open all the time. It's about your energy. So maybe it like kind of like starts there. Yeah, I think. You can also perceive people's energy too, before they even, like, open up their mouths like you could. Yeah. Before they speak. You're like, oh, do you have like a positive? Like, are you smiling? Are your eyes glistening with for the future in the world? Do you? Glimmer, yeah.

Do you, Glimmer, do you shimmer? Like I, I really believe in that, that energy. And you can feel it in someone even if you're just like, interacting with them briefly. Yeah. But then what about? OK, energy aside, what are your thoughts? You guys already know if you've seen the dating episode.

I've said it once and I'll say it again. What? What'd you say? I love the banta. Oh, OK, I love yeah, me too. I think so in terms of communicating with like someone romantically or dating, like I think it's really attractive. Obviously when people are intelligent and I saw this from a like a TikTok video. So if you guys know who it's from, like definitely at them, but they're just like women in

general. This was a gross generalization, but I agreed with it. Women are, at least myself, like really are attracted to people who are intelligent. And one way to demonstrate intelligence is through like jokes and being funny. And if you can like engage in like the witty humor, the banter, the banter, then like I find that super attractive and it draws me in as well. Totally. Like it demonstrates that.

It actually, it like demonstrates several things because it demonstrates that you're smart enough to like, pick up on and like make jokes in the moment, but also that you have enough EQ deliver it in a way that's like funny. And you're like, oh, this kind of joke will connect with this person. Yeah. And like, it's going to land. They have the context for this like blah blah blah. Yeah, it's actually quite complicated to be funny, I think in a in a good way.

Yeah, it's hard to be funny. It's hard to be funny because then you have to like, know the other person and what they find funny and understand what context they have for the jokes that you're going to make. It's a is it a cultural reference, a historic reference? It's like, you know, So yeah, I think being funny, can someone fain humor or being funny? It's hard. No, I don't think you can. I think usually a joke will like fall flat and people can immediately be like that was awkward.

Yeah. I mean, also, like, you like leading with humor. Like if you are leading with jokes, you can really, like, understand a person, like pretty quickly. Like you can be like, oh, like what kind of references are they picking up or not picking up? Like what is their response to my like jokes in my banter? Yeah, I think it also can if you're not like a naturally funny person. I think two things that can

help. One watching like comedy shows and like picking up on other comedians and figuring out what do you find funny. And then the second thing is also self deprecating jokes. Like when you're making jokes, you never want to like punch down on someone. You know, if someone that's what they say for like stand up comedian, you want to like make fun of yourself and you can also punch up as well. Yeah, or like you, first you can like make fun of yourself and then you can make fun of someone

else. Yeah, I also, I like being teased. I think being teased it's it can

be cute. What about the role of like gossip or tea? Like where does that fall in how to talk to anyone? I think it's an important part. Like I think people who believe they're like self-righteous and like, oh, I don't gossip. I don't, you know, especially like harmless gossip. I don't gossip. I don't gossip. I think people who like claim to be self-righteous in that sense. You're just kidding yourself and you're honestly hurting yourself for making connections with

people. I think hurtful, harmful gossip, like that's a different thing. But if it's like harmless gossip and like just a little bit of T sipping can be fine, I think like. Specifically outside of friend groups, like on the topic of how to talk to anyone, like a little bit of harmless gossip is a great way to like breakthrough like 3 layers of like small talk to then like have like kind of this like inside joke between the two of you. Inside jokes also are so powerful.

I was like listening to something the other day on TikTok where someone was like, oh, like one of the one of the best hacks to like befriend someone. It's to like make an inside joke with them right away. And I was like, oh, yeah, I freaking love that. Like, I love when people do that with me. And I also enjoy doing that with other people because then you have this like little like harmless little secret. And there's like this little inside joke and it's like, so

like fun. Yeah. Yeah. But it's kind of like, I feel like there's a kind of like a spectrum between like harmless gossip and inside joke. It's like, can sometimes be like one in the same. So it's a spectrum. It's like A and then diagram or something like that, but like, I don't know, One example is like I was at the gym and then I was talking to one of the managers and I was like, oh, like I heard this happen with like the CFO, which is like someone then I

have no idea. Like I've never met this man. Like, you know, this guy like probably barely knows him and it was just and he just all of a sudden he like, you know, broke the 4th wall or like just like broke the actor who's like, Oh my God, like yes, like this is what happened. This is blah, blah, blah. And it's like totally harmless.

But it was it or it was great to like just like connect about something and then now like every time we see each other, we're like Tiki. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of it. It builds relationships. Yeah, yeah. It's the yeah, the power of normal gossip.

Next, we're going to talk about ways to invite people to talk to you without having to talk to them or without having to initiate. One of the great things that Gene and I share is our love for fashion, and in this specific instance, fashion and statement pieces as a conversation starter. So if have you ever seen a person who's just wearing something so freaking cool, it's a cool blouse. A cool, a pair of jeans or shoes and you're like, Oh my God, that's amazing.

Sometimes when I see these people walking down the street, I will stop them and I'll be like, you look in fantastic and like, where did you get that from? And so I think if you can incorporate that into your life and like there are things that you really enjoy that are like specialty or statement pieces, it really does invite people in to ask you about it. Yeah, I love a statement piece.

So like especially if you enjoy fashion, like I think that's something to lean into because that's like a way that you can express yourself and other people can perceive you and like sort of like understand who you are without you even opening your mouth, right? Like without even saying

anything. You're sort of like having a conversation with them through the way that you choose to like dress, especially if you have something that is more of a statement or like more like noticeable or more like cute. So that's like, that's kind of like informed sort of the way I shop because I just like, also like, I love like statement pieces. Like I love like a whimsical like bag or like a really like unexpected detail or something

like that. Well, that's also why you do a lot of shopping like abroad as well, because then like want to commemorate your trip as like, but then like there's a story behind like what you're wearing. And when people ask you about it, Oh, my God, My biggest flex, and I am so annoying about this, like, And I know it is that when I buy things in thrift stores or consignment shops abroad, I am incredibly insufferable. And for a good reason because it's so cool.

Yeah, that I got this, like, scarf from. It was like, it's like a Van Gogh print on a scarf from a thrift store in Australia and Sydney. And I've gotten so many compliments on it because I wear the scarf as a top and then, like, I tie it around on different things. And people like, oh, my God, I love your top. Like, where's it from? And I'm like, yeah. Yeah, it's from A and it's also like one-of-a-kind because it's from a thrift store.

I mean, I'm sure you can find it online, but who's going to find it? It's. Like, maybe you won't. Like, who knows who makes it even? Yeah. And then also like your vintage leather long jacket from Paris The Don. Paris Thrift store in Paris at 17. Dollars also like for me like I also like to buy like special purchases abroad because then it's like a way to cover commemorate the trip and then

also. It's something that people can ask you about and then you can tell them the story behind it and then perhaps they'll purchase it or just like have a conversation. Or even if they don't ask you, it's not like they'll like be like, where did you get that? They'll just be like, oh, like I like your bag. You'd be like, Oh my God, thanks so much. Like I got this like on a trip last year in Lisbon or something like that, or like I got this in Barcelona.

And they'll and then like that's like you like responding to them with like a little piece of information. And then that's how you kind of like get into yes, conversation. And then they're like, Oh my God, like if I was Barcelona or like I was just there last year, like, blah, blah, blah, yes. It's such a good conversation starter, yeah. Especially if there's a story behind it that you care about. They can sense that excitement that you bring into the

conversation. I think also part of it is that like I, I genuinely love fashion and have like a true passion for it. So like passion for fashion, yeah. So like it whenever people do ask me about it, like I'm really excited to talk about the topic. So like maybe that's something that like either if it's not

like natural to you, you can like try it out like little by little. Or maybe there's like other ways to convey like things that you're passionate about in like what you wear or like how you present yourself. Like if you love golf, like you could be, I don't know, wear like whatever you go golfing, like buy some of the memorabilia and wear it and then we'll ask you about it. Yes, like. Where if you go to Bandon Dunes, like get a little sweater that's like Bandon Dunes like.

Totally. Or like one of my friend, my classmates who goes to golf courses around the world, you always get the little hat. Yeah.

That sent the golf course now. I love buying hats, right caps, kind of for this reason, yeah, because then you can wear it and then you can wear it. You can wear it the next time you play golf in like a normal place, and then it'll strike up conversation with people, especially if you're already on the golf course where other people have similar interests to you and you're like, Oh my God, you went there. I went there, or I've always wanted to go there.

What like recommendations do you have? Yes. Or even like, a lot of times people if they go to like a hotel or something, they'll like, buy a hat from the hotel. Really. Yeah. Is that kind of cheesy? Well, it depends on like the hotel, like people will do it for like Amangani or like Amangiri or? People do that for like rest, like the restaurant and not restaurants, but like dive bars, you know, that's a good.

Yes, yeah. Like something that you like associate yourself with or like an experience that you had. And then like other people, I don't know, it's like social signaling, right? Like. It's like when I went to the apprais at Shammies in Palisades Tahoe. You better believe I got a Shammies hat and I wear it around, you know, if you know, you know. Shamwa Shamwa, the other part of the memorabilia that you pick up at Different. Places. Is that it?

Also kind of as a way of signal signaling to people what sort of groups you belong to or like what sort of common interests you may have. So like, why do people buy so much gear from their undergrad or from their grad schools? Like why does Sheree have like 50 pieces of Stanford clothing? It's because one, she's obsessed with Stanford. I love Stanford and also she has tons of stuff from Barnard in

Columbia too. So she just like obviously she just like loves it. She's passionate about it, but like also it's like subconsciously a way of being like, hey, like this is part of my identity and then you. Can see it right away when you see me. And that's also a conversation starter, too, especially if you're an alum or you'd, you know, you live in Palo Alto or you're in from the surrounding area.

Like I'm when I'm wearing like a Stanford sweatshirt, like people can see it. And if they bring it up, I'm like, obviously I'm going to talk to you about it. Yeah. You're like you wanted to Zimmer in Me too. Me too. What year are you? Oh my God, I was stammered. Well, I. I'm not a lot of now or if you go to a concert. That's why people love buying concert. Anne Marabelia Yeah. Because it shows you the music that you're into and then you actually went to the concert. Yeah.

So yeah, there's lots of ways, even if you're not like obsessed with fashion, like us, to kind of like express who you. Are without words and then have people come to you. How to talk to anyone? Yeah, start a conversation with no words. How to start a conversation without saying a single word? It's the energy.

Thank you guys so much for tuning in to this episode of Tiger Sisters. Hope this was helpful. There's some topics that you know could be discussed further. They're open discussion, yes. And so Please remember to like, comment and subscribe. And we would so appreciate it if you could share this video with someone who might find it helpful. We'll see you next time. Thanks. Bye.