I think that truly what's going to happen as digital asset space starts to merge with the traditional financial players, as you're going to see a revolution take place as it pertains to just our financial lives generally as consumers.
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I'm a big fan of this hardware wallet. So if you'd like to learn more, visit the link in the description. Hey everybody, Tony here. We are down at Station three in New York's Financial District, and my guest today is Bo Hines, who's the executive director of the Presidential Council of Advisors for Digital Assets. Bo. Great to have you.
It's great to be here. Thanks for having me.
Bo. You are on the forefront working with David Sachson, the President, on crypto policy and different initiatives. I have lots of questions for you, but i'd love to start with your background. Where'd you grow up? What did you want to be when you're growing up?
Oh, that's a good question.
No one's asked me that over the course in the last two months, and all honesty. So I grew up in Cherrow at, North Carolina to an entrepreneurial family. My parents actually grew up as farmers in rural Indiana. My dad grew up in the northern part of the state and my mom grew up in the southern part of Indiana. But he started a licensing pro company in which they consolidated a lot of the NASCAR licenses which brought him originally to North Carolina. So I like to claim I'm
the only true born North Carolinian in my family. My sister was also born in Indianapolis. So you know, I think that just coming from a family with the entrepreneurial spirit really shaped who I was and what I wanted to do. But with that being said, I did the two things I think that my dad probably wasn't as fond of, which is one becoming a lawyer and to a politician, a non practicing lawyer.
I should say.
But in the grand scheme of things, you know, very close knit family. We all live very close by.
I actually live in the same neighborhood as my parents in Charlotte.
Oh wow.
And that's really helpful as I have a six and a half month old now my wife and I do little Robert Theodore. But you know, I think that for me, I'd always been fascinated just by how the business world, you know, intertwined with politicians and regulators and how government could really you know, play instrumental role in creating an environment which would allow people to thrive and or stifle innovation. And I think that in this space, obviously with digital assets.
We've seen a government regime that has stifled innovation in the space for quite some time, really over the last decade and a half, moreover under the Biden under the Biden regulatory regime specifically in the last four years, we've seen, you know, folks in this industry be victims of lawfare and just unfair regulation practices generally. And so that's something that you know, we're extremely excited to fix under leadership of President Trump and our AI and cryptos are David Sachs.
We feel like we're well in our way of doing that.
Yeah, what a complete change, a complete one to eighty from what was happening over the past four years. As someone who is interviewing entrepreneurs and innovators and people were just looking to build technology and they didn't have any political agenda, but they were getting attacked politically from different angles. And it's just night and day compared.
To what was going Sure, yeah, yeah.
Now I wanted to go back to your background because I read that you played football and tell us a bit about that. And also if the universe had changed your path, where you know with NFL team, would you want to play.
For oh Man. Well, you know, football is a big part of my life growing up. My dad played.
He had a brief stint with the Detroit Lions, which you know that became my team, which was a very painful childhood for most of my life as a Detroit Lions football fan. I remember the own sixteen years and it's great to see how they've they've turned the ship around there. But my dad was a football coach to me my entire life growing up, coaching all the way through high school. And you know, I had the opportunity to play football in North Carolnta State on scholarship, and
I took that opportunity. It had a you know, a very successful freshman campaign there as a receiver, and it made it easier. I had a phenomenal quarterback in Jacoby Brissett who's still playing the NFL today. But you know, I think that really it shaped me in many ways. One is, you know, just being able to pursue things that are difficult. You know, being a college athlete, it's
not easy, especially at that level. And I have a immense amount of respect for all the you know, men and women that that.
Engage in athletics at the collegiate level.
I had the opportunity to also play at Yale for two years after I was at NC State, and that's where I ended up graduating. Unfortunately, I had a few injuries and I was up there and I kind of felt like, you know, it was time to change directions a little bit. But you know, if I had to pick an NFL team to play for, I'd have to say the Lions. And I have to go back to my roots here for a second. But you know, I
really enjoyed my experience just just playing the sport. I mean it just you're able to build just a sense of camaraderie, learn how to work with a team, do things that are challenging with other people.
Uh.
And I think that, you know, you can use a lot of those same principles and apply those two to anything you're doing in life.
Is that what kind of made you go into politics because you have to work for the people essentially.
For sure.
I think one thing that's unique about you know, college athletics generally is in a locker room, you have people that come from all different diverse backgrounds and walks of life, and you have to figure out how to how to you know, become friends with these folks, learn what their stories are, what their perspectives are, and really just work together as one unit. And I think that, you know, if we could do more of that in politics, would
be a lot better off as a country. But I think in this perspective with Digilast's what's fun about this is that you know, this is something this is something that's extremely bipartisan. You know, it's so important for our country to be at the forefront of digital technological innovation and you know, really the leader of the globe in the space as we attempt to revolutionize the financial marketplace forever.
So both take us behind a curtain. What's it been like working with David Sachs and the President? And it maybe take us what does your day to day look like and what are you working on?
Well, you know, first and foremost, I have to say that David is an unbelievably brilliant human being. And obviously he's demonstrated his immense success in the private sector, in the VC world and all the projects that he's been a part of. But we're just, you know, unbelievably thankful to have him in the White House. And I think the President made a phenomenal choice as it relates to someone that could deal with both crypto and AI, as he you know, understands both spaces truly in and out.
But he's he's just phenomenal to work with.
You know.
He takes a lot of the same principles that I described in terms of working with teams and developing folks and putting them in the right positions that you see in athletics, right, But that's just a testament to his leadership skills, whether it be in the business community or now, you know, with these political principles applied, I don't see
it being any different. He's just he's we work handing glove together on all of these issues as it relates to crypto, and you know, I can't say enough good things about him just as a person and the leadership qualities that he has.
How did you find yourself in this role? How did you meet David first? Or the president first? How dup happening?
Yeah? So, actually, I'll I'll go back a little bit.
So my during my college or my college freshman football campaign and thence he stayed actually played in the Bitcoin Bowl, which sparked my interest in cryptocurrency. I ended up buying my first bitcoin shortly thereafter and became a pretty avid trader across multiple ecosystems back when it was a lot
less uh kuth uh, to say the least. And you know, certainly have empathy for the folks in the industry that have dealt with, you know, the battles amongst institutional players that didn't understand the space for a long time, and I saw that even from just a retail perspective. But
you know, I ended up graduating from MEO. I went to law school at Wake Forest, and I had the privilege of learning from Professor Hawk, who taught blockchain internet law there, and you know, really enjoyed those topics, and obviously, being a participant from the retail side, I just had a keen interest on learning more about the space and stayed in tune with all the regulatory battles that were going on. But I ended up running for Congress while I was in law school, and I won the nomination
and a very contentious seat. You know, this was like, I think, a Biden plus point six district as basically as purple as you can get, and ended up losing my race unfortunately, but learned a lot in that process and just really loved, you know, the community aspect of it all again, like getting getting able to learn people's stories and hear from them, figure out who people are and what they're doing inside of your community, which is
something that really drove me. And so I stayed in tune with the political process and ended up starting a strategic growth equity firm with two other partners, one of which is my father. But you know, we were more in the tried by side of things. We look for companies in the data, tech and marketing space and we ended up servicing you know, super PACs and PR firms
and a lot of different political verticals. And so I was able just to stay in touch with what was happening on the political side along with what was happening in this space. And you know, the President endorsed me in my first congressional race, so I had that connection there. But you know, after you know, his his mandate of a victory. In this past November, I found myself down in Transition and we were talking about what are we're
going to do with digital assets. We know how important this is for our country, we know it's a priority for the president. You know, this kind of just naturally came together. So David and I started talking about, you know, what our plan would look like to make the United States the crypto capital.
Of the world and to usher in the golden age for digital assets. And I feel like we're well our way of doing that though.
So do you see this industry in addition to other industries there's AI, robotics and things that are on the rise, but being a big driver of wealth creation, job creation kind of what the Internet did for us, right with Google, your Googles, your Amazons, and the rest is history there.
Oh, I think absolutely.
I think that truly what's going to happen as digital asset space starts to merge with the traditional financial players, as you're going to see a revolution take place as it pertains to just our financial lives generally as consumers. And we're talk about stable coins and you know what that's going to do to payment rails in terms of making things more expeditious. You know, you can get even farther and more broad when you start talking about just security,
tokenization generally and the way that things can move. You know, I think that I was asked about this this morning at a conference that I spoke at you know, will my son see the same financial system.
That that I grew up in? And the answer to that is absolutely not.
And you know that's a credit to really what this industry has done over the course of the last decade in the midst of headwinds. Now we have tailwinds, and I think we have the ability to make monumental changes, but it's going to be you know, we have a very unique opportunity in time to do that, and I think that we need to capitalize on it and move very quickly, which I think the President and David both recognize, and that's why we're pushing so hard.
I heard President Trump, I think it was at the White House Crypto summit. He said he wants Congress to have the market structure and stable coin bills on his desk before the August recess. Is that possible? You think Congress can move and get this done.
It's more than possible.
I think it would be, you know, just a derelict of duty from my perspective in my office if we don't get both of those things on his desk before
August recess. And you know what, I'm super thankful for the leadership that we have in both chambers on the Hill right now as well, because I think that was something that was missed on a lot of folks, just you know, an industry and beyond was when they came together with David and announced the by camera Working Group on Digital Assets between the chambers at the beginning of
this Congress. I think that was just a monumental step towards really this industry maturing and being recognized as the legitimate player that it is in financial systems more generally. You know, this is the first time that the chambers had come together and said we're going to make sure that we pass meaningful legislation as it relates to this space,
and now they're moving expeditiously to do that. So, I mean with stable coins, you saw that we had an eighteen to six bipartisan vote out of the Senate Banking Committee with the Genius Act. I mean, that's incredible to see and it just shows you, you know, the will that Congress has to get this stuff done. And then obviously the House introduced their bill this past week and they're going up into markups this week there, so you know,
I feel like they're moving along expeditiously. As expeditiously as we could have hoped. And you know, our job is to just you know, continue to provide support and usher that process along. But you know, I'm so confident in the leaders that we have, whether it's Chairman Hill or Chairman Scott, sub committee chair you know, Brian Style and a lot of these other members have just done so
much for the space. And I'd be remiss not to mention Senator Lummas as well and Senator Haggerty, who are working diligently to make sure that the President's wishes are met.
Yeah. I just had a Congressman Style on and we talked a lot about the plans and getting that bill in the House getting through because we got the market structure last year fit twenty one, so things are moving, which is great. I would love if you could take us behind the curtain of wood President Trump. Obviously we've heard his statements publicly about digital assens and crypto. What is he saying behind closed doors? You know? Is he a fan of bitcoin? He's a fan of the theorem.
How does he? I know, he has a lot of his plate, So I'm not by only being saying this is the top thing, but anything you can share there.
The President is a fan of American dominance, and I can say that, you know, this space truly plays an integral role in securing that, just in terms of US dour dominance through stables, right, and just in a sense of what we can build with technology in this space as it relates to the financial system more generally.
And in order to.
Do that, we have to have clear regulatory authority established. We need to show people what the actual rules are so they can play playing the same game together. I mean, like, this is something that seems simple when you start to talking about it in principle, but the reality is there's a lot of moving parts to all of this. And I think that you know, the Presiden's done a phenomenal job just pulling the right actors together in the room.
And then you know, the creation of this office. There's never been an office in the White House fully dedicated to the digital asset space, and that's a testament to
the President's leadership here as well. I think that one thing that was missing here for quite some time is that, you know, we kind of view ourselves as being an administrator and or shirpa between interagency activity, White House policy industry and the Hill, and our job is to make sure that everyone's singing from the same sheet of music, right And again, like that, that's the President's vision coming to light about how we actually pushed the ball forward
as it pertains to this industry and get things done. And I think it's proven to be very successful. I mean, look how fast some of these interagency actors have moved.
And that goes back to the first Digital Assets CEO the President signed on day three, which he created the Internal Working Group, which is comprised of all the relevant actors that touch anything you know, related to this space, just in terms of agencies and other White House offices, and that gives us really common ground to come together and have conversations that are necessary to get to the
right outcomes. And part of my job too, and what I've done over the course of the last few months is just take on as many meetings with industry as I possibly can. You know, I'm very keen on the idea that industry does know best. I mean, these these folks live, breathe, and sleep this every day and they've you know, they've all faced a unique set of challenges, whether they're glias in the space or whether they're startups.
You know, we want to hear from everybody that allows us to basically garner information and translate that information to something that's digestible and palatable for other folks to receive that maybe don't interact with the space as much or don't understand why, you know, this.
Is so important.
And so we've really taken that upon ourselves in our office to do that, and I think that we're you know, so far we've been successful.
Oh for sure. Yeah, a lot of progress, made, a lot of promises kept, which is which is really great. Talk to us a bit about the stable coin aspect, because geopolitically their bricks nations are looking to bypass the US dollar US dollars the world reserve currency, and China has been declining in its buying of treasury bonds, but stable coin issuers are on the rise in holding those treasuries.
What role will US back dollar stable US dollar back stable coins, excuse me play and help preserving the reserve currency status.
It's instrumental.
I think the reality that folks have to understand is that actors in other countries or citizens of other nations still want US hours right and stable coins provides a pathway for them to achieve that, whether it's the hedge against inflation in their own countries or just just to feel financially secure enough with a dour system that is used throughout the rest of the globe. Right, so it gives them the ability to engage in payments and services
that they might otherwise not have access to. So I mean, I think that it plays a huge part of that just in terms of securing US hour dominance for decades to come. You know, we'll get through the stable coin legislation successful. I know that both chambers have introduced legislation.
I think they're about ninety percent similar. So I mean, as we start working through this in conference or however they decide to do it procedurally, I think that we'll end up getting this on the President's desk in short order and ensuring that everything that I've described can become a.
Reality for sure. Now, from a macro perspective, it feels like we're living in the fourth Industrial Revolution and we've had ones where the combustion engine, electricity, light bulb and all these things came to fruition and it changed the world. Right, you go back to early nineteen hundreds, we have the Internet, AI, robotics,
and on top of the Internet, blockchain and crypto. Is the administration or the gum federal government as a whole looking at it that way, this is the start of the next industrial revolution and potential economic boom.
I mean, I certainly think that we are in our office, and the administration is. The President certainly is, and that you know, hence why he's set this up the way that he has. But I think that people don't really fully recognize yet the way this is going to impact their lives to day basis in terms of how they interact with the financial system and how they interact with
their own finances. I mean, just their ability in terms of expicious payments and you know, frictionless environment in which you're not waiting on an intermediary to do certain things for you, and the way that you move money or interchange.
Services and goods.
I mean, that's that's a big step, and it's something that I don't think most people recognize is on the horizon, but it certainly is. And I think what's unique about this, and you've kind of pointed this out in your question, is that the financial systems themselves have been archaic in nature, right, So we've seen the Internet boom and all the things that have come from that, the way that people communicate, whether it be through social media channels, whether it be
through chat services, all of that good stuff. But one thing that hasn't changed really is the way that we move money. And you know, I think that there's there has been hesitancy in the past. I think part of that was really just due to lack of understanding. And one thing that's been really exciting for me is that the trad y players are extremely curious about what's going on here now. It's not like they're attempting to throw
a roadblocks or hurdles. I think they really just want to be on the forefront of institutional adoption on their side. And that's another thing just to point out too, Like we can get stable coin and market structural legislation through
and that's fantastic. These are really, really truly meaningful pieces of legislation, but we also have to mind the gap between you know, digital asset firms and institutional banking firms so that they're actually integrating these services and technologies in a way that benefits the everyday American and I think that'll be the next step that we take as soon as we get through this, you know, interagency rulemaking process and clearing the decks of basically eradicating anything to undergo
the Operation Choke point two point zero and all of that good stuff. Then it'll be it'll be about building the bridge right and helping you know, even some of the traditional players understand ways that they can plug in these technologies to make the lives of their consumers easier.
It's funny because I got into crypto and the blockchain industry in twenty sixteen, and I remember Jamie Diamond. He's been the final boss almost for bitcoin, right, but even he he has capitulated. JP Morgan is using blockchain tech. Now you have all of Wall Street, like you mentioned Tradfi, they're now building with the technology. I think Larry Fink just yesterday put out his annual letter to investors talking about we need to put stocks and bonds on the
blockchain and democratize investing. So it seems they've given up their initial knee jerk reaction of it sucks, this is scam. Oh wait, this is the future we need to build.
Yeah, No, I think that's right. I think that they've they've recognized how powerful these tools are. I mean, look, with boxing technology, just being able to understand like asset origination is huge and then also being able to trace that asset as it moves across chain is phenomenally helpful for a lot of people. And this goes beyond just the way that tokens move. I mean, we start talking about tokenization of securities and you know, being able to
put things on chain to permit that transparency. I mean, this is a huge step in terms of just you know, power for the consumer and people to interact with with finance on a day to day basis, which is basically everybody in some capacity. And I think that the traditional players understand that, you know, now is the time for us to move forward on the technological side and start accepting some of these innovations that clearly well we'll end up ruling the day regardless of whether it's here or
somewhere else. And that's why we're so keen on, you know, creating a regulatory environment that allows the United States to be not only just the crypto capital of the world, but the innovation capital of the world. As it pertains to digital financial technologies as well.
Now you mentioned whether it happens here or somewhere else. With President Trump's shift in tone towards the crypto industry, we're seeing some companies saying, hey, we're coming back. We're coming back to the United States. We left because we were scared. You know, in the past administration talk to us about that. Are you guys tracking that, like how much capital's coming back in, how how many businesses are coming back in, and things like that.
You know, I think we have blinders on right now because we understand what our mission is and we just want to make sure that we actually deliver on the president's promise, which is to make this you know, the most crypto friendly country in the world. And you know, my message to the folks that have gone off shore is welcome home. I mean this that we're going to deliver on the president's promises that he made in the campaign, trill. And I think that we've illustrated just in the first
two months. You know, what we've been able to accomplish is pretty drastic. But we's still a lot of work to do with the legislative priorities. You know, I'll talk about the first Digital Assets Executive Order just briefly because it outlined, you know, some pretty specific landmarks I think that people should pay attention to, two of which have passed.
One of which was the thirty day landmark, which required agencies and White House offices a part of that internal working group to you know, do a reviewer audit of anything they touched related digital asset space, and the sixty day landmark compelled the same actors to provide a list of recommendations things that they could do inside of their agencies or offices to make this a better regulatory environment
for innovators in the space. You know, our job in this office has basically compiled these recommendations and built out a comprehensive report for the President about how we actually achieve the goals.
That we've set out to achieve.
And you know that one hundred and twenty day landmark is fast approaching and we're well in our way of developing that report. In the meantime, you have you know, phenomenal actors at these agencies already, with like Hester at the SEC who's just.
Doing phenomenal work there.
We have Brian in coming at the CFTC with Secretary lout nek at Commerce and Secretary Best and a treasury you know, their teams have just been you know, amazing to work with. And these people, you know, truly understand how important the space is. They want to see innovation happen here. So as this working group continues to clear the deck and allow, you know, for innovation to occur here, I think that the actors that have gone off shore
will naturally start to come home. What other place would you like to do business then, other than the United.
States, the largest capital markets in the world, that's right.
I mean, so long as you know what the rules are we and we established you know, the clear regulatory authority, I think we're going to be just fine there.
Oh for sure, talk to us about the bigqin reserve and a digital asset stock pop the logistics behind setting this up. I know there's still some things to sort out. I saw yesterday the Big Win Policy Institute suggested big bonds bitcoin bonds that where some of that return can be used to buy bitcoin. Where where's that at? That this whole thing, well.
I think that let's talk about the Strategic Bitcoinerserve Executive Order because I think this outlines, you know, pretty much what our thinking was here. And you know, first and foremost, we view bitcoin as being unique. You know, it's a commodity out of security. It has the immaculate conception, as David likes to say, meaning that there is no issuer and that's intrinsic stwort value.
Right.
So we look at these things and say, Okay, we want to recognize it for what it is, which is being different, but we also want to recognize what's happening and a lot of these other ecosystems in this space because it's also fantastic. And so we had the strategic bitcoiners, or we have the digital assets national stockpile, you know, giving credence to everything else going on, but also making sure that we separate bitcoin because it is very different.
We view bitcoin as digital gold, and I've been you know, very clear about that. And so the question I get asked, you know, by a lot of journalists is well, how much bitcoin do you want? I'm like, well, that's like asking us how much gold do we want? We want as much as we can get as a country, so long as we acquire it and budget neutral ways that
don't cost a tax payer a dime. But one thing I'd like to point out too about this administration is that I think it's it's really just welcoming to and and and you know, exciting that we have a present that's finally you know, working to accumulate assets for the American people rather than take assets away from them. But it also, you know, with the SPR recognizes the value of what bitcoin is and how it can be harnessed for the American people. I mean, look, there's a finite
number of bitcoin. We all know that, and I think that there will end up being a race, uh in order to accumulate as much as you can get between other countries as well. I mean, look, people recognize us, and people are smart in other places around the world. But we feel like with the internal working Group and the folks, you know, the present likes to say, we have a lot of high IQ people in the room.
I think we're going to find the best ways to accumulate as much as we can get, uh in those budget neutral you know, ways that don't cost a tax payer a dime. You know, there's a lot of ideas out there. Lemmas has her own in the Bitcoin Act of twenty twenty five, which is revaluing the gold certificates and realizing.
You know, basically to gain some of those to purchase more bitcoin.
But at the end of the day, we're going to sort through all of these ideas and make sure that we enact the best ones, and we're in the process of doing that, but we'll probably have a lot more to say about that in short order.
Dumb question for you. If you're able to find a way, like you said, the revenue neutral where you don't use taxpayer dollars, do you need Congress or can the president sign an executive order?
So these are things that we can do through anuragency activity. So if you look at the Strategic Bitcoinners IRVE, it basically tasks Secretary Latinik and Secretary Vestent and their team is figuring out, you know, some ideas and ways in which we could do this. But we'll have that conversation more broadly with the rest of the Working group members
as well. That being said, you know, we'd love to see the Strategic Bitcoinners IRVE and shrined into law as well, which you know, that's why we're thankful for sendor Lemmas everything she's doing there. We're thankful for what's happening in the House side as well. I know that there's there's two separate pieces of legislation. Both chambers are now attempting to do the same thing. And you know, look, it's very it's the legislative process really to the SBRs and
it's infancy. So we'll see, you know, at the end of the day what these bills look like. But you know, we're just very happy to see the movement going on up on Capitol Hill because you know, it shows that they're willing.
To take the leadership roles.
It relates to digital assets and recognize, you know, how important all of this stuff is, and that's that's a really good place to be.
Question on the Digital Asset Stockpile. I love, this is just an idea I have what it makes sense to acts these different players. Maybe in the top ten or top twenty as far as market cap your foundation donates some coins to the Digital Asset Foundation or stockpile. Would donations be an avenue you can?
I mean maybe I think that you know, everything will be on the table as we start to flesh out these ideas amongst the working group members, and I think that we'll hear a lot of you know, phenomenal ideas about how we could achieve these things. You know, with the digital assets National Stockpile, it's treated a little bit differently because it allows the Secretary of Treasury to basically invest into or maneuver with these assets. That is different
than the reserve on the bitcoin side. So you know, I'm sure Secretary best has certainly has a reputation for being very good in that space on Wall Street. I'm sure he'll apply those same principles as the Treasury Secretary as it relates to the stockpile as well.
Yeah, I personally, I think it would make sense for some of these projects to donate some coins. They don't have to donate ten million, but you know, maybe hey start out with five hundred thousand coins depending on the market cap and tokenomics and all that, but that would be a good way support the United States.
And yeah, certainly interesting idea.
With regards to the bigcoin reserve from a macro perspective, And I'm a big student of history, Are we at the next Bretton Woods like kind of what happened after World War Two with gold? Where bitcoin specifically is being inserted as a reserve, and it could change the way money, he's backed Viac, Turncy's back.
I mean, maybe we'll see where it goes. I think that we're certainly at a pivotal point in history in which technology is changing the way that people think about asset classes. And you know, I think one thing that's different about bitcoin than gold is that, you know, we continually seem to find more gold, even we just do.
They've been talking about mining goal of asteroids, correct.
I mean, we know how much bitcoin exists.
It's just a question of how quickly it's going to be mined, right, And you know, at the end of the day, I think that we need to be just cognizant of the fact that there is that limited supply that's out there, the finite supply, and as a country, we need to also understand that there is just a strategic long term interest and accumulating as much as we can and doing it quickly before it becomes more expensive.
Because that's I think that that's naturally on the horizon, just given the principles that undergird it.
One, the mining difficulty is going to increase around bitcoin, and to your point, there's going to be a race to get this asset. Do you foresee the government possibly mining. It's for a big one itself that the federal government owns a mining company or whatever.
Maybe.
I mean, look, if it can fall under the framework of budget neutral right then I think that all possibilities are on the table, and we'll certainly hear from the experts in the space is about ways in which we could make something like that work. Not to say that we're pursuing that actively. I want to give the working group time to actually consider the best avenues for success
as it relates to accumulation. And you know, we'll have those discussions openly and honestly amongst ourselves inside of that group.
Oh, for sure, question for you as far as government's usage of blockchain, Elon for example, with his Doze initiative, has been talking about putting government spending on the blockchain, and we know what blockchain, more transparency, more real time data and all these things. Are there talks amongst folks to integrate blockchain, whether it be voting or government spending or in different ways.
Certainly, I think blockchain technology can just as it can revolutionize what's happening in the private sector, it can revolutionize what's happening in the public sector. As well in terms of how we we trace you know, American taxpayer hours and where they're actually going inside of government. You know, I can think of many use cases I'm sure that much many folks in your audience could as well, in which we could actually lift the veil on what's happening
with tax payer money, right. And I don't think that that's you know, pie in the sky. I think it's something that can be implemented, you know, pretty quickly.
But you know, I know that.
Elon is an absolutely brilliant human being, and I'm sure that he's thinking about ways in which you can integrate this technology like many others are as well in the private space. But at the end of the day, I think that it can happen in relatively short order. We'll just have to see what comes of it.
Well, I can't wait for that day. I have a seven year old, so I'm hoping in when she's an adult, she lives in the world driven by blockchain and more transparency, more efficiency, cheaper cost to move money and all these things, but she knows where her tax dollars are going.
Well, how cool to be in terms of asset origination if you could actually see where your tax dollurs went, like your own personal tax dours.
Right, so you see that, you.
Submit your payment or whatever to the irs, you pay your taxes, and now all of a sudden you get to track on train or on chain exactly where that stuff goes.
I mean that would be pretty fascinating. Indold.
Yeah. And the world she's gonna live in, it's going to be really different with robotics. And maybe she'll have one of Elon's Tesla bots in the house. I should be using stable coins to buy her coffee and things like that. It's gonna be an interesting world, all right. I got some wrap up questions here for you. First, if you could create your own metaverse, what would the theme be, Oh man, what would you put your oculus on ankle to?
That's a good question. I guess it'd have to be sports oriented, right, I don't know.
Be like an NFL playing against Tom Brady or something.
Yeah, I mean I guess, you know, simulating the experiences and the thrills that you can have, you know, only an environment where there's one hundred and ten thousand people screaming around you. I think that would be pretty cool, you know, I think that would heighten your everyday experience is if you have people rooting you on to type away your emails.
I think that'd be pretty fun.
For sure. Rapid fire questions, favorite food.
Enough to go with steak fil a specifically nice?
Favorite musician or band?
Oh man, these are the toughest questions of the day. You know what I'll say. I'll say the Dave Matthews band. You need to throw back there.
Yeah, one of its songs I first learned was crash is an Impressive girl, So Dave. Thanks Dave Matthews fan.
Favorite movie, Let's Go Die Hard, and it is a Christmas move.
Favorite book.
I mean, I can't not say Art of the Deal.
It's a phenomenal book written by you know, my boss, and I think at the end of the day, everyone should read it. I think you're seeing a lot of that the principles he describes in that book unfold in front of our eyes in real time.
Here.
Absolutely, And when you're not doing your duties at the White House or whatever may be, what are you doing for fun?
I love to play golf.
I'm not good at golf, but I love to play. And you know, I haven't had much time to play since I've taken on this role, but hopefully I'll get back out there and enjoy some warm weather here soon.
Awesome BO pleasure. Thank you, thank you for taking the time