Oh, Tiffany and Cook, David, Brian Kevin, Patrick Gillespie, Craig Anthew Harper. It's the project, that's you, it's us. What have you been up to today? Cook? Have you been talking to people? Have you been therapizing yourself or anyone else? Have you been punching shit?
I have been.
I've trained a couple of clients, made them punch them shit. I have had a bit of a chat to people. I've had a bit of therapy myself. That's always a joy. I've lifted heavy things and here I am. And I even had a nap today.
What a great little nana nap. How's doctor Bill going? Are you? Are you making any progress? Are you still like whereabouts on the operational functional scale? Are you like your ten being like no issues, one being all the issues? What number are you probably?
I've rocket it up to a good three and a three point five? I reckon, So I'm doing it.
You're approaching, You're you're driving into Normalsville. You're just sitting on the almost normal highway, just cruising into town.
Close.
Yeah.
Well, it's good things psychologies or bullshit, isn't it David?
It is, yes, it is a good thing.
Yeah, yeah, expensive bullshit but now nonetheless bullshit.
Spoken authorized by David Gillespie. Now you wrote something, well, firstly, how are you before I talk about the funny thing? Any news on planet you anything you need to tell any like, any breaking news on planet.
No, I don't think so.
There's no sound effects coming forward.
Sound effects.
We're saving up for a new bit of what do you call this stuff? Foam on the edge of my filter? Yeah, yeah, we're saving up for one of those. I think Melissa has to sell a kidney, but I'll get one anytime, anytime. So you wrote a funny article which I started reading and I did. I wasn't really expecting for it to be a tongue in cheek kind of affair with you talking about the the impending inclusion of ozen pic or the like in the drinking water. Was it meant to be Australia or America that?
But but the piece was, Yeah, the piece was was America. But I was, I guess kind of trying to make a point about mass medication. Is you read that piece and you see the way the politicians sell it. You know, we put a zen pick into the drinking spy will solve the obesity crisis. We'll solve the affordability crisis because.
You won't be able to afford to buy EU. You won't buy.
As much food, so it will cost you less. And we'll even you know, solve the airline seat crisis. You know, you'll everyone will be able to fit into their airline seats. Everyone basically flying first clas So all good all around. What's the downside? You have to buy a bit of a zimpic and put it into the drinking supply, and I guess lose the will to live because it does have an an hedonic effect on people. But the point I guess I was trying to make is often that's
how mass medication appeals. You could make exactly the same arguments for fluoridation. There's a hard way to fix the fact that we're wrecking everybody's teeth, which is we have to stop them consuming vast amounts of sugar. The only thing that destroys teeth is sugar. We know that that's not controversial science, And instead of doing something about that, our solution is to put a chemical in the water supply that does a little bit about it but doesn't
fix the problem. And may have its own problems itself. And that's kind of what I was getting at with this article. And this isn't the first time that really odd things have been seriously suggested as being added to the water supply. There was a serious attempt to add statins into the water supply in Japan, the thinking being yeah, the thinking being, well, you know, let's prevent everybody's heart attack, you know, put.
It into the water supply.
And this is the way the thinking goes, is what's the harm? And we've talked about a few things where there've been mass medication.
For very very good reasons, you know, you know.
Such as preventing birth defects and so on, but without any real regard to the potential side effects of it, and without any real regard to is this really a good idea to give this to everybody in the population.
And because we're in.
A situation where that is the mindset for our public health people, which is the first thing they reach for, is the equivalent of fluoridation of the water supply. Me writing a piece something putting a zepic in the water supply to some people will sound like a suggestion.
Yes, yes, Well, when I was reading that. I mean, it's so ludicrous and ridiculous. It actually confused me because I never expected you and maybe you've done it. Well, I'm sure you've done it before, but I hadn't read it. I didn't. I never expected you to write satire. I never expected and I'm reading it and I'm like, it's really well written, and it's written as though it's real. So there was this kind of this inner conflict and I'm like, this cannot be possibly, like sure, like I
knew it couldn't be real. And I'm like, surely Gillespo hasn't got this so wrong that he's actually writing this, because this is literally impossible that this would happen for a myriad of reasons. And then of course it's not. It's bullshit. It's tongue in cheek and you say essentially that at the end. But I'm amused that people actually well one that I saw anyway, a lady like she clearly didn't read it, and she's like, I hope this is not true, and I'm like, well, just keep reading.
It's not true, but it's it is. It is indicative or it is kind of insightful of you know what, what can happen. I think RFK is anti fluoride, isn't he like? I think he's a big hat.
I think that's yeah. I think that's one of the things.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's got a whole bloody shopping list of things he wants to get rid of.
Hell, that's starting with the podole, of course, which apparently causes autism. No, it does turn you into a psychopath, but it doesn't cause autism.
That is funny. That is I was about to say it doesn't it make you a doesn't what is it? Paracetamol? Doesn't it make you a temporary sociopath for a few hours or more? Lightheled down the sociopath scale. Yeah, tell me the mechanism. Tell me the mechanism again, I forget you explained to us.
So it's.
We've known for a long time that obviously it's a painkiller, but we don't. No one's ever really been certain about the mechanism for that, just they know that it works. And so there have been some studies done, you know, those sort of university psychology studies where they try all sorts of things, you know, just to keep themselves entertained.
And one of the ones they did was one where they tested people's levels of empathy both when they were on paracetamol and when they weren't, and much to everyone's surprise, there were significant and measurable differences. Now, there is a biochemical reason for it, in that it impairs a certain circuit in the brain where essentially empathy lives in humans and in psychopaths, those neurons, which are called one economone neurons, very very less active, they have a lower density, and
so they have no empathy. But what happens when you take paracetamol is that those the function of those neurons get suppressed by the paracetamol and essentially you turn yourself into a psychopath for the four or so hours that the thing works.
It's bloody hilarious. It's like that. I mean, if you wanted to not feel like if you had to go into a situation where empathy was going to be a limitation for you temporarily, like in terms of having to do something, and that was going to so.
Being an executioner for example.
Yeah, I mean, if you had to chop someone's head off, take a couple of panadol, bibity bobbedy boot as long as you do it within that four hour window, you good.
Yeah, it'll certainly help. There actually have been some serious recommendations around people having to do things which require harming others and being given parasitmol for exactly a tempathy lowering effect. So, for example, surgeons and so on.
I was talking to Tiff I was explained to her, I heard this story about in the First World War when they were sending this was an American podcast I was listening to, but allegedly they were sending all these young you know, farm boys and you know city boys.
I mean, this is what is at nineteen fourteen, the First World War pre television, pre movies essentially pre all that kind of that type of propaganda where all of these kids were just getting shipped off, here's a gun, here's seven minutes of training, go shoot that bloke in the head. And there were like allegedly thousands of them that didn't want to do it, like they didn't want to kill people. So they're shooting above their head or
beside them. And one of the things that they did in an attempt to alleviate this lack of drive to kill people was they started creating all these kind of essentially these propaganda movies elevating the status of or promoting the alpha maleness and desirability of soldiers and war and all of this kind of stuff in an attempt to get these young guys more emotionally and psychologically prepared to go and kill the enemy. Like I never thought of that.
Well, the other thing they did was the other thing they did was give them masses of cocaine.
So so it was a real problem.
Around twenty percent of the population are so empathetic that they would struggle to kill another human no matter what the circumstances, which is a bit of a problem in the military, and so it's always I mean in the US military to this day works very very hard against that, using combat simulation, video games and so on to try
and lower people's empathy about killing others. But yeah, it was a big problem in World War One, and one of the things they did to combat it, and also to combat the other thing which was PTSD as a result of killing people or seeing people be killed around you, was to give them large amounts of cocaine. So cocaine
was dispensed liberally to the troops. Most of them were a significant proportion of them became serious cocaine addicts, and when they came back to Australia, they brought that addiction with them. Luckily it wasn't legal then, I guess, and so you could just love off to your local pharmacy and pick up some cocaine over the counter and no
trouble whatsoever. And so the addictive state actually spread pretty significant amongst Australian population, and at one stage during the nineteen twenties, Australia was the highest per capita cocaine consumer in the world as a direct result of it being freely available.
Well not free, but you know, it wasn't against the law.
You could readily available to see, yeah.
And.
Us introducing it en mass into the population through the troops that were coming back from the war.
TIF can you find out when it became a legal cocaine use became illegal in Australia. I'd like to know that.
That must have I can tell you a little bit about it. So in the nineteen thirties, the government was starting to get a bit worried about the fact that everyone was a cocaine addict and felt that it might be impairing productivity, and so they did bring in regulations requiring pharmacists to only issue cocaine with a script. Pharmacists initially just completely ignored that and the governments did nothing
to enforce it. By the time we got through the Great Depression, he was starting to be enforced pretty regularly, and you pretty much needed a script to get cocaine.
M wow, did you find anything tip like an absolute illegal by date? You can get back to it.
I have taught it to ramble on a lot before giving straight answer.
There's a speak just we'll get onto another top.
To give you a straight answer to you. Wow. Wow.
There's a show on and I don't promote a Netflix really ever, but there's a show on Netflix at the moment called In Waves and More. It might be in War and Waves the other way around, but it's basically about all these Tier one operators that come back from More completely fucked up. It's and all the trauma, and there's a new drug that they're using. I'm only like a third of the way through so it so far, it's fascinating, So I can't say the whole thing, but
I mean enjoying it. But there's a drug called iber Game that they're using now have you heard of that?
David? Oh? What is it? Is it a synthetic something?
Rather, it's a h it's not an opioid, it's a what do they call it?
Oh?
God, everyone, We just had a little melt down there. We were trying to come up with a word, and David Gillespie, who knows all the words, couldn't fucking come up with the words. So I blame him. Too late in the day. For me, it's too late and I'm sixty two, So fucking keep your expectations low. Diff who's literally got one job and that's just define words, couldn't fucking find it with her fat little fingers on her
keyboard over there? Could She couldn't. She couldn't do the one thing she got to do, one thing in half an hour, find a word? All right? Enough about getting high and avoiding shooting people in war and drugs that make you psychopathic. So you wrote an article today about microplastics and the relationship with those on sperm count and fertility. Do tell, Do tell? What's happening there?
Interesting study came out about a month ago. Two hundred men in China having microplastics measured. This is so microplastics are really just particles of PBC or polystyrene.
Mostly it's where most of it.
Measuring how much of it was present in their sperm, And the reason for that was that though first of all wanting to know whether there was any they found rather disturbingly that fifty six percent of them had significant abortion or measurable amounts of microplastics in their sperm. But more disturbingly, they found that that wasn't just interesting fact, it was that there was a direct association between the
amount of microplastic in sperm and your fertility. So now we've talked about fertility a bit over the time, because we really do have a world wide problem with fertility. It's male fertility has been dropping at one percent a year since nineteen thirty eight, so I don't know how many years that.
That's a lot. Eighty seven years, Yeah, so eighty seven percent drop.
Except it's worse than that because since two thousand it's been two and a half percent drop per year, so it's accelerating.
It's accelerating.
So we're in a position now where, you know, finding a fertile mail is starting to get almost impossible, and these guys, you know, there's a lot of people running aroun waving their hands and saying I've got the answer. I understand why this is so, but very few people have been able to nail anything down. Definitive sort of people a sort of saying, oh, modern life, plastics, radiation,
you name it. Everyone's got a reason. These guys were trying to nail down one of the excuses that's often given, which is well, that is given frequently the microplastics. And what they found is yes, there is indeed an association between micropa microplastics, and in particular, if you are in the habit of regularly, and these guys were using them every day, using plastic cut aalry, then you're likely to be most at risk. I guess it's got to do
with it. It's in direct contact with your food. Bits of plastic, tiny microscopic bits of plastic are being broken off the surfaces of that food, of those utensils every day. So using plastic cut rorery had the biggest effect, but there was a big effect in general from heating food
in plastics to so on. The reason I thought this was study was interesting was not so much because of the newsworthy worthiness of that, and there have been news stories over the last few days about this, don't use a plastic knife and fork, It'll make you infertile, which I guess is where you could go from this study. The more interesting thing is what they did after they found that, which is that they went to look at what was the mechanism, So why would microplastics affect your
ability to conceive? And what they found is that what it was doing was triggering, triggering a sort of a panic button, if you like, in in sperm cells, which is something triggered by oxidative stress. So when when cells are under oxidative stress, they usually are triggered to die, particularly where they're important cells carrying DNA that are being
used to create the next generation. Then you don't want that DMA being damaged by something and then going on to make you know, a baby that may not be getting the correct DNA set, and you can have all sorts of introgen generational disease being caused then, so lots of things that are often blamed on those sorts of things, you know, such as autism and down syndrome and so on.
So the body protects itself by self destructing the sperm that it detects have error and usually pretty good at it, and the ones that misses are also protected by a secondary and similar scene in the female which results in
a miscarriage. So that's all well and good, and that's how the microplastics are doing it, and none of that is a particular surprise, except that exactly the same pathway is triggered, and we have known has been triggered for a long time by smoking, for example, So smoking we know does the same thing, and we also know that the cure for that is to tell a man who's thinking about having a baby to stop smoking if he does three months beforehand, because it takes three months to
clear out the sperm, if you like, have them refreshed with a brand new lot that aren't affected by whatever it is you've been doing, consuming microplastics or smoking. And the reason for that is that smoking introduces a whole lot of aldehydes into the system.
And we've talked about aldehydes before that.
Cause DNA disruption and destroy and damage the DNA in sperm cells in particular, which are not very well protected in the body because they make so many of them. So the body's going down the big pen route rather than the long block pen, which is it's better to have a thousand bad ones that you can throw out if they don't work, then have one really really good one. So so that's why that advice has always been given
about smoking. At the start, when they were giving that advice, it was just from observing that ten men tended to have more luck getting women pregnant if they weren't smokers. And then later on the science caught up and we figured out the aldehyde triggering that autooxidation pathway, which is exactly the same thing that they're now picking up with the microplastics. So smoking microplastics very very bad if you want to have babies. The other one that's recently been
picked up is alcohol. Of course, we've always known heavy drinking is bad for conception in males. Now we know why once again, big big producer of aldehydes which have that DNA destructive thing. Once again, cure is the same, stop drinking ninety days before you intend to and eve
and everything should be fine. And then there's the really really big and nasty one that we've talked about before, but which is really really nasty because it's less easy to fix and that is seed oils, so the canola, sunflower, soybean, almond oil, pinut oil, all those sorts of things, the seed oils that are now entrenched in our food supply because they're cheap and theoretically healthy. That's what all the health authorities tell us. But so they've replaced all the
animal fats and so on, and our foods fly. Everything's full of the stuff that produces a particularly nasty aldehyde called for HNE, and four HNE is just as destructive as the alcohol, the ones from alcohol and smoking and microplastics.
The problem with.
It is that, unlike those other three, we don't hang on to microplastics in our our bodies.
We don't hang on too cigaret.
We don't stash a few diurries away for later when we're having a cigarette.
It's a one and done kind of thing. And the same goes for alcohol.
We spend a considerable amount of time and energy getting the alcohol out of our system because it's a poison.
So we don't hang onto that either.
The fats, however, because they are pretty handy for building baby brains, get hung onto and we hang onto them for as long as we possibly can. Because in our natural environment, they're pretty rare. In fact, we hang onto them were on average about six hundred days, so we store them for about six hundred days, so two years.
So the advice is the same if you want to conceive, you know, don't do this thing, except that they don't do this thing is eat anything containing seed oils, which is just about about anything, and don't do it for two years. And when you know that, is it any wonder that male fertility rate is plummeting. It's not just because we use it because we're smoking, drinking. Smoking and drinking have actually improved significantly, but we probably are using
more micro more plastic stuff. But nothing that would explain two and a half percent a year. The thing that explains that is the massive increase in seed oils in our food.
Supply, bloody hell. I wonder like one percent a year since nineteen thirty eight yep, thirty eight, you know, which was whatever, eighty seven percent and now it's gone up. The rate has increased. I mean, if there's no intervention or effective intervention, or there's no strategy or there's no I mean what we've spoken about this a little bit, or we haven't spoken about the thalatees or the plastics or the you know whatever. But but like, this is
not something that's generally been discussed. It's something that affects everyone, men and women. Like this is a catastrophic health issue.
And yeah, you think, well, I wonder in twenty and fifty, which ain't really that far away, you know, so twenty five years from now, at the current rate of progression, what's happening, Like, what's the population of Australia, what's the how many babies are being born here, what's the infertility rate, what's you know, I wonder what the real world reality will be.
Then increasingly we'll be relying on what we would describe as third world countries where the seed oil conglomerates haven't bothered destroying the food supply. Because this seed oil issue is largely a Western problem, because it's it's in our takeaway food, it's in all of our fried food, and it's on it is much less of a problem in countries that aren't exposed to the standard American diet.
And so.
The breeders, if you like that, the people who will still be able to conceive reasonably easily are going to be people who are not exposed to that diet in any significant quantity, and so you will increasingly see countries like Australia and the United States and the UK and Europe and someone relying on immigrants for children and less on their own population growth. And you can already see that in the population numbers. And there's lots of lovely
narratives about why that is. Oh, we're richer, you know, women work more, et cetera, et cetera, and all those things are true, but there's also this underlying thing going on, which is biochemically, we're destroying our ability to reproduce, and no one seems to be doing much about it because everyone's running around looking for these far fetched explanations like whether not you use plastic knives and forks, which do explain a bit of it, but which are nowhere near the real problem.
I wonder, is the impact on women the same, Like, is it a comparable impact physiological consequence for women and men?
No, not at all.
So women are actually pretty well protected against this stuff. They have a fairly good redundant protection protection system. You want to remember, it's a different They are using the mont Blanc method. They get all the eggs they're going to get right from the start.
If I hope you take I hope you're taking notes with yeah there.
So they're going with the do it properly protected well method, whereas sperm's going with NA make three hundred million of them.
What happens if we lose a few hundred million doesn't matter. Only one's got work.
So, Tiff, are you a little bit?
Well?
That happens to the man, and this happens to the women. Are you a little bit? What about me?
Though? I haven't be on what what about the hybrids?
What about Tiff and her hybrid friends who have got one foot in each camp?
I can't comment on the biology of tift friend.
Oh gosh, so I mean, yeah, wow. So I guess the or part of the solution is just education and awareness and you getting out there with your little bloody megaphone at every opportunity and just informing the masses. But there's no there's no quick fix, is there, Because it's not I mean, what you bring to our attention is not something that's uh spoken about a lot or or you know, in fact, it's you know, I'm sure there are people who go David Gillespie doesn't know what he's
talking about. I believe you, I'm sure of I'm sure of your research, and I tell people about seed oils as well. But there are a lot of people who are out there sharing a different idea or a different message.
Right, Yeah, that's true.
But if you take the chain of things that I was talking about there, so the oxidation, the four HNE, the damage to DNA, all of those things. You take that chain of things, so you will find really really high quality science supporting every single one of those statements. There are very few people putting them together and saying, well, if all of these things are true, then you have an explanation.
But it is the case.
There's not one element of that where someone could seriously come to you and say, now, what he said about four HME is a load of rubbish.
It's perfectly harmless.
Every scientist on the planet would agree, No, it is extremely dangerous aldehyde, and it does just r upstan and it is a bad thing to introduce a sperm. All of those individual facts, you will find plenty of very
reputable scientists who will agree on. What you won't find too many of is people who put all of those things together in a line and saying, yeah, but what does this add up to and is there a possibility that explains why we're blowing away our ability to reproduce at the rate of two and a half percent a year. By the way, it's slightly higher illustrate. It's about three percent a year in Australia, but the world average is two and a half.
That is a staggering like three percent doesn't seem much, but every year is terrifying.
Particularly when we're approaching the floor.
So the flaw of viable reproductive capacity is around the ten million mark. And you know there are now average readings in the Australian population that are between twenty and thirty million, and readings from the nineteen forties were up in the hundreds of millions, three and four hundred minute, so you know we're already approaching the floor.
Mm hmmmm. Well, so it's a good thing. I'm past my use by dat. I don't need to worry. I'm like fucking old cart and the milk just sitting on the fucking shelf, just fucking next to it, next to a wilted flour. Somebody just come along and fucking pop me in the bin. If I was going to ask you what oils you use to Do you cook with oil or do you just put cold oil on salads? Or like, what's your go to?
I use olive oil and coconut oil.
Yeah, both good calls.
But it's not so much the the oil you add yourself.
It's the oil that's hidden in food you buy.
So speak to the cookie shop lady and see what she's using.
Usually the answer.
Usually the answer is the cheapest one they can get, because no one can taste the difference.
Hey, speaking of oils, do you know what phenoles are? Have you heard of that PhD in ols? That like the levels of phenols in oil and in olive oil in that so, yeah, you can tell me about this. I don't know if this is bullshit, but they say that high. I think in olive oil, like in Australia it's typically under three hundred whatever's per desoleta.
Or I have every now and then looked at this phenol thing and never been able to find any convincing science about it. I know that it comes in waves of people worrying about it, but I honestly there's some stuff there, but nothing that convinces me that it's even worth writing a piece about.
Honestly, I coach I won't say who, and obviously, but I coach someone who owns an olive grove and they produce this and the all over it like they are very high phenol. I think it's like six hundred and fifty plus per whatever. Whatever the measurement is, the normal measurements under two fifty. This is like three or four x that, and they rave about it anyway.
I'd much I'd be much more interested in an olive oil in what percentage of the olive oil is a Mega six fat? So it varies quite a bit with olive oil, and some of them can are not necessarily better than the seed oils they're replacing, and some of them are a lot better. So that varies between about ten percent and up to around twenty percent. And I wish people would focus on that rather than the phenoles.
On the world famous David Gillespie fat scale, ten out of ten being the healthiest yep on your scale the Gillespie scale, what do you give olive oil?
What numbers are it's on the borderline, like it's on the it'll do right if if you if you must have a liquid fat.
There aren't a lot of choices. It'll do.
It's on the arginly safe side of the borderline. So I'm not going to against not going to say to people they shouldn't have olive oil.
But yeah, it's also not something i'd rave about.
So you'd give it a six maybe out of ten?
Yeah, six, seven, something like that.
And what would you give butter?
Oh nine, that's ten. Nine depends what the cow eight? But yeah, nine or ten?
And what would you give lard.
Ten?
No, it depends what the pig eight Because pigs so lard obviously it's pig fat.
But and pigs are omnivores like us.
So if the pig was raised on a grain diet, was a grain fed pig like ninety seven percent of pigs in Australia, then it's probably a three or a four. If the pig was raised, you know, on open forage, then it's probably an eight or nine. Because they're omnivores like us, they store all the amega six they eat, and of their eat they're fed a lot of omega six. They've got a lot of omega six in their fat.
And I'm guessing it's a similar story for tallow.
So tallow is beef fat.
It's always going to be a ten, simple because ruminants like cows don't store any more than about three percent of their body fat has polyunsaturate, so it doesn't really matter what they're fed. I know, people get all up and down about you know, he's a grass feed is a grain fed. Yeah, there'll be slightly worse fat profile in a grain fed beef, but not that much worse because the absolute limit is three percent.
Anyway, what did you say you have tiff? Did you say coconut oil? Did you say that? Or did you coconut?
What is a good nine or ten?
Is there anyone that I've missed out that you want to give a tick?
There's that one to know the name of the name escapes me. The one that's very very popular in India that's basically rendered butter.
Note gee, that's the one. Yeah, yeah, very very very high that one.
But if you're going to cook, if you're going to do frying in oil, the best one is to pop down to the supermarket and get super fry, which is sold in the little red cubes of foil and that's just rendered beef fat.
Very good choice.
There you go, There you go. I'm actually getting a little bit hungry now, but we've got another podcast straight after this, so that's kind of inconvenient. Yeah, perfect. Where can people find you and follow you? And is there anything you want to plug? You're pushing a book, you're pushing.
We will be pushing a book next year, but at the moment we're not pushing a book. But if you want to read the articles that I've been talking about, including the zempic one, then you can just go over to David Gillespie dot org. So just my name dot org and you'll be able to find all this stuff there, including this interview.
Well you're perfect. Yes, I saw that. We've better wrap this up so I can tell you tip secret.
Yes, I'm desperate.
Maybe she can