De-influencing 101: Stuff Mom Never Told You

to influence you to buy certain things. D influencing says, wait a minute, actually, do you need to buy another water bottle when you already have five in your cabinet. I am fascinated by the phenomena that is de influencing, and more importantly, what this de influencing trend says about our current social and economic climate. So I joined my

friends Samantha and Annie over at the podcast stuff. Mom never told you to dig into de influencing and why we are seeing it all over our social media feeds, So I hope you enjoy. I have a theory that, especially during times that are like turbulent or uncertain, the

pandemic would definitely fit into this um. Many of us, myself very very much included really turned to online shopping for a quick serotonin boost or a quick you know this is gonna feel good, or like I got into this habit of enjoying the feeling of kind of giving myself Christmas every day, like, oh, there's gonna be when I come home, there's gonna be a present waiting for me, you know, from past me. And so this is not just my theory. I do have a little bit of

research to back it up. People really leaned into online shopping during the pandemic. According to the most recent annual retail Trade Survey release from the Census, e commerce sales increased by two hundred and forty four point two billion dollars or um the first year of the pandemic, rising from five hundred and seventy one point to billion in nine to eight hundred and fifteen point four billion. Uh. And people again, myself, very shamefully included, uh, really relied

on online retailers, specifically like Amazon. Unsurprisingly, Amazon stock hit a new all time high during and it's only now like pretty recently starting to fall from that huge booth during the beginning of the pandemic. And a quick disclaimer here that like I just people need to say that. Obviously, we're gon, we're gonna be talking about our online shopping habits, but there are a whole bunch of folks who rely on online shopping for very legitimate, real reasons. Folks with

disabilities or chronic illnesses, you know. For them, online shopping can be a lifeline being a swamped parent or a caregiver who can't always you know, pop out to the store for one thing. It's also a reason why somebody might really really lean on online shopping. I don't want to make it seem like anybody who is pressing by online is just leaning into bad habits that they should question. Um,

So I'm not talking about those folks. I'm really taught talking about the quick purchase of things that you really don't need or maybe even really don't want because an algorithm on social media told you to do so. And I want to talk about why the tide is maybe sort of turning on this a little bit. Okay, Yeah, I mean it has been. I have a friend who loves Target, not a sponsor, but she loves like the Target app, and like she will text me as if like, yeah,

Christmas has come early. The Target app has updated, and I feel like this wasn't a thing during the pandemic, and we've talked about it because it is clearly like a emotional it's something she does when she's stressed, and then like, I feel that during the pandemic, I have seen that a lot more where people are like, I need something that will make me feel better for a little bit. Also, this is a great point that you

brought out, because I did. I hate it when people are like judging folks for I don't know, getting groceries delivered or whatever. And there's a lot of impact of that. But for some people that's not like laziness, right. I mean, we definitely relied on it during the pandemic as something that when we didn't want to go out, we didn't

want to spread things. We were very concerned people who were even compromised, and it was a resource that was necessary that really did help try to maintain the spread. And it's that that was the first time you really understood why this could be beneficial. But yeah, that definitely could be abused and I know this is a whole different thing, and that's the whole conversation of like people with disabilities have to rely on things like this, and

it's a service that that should have been happening previously. Absolutely, we absolutely should not be like judging or shaming people for whom they really rely on this for a lifeline.

And I think that's one of the reasons why it's so important that the people who are you know, doing the grocery delivery, who are the workers and the staff, they should be treated well, they should be compensated well, they should have protections like and people with disabilities should not have to rely on like private some pretty exploitative like grocery delivery apps like we like, everybody deserves better and we shouldn't be judging anybody who is just trying

to live their life. Um. But I do think that we are in a place where people who again myself included, maybe got into some bad online shopping habits without really hitting pause and really thinking about whether those habits, you know, maybe got us through a tough time emotionally during but maybe aren't really serving us so well or wallets so well if you're me here right right. It's kind of interesting because I think we've talked about this for I'm a big fan of TikTok, I can get lost in

it for hours and hours at a time. I get that so many things and like, yeah, it starts to read me and I'm like, okay, stop that. Why are you sitting at me? An add about this And it's not necessarily an add but it's someone that I trust, or say trust uh and quotes because it's someone that I like and follow and they seem like good people you never know, uh. And then they're like, oh, yeah, these are my five Amazon fines and these are my five Costco fines and I'm like, yes, you are correct.

I need those things. Have did I know that it existed? No? But I absolutely need those things, and it's getting to be more and more. The five Amazon stuff always gets me. And I have this thing with like there's so many

creators on TikTok, which I'm also addicted to. Uh, so I feel you on that, Sam, but like TikTok ers who are all about you know, like, oh, here's like here's what my really organized desk or workspace looks like Like I clearly have some kind of emotional hang up around the way that work gets done in my life, and so I subsequently follow a lot of creators for who mets their niche, and so they're like, here's what my notion looks like, Here's what my dot journaling looks like.

You're is what my laptop or workstation looks like, and that I clearly have some kind of a like hang up about that internally, and so I watch a lot of that, And so whenever they're like, my, you know, go to my Amazon store front my five you know, the five things that really helped me stay productive, I know that I'm kind of vulnerable and prime to just click by without even thinking about it because it speaks to some sort of internal like the issue I have

where I'm like, I must think that, oh, the way that work gets done in my life is not up to par with the way that work gets done in the lives of other creative people or something. And so it's really I think part of it really is like knowing your triggers and knowing knowing the the vulnerabilities that you have that we're so likely to try to fill by hitting by now or by buying a thing that

we really ultimately might not even need. And so you know that if I had to give this this conversation like a so what it's that we should really be in a headspace of asking some questions when it feels like the algorithm or the app or the platform is

the one in control and we are passive. I think that what is really important is if we switch that dynamic so that we, the human, the person who makes the money and makes the decisions about how the money gets spent, is the one in control and that we are not, you know, at the behest of algorithms and influencers who we don't even know, and you know, apps and platforms, and so in service of that, I think it kind of makes sense to kind of talk about how we got here, like a little bit of a

look back on influencing and how how we got to this point. Or maybe people are kind of starting to ask a few questions about the role that social media influencing has on our life. So if I had to ask you, what do you think used to be the main app on social media where a lot of influencing was taking place, what would you say? Instagram? Instagram? Instagram. It's absolutely Instagram. You know, back in the goals, the era of Instagram, it looked good, it had a good layout,

it was easy to use, it was understandable. It was. It was it was a different time, right, and so I think like one it felt back then this one I'm gonna say, like this is liketeen is when I would kind of situate this. So it felt kind of clear how one would get engagement. So if you were on the if you were an influencer, if you were on the influencer side of things, you probably had a pretty clear sense of like what the algorithm was going to reward. It rewarded images of faces, for instance, and

so the rules seemed pretty doable. You know, post every day post natively from the Instagram app as opposed to adding a picture later. Like it was pretty clear like what you needed to do to to do well on Instagram. Algorithmically speaking, I think that us, as the audience who was consuming the content that influencers made on Instagram, we also had a pretty good sense of what to expect.

You know, you were gonna get conventionally attractive women who were giving you like life envy and making it seem like, oh well, if you bought this specific item, your life could be like mine, right, And like, obviously this is like a curated, manufactured lie that could absolutely be harmful to people who were consuming it um as researchers like very clear, but I would argue that there was something familiar to it, right, Like we understood what to expect

as an audience who was consuming the content of influencers. But now here. There are two big things that are happening that I believe have really shifted this Golden Instagram age and thus shifted how folks are maybe feeling about influencers. The first is that the social media landscape is really really changing and really seeing some seismic shifts. We've seen

this play out in a couple of ways. One, people just are not using Instagram like they were in the golden era of you know, a new report in the Atlantic that came out last month called Everyone Is Over Instagram said that Instagram is slowly and steadily losing its relevant specifically with young users, and like that's the user base that any social media platform really needs to court,

like young people. You want young people to really be using your platform for to feel like really relevant, right right. And It's funny because I I am not on TikTok, but I've noticed that Instagram is just like videos now it's like to talk, which is a different thing. It's a different thing. Um, but it is interesting to me. I love I'm fascinated by kind of these like shifts. Why do people like, like why are people into TikTok

over like Instagram? Why why is that happening? Um? But yeah, I mean why why is it that Instagram has lost favor? Why is it fading? That's a great question. I would say one is just that, like when the rules become less transparent or just less doable, I think people find it less kind of worth it to post there, right, And so I think that if the rules felt clear in Tony four teen, today, it seems like every month Instagram announces a new things are going to be prioritizing.

It used to be static images, then it's going to be video. You know. It used to be like if you posted once a day, that was enough. Then Instagram put out guidance for creators that was like, oh, you need to be making four reels a day. That's a

lot of content. It's just not possible. And so if Instagram decides we're going to algorithmically reward people who follow, this like difficult to follow and also difficult to understand and constantly changing set of guidelines, and if you don't follow those, we're not going to show your post to anybody, even your friends, even the people who want to see your posts. It just eventually starts to feel like, well, what's the point, right, Like that's one of the reasons

why personally, like I've used Instagram less. It's because whatever the guidance is they give to creators to try to get more engagement on the platform, it's just too much. Right Like I have at work, I don't. It's like, Instagram is not my job. For some people, it is their job, and so I can understand, you know, playing the game a willle bit more, but it's not what I do. I have do other things in my life.

And so if then I'm going to be kind of I use this word very lightly, but like punished algorithmically by having my content not shown to people, even people who I know, even people who are my friends who I know want to see that content. What is the point? Like? Why why jump through those hoops if that's how you're gonna gonna be treated on a platform, you know, right? You know? And I was thinking as with Instagram when we were talking about yes, there's all these reels and

the younger people are getting frustrated. They also changed the algorithm. I know there was like a whole year long campaign of people just asking can you see this post um, And even for our posts at stuff mo, I've never told you we are verified. We have our thirty thousand followers. We rarely get more than four or five likes because we don't post but every other day. And like when you look up, how do you get you know, followers

or views. It's literally like you said the post four things, but now it's adding post this, putting it on the reel, put it on the like the videos, and you have to do all three of those things. So you're literally taking four post times three to put it on the same site, and it doesn't sound like it's worth it anymore. And then the suppression alone with the algorithm, why just

why exactly? And you have to basically be a one person like studio, right because like you have to make the post turn it into a real comments and it's like you have a job, dude, Like you're a podcaster. It's like your job is not doing Instagram. And I've actually worked with like um social media managers, like professional

social media managers to help grow my account. And you know, this was a few years ago, so I can't speak to whether or not this is good advice now, So don't try this thinking this is this is how you grow Instagram now because I really don't know. But something that she did is like, oh yeah, I just spend a good amount of time commenting on content of accounts that are similar to you in what they post. And so you know, she would spend like two hours a

day this being like great posts. Yeah, I love this, and like, who has time for that? Right? Like I was doing a little experiment to see if it woul help, and it actually did help grow my account. But like, am I going to sit there and do that? Absolutely not, right, Like, and so I can see why people are just like, yeah,

I'm not gonna do that. Don't need that. And I think any I think that you mentioned that, um, when you go to Instagram now, what you've kind of see is a lot of reels that are really TikTok's that you saw on TikTok if you have that platform, you know, a week ago, and so it kind of I think separately, I think that Instagram is really confused about what role they are trying to play in our lives and in our social media diets. I don't think that they know. I think that like one day it will be images,

one day it'll be real. It's like not clear and it's so funny because, um, someone else who is really impressed about this are the Kardashians. Folks might recall that over the summer, um, Kylie Jenner and Kim Kardashian both posted an image saying, make Instagram Instagram again. Stop trying to be TikTok. I just want to see cute photos

of my friends. And this is really kind of not surprising to me because the Kardashians are so good at being Instagram friendly or the friendly for the version of Instagram that Instagram used to be, right, Like, they're all beautiful, they all take beautiful pictures. They're all really good at looking kind of Instagram perfect and polished. TikTok takes it

in a completely different skill set. You kind of have to be funny or engaging, or you know, you have to have something that's gonna make Like, just looking good on TikTok is not enough. You have to bring something else. And no shade to the Kardashians that is not my skill set either, So I'm not I'm not trying to

put them down or anything. And so what's interesting is that after the Kardashians said, like, oh, go back to cute pictures of my friends, the head of Instagram responded over the summer saying that Instagram they just needed to focus on video and reels to survive and grow as a platform. Um. But then just last week he posted

that you know that was the wrong move. He did a complete about face, and he said that Instagram quote over folk is on video last year, and so now the platform is going back to balancing the amount of photos and video shown to users. UM. In one example that he gave, you said that Instagram will consider how often a person likes some comments on photos versus videos to determine which content will appear first in their feeds. And so this really tells me they're like, they don't

know what they're doing. They're not sure of their strategy. You know, it's not clear to them what they're trying to be. And I think it's no wonder how people are like, yeah, I'll let y'all figure it out. And while you'll figure it out, I'm gonna be on TikTok or or just be getting rid of social media altogether. You know, I think it's kind of funny because I think of this analogy. When you think of Instagram, I

think of the elder millennials as me. Don't don't. I don't want to hear it, because I've been between the xers and the millennials. I came at the right of the cup. But like elder millennials trying to be cool and hip and talk to those gen z ears who would be the TikTok goods and all, that's what's happening. What we see is like Instagram trying to be really cool and really relevant. It's just kind of missing the mark because we are no longer at that point in life.

And I find it funny because that's all I can think of TikTok versus Instagram. I'm trying to become TikTok, and TikTok's like I don't care about you, so nothing is like more. I mean, I love I love this contact because I think that like gen z younger folks, I like, I love it when they come for us

elder millennials. Um, sometimes they'll be like things that millennials really need to stop doing on Instagram, and they I'm always like yes, drag me like like no more boomerang, you can fix us, thank you, and you know the

other part of that. And again, I think this has a lot to do with the generational changes, and again I love it is like, yeah, Instagram really gave birth to, as we said, influencers and selling us things and selling us ideas and selling us things that we will never be and try to what what we try to still attain, which is the Kardashians. You know, they were really big force uh in that. But with TikTok, it seems like the younger generations that was really into it was like,

we're tired of celebrities. We want a chance to see regular people who have a lot of good ideas and content. And the TikTok is for the people. Because I know there's been a lot of pushback as celebrities are not jumping on TikTok, but people, I stop it, this is not for you. Oh my god, I could talk about this for hours. This is something I find so fascinating.

So I think because TikTok is a younger platform, they just have a completely different relationship with digital life than like them then millennials have and so I absolutely agree with you that, especially for younger folks who are spending time on TikTok, and TikTok is the is the fastest

growing social media app out there right now. I think the audience is very different from the curated Instagram audience and that they do want more real stuff, but they want authenticity, not that like fake like oh my house is so messy, authenticity like really authenticity, and they are vocal, like they will call you out. There was a whole

thing with um. I think it was Bethanie Frankel going on TikTok and her transition to TikTok wasn't very smooth, and I think part of it is because like celebrities maybe are used to being able to say certain things and get everybody fawning all over them on Instagram or on other social media platforms, and they're not finding that reception on TikTok. Like TikTok is the app for like regular people to talk, it's not for celebrities to like

hawk their perfect lives. And there's actually a influencer right now, like a big influencer michaela Nigeria. I apologize I been saying her last name wrong, but um, it's in very hot water for trying to do a mascara brand like sponsored content while allegedly wearing false lashes. And so obviously you can't be like this. A mascara is so great.

Look look at the way it should transform my lad to where it's like, I think those are freak flashes, um, And so people are calling this person out because that doesn't fly there, right, And so I think that, like, you're exactly right, Sam, that the audience that is big on TikTok is a lot more vocal, a lot more savvy, and they will call you out if they feel like they're being pushed something that's just like like a fantasy that's not real. Maybe on on Instagram you might get

away with that, but not on TikTok. Well, I will say the thing about TikTok is there are TikTok sluts that that is their intent and entire content is like to call out the falsehood of other content. It is the rabbit holes I have gone down where I'm like, I don't even know this person. I have never even seen them on TikTok, but apparently they're faking having a

scar to get clouts. I need to reach a thousand comments and spend six hours of my time on this despite only having one one life to live on this green nurse. And I know what you're talking about, and I hate that. I know what you're talking about out because I did the dance same thing. What is this that to do with it? Like, it has nothing to do with me. This isn't even somebody who I follow or I'm invested in, like you get you're like people

the evidence that people compile. It's like, I'm fascinated if if anything ever happens to me. I guess I shouldn't say that, but like the way that like TikTok's flues are able to like investigate the nitty gritty, that really doesn't matter. My hats are off to them. The petty. The petty is real, and if it's all in good fun, there's definitely seriousness that we definitely talked about before. But

the pettiness is real. And when you get invested in, you're just like, well, well well, and you can't help but be the voyor and you feel a little guilty. I will say that, um, but you can't put one over on them. And it continues to baffle me because as as you're talking about TikTok is one of the younger ones, the way that it has grown exponentially, I'm like, is it going to be able to keep up with that demand? Yeah, that's such a great question. I actually this is a this is a a fuego take. So

you know, whatever is my opinion. I think that we are going to see government legislation of TikTok in This is like my big tech prediction. I think that it's growing so much. I think there are national security questions. I guess I'll just put it that way. I think that you know, there have been there is like rarer bipartisan support for doing something about TikTok. It's already been banned on I think federal government devices can't have TikTok

on them. A handful of states have banned having TikTok on state run devices, and that number is growing. Universities are the same at numbers growing of universities that have

banned TikTok from state state owned devices. I think that we are seeing enough traction in government in a in a bipartisan way and also civil society and institutions that I do think that like something is going to happen or be done to combat TikTok's growth, because their growth has just been like if folks want to look it up, like it is wild, how many users it is gaining. It's just it's just like exploding. One of the things that I think about TikTok becoming kind of the new

place where people are spending their time online on social media. Um, why that might be fueling a kind of backlash against influencing is that this moves a lot faster than Instagram, which fuels what they call micro trends. And so if a trend is something that it's in style for a little bit of time, a micro trend is something that becomes in style or in vogue very quickly and then

burns out just as quickly. Something can be iconic and very popular one month, and by the end of the month people are talking about it being out of style. A great example is like, um, this clothing brand I really doubled down on and like went for a hard house of sunny. They make this like very bright colored clothing that really pops on social media, and I was like, oh my god, and I bought like a sweater and address and this and that. Maybe a month later people

were like, oh, would already looks so dated. And so if you think about what is sort of in style, how quickly it becomes sort of pass I think that TikTok becoming a place where people spend more of their digital time online is one of the reasons why trends are kind of flaming out so quickly, and so if you're an influencer, you know that's just a lot having to like it is exhausting to be in even this in the audience, to be told you need to buy a new thing over and over and over again, and

in in January, it's this water bottle. In February that water bottles out. Now it's this water bottle. It's it's no wonder that people can't really keep up with that because it's too fast. That's so funny. I feel like I'm the like millennial person that comes in like, oh, I finally got this thing, and they're like, that's three

years ago, what are you doing. It does feel like it moves very very quickly, and actually an interesting implication of this kind of thing is like, because I also do a food podcast, is the thing like the feta pasta, like feta cheese, like couldn't you couldn't find it anywhere, And it was because of TikTok. And then a month later everyone was like, what are you talking about? But for that one month, nobody could find feta cheese. Yeah,

I see it with food. It's so interesting when it happens with food because it does correlate with when you go to the grocery store. It's just like not there. Um, I've heard that tinned fish is like the new thing right now, which if you don't want to talk about like our economic climate, the fact that like tinned fish that go just having our tinned fish date that tells me something. I'm like, oh, people are thinking about our economic climate in some perhaps like less than cheery outlook,

which brings us to what we've been talking about. Is another piece of this is like like like what I was saying with myself my friends, is this anxiety of this like maybe if I buy this thing, I'll feel better, like maybe this will make things better. And that's not unique absolutely, And so the second thing that we're seeing that's really I think shaping all this is this kind of feeling of like economic unease and uncertainty that is

impacting the way that people are responding to influencing. I think that a lot of folks are concerned about an economic downturn. We're seeing like layoffs and a lot of

sectors like tech and media. I don't I think people are perhaps wary about spending money on things that they see online and maybe doing it in a different way than maybe once we're in And I think that, like more importantly, I think that as we go into times that are uncertain, economically uncertain, economically unstable, people don't really want to open up their phone and see people living the high life, right Like, it just doesn't feel good

to be worried about inflation, worried about food being on the shelves, worried about how you're gonna make rent, if you're gonna be laid off, and open your phone and see an influencer trying to sell you that their life is perfect and that your life can be perfect too if you buy this thing that you don't need, don't have money for, and don't even really want. I think that people are just not feeling that vibe anymore. I think there was a time where that had a time

and a place and it felt very familiar. I think right now we're not loving it. Yeah, yeah, it just feels kind of like out of touch. And and and you brought up the Kardashians earlier, and they're big, like they've even been in the news recently for like lawsuits, but they were really big about this of like selling you a thing. It just felt like they weren't kind of

reading the room. I guess, like totally. I remember they and I talked about this in an episode of There Are No Girls on the Internet, my own podcast Around the Holidays. I remember, I think it was last year or the year before, they posted their Easter spread, and it was like the most opulent thing, like even for Kardashian standards, the most opulent thing you've ever seen. It was like life like life size Teddy Bears, full size, like five full size gumball machine means, was like pink

gum in them for bicycles. It was like the most elaborate and lavish opulent spread, even by Kardashian standards, that I have seen. And the response was not like, Wow,

how cool for them. The response was over consume much like, and I think that that really shows us that we are in a place where when they posted that, they probably thought everyone was gonna love it, but in reality, most people were like, this is a little opulent, seems a little tacky, seems a lot of a little out of touch for one holiday, Like, at what point do we start asking questions about the value of over consumption and whether or not that's a value that is like

inherently good or healthy or like serving us in our lives, right, And I mean Instagram and that that's kind of thing, is like you're presenting this really curated version of your life, um and then kind of at least in my case. And I think there's been some says about this, but like feeling bad because you'd see other people's pictures are

like their life is way better than mine. But also, and I could be wrong about this, but I feel like a lot of the influencers I saw on Instagram were women, Like a lot of the people who were like, Hey, you need to buy this thing, And maybe that's just an algorithm for me, but it's not just you. I think this is inherently gendered. The lion share of influencers are women and girls. According to a study by the influencer marketing agency Isaiah, women accounted for more than of

sponsorships made as influencers. But I should know if that, because this is America. There is also an influencer pay gap. Even though there are more like women make up the bulk of influencing, they're still paid less than men for influencing, which is a real head scratcher. But yeah, I think it's women and girls who are being sold all of this and they're not. It's we're not. It's being sold products.

We are being sold products as a proxy for like getting your life together, or like succeeding being a woman, or or I think that we're being sold on the idea that you can consume your way into the kind of life that you want. And I think that capitalism and consumption as a means of perpetuating gender roles has always been a thing. And I think right now, I

think a lot of women are just exhausted. We have been burdened with so much, we have had our rights, just like, it's not a very rosy time to be a woman. What I'm saying, I don't want. I feel like if I go into it, I'll be all here all day. But you know, I think that a lot of women are just like, on top of everything else that we have to shoulder. I don't have the emotional bandwidth two buy into this idea that tells me that I have to buy this product on Instagram to be

a more complete woman. You know, I think more women are calling bs on this idea, especially younger women, right. I will say so immediately after the New Year. The first thing and what are the first and I think you were superviral. Is this girl laying down in bed in TikTok and saying you don't need this. Here are the five products you don't need and then goes down is of all the trends and that this is about you. You're not going to use this, You're not gonna ever

see it again, don't buy it. You're only good Like that was the first video I saw. It was like, oh what is this? And the next one was the girl who was like, hey, I have a bought every single expensive hair product. These are both in Here are the products you should go to go to CVS. This is much better. Don't buy those expensive things. And I was like, what is happening. Yeah, so that is a great example of the influencing which is all over TikTok

right now. So what is the influencing, Well, basically, again, it's exactly what it sounds like. Rather than trying to convince you to buy something, it's telling you you don't

actually need to buy this. So creators will be telling you like, you don't need another water bottle if you're me, you don't need another notebook that you you know, are not gonna use when you already have like twenty on yourself, or telling you how different TikTok or social media famous products are actually not worth the money, not worth it. According to the newsletter Glossy, the hashtag de influencing has twenty one point four million views and has increased in

popularity even in just the last week. They spoke to a creator who goes by L Gray or Basic of course, who pointed to the impact of the economy on consumer spending and the ability or lack thereof to buy based on influencer recommendations as one of the reasons why de influencing is becoming so popular. L says, in the last twelve months, we've seen an extreme slowdown in the global economy. As we enter into a recession, people are starting to feel the effects and are taking a closer look at

their spending and consumption. Many people have gotten fed up with the constant barrage of micro trends and must have items, especially as they take a closer look at their bank accounts.

And so, you know, I think that this creator is probably onto something that you know, we started this conversation today talking about the things that we and again myself very guilty of this uh over consumed online in I think that de influencing is a response to some of these over consumption habits that a lot of us just sort of picked up during the pandemic and like just kept having in our life. And now we're like, wait

a minute, is this actually a good idea? Is it actually good that I, you know, we'll just click by now and get something without really thinking about if I need it, if I want it, Like, is that something I actually truly need? Probably not, I will say, I feel like and maybe it's just the side of TikTok I'm on because we know it is very curated. These the influencers who are trying to help you save money and tell you what it is and tell you what's working,

what's not working. It's almost the way of women supporting women, or you know, the marginalized supporting the marginalized, Like you're the one, I know this is aimed towards you. Typically women are typically you know, those who are in like really harsh places. So I'm going to help you and tell you not to do this. And on top of that, the same conversation about the gen z ears again I'm still in all of them, is that they are all

about calling out the bs. So when they see an influencers saying this is amazing, and then they start realizing this person is all about the money. This person is not genuinely doing things, kind of like the mascara, We're going to call you out until you don't do this again as a way to protect other consumers slash other women. I love how you put that. I absolutely have seen a million times that women and other marginalized people telling each other the truth and leveling with each other and

breaking down for each other. That is more powerful than a million dollar pr AT campaign, than a million well paid like you know, pr agents working over time. Nothing is more powerful than women sharing their truths with each other, and that can like, yeah, it doesn't, It doesn't matter what like expensive marketing firm that you've that you've contracted. Women sharing each other's truths with each other will always

be more powerful. Absolutely, yeah. And I find it interesting because it's those kind of like that same girl I was talking about who was saying don't buy does, and she's now gone viral. Being honest, being truthful and trying to protect others has really built her audience, and she's become an influencer slash the influencer and is now getting credibility and may be able to go viral enough to like start having her own outlets. Whether it is who knows.

I know several people from TikTok as well as YouTube, but that's the whole thing. Have shows, get shows, get brand deals, and get specific deals that are genuinely good because they are honest, and it's building them up. So it's interesting to see how this the opposite of that has grown them. That makes sense. It makes so much sense that I've been I think it's I think it

marks a shift, and I think it's good. I think that like we should question why the powers that be are so quick to reward people who make their entire thing about stuff that you should buy over consumption. We could be instead building up honest platforms and platforms that say like, well, you really aren't going to use this,

or you really don't need this. Like I love watching on TikTok people who do closet clean out and they're like, these are the top five things I like remove from people's closets, or like the top ten things people don't actually wear, because it might actually help create that shift of being a little bit more in tuned and intentional about what you buy. And I think that's really important.

I mean, like, it has so many implications, not you know, not the least of which is the environmental impact of Like, you know, I had a little bit of a of a fast fashion thing myself, like I would buy from this brand she she in, where you know, it's like it's so it's so cheap, but it like it looks it looks like the fancier stuff, but it's so cheap. Then it's like, well, you're like, actually it is one of the biggest offenders a fast fashion that ends up

you know, polluting our world. And it's like I don't want to be I don't. I don't want, like, I don't want my unexamined emotional need to translate to a worst world for the next generation to come. And so I really kind of solve the like need for me to do a little bit of thinking and unpacking and intention around my own consumption habits and what I was trying to fill by buying things and the longer term

consequences for generations to come. I know that sounds like a lot, but like you're gonna start somewhere right, No, it is absolutely goes hand in hand again with the new creators that the people who are getting big on TikTok are those who are like, hey, you're doing these things and it could be of course, this is a whole different conversation about diagnosing and assuming everybody's one thing or another, but it does call call out to be like, hey,

you have this reaction which could be costing you money, costing your time because of a trauma, so you're focusing on the wrong thing. Like I do love seeing them correlate actual action to internalized trauma or uh maybe reasoning however you want to say it. But it is encouraging to see that there's more correlations that these influencers slash TikTok people are talking about out loud, So you start considering the actual basis of trying consuming too much or

consuming way too fast, or not thinking about it. It's both encouraging and kind of scary to see how quickly this can flip, because we really did go from a generation of we have to be perfect, we have to look perfect, we have to be the Kardashians, uh, white girl version of what I mean by that is the skinny skinny version you you know, yeah, I know what

I'm talking about um too. But to like coming into loving your body, do things that are healthy for you, do things that make you happy, do things that bring you joy, and then going into and that comes to having peace of mind. And this is how you do it. And so it's kind of interesting to see how we flip there. But we are at this cusp of like it could flip again, and is it going to be healthy or unhealthy? I think again, TikTok is being is encouraging to me to see the creators that I'm seeing.

That's such a good point and I think, you know, the bottom line of this is that you cannot consume yourself into feeling like a complete version of yourself to feeling whole. You know, I talked earlier about how I get really kind of stuck on these like people who are full time creatives or full time creative professionals and and the way that that work gets done in their lives, and how it looks so good to me. It looks like they're very together, like they've got lists, they look

very organized and very cozy and very peaceful. And that clearly that is speaking that some kind of perception that I have internally that I am not enough. There's something I can buy that it's going to make me feel enough. I have to just get there through self work, through growth, through introspection. I I completely understand the need to like just hit by now and like if I get everything that this woman has in her house, maybe I'll get it,

but I won't. You can't consume your way into I guess, feel good about what you've got, feeling good about who you are, you know, feeling good at like feeling like yourself and feeling like that's enough. There's just not a product that's going to do that. It's gonna take It's gonna take work, and so I think, you know that's it's definitely easier to just buy a thing, and I, boy do I keep trying, but I know I just got some tease that I went viral. We won't talk

about that more. Oh, it's like this is I don't want this to sound judging, because like who amongst us right, like I am, we're all works on progress. But but if you were interested in trying to unwork, unpack some of this, like de influence yourself, first, I should say, like, I'm not a professional. So if you if you are someone listening and you think that you really might have a true issue with like buying things and shopping that you might need to talk to somebody about, you should

do that. Talk to a professional if you feel like your issue rises beyond you know what we're talking about here. But a couple of tips that might help folks de influence themselves. My favorite sleeper tip is that if you have an I phone or I think I think it works on injury to um using your phone in gray scale. My phone is in gray scale probably of the time.

You can go into your accessibility settings on your iPhone and change your your phone to gray scale, and I have it so that the little button on the side, the power button, if I hit that three times, it flips from gray scale to color. So if somebody sends me a picture where it's like, oh, I need to see this in color to get the context, I can easily, you know, flip it to color, flip it back. When I tell you that, it makes things on your phone

looks so much less enticing and less appealing. And I can absolutely feel it when I'm looking at my phone and color. I can feel the little synapses and neurons going off in my brain that tell me by this, click that, look at that, read that, And it makes the experience of using social media more boring, but in

a good way. I'm just I feel a lot more in control when all of these bright colors that are literally designed by people who make lots and lots of money to to like, you know, fire things in your brain and to get you to be as as as tuned in and it's plugged in as you can. And so I'm a big fan of like trying to to throw our wrench in this techno hacking that messes with all of our brains. So trying to put your phone

in gray scale. I love it. Another one is that when you feel that twitch in your brain that says I need this, don't click by right away, right like, ask yourself, does this fill a legitimate need in my life? If you're Samantha's partner? Is it just another vessel with which to drink coffee or liquids? That do? I already have a vessel or several vessels that make that need.

I throw it out and then like, notice your emotions, like when you feel influenced, really asked, like, do I feel the need to buy this because it is serving an emotional need or feeling an emotional hole that I have? And what's that about? You can really just start small, just asking isn't that interesting? Be curious about the emotions that are sparked for you when you're using social media. My therapist always says that judgment and curiosity cannot coexist.

And so rather than being like, oh, you just are so bad with the money, you just throw money away, You just cannot stop shopping online. That's judgment. And so when you're judging the way that you feel, when you're judging your emotions, you can't be curious about them. Curiosity is how we get to some place better and like move forward, and then lastly, learn to love what you

already have. You know, I spent so long chasing micro trends and quick hit trends that when I look at my closet, there are things in there that I love that I don't even really know where they are. I don't even have access to them or see them because my closet is so full of the stuff that I bought that I didn't even really think about, and so it makes it harder for me to love the things that I actually do have that feel good and so

the things that I really do value in life. Because there are plenty of things that I bought where I'm like, oh that was I do not regret that choice. That was a goodbye. It makes it harder to really appreciate the things that are good byes and have them stand out when you just buy so much crap that you don't even really need right organized, because you will find that thing you love that you forgot about for two.

If you do that, you shop your closet exactly. Yes, during the pandemic, I remember there were a couple of times where I was like I really really want this thing, and then I would look through my closet. I already have that thing. Yes, I can't tell you how many times it's happened. Where'm like, I'm like doing reruns, Like I like, I'm already in reruns on my closet, like what is this? And then like, if you're me anyway, I wear like the same T shirt like for an

entire week. So yeah, buying new clothes just to wear your uniform every day? Like what are we doing? Right? Yes? Well, thank you as always for it for bringing this topic to us. It was very informative for me. I've not heard of this. This is amazing. I love it. I love it. I love it. Yes, where can the good listeners find you? Well, you can always tune into my podcast on this very same network. There are no girls on the internet. You can follow me on Instagram at

Bridget Brian d C. I will not influence you. I can't promise that I will never, but you know, like we gotta eat. No, I'm just kidding. On Twitter at Bridget Murray I love it. Yes, go go check that us out if you haven't already, listeners, thank you again Bridget for coming. We love having you, can't wait to have you again. Yes, yes uh. And the listeners I who would like to contact us, you can or email. It's definitely a mom Stuff that I Hurt Me dot com.

You can find us on Twitter at moms to podcast, or on Instagram and TikTok what that stuff Mom Never told You? Thanks as always to our super producer Christina, Thank you, and thanks to you for listening Stuff When Never Told You. Protection by Heart Radio. For more podcast my Heart Radio, you can check out the radio app Apple Podcast, where you listen to your favorite shops m