Paolo Nutini

St. Lo, Apple Music. Paolo Nattini, incredible artist. Shhh. Come on. Takes his time, you know, definitely likes to exist in the shadows until he's ready to step into the light. As good things do. Likes a drink. Don't we all? As good things as yeah, don't we all? We do. Well we do. We do. Yeah. As does he. Went on a little walkabout in between tours and albums, lasted a few years. Really stretching those legs. Yeah.

Yeah. Like a good eight to ten year distance between his last record, Caustic Love, which I love by the way, and this brand new album, which is just incredible. It's called Last Night and the Bittersweet. It covers the most amount of ground I feel that any Palinatini album has done.

shows every side of his songwriting ability and uh it's just beautifully produced. Now Paolo when he first came out has this kind of media art rise to success and and again was very reluctant when it came to conversations or doing anything like that. He talks a bit about that in this conversation, you know, the things he doesn't want to do.

do is what we're about to share with you. But he and I have always seen eye to eye and always had good conversations. So I find myself on the right side of this experience with an incredible and somewhat reluctant superstar Paolo Nattini in a rare conversation talking about his new album and other things. This is the remarkable Paolo. When I first heard this song, you know, it was at the end of listening to the what is an amazing album palette.

It's so beautiful and it's so wide and broad and covers so much amazing ground. But that song Writer just absolutely I was pretty speechless when I heard that. Um I felt like anybody who's ever strived to communicate through art and realizes that it's both a wonderful pursuit but also at the same time kind of futile. Yeah.

You know,'cause it'cause it's like'cause it's like you can never reach everybody and you can never really ultimately make your point perfectly. I just feel like that song really summed up the the whole process for me. Oh wow. Well thank you for for listening to it. You know that's that's a that's the main thing. It's nice to see you then. You look well.

Yeah, you too, man. It's been a long time. I'm trying to think the last time we caught up was around caustic love and you've lived a life and I I've moved from the UK and a lot's happened. But um focusing on this album and and where it began and the whole timeline, Paolo, I mean

We're gonna get into that. My first question is just how are you now? How do you feel when you finish an album? It's it's so few and far between. I wonder how you sort of feel personally,'cause the last time you finished one and finished your tour you went walkabout. So how do you feel now? Ya no, I feel, I feel Happy to be back on tour and happy to be moving around again like I think every anybody would, you know.

Yeah. I'm happy to be back playing and and communicating with people that that that and and hearing from people what they think of the m of the music, you know, directly, hearing from people and seeing people's reactions are are something that that you you know you can't you can't get any other way than than playing a live show.

So yeah, and and also I'm trying my best to fit in a few wonders in between because that's I I I must admit it's it's where I feel. I do I do feel most creative and that I can think, you know, for instance I had a little bit of a gap there. um between shows and we went to do some recording. We had some you know, some try some new ideas in uh in Brussels.

where we go to a studio. We've been going there for the last ten years and I had a few extra days and I'd never been to Antwerp and I decided to to go there and just have a think and just walk about. And yeah, what a place. I also managed luckily to catch Iggy Pop and Thurston Moore who were playing in this tiny little jazz festival. I'm jealous now. I'm jealous now. I mean that's a show, bro. That's a show.

Yeah, the Thurston Moore group played played before Reggie Pop and it was one stage in this lit little park in Antwerp. It was great. It was I was lucky to be there at the time. I love that you went to that because if I think back to a song like Lose It. There's definitely some Sonic youth going on there. I know a lot of people have mentioned lots of different things when they heard that, but it's just that. that trust and willingness to find a r a groove. And

let that be the dynamic for the over the course of the song and not feel like you have to go hard left and hard right, you know what I mean? And I I feel like I hear I hear those artists in in a song like that or at least the way that they what they mean to you. But that song actually came about in Belgium, in that same studio that we were at and you know, we'd been kind of working away on two two s two other tracks and it got to about four or five in the morning.

I had a little idea on the base. When we met a suggestion sort of like, Do you wanna try some do you wanna try something else? Do you wanna try this new idea? And and I guess if that's met with anything but, you know, a grimace. Then it should be then then you you should really run with it, you know, because there must be something in it if uh you know, if if it's if if people are willing to indulge at that time.

after a full day of uh m sometimes banging your head against the wall. So I and it came about and most of what you hear in that song happened in that night which is great. We brought in some other players to do some other things afterwards. The majority of it came about that time. So there was

I guess it was we I guess we felt like we were in one lane and and I was on the base so there was only so far that I could take it when it came to left and right. I'm not uh Υπότιτλοι AUTHORWAVE Yeah but you got groove Paolo, you got groove if it flows through you.

Then it's it's for you. Whereas there are a lot of other instruments that, you know, require a lot more sort of um physical f practice and discipline and all to truly understand and then you find your your y you know, your personality in it. I've seen kids pick up a base. And the first thing they ever played was the funkiest, coolest sh I've heard in a long time, you know,'cause it's just it lends itself, I think, to something that's just intrinsically human, the bass.

Yeah, it's it's it's a very good instrument to make lots of happy little mistakes and happy stumble across things which I love. If I if I can be being constructive while making mistakes then it's jackpot, you know,'cause I'cause I'm forever making them. I I find like a lot of a lot of my favorite bass lines come from there's an album that I got, a compilation of music from Mauritius, psychedelic sort of music from Mauritius, nineteen seventy.

You know, early seventies. Yeah. It's a kind of style of music called Sega. music and and the bass lines are are my favourite to try and I I did a lot of that in the lockdown kind of you know in the lockdown period I sat and I played along with those bass lines and there's another band called Amanaz

Oh, they're amazing. I just sat around when I didn't have anything to do productively and constructively in music and I I started making playlist after playlist after playlist and I made a couple f uh you know from finding things like Minez where it was just like, Okay, there's something really amazing from that early to mid seventies to a point that was going on and

Some of the more you know, like far reaching parts of the planet. They were finding ways to record these records that have been unearthed. And this sh is the funkiest sh I've ever heard. Yeah, I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying writing on the bass as well because it does encourage you to to to not move around. You know, it's we're talking two three chords if you're writing on the bass generally.

And I think sometimes that's enough, you know, sometimes. But then again, there's other songs on there which contradict that on the record.

There's a lot of wonderful music on there. I mean, yeah, okay, eight years, we can all focus on time. I I feel like that I feel like if quarantine taught us anything is that we should probably not be so obsessed with time.

Yeah, I mean it just uh I think I think when you condense it all that eight years generally that kinda becomes four in a way of We do we toured the record for a couple of years, you d you then take away those two years where obvious people did um pr produce and release things at that time

I think for me it felt like I've been I'd been away from performing it so long that I thought that when I was gonna come back with something I cannot I I wanted to make sure that I could get out there and play it and have that. connection that I was talking about at the start of our conversation. But the main thing was that the whole notion to wanna do it again was w came about in that time because a lot of the negative aspects that I've thought about the whole

reality of it that that put me off doing it for for for a for a period of time. They that they soon sort of turned themselves into like, you know, positive motions and We've had a few conversations at at various points where you've sort of identified some of these challenges, but we've never really found the you've ne we've never found the conversation where d to to to kind of best describe it. And I guess

f for the negativity to ultimately find some kind of alchemy into a positive place. Y y you had to have got your head around it. So Throughout those times when everyone was kind of listening to your music and coming to your shows and you were finding certain things challenging, what was kind of what wasn't working for you? I guess the whole that whole process of

Here here's what I have, you know. What do you think of it, you know? Um I mean writing songs and making music are are essential for me. Th there's no question there was no ifs or buts about what about how I felt about that or or did I want to do that? That that that that wasn't part the problem. It was the exposure, I guess. It was the whole reality of it.

doing interviews and and taking photographs and all these different things that I became I I guess a little bit uncomfortable with and and and I felt like I don't feel it for me personally, if you if you're not one hundred percent wanna be in that situation and be on that stage, then I don't think you should ask people to come and watch you because I I it could

It takes a lot of time, effort and money for people to do that. I feel that if you're not ready to do it with conviction and and and passion, then you shouldn't do it. You know, you're just describing a balanced life. And I think to your point, we expect a lot of artists who get into this this trade of of of creativity and commerce.

which is like cool, you're on the you know, y all your dreams have come true. Keep keep going. And and it sounds to me like what you've figured out is a way to put your Life and what inspires you first, and will all, you know, be here or not, and you're okay with that.

Yeah. And I was writing and I was happy because no matter where I was and where I was wondering like he put it like which is true, you know. Um I was if I wrote something even if it was just a small m morsel of a song or a bass line Something that I felt was even a thread to pull on on a song. Like it was sometimes it came as a full song, it was you know, you're you're you're laughing if that happens and if you're and if you feel like it's as as good as it can be immediately then fantastic.

Um may it continue, you know. Alongside that, I was experiencing a lot of different things, a lot of different cultures, a lot of different people. I was I was building be it short term, long term relationships with people that that felt like there was a meaning and a and a purpose to the whole thing and and and it was a fulfilment to the whole experience. It never felt like I was

wasting time. I felt like I was exploring something. I was I was on a different sort of, you know, trip. I guess that's what I meant by the whole lockdown thing because I guess whenever I had that searching to do, I had to do it within the confines of of, you know, my my house and my garden. That was it. So there was nowhere to really and I and and with that came a lot less you know, interaction and distractions and and I guess that's what made me figure a few things out.

Help me with the timeline here, bro. You come off the road from Caustic Love, that album is you know how I feel it. an amazing record and the tour that followed was I love that album, man. I appreciate this you you you saying that. You showed some great support for it then. I remember coming to see you in the studio not long after it was released actually and you were you were so enthusiastic about it and it and it meant a lot. Thanks.

It's stunning bro. And and I mean every record you put out has been different from the last and and equally beautiful, but that album felt like, you know, okay, you could go away for ten years and I would have I'd have felt, you know, satiated as an ar as a fan, you know. So you decide then to go travelling. You decide to sort of I mean, the way it was described in an article was a one way ticket. So

Can you just sort of elaborate on that experience?'Cause it's something I think we all dream of having the freedom to do, especially once we grow up in Advertent Commas, and yet you found a a a way to break free and go do it. So can we talk a bit about that experience?

sort of drew a line in the sand with the tour and I'd decided and on that tour I'd went on to bigger stages which I'd resisted before. Yeah um Before that we'd had all different opportunities to take into different to bigger stages and I had ended up doing several nights

slightly smaller stages in order to compensate. Didn't feel comfortable doing those. And we did those and I went and that was um that was a great experience and But it also was uh you know, it w uh that had an impact that that I quickly realised why I'd resisted it and uh overcame that, but it still had a bit of a a lasting impact that that I took with me when we finished.

And I went over to New York and stayed with a friend. I was a bit all over the place, I remember that. To say the least. To say the least. And I was I was doing the kind of um I was I was I was playing this part of the jaded kind of drunk mm person, you know, in New York which in New York you can go there and you can you can you can drink you could stay in the barn d you know, morning till night

It's a great weekend. Anyone who's old enough to drink and experience that should allow themselves to safely have that have that that Ferris wheel ride. I got a little polite nudge from the friend I was staying with who uh Who it was kinda like, Are you sure you don't want to go somewhere else, you know? You sure Are you sure you it's like, you know, remember you know, Tulum near Mexico was on your bucket list, wasn't it? You know, you've not been there.

And he says and the and the beauty of Mexico is you know, from here it's only a few hours. If you wait till you go back to Glasgow, jeez, you're you're talking, you know, ten hours, eleven hours. Paulo, if you get kicked off the couch. In New York, you really fed up. I've couched served in New York for three months. People are open to it. I never got kicked, I got I got a little nudged That's a New York kicking, bro.

I got a little nudge and then that became the start of this like a little I be I became a little fascinated by what ha what happened there because I went with no I stayed for about eight weeks and in that eight weeks then we couldn't even scrape the surface of all the strange serendipitous things that then happened along that way and all the and all the uh new experiences that I had. This is in Tulum. This is in Mexico.

Well this was into them for a little bit and it's it started there and and and it s it centered itself around there but it it made its way over to different parts like um Bakala or Mahawal Um if it wasn't for something that called me back um at the time.

I I might I may well still be there. Um But that was the whole notion of like what could happen if if that became something that I focused on, if that became something that I just kinda let loose. I think before that I would have been I would have been very conscious that it was a s a holiday and that there was other things to do and that, you know, it would have felt irresponsible to just not worry about how long I was there or why I was there.

we mature we search you know, structure presents itself and we willingly embrace it because for for some reason we think it's gonna

It's gonna make things easier. You know, it requires a certain sense of courage to be able to walk away a without any p you know, a actual available architecture before you beyond whatever the day brings and whoever you run into and And for all of the great experiences you had, w were there any moments when during during your travels where you were like, I'm very far away from home right now?

That's that's what I was just about to say. That was the first time I realised that I w that that wasn't the case and God I was like looking at the at the s I mean, it was start, the poverty and the division and the class and again, you know, like getting to

going through somewhere like Peru or Bolivia. I mean it's it's it's really insane the the the the way some you know, the the meat the means that some people have there. I feel I'm really glad, you know, that I took that time because yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r yw'r an enjoyable thing as such it would have felt like um it would have probably felt like a there was an air of desperation about the

Yeah, it would have felt like you were trying to escape something, right? And this doesn't sound like an escape at all. I don't know, I don't know really, but I don't feel at the time and other stuff. you know, there's music that that that you've heard on this record that that was part of that journey. There's stuff that you're gonna hear in the future that was part of that journey and and uh

This is the point where I get to ask the question I've wanted to ask the whole way through since I heard this album, which was What song really conjures up? the most vivid memory of that time. Like what one, if you could pick one, was where the location and the environment and the vibe and the feeling was so perfect that it just presented itself and And it's pretty faithful to that experience on the record. One of the I like I say, one of the rare moments where something Comes out of nowhere.

Comes quickly and like yeah, like you said, it's it comes quickly and and uh I guess they all come out of nowhere really to uh to an extent. Yeah, but this one's this one's wait this one's been waiting for you. Well no. Just gotta make sure you whenever we things come along you catch them and or try to catch them or catch a memory or version of them or something.

Another place we record is is is in Valencia, Danny Castellar who who I produced the record with along with Gavin Fitzjohn, who are they are both without them, the m the the the album Without their talent and patience. I would it would uh uh yeah, yeah. But with Danny but so Danny's from Valencia in Spain and we um There's a little studio um in a in a place called Barchetta, which is about an hour outside of the centre of Valencia and it's up and it's nestled on top of all these orange groves.

And um and it's it's just got this kind of panoramic um Just just nature. Just it's beautiful it's a beautiful place. Um And I'm sat and we had this idea and I'm and I and I have it and and we I write the the lip song through the through the echoes and I'm I'm thinking about my my little sister. I'm thinking about my little sister, I'm thinking about, and I think there was something I think I'd, I think I'd not long before that, given, you know, being on the phone and.

You know, tjönare eller lamenting about something. And she kind of absorbed that all and helped and responded in the way she always does and sort of understood about it in the way she always does. And I w I I guess I was trying to g tryna translate what that meant to me. And it just came out and it was there and I was looking out you know, there's a glass window in the studio and the sun's coming down and I'm looking out over over that setting that I explained and I guess that could

could could uh answer the question that you asked me about a vivid um image, a vivid scene. Um when something felt quite cosmic, you know, uh but but very simple, very not complicated, not nothing not drug induced, not drink induced, just a sober Cosmic little moment that means an awful lot. Mm-hmm.

Have you been writing more like that? I mean I w last time we spoke we were pretty open about the benefits of You know, leaning into substances in a certain way and I know you like a drink, I like a drink. We've ha we've had a drink. Um yeah, she has to that she's like I wish I could. It's LA, it's eleven forty six in LA. I'm fifteen minutes away from appropriate drinking time. There's a small window in L right of appropriate drinking time as well. He waste the time.

Well at least at least when you're not in like a house party, you know. I have to say, and maybe this is this might I don't want this to come across as trite, but I mean it from a really, really beautiful place, y y y you just look fucking awesome. Like your skin is just glowing, your light in your eyes, the whole thing just feels like you're really present and the whole thing. So I sort of wonder kind of how you've sort of moved through that.

It's a very this is a very specific lighting rig that we have here. There's a there's a crew of about ten people around here with you know, make up their not here. I'm kidding her now. Uh no, um well look, I don't know. I if anything, the sun I always find the sun can hide a lot of sins and can help. I I I find like

generally I kind of get charged a lot by the the sun. I think it might be the Italian gene. But yeah, Italy we just did a little tour there and it was I mean, the sun is one thing and then there was that sun which was ferocious and angry

Do you still try to get beyond the sober cosmic experiences? Are you still searching for inspiration in in other things? I mean, I feel like you're ahead of the curve because some of the things that you were doing now are considered to be acceptable forms of psychotherapy.

So I mean, I sort of wonder, you know, whether whether or not you still dabble in spaces searching for different ways to uncover things in your mind or whether you're kinda like where's your head at in terms of the way you move from the reality to the spiritual to the substance?

Well I tell you what I don't do now I never go I don't I very rarely go looking for those things you know I very rarely sort of s you know, there w there became a period where certain things I guess got like linked with certain moments that they they they they came hand in hand and

And the and that's kinda gone out the window. I mean I d d there's times where I find myself in situations that the things come along and and I make again having d having done certain things I really know how I react to certain things and and and I know that if I approach it in a certain space Th and you can't obviously be be sure of that because you can uh I've I've I've also at one point thought it's just the the whole thing and then be Yeah.

Really, really uh reminded that no, each thing can be very individual. And uh so so yeah, I'm not pretending that I've cracked that but I I can I can have an educated guest now. And um and yeah, uh I but yet generally I think You know, one of my favourite things is to is I it c when creating when creating something, when trying to pursue an idea or something That is a that is a there's the alchemy of that trying to that that's a bit pointless trying to to to decipher what

what's gonna work, you know, what's one drink too many or what's one puff too many, all of that stuff. But it's certainly not there's not too much or nothing's not gonna do you any favors, you know.

There's a song on here called Radio which begins kind of like this this f through line that dips up and dips down of this very basic human desire for love and to be loved. I liked it'cause it felt like it was kind of almost a cynical re reflection of of this kind of like, um, disingenuine love. Uh everyone's in love, dah da da. And then it's this kind of it opens up and it's like, Well, wait a minute actually, like, you know. I I'm searching for that too. Like

May maybe I sh may maybe I should embrace that rather than re reject it from a distance. And I I love that sentiment and I feel like that's kind of flows through the album a bit. Is that is that fair to say? Is that was that did that surprise you? Is it through line? Is it as a continuum?

The main thread of the record was just a a a kind of conscious notion of trying to trying to to you know to to move out of or tr to try and consciously be be happier, you know, and and and and maybe pursue something and and and try to You know, to stop going over the same.

you know, open open up the mind and and a well in a completely different way to the to this kind of all that Alisonogenic stuff just just to a more Just to yourself really and to sort of tr see what's in front of you and see what's in the the mirror and uh not only within yourself but become a bit of a better person to be around, like you know. And and yeah, I mean if that

If I get you know, love. I mean even just like the the notion of of of liking or loving yourself a little bit more and and being And and liking what you do and how you do it and what you bring to'cause you know, like what what do you bring to the to the whole party, you know? Like as uh emotionally as as a person. It's so funny you mentioned that'cause the first time we ever really spoke.

properly in depth was on ca caustic love. I'd been actually warned. Like people have been like, he's he can be tough. Like he's he can be really tough to talk with. He he doesn't like doing interviews. And people had sort of I never got that from you for whatever reason, but I I got a sense that the expectation and you touched on this before Oh.

can actually drive you deeper into that heaviness as you describe it. That not being comfortable in the environment that everyone's pushing you to be comfortable in just makes you more uncomfortable. Sometimes you're comfortable and sometimes you're annoying or sometimes You know, being like, you know, being like this, you know, there's a, there's a situation of it.

an environment that, you know, you y you can't help but be a th then then then react to what what you're going through, you know. It's like it's like if you meet someone in the street that It's very harsh and hard to sort of base your whole entire opinion on somebody from meeting them one time, you know, because you know y you don't know what's happened that day. And yet we sort of find ourselves ignoring that basic common sense.

Again,'cause of time and'cause of this kind of pace that we're all moving in. I I've always tried my best to to be empathetic with that notion and and realised that, you know, we're not supposed to be. um spotless and perfect and and right all the time and even even even you know, uh everything we do doesn't have to Tick the boxes of acceptability. You make a mistake, it doesn't mean you are a f***ing mistake.

But, you know, there's obviously, like you said, there's common sense and there's common decency and there's certain things that, you know, that you just... th you hope that people know that just can't can't be done. But, you know, I think I think sometimes, um And we're we're like I said, we're we're human beings and we're If you know, if if y we all we have to learn.

And and it's funny'cause you talk about this kind of overarching desire to want to allow people to make mistakes and yet you y you know, when you talk about making this album trying to trying to ultimately kind of nudge yourself. into that place yourself, right? To acknowledge that it's okay for you as well, right? It's okay for you to be that. Yeah, yeah, or or or no. Y yes and no. I mean uh what I was going on about is maybe

saying that that, you know, maybe I was I was personally becoming I've not got a desire to want people to make mistakes or let people to make mistakes. I've just got a you know, like I try to not vilify someone it's uh straight away, even if they if they do me wrong or if they come at me or It's there's you know, but then so you know No, for me it was more like okay, I'm I'm kinda tired of making the same mistakes and I've kinda you know, I'm um I don't really see what I'm uh either

becoming or or what I am. But these are personal repetitive things that I that I that I felt. That that generally was usually stuff that that the victim was generally The biggest factor was myself.

They were quite inward things that I'm talking about and I I think that's that when you talk about an overarching theme to the to the record, um You know, I found myself going on in a lot of the you know, ups and the downs of of of my life were very, very were piggybacking each other, were very, very and and and I just felt'cause there's no way I could at least

ride the up the positive for a little longer. Uh, you know, before the inevitable dip happens. But which'cause'cause of course it will, you know. Um but but I just felt like I wasn't doing that sort of uh you know, that wave any favours by the way I was living my life and the way I was sort of handling myself. If you if you give into it from start to finish, it's a considerable commitment of time that requires you to pause and slow down and really acknowledge.

the songwriting and the music and and I urge everyone who's listening to this to do that. It's not an album I feel that you should be just taking one thing off and this, that, and everything else. Because not just'cause the quality of the music, because it's good for your soul to sit down for seventy minutes and just absorb something.

and just listen to it and appreciate it. And and I just I love that man. It's kind of in contrast to everything else that's moving right now and I I actually appreciated the fact that you were That you were really generous with your time on this album. Oh man, that's it's th the the the generosity would be the uh the other way up. I I just felt like I had to be and there was many stages where the the songs were were a bunch of songs.

Or if you know, and and until it becomes an album, that's really what they are. A bunch of songs. Rydyn ni'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd i'n mynd I won't hold you accountable, don't worry.

You're you're kinda conjured in other things. That you know, that I you when you go and out you know, over that time I'll go in and I'll do a session, I'll put and I'll call I'll call the people that I want that I feel. y mae'n ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud. we'll go there and we'll go for maybe five days or a week or something, you know, if if the time allows it and everybody's thing.

And I'll have a feeling or something, you know, there'll be a cluster of music and a cluster of songs that come out of that session. I guess what you hear is somet what when it becomes an album you kinda get a I guess there's there's songs that come from all of those different little those those notions and all and all of those different sort of impulses. And there's other songs that are that are there. So so you know, as you're

As you're sort of making one thing'cause another thing happening anyway. And but even that then has to become what it's gonna be and and until it's an album I don't really feel like it's it's an well it's That sounds stupid saying it, but until it is an album it's not an album, you know. It's it's a bunch of songs.

And yeah, and and really the the the amount of songs, that's more of a product of what I thought it took to become what it should be, rather than a conscious, okay, let's let's As make up for, you know, like a lot of people said, oh, you know, you're making up for those times.

Like there's some kind of like we've been taking notes saying look every year he's not here. He owes me another four songs. Now that adds up to approximately seventeen songs and anything less than that, Paulo is a fing kick in the nuts from my point of view as a fan, you know what I mean? One star, one song tooth, one one song shot. I guess it's like you're trying to make it like a like a film or a Yeah, you you got you gotta see the you complete the thought. You have to complete the thought.

Yeah.

We started talking about Ryder and w sadly we've come to the end of our time. You played that was what you played at the start. Yeah. I mean that song I s I loved it. When I heard it the first when I got to it on the album I just isolated that one song and then sent the album but with that song playing. So so many people I knew. Um

People you know, people I know, I just into everyone. I was just like, you gotta songwriters, producers. I was like, you guys gotta listen to this. This is just like perfectly sums it up.

And everyone came back and agreed. It's it's it's kind of like one of those moments where the troubadour gets gets his gets his flowers or gets her flowers, gets their flowers. Um I sort of wonder what Can you just please kind of find some words to try to sort of best put into context that song for you and where it came from and and and and why it sits where it sits on the album, what it means?'Cause I I really love it.

Well I guess I guess you know what, I think it I think it it comes at the end because I think it was a nice illustration of a lot of the the things and the and the and the aspects of my personality that that that led me to want to you know, try to break through, you know, and maybe be... to be more than what I consider myself to be. It certainly wasn't the last song written on the oven, in fact to the contrary, it was one of the earliest maybe songs written in the whole process.

But I think that's why I think it was To me it felt like well that's kind of says that's kind of reminds me of why I wanted to you know why I had the whole notion in the first place. And, you know, and and it's certainly it's it's it's a it's a bit of a kind of harsh reflection on you know, the character, you know, the whole, the character's self, you know, and And yeah, I think it, for me, in a way summed up a lot of the things that I was... talking about and it's not you know the album is

full of different things, observations. Some of them are autobiographical and some of them are Some of them are about things that I've read or watched or things that are happening to other people.

That I guess that sort of reminded me of that I was the kind of person that somebody could come to if they were in trouble. In other times where I was very unreliable and and I was too I was I was m maybe, you know, the times when as a person you're You're not really that emotionally available or, you know. you can't you can't provide that kind of solace and and and and support because generally you know, because y you you you don't have it in you sometimes and sometimes you do.

Yeah, I think we all do that a lot of times as well. You know, we give this advice to people who are struggling and we go when then the next day go out and completely contradict it, I find that I've done it, I find that people that give me advice do it. We're flawed. Редактор субтитров А.Семкин We're a weird species. But you know, that we we do have times where we we we can do you know, we do good we can do good and we can help people. And I think

I I you know, t try at least to try and help people is is a good idea. Um, even if maybe you can't all the time. Thanks for listening to another conversation on the interview series. That's a rare one with Paolo Nottini. Stick around. Well over a hundred conversations right here now for you to dive into. Another one coming next week. Take care.