(BEST OF 2022) 19| Part 2 | supporting a loved one

To Conversations With. My name is Shaylee Huckendorn and I live with bipolar 2 disorder.

Sharing with others is healing both individually and collectively. Sharing our stories will educate others, bring more understanding, shed more light and smash more stigma. Our voices need to be heard. Our stories aren't over yet. And this is Bipolar.

Hi there. Thank you so much for joining. This is Bipolar. Welcome to part two of an episode that we have filmed about how to support and love someone in your life who is struggling with a mental health issue. We are going to dive right back into the conversation. So here we go.

I'd love to shift gears it's really hard for us because our main friendship relationship is our husband but I would like to specifically talk about fry as hard as it's going to be because they're our pretty best friends is to talk about friendship so I'm going to try and think about high school to now yeah and I'm going to try and think about also family members because I'm super close to my mom my dad too in a different way but my mom and

a lot of the times especially in the beginning of my marriage because I wanted to be a good wife and whatever that is I took it more out on my mom and because your parents are supposed to be there for you forever and my mom is actually a very her percent she avoids conflict or anything so she probably should have because it set a boundary for me for future relationships.

So if you're a parent or brother or sister, you're actually, when you set boundaries or you're teaching and setting them up to have successful relationships, even if it's totally uncomfortable for you, think about it. You're like, oh, you're seeing them that your words or your boundaries are making them cry or you think making it worse. Think about future, like you're actually helping them.

And so I think about that. I'd love to talk about some friend struggles and some stories you tell yourself about friendships or when do you have common themes or feelings that come up in friendships that you think are probably deeper or rooted in a lot of the. Negativity and anxiety that our bipolar brains tell us. I would love to hear about your struggles and friendships, maybe even starting in your 20s, if you can think of it.

Going back into my 20s and even into my mid-30s, I would say my biggest challenge was in my darker, more depressive episodes, I would find it nearly impossible to return phone calls or emails or even answer the door. And so I know now that left so many of my friends feeling ghosted or unwanted, or they were probably questioning, does she even want to be my friend? The problem was I wasn't at a place where number one, I understood what was

going on with my brain. I did not know I had bipolar disorder and I was unable to share with them what was going on with me. So I think it just led to feelings of guilt and shame on my part as a friend, that I was the worst friend on the planet, and then also this massive confusion on their end. And I do get so many messages from people saying, I have a friend, I've reached out, I've heard nothing. I reached out again, I heard nothing. Do they want me to keep reaching out? Am I bothering them?

And thankfully now, since coming forward, with my closest friends, I have been able to share. I have this diagnosis, and I get overwhelmed easily. And if you don't hear back from me, it's nothing against you. And I know you've even shared that sometimes when you don't have the capacity to respond to someone, sometimes you send them a heart and it just sends the message. I see you, I hear you, I love you. I can't respond right now, but please don't take it personally.

And the other struggle that I would like to think I'm getting better at is setting boundaries and saying no. And so I'm the ultimate people pleaser. So in the early days, I would commit to doing anything under the sun. I once did not want to do this, but said yes to a lady who wanted me to paint her entire living room. Never in a million years did I want to paint her living room,

but I did not want to disappoint her. I did not want to say no. So there I was spilling paint, slopping all over her carpet. She ended up not liking the paint job I did because part of it was like a faux plaster effect. And it just, I wanted to avoid her. I was angry. That trickled into my family life. And sometimes with friends, I, you know, haven't been able to say, look, I'm maxed out my schedule. I can't meet you for coffee.

I haven't been able to be honest and just say that. So in the past, I would admit to attending all sorts of functions or coffee dates, and then I would end up getting angry and resenting that person out of no fault of theirs. And so that was always a struggle as well. So thankfully now I've learned it's okay to say no without a 50 foot long excuse.

It's not selfish. And actually, I think we've talked about this, that you really value and appreciate when someone is able to give you a no because it signals to you that they feel safe and that they're able to be their authentic self.

And you know and it feels like they're telling me the truth because sometimes we another symptom we have is we anxiety can make you paranoid right and I did love what you said and I'd love to do the flip side because this is the part that I find so interesting where we're so different, and because we're also introvert I'm extreme extrovert right so you go in I know and I knew this from very young.

I don't know if it's because I had a big family or what, but I've always struggled with being alone. I used to struggle with being, no, I still do, being alone for long periods of time because I can spiral really quickly. And especially with the common theme with depression and mania is that everything sucks. And that just sounds like minor, but no, like nothing's ever going to get better. This is it. Do I even want to participate? And I now see it.

It wasn't, we get really confused as soon as we say anything to do with suicidal things, but ideation is different than thoughts or planning. And now I can recognize that they are like, just thinking, what's the point? And I didn't want to die. I didn't want... To disappear, anything. I didn't think about hurting myself, but I just think, what's the point? And is this worth living?

And I might as well just give up. Mine was a big thing is I might as well just go to sleep or stay in my bed because the world's too scary and all of these things. But because I love company so much and I love just being with people. And in fact, it used to be unhealthy. Like I think like, even if I experienced like a sunset, if I didn't have someone to experience it, it's like I was out of body and like it didn't matter or happen if I couldn't experience it with someone.

But not everybody has that capacity to hang out with you all the time. So I feel the story I tell myself is I feel real like clingy and annoying. And I've always feel like I like my friends more than they like me. And I find yeah, yeah. So I It would have been hilarious if we were, no, wrong word. It would have been terrible. But I think like in hindsight, because I would have been like, she hates me. Right? So it's now understanding different people.

And that's why I'm drawn towards people that are introspective and deep and are doing work. And into that, I have a hard time hanging out with or being friends with people that don't talk about their feelings or I go deep fast. But also sometimes, you know, when I was manic, if a friend would disappoint me or let me down or I'd get into and no fault of their own and sometimes made mistakes. And it was valid that they really hurt me.

But and if we couldn't talk about it you talked about the resentment that I think there was a couple friendships that I walked away from and I made I couldn't see their point of view and I made them the villain and I every little thing they do did that I could look back and think half of it wasn't bad but I could take the bad side of it and twist it and even sometimes tell other people that they were terrible because another thing is I don't trust myself.

So I had this negative thing that I've really worked on and I'm happy to say that I don't do it very often anymore, but I don't want to be alone also in my thinking. So if I'm angry or frustrated or whatever, I feel like in order to validate it, someone else has to feel the same way. So I try and convince people to feel the same way. So I have someone on my side, Even if there's not a side And I think. I think it's a real hard thing. I just felt like I give everything.

That brings into something you said before about how our family or other people in our lives that we're most comfortable with get the brunt of it because I want to be the perfect friend and I'm a good friend and I strive to be a good, trustful, loyal friend and I will drop everything to the detriment of my family sometimes and make plans on important, oh, we'll just move your birthday because this heck of a needs me or things like that.

So I harm other people in these close friendships. And I go so deep so fast. I know in the past, as much as I want to think everyone likes me, I think that those friendships where I overwhelm them because all of a sudden, like I am so I attach quickly And that was a real struggle in romantic relationships, too, about not wanting to be alone. I got into some really not awesome situations and would not give up just even though they were bad because I didn't want to be a quitter or because I just

give everything so fully. So I thought I'd tell myself a lot. And sometimes now, even though I have the, I can't even tell you, took forever, but have the bestest friends that I can be totally honest and repetitive with. They know my tapes and they'll listen to them. And we have a way of doing that is we found, because for some reason I have a bunch of introvert friends, because deep people are sometimes introverts.

And I always feel exactly like I'm too much for them but we found ways through we have a whatsapp group and we have a mark I have Marco Polo with some people where it's video they watch and respond when they can this technology that would have helped probably a lot of friendships when I was young younger because when I need someone I need them immediately and when I don't sleep it's in the middle of the night and and I used to think that I had they had to respond but knowing

these friends have told me that I am important and they will get to it when they can and it isn't ignoring me that kind of thing and so we'll send the heart so they know that I got it but I feel so safe in these spaces that it could be the middle of the night and I know I'm not bothering them so I will do it yeah and I know they'll get back to me eventually but the act of just reaching out sometimes is helpful, even if like knowing I have a space at 3am to say, I don't know if I.

I want to go to sleep for a very long time, or I have signal words to friends and my husband and my big one is, When I'm depressed or manic, both, I want to run away. My thing is, I really like Bowen Island. It's like this hippie island. I love it too. 45 minutes away from Vancouver on a ferry. And being an extrovert, it would probably be terrible to live there because there's not a ton of people. But my code word to my husband, and I've told my friends as well, I'm moving to Bowen Island.

And then they know it's severe. Yeah. Do you have any, it must be hard for you.

Tell me about friendships because I don't know if all our listeners know, but you move a lot and have moved a lot. So how does that work with friendships for you? We have just moved to Arizona and one of our goals was to get involved in our local church and join a small group. And so we did that within the first few weeks. It was a bit scary and terrifying, but we have connected with the most amazing group of supportive people. And I remember showing up that night going,

ooh, I'm going to have to introduce myself. How much of my story am I going to share? And I felt so safe the very first night. I know this doesn't always happen, but I shared my bipolar diagnosis. I told them that I advocate. And it was amazing. They didn't seem to bat an eyelash. And they're very supportive of everything that I do. For me, the best strategy now is I'm pretty much an open book. I like to go deep really fast too, just like you.

And if it's someone that I'm feeling like I really wanna foster a friendship, it won't be long before I do let them know about my mental health. What would be your tip?

Because that's what you could do. What would be your tip? Because I know lots of people, and we'll do this at the end. Let's round up the tips. Just because a lot of people that listen may not know bipolar brains. We'll try to be succinct. What about pre-diagnosis friendship? Like, how could someone be a friend to you knowing that, you know, that you might bail on a lot of things, right? Knowing that you might not get back to them, knowing what, yeah, how can they be a good friend to you?

And not even, yeah, how could they have approached you to get more? Because, like you said, we're advocates.

And, in fact, sometimes it forces. like even the other day it forces people especially you're an author as soon as you say an author your book right yeah I do I'm an advocate I do a podcast and everyone as soon as you say advocate are all you're so amazing so important and then you get to the next step yeah what's it called you don't always get the same reaction right yeah oh and then one thing I wanted to add to that go back and listen to the Sharice episode

everybody because the awesome thing that she says about telling people is the whole she says and loved loved ones can use this as well when they're talking to people depending on how open their person is but did you know that my partner had you give a question so that they actually have a response they could say no I didn't or yes I did so then they have something to say so when they don't they at least have something to say so So anyways,

but I do want to talk about because I just said it would have been hard for me to be friends with you because it would have been so hurt and all of those and take it personal. But what, how, yeah, what could they have said or what? Yeah, I'm going to be the first to admit I was a crappy person to be friends with back in the day. Unreliable, unresponsive. Yeah, I would have probably hurt your feelings greatly.

But I think the key points would be don't stop calling, even though you might not hear back from me. We do get your messages. Even if we're not in the best place and we can't respond, we do read them and hear them and listen to them.

Yeah for my friends to keep reaching out it would have been tempting for them to stop inviting me to things because half of the time it would be a no or no response at all yeah it would have been great for them not to give up on me and yes it's just so tricky but not stop calling but at the same time give me space if that makes sense it does like not every day and not not an expectation I've had people that in deep depressions that are more introverted and go in and not like

me who goes out say that no pressure to write back and not a guilt trip either but I love the yes no pressure to write back or just a simple message I'm thinking about you I care about you yeah no pressure to call me back I just wanted to reach out and give you a virtual hug I hope you're doing well and I would love to get together at some point I think another thing is I didn't answer the phone back then because I knew I wouldn't be able to set a boundary if I was asked something

in real time on the phone. And the worst thing they could have said is I have something really big to ask you. Call me back. I'm never calling you back. I just keep fast forward to now. It's just night and day difference. Yeah.

And I think maybe that comes. yeah and i think people get hurt too from my perspective is because not to be braggy but i'm like super fun and people the hard part is people to be friends when you're manic before before and sometimes after because you are a when you're doing the high manic part and not always the hard manic part we never ever want to romanticize it but um yeah I'm a wild fun like I'm funny I think for people like I'm fun to be around but also

too like I try to be a really good listener and I think I struggle with friendships is that sometimes because I'm so open and go deep so fast is that I become best friends with everyone and I think and then I felt like I had to pour into to everyone because I didn't want to hurt them how I would be hurt. And I overwhelmed myself where I had nothing left for my close people or whatever. I was like, oh, especially if. I'm like empath, want to fix and be there for people.

I would put my own needs, my family's needs aside and think, or think they only had one other person. We have grandiose thinking when we're hypomanic and think we're the best or amazing. So I would think I'm the only person that could help them. And I would run myself into the ground. So I think, yeah, I think that one's a hard one.

And I think, yeah, when you can communicate, but also too, I've had to learn in my life to know you know how you say there's friends for a reason a season a lifetime or friends that are like I have friends that I could call that are spontaneous and would go out I have friends that I need to give this much notice and I think just having and I think that's what like the millennials and the next one that I don't know the name of are so much more

open and their feelings and there's more support and such, I think, yeah, just the same thing with communication. And now, Shaylee, I am going to flip the tables and ask you the same question, but in reverse, because I know you've shared that you're a very different extroverted friend than I am. So if you could give some tips.

Yeah, yeah. So I think the reassurance, right? Reassurance. And one of the things that my friends do is if I forget to say the story I'm telling myself or whatever, if I I just say, everything's terrible. I'm a terrible person. Or I'll say something mean about myself or something that is a lie that my brain has told me. My friends say, my few closest friends say, or I reject that. I love you, but I kindly reject that. Or same with, I have a problem with over apologizing.

And they're like, I'm not accepting that apology. as kind as it was because it wasn't needed or no apology needed and I think finding the thing so if I'm I don't want to say too much if I'm looking for more that you can give we found things like I said the whatsapp or the different ways for me to be able to tell you and then my job is to, give that space until they can. Also to invite me to things and.

Do things or give me hope that we're going to have something to do soon because sometimes I feel panicky when there's I feel panicky when there's no plans on my calendar I cannot even tell you how this how summers as a teacher having them all off and not everybody else to giving me something to look forward to even if it's a walk and or I feel less clingy if you can tell me what you can give and it's not like I can I have I have a week off this week I can do something

that week or my kids are busy this and this but do you need me to call or whatever and then once in a while like if you can and I'm in total crisis just showing up for me I'll remember that for all the times that you might not be able to because we have kids we have all the things so So I think that, and I, yeah, and I just think also too, like I'm comfortable enough. And these are my tight friends to say what's going on in your brain.

And when they learn something new or also if they're like, cause they're learning to advocate and they're like, Hey, I said something the other day. Tell me your wins with being able to talk about your mental health.

And yeah just the reassurance and find out the look up love languages or whatever because gifts or cards or even when people send me a picture of something in the store like this made me think of you knowing that people are thinking of me because I think of my friends so much it makes me feel it helps combat the lie that I like everyone more than they like me let's think back to the ones that we said and like just break them down into titles so communication saying what you need yes

having the code words knowing that you're not gonna fix them or be able to get them help if they don't want it yep affirming assuring and not always keeping score yep put on your oxygen mask seek support however you need it because you've got to take care of yourself first so that you can be a support system to people you're living alongside. Have key words or phrases that signify that you're struggling or that can de-escalate.

Oh, I thought of a new one. I'm sorry, succinct people that want us to wrap this up. This is bipolar. We have to. I forgot the one about writing down. So when I was really bad. I can explain, like my husband and I have a book that we write back and forth to each other because then I can read his feelings because we got to go back to their feelings too about things and we have to go back.

So we write it down or now we're so lucky we have texts and things when I've had the moment of introspective, even if it's like at a weird time, I can write it down and he can see it more because I'm calmer. Because if I'm mad or manic, I can't write it down that much or I record myself. So yeah, communicating in a different way because sometimes we don't have words. Sorry, let's go back to the other one.

Did we talk about setting healthy boundaries for yourself? Yeah, setting, like you said, the oxygen mask. And I think, yeah, I think that modeling, that also means modeling the type of relationship you want. And that goes with friendships and parents and brothers and sisters and such, or chosen family. You modeling, doing things to keep your, because we all have mental health, your mental health well, will help your person possibly want to do that.

And if you're someone, oh, you saw the one? Go. Dog holes. Yeah. Do it through the lens of your loved one or friend does have a mental health struggle, a diagnosis. It's biological. And so to always keep that perspective will help you not to take things so personally and also maybe offer a little more grace when it's needed. And we will have things again. And it's okay to be disappointed that there's some people call them relapses.

We mostly call them episodes because I think relapse makes me think that I'm well, but maybe relapse from stability. I don't know. That one confuses me. But yeah, that it's ongoing. And if you're someone that's listened to all of this and think that's not going to work in my personality, is too far gone or not like some of your boundaries might have to be to remove yourself until there.

And I know that's so hard. And I don't even saying it, I don't even know if I could do it, but you have to take care of yourself. And I'm really sorry if this doesn't seem helpful, but take care of yourself first, reach out, get the help you need.

Cause if you're not in a good place you're going to be of no help to another and yeah we're just we're this it felt better than i thought it was i knew it was going to be helpful and i knew it was going to be hard but i think julie and i's goal is to not walk away and think that we're terrible because we still struggle with all of the things we've talked about so thank you for loving us and for sticking by us and for listening because this is bipolar this is bipolar thank you

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