Sobriety, a Serious Relationship, and Couples Counseling w/ Joseph

Therapy Roulette Consent to Vent / Trauma disguised as comedy / Therapy Roulette: Consent to Vent / If you dont have problems, then youre likely repressing sh*t and you should find a therapist / (Whos not me)

Hey, rouletters, welcome back to another episode of Therapy Roulette, where I give you consent to that. My name is Michele Baci, I'm your host. And this episode is one I've been waiting for. Since the impetus of the podcast, I interviewed my boyfriend, Joseph, mostly because we went on a vacation together this week, and I needed a guest. But he's a great guest. We really get deep into a few of his personal stories, including sobriety and his therapy experience. And I think he's very honest and

I wish we could stay here longer. But LA is calling me back. We have a house that we have an offer on that I have to go attend the inspection. So I'll be flying home soon. I suggest you go to Lake Tahoe. If you ever get the chance. It's so beautiful. I'm gonna come back as soon as I can. It was a nine hour drive from Los Angeles. But you know what it was worth it. I hope you enjoy my conversation with Joseph. He is a civil engineer. He likes to 3d prints designs. He's very funny. He's a

guest interview / a friend for you / strangers whose issues are relatable / guest interview / They're the voice that's new / this person has problems and they don't mind discussing it, but they still need a therapist / (Whos not me)

Joseph. Welcome to my podcast.

Thank you for welcoming me.

I see the look of fear in your eyes. How are you feeling at this moment?

I don't know.

You don't know.

I don't know very stuffy.

Is that just because we were listening to the audio and you thought he sounded stuffy?

No, I can actually tell I sound stuffy.

Alright. I think you sound okay.

I'm sure it's fine.

It is. Try to relax and take a deep breath. So this is my podcast. But Joseph is the audio engineer and he is taking control of the night. She's taking control of the audio. No one's watching. You can't relax.

I mean, yeah, you're watching me.

I'm always watching. And that's scarier than other people. So Joseph and I are dating. We've been together a year and a half. And in quarantine times. That's like, what do you think? Eight years?

Yeah, it's been eight years for sure.

It feels like eight years. I know him too. Well, and I think he knows me too. Well, also.

Yeah. It's definitely been eight years cuz we already went through counseling.

Yes, we just did couples counseling, which was great. Like,

I think it was about two months. And then they kicked us out. They said you're done. Now get out of here. Yeah, like you guys are two functions. I don't think we can help you. I think we just completed the course but we had never understood the timeline for the course. I think the course is dependent on how shitty you are.

I don't know because the shitty ones usually Don't last in counseling because they break up.

I don't think everyone who goes into counseling with a bad relationship breaks up, maybe. I think there's probably recoverable moments,

or at least teachable moments.

Here's the question it was this your first time in couples counseling?

Yes, absolutely.

Yeah, it's kind of an adult thing to do.

Yeah, I don't think I would have. I mean, you're the first like, person that I was in a relationship after I got sober. So you were like, the first person who I wasn't just like, fucking around with, I guess, the first. I don't want to say that. Because like, you know, I dated people I cared about, but at the same time, I was dipshit. As a

high person.

Yeah. It's just like, I just didn't care about anybody other than myself.

And then I'm the first person you talk to as sober frame of mind.

No, no, I, I dated. At least one other person, but not like, we never really were like, in a boyfriend girlfriend situation. It didn't get to that level.

No. And then you're hitting five years sober in the fall or you're ready. Five years sober. Five years sober. So you're gonna be six years sober next fall? Yeah. Okay. Which is a big milestone.

Yeah. So I waited about like, two years before I had any relationships,

because they say don't date the first year of sobriety.

Yeah. And I think I did like getting a very, like, minor relationship with somebody. But I realized it was a bad idea. We both met in rehab. So

I remember you. Yeah. mentioning that to me? Yeah. Probably not the most stable choice of people in rehab.

I mean, you're just both very vulnerable. And so that's, I think, why like people get in relationships and rehab is because they're both like, photobiol at the same time and see each other vulnerable. Yeah. You know, you're just like, kind of finding somebody, especially like, if you're a code pattern person, which I am. So like, I think like, trying to find somebody, like go through that with you is like what you want, but you know, it's not good. Because everybody says it's a terrible idea.

You also don't go to rehab with your crew friends, you're there alone. Oh, yeah. Probably desperate for someone to talk to

you. They're alone, there's a bunch of people who are also very messed up. And it gives you a good window into how your life could be worse, or better. Because, like, around you, there's people who are much worse off than you and other people who are like, Oh, you think you have a problem? That's cute. Yeah. And that's kind of like, the mentality of a lot of people in rehab is like, you

Like, we completely when you go to tune up your car, you just get some weed tune up for your body.

I know, it's like, it's like medicating yourself thing. And I know a lot. A lot of people who are have drug addiction problems are self medicating. And some of them have, like, you know, underlying problems that they never dealt with, or they are just they just need to be in that state to function. I guess. I don't

know. Cuz you're running from something?

I think Yeah. Yeah. A lot of people I'm certainly there are people that aren't but and are like functioning, but I feel like you know, anybody who uses is escaping. But it's just like what level of escapism is healthy because like, some levels of escapism are fine if you can, like be a functioning member of society and like, keep up a good job and like stay functioning and like all that stuff. But I was never that

Yeah, and as a California Boy, that's probably a hard reputation get. So I can imagine, you know, You probably weren't proud of it at some point.

Yeah, I was really into concentrates. And so you know, and I had a good supply of them that was cheap and basically free. So when you have that kind of connections, it's like, you don't have to limit yourself. You're just like,

you need too many people.

I need too many people. And then I like, you know, other stuff that I don't really want to talk about.

Yeah. But you went to rehab and got perspective.

Yeah, I mean, I mean, back when I was using I was the kind of person who would be like having edibles every day. Especially during the end.

That's too many

are like once I made myself so they'd be really strong.

You're kind of coming off to drug dealer Sq me right. Now. Let's, let's switch characters.

I mean, yeah, I wasn't I wasn't really ever drive to get there.

I just imagining like smoke weed every day pop edibles every day. That's never something I could do. Like, I, I freak out when I lose too much control.

Yeah, I know that about you.

So I can't even like fathom that reality. being out of control all the time.

Wasn't out of control. I mean, in my mind, it was a stabilization method that I was good at Intel. I.

Well, I'm glad you did the sobriety thing.

Yeah, I mean, I learned a lot about myself. I mean, I went to rehab three times.

Has the past year in the pandemic been any kind of tests for your sobriety? No,

not at all. Actually. The thing that's hardest for me is like real life where you're like going out and like, you know, like coming to this casino.

Yeah, we're in a casino right now on vacation.

Yeah. And coming to this casino, and like going downstairs and watching people gamble and get free drinks. And, you know, like, just like going out.

You would never choose to go to a bar.

I used to go to bars. You know, before I met you to play pool and meet people, but I didn't drink you know, I'd have like, ginger beer.

Yeah.

Um, but no, like, I didn't go to breweries and stuff because I really used to love drinking beer. And I had an uncle who have an uncle that is like a brewer. And he makes really, really delicious beer. And so I kind of got into that, like, when I was younger, you know, really into, like, tasting beer and learning about, like, how it's made. And like, what goes into making sour beers and stuff like that? Because that's, that's what he was really into.

Yeah. The nerdy part of it.

Yeah, the nerdy part of it, where you're, like, learn how to like, boil oats and put it into a hot pot. I don't know, like all the words, but how do you engineer beer? Yeah. And I was really into that. And I thought it was really cool. And then I was like, as soon as, like, he got into that, and he let me like, come into that part of his life. I got sober. And so like, you know, when my sister was getting married, we brewed I think it was like six or eight beers for and it was like all of

What's the pre process stuff?

Do you like the mash? Which is basically like, boiled oats. It's like,

it's like this.

It's like really watery oatmeal with like,

okay, it's like a Starbucks oatmeal.

Yeah, well, I don't know. I've never had Starbucks oatmeal. But yeah, it's very watery. Like, like, it's just like, if you were like put some oats and some water and then drink that water. That's kind of what it was like with some sugars in it. And you could kind of like extrapolate what that wasn't. And I you know, I still smell like your beer, everyone. So I when I see you get a sour or something. I'm like, Oh,

because you have to substitute something. Yeah,

so like, I would end it like when when I would smoke weed. I wouldn't drink a lot. I'd have beer every once in a while. I would never really get drunk. But when I didn't smoke and I was still drinking, I would get drunk. So obviously I just can't do anything because I'm not very in controlling things that manipulate my brain chemistry.

Yeah, you were saying the other day how you govern your life based on a lot of rules. But I think you just maybe think of them as rules more clearly rigidly. I think everyone has rules. I have rules for myself.

Yeah, but I have, like, absolutes in my life, which are different than rules because like rules kind of are breakable. on a lot of levels, you can like break rule every once in a while.

Sure, you have like a, a once a year, like teaser,

I have absolute satify. If I break that rule, or that absolute, then I'm shit out of luck rehab again. Or, you know, I could die. Like I could spiral out of control and get worse, because, you know, the last time wasn't very fun.

Yeah. What do you think about America legalizing weed?

Um, I think all drugs should be decriminalized.

Because they all have benefits?

Um, well, I mean, you know, we take all kinds of crazy medications that are worse than most of the drugs we take. And a lot of it has to do with more the prison industrial complex and like, you know, putting people that are less than that, or don't have as much going for

It's like in the show, we're watching, Your Honor. Like you see how easy it is for, you know, a young black kid who just is trying to probably make a few bucks get thrown into jail? I don't know. I think that's a big part of the weed problem in America is like a lot of young people of color get thrown into jail. As soon as they're 18 for selling a few.

Yeah, I mean, I mean, there's no difference in between a doctor prescribing you a, if I couldn't, then you know, or going to the going to the hospital and getting morphine, it's the same as heroin. There's no difference in it really. You know, I take I take stuff for HD, which is essentially just meth in a time release controlled form that has a very controlled dose. And I can take that as a sober person, because

And you've been, you got diagnosed with ADHD as a kid?

Yeah, like in first grade.

So you've been on some medication since first grade? No,

I stopped taking all that kind of stuff when I was in sixth grade. And then I started taking it again in college. And after I got sober, because I wasn't very good at focusing. And I was on other medications, too, that were kind of like, good. It was a balancing act at the beginning of sobriety for me.

What do you think about therapy?

Okay, I love therapy. I mean, like, as somebody who's been to rehab multiple times.

Oh, yeah. Cuz you said you tried out all the therapies and rehab, all the different types.

Well, I went to like a really cool program that was outpatient therapy. And it was basically just like, a lot of group therapy all day. So it's like going to a job, but all you do is group therapy for like, six hours every day, all Monday to Friday, all group therapy. And like one I can't remember how many times a week you do one on ones, but there were one on ones too.

What do you think of group therapy is that more difficult?

Um, it's a balancing act, I feel but what it's really helpful for, especially in like the rehab kind of situation or like drug abuse or like any kind of abuse, like any kind of trauma to is very beneficial. Sorry, the alarm went off. It's good because you have like a group of people that can. Like sometimes you sit in therapy, and group therapy with like in a rehab setting, a bunch of people can really bring out stuff that you wouldn't say like somebody might bring up something that

you've climbed the ladder.

Yeah. And I wouldn't have done it without sobriety. I would be like, fucking around all the time.

Yeah, cuz it kind of kills your ambition to just be stoned 24 hours a day or chasing some escape all the time.

Yeah, it's, it's just like being an engineer does not cope well, with smoking weed on your lunch breaks?

Yeah, I think it would, you know, throw off the engineering plants.

I mean, I don't think it's that it's that, like, your managers and the people around you. Because, like, if I could, I don't know, back then I thought if I could, like, get a, like a dose of marijuana, what marijuana is, like, every day, it'd be like, good for me, but it's not. It's, you know,

it's numbing. I think it's numbing. Yeah, it's

absolutely numbing. But it's, there's, there's more to it than just numbing. Because like, you know, it helps with my ADHD. It helped us it helped with a lot of the stuff that I have. And, you know, it was self medicating that stuff. Instead of taking Adderall or Ritalin or vyvanse whatever it is. I was smoking weed. And that's what I saw it as, like, a tool to you know, that when I first got my medical card, I was 18. And my mom would miss me to get it. Because I had kidney stones.

Yeah, to medical reasons. I had

like legit medical reason. And it was the only way to really like, it wasn't the only way I could go take like like a Vicodin or something like that. But I was like doing concentrates instead to like cure to the kidney stone pain, which had helped help to relax your body. Because with kidney stones, like the big thing is like getting your body to relax so that you can pay them.

Yeah, it's like the way you got hooked on weed. It's like you got addicted to a painkiller.

Yeah, basically,

especially as a young 18 year old. Like, how are you supposed to manage that?

I mean, I was I was addicted to it before then. Certainly, like I started smoking when I was 16 or 17.

You heard it here first. Marijuana can be addicting.

Oh, absolutely. You can't get addicted to it. I mean, especially stuff like concentrates. It's it's really like mimics heroin. You get withdraws from it. You get the sweats. You like have trouble eating. There's like you have like psychotic episodes. Like there's all kinds of crazy things that happened with coming off of that level of heat. It's a psychotic, so I mean, it might be a very small psychotic, but it's like it'd be like you taking an anti psychotic medication. It's the same thing.

Yeah. They see when you stop smoking weed after like smoking it a lot, you have the craziest dreams, because your brain is changing.

No, it's not about your brain changing, it's about your sleep. Because when you're smoking weed, you don't actually go into this certain cycle of sleep.

The weed blocks you from it.

It's hard to like say how it works, because it's not an exact science. But they say that it doesn't get you into the deepest. You don't go into the deepest REM cycle smoking weed.

I don't know. I'm glad you're sober. I like you better for it.

I like myself better. So that's the important thing.

Yeah. And you tried out a bunch of therapies in your rehab since now you're doing therapy? Present day. How's it going?

Yeah, so after we did our, I've been wanting to like pick up therapy again, because I haven't been to a therapist and about two years. Maybe three, but I think two, I'm not sure. But now I've went into more after going through the Gottman method with Michelle be with you. Um, I kind of realized that I had some triggers from like past traumas that I went through.

You kind of stole the show of couples therapy.

Yeah, cuz I have like, gnarly

problems. Our couples therapist made it so much about Joseph and like, I was fine with it. But also I was there too. But she was like, Joseph needs more attention. And I'm gonna give him all the recommendations. And I was like, Okay.

Well, I mean, I have like, I think it's called C PTSD, complex PTSD, from like, multiple traumas growing up. And at least that's what I would think I have. I have a lot of

you've traumas to work

out. I've got a lot of lettered things in my butt. That's one of them. And so my littlest brother's started seeing a sack. He was on your podcast, I think.

Yeah, he was on the episode. early early on an episode about Burton k CDs,

and EMDR therapy. Yeah, and so he started doing EMDR and he really liked it. And he suggested that I tried out. And I just started it, so I can't really I think it's really interesting, the, like, tapping thing is, it's I'm doing EMDR eye camera, but the the tapping thing is but

he was doing it for like a month or so a little over a month.

I think I've had like five sessions maybe. But it's kind of like all over the place. It's it's really interesting the way that I'm doing EMDR it's, there's another thing it's it's like these little tappers that are in your hand and they like oscillate between both hands, they switch off and you can feel it in your brain it's like ticking like in between your behind your eyes kind of thing it's weird but it but it like leads you down this like it's like like a crumb trail of just

That's short for dashboard.

Yeah, like, you know, the gauges are and stuff but the whole thing it goes across the front of the car, and he would buy like one that needed a little bit of work. And then he'd fix it, repaint it, and sell it for, you know, a couple 100 bucks. And you'd make good money on it, you know? And it was really interesting as fun. And I brought up all these memories of doing that. Yeah, in the session,

these are things you would think about now as an adult, unless someone is talking about them? No, but it's cool. You can access them through EMDR. Like, yeah, the sensation in your hands. A part of your memory?

Yeah, it's just like kind of leading you? I don't know, it's very interesting.

Is it weird? Because your therapist is the same therapists your brother uses? Is that weird for you?

No, I think it's good in, in and in cases of trauma, especially when it's family trauma, and associated with your family, for the therapist to kind of know a little bit of background story. Because it can you know, the therapist can kind of see the family from multiple angles, and draw connections in between the memories. he or she's not really going to tell me about what's going on in sac sessions or what, what? Yeah, the other way around. That's not how it works. But

it almost helps her understand you a little bit better.

Yeah, because there's more perspective.

It is weird as I continue to, like grow in our relationship, as I'm dating you for longer. And I get to know your family better. It's like I know more and more of the whole picture of Joseph. And it's interesting as the pieces come together. It's weird because we live in your hometown.

Yeah.

So I feel like I know too much about you. Sometimes.

You don't even know the surface. I don't know. It's really hard. Because you don't know anybody from my previous life.

I don't know your past. I don't know your present.

I've met people from your previous life. You've met like one or two people from my previous life, but I've met most of your friends.

Are you talking about my previous life before I met? You

know, just like, yeah, yeah. Whereas like, you don't know anybody that I

you haven't met most of my friends, you've met some of my friends. You're like made friends. I have a lot of preference.

Okay, let's move on.

My friends are spread out throughout the country.

This is very true, you have a lot of friends.

But sometimes I'm telling you stories, and I'm trying to, like give you an idea of my past or my where I come from, by telling you stories or about people who are my friends. And you don't know who I'm talking about. So it's like, I hope you're able to grasp what I'm saying in these stories.

I am Yeah, we'll see.

The test is coming out. Well, I'm in therapy now. And I also was inspired to find a personal therapist after couples therapy. And it's just been phone calls with this therapist, and I feel like she's supportive. And she does tell me to take care of myself, which is something I don't do. So she serves a good purpose. But not getting that much out of it. So I don't think I'm gonna continue with this therapist for too much longer. Yeah, I

mean, I feel like if it's not like, therapy is to challenge you. If it's not challenge you it's not like worth it to me.

And she's telling me anything I don't already know.

Yeah, you don't really want like a pity party or like, lecture.

Yeah, I don't need another like parental figure.

Yeah, whereas like, I kind of do need a parental figure sometimes. Yeah, it's, it's interesting. My previous therapist, was like a guy and he, he's very like, good dad figure. He has perfect family. loving wife the whole the whole nine yards, and he was pretty cool. serapis This is a woman who's also

did she seem together? Bless you. Last year,

she's also a recovering addict. Oh, yeah.

What was her advice? I don't know. You just know she was in some kind of.

Yeah. Harder. So for me that for sure. Harder stuff.

Do you just say that about everyone?

No, she said the hardest. she'd

let me know if you need a break.

I don't need a break. We can keep going.

Well, if you need to blow your nose. Um, okay, well, I'm glad it's going good for you. I feel like you're a couples therapy was mutually beneficial.

I think we both learned a lot about each other.

I think you just started stealing the show toward the end. And I was like, I feel left out. But she would talk to me too.

It's hard.

I just wanted to address our communication. I feel like our communication is vastly improved. Absolutely. We're much better at fighting now.

Yeah, last like second, sir. minutes. It's a it's not like, you know, the timescales, much less I feel like

yeah, cuz I am not good with dealing with confrontation, I feel like when we would argue I would be upset all day.

Yeah, it would ruin your day, I remembered like, I'd come in the room, like hours later, still be upset and be like, God, I fix it. There's no way to fix it. But now

I'm better at talking out and addressing what's really making me upset and communicating it. Because no one tells you how to effectively communicate your needs, your wants, what you're really thinking. Like, you have to go to a couple therapists to figure that out.

No one, no one's watches, you know, they don't teach you anything. Now, nothing relevant.

So we were just attacking each other on the regular and that's why I would cry so much.

wouldn't say attacking each other. But I'd say like more about like triggering, triggering each other.

Well even like doing the you statements by saying like, you left the dishes in the sink. You didn't park the car on the right side of the street. It's such an adaptation. Yeah, yeah. Whereas now we're trying to like more effectively use I statements like,

which is really hard. I thought you moved the car. It's pretty hard to actively, like,

it's hard to reframe the way we talk.

I mean, that's not the hard part. I think it's just like making sure you do it. Like, it's really easy to start off with you. Especially when you're upset.

And then we can both be defensive. We both have the same. astrology signs and competitive. Yeah. You don't think that we're both Scorpios that has anything to do with it?

I mean, yeah, but like, whatever.

Joseph rolls his eyes, it totally matters.

I guess.

When you're a Scorpio, it matters because you're both so strong headed.

very shocked at it. Yeah. Yeah. But passionate as well.

Yes. But when it's bad, it's bad.

Yeah, but I don't think like, we've had any like, fad. Like maybe one really serious argument.

I don't know. This is my longest relationship. I don't have to compare too much else. Short term relationships.

We're getting close to mind. To your longest relationship.

Was it two years?

Yeah, I think so.

We'll be there soon.

A train wreck.

Well, I hope that's not how we end.

Oh, my audio looks like it's too quiet. But I think it's fine.

I think you're just getting into like your podcast voice.

Yes, probably. Probably.

So we're taking a big step together. We're buying a house.

Yes, this is a very big step.

And I feel like it's brought out a lot of emotions and paranoia. frights

Yeah, I think I think it's really stressful. So it kind of brings out all the words extremely

stressful.

Yeah, it's a lot of money. Yes.

All of our savings. And it's weird that we're making this decision together. Because we, I mean, we're used to operating as individuals as far as like finances and life decisions.

And the only way you can kind of buy a house in California is together anyways, does it make sense otherwise,

at our age at 30? Well, I

mean, just like with our level of success, I guess.

Well, how do you feel it's going so far? We have a house offer on the table and we might, we might

go we're in escrow. Michelle. We're in escrow. Well done. We are in escrow. Currently.

We'll see if this house works out. I I'm taking it day by day.

Yeah, I just don't want to lose that. 16 $100 It's not a lot, but it's like, it's a lot. It's a lot. Yeah.

Anything above 20 is a lot to me. Yeah. It's 800 invested for the inspection, and 800 invested for the appraisal.

Yeah. And that's basically all we lose. If we get past this, and we're like, screw this whole thing. They can't really see basically, cuz you just said it's a lot of money. Yeah. But it's better than losing 20,000

or the price of the house, which is nearly a million dollars.

Yeah. But it's, it's an investment property. So it's a duplex. So you can't prepay. So the million dollars because it's a little different. Because like when when when somebody hears you're buying a million dollar house, you like what the fuck? But uh, you know, we're buying a duplex, or renting out one of the units so we can actually afford the mortgage.

We're hoping internet is profitable at some point. But for now, we're just trying that. So these are 16 $100.

Yeah, yeah.

But I think it's definitely made us like a little bit more cemented together. Like, oh, this relationship is going to another level because we're buying a house together.

I think after living with each other non stop for 12 months plus. Kinda like, if you can do that. I'm pretty sure. It's gonna be pretty easy.

Do you think you've seen it all? With me? No,

not that I've seen it all. It's just like most relationships don't see each other that much.

Right? The perk over

over five over five years? Because like, if you think about it, most relationships spend most of their time together on the weekends and past six o'clock.

Yeah, if that. So like six to 10 if I was doing my own hours a day, my like, two years ago life working in TV production, I probably see you a few days a week.

So like not it's not a full week. It's like, it's like you basically every week spend three, three days together because it's 20 hours at night on the weekdays and but now 48 hours over the weekend.

Yes, we are spending the maximum amount of time together. But we're also like, it's not like we're doing nothing all day. We're both working all day. So yeah, but there's that degree of separation.

It's a little bit but it's not like

we're both working from home. Yeah, we're

both working from from our one bedroom apartment, from the apartment where like our desks are essentially connected.

We've passed this test.

And we're, we're in a cubicle together.

It's not even a cubicle. It's a blank desk.

Yeah, so

I'm down with that relationship test. I want more space. I hope we got it.

But we're gonna have so much space, we got a pool table.

You know, we started out quarantine with our desks actually connected as an L shape.

And then with the recap running into each other with buttered chairs,

or or you kept running into me.

Whatever wasn't it like

you would have these phone calls or meetings with your work people. And then you would back your chair and to me because you got excited or like, wanted to speak up more back. You're cheering for Michelle. I forgot she's there again. And then I had to say let's chop this desk in half. Let's separate the L shape. It's been better ever since.

I'm worried that we're being too loud that our neighbors are

upset. We're just talking. I know. But we're in a fancy ass hotel.

Who cares? Yeah.

Don't stay in a hotel if you don't want to hear a podcast recording. We're not even being loud. Okay, loud. Is you in a work meeting?

That's true. Have you heard about the latest Tesla? That's not my work meeting.

That's my that's my passion. Okay. Did you see Ilan did this on the internet with the pigs?

That's me talking to you.

That's you talking to anyone? Okay, whatever. Well, okay, so what do you think the biggest asset is of, of therapy.

So biggest asset is of therapy.

What's been the most advantageous?

Well, I think the biggest thing for me in therapy is not like, repeating the past, the biggest thing for me was not to be like my parents, when I raised a kid, and that was, that's like, the biggest thing. And now, why I'm going back to therapy is so I can kind of try and remove some of my triggers that make me angry or upset, or like, make me lose control.

Yes. I think that's a good goal. And it's funny how I think a lot of therapists see that in their clients. They're like, Don't you want to be better than your parents than your family? Like, whatever generational trauma you have, or whatever your parents infringe into you, when you were growing up? That might not be positive or great. You could fix that in therapy, you can address it and learn how it's been an obstacle.

Yeah.

Is it just because you want to be a dad? You bring that up?

Yeah. I mean, that's like the most and, like, I don't want to script kids. And then like, also, I don't want to ruin my relationship with my wife.

Your wife, you mentioned your wife.

Yeah. I mean, that's, that's like, because like, you know, kids can kind of pliable and can seem impressionable. Yeah. But they can see, they can still succeed with this still a little bit of like, bad parenting or like, Miss parenting. But like, the hardest part is making sure your relationship stays healthy. At the same time. It's all the subtle things they pick up on. That's what you want to be addressing in therapy. Like,

why do I have this disorder? Or why do I have this infringement on my thinking or my behavior? Oh, it's because like, my parents did x, y, z when I was a child. Yeah. And thank you for mentioning your wife. I was giving you a hard time earlier. Whenever you talk about the future. You're like, my kids, my kids and like, what about your wife, Joseph?

Obviously, that's a part of it. But

the kids come first I get it. It's okay.

That'll come first. It's just like, that's what I'm worried about. I'm less worried about ruining our relationships and messing up my kids.

Well, the relationship always needs maintenance.

Of course.

We're working on it.

I think that's easier than kids.

We're getting so much better at talking to each other. Do you remember how we met the details?

Yeah, we've been over it a couple times recently.

Tell the Therapy Roulette listeners.

We met on hinge. And then we went to

we only exchanged a few messages.

Yeah, that was my mo on hinge.

He asked me what my hobbies were. And I was like, Oh, boy. I like to read and write.

I think you said comedy, though.

Maybe if I was being honest, then I would have said comedy. Sometimes they don't say that. Oh, people don't like that.

I think I was attracted to that. I thought that was cool.

You were talking about woodworking and Burning Man. I remember you misspelled Burning Man.

Oh, yeah. I don't care about spelling. I'm always typing too fast to care. So I just like type, you know, you've seen how I text. You're not a words person. No, I don't care about spelling. They get the point.

We exchanged a few messages.

And then and then we met up at like, matcha tea place or something. You asked me out. I asked you how and then you said that? Yeah, let's go here. And we went there. We got T and then we walked around the downtown area. What I liked about our first event goes near the art district.

Because downtown was between my place of living which is North Hollywood and your place of living, which is Long Beach downtown was in the middle. Even though Long Beach, North Hollywood are so far away.

Yeah, I mean, I drove for the new probably. Yeah, but that's fine.

But I'm surprised we even met up because there was such a great distance between us.

Yeah,

you weren't fazed by it?

No, I mean, like, it worked out.

Yeah. Some people don't want to drive further than like, a block. You know, they're like, if you don't live within five to 10 minutes is not gonna work out.

I mean, that's kind of stupid. It's limited thinking. Yeah, I mean, who cares how far away you live, as long as it's like drivable, and an hour or two

Yeah, yes, I was really

put in some work. Like, it's great if you're like close to each other, because then you don't have to move ever. But like, you don't have to move in faster, whatever, whatever it is right. But like, I mean, if you meet somebody you meet.

What I liked about our first date was I didn't really pre plan it. Like we agreed upon a day. And then I had something to do that day, I had like a background acting gig. So I didn't know when I would be done. And I said, I'll text you when I'm done. And then I vaguely knew the location, the tea house, but we really decided everything like the day of

Yeah, that's kind of how I do everything.

It's how I I never operate that way. So it's funny how that worked out. I always pre plan.

I don't plan

sometimes I leave it up to the date. They'll be like, Oh, you're planning the date and you do it. But this time, it felt like everything was open ended. And we we had smoothies at the tea house.

We didn't even have the matcha tea.

We didn't have the matcha tea. I found that later. You don't like matcha for you still wanted.

Do you still agree with the mochi? I assume they had that like bow buy or something like that. So just get boba. I like that, like bubble tea or whatever.

We ended up getting like green fruit smoothies.

Yeah. Which is fine. I like that.

And I remember we sat down and talked and then the smoothies were gone. And I thought, okay, where did we go next?

Yeah, I walked around. Yeah, I think we went to like a weird art exhibit.

Yes, it was supposed to be a museum, but it didn't feel like

so that wasn't even the museum. I wanted to take you though. We still haven't gone to that museum. That was like some weird it was like a weird like college exhibit for like students.

But you didn't know you were gonna take me there that day.

No, no, I did. I looked it up while we're sitting while we're walking. Remember, I was like trying to find it. I thought it was nearby. And we went to the wrong one

cuz we decided to walk around downtown, whether we wanted to go to his clothes. And you were thinking what's around here?

Yeah. And then we just like walked around this like area. And then there's, I think it was like an alley that we walked through that was near there. And there's a bunch of little stores and we walked in the store with overpriced plants. And I was talking to you about how much the plants were overpriced.

That's when I realized you were cheap. Not in a bad way, but that you wouldn't waste money on something frivolous?

Well, and I was like, more economical. I think I'm multiple times on that story is like I could make that way cooler.

And you do make a lot of cool stuff.

I tried to you're a woodworker. Yeah.

I don't know if you've been on dates where like, your date has something planned. That's so elaborate, and you feel like you have to go along with it. Like I've been on dates, especially in New York, New York's very walkable, where the guy would have like three destinations planned out, he's like, we're gonna start here. We're gonna go here in the land up here. And you go and it's a

I think as a man, I have a totally different experience where I'm the person planning this.

Would you ever plan all that for a first date? It's too much. Did you three locations on a first date? Don't tell your date, you're going to three locations.

At most out plan like two. Usually, I'd only plan one and then I'm back. Hey, depending on where we were in their area, I'd be like, Hey, is there anything you want to do around here else? Or I'd have a second place planned.

Would you do cut off the date early if you weren't feeling it? Absolutely. See, I didn't have the control. Or the just one day where like, I would always like try to humor them.

I learned this lesson you don't pick up your day.

On the car in the car.

Yeah. And the first day Yeah, that's terrible idea. So I picked up this girl one time. I drove all the way to LA to like North Hollywood or something. And then and then we went to the

you're just throwing out North Hollywood cuz I live there.

Near Griffith Observatory ish. And we drove to Griffith Observatory. And we parked and by the time we parked, I was like, I looked over and I was like, I don't think this is gonna work.

Like you told her that.

Yeah, I straight up was like are like, Are you good like that she's like, yeah, I guess.

Did you drive her home? Yeah, I didn't get out of the car to walk around the observatory.

We got out of the car and started walking up the hill. And I was like, I don't think this is good. Like, like, I think this is a waste of time. Just like yeah, we both

I think I'm just too nice to people. So I would wait The whole date

was over. I hated everything about

well, at least you can recognize that

she worked for a nonprofit. And she was like, trying to tell me how nonprofits are great. They're not.

Yeah, I don't want to get into this with you. But I remember the story. Yeah. You're anti nonprofit.

Yeah. You know, I learned an interesting thing today that I was forgot to tell you till right now. How much money do you think goes towards homeless people in California? From where? From? California? The government from the state? Yeah.

Give it like a percentage.

How much money? The dollar amount?

I'm not good with guessing. Just guess what would you government assisted amount?

Would you think with 100 and 100,000 people on the streets in California? How much money

200,000

to 500,000 600 million.

600 million goes to 600 million

to homeless year this year. 600 million.

Isn't that good? Is that not enough?

I think it's a scam.

Why is it a scam? Joseph, you've very short time to explain. Because they

don't want to hear talking to get into it. It's just it's just a podcast I was listening to

Okay, don't make this a meta podcast.

Okay, it's fine.

listeners, please do your due diligence and research how much the state of California gives to homeless people because I

send me messages about homeless people I want I want to know,

I would love to learn how to help more homeless people.

I want to know where that money is going. So I know where a lot of fucking money

were in Lake Tahoe right now.

Oh, yes. beautiful out here.

And it's a nice change from Long Beach because we haven't seen a bunch of like, homeless people. soaking up the

sunshine. Everything's clean. So clean.

But we did see one crazy hippie lady screaming toward the mountains and flailing her arms as if she's with her arms.

She was like, orchestrating, like, she was Symfony. That's what it looked like. She was like, moving her arms and like, head up in the sky. Like the whole the whole thing. She's conducting a epic symphony of mountains in the grass.

It looks like some witchy behavior.

Yeah, she's very Wiccan esque.

So you think our first date What? Well?

It didn't end very well. I remember.

We talked too much. I think

yeah, I think we got too far into what if what we

were looking at politics for them.

Yeah. Which you should never talk about on a first day.

This is my theory is that I've told you my favorite app was OK Cupid. But you and I met on hinge. And okay Cupid is very politically skewed. Like a lot of the questions are about politics or about ethics. And I would like read into those questions a lot and really analyze them. But on hinge, they don't do that level of questions. They do more icebreakers. So I think it worked out that we met on hinge because I didn't overanalyze your profile beforehand.

It's too much information sometimes.

And I like the person you are. I think we do have different political beliefs. But it doesn't really affect her ethics or the like.

I think it just leads to good conversations.

questionable.

We definitely have interesting conversations.

Toward the end of the first day, it got a little heated.

We're talking about how I don't like didn't like to vote.

You didn't like to vote and you also said something negative about Hillary and I just felt personally attacked. But then at the top.

Yeah. I was surprised that you called me back after that.

I think I texted you later that night.

I think that you did but I was surprised still.

I contemplated my feelings and I felt I liked you.

Okay, well, that worked out great.

We've since learned don't talk politics over dinner,

no politics at dinner preferences. I probably like almost no politics.

But you can't not talk about politics at our current Dean Ah, I can't ignore politics.

I love that your your parents philosophy is just not to talk about politics at all. Like they don't know who voted for who ever. That's what they say. That's what they say. And I believe that.

I don't know. What I like about my parents is they don't try to influence anyone. They all go to their house and watch CNN and they're like, you know, they'll stop by in the watch for a little bit. They don't engage and they don't debate they just kind of observe

interesting

be you and We like to debate and argue.

Yes. But it's fine. I mean, mix for good conversation. I

think it's never boring. That's what I like. And then because we're not cut from the same cloth, like, I'm very liberal and you're more anarcho capitalists.

I would probably say fiscally conservative.

That's kind of a throwaway phrase or anything. No, that's not an all encompassing political view. I just like one little section. I just

don't believe in the government.

The fiscally that's only a part of politics.

It's a big part of politics.

And aka anarcho capitalists, but anyway, dating you, does broaden my empathy and my perspective to understand other points of view. So thank you.

You're welcome.

Although I don't pretend pretend to understand these terms. You label yourself.

They're interesting. I think

you either hate Mitch McConnell, or you don't care.

He's a fucking weird, dude.

At least we can agree on that. Do you have any questions for me? I don't know. How are you liking podcasting?

She's interesting.

I feel like you've developed a persona as we've turned on the microphones.

I don't know. Not a bad one. I thought I would this conversation would last that long. For some reason.

He thought I would kick you out.

No, I just didn't know like what I was going to talk about. But it was actually good. Like, I think I talked about a lot of stuff.

I think he opened up

here probably

no questions for me.

Why did you start this podcast?

Because I've been a fan of podcasts for quite some time. And I've always wanted to try podcasting myself. And I think as a, as an artist, I see the art I love, like writing. And I want to make it myself. So I've listened to a lot of podcasts over the years. And I've said, Why can't I put that out

into the world? I love the concept when you came up with a good concept.

Thank you. You've been a big support system. We're up to the roulette wheel portion and how fitting because I'm gonna play roulette in the casino later tonight. Oh, yeah, she's

gonna gamble. All of our escrow money away.

Now. our finances are separate because we are not married. I'm gonna spin the wheel for you. Oh, what's your favorite film? Or a favorite film?

Bronson is my favorite film.

I've watched it with you.

I love that movie. Tell us what it's about. Bronson is about the most violent criminal and the most violent prisoner in the UK. She's notorious.

He was a true story.

Yeah, it's a true story. He was in solitary confinement, a lot of his stay in prison. But he was like, a very weird guy. Very strange. Like slightly artistic in the way that he approached the world. He loved the prison. And he loved fighting people. And he's very passionate about it. No,

do you love his character because he's an outcast outcast from society.

It wasn't about being an outcast. I liked him that's part of it. But it was more about his like very rigid ideology. Which I guess is interesting thing to like about somebody but he's very single minded.

What was his ideology?

He's just like fighting a lot.

Like he believes in punching someone.

I mean, it was just like every time a you know, a guard would come in and his cell he would be prepared to fight them to the deaths.

So survival.

Yeah, but he was like Raw and like, you know, there's just like one scene where he like I I don't know if it was like poop or whatever but he like like, yeah, it's gross. He like put it all over his body it might have been grease like, I don't know where he got it but he had like something stored underneath his mattress and he put it all over his skin. So he was like all slimy got

Well, he's existing just, he's his own universe.

Completely. There's no one else. It's just him.

It's a weird movie.

Yeah, it's really weird.

I can see why you like it.

It's unpredictable. Complete it's complete chaos. I just love chaos. A little too much underdog.

And you'd like you like a lot of macho stuff like fighting manly stuff.

I guess

you need I wouldn't say you like fighting Do you like woodworking? No, I don't really like watch.

I would watch MMA but it's not like something I do. I don't know. Yeah, like I guess I like macho stuff like woodworking I tools. Cars.

Like fire. You've manly hobbies. My favorite movies are all romantic movies like Eternal Sunshine is one of my favorites. Notice that it also they have to have a psychological bent.

Yeah, you like thick the quirky like weird ones that are like one of the people is in like dire straits. Yes. And then met somebody and they fix their life.

Well, we haven't watched Eternal Sunshine together yet, but we watch garden seat together, which is one of my favorites. And that is a dude coming out of being on lithium. And you see him like enter reality for the first time and he needs Sally Portman and then it's just a love story. Yeah, but two people connecting and they're like, oh, if we're together, it makes the world better. Watching a movie like that it gives me hope. It also like shows you like people can

it's a great movie.

What did you like about it?

I tried to remember the plotline is no, I liked it.

I think I had to tell you it was quirky. You're like what would you call this type of movie?

Before I watched it with you,

as you're watching it, okay. I remember telling you like they label it quirky. There were a lot of cool shots too. It's a cool directing that Zach rafted in that movie. Like the guy wearing the shirt against the wallpaper.

Oh, with the matching shirt to the wallpaper. Yeah, there's a lot of good shots.

Do you spend one more?

Sure podcast. quick one. Quick,

this one will be are you more analytical or more creative? And why? Oh,

I don't know. I think it was split.

You think so?

Yeah.

Why do you think so?

I think I'm analytically creative. Why? I like patterns. And geometry.

You're very picky about design. I moved in with you told me if throughout most of my furniture in so many words.

Um, no. He got rid of one couch. And I didn't like your table

and my bed frame. And my desk chair.

I had made my own bed frame that took six months. your desk chair was a piece of shit. You now have a $800 desk chair. So I think you got a nicer desk chair out of that.

Okay, okay, but why are you Be creative.

I don't know, I think I think I like patterns. Like, I don't know, like, the kind of art I like isn't? I don't know. I'm definitely like a very creative person. But

do you have analytical qualities I would have? If you asked me that question, I would have said, You're totally creative. 100%.

Okay. You do have analytical qualities. I would like to think I'm analytically creative, but

become a spreadsheet master recently.

I think I want to be analytical, but I'm creative.

But you can turn it on analytically.

Yeah, I guess. I'm not a human calculator or anything. But I do like a very polar thoughts. See, they're black or white? Yeah.

And in woodworking, you can precisely Yeah, design something

in my head. A lot. So nice. I don't know. What about you.

I think my head is analytical. Like I like to analyze situations and possibilities. And I'm very imaginative. But I'm way more creative. Like, if anything, my creativity is a flaw because I just get bored by real life all the time.

I see.

But I wouldn't trade it for anything.

I read a lot of books as a child, and this is what I've become.

You're a great person.

Thank you. So are you. And on that note, thanks for doing the podcast.

It was fun.

I'll talk to you again soon.

I hope so.

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