Session 410: Can't Get Enough with Kennedy Ryan

at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you love listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to be a substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for joining me for session four ten of the Therapy for Black Girls podcasts. We'll get right into our conversation

after a word from our sponsors. If you're on BookTalk or any book obsessed corner of the internet, especially amongst black women, you know that there's always a Kennedy Ryan book at the center of the conversation. Kennedy is no stranger to crafting characters that feel real and fully formed, and her stories linger with you long after you've turned

the last page. Her newest book, Can't Get Enough Is No Exception, the third and final book in her Skyland series explores shifts and family dynamics, deep love, and the kind of healing that feels both tender and powerful. I'm excited to be joined by best selling author Kennedy Ryan to dive further into her writing process and talk more

about how she brings these stories to life. If something resonates with you while enjoying our conversation, please share with us on social media using the hashtag TVG in session, or join us over in our patreon to talk more about the episode. You can join us at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com, slash Patreon. Here's our conversation. Thank you so much for joining us today, Kennedy.

whatever it is. But if I feel like my storytelling could add to that discourse, could shine light on it, then I gravitate towards, you know, working inside of it and writing about it. And I write romance, you know, and sometimes people are dismissive and don't think that you can groat some of those heavier topics in romance. But I feel like romance is the perfect genre to have difficult conversations, to have conversations people are avoiding because it's

such a digestible, palatable genre. You know, it goes down easy, and also there's a guaranteed heavily ever after. So a lot of my inspiration comes from things that are happening in the world discourse that I want to have. My background is journalism, and so a lot of my creative process is really fueled by lived experience. Before I start writing a book, I'm always reading something. For example, we

talked about the book that I'm writing now. This particular heroin has a lived experience that with certain mental health, mental illness, it's not my lived experience. So I've read like five memoirs. I usually do a lot of interview, usually ten to fifteen subjects for each book, somewhere around there a lot of them. If it's a medical condition, I'm talking to doctors who treat that, I'm talking to people who live with it, I'm talking to psychiatrists, I'm

talking to people who actually know about those experiences. And then after I've done all of that kind of research and it's really the cornerstone, then I start to build out this fictional story that grows out of real lived experience. And so that's really what my creative process always looks like. And the variables will be what is this condition or

what is this what is this vocation? This whole series, the Skylind series, And you know, we're talking about book three of the Skylind series, which is called Can't Good Enough. It's the last book of this series, which I'm kind of like bittersweet about. But the whole series, honestly, I've written with a lot of intention, and a lot of that intention was around mental health. Each book is looking at different mental health conditions, it's looking at different lived experiences.

For example, the first one, the heroine is recovering from a pregnancy loss, and she is in a deep depression and at the same time, they just lost a loved one, she and her husband, and he has not ever dealt with his grief, and so he's been very resistant to

therapy and they end up divorcing. And really that whole book is exploring the role of therapy in depression, finding the right medication, and then with him realizing that therapy is a pathway to healing, and for this particular story, that he's not going to get his wife back untherapized, you know. And so one of the mental health conditions we're looking at in the second book is autism, which I have so much personal experience with. I'm an autism

mom and have been for twenty years. Autism Advocate led a foundation for families to have children with autism. So it was really special for me to write about autistic twins and what that parenting journey looks like and what the community looks like when it comes around and integrates and includes those with autism. And then in this third book, we are looking at Alzheimer's. This is a heroine who

is a caregiver for an aging parent. It was really personal for me because my grandmother was living with dementia at the time. She passed away literally the week after I turned in the edits for this book, so it kind of felt like, wow, you know, timing. But I interviewed my mom, you know, as one of her primary caregivers,

along with a lot of other people. But this whole series has really been looking at how we as women, and even more specifically as black women, how we take care of our mental health, how we address issues of mental health, protecting our peace. And then I think another thread is how we are there for each other, because the sisterhood and the friendship is really rich in this and how we support each other through everything.

I was just like, Okay, this is what I'm writing, you know. And I was interviewing people who had lived that. I was interviewing people who worked at shelters. I was interviewing all the pieces of that puzzle, and I ended up with a bald spot and I was like, how did this happen? You know, I didn't understand so much of that stress I was actually experiencing and holding on

too for myself. And that book was a real learning experience for me because I understood if I am going to be writing deeply into these subjects, some of them that have those stressors and those strains and those triggers, I have to take better care of myself, and I'm not always very good about it. But one thing that I myself when I was writing before I Let Go, which is the first book of this series, of course, that's a heroine who is dealing with depression. I was

myself diagnosed with depression. I don't advise writing a book about depression when you are dealing with it yourself. But I learned to take care of myself during that process. Obviously, well not obviously for some people, I guess, but I ended up getting on antidepressants and other things that really helped me with my depression was physical activity, getting outside

and now I'm walking every day. You know, first of all, there's just so much good stuff that happens in your body when you walk, the way your brain responds to it, the hormones that are released, and then it clears my mind. It gives me a space that's just my own. I am a special needs mom, I am a full time writer, and I have other roles and sometimes it feels like there's no time for me. And that time when I'm walking. I walk for about an hour every morning. It's like

so mind clearing. It centers me. And in addition, to all the benefits, you know, physically, and then I pray. I grew up as a person of faith and it's still a big part of my life. My faith and what that looks like for me is very centering, meditating. Just making sure that I feel connected to something that's powerful, even beyond myself is a big help too. And my husband. The thing is, I am not very good sometimes about taking care of myself. He is much better sometimes it

taking care of me than I am. I'm about to go on a tour and it's like ten cities in fourteen days, and it's very intense, and the last time we were on one. He always travels with me, and he is the one who's like, Nope, she's not doing anything else. We're done for the day. She's going home. Where's your water? And he just kind of helps me. So I think having people in your life who also look out for you because I'm a little bit of

workaholic by nature, and he knows that about me. So having people who know those things about you and help take care of you is very important, at least it is for me. Yeah.

this going to do my brain? What is this going to do to my But honestly, I was at such a low place in my own life. I was having panic attacks. I was barely able to get out of bed, you know. And my husband was the first one to notice it. It was during the pandemic, so I assumed it was just it's the pandemic. Everybody's living like this, and my husband's like, no, I think it's something else. I was supposed to be writing before I let go and I had not been able to. I thought it

was writer's block. I was talking to a writing coach and she was like, I think this is more than writer's block. I think you should talk to someone. And I went through three therapists before I found the right one, which is also what the heroin experience is in the first book, because I wanted people to know sometimes the first one doesn't take you, know, and you got to

keep looking until you find the right one. And when you're at such a low place in your life, it takes a lot just to take that first step, and it can be so discouraging when you take that first step and then it's not the right one. You're like, you're telling me I have to take another step with another person. And when I found the right one, she was pretty quick to say, I think that we're dealing with depression, and I think you should talk with a psychiatrists.

I think we should get you on medication. And I remember one of my family members saying, you know exactly what I thought, you bir just pray about it. You don't need to take no pills. But I did. I started taking an antidepressant and I felt so much better, like pretty fast So for me, the improvement in my mood and in my state of mind was worth dealing

with those questions, dealing with those issues. And I had been so blocked creatively by depression that for me, I had no thought that this could make it any worse. My book was six months late at that point, and when I had my first session with my therapist, I said, I have a book to I just need you to I just need I need to get this book done, you know, I just need you to fix this so

I can get my book done. And she said, I really don't care about your book, and I'm like, I need you to care about my book at six months late, you know, And she goes, I care about you, and I think that if you really put in the time, this could be the best book you've ever written. And that book was before I let go, and it changed my life, changed my career.

also very compassionate. She asked the right questions. She started asking me questions about my sleep. She started asking questions about hygiene. You know, some days I was like, I don't even want to goe out of a bed, take a shower. You know. She asked questions about what my eating was like, what my libido was like, which was nonexistent. She started asking the right questions and it didn't take her long asking the right questions to identify what was really going on.

And I will say this, I know that it doesn't have to be but she was also a black therapist, and that made a difference personally for me. I felt seen and understood. I felt like there were subtleties of my experience, especially as a black woman in publishing, navigating a very white dominated space. There are certain systemic barriers

I'm up against all the time. Having a therapist who understands those subtleties, the subtleties of what that feels like and what that looks like, and doesn't think I'm imagining it or take it for granted, but considers it in in our conversations makes a really really big difference for me.

with depression and then the grief. We're dealing with all these things. It's a late term pregnancy, Like there is all of this heavy material that's in the first book that I tried to be very thoughtful about and wrote in concert with therapist and people who live those experiences. And Hendrix kind of comes in a lot of times as comic relief. It's like, this is heavy. This is heavy. This is heavy. And then Hendrix pops in with something and you're like, Okay, I can breathe, Okay, I can laugh.

This is heavy. This is heavy. This is heavy. And then Hendrix again is like, hey, you know, we're still having fun. We're still here for whatever. And she also in those other two books was incredibly supportive to her friends and she showed up for them, and it was apparent to the reader that this is somebody who's like write or die, Like, this is somebody you want in a pinch if you're having a hard time, this is

who you want. And it was really her time to look to her friends to be that for her and so building her out as not just comic relief, not just the good time girl, but as a fully dimensional woman who has joy, has all this joy, and is so such a good friend to everybody else. You know, she has the rich auntie vibes. She is childless by choice. You know, she doesn't want to have kids ever and doesn't feel like she should have to provide an excuse, a reason, a trauma. You know, She's like, I just

don't want kids and that's okay. But she loves everybody else's kids. So this is a very warm woman who is there for everyone else. This is a story where she has to learn to lean on her friends and to lean on her family because her aunt comes in and helps her with her mother's care. It's too much for her on her own. And I really enjoy building this aspect out. We knew that she was a businesswoman.

We knew that she was running her own business. She manages celebrities, especially like reality TV star celebrities like think you know, housewives kind of thing. We knew that about her. But what we didn't know is her role in venture capital and that she and a group of her so wars had started a venture capital fund that was focused on black women founders. You know, we didn't know that about her. We didn't stand how committed to her community she was that way, and that was a lot of

fun for me to build out. I didn't know a lot about venture capital, and so the research for that was fun. And I started writing this right around the same time that everything was happening with the Fearless Fund, So that was very interesting, and I really dug into some of those themes of affirmative action DEI things that are very prescient for where we are now, and at the time I didn't realize how prescient it would be.

I wish it wasn't as prescient as it is. So a lot of those aspects went into building her character out, and then we see her as someone who for me, she's a plus size brown woman, and I wanted her to be the main character. I wanted her to be someone's obsession, you know, in a healthy way. I call it a chasing romance. Sometimes those are not the women we are seeing at the center. Sometimes those are the women who are the sidekicks, so that you know, the

funny best friend. I didn't want to treat her reductively. I didn't want to do that. I wanted to build her out in all of her dimensions, and then I wanted to celebrate her at the center of the story as the love interest and have this man who's incredibly eligible and who could have anybody want her. That was really important to me for women who are plus sized like me, you know, women who are black like me, to see ourselves at the center and to see ourselves

pursued and loved outrageously and called worthy. That was really important for Hendrix as a character for what it represented, and then for this story specifically.

big thing is I will never settle, you know. I'd rather not have a husband. I'd rather not have a romantic partner than have someone who doesn't deserve me. And so that has been her perspective. And so I knew that Maverick is going to have to be very special. I knew that he was going to have to bring it because Hendrix is not easily impressed. She doesn't need anything from anyone else materially, but what she needed was someone who could be a soft place for her to land.

And the thing I loved about Maverick is a lot of times when I'm writing romance, there are certain tropes, you know, that romance readers enjoy, and I like to introduce those tropes but then kind of subvert them, like kind of twist them around a little bit, like the billionaire romance so big right now, and I'm like, yes, okay, let's do this. But what if he's a billionaire who

gives outrageously to historically black colleges and universities? What if he's a billionaire who sees how marijuana, you know, has been criminalized in the past and specifically weaponized against black men, and decides, once it's legal, I'm going to create a fund, you know, and we're going to create generational wealth with this now that it's legal. Like, what if we had someone who is a man of means but also a man of mission, a man of purpose, who supports his community.

What if that is what the billionaire trope looked like. And so that's what Maverick is. And I'm a basketball girl, you know, So Maverick is also you know, he's someone who wants to be an owner, you know, of a professional basketball team, which is not something we have enough of where we see black men who are ownership in sports. So that aspect is there in the story too. So I love writing aspirational characters, not perfect, flawed, but also ambitious, yes,

but vulnerable, you know. And Hendrix is that, you know, she has these vulnerabilities. And when you are a dynamic, powerful, ambitious woman like Hendrix, you want to be vulnerable with someone who is going to appreciate that about you and who is going to be that soft place to land and so I think that's that's how I formed Maverick, thinking about what she would need and who is someone who she would feel like she wasn't settling for, because that's her big thing is if I'm doing okay all

by myself, why do I need you? You know? And he showed her all of the soft things, the love, the protection, the respect, and she wanted someone who would respect her dreams and her ambitions equally, which a lot of times for powerful women that can be hard for men who don't check their own egos or who want to feel like women need to be dependent on them. So he needed to be someone who's very secure, you know, in his own manhood and in his place in Hendrix's life.

is friendship and sister love. These three women think of themselves as platonic soulmates, you know, they think, these are my people. We're in it for life. Anything they need, That's what I'm gonna do. I grew up seeing that, and I didn't realize it, I don't think until I got deeper into the series and I realized those are the kinds of friendships that my mom has and that she surrounded herself with and seeing the importance of community and sisterhood, and I wanted this story to reflect that.

And I think that we're in a time where community is more important than it's ever been. You know, when you can't depend on some of the systems that are supposed to be there for you, or the government or whatever it is, having an inner circle, having a community, having friends is tatamount. And I think that's what this

big part of this series is about. And I also talk in this series about loving yourself, especially in the second book, about how loving yourself is the foundation for all those other loves you know, and really leaning into all about love by Belle Hooks, really leaning into that as a text that's a foundation for the series, but building on that familial love, sister love, and friendship, and then of course romantic love. So that's kind of how

I approached it. But it's it's esteemed, you know, in a way that sometimes sometimes people don't see as much in romance because of course the emphasis is so much on romantic love. But I also think that there's so much we learn about people when we know who their friends are and when we know who their family is. Like there's to me that is a part of building character, is who are your friends? Because that also tells me

a lot about what you value. It tells me about what you enjoy, what makes you laugh, who you are when the cameras are off, or when you are not at work or you're not you know, you can do the code switch and you can completely relax, like who are you then? And I think one of the best contexts for that is true friendship. And so there's a lot about character that we learn when we have that, and so that was really important to me.

And Hendrix is kind of that, like black Girl, Magic Girl, And there's this one passage where she talks about black Girl magic and she talks about how it's not a wand it's work and that so many times we're magical out of necessity because we have to be to survive, and that it's resilience. So in thinking about that, It's so funny because we are in a place where, especially Black women in America, the overwhelming majority of us had a vision for this country that didn't come to pass,

and that was very disillusioning and very painful. I think so many of us grieved it and are still grieving it. And it's interesting to see as the protests break out that we are not showing up the way that we

have before physically, like in the streets. It was so funny because someone posted it was in Atlanta, which I've spent twenty years in Atlanta, so Atlanta feels most like home to me, but it was in Atlanta, and it showed this protest out in the street and these three or four black women like having mimosas or something like looking out the window like Okay, I see you go off.

You know, Like we are in this space where and I am constantly finding that balance because at the same time that I want to protect myself and I'm also a little indignant that certain things have happened when we tried to warn people, and we have always been the engine for resistance in this country. It is interesting to be at a place where we're like, oh, we're going to be soft for a while. You know, we're going

to get our fans out. We're gonna, you know, learn a new dance, and we're gonna do all these things. But at the same time, I am also a mom of a special needs son, and so I'm concerned about medicaid. I'm concerned about medicare for my parents. I'm concerned about the world for my queer friends. So it's like balancing how do I express resistance in a way that is safe for me right now? And I am finding that.

I think a lot of black women are finding that, and every it looks different for everybody, and we all have to figure it out for ourselves. But it's so funny because I had written the first version, a couple of versions of this book, and we were in the final edits and the election happened, and I changed the dedication the day after the election, and I changed the dedication to this for the ones who have used your magic to lift, protect, and illuminate everybody else. Rest is

your new resistance. Rest and shine My loves Rest and shine. And I think that's kind of where we are. You know, there's this balance of resting, resisting, but also shining polishing ourselves up, taking care of ourselves in the ways that feel right for us as individuals, creating community, making sure

that we are supporting each other. Those bonds in our side, our community are, like I said before, more important than ever, with so many systems that are supposed to create any kind of equity, are supposed to create support being stripped. For me, I can't check out completely because it's not just like this country's going to you know, pot or whatever. It is specific lives of people I love that are

attached to those things. So I think it's figuring out how you want to resist and what feels right for you, but then also protecting your peace. And I think that Hendrix's story kind of embodies that. We see them that the and we see her courtside with like multi thousand dollars tickets, and we see her on a yacht, you know, and we see her on a private plane, like we see her balling and iceed out. We see all of

those things and like that life. But then we also see her when it is the right time and when it is her choice, on the front lines of resistance, specifically around black women in venture capital and fighting for more for her community and for women black founders, black women founders. So I think her story is that balance. We see all of that soft life stuff, but at the same time we also see her when she's ready and on her term, standing up, resisting fighting.

not stopping. I'm not stopping, I'm not slowing down. I'm not compromising. I'm not stopping what I'm doing. So we can do you know, whatever you do, I might not be following you like she needed a partner who understood that. And I think it is more common than not that a lot of women we have big dreams, big ambitions, and when we get married, when we have children, it changes the dynamics for us in a way that it

doesn't traditionally change them for men. We are the ones who potentially end up with pregnancy leaves that maybe slow us down in our career tracks. We tend to be the ones who bear the burden of taking care of the home, of taking care of the kids. Now that you can have a partner who helps with that, like absolutely, but conventionally, historically women have borne the brunt of that, and it can slow down our ambitions. It can for

some of us, sideline our dreams. And I think it's really important for you to ask questions about your own dreams and your own ambitions and the thing I love about Hendrix too, and all the women in this book is that they're older, older than most romance novels. Like most romance novels, a lot of romance novels, you know, there are people in there twenties and maybe early thirties. These women are forty years old. They've lived a little,

they got some good miles on them. But that also means Hendrix knows exactly who she is, and she knows exactly what she wants from life. And sometimes when we come together with a partner and we haven't taken the time to really know ourselves, we haven't taken the time to really explore our own ambitions. We haven't taken the time to really figure out what are our dreams and

how are we going to accomplish those things. Sometimes, when we haven't spent time with ourselves to understand who we are and what we want, when we get with a partner, some of that can be absorbed by their dreams, by their ambitions, or by the shape they want to see us in. Hendrix is like, I got a shape. You know, this is who I am. I'm not going to try to change you. Don't you try to change me? If we can exist together if we can love each other

as we are. That doesn't mean that you don't ever compromise, but there's a respect for how a person is made. There's a respect for what a person ambitions and dreams are. And I think that's what we see with Hendrix, a very strong sense of self that and she talks about it. She's like, you know, in my thirties, I was in the streets looking for what, But now I'm settled. I know who I am, I know what I want, and I'm not going to change that to be with someone.

I want to be with someone who wants me as I am. And I think that's something that we as women have to ask ourselves. What are we willing to compromise? What aren't we willing to compromise? What aren't we willing to settle for? How do we protect our dreams and our ambitions and at the same time align ourselves with a partner who loves and respects us. Those are some of the questions that kind of rise to the surface

in this story. And when we talk about children, it's kind of self eliminating a little bit, because there are men who are like I want a family, you don't want kids, You're not for me. And Hindus is like, well, I don't want kids, so you're not for me. I'm not for you. Deuces cool, have a great life. And it's so interesting because when I was talking with some friends when I was first writing the story, and I

was telling them that she was childless by choice. And this was before, like Hendricks has been childlessed by choice since the first story, which was in twenty twenty two, and so we didn't have all of the cultural conversation that we've had around child's by choice over the last year or so. In the same way, that's just who she was. But I remember some of my friends going, oh, are you concerned that people will think she's cold? And I was like, why why would people think she's cold

because she doesn't want to have kids. And I'm like, oh, wow, you think that you think that a woman is cold if she doesn't want to have children. And they're great people, you know, but it's so baked into us that as

a woman, that is an expression of our womanhood. And I've been telling people we are not our wombs, you know, Like this country is so fixated on defining women by our wombs, our reproductive rights and whether or not we have kids and all of the things, and I'm like, hands off, we are bigger than our reproductive organs, Like why are you defining if I'm cold or if I'm warm, or if I'm generous or if I'm kind by if

I have children. And there's this part of the book where Hendrix talks about, you know, I may not have kids. There are women like me. We may never have children, but we are godmothers, we are aunts. We are pushing our love out into the world on our terms. Let us love people the way that feels right for us. And so I think that's something that all of those questions I think rise to the surface when you're reading this book, or at least I hope they do. I wanted them to.

I curious about? What do I want to learn? And I hope that if it's something that's going to be compelling enough for me and exciting for me to learn, it would be exciting for our readis to learn. And then artistic urgency, which is there's something happening right now in the world that I feel like needs more discourse,

more shine. Is there an intersection between my work, my storytelling, and this thing that's happening right now in the world that will illuminate and amplify that discourse, and if so, I'll write it. So those are kind of those these three element that are present when I'm deciding what I'm going to write, and that is a me process, that is a process that insulates from anyone else's voice. We

talk about writing to market. I don't write to market, which is when you look at trends and you're like, oh, I'm gonna write this, I'm gonna write this. My career is dumbfounding, do you know what I mean? Like, because I don't write to the things that are popular, and sometimes I write things or people are like, is that even romance? You know, it feels like I'm often writing

against the grain. I don't you know sometimes understand how my books have become even a little popular, except that there are people who are drawn to the things that I'm drawn to, which is I like things that feel like real life but also with joy. And I hear people's opinions all the time. You know, when you talk about BookTalk, you talk about TikTok. I love TikTok, like I'm on TikTok all the time, but I don't want

to see myself on TikTok. You know. I don't want to see people talking about me TikTok, but it's inevitable, do you know what I mean? Like, every time I go on TikTok, the algorithm knows, oh, you're Kennedy Ryan. We're going to show you stuff about Kennedy Ryan, And I'm like, no, I don't want to see any of it. I don't want to know, you know. And it's so funny because there is this I have intentions I always talk about. I say this a lot. I say that

I don't just release a book. I send a book on a mission, and I think about storytelling from a missional perspective. There's something that I want that story to accomplish. It is written from various specific belief systems, and it has intentions. And when you're writing like that, when you are crafting a story from there out, other people's opinions don't necessarily come into it, as it's intrinsically insulated from that.

And then when it's out there and I've kind of formed it, I'm like, well, what what kind of bone could I throw? You know? A reader like, oh, he could be a millionaire. But the story, the core of the story does not grow from that, oh, like in a storyline before I let go. One of the things I was really concerned with, which is the first book in the series, was destigmatizing mental health, specifically for the

black community and then most specifically for black men. And so we see a man who is resistant to therapy and then over the course of that story understands, oh, I need this, like I won't survive without this. How have I made it this long without this? And he has this journey from being completely resistant to it till by the end like knock emergency, I need to talk

to my therapists, right. And there are readers who are like, oh my gosh, why couldn't Josiah just have from the beginning been like all in on therapy and he's not my book boyfriend. And I'm like, well, I wasn't. Really, I don't care about that, you know, I don't care about book boyfriends. I care about that journey. My intention

was that journey. And the reason I did that is because I know there are women whose partners are resistant to therapy, women who would read that book and be like this, this is what I'm talking about, baby, And when I tell you, so many women message me. I just gave it to him. I just gave it to him and said, read it. And now we're in therapy. He's in therapy. I call my insurance company, see if

they'll cover therapy. That is what I wanted. If he is your book boyfriend, that is a side effect, that's a byproduct to me. I don't write to those things. I'm not thinking about those things. But at the same time, in that book, where I was dealing with all of those really heavier themes, and I had all these intentions, and I sent the book on a mission. You know, there is this point when they go to this hotel

and it's the only one bed trope. You know. It's like they go to this hotel and they're supposed to have two rooms. This is a classic romance trope, and it's like, oh, there's only one room. There's only one bed. And as soon as a romance reader sees it, they're go, oh, it's the only one bed trope, you know what I mean. So it's like, oh, gosh, this book, this was only one bedo, you know. So it's like I can thread those things in. But a reader readers desires are never

dictating what I write. So that's kind of the balance is, Oh, but look, I can give you only one bed. Oh but look, I can give you this really cool meet cute. Oh look, but I'm going to write what I'm going to write and it's not going to be affected by what people want.

own way. So I think there's a strength, but I also think there's a vulnerability in all of these characters. And part of that is to say we don't have to be strong all the time. We should be able to be flawed, we should be able to have weaknesses, we should be able to have pain that's acknowledged equally and at the same time, you're going to see a

partner because it's a romance. You're going to see a partner who loves that woman outrageously, who respects her as an equal, and who makes her feel esteemed and celebrated. I tend to write from the margins to the center. And what I mean by that is one of the hallmarks of my books is what I call sceneiness, meaning I like to write about women who are not used to seeing themselves at the center of narrative and culture.

So I like to write about black women, brown women, disabled women, chronically ill women, fat women, you know, like neuro divergence, like those are not always the center of the narrative. So I like to write from the margins to the center. So you see that a lot in my work. You're like, oh, okay, I see you. You know, you right in the meadle. Are the main character. You're not the sidekick, you're not the funny best friend. It's you.

So you often see that kind of like someone who you're not used to seeing at the center of narrative and culture, pulled from the edges to the center. You're going to see a woman who doesn't settle, and even if she settles at one point. Part of her journey is figuring out that she doesn't have to. When you see a character like Sulidad in the second book, The

Pink One, this could be us. This is a woman who's married to you know, I'm not going to cuss on your show, a pos, all right, married to a pos trash garbage, and when he shows his true colors, you know his true nature, this deep betrayal. She has to start all over, and she has to start all over.

She has three kids, and she's now going from being a stay at home mom to being a provider for her home, maintaining this house, building a career, all of this, but a career that's grounded in what she's gifted in. And she's like, I have given him so much of my power. So that whole journey is taking that power back piece by piece and rebuilding herself into someone that

she and her daughters can be proud of. So every journey looks different, but it is that how am I taking my power, claiming my power, keeping my power, sharing my power where it's necessary. And I think the other thing that you'll see a lot in a Kennedy Ryan novel, is I really see my work as this intersection of

swoon and social commentary. You will see that in most of my books, you know, whether it's destigmatizing therapy, or discussion of all the things that happen in book two with her and rebuilding her career, or it's you know what we see in book three, which is obviously what does it look like now for us as a generation caring for aging parents, but also the social commentary of what does equity look like? Why is equity worth fighting for?

Why is it still a valid conversation for marginalized people to still be demanding more than what we have been given and what we've had opportunity for. Why is that still a valid conversation? And all of those things are going to happen in the context of a romance novel. You know, I've had commentary on land grab. I've written books that are commentary on climate change and the voter suppression, missing and murdered indigenous women, intimate partner violence, like my

catalog is all of those things. So I really see a lot of my work as this intersection of swoon and social commentary. How do those things go together? And it's, like I said, for me, romance is the most digestible genre, so it goes down smooth all of a sudden. I'm here for the kisses and the swoons and the spice, and I'm like, oh wait, I'm asking myself real questions. I'm in my journal right now, like what happened? You know? And so that is a hallmark of my work.

to go. One of the things I'm most proud of about this particular campaign is that we my publisher and I are partnering with black owned bookstores and we have a pre order campaign that is specifically for black owned bookstores, and when you buy, can't get enough through a black owned bookstore. It's linked to my bio. You click there, it'll show you all the black owned bookstores that are participating. There are certain things that you can only get from

the Black owned bookstore pre order campaign. It's like full color art, it's you know, sign book plates, it is a bookmark, it's all you know, it's all very specific, and you can't get it anywhere other than our Black owned bookstore campaign. So that's one of my favorite ways for people to buy these books. And I did that for my last release, which was real, and we're doing it again for this one because a lot of times we are begging black authors, are begging retailers, we are

begging the big stores. We are begging people please carry our books, Please give us visibility, please make space for us, please get us on your shelves. And black owned bookstores twenty four to seven, three sixty five amplifying our stories, supporting us as creatives. And so this is kind of my way of saying, you amplify us, I amplify you. I want to prioritize black owned bookstores and I want to incentivize readers to support and buy from black owned bookstores.

with your questions and suggestions for the podcast. If you have movies you'd like to suggest, or books you'd like us to review, or even topics that you want to hear us discuss, drop us a message at Memo dot fm slash Therapy for Black Girls and let us know what's on your mind. We just might feature it on the podcast. If you're looking for a therapist in your area, visit our therapist directory at Therapy for Blackgirls dot Com slash directory. This episode was produced by Elise Ellis, Indechubu

and Tyree Rush. Editing was done by Dennison Bradford. Thank y'all so much for joining me again this week. I look forward to continuing this conversation with you all real soon. Take good care, what