I get a team. Welcome to another installing the you project. I just fucked up the first one and then said a whole lot of bad words and Tip's going to edit that out. But it would make a brilliant reel. But Tiff, do not make it a real because while some might laugh hysterically, a few would probably want me withdrawn from the interwebs.
We don't need that.
Mattie Lansdowne, who's got Craig Harper still written on his screen, joins.
Us, Hi, Matthew Maddie, Hello, sir, how are you?
Is it actually Mattie or Matthew.
I'm assuming it's Matthew, but I've never heard you or anyone refer to you as Matthew.
If you meet my parents, you'll hear them call me Matthew or my sister. But outside of that, pretty much everybody calls me Maddie and then matt was like in a work environment. Was always when I had a day job, that was where people call me matt. Now if I hear matt or Matthew, I'm a bit like, what's going on?
Do you have any Like?
I know you played footy and pretty good footballer, did you have any like mates or teammates who called your fucking Lando or something like did you did you have a did you have the equivalent of a jumbo? I bet you're jealous of that. Did you have a nickname?
Not really, to be honest. Everyone used to just call me landsdown or pants down.
That's about it.
Wow. What about you, Cookie?
Did you? I mean I call you cookie periodically? Did you have any nicknames?
Oh? No, just tiff just really yeah.
Wow.
Everyone in my circle when I was growing up everyone had a nickname, like virtually nobody. I mean, I mean they got called that, but typically everyone as well would have another name or two.
I had many names, but anyway, Yeah.
I was always jealous that I didn't have a nickname. It's like everybody had one but me, And I was like, why do I get called my actual name?
How boring is that?
I think I've said this once since seventeen hundred episodes, but I can wheel it out again. I trained a grid iron team in the Believe it or not, Victoria here in the southern environment of Australia has a grid iron league. What they actually, I don't know if it does anymore. American Football League and back in the day. I worked with a team who were called the Southern Bulls. And let's just say that Cardio vashkular fitness and conditioning prior to me arriving was not high on the list.
It wasn't like an absolute priority. So when I rocked up, I mean, obviously they there were some expat ex Americans and some pretty reasonably talented Australians and there was eight teams in the state league, and so they played just like a normal season, including finals and all of that. And I rocked up and I nearly killed them, and so they just called me doctor Death, right, and then that took off, and then eventually after then they just called me Death. And then so at social functions and
this is not nice, is it. This is back before I had any kind of profile. But and then the wives and kids would meet me and it's like, oh, you know, Donna, this is Death. I'm like, oh, hi, Donna, I've heard about you, Death. Oh you flog the boys and so and then kids would be like hi Death. I'm like hi kid. I'm like, you know, the bloody the nickname you don't want. That is a terrible That is a terrible nickname and probably a story that we
could have avoided. Maddie, we didn't do this last time that we spoke, but just give people a snapshot who maybe have never met you on any podcast of who you are, your job, your quolls and kind of what you do.
Sure, So I am Maddie Maddie Lansdowne without a nickname, but I'm a scientist, or I was a scientist. I used to work in a cancer research hospital. I worked for a company in nutritional epigenetic research as well doing lipid metabolism's kind of work for my honors degree. And then after I guess I did that sort of main work and became a molecular biologist. I worked in a cancer nutrition but also vaccines early on in my career as well, so massive nerd basically, and then afterwards I
went through this sort of transformation. And what I mean by that is just working in the hospital system realizing it wasn't overly helpful in a chronic disease scenario and no one was dealing with the cause of disease. Everyone's
just sort of medicating everyone to death. I would argue your nickname, and so I got really passionate about nutrition and alternative medicine, and then I went back to UNI and did a clinical nutrition degree, and I also then got qualified in becoming sort of a coach for emotional binge and overeaters as well, and then there was a bit of eating disordered stuff in there as well. So and yeah, now run a podcast how to Not Get
Sick and Die, which is doing pretty well. And yeah, I work with most mostly people that are sort of forty to sixty years old, on emotional binge and overeating and all of that naturally includes weight loss as well.
And while we're plugging the shit out of everything, TIF, do you have a podcast?
Oh? I do, thanks for us, Roll with the Punches.
What's it called?
Roll with the Punches?
Wow? Sometime amazing, amazing.
So, Maddie, we're all got a bunch.
I've got a bunch of random things.
I want to ask you about things that I think most of us, not all of us, but most of us will be interested to know your thoughts on one is I want you to speak to hydration. You hear shit like, oh, half the population are regularly dehydrated. I don't know if that's true. I don't know if that's not true. And the eight glasses of water, which clearly is probably redundant and ridiculous because eight glasses for who, and how much do you weigh?
And how hot is it and how much do you sweat?
But tell us about your thoughts and I guess advice around staying well hydrated.
Yeah, so, I mean super important, and I would agree that most people on a day to day basis are, although I think that's changed a lot in the course of my experience of being in the world of health and nutrition. People are a lot more conscious of their water intake now, but a lot of people end up overeating or snacking because they're confusing the signals of yeah, I guess hydration or a lack of hydration, and eating
because it feels much easier to or much. You get to the goal much more rapidly by eating as opposed to drinking. So and I find as well a lot of people I work with, you know, some of their challenges with food.
If we can get the if we can get.
The hydration right on a day to day basis, which changes by the way, you know, if you're you know, out on the weekend, doing some laboring at home or figuring out what you're doing to move around the backyard and landscape and that kind of stuff. You know, you're going to need more water than you do when you're sitting in an office, you know, Monday to Friday type things, so that that amount varies whether you go to the gym. But the other part of hydration which gets missed a
lot is the electrolytes. It's the minerals, because hydration is not just water in it's the balance of water and electrolytes, or water and minerals. And so I think it's really easy to forget about that mineral piece because if we go back to the eating, and I keep defaulding that that's my experience. But is that satiation and feeling full, like you know, you get enough after you've eaten enough, or not wanting to binge eat or crave sugar afterwards.
That satiation is governed in the gut, often by some of your minerals and electrolytes that you consume with your or you should consume with your food. A lot of those electrolytes come through your food, but you can also buy you know, lots of different sashets, not talking about fluorescent blue, you know, power aid catorade kind of stuff. There's plenty of sugar in that, and there's usually usually
a limited amount of electrolytes. But if you're eating a whole real food diet, you can get a lot of the electrolytes you need. But if you're working out a bit, you know, you're outside a bit, you're sweating a bit, then you possibly want to add in some kind of electrolytes supplement, which is going to balance your hydration.
What's going to get the tick?
Because I feel like there's a lot of hydration supplements in inverted commas double asterisk that are kind of shit that like sports strings are essentially fucking flat lemonade.
Yeah, basically, well, I mean there's a few different brands out there where you can get Sody Sodi. They're pretty good, so they're sort of often the top of the list, and they're kind of the Australian version of Element, which appears a lot in the US sort of health and wellness market. Yeah, but the main thing you want to avoid if possible. It's not always possible, but yeah, is the added sugar, you know, the unnatural flavors. Because the other side of that is that if you have just
electrolytes in a drink. I don't know if anyone's ever done that without any flavoring whatsoever. It's not going to be a drink you want to do too often because it's not amazing. It doesn't taste very good. Magnesium and calcium and all that kind of stuff as powders not that fun.
And I think you also made a good point because you were suggesting that you didn't say this, but you kind of said it in directly, that our hydration requirements are not static. They vary depending on a bunch of different factors.
You know. It's like, well, I'm outside all day running around.
I did twenty thousand steps and it was a hot day, and versus the day I did three thousand steps because I was mainly inside watching Netflix and eating chocolate, you know, and I had two wheas and I got off the couch twice, you know, So like I might literally need twice the water intake, all the hydration whatever, depending on what I do from Monday Tuesday.
Right, Yeah, completely, And it reminds me of I was on a coaching call this morning where I'm one of the clients, and somebody had mentioned that they were doing seventy five hard because there's the other side of hydration, which is, you know, seventy five hard. You have to
consume like four leads or something plus a day. And there's actually been accounts where people have died doing seventy five hard because if you don't balance your water intake with electrolytes, there's a huge bias to one direction, right, and so that and that's the water side of it.
And so what you do is you wash out a lot of your electrolytes in the process, and it probably drives cravings as well, because you want your body is probably wanting to balance that with electrolytes, so you need food to get all of the minerals back in to balance it. So you know, you can actually overdo hydration and wash out a lot of the things you need in your urine.
Is that called hype inatremia or something like that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, you and I and maybe Tiff we could start a new program called seventy five really fucking easy? How good would that be to market? Beni Zella, seventy five easy? You've heard of seventy five hard? But wait, all right, so my next one a million kids in the gym. Nearly every kid in the gym that I see, and let me clarify, kid fifteen to twenty year old. I'm just going to use that age
kind of group. Nearly every kid that I see, and I'm mainly boys here in the gym use pre workouts, which are essentially stimulants, right with a bunch of caffeine or guarana or both and a bunch of other shit, which to me would seem if you're sixteen year old, sixteen years old, you probably don't need a heap of stimulants. I don't think anyone does. But tell us about your thoughts on those.
Yeah, I would agree.
I think at fifteen to twenty you're sort of, you know, in the peak of testosterone, the peak of all of the hormones, human growth hormone.
I don't think you necessarily need creatine.
There's so many studies on creatine and it's probably one of the most studied supplements ever, and there's very little research to say that it does anything particularly bad. But yeah, I don't think fifteen to twenty year olds need to do it. I don't think anybody really needs to use it unless they're really serious about stacking on muscle and getting on stage or pushing themselves. I guess through sport at an older age, maybe very low risks to creatine.
But at the same time I think, yeah, stimulants like I don't do coffee or anything like that. If some people need them, they need them, but definitely not young boys that are like testosterone human growth hormone loaded.
Yeah.
I do cretane every day. Everyone just saying I'm not a recommendation, just full disclosure. I do about ten grams maybe eight ten, which is like almost two teaspoons. And for me, again this is anecdotal. For me, it helps me recover. It's not like matt said, it's not a stimulant. Matti said, it's not a stimulant at all. But also, which has only been highlighted in the last year or two in a significant way, is that it's a nootropic
in that it's a cognitive enhancer. There's quite a bit of research out to suggest that it can improve focus, concentration, cognition in general. So and it's like also you said, I think, Mattie, it's one of the most researched and you know, like safest things you can take for that, but or that you can take better. Yeah, the pre workout stuff, the stimulant stuff. And I think also with that, am I right in thinking that? Like with those, you know, your body adapts and so you just kind of shut
down your receptors. So to get the same nervous system sponse over time, you're going to need more of it. Like if I take you know, one hundred grams or milligrams of caffeine, over time, I might need to take two hundred milligrams to get the same nervous system response.
Well, I was going to ask you that, have you noticed that any kind of tolerance build up? You know, how many years have you been doing it?
With what creatine?
Yeah, well there's no real I don't find any kind of stimulant effect at all with that. But but I know, you know, like with the only stimulant I have is well, I have coffee and tea. It's funny they say tea's got the same amount of caffeine as coffee. Tea does nothing to me in terms of that, you know, coffee does. Coffee does. Like I have an a rhythmia which is genetic, which doesn't really cause me any major problems every now and then I feel a little flutter, you know, just
when I catch myself in the mirror. But ah, sad, really, isn't it. But yeah, but if I have say, two strongish coffees, I'm fine as long as they're not close together. But if I have a third one, sometimes that just sets things off a little bit. So yeah, I really need to pay attention. But what do you think of coffee?
I mean, I know you don't drink coffee because every time you and you and I catch up, the people at the Hamptons hate you because you spend zero dollars and you take a chair and then from water, Yeah, and you drink their free water and I just apologize for you for an hour. Like there's a lot of I guess, anecdotal evidence or conversation at least to say, you know, like a lot of people rave about the benefits of coffee thoughts.
I think there's definitely benefits to coffee. I think the way that it is used is not always beneficial. And I think there's an important distinction there because a lot of people, you know, they have it before they've been out of bed for ten minutes, and really you should be waiting so when you wake up in the morning, you have this natural rise in cortisol, so your stress hormone,
and you know that hormone is not always bad. A lot of people sort of only ever hear about it in the context of like, intense stress, cortisol is bad.
Cortisol is not all bad.
It can be bad in situations, but if your cortisol is part of waking you up and getting you conscious for the day, and so a lot of people try to use coffee to override that kind of foggy feeling that you have in the morning when you wake up and your body is still waking up, and so they sort of take a hit of coffee to override that. But if you don't let it get to its natural peak and then have coffee, what you're doing is essentially you're trying to heat the room whilst the air conditioner
is on. You're giving yourself a dose of cortisol at the same time that your cortisole is naturally going up, which is why the crash is so hard, because you didn't act get to your normal stable level of cortisole
release before then adding the stimulation on top. And a lot of people that actually wait ninety minutes to two hours before their first coffee, which I know for some people is like and you know, it sounds like a crime, but you'll actually notice that the three pm slump and that sort of you know, when you wear off where the coffee wears off in mid afternoon, that crash will be much less intense than it would be otherwise because coffee is not as much a stimulant as it is
a sleep preventter. So the molecule in the brain that is a dentoceine, and so coffee blocks so a denosine basically builds up over the course of the day, and we get to a place where there's so much a dentisceine that we fall asleep, and so coffee blocks a
dentoscene from a binding to the receptor. So the second that that coffee wears away, there's like a bit of a tsunami or a wave of this a dentosceine build up that smashes the receptors, which is why all of a sudden you feel this huge drop in energy because you've just gotten to that point where the brain and the body has used up all the coffee and the caffeine and so now we can. You know, we've been holding back this the dentis scene, which hasn't stopped building up there and then it crashes.
But that crash is far less.
If you let your body get to its natural quartisol peak before you introduce the stimulant in the morning.
Well, theoretically brilliant. Practically I won't be doing it, but thanks for the heads up. Thanks as if I'm waiting for two hours from my first coffee. What's wrong with you? Yeah?
I know, that's what I mean. It's wrong with you. Speaking of sleep and the impact of different factors on sleep, Professor tell us about food and the relationship with how close I eat to sleep time. So let's say I want to be asleep at ten. In fact, I'm going to say nine. I'm going to personalize this because at the moment I'm trying to be asleep by nine ish because I'm getting up at stupid cl and walking early, and so by the time I get to the cafe
quught to past six. Of most mornings, I've walked five k's or thereabouts, right, And I guess the old I don't know if it's science or it's just you know, a folk tale is that you know, you shouldn't get too close to dinner because it interrupts your sleep.
What's the actual science?
Yeah, one hundred percent agree with that. So my general recommendation for most people would ideally be three hours between finishing dinner. So let's say you're put in the last bite in your mouth at six and then if you go on a bed at nine, that would be that would be a good thing to aim for. You can have liquids in between, you know, and by liquids I don't mean alcohol, I mean water, electrolyte, kind of drinks that would be okay before bed. Obviously not coffee, not
tea that are stimulating. We don't want to do that before bed. But the reason is, well, there's heaps of reasons why we don't want to be digesting when we're asleep. So one, in order to get good sleep, the body actually changes its temperature, right, so it drops drops two degrees. However, if you lay down and you've still got digesting to do, you'll find that you have a really restless night and you'll be tossing and turning and waking up a lot. And the reason for that is that part of your
brain will be saying it's sleep time. Let's cool the body down, and your gut will then be like, hang on, what are you doing. We need to turn the temperature
back up to effectively digest what is in here. And so you have this back and forth of this temperature fluctuations and you might notice your you know, the dove goes on and off, or the sheets go on and off and on and off, because your body feels like it's going through these heat cycles, heat and cooling cycles, which they it really is until you actually finally digest.
And because you're horizontal, you're also slowing down that digestive process simply by not using gravity, by sitting up, by not you know, allowing it to move through your system as it normally would. So you're sort of wrestling this temperature thing, but also this lack of gravity that's going on as well.
So that can make sleep.
Super disruptive if you go to bed too soon after eating, because you're, yeah, you're not letting your body drop into that temperature range, which means optimal sleep will happen.
Wow, Can I throw my training partner the crab under the bus and tell the world right now that the ball of muscle that is the crab. The X pro bodybuilder that is the crab frequently gets up in the middle of the night to eat, Like he wakes up at two o'clock hungry and then we'll just go eat cake, toast peanut butter. He's been known to eat a whole jar of peanut butter with a spoon, like sitting on the couch with a I don't know, five hundred gram,
maybe two hundred and fifty gram. So I'm suggesting I'm guessing that's no good for him.
Well, I guess it always comes down to what are your personal goals, right, Because if you're trying to keep an amount of muscle on your body that is very disproportionate to what your natural body would hold, then yeah, you obviously need to eat a lot more and reduce the amount of fasting window that you're in because otherwise your body's going to find a way to burn some of that. So yeah, obviously someone that's lifting heavy, that's really making an effort would probably you know, benefit.
From eating more.
But you know, it's like, are we getting ripped or are we getting healthy? You know, they're not always the same thing, right, Yeah, And if you're not sleeping correctly for years because you want to look good naked, which we all do. Then what's the payoff for that? Longevity wise? Do you wipe off five years of your life long term? Like? And nobody knows the answer to that. It's impossible to calculate until you cark it. But yeah, I guess it
depends on your goals. And I don't know many people that don't feel fucking fantastic after a good night's sleep.
Yeah, it's so true.
I mean, I know this ain't really a podcast about sleep, but it is so true. It's almost like, I mean, I know there's a million variables, Well there's not. There's probably ten or twelve important variables in terms of just health and longevity, but like major ones. But I reckon, I reckon sleep and maybe even anxiety are near that. If you can manage anxiety, way easier said than done. And sometimes, of course there's a relationship between sleep, poor
sleep and anxiety. But I think, yeah, if you could every day get eight hours of great sleep or whatever your number is, Fuck, that's an amazing headstart on life, isn't it.
Oh?
Absolutely, the way that it informs your cravings, you know because if quite literally, if you think about it, if you sleep for eight hours and that technically produces enough fuel or capacity to deal with the sixteen hours of awakeness, and you do that every day, then you don't need to overreach for the energy that you need to run your body, whereas if you sleep six hours or less,
then you're running the tank empty. And so what do you do in those extra two hours, Well, you get tired, and so you need to put extra calories in to stay conscious. So then you eat, and because you're tired, and if you're staying up late a lot, there's probably
something stressful going on in your life. Those food choices become worse and worse over time because it's like convenience and care factor by the end of the day or by the middle of the morning when you're staying up until and plus your insulin and your blood sugar disregulate far more when you're underslept as well, and arguably the whole point of that happening is to drive you to
go and find resources because you don't feel amazing. So those sugar cravings aren't just there to annoy you, they're there to basically go and get more fuel because the body is trying to find a solution to whatever energy and balance is happening right now.
I want to revisit something that we've spoken about once before, and that is protein requirements and RDIs And just because a lot of people listening to their show work out. A lot of people, men and women, old and young, go to the gym, and a lot of people and it's not so much we're not talking about being the crab. We're just talking about building muscle and strength and functions so that into our older years we're you know, we're
fully operational, or we're optimally operational. For our genetic potential, you know, we're as good as we can be. Right Like, I'm sixty one, I've for my age and for my genetic potential. I have a lot of muscle, I have a lot of strength. And that's because I do the things, not because it's natural to me, not because I'm lucky or genetically gifted. That's just because I do the things
that create that outcome. With that in mind, you know, there are a lot of people, Mattie, I think that you know, sleep okay, train pretty well, try pretty hard, have a pretty good attitude, but maybe I'm not getting enough protein. And we're not talking about mountains of protein here, everybody. We're not talking about, you know, being a buffhead or a meathead. But so the RDI I think we've spoken to is zero point eight grams per kilogram of body weight.
I think on the Australian recommendations, or a lot of people think maybe somewhere closer to one point five gram of protein per kilo of.
Body weight or thereabouts. What are your thoughts around that?
Yeah, I completely agree.
I think the thing to remember is that the recommendations for food nutrients, micronutrients, macro nutrients, the main goal of them is to produce a population that isn't dying. That doesn't mean optimal, right, because if you think about what needs to go into making food recommendations to the masses, and if you think about it from a government standpoint, we need to make sure that the population doesn't get devastatingly ill. We need to make sure the farmers and
the imports can manage that degree of food recommendation. And we don't want to send the food companies that we're sort of recommending for, we want to send them broke. So there's an economic factor to it. So it's an enormous macroeconomic sum that goes into making those recommendations. But the whole point of me giving you that backstory is to say, it's not about optimal health, you know, it's about running the country. And there are two very different
ways to look at recommendations. It's like the difference between going to a naturopath or a doctor. The doctor will look at your bloods and say, well, you're not dead yet, fantastic, see you next week. The naturopath will say you are a long way away from optimal and there's a lot we can do. So I'm more on the natural health side,
as you've probably figured out by now. But yeah, so leaning definitely towards more towards one point five one point eight grams per kilogram of body weight, you know, sometimes up to two grams. I definitely do close to two grams per kilogram of body weight for myself.
I think I would too.
So what that means everyone, And again not a recommendation, but if just she wanted to figure out the math, So if you did, for example, if you weigh sixty kilos like Tiff, ways give or take sixty kilos, so if she was working on one point five grams per kilo body weight, she would need about ninety grams of
protein per day. In fact, I would think someone like Tiff, who's got a lot of muscle and trains hard, and I would think, this is just my guestimation, that Tiff would probably be closer to two in terms of because she she boxes, she lifts, she runs, she's a high energy human. She doesn't fucking sit down. You know, do you reckon you be closer to to Tiff in terms of your requirement?
Yeah?
I reckon, Yeah, Yeah, I think so too.
Right, last question, Then we're going to wind up.
So you spoke before about we all want to be ripped and blah blah blah, but you know that comes at a cost. And you know what's the cost if we're fucking jacked and ripped and we've got veins on our eyelids, but we live.
Five years younger or less.
Right, Yeah, And this is not an easily answerable question. There's probably no definitive answer. But like when we look at somebody like Tiff who is naturally pretty lean and puts on muscle naturally, and it's probably a little bit atypical and there are you know, most people who work out. I would think most people like and this is just my guestimate everyone, but I think most people forty and over, I think probably their priority is health and wellness and function.
But we all want to look good, you know. I don't want to look terrible. I want to look as good as I can. I've got an ego. But if I had to choose between being healthy and functional or looking good, I'm going healthy and functional, right, because I don't want to be a dead, good looking corpse, you know. And so tell me a little bit about women and body fat percentages, because we know that men can be typically somewhere around ten to fifteen percent body fat and
relatively functional and hormonally well. But that's not always the case for women, is it.
No, And that's because of the natural variation in body
shape for women, which is like dramatic. And I say I highlight the word natural because there's so many different, you know, people from different cultures and that have naturally curvaceous hips or naturally shapely boobs and bums and that kind of thing, whereas there's also you know, the sort of stick thin, strong muscular women as well, you know, so there's a huge variation, and I would say a much greater variation in female bodies than there is for men.
So I think it's very much a personal thing. Although you know, obviously there's generic recommendations for body fat percentage, but it's very difficult to apply to the individual without the individual sitting in front of you so you can
see their natural frame. And often, you know, if you're already with somebody that has a significant amount of body fat on them, you might not be able to see their natural frame, but you might be able to identify it from photos from ten or twenty or thirty years ago. Not that anybody should try and be who they used
to be. We want to move forward, but understanding someone's natural sort of body and predisposition to body fat percentage is important before you go recommending it, generally speaking for women, and again general is vague, but if you go start going under twenty percent, you're going to start messing with your hormones. But some women sit there or a little bit lower anyway. But often, and often the athletes I
saw tiff fulls and faces there. But often when it comes to bodybuilding athletes, boxes they are they've got amn area, you know, because they've forced themselves to such low body fat percentages that they don't have a cycle anymore. Their hormones are cooked, and it's not uncommon to see the fittest, you know, the fit girls in the gym to find out that they're not actually having a period. You know, it's very common. So you know, there's multiple sides of
the conversation. But I'd be hesitant to recommend any percentage number because there's such a great variation.
I think that's very wise and prudent. Grasshop just quickly, because we've got to go to what's your body fat at the minute? Do you reckon percentage wise?
I don't know, but I know that when I was actively training and fighting the last time I had a test for an accurate reading then I was ten ten, I know that the scanned amount of fat in my body was something like five kilograms of fat because I remember I was going to drop weight for a fight and then I did a scan and went, oh, I probably probably can't lose three kilos right now.
I probably can't lose probably can't. But it's always a sorry tiff.
No, Yeah, I was just going to mention doctor Stacy Simms, who I've spoken to, talks about this for female athletes, and when we did, we talked about that there's a term called low energy availability, and she'd mentioned two things that indicate that. One is stress fractures. And in my first amateur novice title, I won with a stress fracture in my spine my transverse process, and also I lowin and I had two weeks before found out I had
low liine. Not one health or coach or anyone around me at the time ever mentioned looking at how much you're eating, how are you fueling yourself? Why have these
two things happened? So it's really interesting women, we don't know what the cost of how active we are is and when you go from being skinny fat to an athlete and your body kind of weighs the same, or I actually weighed more when I started boxing, but I leaned up, but I had no understanding of what that meant and how that translated into health.
Always interesting to chat to both of you, Maddie. Where can people connect with you?
How to Not get sick and Die podcast YouTube, all of the Spotify, Apple podcast platforms, all that kind of stuff.
Real Weight Loss Coach is what.
I am now on Instagram, So come and hang out there if you want to get healthy and yeah, Maddie Lansdowne dot com for anything else.
Superstar Champion R Tiff. Thank you, Mattie, Thank you, audience, Thanks you. Next time,