This is Gavin Newsom and this is Michael Savage. The hell are you doing here? Why what are we doing here? The two of us, of all people.
Well, we're supposedly political polar opposites, which we probably are. However, as I say on my TV show, you don't have to like my politics to like me. And a lot of people seem to like me but hate my politics. Some actually like me on my politics, which is the ideal.
I love it. So we've known each other, I mean full disclosure. So folks may not know this. We've known each other over the course, on and off for a couple of decades, now right, I mean back, I remember you. I was joking with Trump the other day in the Oval office. I said, you know, before you know, you'd calling me newscom is not novels discuss Savage had a version of that early.
On when I was mayor any twosome news Thank you very much. Should I tell that story?
No, you shouldn't all that stories.
It's got your great father involved in it. He did he get involved in it?
No? I met.
I was in a North Beach restaurant, which you remember the heyday of the North Beach restaurant. Come on your dad may rest in peace. Judge Newsom was there. I was introduced to him and I said, you were the Board of Supervisors chairman, and you had just introduced the gay marriage at resolution. And I said, Judge, your son just made the biggest career era of his life. He's finished. And he said, you know, I agree with you.
Michael. Well, guess what we were both wrong. He did agree with you. By the way, he was always up. He was come on old Irish Catholic west side of San Francisco. And by the way, I remember you remember this back in the day. That's why you probably shook my hand. Back then, I ran as the conservative right, and.
I don't remember. Honestly, I don't know what you ran as. I know that the city was. Look, I came here in seventy four. I'm an immigrant to San Francisco. My father was an immigrant to America. I'm a first generation American. So I have one foot in the old world one foot in the new. I still see a little bit of the immigrant and the native of stuff, but I'm new to the city. It was a great, wide open city.
You could do whatever the hell you wanted. And then what happened was it went off the rails because ultra tolerance led to or, as I put it, Governor Newsom, when anything goes, everything goes.
Got it. It's a good line. It's a good line. My line. I told my kids. I said, how you do anything is how you do everything. It's true. So you got to focus on the detail. How you make your bed, and it's what how you do everything? You actually make them make their bed, make them make their beds. I make my bed too, by the way, But I believe that. By the way, sometimes my wife doesn't even believe it because they are a few days off. But let's talk about you know, you've never taken any time
away from the bayar. I mean, for all, you've been here since the seventies. Seventy four and you've seventy four. You went to Berkeley PhD in seventy.
I heard it in two and a two years and seven months, which is a world record. No one knows about it. I came here with two master's degrees. I was blocked from a PhD in one of the master's degrees because the field was too advanced. And I came here and got worked for an independent PhD which was unheard of. Only seven of them issued a year. At the time, it was the toughest thing I ever did in my life. I was so proud to get a PhD from Berkeley because everyone said to me, that's your
union card. You get that PhD, you're going to be hired as a professor. Unfortunately, hello, it kicked in. White males need not apply. I was rejected from every position I applied for, and I was told point blank that we can't hire you because we have to fill quota, as they told it to me.
So they were very excited. Mean, that's because I remember you wrote a poem in nineteen seventy seven, right about white male. You saw that you wrote a poem which you altered the white male, the Death of the White in the seventh How do you know that you were talking about that. Someone gave you a bangground on me. I've been tracking you. We've been casing savage I did.
I wrote a hot book called the Death of the White Male, which no one knows about.
It's a pamphlet. Trotzky or Lenin would understand that. By the way, speaking of Trotsky and Lenin, you were hanging out with Alan Ginsburg Lawrence fer linged, yes, quite literal. Maybe, I mean Lawrence Port Lauriate, San Francisco. Oh yeah, many moons later you had some you know, interesting moments back there in North Be. Back to North Bes.
I mean, ass was a friend of the family, Lawrence and Janet and I. He meant he flew out to with Alan Ginsburg. Lawrence and Alan flew they were on the way to Adelaide Arts Festival in Australia, and we had known them from New York. We know Alan from New York. And I met Lawrence here and I said, why don't you stop at our house in Awhi. I was renting a house going to grad school there, and they both stopped in. They spent a few days with us, and that was that. But Lawrence and I stayed on
and on in the years, politically opposites again. Yeah, but you don't have to hate someone who you don't agree with. That's that's why I'm here, That's why you invited me here.
I love that. And but it's I mean, it is a remarkable journey for you. I mean, if I just wrote out your resume, those early years, not only were you in San Francisco and in the Bay Area getting a pea HD. But it was the PhD in what it was around nutrition eth no medicine.
Nutritionalth no medicine, which was an interdisciplinary PhD with epidemiology, human nutrition, and anthropology in a combined hole, which was an interdisciplinary PhD, which in order to get into that program you had to go through the heaviest screening program because a lot of people use bullshit to get into discipline and do nothing. I had to go through the toughest people at that university and explain why I wanted to combine those fields in a new field. And it
was a tough interview. So I got to the PhD blocked from it. I'd written seven books at the time, but it still couldn't get a teaching job. So I got very angry. Gavin, I'm an immigrant son. I want to be a professor, it's all I want to be and they're saying because of your race, you can't be hired.
It's crazy, So you really, I mean, it was that indelibent? Was that the big shift then for you in terms of your politics? Did it really become you were like enough? It was it?
Well, Gavin, I was a social worker in New York before I came here, teach your social worker. And I was going into houses of people on welfare who were living better than I was. I was living at the time in a rental apartment. I had wooden furniture crates. We had a mattress on the floor and orange crates en tables. So I go into the supervisor at the welfare office and I say to her, blah blah blah.
She says, well, start writing out checks. Mister Smith gets six hundred dollars for an end table, eight hundred dollars for two chairs, nine hundred dollars for a bit. I said, wait a minute, I don't have that. She said, just keep writing the checks. And I said, something's wrong with this system.
And so you weren't raised necessarily with a strong ideological Oh no, your parents weren't. That's your father, your mom. I mean, they weren't out there marching the streets for a Democrat or Republican. It was none of that.
Nobody knew a Republican in my family or in my circles. My father was an immigrant, and he would walk the streets and he would point things out to me and teach me what the world was about but he would say, I said, Dad, are you a Democratic Republican? And he would say, you know, Michael, he said, all I know is things are better for me when Democrats are in office. I remember he came through the depression, right. He worked
in the WPA. He got a job as a kid who had nothing, driving a car for a politician.
I still don't know how he got it. Who did he know?
He told me stories of driving some correct politician to Saratoga Springs. I don't even know the rest of those stories. So he to him the government intervened in the Great Depression with the WPA, and it saved.
Him, right, so it shaved his perspective.
But he didn't understand that. After JFK, who I voted for, I loved JA. He was one of my heroes. I'll never forget how he influenced me. When I saw that picture of him and he said, don't ask what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country. You know that that puts steel in my spine. I wanted to go out of March and do something for my country. I love that one good line can influence a person for a long time.
Yeah, there's notion of responsibility, not just opera. It's the one piece that I think our party continues we continue to miss well. But we're going to get to that in a moment. But I just want to talk about those moments that shaped to you. I mean again, sitting here talking about nutrition. You were working in a clinic
in San Francisco, Nutritionia. You're writing all these books you were, I mean, dare I say, and here a bunch of them right here, one of what, by the way, you said seven, But you've done twenty nine nine.
Books published, several unpublished. So well, you know, there's two novels in there, San Francisco. People don't read novels, Abuse of Power and A Time for War. They're set in San Francisco, in North Beach, in the North Beach Restaurant and around there at the time of Lorenzo was alive.
Lorenzo Patroni, that's North Beach Restaurant. So he used three years.
Ago, all the Italian and all the Democrats would meet in that restaurant, remember, in the back.
Room and the closet of Republicans.
See, they'd meet there, and one of them once said to him, he said, Michael, you know what they said to me. I said, what they said to me? Are you a right winger? He said, no, I'm not a right wing. I'm a fascist. That's what Lorenzo said. May you rest in peace.
You rest in peace. By the way, I'm survived. He survived as long as he did. He was usually three or four bottles at lunch in and then went all night. Poor man he was, but he was. He was like a bear, a bear. He was a bear, old world bear, different generation, but but it so we were shaped so similarly.
I mean, I was the kid in the corner with my father, with George Moscone, the former mayor, Quentin Kopp, the former State Center then become judge all that and that shaped my political beginnings and sort of, you know, gave me a sense of what the whole political scene was about in North Beach was really the sort of it was the neighborhood city hall where real deals were done.
So, Gabrett, we want to talk about I'm sorry, the personal stuff and the health stuff. I know that, but if I don't ask some can I read the bullet points.
You're bringing notes? I bring nothing. I got the questions. Can you bring your question? Well, I want to let's jump in. I'm gonna, but I want to start. Let's start with this and we'll go back and forth. But this whole from nutrition is really interesting because it's very contemporary. Now you've got r fkgu You've got now new Health and Gearing Service Secretary obviously Trump embracing this notion of Maha make America healthy again. By the way, I love that.
I love that. Californiak at you. You're not a fat guy. No, but it's not even about body weight. It's about just health and wellness, all the stuff you've been preaching and practicing. You were the original you were, I will say, your original bunch of things, and we'll get to language, borders, and culture. Oh wow, and Trump and Trump is because you were you know, Trump was a Democrat when you
were practicing the full metal polio aware. But this whole MAHA movement, I mean, you've got to feel pretty good about that, or do you feel it's a little off based and not necessarily is it well established in the sort of cornerstone of your your more academic thinking.
Okay, So I was a big element of the alternative health movement in California from the time I got here herbal medicine, homeopathy, nutrition, wrote books on it. I knew all the leaders. I knew Linis Polling, I knew Bob Cathcot, I knew Richard Kunyan. These were the genius geniuses in the field. Here's the problem with RFK Junior. He said, Johnny come lately to the field. I like what he's doing. He doesn't have the nuance or the subtlety to understand
a lot of it. And even when he was appointed, I was sending messages to Trump saying, you can't eliminate the entire Health and Human Services Department. There are some good sciences and the scientists and the nih You can't throw the baby out with the bath water. Slow down. All revolutionaries, as you know, left and right, want to start from the beginning. You can't do it. You can't fire every scientist. I try to tell him that, and I try to get on the good side of RFK Junior.
Without any look.
Russ was skiing and asked, and if you were sitting, you know who was on the chair next to him, RFK Junior. So he said to him who he is? And he says, you know who my dad is. And he says Michael Savage, and he says, Wow, he's a great guy.
But you know, I've never talked to him RFK all these years. No, I still haven't gotten to him. Interesting, despite the fact that you've been at this longer than he's been there.
I would like to help as an advisor on the alternative medicine side of his revolutionary quest. And I also would like to offer you, Gavin some as the governor of this great state where I've been since seventy four, don't you have a health task force alternative medicine?
Of course, No, we've been. We're about wellness, about health care, not sick care. We've been focused on all the issues around ultra processed food, free meals, nutritious meals, focusing on farm to fork, focusing on proximity to agriculture, focusing on small farms and regentative farming, all the component parts and all this, I mean a lot of it, of course, is weaponized politically. I did quote unquote the Skittles Band
a couple of years ago. The same folks and the right we're attacking the Skittles Band, which was about red dye. Now they're embracing and celebrating it. The kinnam before.
I wrote about it in nineteen seventy four in a book called Bugs in the Peanut Butter.
Is that right?
It was a book for children about all the dangers and everyday foods. People thought I was crazy.
I love it.
But do you have a commission on alternative health, homeopathy, nutrition, herbal medicine.
We have, you know, not full I mean it's represented in health bodies, but it's not fully.
Represent the State of California should be leading the world in all these alternative I think modalities. You have tons of practitioners in those fields in this state.
Tell are you? I mean we may negotiate fifty cents. I'm so curious. I mean, look, I joke about language called borders, language called culture, my motto your I mean, it's just indelible. I was listening to you as a supervisor, is listening to you as mayor not just because we ran into each other, not just because I knew your son Russ and love your wife Janet. You're the most entertaining person in personality period, full stop and storyteller. On the radio, you were.
I'm a good story Well, I tell stories because they're part of life and education. Is about telling stories. A good teacher tells a story, doesn't just beat you up with facts. So if I can tell a story about my life and it tell it makes a political point, fine, So let me tell a political story. If I may about five years ago I had a heart attack. Yeah, okay, hearing Marin County. Yes, so I'm right to Marine General. I have to wait online. It's filled with illegal aliens.
And the girl at the desk makes me wait. I said, I'm dying. Do you want to say what I called? The car he's waiting for me, and she starts driving me through like hooks. I said no, and I walk into the er room and they hooked me up and do this stuff. So income too, huge two hundred and fifty pound black bodyguards because they heard there was a troublemaker in the emergency room. So here's this little Jewish guy in the surny with wires and plugs in him.
And I said, yeah, I'm the one who was causing trouble out there.
They laughed and they left, and I said, why do I have to wait to get into an emergency room when I pay more taxes than any ten thousand of them?
Do you know what. That's why we do preventive care. That's why with a different approach, because we have sick care in the emergency room that's universal all across this country. Well I told you above access all across the country who's sailors instance as you are, and sabstantially higher prices on the back end for the emergency.
See, this is where we disagree, because you can't give first world excellent medical ok to everyone on the planet.
Michael was going bankrupt. No, and I appreciate it, but honestly, I mean that sincerely. What would you do to the person that was just hit by a car, that was here for fifteen years taking care of your elderly grandparents in an elder care facility and they end up in the emergency room. You say, no, you're not going to get that.
Of course, you're going to give them care. First of all, it's not only in your Maine, but it's available to them. But that's not what we're talking about. There are people coming over the border just for expensive surgeries, just for expensive By.
The way, a few years ago, I remember people going south of the border into Tijuana from San Diego because it was cheaper to get some quality care in Mexico.
Telebody, if you talk about borders, language and culture, which you introduced, and I think it's very important.
Everyone knows it's my mantra. Why aren't you asking it? By the way, when was it your mantra? I mean ninety four were people talking like that in the early nineties. They were starting to a little bit right now Prop ninety seven in California. Oh you remember, so there was a little of that, but you but you really coined that frame.
Okay, So I created the poll of your society in ninety four here in California, which no longer exists.
And the motto, how to write a card up? What do we stand for?
Border's language, culture? So nobody truly understood it. But there's not a country on earth that is not defined by its borders, unified by its language, and doesn't have a common culture. And when you lose all of that, you lose the nation. I don't care what the nation is. It could be a small African nation, a small Caribbean nation. They're defined by their border's language and culture.
How old does that?
People understand? So when let me just finish the border thing. Even China built the Great Wall of China to protect its border. Why because the Mongols were invading China. So I'm a total believer in the sovereignty of a nation. I don't know how anyone can argue with that.
Right, And I mean there are some that obviously do, but I'm not among them. By the way, California we put down almost four hundred, three hundred and ninety four National Guards since the week I first became governor to supplement and support customs and border patrol at the border, to address some of the issues of fentanyl and some of the border security concerns.
So I you agree with Trump then on cracking down on the flood of illegals into the nation.
I think there's a way of doing it and approaching it, and I think we have a broader problem, which is immigration policy and asylum abuse. The asylum system is broken in the United States. You have the power to do something about it in the state, don't you. Well, not directly, and we have no border direct border except for supplementing our support, which we again have been doing for years and years and years.
So he has a great statement that no one's going to expect from me, where I probably I am to the left of view on something I love with immigration that people don't understand. I know of a person who was here twenty years from Mexico. He's worked seven days a week, he's paid taxes. He can't become a citizen. That's wrong.
I'm with you. Something's wrong with that. That's why we talk about the border, which is critical. Not even a traffic ticket. I appreciate you. It's not even a traffic ticket. Now you haven't So this is interesting. Just the last comprehensive survey in the state of California, and this is not a contemporary survey needs to be updated so that that sixty seven percent of people that are here without documentation in California have been here for ten plus years.
Is along the same and they paying sixties and paying taxes. But here's the second majority of folks. The worker pays taxes, but they have several dependents at home who don't live on supplemental income from the state and the federal government.
That is a problem. And that's that and therein lies, yes, some of the sort of dialectic you and I will have to have in terms of what's the appropriate level of support and how you deal with that's that reality, the federal failure to address the issue of immigration, immigration policy, and border We completely agree with the question is what's that pathway to address the example you just provided, because I how to do it, Gavin, I pay sixteen percent
in state taxes. You pay, well, then you need a better accountant because it's thirteen point three percent. But there's a millionaire's tax on top of it.
Well there's and I work, and I'm eighty three years old and I still work, right, Okay, I have another home in Florida. Yeah, I don't live there. I prefer where I live. I've gotten used to the fog, to the seagulls, to the cormorants.
I know all the birds of the bay.
I'm an avid, so I got used to watching the fog rolling over the Morine Hills. I watch it roll out in the afternoon.
I love it.
And I've always said, you got the ten zones, You've got snow to the desert. So it's a perfect geographical location for me. But there's a point at which I will leave this stake, and that will be taxation. With that representation, I can go to Florida and pay no state tax.
Right right, Yeah, I mean The reality is you're we have the highest tax rate, but not the highest taxes in America. Who has a higher state tax tax rate? The vast majority of people are not you. They're not the one percent, which means ninety nine percent of other people. I'm subraitizing them. No. But at the end of well, we can get to that. But the bottom line, places like you use Florida, they tax their low wage workers more than.
We tax the Gavin, I shouldn't be punished for succeeding. It's and it's a disincentive to me.
I get it.
By the way, should I work? Why should I keep working?
Well, there's there's many reasons, and you don't need to work. I know this. There's no going of course, you, of all people not have to work. But I have it.
I'm an immigrant son. I wore dead Man's pants as a kid. Every nickel I have, I've worked as I'm five years old. Young man drives to me. He's from Mexico. He says, Michael, you're an inspiration to mean you keep working at your age. I tell all my friends that not all all white people and houses don't work. He says, some of you keep working, And why said You're such an inspiration to me. But work is a sou you know, go again, I'm sorry. Rodan the great sculptor, Yeah, everyone
knows his work. It's in the Palace of Legion, amount of all his work, right, love that museum. So I read Rodan avidly and Rodin said work is the only salvation. And I found that to be true.
I love it. I was with Voltaire said work selves life, three great evils, boredom, Vice and Need? Who said that Voltaire? Voltaire boredom, boredom, Vice in Need? Look, I'm with you, We're not, but I think it's important. Just in California, the vast majority of middle class taxpayers pay less than they do in California middle class than they do in states like Texas well. Question of who you're for, we have the highest again, to what level we are averaged
the slightly above average tax state. It's the one percent. And by the way, we haven't raised your taxes at the one percent since twenty eleven. And it wasn't I wasn't governor, wasn't the lieutenant governor, all right, I just became lieutenant was the voters of California that did that. But I don't disagree with you.
Four people always vote for tax session on the rich. That's what Carl Marx taught them to do.
So the thing is, I'm not advocating for increasing taxes. Haven't done in as governor of the state of California. No income tax increases under my governorship. I've opposed them. In fact, did five million dollars of ads to stop Proposition thirty, which was a tax increase run by corporations in the Bay Area that had their own special tax increase where I did ads to oppose it and impose the wealth tax in California. So we're trying to keep you here, doctor Savage. Well, I will will leave taxes
go up. I know I'm working hard against.
So look, I made a little as borders voting, illegal aliens voting in the state.
Is that still illegal? Of course it was always illegal. It wasn't never. I'll bring a vote. But what substance of evidence is there to suggest that you have any receipts to back up that all of these people are voting illegally.
I don't know that all of them are, but I'll ask you a question that everyone Look, I put this on social media and they said, ask the governor. And again I don't have to be contentious to ask you this, though I appreciate. Why does it take so many months or days to count the ballots in California the month?
India one day to count six and forty million votes, Germany eight hours to counts fifty million votes, Argentina six hours to count twenty seven million votes, California four weeks to count sixteen million.
Vote It's ridiculous. Why it's ridiculous, it's because it's and by the way, we've been having this conversation enough and it's a first of all, we believe that every vote counts, so we want to make sure every vote is counted. Because of the provisional ballots, the fact we do all mail in ballots, the fact that we have such a huge investments in making sure that we increase that outreach. We want to make sure again every vote counts. But
you're right the time right about the right. No, the right, absolutely, the right is right, and you are right to criticize the extended period. I'm not actually a right I'm an independent independent conservative. I would what does that mean? Independent meaning I'll make up my own mind about every issue. So on the environment. I'm probably to the left of you. You what I love about you. This is where we
have some interaction periodically. And I look at you as you're an animal rights guy that absolutely big into the animal rights advocates. Well, not burning down clinics or attacking people who eat meat. You're conservationists, but you know the environmentalists because there's a difference. Conservationists believe in conserving the environment. Environmentalists use the environment as a political weapon or a tool to advance I would say, a Marxist agenda. There's
a big difference. It's it's like anything else.
I mean, you could be force something without using it as a weapon against your political enemies.
So everyone's saying the fires, the fires, the fires. Yeah, can we talk about the fire. We need to talk about the fires. It's this last decade has been extraordinary and devastating, not just in Los Angeles, but the campfire where I originally was with President Trump as governor of elect walking there eighty five people lost their lives. We live very close both of us now morin Santa Rosa. The Tubs fire mount terrible fire, one hundred housing units loss.
So no, this is this is serious. Stuff, and you know, God bless there's fires going on in the middle of winter in south North Carolina and as we speak.
But what about the rebuilding down in Pacific Palisades. This is a hot button issue. Yeah, shouldn't it be a I'm sorry, a special master to administer the funds? It seems fishing to a lot of people.
Administer which funds the FEMA.
Dollars the rebuilding of Los Angeles.
Well, there should be accountability across the specters whose accounting. FEMA has rules and regulations overseen by Congress, and obviously the distribution of those fun A lot of it's individual aid, a lot of it's to the SBA, a lot of it have very prescriptive requirements that are well established across
the country. But we're all for accountability. I'm for accountability and I have no problem and I think in terms of that transparency and accountability advocating for it and for all our tax dollars, not just as it relates to reach.
So here's one related to it from my friend Danny Harrowitz, who's my attorney.
Great man. You got to meet Daniel Hope you never have to meet him, But no, he's a great guy, are you getting in trouble? I hate lawyers. I only like my lawyer.
He said, Please, he loves you, he says, he said, please ask the governor the following he said. State Senator Scott Wiener the SF has introduced SB six seven seven, which his website says is designed to strengthen to a California's landmark housing streamlining laws SB nine blah blah blah. These bills would allow developers to override local zoning laws and create high density housing in suburbs and places like
the burned down areas of LA. The bills allow this intensified development without any provision for increased fire, police, or water services. He says, Gavin, you signed SB nine and S before two three. Given the devastating impact of the Los Angeles fires, are you willing to rethink your support of these bills and allow local communities to make their own assessments.
Of fire and public safety? Right here so as it relates to the specific bill that he referenced that Scott Winner just introduces one of two thousand, Michael over two thousand bills we're just introduced by the legislation. Too many bills. There's not two thousand problems. I know you think there are a lot of problems. They're not two. You don't think they're two thousands. Don't think there are problems. I don't think there's two problems. There's only three. Language of culture,
Language and culture. We'll get to language and culture in a second. We talked a little bit about borders, but no, so first of all, I haven't had chance to review it's it's difficult to respond specifically about it. It's not on my desk. It may never end up on my desk. Which are these bills the bill that he was referencing from scot Winner. But and that's not just me punting on it. But let me talk about the rebuild in LA. I'm not looking to up zone the palis Aes. We're
not looking to make this sort of developer friendly. In fact, I waive the Coastal Act and I Wave Sequel, which is our environmental reforms to allow people to rebuild like units within one hundred and ten percent of the original foot right with the original plans. Fast tracking that process, we got the debris removed. And thank you to the EPA, thank you Lee Zelden, thank you to President Trump directly
for helping. We got the debris for the hazardous waste done in less than thirty days, unprecedented in US history. We want to get the rest of this debris done within nine months. Concurrently, we're already doing housing permits and people were going to start reconstruction in a matter of months. But you got to build back smarter better. You've got
to deal with the climate realities. You've got to deal with fire issues, You've got to deal with redundancies and systems related to Fire's going to slow everything down, not going to slow you that we do this. Concurrently, we do this and sort of stacking order. We're trying to do this quickly, but safely and smartly because we don't want to be as dumb as we possibly by building back in the way that we built in the fifties
for a world that no longer exists today. And you have to admit hots are getting hotter drys or dryer droughts, well is atmospheric rivers. No, no, no, mister savage. Slow science is my middle name. I know, but your I mean, but your other your eyes tell you a different story too, right. No, No, reality is reality. Let's talk about climate change. If you brought it up.
I up, I run up temperatures, and a lot of this is total bullshit.
They're all wrong on it.
The science doesn't support it. And I'm going to give you one piece of evidence that people don't want to look at, real science evidence. I did it on my YouTube channel yesterday because I was talking about the Pope and his health. And the Pope is a radical leftist politically, by the way, Saint Francis San Francisco. No, and I
wish him our patron's speedy recovery. But he was a radical, you know, leftist guy, and he was wrong about environmental things because I know who wrote his encyclical on this, and the guy is a classic Marxist. So one piece of evidence, which they'll cut right out of this tape. They're called the vastork ice core samples. No one heard of them, Okay, So Russia and France, you got left and right scientists from both countries drill into the Antarctic shelf.
They drill down ten thousand feet two miles. They pull up a core from the Antarctic. And why are you looking at the core of the Antarctic Because you can see climactic changes in the core. As you understand, and guess what, there were carbon dioxide increases millennia ago, but they always followed temperature increases. They didn't cause the temperature increases. People don't understand that we had a period of great flora enveloping the Earth, which produced a great deal of carbon dioxide.
So it now. Don't get me wrong, though, I'm not arguing for pollution. I'm a guy a bicycle every day. I like a Berkeley graduate bicycles every day and writes books about nutrition. I believe me. I hate police the original I mean, the guy who's inspired so much of what Trump is a fits. Well, let's talk about that if you want. Let's talk about Trump and Trump is it.
But don't you and before that though, because to be fair on the climate issue, I mean, but you'll you'll acknowledge well you know, I mean seriously, just you know, and you're you've got your northern California guy, you go up to Lake Tahoe, just the snow levels. I mean, these there's some trend lines here that are understandable. Headline, climate has been changing for millennia, and what you'll acknowledge it's changing. Well wait a minute, but it's not changing
in the direction you think it is. We're actually we're actually entering a little ice period. People don't study history long and in geological history, we're actually entering a cold phase, not a hot phase. So climate. Remember in the.
Middle Ages of fifteen hundreds it was very cold in Europe or read about me.
You weren't around, Yeah, it wasn't, but it was frozen.
England was for all of the Dickens novels set in the snow in London because cold wave came through England. It was a cold a little ice age.
It was called.
We're entering a small, little ice period on the Earth, not the opposite. So there's a lot more to the science. If you could let me sit down and I'll show you data and your scientists they're not going to want to hear it because people don't want to look at science. They only want their doxies supported by the science they approve of.
Yeah, no, I mean, look, I you don't have to believe in science, but I do. I joked about believing your own eyes. I mean, places, lifestyles, traditions, communities being wiped off the mat. We had a three year historic doubt. The most significant drought California's history, drought since statehood, and it ended in three weeks with the wettest three weeks since state correct the.
Wettest extreme is Nature always corrects, it's so extreme, correctly, I come on, nature corrects.
So wait, I'll tell you. Somebody does bat last bats a thousand. Chemistry, biology, physics, that's all Mother Nature is. I'll agree with you on that.
But Gavin, listen, in eighteen seventy two, it was so hot in the state of California before there was the first internal combustion engine. Eighteen seventy two, the corn fields exploded in the Sacramento Valley from a heat wave.
No cars, no real factories yet.
Because the climate was changing, because it always changes.
Now, having said that, I'm not arguing for pollution. I you know why I I'm a theft in my mind. You know why I moved from New York pollution.
I left New York in the sixties to get away from the I would be deadified state.
By the way, in nineteen sixty seven, Ronald Reagan, then governor, agreed with you. He created the California Air Resources Board because of the smog in LA. He wanted to clean the Air, Clean Air Act nineteen seventy Did he do it? And our waiver was caught out? That's what Trump's attacking
right now. There's a beautiful picture of Reagan in the oval looking down at President Trump as he vandalizes Reagan and Nixon's clean Trump on this podcast, even though you would like me to but Snell, we're getting along Trump and you and we still we spent an hour out but he's look.
How can you ask him for three hundred billion dollars to rebuild California and spend and spend fifty millions and spend fifty million attacking in house.
We didn't spend fifty million attack We hope we don't use a penny of it. We had. We were involved in one hundred and twenty two lawsuits in the last Trump administration. I was only involved in two years of that. Governor Brown, who you know well have had on your show and over the years, was I think I did years ago, years ago? Yeah, And I said, I only make the point that you're always someone that reaches out. And I've always appreciated that.
I had Nancy Pelosi on my radio show proving the point.
Nobody would know it. I know. I had charl Schumer on my radio show years ago. No one knows that. See, you know why why politics makes strange, bad fellow. That's why we're here up having a civil conversation. So look, we didn't put that money up to go after proactively Trump. We're doing to protect Ronald Reagan's leadership at the California Resource Sport.
If you make that start, If you want now look on the environment, I can guarantee you that on the environment, Trump and I don't get along. I can guarantee you sing. Yeah, we knew that in the last administration. And in fact, I can tell you a story about it if you'd like to hear it.
Yeah.
I was an Air Force one with him in the flying Oval Office. I won't tell you the long story, but we flew out of Moffitt Field to LA to a fundraiser. I got on at the last minute, and he didn't like me because I was criticizing him on the radio about his environmental policies.
I'm led into the Oval Office.
I was let on the plane at almost the last minute, and the guy I won't tell you who got me on, he said it takes months for clearance we got you on.
She gets me on. I'm on the plane and they have.
A buffet and I tend to like wine, and I was I hadn't dr so I started drinking more wine.
On Trump's air force.
He doesn't drink, but no, I know, yeah, I didn't think i'd be meeting him. I thought I was just getting a ride down to LA for another fundraiser. All of a sudden, after I had three glasses of wine, they said.
He'll see you now.
I said, now, okay, So they bring me and I swear to God, he's sitting in the most powerful chair in the world. And the minute I walked through the door to the guy who brings me, and he says, he doesn't look at me. He says, what is he doing here? Points at me like I'm a none person, but I'm from Queen's on the other side of Junia Turnpike,
and I know how he works. She sits and he goes like this, like bring the Hebrew in, you know, sit him down, the king bring He sits me down and I say, he says, what are you doing here? Because he knew I was critical of him on animals in the environment. I said, Donald, you need me because I don't need you. I said, come on, knock it off.
You have Hannity in.
Your back pocket like a sock puppet. I said, they all kiss your ass. I said, you need me because I speak to the educated people out there who want the environment protected. I don't need you, and went on and on. But you know, Gavin, after that we settled down. We had fifteen minute flight. His valet brings out two hot dogs. They were kosher, by the way, and I'm not kosher, and I'm starving because i didn't need all day.
Show you how sensitive me is. You've met the man oh many times.
And he looks in my eyes and he sees my eyes down onto the hot dogs, and he looks at me and he.
Says, do you want one?
The most powerful man in the world, holds up a tray and asks me, I'll take one of his two hot dogs. Being from New York, I said sure. Now, last point, he's not a bad guy. He says to me, mustard to catch him.
Well, that's obvious, right, No, I tell me you're a mustard. I'm a mustard guy. Got but he put it on my hot dog. So what is the point. The point is that he's actually a very sensitive guy to other people. I agree, by the way you are as well. But I've always felt that about you. I am it's a compliment. Thirty years ago. You came to a Thanksgiving party. Thirty years ago, Gavin. Okay, I said, two decades, it's been three. Well, okay, maybe in the radio in ninety four, we're Atalia Pharaoh,
which you can't even make up. You subbed for Ray tel Oh, who is a liberal lion back in the day, late later than I remember that case, late late caj But then you and so that was obviously such a success and you and obviously you woke a lot of people. It wasn't a success.
What happened was the program to I have to ask me to fill in for a guy on kg I never listened to because I'm not up in the middle of the night. So I figured, y'all do radio. So I go on kg O at night. I didn't even know who he was, and I started talking about stuff that I believe in, and people were pulling the most hateful calls I ever had in my life. I drove home that night to my family. I was shaken. Looking in the rearview mirror. I was scared someone was going to kill me.
You literally except for raytali Affarah. I mean i'm talking about let I mean Bernie Sanders is a right wing to Ray Tali Affaarah, and he's he's sort of dominant. But so you got your own show the next year. No.
No, I went home and I said to my wife, I'm never going to do radio again as long as I live. It was the most hateful experience of my life. I'm not doing it again. Next day, the phone rings and the rest is history. She begged me to do it again. I said, I'll never do that show again, and I'll never do an overnight show again. And before long they created KSFO, the Conservative Alternative. They made me the afternoon drive host, and of course it took off
from there. Then it became syndicated, but not just took off. I mean you had but nine million listeners are probably closer to twenty million listeners.
Which is at the peak. So I mean you were the I mean you talk about this whole space. I mean we and you know how everything's changed. You've got your podcast now radio, but you dominated this space. Well, Rush was number one. It was you Rush, Rush, Hannity and Savage and Hannie Yeah, yeah, but Hannity has no intellect. Rush.
I won't say a word about because he's deceased. I won't talk about the debt.
You've never been shy about criticizing anybody and including myself. Are you good about your good stuff? But I don't want to you. I mean, I love even Joe. Even Joe Rogan, which is interesting, called him a meathead.
Well, unfortunately he is a bit of a meathead. I mean, look, you can't argue with success. No, and the fact is that the most number one biggest podcaster in the country. But ask yourself a question, why hasn't he had me on?
Why?
I don't because he's afraid to talk to me. He's had people you never heard of on that podcast.
Understatement, most I don't I but you know, I don't read the time. Look, I had three hour Pucket.
I had Tucker Calson on my first TV show on Newsmacs four weeks ago, which was a shock.
Why because he hadn't been back on TV and all I.
Didn't think Tucker would do an interview Number one interesting, he's a giant Okay, and Tucker always liked me I ran into him in San Francisco in a studio. We were crossing doing a show. He was very friendly to me. Then never talked to me again, and I invited him on my TV show and he shockingly said yes. And he's a very congenial intelligence.
You thank him. I appreciate. But you don't like Glenn Beck. You called him what he hemorrhoids with eyes.
Well, I believe that was then. I don't use those terms anymore. I become older and wiser. But Gavin, you know you should have Tucker on. He's very smart.
I don't I agree. I think no, I'm fascinated by Tucker, but I'm fascinated by.
Well, he's a liberal at heart. You know he's People don't remember Tucker had a bow tie and was on MSNBC. Do you remember that you had a three months show on MSNBC.
If people can't believe that either, Jesus, I remember that I was watching you every night. Did you see the night I apploaded that was well you You expressed a strong opinion that was not necessarily shared by Manys and it was a prank color I recall it was a prank caller.
They had their power to control it by cutting it and editing it out, and they let it run because they I was undermined by the team. Watch out for your team, gam I was told in the media from the beginning. It's always the people who run the cameras, the lights and the microphones will control your future.
But it's amazing you're resilience. But more important, I want to go back though. You dominated this space and so basically and you're still at it to the point you don't need to do this obviously, you love doing it. You're entertaining as hell. It's not all jaical plating edutainment. Let's say there's a entertainment. Is that how you describe it? Is it? I mean, and has that been the secret sauce? It's I mean fact sure, but I mean you're talking
about what you're eating. You're talking about, yes, recipes.
That was the that was the fun part of my radio stuff. But on YouTube, I do cooking shows at night in my house where I can curse politicians. So if I'm cooking, if I'm cooking my Kla mari or my shrimp at night on my pan and the cameras on me and I say, this shrimp has more integrity than Joe Biden. And I'm not kidding at least you know it's a shrimp and where it came from. But okay, but I would use cooking as a foil.
It's a lot of fun. So what do you make of today? What do you make of the Charlie Kirk types and Tucker that. I mean, all these folks, these new platforms, hundreds of me. I mean, they seem to be profoundly influential in sort of building off the craft you sort of led decades and decades ago. I mean they're sort of the oh, forgive the frame, but og so much would exist as well, just sort of the well in the vernacular of you know, original gangster, you know.
I mean, I'm using, you know, just some language that people can know now I understand, you know, but I mean literally, it's the world you invented that didn't invent and it existed before me. They was talking to in New York. I never listened to it, by the way, Yeah, I was not that interested. But you took it to another level because I introduced a level of education and knowledge and personality that never existed. People are not willing to talk about their daily so if I would walk
in San Francisco and i'd go in a restaurant. I eat a lot of cheap Chinese restaurants, which I love. I would talk about the meal, and people were interested in the meal as much as they were in the politics, if not more so. And you also, as you're walking the streets express you're what of you about the politics?
And let's talk about San Francisco. Gavin, Please, I love the city. I don't go over the bridge anymore.
Well, I mean you should. He's coming back. What happened back? Here's what's happening about. Ten years ago. I was in North North Beach restaurant just real in November. They called me when I was in Florida, the new owners. Do you know them?
Yes, And he asked me to come in. He said, we know how important you are to this restaurant. But by the way, I have three novels here. That restaurant's featured in three of them. So I'm sitting in North Beach having dinner. A man comes by, if you want to call him, that takes his pants down and defecates outside the window in the street.
Not excepting without.
Civility, there could be no civil order. In a country I agree with. This shouldn't be permitted.
It's not acceptable. The encampments nor the tents. I couldn't agree. I mean, how you were driving? Accountability were drive? How do you not cracked down on the well, remember I did care, not cash. My body was burning effigy. It became the defining issues. When I was mayor, we dropped. We reduced the street population by third. We still population. Well, it's not a static environment. I wasn't mayor. It's been decades.
PA the government half. I'm the governor, but I'm not the mayor of California, and I want to see accountability at every level of government. The state visus is realizingly it's it is turning around. I still don't go, oh, you got to you gotta Neighborhoods are thriving in San Francisco. You got a new you got a new mayor, and there's great he's he's pretty Daniel, yes, and he's cracked down on the tents and the encampments, and you're seeing progress.
We're starting to see that. I hope I live long enough to eat in San Francisco again. Come on, you love eating in San Francisco. Scomas and the neverate Scoma's in my life. You never did again, made it up.
We should go to dinner in the North Peach restaurant.
We have to.
Let's go in when you're ready for it, and then I'll tell the story on my podcast. So, Gavin, the homeless thing is the turning point. When that man defecated outside the window, that was the beginning of the end of San Francisco for it not only for me, but for the whole city. Because the cops couldn't do anything about it. The hands were tied by this small band of radical left wingers who were saying they're sacred, you can't touch them.
I mean, look when I was there, when I was mayor, you may recall this. I did a sit Lie ordnance. I did this anti panantling ordnance. I did care not cash, converting welfare checks to services and accountability. We saw real progress. I've been very AGGRESSI Savanna encampments, just did a new executive order in the state and we're flooding the zone with state support and a way we've never done in the past. When I got there, Michael, this is important.
There was never a governor that actually there was no homeless plan in the state of California. There was no support for cities and counties, and it felt that way we had under Schwartzenegger. It's not a knock on ar Old, but goes back to two thousand and five. We had one hundred and eighty eight thousand homeless in California. It's not new. What's happened metastasized into a cancer after especially during COVID and what's happening the street.
We're blaming COVID, but you know, no civil society would tolerate this, Gavin, And here's my position on it, and it's something you're not going to like to hear. There is a solution to the homeless problem, which is ended well, you build camps for them in places outside cities, and you give them the care that they need against their will. You don't let them shoot up in the streets, you don't let them defecate or urinate or beat up old women in the streets. You take them off the streets.
Yeah, I agree with focus A one hundred percent, agree with broadly with that settiment in terms of cohercion. Just so you know, we just did two major reforms we've had all these old conservatorship laws that are weak. We finally have strengthened conservativeship law so we can begin to get people off the streets. We also established a new paradigm called care Court, which is a whole new strategy to also help in advance to address that subset of people.
And we did the most significant mental health reforms and investments in state's history. That those resources are going out to do regional centers along the lines of what you're suggesting, taking them against the way different paradigm of thinking more supportive care as opposed to substituted care in the vernacular of all the quote unquote experts, and we're trying to make up for this. And you'll appreciate this as a California in nineteen fifty nine, at peak nineteen fifty nine,
California had thirty seven thousand mental health beds. Today five five hundred corect. Oh you're agreeing, OK, reopen to the mental hospitals for double the population today. So we had half the population in the late fifties and sixties, of course, and we had thirty seven thousand. So what we're doing, we just did this initiative Proposition one to provide six plus thousand new units that were all throughout the state.
And we're regionalizing along the lines of what you're saying, mental hospitals, literally, behavior health, subsecuse mental health and literally it's the biggest investments in US history, biggest investments. Or do they have to comply? That's what the Conservatorship Reform SB forty three was about. That's what our care Court is about.
And we so if a guide defecates outside a restaurant window, a copkin and restaurants send him to one of these facilities.
They can refer them through the care Court. In fact, a police officer quite literally now because of my care court can refer. In the past, they could not refer that individual.
Well, I hope it works. Look, we all have a lot at stake in this state and in this city. It's why I don't leave, because I still love the state in the city. But if it's intolerable at a certain point, everyone will leave.
Business is a leaving. It's interesting, Well business, we have more fortune five hundred companies than anytime the last deck.
Well, why did they kick SpaceX out?
Why would you take SpaceX is not being kicked out, well, they can't launch their rockets because of the coastal And you saw what did I do? I joined in the law. I literally said, I'm with Elon Musk attacking the Coastal Commission. I couldn't have been I was very vocal, and then you were really acceptable. We had fifty one launches last year, which is a record since nineteen seventy four. Why would
you not want a rocket company in California. We have the Mohave Desert, we have Vanderberg, and we have Rocket Beach, which is Long Beach. We're starting to dominating this space I hope so. And we have record breaking launches out of Vanderberg. We're making with relativity, not just SpaceX all of the year. You don't want to go to Mars, do you? I'm not personally. I think a lot of people like Elon want me to go to Mars. I
don't want to go. I don't even want to go over the bridget talk one and we're out of time, but I wanted just before we're done, I do want to talk about Trump and Trump is you have to be pretty proud that the issues of border in language of culture. I mean, the president just came out saying the English is that's right out of my mantra. Right, I mean, this is stuff you've been preaching for decades. Okay.
Salon Magazine, left wing magazine a number of years ago, when Trump was president, wrote an article called the Father of Trump a mania and it was about Michael Savage and it was sort of middle ground, wasn't attacking. And I was told by one of his chief architects, who I will not mention, shortly after he was elected the first time he visited me in my home in Florida, and he said, Michael, we took all of your books,
we made talking points, he ran on your platform. I said, okay, fine, because I know he was a liberal when he was young in New York. I was a social worker and a democrat. So people change one day. You may be a conservative without even knowing it. But no, but Gavin, so yeah, I'm the father of a lot of what he's doing. I was honored to see Boarders life. But no one's called me from the White House and said we want to give you the Presidential Medal of Freedom, and we recognize that you did this.
We think you're great. No one's called how do you think that's the case.
It's interesting because in every political entity there are politics.
I'm not involved at all with the in crowd. I don't know them.
You mentioned Charlie Kirk.
Yeah, you don't know. I have all of these sea packs. I've never spoken at any of these announts. I didn't think about that you have. Do you have the equivalent of a Presidential Medal of Freedom in the state of California? We do California Hall of Fame? Here in the Radio Hall of Fame. I'm in. I'm in the National Radio Hall of Fame. But why am I? Okay? You know, Gavin, it's by the way, thank you for asking that question.
It's a good question. I should be in it. You want things to be lit up, you want me to I want to build board on the highway again. I'm going to announce you in the California Hall of Fame. That will light things up, mister Savage.
But I I came here in seventy four. Look what I've done in this state.
No, I'm believing you haven't left the state. For a lot of these guys turn their back on California as they're attacking it. You have it, so I admire that I do.
I mean, I don't have to agree with you, nor you with me. For us to sit and have a civilized conversation. It's the only way we're going to solve the problems of the state and the country. Right, and I feel the same thing about the country itself. The left and the right already each other's throats to hate each other, and they would like me to have been on this podcast and be screaming and yelling like a foaming idiot. We get nowhere with that.
It's idiotic and though, and the whole point of this is not to have those conversations because those I can hear twenty four to seven on Spotify.
It's bad for my health, number one, and I don't feel that that gets us anywhere. But before we leave, you brought up Trump and the border's language culture, and then you brought up the things you know. I have to thank you for the Bancroft Library and the jets in our barium. I think this should be in your podcast because people say, why are you so nice to Gavin us? Well, I'm not that nice to Gavin Newsom. I just don't go out of my way to insult people.
Just for the sake of sounding like an idiot, so a lot of people do.
Okay.
I reached out to you about five years ago, and I said that I have the University of Texas is interested in collecting all of my writings, all of my manuscripts, my journals. And I said, they really naturally belong here in California. And you reached out and through the chain, the Bancroft Library came back to me and they spent two years with me in my archives, taking all of my correspondence, my writings, and you know, they have the
largest collection of Mark Twain papers in the world. And I said to the libraryan it was a lovely lady. I said, don't you feel a little uncomfortable that I'm so called a conservative? She said, Michael, we're not here at the judge politics. We have conservative authors who are Californians, liberal authors or Californians. And she said, you have done so much in your life. She said, you have three phases. You're a poet and a novelist, then you were a
botanist and a nutrition writer. Then you're a payment political writer. And she said, we need that in our library. And then I have a collection of medicinal plants, Gamant, they're in the jets in her Barian They're in seven her barrier around the world, Jepson is won. These are the plants I collected, medicinal plants. Yeah, you know where else they are or Moscow Herbarium. I've never been there. Q Gardens, London, New York Botanical Garden, Chicago Herbarium, and the Honolu Bishop Museum.
So we have a rare collection of all my collections in the jets in barbarium. Again, this is for scientists to look at for agents, and it's here.
And I want to thank you for.
Opening the doors because another governor just said, you know, go pound sand I'm not interested.
No, I appreciate it, and it was an honor to be However, a health I don't know how much help are you. I mean, this was on all of it, on the merits substantively, and everyone doing the right thing. But when they don't do the right thing, I call it out. I can't stand cancel culture. I love free speech. I can't stand when someone people I remember Bill Maher was going to Berkeley or something and they said Bill's too conservative, it was too controversial. I've never liked that
called it out then will continue to. So I don't think anyone served in that respect, all these banning and cultural purges that people have been on. I don't believe in the mao cultural say No. I think a lot of people assign and attach those points of view to me. But let me ask you in closing, Oh are you putting me in the California Hall of Fame? You're gonna put me on this spot by the way you've made. You just made the most compelling case you possibly could
have for the multi dimensionality. Here. There are people in that Hall of Fame that have done basically one simple thing, and here you are twenty nine books, best selling books across the spectrum of issues and ahead a novelist, I know. And you were banned from the UK. Oh yeah, and you know that what they called you? What propaganda hate or what was the exact phrase?
I mean, the only hell American author banned in Britain. Yeah, for things I didn't even say. It was a terrible, terrible thing to do to me. And I woke up that morning I saw it on the Drudge Report at the time, and I said, oh my god, I'm banned in England. So I went in the radio show and I said, God, there goes the great cuisine that they're known for in my dental care that I was looking forward to of that line. But I think it's a terrible thing to do to me, because first of all,
I didn't say the things they said I said. Secondly, I spent four hundred thousand dollars to try to get my name off the list, and I've not did not succeed.
I gave up. I don't even care still on it. Yeah, I can't go to England to this day, I cannot enter England, the land of the Free and the land of the Magna Carter does not let Michael Savage in, but they let Jihadis run around screaming kill the Queen. I'm not gonna argue with you, no, Stormer. I don't I think we have met. Have you met? Smer bring it up. We'll have to bring it up. Let me ask you, just get me off the list. Let me ask you this. Let me if you were going to list.
Speaking of lists, you know, Democrats, if they're not trying to figure out what the hell just happened, they sure as hell should right. So I'm serious about this. I'm you know, I'm not asking for sort of a flippant It's not a flipping question, and I hope certainly not patronizing, But what the hell do you think our party needs to do? And what what's the biggest lesson? Seriously, are you really sei Michael Savage to the Democrat advice to
the Democratic Party was it because we're too woke? Because we didn't focus on borders? I mean is it's what is really straightforward? It is borders, language and culture. And the thing that triggered most of the people who turned against the Democrat Party this was this incessant drum beat going back years vilifying the white male, white supremacy, white supremacy, white remember that that became a mantra of the Democrat Party.
They took all the working class white guys and said, what the fuck you basically pardon me, what are you doing?
Man?
We work, we are also citizens. Why are you turning us into Hitler's because you know so, that's what was one thing. Then the illegals getting free care, and then the illegals voting in some municipal elections. Those, but the big thing was the women. When you had people with the right or whatever you want to know.
The whole trans issue triggered the women who were normally liberal. But when you have kids being brainwashed in school to accept that stuff in little in kindergarten, Hey, I'm a sexual libertarian. I want to be very clear. Okay, I really don't care what people do to make themselves happy. Okay, this is not my business. Life is very hard. If you can be happy with someone, God bless you, but
leave the kids alone. That's the whole point. And when you start crossing that line into the schools, you're going to see what happened. That's what just happened. It was the women and the schools. I think, Gavin interesting, So I mean the trans issue. You thought that, I mean that it was a children issue. It wasn't a trans No one was against. So it was a gener assignment surgeries for these miners. Yes, where Yeah, I felt that our party was complicit in terms of creating those conditions.
I don't think so promoting it to some degree, you would argue, I wouldn't even go there. I would say that the people had had enough. There were so many more important issues God, faith in reason. I mean, there's a spirit we didn't even get let's do another podcast.
In a month. I know, talk about God and which is a big part of your life. Faith? People don't know that big part. I pray every day and have for decades. You have, and you are, You're by the way, And then we're going to close on this. You are ascending to a unique status. Shocking, isn't it? Well, no, tell us about it.
The president of a local Jewish community. Yeah, and from a very orthodox group of Jewish people. The guys that wear black, the black hat people, they like me, and I say to them, I'm not that religious. Why do you want me to become reaching out to the community. They said, you're more religious than us in some ways. They watch my podcasts and they don't watch the media. They know that there's a spiritual element to Michael that's palpable, that emanates, and.
They like it.
It's that simple. But does that mean I'm holier than anyone? I am such a fallen angel, Gavin.
Well, it's good to be with another fallen angel. Still on that one. It's great to have you, Michael Savage. Thanks for being here with