Ep 77 Legionnaires' Disease: A Killer Mist - podcast episode cover

Ep 77 Legionnaires' Disease: A Killer Mist

Jul 13, 20211 hr 11 min
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Episode description

Celebration wasn’t the only thing in the air in Philadelphia in July of 1976. Over the course of several days during the 58th Annual Convention of the American Legion, a killer mist spewed out of the air conditioning units throughout the building and into the sidewalks nearby. The result was a large outbreak of unexplained febrile pneumonia, often fatal, that would acquire the name Legionnaires’ Disease. What was causing this terrifying disease and how could it be stopped? In this episode, we walk through the massive investigation into this outbreak that would lead to the discovery of the causative agent, Legionella pneumophila, and explore the biology of this mysterious pathogen. We wrap up the episode with a look at the current status of Legionnaires’ Disease and a potentially grim forecast for its prevalence as the world slowly gets back to normal.

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Transcript

Speaker 1

It was the end of the month and I was helping a friend paint her home. Her house was about thirty five miles away from mine, which is in the city of Boston, so in lieu of driving home, she opted to get me a room because I was going to be helping her the following day. Once I opened the hotel door, it was hot and musty, and you could tell no one had entered that room for a while. I turned on the ac and was hit in the face with a musty mist. That smell still lingers with

me today. Didn't think anything of it, ate food and went to sleep. Continued with my weekend as scheduled, basically the gym and sleep. That following Monday, I felt out of it. I wasn't sick, just exhausted. I thought it was simply from going to the gym. I didn't have work because it was Memorial Day and wasn't due back to work until Wednesday. But I stayed in bed the whole holiday and the day after. I just remember being at work tired. I thought it was from oversleeping, and

the best cure for that was more sleep. As the weekend rolled around, I was back at my friend's house, painting, but I noticed I needed a break every five to ten minutes or so. I was a bit sore and always out of breath and sweating profusely. Monday rolled around, and it had been nine days since I was at the hotel. I went to bed, and when I awoke, I could no longer walk straight. I was slamming into walls and couldn't see straight. When I awoke, it was

already midnight. I overslept again, but now I lost all motor skills, couldn't walk at all, and my speech was slurring so Siri didn't recognize my voice. I had to crawl to use the restroom and had a hard time not knocking things over when I did. I awoke in my bed to my mom asking me about the mess in the bathroom. She immediately knew I was sick once she heard me speak. I woke up in the hospital surrounded by nurses and doctors trying to figure out why I couldn't talk or walk and why I had a

fever of one hundred and six degrees. It took about four days before they figured out it was Legionnaire's I still had a temperature of one hundred and three, still couldn't walk, no motor skills at all, and was unable to speak. Hallucinating at this point was the most enjoyable part of the day. I know I had rooms of family and friends, and by the look on their faces, I could tell they were told the severity of everything which I didn't even know. I was in the hospital

and rehab for about three and a half weeks. I can walk and talk again, and all my motor skills have returned. I drop things a lot, and I'm very forgetful at the minor tasks. I had to relearn what I did for a living and how to drive. I used to love working out, but it's so dangerous now because I can't balance weights like I should and walking hurts after a while. My joints feel like they are on fire most of the day. Steps are my new arch nemesis. My knees feel like they are about to

buckle and crumble whilst walking up or down them. I have dizzy spells, get tired at the drop of a dime, and lose my train of thought halfway through tasks. It has been interesting, and I am glad to know I am not the only one out there dealing with these side effects and that things can get better. Wow. Yeah, that sounds very horrible and terrifying. Yeah, so that was from a website called legionella dot org, where under a section called share your Story.

Speaker 2

I didn't realize until kind of reading through some of those first hand accounts and researching this episode how long lasting some of the effects of infection with Legionella can be.

Speaker 1

Oh yeah, No, it's like I think there is a lot more under the surface than as per usual then we think there is at the beginning of these episodes. Hi, I'm Aaron Welsh and I'm Aaron Alman. Update and this is this podcast will Kill You.

Speaker 2

And today, of course we're talking about Legionella, the causative agent of Legionnaire's disease.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and pontiac fever and pontiac fever other things. It's it's gonna be an interesting I have lots of biology questions already, so cool.

Speaker 2

I knew that was coming, and I like hope that I know the answers to them. But you're probably not gonna like a lot of them as usual.

Speaker 1

You mean, like it's I'm not gonna like them because it's well, we don't quite know. Yep. Yeah, great, great, great, great, they're not satisfying answers. Dang it. That's okay. Well we'll get there, but first we do some podcast stuff.

Speaker 2

We should yeah, because it's let me check quarantin any time.

Speaker 1

It is quarantin any time. What are we drinking this week?

Speaker 2

We're drinking losing your Cool?

Speaker 1

Yeah, for reasons I think we always say this, but that will become more clear as the episode goes on. Basically, we're talking about air conditioning, we're talking about fevers. You're just gonna lose your cool.

Speaker 2

You're gonna lose your cool, and what's in losing your cool?

Speaker 1

Eric It is a I think it's actually a really delicious one. So it has normal rum, pineapple rum, lime juice, Apricot liquor, and simple syrup. And we will post the full recipe for losing your cool on our website This podcast will kill You dot Com, as well as on all of our social media channels like Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, and those are the places where you can also find the non alcoholic place seburrita recipe exactly.

Speaker 2

Speaking of our website, this podcast with you dot Com check it out if you haven't already. We have so many things there like merch and a bookshop dot org affiliate account. We've got a good Reads list, we have a Patreon, we have links to Bloodmobile, our music. We have transcripts for so many of our episodes, soon to be all of them.

Speaker 1

So definitely check out our website. Yes, check it out. Uh. I guess like, I feel like this was a really fast intro, but I'm I'm like I do. I don't know what else to do here.

Speaker 2

I'm excited about this episode, so maybe let's take a quick break and then just get started.

Speaker 1

Let's do it. So.

Speaker 2

Legionella is a genus of bacteria that has a whole bunch of species, way more than I realized. I think at least over fifty.

Speaker 1

Yeah. I think that's been a fairly recent development.

Speaker 2

Yeah, and I believe that at least thirty of these bacterial species can be pathogenic to humans. And in general, these are a much more interesting group of bacteria than I realized. I feel bad because I was just like, oh, they're another gram negative like waw. They're much more interesting than that. They are gram negative little rods. And when they're not infecting us humans, they live in freshwater sources, but not just free floating in modern No.

Speaker 1

No, I'm so glad you're going to talk about those. Oh yeah, it's so cool.

Speaker 2

So they don't just live free floating in the environment. They exist as pathogens of amibe uh huh.

Speaker 1

And other protozoa. I was when I was reading that, because I was like reading about the evolutionary history and I came across that, and I was like, this is so well timed with our Nicleeria Fleriye episode exactly. It's wild. And also I was like, oh, this is definitely an error, Like I'm reading too much about Aaron's biology section. I need to stop. Yeah, it's so fascinating.

Speaker 2

So I always thought of them as just a water born bacteria, which they are, but in water they can live and persist free floating as well as in biofilms, which is what makes them very difficult to deal with in pipes or water heaters, air conditioning coolers.

Speaker 1

Et cetera.

Speaker 2

But they only multiply inside of another organism like an amiba or another protozella.

Speaker 1

It's really cool because that also has implications for like why it infects humans or how to affects humans.

Speaker 2

Just gonna say, but I'm going to put a pin in that, but keep that in mind, because when we talk about the sort of pathophysiology of how it gets us sick, Yeah.

Speaker 1

It makes complete sense. M hm. Okay.

Speaker 2

So we have a lot of different species of Legionella, but the one that's most famous and probably the most common pathogen of humans, at least in the US and throughout Europe is Legionella pneumophila, which has a whole number of different subgroups and then specific strains within those subgroups,

so it's a pretty large overall group of bacteria. And so this is an environmental pathogen, and the way that people get infected with it is through contact, generally aerosol contact with water that is contaminated with Legionella and also amiba of course, and Legionella in general grows well at warm temperatures like twenty five to forty five celsius, just like the amibas that we talked about in our Nigeria palrite episode. It's happiest around thirty five celsius, which is

like ninety five fahrenheit. It's pretty warm water. Yeah, And what's interesting is that although this is a bacterial species that's found naturally in aquatic environments across the globe. It generally doesn't reach high enough levels to get you sick in those natural environments.

Speaker 1

So what's the infectious dose?

Speaker 2

Then, Aaron, I knew you were going to ask that I have it in bold.

Speaker 1

We don't know you have in bold. We don't know, well, no, I have in bold. What is infectious dose?

Speaker 2

Because yeah, that was my biggest question too, because all these papers say, you know, it's in human altered environments where we're artificially heating water. Then you have this disproportionate growth of Legionella the bacteria in comparison to the amibe, and that's what leads to human infection. But there isn't a well established dose response relationship or even a clear

infectious dose or lethal dose. There are some papers that list numbers, but those studies were in guinea pigs, so we really don't know how accurate they are.

Speaker 1

Well. And it's really interesting too, because, as I'm sure you'll talk about, there's a wide range of like host susceptibility, where like your immune system and your age and you're whatever risk factors must change a lot of like the infectious dose for one person might not be the infectious dose for somebody else exactly.

Speaker 2

And we'll talk a little bit more about that when we talk about the symptoms of like the kind of range of symptoms that you see in these disorders, because I think that plays a huge part in it. Okay, Yeah, it also makes it difficult in terms of prevention and control to like do environmental monitoring because we don't know what is a safe level versus an unsafe level of

Legionella in water sources. Yeah, yeah, great question, Eric, But in general, this is not a pathogen that's transmissible person to person asterisk. It has happened maybe a handful of times at least once that I saw documented, but that's very rare, and in general, outbreaks that happen are from a shared environmental source.

Speaker 1

What were the circumstances of the person to person transmission? It was a.

Speaker 2

Mom who was caring for someone who was very severely ill for like over eight hours a day in a very small room without any ventilation and so presumably and she didn't have contact with that same water source that he had.

Speaker 1

Had contact with. Okay, interesting, that was the one that I saw. Yeah, So.

Speaker 2

All right, so let's talk about what happens when these bacteria get inside of our body because I think it's really fascinating. I might go into more detail than I sometimes do on this, but I think it's gonna be fun.

Speaker 1

Okay, let's do it.

Speaker 2

So, since these are bacteria that generally live inside of ambae when they're in the environment, it's not surprising that once they get inside our body via inhalation into our respiratory tract. These are also intracellular bacteria like Ricketsia and chlamydia and a lot of other bacteria that live and multiply inside of our cells rather.

Speaker 1

Than just in our bodies.

Speaker 2

So in us, what they do is these bacteria adhere to our cells. I think from what I read they can infect other cells like our respiratory cells, our epithelial cells, but primarily they infect Macrophagious Macrophasias are white blood cells that normally serve the function of gobbling up bacteria and then killing them. But Legionella is able to persist inside these macrophages. Here's how they do it. Normally, when a macrophage gobbles up a bacteria, you can imagine them taking

their little macrophages kind of almost look like amiba. They have like wiggly arms and they take those wiggly arms and they wrap it around a bacterium like a giant hug and then they bloop it inside of the macrofage cell. But once it gets inside the cell, it's wrapped in a little bubble of macriphage cell membrane. M hm. It's

called the phagosome. Yeah, yeah, you know this erin And now normally, once that fhagosome is inside the macrophage, all of these other mechanisms inside of the macrofage cell would see that bubble and be like, ugh, there's another bacterium. Boop, and they'd pop that bubble, release the bacterium.

Speaker 1

And kill it mm hmm.

Speaker 2

But lee Janella prevents that bubble from ever popping, So they persist inside a bubble inside a macrophage, and they replicate and replicate and replicate. The reason I think this is fascinating is because it's exactly the same thing that they do inside an amoba. Because amibas eat bacteria the same way that our macrophages do.

Speaker 1

Right, it's also very virus like behavior.

Speaker 2

It is, it's very viral huh yeah. And then inside of us they do the same thing that they do to amiba. They kill our cells just like they would kill an amiba. So that's how we get infected, how we get sick. What does the disease that Legionella causes actually look like? Kind of like in our chicken pox episode, And we already mentioned this at the top, there are two different named diseases that are associated with infection with

Legionella bacteria. But I as I was reading this, I was like, I find it annoying that we have these two different named diseases because they're not truly really different. They're kind of just a spectrum of symptoms which all seem possible after a Legionella infection, including asymptomatic infection. There's evidence of people who become infected zero convert, so they show evidence of infection and immunity, but never have any

symptoms of infection with legionella. So some places have started just sort of naming this legionellosis as a spectrum of disease rather than legionnaire's disease versus pontiac fever.

Speaker 1

Right, I mean? And I also think that probably the likelihood of someone being diagnosed with pontiac fever is much lower than with legionnaire's disease, and like if the exposure is the same, Okay, I guess that leads into the question of why are there two diseases? Like why are there two name diseases? I mean, historically it makes sense, but like why did that differentiation persist for so long?

Speaker 2

Great question? And I knew that you were going to ask this question. That's another place I have it in bold. We don't know, no, yeah, yeah, I So my big question was is it species specific? Is it different species

of Legionella that are causing pontiac fever versus legionnaire's disease? Maybe, but not really as far as I can tell from all of my research, because not only do we mostly test for Legionella pneumophilla zero group one, and so like one specific group of Legionella numophila, that particular bacterial species has been found to cause both legionnaires and pontiac fever,

as well as asymptomatic infections. So it can't be entirely based on zero group, and it can't be entirely based on species of bacteria, because again, there's a lot of different species of Legionella, so there's likely a huge amount

of host factors that go into it. We know there are risk factors that make Legionnaire's disease a lot more likely, things like if you smoke or have any kind of chronic lung disease, an older age, especially anyone over age fifty is at higher risk than people younger, and any kind of immunal compromise, especially immuno compromise associated with cancers or being on cancer therapy or steroid treatment. So those things we know make it more likely that someone exposed

to Legionella will develop Legionnaire's disease. But like you said, Erin, we also just don't know as much about pony because.

Speaker 1

It's pretty mild.

Speaker 2

So pontiac fever is basically just a mild flu like illness caused by legionella. It's fever, body aches, maybe some respiratory symptoms, but it lasts for a few days and then you get better. No pneumonia, no death, No pneumonia, no death exactly.

Speaker 1

Yeah.

Speaker 2

Legionnaire's disease, on the other hand, is a pneumonia, and we've talked about pneumonia a lot, actually, even this season in our coxsidioidomcosis episode.

Speaker 1

That's what kept popping into my head when I was reading about this, Yeah, definitely. So.

Speaker 2

The symptoms of Legionnaire's pneumonia generally start anywhere from two to fourteen days after infection, so that's the incubation period. It can be quite long. It starts very often with a fever, and like you heard in the first hand account, this fever can get quite high. Often you'll have chills

which are osociated with such high fevers, a cough. Unlike some of the more quote typical pneumonias, this cough is not often very productive, so you don't have a ton of phlegm that you're bringing up, but you still likely have a cough. You'll probably have some difficulty breathing and some chest pain because there's intense inflammation happening in the lungs.

And if you read the kind of classic descriptions of Legionnaire's disease, it's often described as having GI involvement, so like diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, But in reality, this can happen with other atypical pneumonias as well. Atypical pneumonia just means a pneumonia that doesn't fit the old school, very classic definition of pneumonia that's generally caused by streptococcus pneumonia or

clebcila or something like that. So there's a whole group of atypical pneumonias of which Legionnaire's disease is.

Speaker 1

One, right, Yeah, I was I kept wondering what a typical Like, what distinguishes atypical pneumonia from typical pneumonia.

Speaker 2

Yeah, there's there are things like maybe the X rays will look a little bit different than pneumonia with strep pneumo, But there isn't any one specific X ray finding that tells you this is Legionnaire's disease versus something else. So it's kind of it's a very non specific way of grouping pneumonia's.

Speaker 1

So like if somebody came in with symptoms of pneumonia, some kind of pneumonia, like, what would make you go, oh, that's typical pneumonia versus atypical Would it be like you, you know, screen them for strap or you look at the X ray? Is it a combination? Like yeah, it's a really good question.

Speaker 2

There's not a good answer to that because what we end up doing is just treating for all of it very often. Okay, Yeah, so there are X ray findings that are maybe more specific for a strip pneumo pneumonia versus more atypical pneumonias, like maybe the X ray will be a little bit more diffuse and patchy versus like, Oh, here's a pneumonia in one lobe of your lung. Very clearly defined, but that's not specific, right, None of the kind of ways that we used to diagnose, like oh,

is your cough productive versus not productive? Are you very very very sick versus your X ray looks terrible, but you.

Speaker 1

Don't look that sick.

Speaker 2

That's something that's usually associated with an quote atypical pneumonia is the X ray might look really bad, but the person doesn't seem that sick.

Speaker 1

Clinically, gotcha. Also, like I said, GI.

Speaker 2

Involvement, right, classically you would think, well GI involvement, Maybe I'm thinking legionella is more likely, but that can happen in other pneumonias as well. So there's no like one specific thing that if someone walked in you would say, oh, well, this is most definitely this one cause.

Speaker 1

Et cetera, et cetera. M hm.

Speaker 2

And that's what makes pneumonia in general difficult because it's often difficult to test for direct causative agents, especially if someone doesn't have a lot of phlegm that they can cough up that you can use as something to culture. Right for legionella, there is another test that you can use on urine. It's a urine antigen test that can test directly for the presence of the bacteria.

Speaker 1

Which is very cool.

Speaker 2

It is very cool, and so that is something that you can do to test directly for it.

Speaker 1

It's of course not a perfect.

Speaker 2

Test, just like any diagnostic test, but it is effective, So that's pretty awesome. And it's a lot faster than something like culture, which takes many days. Yeah, so that's kind of what it would look like if somebody was infected in general Legionari's disease, legionellosis with pneumo has about a five to ten percent fatality rate that's with treatment.

Speaker 1

Is that just because of just how fast the bacteria is like already cause damage before it's caught, or is it like the efficacy of treatment isn't as great as for other pneumonias, Like why is that?

Speaker 2

So it's actually pretty similar to the fatality rate for pneumonia's in general.

Speaker 1

Okay, that's just a bad it's just a bad pneumonia.

Speaker 2

And I think that historically Legionnaire's disease was considered a more severe form of pneumonia, and if untreated, the mortality rate can be a lot higher than for other forms of pneumonia. It can be as high as forty to eighty percent, whereas for other pneumonias it might be less like thirty percent or so. But as we've gotten better at recognizing Legionaire's disease, I think people get diagnosed earlier, and so we've seen that it's not always necessarily the

most severe form of pneumonia. It's just that previously we were only seen the sickest of sick people. If that makes such yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. And the other thing that you would say would make this a more atypical pneumonia is that if you treat it like we would treat a typical pneumonia with something like a penicillin or a cephalosporin, it wouldn't respond because those type of antibiotics

that we use for more quote typical. And when we say typical and atypical that doesn't mean common versus uncommon. Atypical pneumonias are still quite common.

Speaker 1

It's very confusing.

Speaker 2

I don't like real at all, but it's if you read about pneumonia's they use that terminology all the time. I'm not a fan, but yeah, so it doesn't respond to those You have to use different antibiotics, which is why in the US and a lot of other places, if somebody comes in with pneumonia, they'll often get an antibiotic that will cover both the atypicals.

Speaker 1

And the typicals. If that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, because.

Speaker 2

Because if we aren't able to test for the exact bacteria that causes it, you just want to cover everything that makes sense. Yeah, well that's the biology pretty much.

Speaker 1

Oh my goodness, that was so fast it was. Do you have any more questions? I guess I have more questions about like exposure, I think, and so maybe that's for the current status situation.

Speaker 2

Yeah, we'll probably talk about that a bit.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, I think that's I think I don't have any more for the biology.

Speaker 2

Even though all my answers were I don't know.

Speaker 1

We made it through.

Speaker 2

So Aaron, do you know more than I do? Like where did this pathogen come from? And what's up with it?

Speaker 1

I will try to answer those right after this break. I like the story of Legionnaire's disease, because on the surface, it seems like a fairly straightforward example of a classic outbreak investigation and unraveling the mystery of a new infectious agent, which is basically what I thought it was when I first started researching for this episode, and that investigation, that whole outbreak epidemiology part of it is super duper interesting. But what I find makes it even more interesting is,

of course, the context always the context. Why did this outbreak happen when it did, and what about it? Stances led to the way it played out, both in terms of the epidemiological investigation as well as how it was portrayed by the media. So let's get into it by going back to nineteen seventy six Philadelphia, Pennsylvania aka the

City of Brotherly Love. This entire year, everyone around the US was celebrating the bi centennial of the country, including more than four thousand members of the American Legion, which, if you didn't know because I had to google it, is an organization of US War veterans. They do a lot of lobbying on behalf of veterans, and they also hold meetings or commemorative events, and one of these such events took place from July twenty first to July twenty

fourth at the Bellevue Stratford Hotel in Philadelphia. This was specifically the fifty eighth annual convention of the American Legion Department wow YE. Over the course of that convention and in the weeks that followed, two hundred and twenty one people became ill with a mysterious disease and thirty four died, which is a rate of about fifteen percent. Most, but not all, of those affected were members of the American Legion, hence the name Legionnaire's disease. So what went down at

this hotel? Yeah, The outbreak was first brought to the attention of the CDC when a local physician at the VIA diagnosed several of his patients with pneumonia. But this pneumonia wasn't typical pneumonia whatever it what means was it? And this one didn't seem to respond well to the normal antibiotics that he generally prescribed, and alarm bell started going off when four of his pneumonia patients died. Oh gosh.

On the morning of August two, David Fraser, a former EIS officer, who worked as an epidemiologist at the CDC, got the call that something was going down in Philadelphia and he was put in charge of a field team to find out what. Fraser and his team arrived on the scene fairly early on in the epidemic curve, and while they had a lot to go on epidemiologically, that knowledge didn't help them too much in their top priority

stopping or at the very least, slowing the epidemic. They knew that the linking factor among all of the people getting sick was this convention at the Bellevue Stratford Hotel. And as it turned out, these first few patients that the doctor at the VA sort of sounded the alarm on that was just the tip of the iceberg. More and more cases of pneumonia began to appear in doctor's offices around the city, and the death toll was mounting.

Speaker 2

Can you remind me how long after the convention this doctor told the CDC, like what the timeframe was?

Speaker 1

So I think the doctor told the CDC in like the very like August first, or like the very end of July. And I think the first cases were a few days in the middle of that convention. Oka and so which was July twenty first to July twenty fourth, And so the CDC got there like the first week of August, so like pretty soon, and it's like the epidemic curve maybe hadn't quite peaked, it was close to peaking, yeah, but yeah, but more and more cases started to like

roll in. But it is likely that given the incubation period of two to fourteen days, those that were going to get sick had already been exposed, right, and there may not have been a whole lot more exposures happening.

Speaker 2

And that that convention was over and they presumably had left the city.

Speaker 1

A lot of people, I think a lot of them were in were in Pennsylvania at least. Okay, okay, So yeah, So even though probably a lot of the exposures had already happened, the disease was still showing up. And so more and more of these cases of pneumonia began to appear in doctors' offices. The death toll was mounting. And immediately the first thing that they suspected, the CDC suspected was influenza, but not just any influenza, swine flu or H one N one and so here comes some of

the historical context. So earlier that year, there had been some cases of H one N one swine flu at Fort Dix, New Jersey, which got a lot of public health officials a bit concerned that this could be the start of another influenza pandemic similar to the one that happened in nineteen eighteen. And these cases of influenza were

worrisome for a couple of reals. One was that although in nineteen seventy six people didn't know exactly what strain the nineteen eighteen influenza one was, studies had suggested that it was a similar isolate to the H one N one swine flu that had popped up at Fort Dix, and as we know now, it is like very similar. And another thing that was, you know, concerning, was in

the timing. So these Fort Dix cases had happened very early in the year, like in January, which is much earlier than seasonal flu tends to increase in incidents, and that was another characteristic that it shared with the nineteen eighteen influenza. Okay, and so even though the nineteen seventy six swine flu outbreak at Fort Dix had caused only

thirteen hospitalizations and one death. These similarities between the nineteen eighteen influenza were striking enough to lead to Gerald Ford, who was president at the time, to call for a mass immunization program. Over the next six months after first appearing at Fort Dix, swine flu had caused no additional cases, no hospitalizations, no deaths, and its spread seemed unlikely, and so the momentum for its vaccination or control seemed to

be slowing somewhat. That is until these mysterious pneumonia deaths began to happen in Philadelphia, and these deaths led people to urge Congress to pass legislation indemnifying vaccine manufacturers for a swine flu vaccine, which is a decision that Ford later received a lot of criticism for, and in general, this like rapid response and some of the subsequent decisions regarding the potential you know, nineteen seventy six swine flu

epidemic that never was. They were really controversial at the time and have in retrospect been called too strong of a response for this outbreak that never was, sort of like this miscalculation of risk and like being overly cautious, and I mean, I think It just serves as an example of, like, it's really hard to know what the right move is, but I bring it up because it's really important in understanding, at least in part, why there

was such media frenzy around this mysterious illness in Philadelphia. You know, you have you have newspaper headlines calling it like the you know, Philly killer or killer fever, you know, ill in Philly. And actually I think I made that last one up.

Speaker 2

Everyone was just sort of primed to be paying attention to something like this. Yes, exactly, Okay, that makes sense.

Speaker 1

I mean it's sort of like I was thinking about it in the context of today and COVID and how like if there was a convention let's say, like this summer and next summer, and it was like, oh these cases of atypical pneumonia and fever, people would be very concerned for a good reason.

Speaker 2

Uh huh, yeah, remember that for later. Yeah, O great, okay, oh yeah.

Speaker 1

And the other thing is that swine flew this H one N one. This wasn't the only potentially deadly epidemic disease that was featuring in headlines during the nineteen seventies. Ebola, lass of fever, marburg virus, camplobacter enteritis, and gastritis lime disease. These were all making themselves known and scaring the world along the way throughout the nineteen seventies. And there's a quote that's often used to characterize the attitude of Western

medicine in the middle of the twentieth century regarding infectious disease. Quote, it's time to close the books on infectious diseases, declare the war against pestilence I and shift national resoarch to such chronic problems as cancer and heart disease. So it turns out, and I found this out while trying to find this exact quote, that this is an urban legend. I knew it.

Speaker 2

I feel like I remember looking up that quote like when we first started this podcast and being like, it's not a real it's not real.

Speaker 1

It's not real. Yeah, No, like this no one like this quote was never said. It's it's just yeah, no one can find the origin. I know, I know, And so yes, it may be a misquote. And while the war on infectious disease was never declared over, it is true that advancements in antibiotics and vaccines may have made many clinicians a bit say, over confident, maybe regarding their

ability to handle like whatever came their way totally. And even if we lacked the tools to take care of a pathogen, the number of newly diagnosed human pathogens, especially those that could cause epidemics, was kind of slowing to a near crawl, like since the heyday of you know,

early germ theory and et cetera. If the first half of the twentieth century was basically like stick some sputum onto a slide, pop that slide under the scope, and then describe a global pathogen that had been infecting humans for millennia, then the second and half of the twentieth century felt to like many people, that there's like nothing

new under the sun. We've gone it all, or just like a few things, like it's it's more of an anomaly to find a new pathogen than it is to just see your typicals right then, just your typical pneumonias, right and obviously that's not our feeling now right like not in the age of COVID nineteen of Zeka of bird flow of sin nombree virus, like we are keenly away the globe right now is keenly aware that emerging infectious diseases are very much a part of life, but

this was not necessarily the case. In nineteen seventy six, Legionnaire's disease would really become one of the first or at the very least like part of the first cohort of emerging infectious diseases, which was this concept, a new concept at that time that would eventually force humans to evaluate the ways that they interact with their environment that may increase the risk of a spillover event or at the very least alter the ecology of the pathogen that

could lead to an increase in human disease. And this trend of emerging infectious disease isn't solely one due to environmental disturbance, of course, it's also due to the constant development of technology and the growth of our own knowledge base that allows us to see more detail where previously it was all sort of a blur, like we're going to describe new species because we described one genus in the first place, or a new genus, right, so it just kind of like it builds and builds and builds.

But let's head back to the hotel. Let's check it on what's going on there? Yeah, the CDC had shown up in full force and were quickly at work surveying those with the mysterious pneumonia as well as other attendees of the convention that hadn't gotten sick. These surveys revealed that older, age and smoking were pretty big risk factors, and that men were three times as likely to get

the disease as women. They checked hospital logs they determine whether it was just the legionnaires or if other hotel guests or if anyone local had gotten sick too, and they certainly had. There were several cases of what was referred to as Broad Street pneumonia, which is the street where the hotel was on, that had popped up. Basically, these were people who weren't legionnaires or had not even necessarily gone into the hotel. Some had just been on

the sidewalk next to the hotel. So what the heck was causing this disease? And even more pressing, how was it transmitted? And it would take some time for the second question to be answered, and I'll get to it, But what all of this shoe leather epidemiology did was help with the second question. At least in the form of ruling out, so food born and transmission was ruled out,

Arthur pod vector borne transmission was ruled out. Person to person transmission was ruled out, which also kicked influenza to the curb at the same time. And it seemed most likely to Fraser and the others on this field team who were investigating the outbreak that either airborne or water contamination might be the culprit oh, but extensive sampling of the sources of water and all of the air ducks in the hotel it turned up nothing. Like they were baffled.

Not long after the CDC had arrived on the scene, cases began to decline, and eventually there was nothing left to do but go back to Atlanta and begin preparing the reports, which they did on August twentieth, usually just like two and a half weeks of like hardcore investigation, like so many people on the ground right, and even though the field workers had covered a tremendous amount of ground in their investigation of the outbreak, the fact that

they had come back without a causative agent, and that they seemed no closer to being able to prevent a subsequent outbreak of whatever this was. It made the CDC a big target in the media reporting at the time, which was already super critical of their handling of the whole swine flu situation. Right and also like this was in the headlines for ages, it became like part of popular culture. Almost like Bob Dylan wrote a song called Legionnaire's Disease.

Speaker 2

I okay, I know who Bob Dylan is, so that's like almost a.

Speaker 1

First for the two US. Good first step.

Speaker 2

But I feel like even today, most people will have heard of Legionnaire's disease.

Speaker 1

Like it's a thing.

Speaker 2

People have heard of it, it's a headline, et cetera. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Do.

Speaker 1

You want to hear the Bob Dylan like a couple of lines? I would love to. Okay, Okay. Some say it was radiation, some say there was acid on the microphone. Some say a combination that turned their hearts to stone. But whatever it was, it drove them to their knees. Oh, Legionnaire's disease. I love it. Yeah, and it goes on. There's more. I haven't listened to the actual song, so I don't know how the melody goes, but it exists.

But anyway, I think that the song. I think that the you know, the little lyrics that I shared really speaks to the fact that no one knew what was going on, and that was part of the reason that it was like so persistent in you know, headlines and like the news stories at.

Speaker 2

The time, right, people love a mystery exactly.

Speaker 1

And all that the CDC and the affiliated institutions could could do, all they could say was what Legionaire's disease was not. And this was such an enormous investigation, even in just a short time period, Like, for instance, the Franklin Institute looked into the air conditioning system, The Academy of Natural Sciences examined the water supply. Drexel University used mass spectrometry to look at whether there was anything in the water. Harvard and MIT were involved in testing hair

of survivors to look for an environmental toxin. University of Connecticut examined nickel poisoning, which was actually a pretty popular hypothesis for a minute until it was revealed that autopsy not which were nickel coated was leading to the like inflated appearance of contamination. Yeah, huh, like, but this was a huge undertaking.

Speaker 2

Yeah, and nobody even when they tested like the air conditionings and things, they didn't they couldn't find it.

Speaker 1

The why, But yeah, there was At the end of this, like after some of the reports had been produced, committees of infectious disease specialists and committees of pathologists came to one conclusion regarding the legionnaire's disease outbreak. Whatever had caused it, it definitely wasn't a bacterium. Yeah.

Speaker 2

Gosh, yeah, I love it when those kind of conclusions happened.

Speaker 1

I know. I mean it's so easy in retrospect to be like, well come on, but it is like yeah, so like why why were they so sure? Well, I mean it wasn't showing up on any of their routine or even in their non routine screens. Yeah, microbiologists had swabbed and smeared and cultured and stained every sample they could think of on all different types of culture media, but to no avail, Like nothing was there. Antigen tests

revealed nothing. The pneumonia itself more closely resembled that of a viral pneumonia than a bacterial pneumonia, and so they were like, well, it must be either some sort of virus or some strange environmental contaminant. And I should note that there were some groups that did believe it was some sort of like undescribed bacterium, but like by and large, there were committees that were like, no, this is not bacterial.

And now that the outbreak appeared to be over, the window of opportunity for uncovering what caused it seemed to be narrowing. Right. Of course, the failure to identify the causative agent led to constant criticism of CDC researchers assigned to the task. And there were still so many people

assigned to the task. One of them was doctor Joseph McDade, who was a microbiologist at the CDC, and he had started working there in nineteen seventy five, I think, just like eight months or so before this nineteen seventy six Philadelphia outbreak, and he worked in the department for Rickettsial Diseases.

Speaker 2

Ooh.

Speaker 1

He had spent the previous decade studying various ricketsier both in the lab and in the field, including outbreaks of typhus in Egypt and Ethiopia. And if you think back to our Rocky Mountain spotted fever episode, which is a

ricketzial disease. You may remember that ricketsie are notoriously difficult to cultivate to culture since they're these intracellular pathogens, right, And so mcdaide's background working on Rickettsia would prove to be key in finding the missing piece of the puzzle of Legionnaire's disease.

Speaker 2

And that's just fortuitous. Like well, I mean, it's lucky that McDade was there, or was.

Speaker 1

It because there were so many people working on so many different angles of this, Like was it fortuitous? Was it serendipitous or was it inevitable? Yeah? Yeah, So, like I mentioned, all kinds of these different hypotheses were being put forth to explain the outbreak, all at the same time. So you had a million different moving parts all looking at this angle and that angle, and this virus and

that virus, and this fungus and that fungus whatever. And one of these hypotheses was q fever, which is a mild infection caused by Coxiella burnettii, which is a Ricketzia

like pathogen. So it's really small and intracellular that can cause a typical pneumonia in people and it doesn't generally do that, but it and mcday didn't really think that this deadly outbreak, like I said, fifteen percent mortality rate was q fever, especially since people get Q fever through exposure to contaminated animals and like inhaling dust from them. But he was like, well, no, no, of course I'm gonna, you know, rule it out. And so he set to work.

And so, like other ricketzial pathogens, Coxiella burnettii is a bit tricky to culture and isolate. So first you need to take the blood or tissue sample, grind it up and like put it in solution and then inject that into guinea pigs. And then you call the guinea pigs and take tissue from them to put in embryonated eggs. And when mcday did this with lung tissue from people who had died of Legionnaire's disease, the guinea pigs became febrile,

like right away, like with a severe fever. Okay, nothing grew in the eggs when he tried to do that part of it. But when he looked at smears of guinea pigs spleen that had been stained by a technique common for like staining raquetzial species, he saw rod shaped bacteria, and he showed other researchers who kind of shrugged it off, saying it was a contaminant and not in high enough

numbers to be the causative agent. Oh my gracious. Well, and around the same time, the nickel hypothesis had gathered steam because it was kind of being consistently found in all of the people who had died from Legionnaire's disease, which makes sense because it was on the autopsy knives anyway, and so, but so he didn't pursue this like rod

shaped bacterium too much, Oh my gosh. But a few months later the nickel theory had been debunked and McDade found himself like wondering about it, just kind of like why. He was like, why can't I drop this idea about this rod shape bacterium? He was like, why is it there? Why why was nick culture in the eggs? Blah blah blah. And so he went in over like the Christmas break

and was like, there's no one here. So I'm going to have the lab all to myself and I'm going to be able to do this work without being disturbed. Oh my gosh. And so he went back and he started to look at all of the slides again that he had prepared, and on one of them he saw not just a single, you know, rod shape bacterium, but a cluster of bacteria, which made him realize that this probably wasn't just a random contaminant, but likely the culprit.

And additional testing revealed that he was right. More than ninety percent of the Philadelphia patients had antibodies to this bacterium, and they were also able to isolate it from additional autopsy specimens. Oh, but they still didn't know exactly what it was like. Was it a Ricketsia. No, it certainly didn't look like or behave like a Ricketzio species, so

maybe it was something else. Eventually, through lots of trial and error, researchers were able to put together a recipe for a culture medium that met the very specific needs of this super festidious new bacterium. It's very picky. I yeah, I love the word festidious for bacteria. It's a good one.

It's a good one. And through this they were also able to solve the mystery of its outbreak because it turned out that this bacterium loves warm water and the warm weather in July proved a perfect time for this bacterium to be misted out by the air conditioning system into the lobby of the hotel and into the sidewalk next to it. Just this like killer missed. Oh, by the time that the CDC had examined the AC system, it had been cleaned, so no traces of the bacterium

had been found. Huh yeah, interesting. And this new bacterium was given the name Legionella numophila as a nod to this outbreak who was affected by it, and then the tendency of it to cause disease in the lungs like lung loving. And this turned out to be like a whole new genus of bacteria. But new doesn't necessarily mean new to humans. It may just mean newly described. So had the world seen Legionella numophilla before, absolutely always aways. All you needed to do, it seemed, was just to look.

Once Legionella numophila was pinpointed as the causative agent, researchers immediately began combing through past unsolved outbreaks that resembled the one in nineteen seventy six to see if it had

emerged before. And it apps lutely had in nineteen sixty eight, for example, when ninety five out of one hundred people who worked in a health department in Pontiac, Michigan, became ill with a mild illness, no deaths, And at that time there had been extensive epidemiological investigation into the outbreak, and the air conditioning units had been suspected, but it again didn't yield like any solid answers, and so it

was kind of just like it's a mystery. But then once Legionella numophila had been described, people who had pontiac fever like were in that outbreak were tested for antibodies, and it was shown that they were one and the same.

Speaker 2

Interesting because of just the sort of epidemiological similarities, even though the disease itself wasn't nearly as severe.

Speaker 1

M exact fascinating. Yeah, and even at the Bellevue Stratford Hotel, so the same place where like this nineteen seventy six Legionnaires disease outbreak, first outbreak happened two years before during a meeting of the Odd Fellows Society. Yeah, several people had become ill with atypical pneumonia. So it was again shown that the same bacterium had been hiding out there.

And then another outbreak of unexplained pneumonia in Saint Elizabeth's Hospital in Washington, d C. In August of nineteen sixty five that was also linked to the bacterium, And there was a specimen from nineteen forty three that revealed a strain of Legionella macdadi, and then another sample in nineteen forty seven turned up Legionella and so like it had

definitely been around. I didn't really find anything on like the evolutionary origins of it, but it was clear that like outbreaks or cases of the disease weren't just a thing of the past, and also not just something that

happened in the US. After the bacterium was discovered and described in December January of nineteen seventy six nineteen seventy seven, additional outbreaks occurred in Vermont in nineteen seventy seven, in England in nineteen eighty five, the Netherlands and nineteen ninety nine, a big outbreak in Spain in two thousand and one involving like seven hundred people, two thousand and five in Canada and Portugal, and twenty fourteen the bronx in twenty fourteen,

I mean happening all over the world, and those are just the outbreaks. Like this disease also happens very sporadically, just like individual cases.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I feel like that's important to say because I think people think of it as just this outbreak pathogen, but really it can cause pneumonia in anyone anywhere, even just one case.

Speaker 1

H Yeah, absolutely, and so I am almost ready to turn it over to you, Aarin, But first I want to talk about the timing of all of this. Why did this disease seem to emerge in the mid twentieth century, Because you know, I didn't say anything about ancient Rome or Hippocrates or the Ebers Papyrus, So was it truly new to at least the twentieth century. No, not at all. I mean, like you said, this is an environmental bacterium, like it doesn't need humans to infect in order to

live out its life. So it's possible that it caused cases here and there before the twentieth century. But there were two important developments or trends I guess that happened to lead to its emergence. Then. The first is simply advancements in microbiological technology and epidemiological techniques that allowed us to isolate and describe this pathogen. The second is air

conditioning and water cooling towers. Like outbreaks with this bacterium are often linked to the HVAC systems in various buildings, especially hospitals and prisons as the source of exposure, which historically, obviously you know, wouldn't have been an issue, Like there were passive air conditioning systems, but they weren't the things that we have today. The things that we have today, those sort of developed for more widespread commercial and at

home use around the middle of the twentieth century. And so that's right when these outbreaks of Legionella first started to happen, right, And so it all comes back to timing and context. Yet again, why did it happen when it happened, Why was it discovered then and not earlier, Why was there so much media attention? How did the

demographics of the victims affect the attention it got. I didn't go into it here, but there has been a lot of discussion about that and the fact that these were members of the American legion who are largely impacted and comparing and contrasting that to the early days of the AIDS crisis and how little attention that got In comparison, all of these things play a huge role in how

epidemics or outbreaks, including this one, play out. So, Aaron, as I sit here sweating because my own air conditioning unit is broken in my apartment and it's summer in Chicago, so it's kind of funny to just read constantly about air conditioning. I'm like, okay, yeah.

Speaker 2

Like dripping breathing in Legionella.

Speaker 1

Will you get me up to speed on where we stand with Legionella today?

Speaker 2

I would love to right after this break for a cold glass of water. Since the theme of this episode is we don't really know, we'll continue that here in

the Epidemiology portional, Aaron, we know some things. It seems as though worldwide and in the US specifically, the overall risk for Legionella infections seems to be increasing, or at least the overall case numbers are certainly increasing, even though we have better guidelines in terms of cleaning of air conditioning system, et cetera on how to try to prevent

Legionella contamination. So in the US from the year two thousand to around twenty fourteen, the US, which reports case numbers a little bit differently than the.

Speaker 1

Rest of the world.

Speaker 2

Of course, the US case numbers increased from about less than one per one hundred thousand people to one and a half cases per one hundred thousand people per year.

Speaker 1

This brings to mind that paper from Nygleria Fallerei where it was like, is this an emerging parasite.

Speaker 2

There's a very similar paper for legionella.

Speaker 1

Yeah.

Speaker 2

And so these numbers include both outbreaks and those single sporadic cases like we talked about, which do happen, and it also importantly includes both Legionnaire's disease and pontiac fever. But the biggest problem is that in all the surveillance systems in the US in Europe, over like ninety nine percent of cases that are reported are Legionnaire's disease. Why

because that's the severe disease. So those are the people who are going to the doctor, going to the hospital, getting really sick, and then that disease is then reported.

Speaker 1

Question, uh huh. Has the frequency of outbreaks or the intensity or the size of outbreaks increased or is it the number of sporadic cases that have increased or have they increased in parallel. Good question.

Speaker 2

It seems like both have increased.

Speaker 1

Okay.

Speaker 2

Interesting In Europe, the European surveillance system in twenty eleven reported a prevalence of nine point seven per one million people, so it's a different scale. But and here's the biggest problem. We talked about this as well with our coccidioido mycosis episode. Even when you have a surveillance system in place, when we're dealing with a pneumonia, it's not super common that we're able to actually test for or identify a specific

pathogen that's causing that pneumonia. So we not only don't have a good handle on the number of true legionnaire's cases every year, we also don't have great stats on the overall mortality rates every year because.

Speaker 1

We just don't know.

Speaker 2

In the US, in one paper from CDC, they suggested that the overall burden in terms of like if you look at all pneumonias, about two to nine percent of total community acquired pneumonia. And again that doesn't include hospital acquired pneumonia. And like you mentioned, Aaron, the HVAC systems in hospitals are a big place where contamination is possible, and therefore this could be a hospital acquired infection. But if we just look at community infection, two to nine

percent of all pneumonias might be associated with legionella. Other papers that looked more globally suggested even up to fifteen percent of pneumonias that required hospitalization were associated with legionella. So if we go back in the coxsidioido my kosis episode, I did a bunch of like air in math right where we tried to calculate, like how many cases might

there be. So there are in the US at least between twenty three and twenty seven cases per ten thousand adults of community acquired pneumonia that results in hospitalization every year. So if we think that maybe on the high end, ten percent of those might be caused by legionella, that would be two and a half cases per ten thousand adults every year, which is of course a lot more than are reported, And that would be about fifty two thousand cases per year in the US.

Speaker 1

So the substantial number, it's a substantial number. Yeah.

Speaker 2

So for sure globally, tens of thousands of people are becoming infected, potentially even hundreds of thousands, but we don't exactly know how many. The good news though, is that, unlike with coxcidioidomycosis, in many countries and in many parts of the world, the sort of standard treatment for community acquired pneumonia does include antibiotics that treat against legionaires, right ammonia, So that's at least a small silver lining.

Speaker 1

And have there been any seroprevalence studies that just like, look out it out of the blue? Good question.

Speaker 2

I didn't find many, Okay, Yeah, And overwhelmingly that's one of the biggest areas that we still need to do research on, is just getting a handle on the true like epidemiological risk.

Speaker 1

Yeah, so a question about that, like what is it about certain air conditioning systems? How are they cleaned? How does it get there in the first place, And like how do you protect yourself or or know whether you're inhaling you know this? Killer? Miss? Yeah? Killer miss. Yeah.

Speaker 2

It's a good questionnaire and not to freak you out, excellent.

Speaker 1

Yeah.

Speaker 2

But the biggest thing I've seen recently is a lot of news articles talking about the risk of legionnaires increasing as the pandemic of COVID nineteen begins. To wane because so you asked, like, what are the like, what kind of conditions lead to this growth? Right, unused air conditioning units that have a little bit of water in them, those kind of stagnant water in pipes. That is beautiful biofilm territory. Oh.

Speaker 1

No, all of these office buildings.

Speaker 2

Exactly, all the office buildings, all the hotels, all of these things that were closed or vacant during the pandemic. All of these months of these systems not being used, there's a huge potential again not to freak people out, but for legionnaires to increase.

Speaker 1

Wow.

Speaker 2

But the good news is that that people have been thinking about this. I read one article. It was just from like a news source, but it was about someone whose entire job during the pandemic was running the water in hotel like bathrooms and flushing all the toilets and running water through the pipes every week so that this hotel maintains good quality of water.

Speaker 1

How many of these cases are linked to or is it really known whether it's like these industrial HVAC systems or like personal at home HVAC systems. It's a good question.

Speaker 2

I don't think that we have a good handle on it, especially as we really just don't know how many cases there are per year, and I would guess, especially if you're talking about a personal h VAC system that you know maybe only one person ever gets exposed to it and gets infected, those cases are going to be even harder to pick up and to link to something specific. Okay, right, it's the larger outbreaks that you can then trace back

to specific environmental sources. So yeah, that's Legionnaire's. There's some other pretty cool research being done. There's a lot of cool research being done, especially on the kind of detailed molecular biology. I'll link to a couple of papers on that to try and understand how Legionella is able on a molecular level to survive and persist in our cells,

as well as on vaccine development. So we're nowhere near having a vaccine, but there are people who are working on mouse models to try and develop a vaccine because it's at least theoretically possible based on how much of an immune response humans mount to it.

Speaker 1

Okay, so well sources. Man, this was like short and sweet episode. Not that sweet, I guess.

Speaker 2

But short and moderately horrific.

Speaker 1

Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, I have a bunch, but I want to shout out a few that I found super helpful. One by Weiss from nineteen ninety two called a Plague in Philadelphia, Another by macdade himself from two thousand and two Legionnaire's Disease twenty five years later, Lessons Learned, and by When from nineteen eighty eight Legionaire's Disease A historical perspective.

Speaker 2

Wow. I love that there was a historical perspective like twelve years later.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I know right.

Speaker 2

I had a number of different papers. There's a really great comprehensive one from the Lancet twenty sixteen just called Legionnaire's Disease. Another from nineteen ninety three in Clinical Infectious Diseases called Legionnaire's Disease. We'll post the links to all of our sources on our website, This podcast will Kill You dot Com, where you can find every single source that we use for this episode and all of our episodes. Mm hmm.

Speaker 1

Thank you to Bloodmobile for providing the music for this episode and all of our episodes.

Speaker 2

Thank you to the Exactly Right Network, of whom we're very proud to be a part.

Speaker 1

And thank you to you listeners. We hope you enjoyed this one. Actually, we just got an email like the other day being like can you do one on Legionnaire's disease. Yeah, it was like come in your way, you ask me answer and a big special thank you also to all of our patrons, you are amazing. We love you so much. Okay, well, until next time, wash your hands. You filled the animals. Ob bonba bum bu.

Speaker 2

Bu bu

Speaker 1

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