A good eight champs and championettes. I guess it's champs around, really, isn't it. It's not a gender thing, good a champs. It's Jumbo, it's Tiff, it's Bobby, it's the Project, that's you. It's Thursday. Is it Thursday? Ye, it's Thursday, and we're all busy, We're busy. Just what's her name? Tiff? I had Tazzy and Tiff. TIFFs just got back from Tazzy,
so that twenty seven times fast. And Bobby's just got back from the West Coast to the East coast, No, the other way around the East coast to the West coast. Is it nice being back in the sun, Bobby.
Well, it's Clardyon raining here. It was really nice being back on the East coast. To be fair, it's blows freezing. It got colder in New York than it wasn't Antartica at one point, but I loved it.
Nice. Tazzy was Tazzy colder than here.
Tiff, Well, thank you for Lee because here was quite ludicrous when I left, but it was. It was about twenty two to twenty three every day, which in Taggy is just lovely.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well it's all been going on. We've all had a few things going on. I want to unpack any of mine, but I will one day. And Bobby, how are you feeling because you've had a few peaks and troughs. How's your head, how's your heart, how's your energy? How to work?
Yeah? Things have been things have been intense. A lot of stuff happened in hopes. But you know what, I'm still alive. I'm still here. So let's talk about that.
Let's talk about like all of us coaches, all of us are coaches in some shape or form, what's your responsibility or what's the expectation? Because I've been thinking about this lately.
You know.
It's like you said to me just before we started, how are your parents? And I went, yeah, I can't tell you. That's not a one minute answer. That's more. And by the way, everybody, thanks for all your well wishes. A few struggles going on on a planet Harper, but they're getting there, they're okay. But what do you think. Let's start with you, tif Like, I know you have peaks and troughs because you talk about it, our listeners,
your listeners know about it. And in the middle of you know, shit falling apart, which you can sometimes for a month or a week or a day or an hour. What's your kind of thinking around how do I still be that positive, high energy person but also be authentic because at the moment, I feel like dogshit, But you can't turn up to coach someone and go probably won't be a great session because I'm having a moment. How do you navigate that?
I think I'm like when you show up to do a job, you kind of step into that not character so much, but that professional space, like that headspace. But in the middle of that, I feel like I've always maintained and a pretty open persona and you know, I share what's going on, not not in this session. It's like once we're done with that, yeah, definitely, or maybe
sometimes sometimes it's relevant. Sometimes it's relevant to go, oh, this is this is what's going on for me right now, and this is what i'm you know, and sometimes there's helpful insights in that.
Yeah.
What about for you? Energy management? Like do you get to the point where you go just where I'm at right now my energy and my head, like I'm just exhausted, I've got no juice in the tank. It's probably better for the client that I go listen, Can we just put this one on hold? Yeah?
Yeah. Often we'll not not putting people on hold often, but I often have to manage my energy, especially lately like hormones awol, and it's new for me. It's new to go. I'm why am I so tired right now? And how like, I've had to change a lot of how I do things so that I can continue to show up because you you know, like it's people first, it's your job first.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Yeah, it's tricky.
It's tricky.
What about you, Robert, What about when you're not you're personally not feeling great, but you want to show up and be a version of great for your clients, or your team or your audience.
I think my perspective is similar to Tiffanis. First of all, I don't think it's important to show up quote unquote positive all the time for every session. I was listening to your podcast with doctor ca McDonald We love Them. I really enjoyed that episode. But you had pointed out you can't always control how you feel, so there's a lot of influences there. So for me, it's a matter of what am I focusing on? Where am I directing
my attention? Which I mean, if you have a lot of stuff on and you you know, let's say you haven't slapped, you're fatigued, you are more susceptible to things like emotional contagion. But at the same time, what's also
true is focusing single mindedly on your client. That conversation is in fact a form of mindfulness, and it's very helpful for you to step outside of yourself as much as you realistically can and focus single mindedly on what's important for the client in front of you in the moment. So I don't think positivity is something that you need to show up with every single session, But I think self awareness and tak us some time before the session, not jumping from one thing into another, just even a
couple of minutes ago. Kurk Right, what's my intention here, where's my focus? Whatever mental reserve I have? How do I allocate that away from me and towards the client for a little while.
I think if we like, as you're saying this, as we're saying this, I'm recognizing and respecting that most people who listen to this aren't coaches. So I think it's probably and that's that's not good or bad, that's just a situation.
But also I.
Would think the majority, more than fifty percent, may be way higher of our listeners are parents, and I think or as a parent, or as a partner, or as a boss for that matter, whatever, or a coach. Yeah, how do I show up like I would think?
Well, I wouldn't think.
I respect that parenting is fucking infinitely harder than doing the job. Us three dumb asses do right, None of us to my knowledge, Bobby, unless there's something you want
to tell differ and I right now. Although Tiff is a parent of sorts and you have been to and I have been for that matter, But yeah, like, just how do I be a mum or a dad, or how do I be a good friend, or how do I just be that person for that person and without denying what I'm going through all my feelings but not kind of let them be a victim of my not feeling good in the moment, Like, how do I be as consistent as I can for them?
Either of you? I think sometimes part of that is being honest.
You know.
Brene Brown said something where she talked about in marriage that type of relationship. Sometimes one person shows up with a lot more energy reserves than another, and you hold that space like some person might be at like hundred percent, but your partner might be at sixty. And you know the Internet, she got a lot of flak for that. It's like, no, everybody, you have to show up one
hundred percent all the time, be committed. And it's like, I think you're being dishonest and unfair to your partner because even if you're showing up one hundred percent all the time, which will to be fair, that's unlikely that you do. Your one hundred looks very different day to day. And sometimes, you know, just telling your partner, hey, you know, this is where I'm at and this is what I'm going through, I think that mitigates the intensity of those
emotions in you. It's honest, it's authentic with your partner. I think there's also urgency and importance. You know, some some conversations that are critical are important, some are urgent. Some are a combination of the two. So if you're dealing with something that is highly important but it's not urgent,
we don't have to have this right now. I think sometimes just say hey, you know, this is my bandwidth in the moment, and I know this is important to you, right and I really want to be present, you know it. Can we do this, you know tomorrow, because I don't want my stuff to get in the way now. Sometimes things are urgent and you can't really do that and then showing up as much as you possibly can. But I think it's that level of honesty with yourself and
your honesty with the person you're speaking to. And by the way, this is coming from someone who hypocritically doesn't always practice that, because there's a difference between where I think I should be and where I actually am. And it's like, Okay, I'm feeling like I'll scale from one to ten. I'm like a four, But okay, I'm going to do this right now because somebody else wants me to do this, and there's a place I think that's important. But sometimes like can I give Can I give an
example of something that happened with me? And this this isn't like a personal relationship, but my first hands on practical coaching exam I ever took. This is going back a long time ago. I was ready, I was there at the table, I was anxious and I got on with instructor and she was in bits. This is someone who I've been in correspondence with, and she was she was you could tell she's she had been crying and something had really gone very very wrong in her marriage
that morning. And she's like, I don't think I have I don't think I have the mental space to do this, and I know all the preparation that went into this. Can we reschedule? And one I remember feeling horrible for her because I know if I was on the other end of that call what that would have felt like,
plus the stuff she was going through. But I also remember feeling quite grateful because I thought that was not something I was doing for her, that was also something simultaneously she was doing for me, because she could have powered through that, and that's something that could have affected, you know, my life and hers. So I think that level of openness and honest and awareness is important. Yeah, one hundred percent.
So I'm going to present a hypothetical, or I guess a question to you, tiff In. When we talk about negative states that we all get into emotional and psychological, I'm speaking about more which we know have a physical consequence. But what's the state that's most likely to derail.
You in the moment.
So I'm sure there's more than this, but what comes to mind for me is anxiety, self doubt, for our self loathing, overthinking. Maybe there's another one, but what's the one that for you has been the biggest struggle? So two part question that like, what what's going to fuck you up the most? I just I may or may not riff on this, but for me, I think it's unworthiness. I always feel not good enough, unworthy. What's the biggest one for you? And then how do you deal with that? You do about that?
I feel like maybe overwhelm because I don't recognize and I don't know what to do with it. And I felt a bit recently, so I think overwhelmed can get put me into a state of a lot of those things, anxiety and reactivity and irritability and negativity and being quite cynical and a very different version of myself. So my outlook of everything shifts, and I actually can't in that moment.
Definitely it's a struggle to pinpoint it. So I'm like, I don't actually I can't recognize where this is coming from. It's going to take a bit of stepping back and getting self aware and looking at my environment and what's going on at the moment and try and piece it together. But yeah, just being that person in the middle of that is very hard and frustrating for me.
Because I'm this is my guess, right, that state as an emotional state. You are emotional, but then you've got to try and understand it logically and as critically as a critical thinker, you know. And so you're in this state where you're actually your prefrontal cortext is not operating at an all time high, so you can't think real
clearly because you're in overwhelm. Yeah. Yeah, that's maybe only a hindsight thing that where you can an hour or two later go, nah, I think it was this and this is probably the reason why.
Yeah. And what's interesting is because I've always been very independent. I think I always it's easy to withdraw and just not be around people. So that's confronting as well. So now I have someone in my life that I am speaking to every day and I can't just I can't just withdraw, So I have to go, oh, I can't just.
It's so good you said that.
I was going to say I know I've thrown you under the bus hundred times with old mate we love him, good Scotti. You're a big fuck stick, Yeah, a big fuck stick. But yeah, I think for you because, like I've said a thousand times tips the girl who's got you know, the T shirt that says give me a hug and the baseball cap that says but fuck off. Though, right, so like you're you're also you're quite quite lovable, but
a little bit fucking terrifying. And so even for me, who reads people pretty well, I'm.
Like, eah, fuck, I don't know.
I don't know, you know, And I could be really.
Aware of being quite cunty. There's no other word to describe how I feel when i'm that.
But I'm like, can you say that again, because I think I spoke of you.
I can be very aware when I'm being quite cunty and go and I'm like, oh, I don't want to be that person, but right now that's the person that is stuck inside me. And so I don't want to be around people and I don't think it's fair on them. And then yeah, it's a challenge.
And right now my Migdala is running the show. So you can all fuck off get back to me in an hour or so, Bobby, Bobby, what about you in terms of like when something's going to come?
I could be county as well. Why do you ask?
Well, we know that, but specifically when something some emotional state or whatever kind of what's the thing most likely to take you.
Out of the game temporarily? Wow, there's so many of them. I think overwhelm is definitely part of that. Overwhelm is big for me. The other thing is, I don't know how like whether it's self anger or disappointment. But when I feel like I'm about to fail on one, not fail because you know I'll feel disappointment, I'll get over it. Sometimes I find failure quite engaging, like I actually enjoy it because of what you learn in reflection. But if I feel like I'm about to fail another person, yes,
that is so disruptive for me. And it can be over something small like my wife send me to the shop and say I bring back you know, salmon, and I'll bring back I don't know, like cigarettes, cigarettes. That would be funny, and I will feel this incredible sense of angst inside. Like for her, she'll be like, oh okay, yeah, whatever, for me, I will feel like self loathing and disgust, and I'll also feel fear as if like there's going to be severe repercussions. And I know where that stuff
comes from. Yeah, and that's not the relationship I'm in in my marriage, but it's definitely the relationship I grew up in. So I think, upon reflection again, to TIFF's point, I can say, oh, I see what happened there. It's not that serious, and I can recalibrate, But in the moment, I don't really have access to my cognitive faculties. And you know what, I'm a complete state.
So what is I think difficult sometimes is how do I say this? So right now, Mum and Dad are going through some stuff and Mums let's just say, you know, her memory and stuff's not working great, and there's you know, there's a few issues. But she will say something to me one day and then emphatically say the opposite the next day, right. And the thing that didn't worry her the day before is a cadashphe the next day, right. And so for me, the.
Like there's two parts this.
There's a real cognitive part, a critical thinking part, and there's an emotional part empathy, you know, and it's trying to trying to just be wherever they're at, you know, rather than going, mum, we spoke about this yesterday you said, yes, it's all good. And now I don't do that. I don't even try to do that. I just try to love her. I go, how do I be the most loving and how do we get through this conversation because all I don't.
Firstly, I want to look after them physically, but I just this is weird.
But for me, I just want to be for them emotionally and mentally, because I think that's the biggest trauma. The physiology. Yeah, sure things have fallen apart a bit, but you know, old people get to a point, and I mean this with love nearly all old people where just everything's overwhelming and terrifying and they can't remember shit, and you know, it just goes there. So for me, it's trying to, you know, theory of mind understand what's going on in their mind, but also empathy understand what's
going on in their feelings and their emotions. So it's this kind of duality, this dual processing thing that's happening in real time. Like I'm trying to figure out what the fuck is she thinking? But literally what is she thinking? You know, like not critically, like curiously, what is she thinking? And why and why are we here today and yesterday we were there? And now emotionally what is her experience now?
What is she feeling now? And for me, that's it's been a yeah, it's been a big step out of the theory of all of this that I've spent so long on and bits and pieces of you know, real life and reality, but now where it's like, oh, I'm at the cold face of this and as an experience it is definitely not the same as the theory.
What harps is it like to manage because you need to manage you and your overwhelmed in a moment where where then you put them at the forefront, Like that's a that's a bit dynamic.
Yeah, yeah, well as being you know, at first, everyone, I'm fine, but I'm pretty fucked at the moment.
Like I'm tired.
I'm tired, you know, I'm about had to delay my PhD stuff a little bit, but I just got by the way everyone. I've got feed This doesn't mean much to most people, but I've got feedback from two quite good academic journals that two of my papers are a potential, so they didn't get what's called a desk reject, which about ninety percent of papers get rejected straight up in good as you know, Bobby in good and probably TIF in good journals.
So that's good.
But yeah, so at the moment, I'm trying to finish this thing that I've been chipping away at forever, and I'm trying to obviously Mum and Dad in my priority like flat out, so nothing else, you know, if I had to move there and stop everything six months, that's what I do, right, So trying to navigate that, trying to manage my own energy, Like I'm going up to see them tomorrow and I'm literally going up to have lunch, you know, And so there's depending on the traffic, four
to five hours driving to spend ninety minutes with them, you know, or two hours, and that's fine too. Yeah, So it's the answer is I'm not great at it. The answer is I'm learning, and I just, at the risk is sounding cheesy, I'm trying to lead with love and see what happens, try not to have a breakdown. Yeah that probably sounded super sloppy, pologize everyone that's not enterstanding at all.
I think it's important because I think it's I mean, you say it to me often a version of this is it like this is now when it matters, and it goes to show us in a world where there's solutions and information and data and how to do this and how to get better. And then there's the reality of it's like, it's always going to be hard, though, and we're going to be messy when we get in the middle of that, no matter how many PhDs and how much thegory we've on board about it.
And also think about this.
Let's say Bobby goes to me, Hey, Craig, I'm really dealing with I'm fucking I feel overwhelmed, and then later you say to me, Hey, Craig, I feel overwhelmed. I could have a conversation with Bobby that's really quite valuable and therapeutic and helpful to him. I have the same conversation with you. Totally misses the mark. So this is the thing. Even if we can recognize the state or the feeling or the emotion or the whatever, there is no single answer because Bobby's answer won't be yours and
so on. Yeah, so how are you going in the background there, Bobby, You're right.
Yeah, I'm just just learning about all the stuff. You well, just just I think pensive overwhelm is about five minutes away, so we're good.
See if you can put it off till about I don't know, one to thirty our times, six thirty your time.
I'm about it. I'm putting it in your calendar six thirty one. Overwhelmed. That's that's how it's getting. We have to we have to time, budget time, allocate it for overwhelm. Yeah. Who's got time for overwhelmed nowadays?
Oh?
Fuck it?
Just yeah, just schedule it. Yeah, eight o'clock, June seven, breakdown.
Yeap, Jack done, all right, Self care accomplished. Thanks, thanks hops. I'm just I'm just less and into what you're going through with your parents. And you know, my mom is not in a good place. She's in remission from cancer, but now she has a bunch of other things that are quite serious. And you know, hmm. Amy was going to come home with me two days ago, but she didn't because she has to stay out there because I have things that I have to be in person for
out here. So now she's in Brooklyn, and it's just interesting do it Where you said do things with love, I think that's all you can do. Sometimes it's like, how do I do this with love? Because I feel a tremendous amount of conflict and guilty with my mom because she's she's old and she really needs help and we're making sacrifices to help her and do whatever we can to have Amy there, me here, but she there's a lot of resentment that I feel I have because
I mean, she was not a great mother. That's that's putting it mildly. Growing up, Yes, and now that you're seeing cognitive decline, there are certain attributes that she can't mask as well, and they're coming out and it's like, oh, okay, there you are, I remember you. Like, So she has spent the past I don't know, oof the past fifteen years trying to be very sweet and you know, like make amends for everything, and that's been a that's that's
been a winding road. Sometimes it's been better than others. But now now there's parts of her peeking out through the surface, and it's hard for me to deal with it. Yeah, that is tough. Without getting into it, and it's like, wow, that's that's not a nice person coming out, and like, what do you do? Because sometimes I get quite angry. It's like, just you just got to take a moment, you got to recalibrate, and you got to do this with love. Like it's okay to feel what you're feeling.
First of all. I think trying to trying to repress it causes it to come out in ugli or dysfunctional ways. But take it, own it and move forward with love. Anyway. My wife, like Amy, is amazing at that she's taking care of another person who's getting quite on along in years and she's able to say, Okay, this person is who they are, But how do I show up lovingly? Anyway? I think that is that is a beautiful attribute. And sometimes people you can do.
I think that what you're doing is incredibly hard, and you know, sometimes times, God bless them old people. And I mean that respectfully everyone. I mean old. I mean eighty My parents are eighty six, right, eighty seven this year, And some of the stuff that comes out at times it's like, oh, you know, but my inner voice goes, hey, most of your life has been in the ballpark of
fucking amazing, right, so shut up. Secondly, you talk about all this shit all the time, Well, now there's the opportunity for you to do the shit, to be the shit. Like otherwise, I'm just a voice in the wind that's talking bullshit. And as I say to people all the time, what I care about most is what you're doing when no one's looking or giving you applause or and there's just that where you go, Yeah, I can could I in some instances find a reason to feel sorry for myself if I want it.
What does that help me?
No?
Does that help them?
No? Does it change the situation? No?
Does it produce a good outcome?
No? All right, so let's not do that.
Let's do it.
Not do it one because it's dumb, and two because you don't want to be that person and you want to, as we said, leave with love. So yeah, dude, I feel for you, and I you know, like this is weird, but you know, since we met all those years ago, you've always kind of been that little sometimes lost brother where you know, I know how uh disconnected you can feel from people, you know, because you're you're not typical. You're not typical, You're not the same. I don't I
know fucking thousands of people. I don't know one person like you. I don't know one person who's I go, oh, this person really reminds me of Bobby. And I know that there's a lot of you know, I mean, we're just here, so mus well, stay here. But there's you know, there's a lot of pain in you. And I know that you mask that. I see that, I see you just you know, you get to a point of a conversation where you're like, right, let's do a left turn
and talk about Dix or whatever it is. You know me too, you know where you go, fuck, let's do something funny. Well, that's true, that's more me. Let's be honest.
That's me.
Yeah, I think you're I'm the fucking big brother with no morals. But yeah, you know, it's just that we just cope the way that we cope. Sometimes it's deflection, sometimes it's humor. Sometimes it's pointing a finger back and going nah, fuck you, which is probably not a good recommendation, but yeah, I think sometimes on this show, you know, it's all well and good to go. Well, in this situation, we should probably try a bit of this and sprinkle a bit of that on and you know, here's four
things you can try. Well maybe maybe sometimes though I think you're just The thing is to just sit in the middle of the shit and feel what you feel and see what comes up, and see what you can figure out, rather than what any of us genie I are thrown at you, because I think that's as cliche as it sounds. I think experiences and interactions and life is the best classroom. Like just going through a shit is where you learn, you know. I don't think you
can learn about grief without going through grief. You know, you just learn the theory of grief. Go through grief.
Motherfucker. That is different.
That is so far from those seven points I read in that book, those five stages of grief.
Those this the.
Fuck and hell this is nothing like because one is just a kind of a theoretical framework, which theoretical frameworks have their place. But I cannot explain the shit that I'm feeling. So you and your theories fuck off, you know, and you just kind of work through it a bit. Yeah, So a tip, do you not because you were going to map maybe have to jump out? Are you still good?
I do no longer need to.
Oh, perfect right, well say something mind blowingly wise, were you? Because Bobby and I haven't fucking silk over.
Here, just as you've been talking a mull over that idea around what we how we approach or what we do with the recognizing the pain or the herd and feel like that idea of how do you feel what you feel without and not make it bigger, but allow it to be there and not suppress it and do
something healthy with it. Because because I was talking to a guest earlier this week and around that concept of when we don't express things, When we don't don't express our feelings or what's inside and we suppress that, it's toxic, we get sick. It's like that if there's dark emotions there, if we have hurt and pain, like I kept a secret for thirty years and didn't speak up. So I'm really passionate about it. But in saying that is also a way to not hold it and make it heavy
and to not project it onto other people. So as you talk about all of this, I'm just I'm thinking about that.
Yeah, that works for us.
Yeah, I also think about you know, when you're talking to someone and they're going through something, and you recognize the thing that they're going through in the moment mentally and emotionally, that it isn't real objectively, it is subjectively the experience is real for them.
Like I watch my mum take a zero out of ten event or issue and it becomes a ten out of ten problem. But from the outside looking in, I don't think anyone else would think that, but Mum does in the moment. And so when I was young and dumber, I would try to go, Mum, you just like you're just creating something out of nothing, There is no issue,
you just invent Well. Not surprisingly, that didn't fucking help, But that didn't give her like some light bulb moment of clarity and self awareness, right, So then I had to learn to acknowledge what was actually going on, but respect what was going on for mum. And what was going on for Mum was this is a major problem, and with this major problem comes anxiety and fear. And so I'm respecting the emotional state and the feeling and the personal reality that she is inhabiting, and I'm speaking
to that person. I'm not speaking to the external issue. Because if you look through the lens of empathy, and you know what they call in psychology self other awareness. You have this different experience versus Oh, Craig, the fucking fixes here, Hey, Greg, the fix a fuck off? Get in the car. You know we don't need that guy. You with me, Bobby.
Totally. I feel like this is one of the biggest problems in relationships, and it's a massive cause of suffering for others and ourselves. Is the inability to see past our own thought processes, biases, and where we are in the present moment and just sit with someone not based on fixing their situation, but what is it like to be that person in the moment. I just want to point something out because I was thinking about this in
the call today. I was thinking about you on my way to an event because I was listening to your show with Cam and I've witnessed vicariously on a few of your shows as of late, you challenge your own perspective and thought process and kind of not moving beyond it, still holding it, but also considering what else might be true and meeting your guests there, and I thought, wow, you know, it's amazing to see like Harps like on a show in real time growing because you were doing
it with Cam And I'm not going to get into where I how, but I've heard you do that on a couple of other shows I've experienced to do that with me, and I'm thinking, I just want to point that out because I don't know if you realize it or you're noticing this, but I am seeing you as a person like my dear friend growing Yeah, even at your advanced stage. Ha ha, there it is, there, it is.
Fuck, thank god you did that. I was getting so uncomfortable. Oh relief, But this is what I think, Like, you know how people have to be right some people, and sometimes I've been that that people. And when I'm unemotional as I can be, and I'm as objective as I can be and I'm as self aware as I can be, I look.
Back over the last say forty years of.
Grown upness, and I go, how many times have you made a mistake or how many times have you got something wrong? I'd say, oh, fuck, I really don't know, but like very small to very big, probably multiple times a day. Well let's go, well that's five, let's go forty years. Let's go two hundred times, three hundred and sixty five days. You know, whatever, it's thousands or tens of thousands of times, and I just go, well, of course I'm still getting things wrong, probably at the same
rate or maybe higher. And so I think the having enough awareness and humility and courage, which I do not always have, but to be able to go this is what I really fucking think. But I could be wrong, because I've been wrong many times. It's like you and I grew up in a pretty religious paradigm part of our lives anyway, and so we had certain beliefs in data DA and I still have certain beliefs. But is there a chance I'm wrong? Of course about some of it,
all of it, a bit of it, of course. So my faith or my belief doesn't have to be wired into certainty or knowledge. It's like, well, of course there's you know, So I think that I actually think being okay with being wrong is just liberating.
You know.
I think it makes life so much easier for you, well by you, I mean us, Yes, yes, it's strength things relationships, and I think I believe it expands your capacity for thought because you don't have to let go of your point of view in order to embrace somebody else's point of view and know that both might be wrong correct somewhere in between, or it doesn't matter because that is their reality, and it is their reality infringing upon their life in a negative way or anybody else's.
Is it depriving them from a fundamental right? If the answer is no, you're just talking about differences in perspective. And if everybody has the same perspective, the vast majority of us are redundant, aren't we. So I think it's like in NLP they call it different positions like first, second, third, and fourth. I think that's a powerful mental exercise where, Okay, what is my point of view? Because if I'm going to be with you, I have to be anchored with me.
What do I believe? Okay, now here's my point of view. How can I step over to your side of the table and see the world through your eyes as much as possible? So let me take the perspective of Craig. And then third position would be Tiffany, if I was sitting at this table and I was observing this conversation,
what would be my point of view there? And then stepping even back one level beyond that, universally, what could be interpreted from this and I think when you go through those different dvantage points, One, it mitigates a lot of anxiety and reactivity too, it connects you empathy, and three, I think it expands your capacity for thought and adaptability, which is a quintessential component of resilience. Yeah, love it, love it.
I think I'm going to go to YouTube. I feel like a lot of times we want to be right because the thing that we believe is a form of identity for us. It's like part of our identity is tied into you know, like I used to anyway, I won't bang on about me, but do you feel like that ever? Like, oh, I'm this person or people see me as that person, so I've got to be that. And also I want to be right because I want
people to think I'm smart. And you know, it's like or you know, when people talk about who I am. I am a Christian, I am a vegetarian, I am a tennis player, I am a whatever, I'm a Manchester United supporter, I am like we talk about something that isn't actually us and we make an im statement before it. Yeah, So I think it's really easy to get trapped into that thing if you don't want to, especially if you believe something for twenty years.
Yeah, and I think just one an answer and certainty. And it's how we on one hand, we sit here and we always saying everyone's different. My answer is not your answer. Everyone needs something different. But then there's the other part of us that goes, this is what I've learned, and this is how it is, and this is what I believe. And we have to remember that you're holding those two things and you're speaking to a world of
people that have that are that are different. So that thing we believe and we said we have to realize is also extremely flawed for a lot of people. Yes, yes, and it's hard.
Well, I've taught things to groups, like to audiences where now I'm like so embarrassed that I taught that. I'm like, I've said things to a thousand people in a room that bullshit, and now I like, oh fuck, I hope nobody remembers that day.
It was a while ago. I hope they don't remember that.
I said that, because I know I was actually I thought I was right talking about whatever it was, and now I know I wasn't right, like factually scientifically, like you know, or I wasn't totally right. Is there anything that you used to teach Bobby or talk about with a level of certainty that you now go? What the fuck?
Was I thinking? Yeah, nearly eighty percent of what I used to teach, because that's the key word there, right. It's not that I believe this and I thought it was useful and I conveyed it. It's I taught that with so much certainty because I strongly believed this is not how I am, this is how the world is. Wow.
And that's a major blind spot. And I think what Tiff was talking about earlier with reflecting after the fact on emotional states and responses is critical because when we don't do that, when we don't acknowledge an emotion, it
comes out in so much uglier ways. For me, it was certainty and judgment about how people should live when I was in my twenties, like about how people should work, which was pretty much all the time, and think about nothing else because everything else is a feud to waste of time or I had a guest on well, I guess this is our show, so this show years back. I forgot his name, and he pointed out how we were having a similar conversation, how one of my behaviors
is highly narcissistic. Now, he did not say that I am a narcissist. He just said that my behavior patterns were narcissistic. And it comes down to I think the example was if I say I'm going to clean out the dishwasher and then Amy comes home and I forgot to clean out the dishwasher. Yes, I mentioned earlier that one of the emotional states that is problematic for me
is when I feel I have failed someone. And what I would do in that funny story about work not too funny, what I would do is I would get into oh my god, I'm horrible. I would just completely come undone and self loath. And he's like, okay, So now your wife not only has to deal with the fact that after a long day and you were supposed to do something, you broke a promise. Not intentionally, but you broke a promise. She also now has to deal with your emotions about it. So now it's all about you.
That's that's narcissistic behavior. You might feel horrible and communicate that you feel horrible. What she really needs is, yes, I drop the ball on that, And this is how I'm going to make sure this doesn't happen again, because you've got a lot of shit on and when you asked me to clear out the dishwasher and I agree to it, you probably should have the confidence that it's done. So the other day at work, real fast this was
not great. So I was trying, I want to remember an acronym of an event that I got accepted to speak at, and I'm communicating with one of my partners and I forgot the name, and I was like, she is going to be so disappointed in me. She's not going to know who I'm talking about. And she's like,
WHOA what is this? I don't remember? And thinking about her disappointment in me forgetting the acronym of the organization, I start like trying to copy and paste the acceptance letter of the signature, and as I'm doing that, I'm struggling to copy and paste and I didn't even realize I said this. It must have been a Tourette's moment, but I was like, you are so stupid, and I didn't realize I had my voice dictation button on. So the message I sent to my colleague was, hey, I
got accepted for both of these submissions. You are so stupid. Hey, oh that is great. That is great. Yeah, I hope you going through hell right now. Not if you're in HR. It's not great now because it was obvious, there was no context why I would say that. But she was like, explain yourself, what do you mean I'm so stupid? I was like, what what do you mean? You're stupid? And
I looked and I realized voice dictation was on. Now I wasn't talking to her, I was talking to me, and I didn't even realize I said that all because of that pattern, Like I should know this acronym. It's a stupid little thing. But I blew it up in my mind. And then I said something really unkind to myself, sent it over, which she for a second could have interpreted as aimed at her. It's extremely destructive to not deal with your emotions and your triggers.
Yeah, yeah, wow, dude, that is But I had done do that to yourself, done to that either. You know, you're a little battler, but you're right, you're a little ussy batla.
But the thing is, I didn't realize I did it. It's not like I consciously said it. Mus it's it's kind. I don't want to blame it on Touret's but it was like a terrest moment. I had no idea that I ever uttered that. Even after the fact, no clue. When I looked at the message, I was astonished. I was like, really, I said that about myself in that moment and sent that over. Actually, that's not great.
I so want you to have a live on the stage Turett's moment, which is very unfair of me. But fuck, ID love.
That all that that that'll never happen because stage is that environment is the most conducive to controlling your terrest's symptoms. You're putting out a ton of physical energy with complete intense mental focus. That is the last place I would do that.
There's this kid must have made and it was years ago. Now, who was on Australian Idol. Do you know a singer called Delta Gudrum Bobby now okay, so very well known Australian singer, great singer, bye bah blah. Anyway, she was one of the judges and this young dude had all kinds of fucking savage ticks and Tourette's and busy. You know, it's busy, and then when he sang, it all went away and he could sing like an angel. So anyway, huh,
so good, so good. So he sings and he's fucking amazing, and Delta comes up to give him a hug, and Delta's giving him a hug, and he goes on.
National television Delta's Hot, Delta's Hot.
And it was just the best. It was the best because he was like seventeen or something, and I don't know, she was probably twenty eight and gorgeous, and it was just my go that's the best thing ever. And like people Jersey, she took it great. She was great. Yeah, everybody loved it. Everybody knew what was going on.
You know.
It was kind of like, oh my god, but also hilarious and also sweet. So I wonder what that little dude's name is and where is that now?
To you?
If any final thoughts or wisdom that you want to impart with us to bullfheads or the non buffheads in our audience.
Nothing here, harps. I might just drop into Overwhelm a few minutes before Bobby.
Actually, yeah, okay, Bobby's got seven minutes, seven minutes away, seven minutes away from overwhelmed, so enjoy that. Maybe get yourself a drink.
Minutes. Sex is going to be rough, I know what's common.
Yeah. So Bobby's podcast is called the Self Help Antidote.
Uh.
Tis podcast is called Roll with the Punches.
Uh.
Bobby can be found on LinkedIn, and he has a website called is it Robert Capuccio dot com?
Yeah? Coincidentally enough, Yeah, I.
Couldn't remember if it was fucking pony Boy or Robert. I think that's us, Tiff, that I forget anything for you. Tiff enjoys water sports and meeting people, but not anymore because she's got the fucking she's got the goat, she's got the fucking cooda, she's got the don't worry about that. She's got the number one fucking boy in town, much to everyone's surprise, and that, oh support something so funny to say nine of my audience would be like, you're the best ten percent of I'm going to send you
a fucking email. I can't. I can't. I'll tell you off, heir, But I know listeners, if we didn't have, like you know, all those people who send me emails that I totally deserve. By the way, I could tell you, but I can't.
How should have a blooper's link so you could share it with the audience, And then, because it's a blooper's link, anyone that's offended, but they click on it anyway, they've only got themselves to blame.
Yeah, yeah, and fuck you?
Yeah good?
All right? What are they both next? No? And see you both next time.