I'll get at and welcome to another installment of the show. The show that is your favorite podcast. Well maybe maybe not, but some of you it's favorite podcast because you tell us and thank you. And also, if you're not a member of the Facebook group that we have, which is creatively called the You Project Facebook group, I know Tiff and I worked on that for fucking weeks. We rang David, he consulted, We had a team, you know, pr advertising, branding, marketing.
We came up with that. Feel free to get involved. And not only is it good because it's a good community, but David James, Kevin Patrick Gillespie writes articles and puts some of them up there for your perusal and cognitive and emotional and psychological digestion.
Tiff High, Hi Phil, You're on fire today?
The only Child? Pick the only Child? You know what? Last night?
Hi David, Hey, how's it going, Graig?
But thank you? Last night I did a workshop called pre Season twenty twenty five for anyway, just talking about getting our shit together in the next year, as we always do before the end of the current year that we're in. But I had I shouldn't say this, but fuck it. Whatever, little credibility I have left. I'm just going to say to the world. Every now and then, about once a month, I have a nicorette, two milligram nicorette because it just wow. So last night was the night,
and I also had with me. I had a coffee and a coke, so I had double caffeine and nicotine. And I know a lot of my listeners are right now disappointed. I do not smoke, don't do drugs, don't do booze. But about once a month I have a two milligram nickeline.
How could you fit the smoking and the booze in with all of that?
I know, I know. Fuck. I was on fire. My brain was just it was just the only problem was at midnight, when I'm usually three hours into my slumber, it's fucking noz's to be seen. Do you sleep well? Go less bo ah?
Yeah?
Usually Do you have a particular you probably don't worry about it because you know that I reckon two things that we're going to get to the topic at hand. But I reckon two things that a lot of people don't think about because it doesn't affect them, but it does affect a lot of people. One is a lot of people don't sleep well, like I reckon maybe half the population. And the other less glamorous one is that
a lot of people don't shit well. The amount of people that are constipated that I've worked with over the last forty years. TIF, do you do both of those well?
TIF? For you comfortable with him revealing these things about.
You, well, I notice that he's just gone straight to eat it for a public report of my bow movements quite regularly. Quite good sleep has always been a challenge woman, But I'm really I've really got on top of that over the recent times. What have you changed A strong bedtime routine. I've got to be quite good with that. I mean, just an early riser always. But if I don't wind down well and have a routine and get
the I've got to be a nana. If if I'm not winding down before ten, it is party time in my brain until at least three am, wide awake.
Well, don't do caffeine and nicotine before bed.
Well, that's a hard note for me.
It's hard.
It's a lunch and I'm cut off there.
Yeah.
In general, avoid stimulants, I mean, nicotine and caffeine are obvious ones, but the ones people don't realize they're taking on the electronic ones. So you play computer games, you get on social media, you do some online gambling, all of those things.
In short and the online gambling.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And I know you quite know what we're talking about here, but you know, Craig might, you know, don't do porn either, just just before you go to sleep. It's all of these things give you a dopamine spike, and it's going to make it really hard for your brain to calm down.
Do you know what I see a lot of is kids in the gym. Well, think about young Jamie at the gym, tiff nearly every time you see her, the Crabs kid. She walks into the gym every day with a red bull.
I know, in the PM, in the PM.
Yeah, and she's not alone. And I'm not throwing her under the bus because I would say seventy eighty percent of the teenage kids that train in the gym they have some kind of stimulant before they train or after they train, or both very very and they have this thing that you may or may not have heard of. David called and I'm not being facetious. And there's a
whole different, bloody plethora of them. But they call them pre workout drinks, and basically they're just stimulants, central nervous system stimulants.
All right, So I can of coke, it's.
Yeah, but times four, so it might have instead of forty grams of caffeine, or have one hundred and sixty grams of caffeine. I mean, razy crazy amounts, but yeah, these and then I reckon the biggest consumers of those particular energy drinks are children. Well by that, I mean people are under twenty, you know, anyone speaking of junk food. By the way, everyone, if you don't follow the Great Man, please go to LinkedIn. Follow him on LinkedIn. I follow him. I look at all the shit he puts up. It's
all good, all the time. And I'm going to be honest. He doesn't have many followers, So give him give him shop out, will you. I mean, it's a little embarrassing for how good he is. It's a bit underwhelming. So go and follow him on that and give him a little bit of love and say I'm here because Jumbo told me to give you a little bit of love. Here, I am hey.
Just before we get to the first article, we're going to talk about coming back to the thing you said before about bowel movements and sleep. The common thing between those two is anxiety. So usually sleep disturbance is the first sign. Often the studies are showing probably two to three years prior to diagnosis, first sign of anxiety slash depression is sleep disturbance. Bowel movements is similarly associated with anxiety. So if you're seeing that, particularly in teenage children, so
difficulties will sleep. Now with teenage children, when you say difficulties will sleep, it's not going to bit later, which their brains make them do any way, by virtual being a teenager, because there's a shift in the metabolic clock by about two hours during teenage of them, so they go to bed naturally two hours later than they did win prior to puberty. But if they have trouble staying asleep or getting to sleep sort of after eleven o'clock at night, then it could be a sign of anxiety
and depression. This is important because of a story that was out today in the papers. I haven't written a piece about this one yet, Craig, but they found in this study three quarters of Victorian teenagers have diagnosable have had a diagnosable clinical anxiety or depression over the last eight years. Now three quarters of a teenage population sets a world record. There's no other study that shows that level of anxiety and depression in teenagers in the world.
We are at the starting edge of a very, very big and we can come back and talk about that one in a little while. But I just thought i'd raise that because it connects those two things that you mentioned before.
All Right, we'll circle back. But I'm very I don't know about that. I mean, I believe what you're saying, and I believe what was written, but I don't like that's the majority of children having diagnosable anxiety then anyway, eighty.
Four percent of females between the ages of ten and eighteen in Victoria.
Does that mean they have consistent anxiety it's a condition, or they're teenagers and every now and then they get anxious because that everyone.
What they found was three distinct waves of its three annual occurrences in that age group ten to eighteen year olds that were met the criteria for clinical diagnosis. So not just a bit worried, but clinical diagnosis of anxiety. Wow.
Yeah, I don't know what the solution is to that.
Obviously there is a solution, take all the devices away. That's easy. Do you reckon It's only that I think that's the majority of it. I mean, there's some other things laid in on that, because the other thing that causes the same response in the brain is not just addiction. Remember there's also uncertainty. Well, uncertainty magnifies both addiction and danger.
But there's danger, and danger can be in the form of addictive things, so like gambling apps that simulate danger, or gaming apps that simulate danger, or it can be in the form of chronic stress, like a family that isn't sure whether there's going to be enough money to pay the rent every week, or the COVID nineteen shut down and lockdown things created enormous amounts of chronic stress. But that research tried to adjust for COVID in these numbers and found that it couldn't be a tribut to COVID.
So whilst it may well have had a contributory effect, and all of those lockdown things could have contributed to it, they said it was there before that happened, So that tells you it's something much much earlier that's been going on noting that we've only had really access to social media, online gambling, online gaming, and ready access to pornography probably only the last fourteen years to teenagers. So it's those kids that we're starting to see the results from.
Just we'll come back straight away. But I remember about three months ago or four months ago, you were talking about this TV show called Friday Night Lights and how the first season was two thousand and eight, and I think the last season, which is season five, was two thousand and twelve or thirteen something like that. It's five seasons, and then in between season one and season five was the advent of smart. But I'm both happy with you and mad at you because I've watched all five seasons now.
And you enjoy it.
I did it. It's just like this simple little like it's it's about football everyone, but it's not. It's about this town and this coach and this family and the players, and it's very much like a sociological exploration of relationships and connection and adversity. And but I liked it because it's not I don't like watching things that are scary, like like I don't mind a bit of like action and like war movies or that stuff that's like horror and stuff that you know, puts my blood pressure through
the roof and then I can't fucking sleep. I like watching things that are nice to watch.
But the thing about this show, I mean, it's not Gilmore Girls, right, so it's not that nice to watch. Is what they tend to do in that show, and I think they do it really, really well, is those teenagers. And it's about kids who are you know, sort of
grade twelve age in high school. Those teenagers do just about everything wrong, like they you know, one of them gets pregnant, they're experimenting with drugs, they're driving illegally, they're stealing alcohol, even someone a little more criminal than that. And what's great about it is that it shows you the things that were dangerous before kids had phones and didn't need to bother All of those all of those things now have about halved or less in incidents since
the advent of smartphones. So risk taking, real world risk taking, has half. There's much less team pregnancy, much less public drunkenness, much less dangerous activity, much less law breaking. But the reason is because the kids are all in their bedrooms addicted to their devices, and the damage there is much more severe because now it's not a few adventurous kids who do that, and in that show, there's a couple or two or three that are always doing the wrong
thing and everyone else is pretty much okay. Now it's everybody all the time using addictive devices. And what we're seeing is that fly through because if people say, oh, well, so what keep them busy? Shuts them up. That's what you want from teenagers, except when it results in seventy five percent of them having diagnosable anxiety.
Yeah. But like when I said to you, what's the solution, you said, get rid of the devices, which theoretically, but we know that's not going to happen. So what's the solu Well.
The solution is call them out for what they are. Name them so it's not the device, it's two or three, three or four apps explicitly designed to addict humans that are on those devices. Call them out, name them, ban them.
Well, I wonder if that's going to happen. And of course, Victoria was I think the first state in the world or to ban social media for kids under sixteen, and that made kind of global headlines. So I don't know.
But the thing about that is people always say, ah, that's not going to work that, you know they you know, you've ever seen kids who want to get to something, They'll get they'll find a way, and they will. But that law makes the conversation at the breakfast table a hell of a lot easier for a parent if they can say no, you're not doing it because it's against the law, yes, rather than all day arguing about it.
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, speaking of things that are not good for us, So you wrote or you posted an article about ultra processed foods and foods that are high in seed oils and the potential relationship with colon cancer.
Yeah. So I don't like the term ultraprocessed foods. That's the term the article used. I don't like it because just about everything we eat fits the definition of ultra processed food. I mean, if you didn't pick the apple yourself, or you chop up the cow yourself, then it's probably pretty ultra processed. So the but the point about this study and the reason I posted it is for a
long time I've been banging on. I wrote a book about this in I don't know twenty fourteen, called Toxic Oils and There was a follow up a few years later, and I've written a few other books about it too. But the evidence has always been a little bit inferential in the sense that it suggests that there's a problem, it suggests there's a link to cancer, it suggests this is probably not a good idea, but there hasn't been
loads of high quality studies linking these things. Now I've made the linkages in my books and said there's enough evidence there for us to call this one okay. On the precautionary principle, we should be really really careful about putting this stuff in our food supply, particularly in the kinds of quantities we are. So what are we talking about. We're talking about everything that you know. They're commonly called
seed oils. A lot of your listeners might know them as vegetable oils because that's how they're labeled on the packs. So this is canola, sunflower oil, soybean oil, cottonseed oil, grape seed oil, rice brand oil, all those sorts of things. They're very, very high in something called a mega six fats. And I've said for a while and many other people have too, our bodies aren't built for that level of
amiga six fats. Omega six is are the pro inflammatory fats, so amiga three people often know amiga three fish oils and so on as being anti inflammatory. Well, the anti inflammatory that the omiga three is fighting is the information caused by the amega six. So we have a lot of these in our diet now. All the fast food restaurants, I mean McDonald's in Australia switched in two thousand and four from animal fat to these things. I think they
use canola. All the rest of them followed, and the last I think to fall was KFC in twenty twelve when they switched over to canola from their palm oil I think is what they were using, which is fine. So it's now everywhere anything fried in anything is fried in these oils. If you look at the fat on the label of any food on a supermarket shelf, it's going to be one of these oils, often just ascribed as vegetable oil. They don't tell exactly what it is.
But it is now getting to the point. I know you're desperate for me to eventually find a point in all of this. This study is the interesting thing. It. This study nails it. What they did was they analyzed colon cancer, so they analyzed the tunas the tuners, no fish were involved. They analyzed the tumors of sufferers of colon cancer and they found excessive quantities of Amiga six fats,
and they also found a mechanism to explain it. They found that the Omega six fats encouraged the tumor growth and suppressed the anti anti tumor activity that the body naturally had.
Okay, hit the brakes, just say that, I know what you said, but just say that last bit again. What did they find?
They found that the Amiga six fats in these tumors encouraged the tumor growth and suppressed the body's natural defenses
against it back. And the reason this is important is if you look at the statistics on colorectal cancer or call on cancer, whatever you want to call it, colorectal cancer in the United States and in Australia, it's now the second biggest killer, second biggest killer behind lung cancer, by the way, which we can talk about another day, which is an interesting one all on its own because nobody smokes anymore. But we'll come back to that one.
But this is now the second biggest killer, and if you look at people under the age of fifty, it is growing exponentially and there is no explanation for this from the scientific consensus. So if you look at the Australian statistics and look at people under forty in Australia in nineteen eighty two, there are eleven point seven people per one hundred thousand. Now sorry, there were three point seven people one hundred thousand. Now there are eleven point
seven p hundred thousand. So it is tripled in that period of time. Now, for anything to triple, I mean we want it going backwards. I mean got flat to backwards is what we're aiming for here. With cancer tripled in people under forty is terrible, absolutely terrible, and that the scientific community has no explanation for that is even worse.
These guys have found an explanation. It's an explanation that's been there for a while in books like the ones I wrote, and other people are speculated about it and said, hang on, why are cancers that are anywhere along the digestive tracked going bananas in younger people Because it's not just colorect or this thyroid cancer et cetera et cetera, and I have connected dots and others have to and said, it's the Amiga six fats. We've introduced massive count it
is of them into our diet. They are pro cancer elements. That's what's causing this. This study puts a pin in it and says, actually we think it might all right, I just want to.
Okay, great, So now some people are listening to this and they're a bit terrified, which is not the worst thing. So just while we're in this moment of improved awareness around this, and again, remember everyone, this is just people talking. This is not a prescription. But just tell people. I know we've done it a few times, but there'll be people who've never heard of you and this will be their first time with you. And there'll be people who
have heard this list before, but forget it. So what is on the acceptable, what's on the David Gillespie yes list in terms of oils, and what's on the no list?
Okay, So what we're aiming for here is you need fat in your diet. No fat, no diet, right, so you need adding your diet. But what you want to aim for is fats that are very very low in these Amiga six fats. So now they come from one place, which is plants. In the modern industrial diet, they come from things labeled as vegetable oils. No vegetables were harmed in their construction. They actually come from seeds. So the things you want to avoid are fats that come from seeds.
So we're talking about canola, sunflower, grape seed, rice brand, a lot of the nuts based ones like almonds and so on. Those are things that you've got to avoid because they in general tend to be high in Amiga six fats.
What about whole almonds versus just because somebody on the call eats almonds every day.
Whole almonds are okay. You've just got to be careful how many you eat. And I published a table in one of my books that actually calculated how many could eat and not exceed the allowance of a Mega six fats. I'll shoot it through you after the show and you can put it up if you want, but it's I can't remember what the number was for almonds, but all of them were sort of reasonable numbers. You could eat reasonable numbers as long as you know they weren't the
primary constituent of your meal. Every day, then you're probably okay because you're eating a lot of other stuff besides the fat. When you're chomping through whole arments, when you grind them, when you grind them up and use them as flour and everything you cork, or when you turn them into a paste and spread them in on everything, then that's a different thing altogether. So I'll send you that, but.
Just quick, sorry, just quickly, because I try to think, if I'm a listener, what do I want to ask? So I'm guessing regular peanut butter, I mean regular peanut butter off the shelf at Safeway and more worse, doesn't get the tick.
It depends a lot on the brand, is what I found. Like when you actually do the analysis of the data they are forced to put on the label, and I have done that, it really depends a lot on the brand. So some brands are okay, others are not. And it's because many of them don't use actual peanuts.
They use.
I don't know what the term they use for it is, but basically deconstituted peanut powder and then they reconstitute it with other fats. So if you careful, if you have a look at the label, and it just says the ingredients are peanuts. You're probably good, but have a close look at the label. Don't make assumptions about what these things are made out of. Just because I said peanuts on the front doesn't mean that's what it's made of.
So yeah, look, be careful with peanuts their borderline. Things that aren't borderline.
Tell us what okay on the to do that on the the okay list. So we know, butter, I think lard, I think.
Anything from an animal. So all animal fats are fine. So but lard, tallow rendered, beef, rendered, you know, any All animal fats are fine.
What about the what about the crackling that I'm going to eat off the pig at chrissy.
Yeah, look it's it's it's okay. Pig fat is a bit of a problem in Australia because I think it's around ninety percent of our peaks are raised in you know, industrial form, not on they're not free range, and and those ones are fed a lot of grain, and because they're omnivores, that grain contains a lot of Amiga six and it ends up in their fat as a Mega
six fat. So so this is the only point where I agree with standard Heart Foundation advice, which is, if you're going to eat pig like in bacon or pork of any description, trimmer take the fat off because that fat, if it's you know, if it's far if it's not free range, that fat probably contains a large amount of a Mega six fat. And in Australia, if it doesn't explicitly say it's free range, it's not, because most pork in Australia is not free range. Pigs, by the way,
if left to their own devices, don't eat grain. They roam around, they eat a lot of things, but they don't go and choose to eat grain. But far you know, the battery pigs or whatever they're called, they're given a lot of grain. So to be avoided eat still eat the pork, chop the fat off, and if you're going to eat crackling, do it once a year. I would
have thought is probably reasonable advice. But coming back, so, animal fats in general though, are pretty good any kind of beef milk, but anything from a cow is going to be good because ruminants like cows and goats and sheep actually don't store a mega six fats in any serious quantity. So you don't even have to worry about the fat on those animals. No matter how much people might tell you you've got to have you know, fast raised or you know, all that sort of nonsense, it
doesn't really matter with ruminants. Now, if we talk about people say, oh, yeah, great, but I'm a vegan or a vegetarian and I don't I can't eat all that stuff. What can I eat? The answer is there are some that feed into there. So there's a couple of fats that mimic the fat profile of animal fat, So palm oil, coconut oil, and they're they're they're fine. They actually look when you're doing an analysis of them, they have rough for the same analysis as animal fat. No concern with those.
There's an in between category which I call fruit oils, which are also I would say fine as long as you're not eating vast quantities of them. So these are fruit oil. So this is olive oil, for example, is a fruit oil. Avocado oil is another fruit oil. And there's one nut oil which is absolutely fine for some reason, macadamia nut oil, which WHI has a fat profile very very similar to animal fat.
Now, Tiff, I'm guessing from the screwed up look on your face. There's not going to be a lot of pork crackling going down your gob over the next week.
Definitely not. And I feel sad for the little peace. It made me feel sad thinking of the poor little bit.
It's just that is It is sad. That is the That is how a lot of farming works there is. It is not a I don't want to be a downer, but yeah, it's not a great existence. What okay, you know what's interesting, David? I mean, all of this is fascinating, but like it's literally it's literally been flipped. Like we the last twenty years, we've been told, you know, time and time and time again, no animal fats, like avoid
animal fats like that. It's like that's what's going to kill you, animal fats, And you're going, no, fuck that. There're the ones that are going to say, like, it's not only is it have we been misinformed? We've been you know, if you're accurate and these people are accurate, which I believe you are and they are, is just my thoughts. Everyone, then we've actually been told the opposite of what is true.
Yeah, And thinking about the time frame it was in the early eighties that they started telling us that. Yeah, and from that point these statistics have gone crazy on cancer incidents. So and it's all well and good. You know, people will say, oh, correlation does an equal causation. You don't know what you're talking about, Gillespie. Sure, But then you see studies like this starting to hit the press saying, actually, we've done the digging, we've done the analysis, and it
looks like this could be true. You know that to me, says Okay, now you really do need to step back, because now it's not just a theory, it being shown to be implicated in the development of cancer.
Mm hm hmm. Yeah. Tip you eat. You're a carnival, aren't you.
I'm omnivore. Yeah, yeah, I do love a steak. And you know what, I really love Christmas ham.
You know that comes from little piggies too.
No, what a dichotomy.
Listen to you, which do you feel a little bit? I'm not trying to. I just I feel like you must be a little bit conflicted because you're such an animal lover.
It does it does?
I feel like if I did go down the rabbit hole, it would affect Someone was talking about cooking duck the other day, and I was in my mind assessing my difference with thinking of little ducky how call of ducks. I was like, oh, you can't make a duck stew. Leave them alone, And then I think about the poor chickens.
Like, you know, what's funny is how we anthropomorphs animals and we we rationalize. It's like we can rationalize eating tuna, which is a thing that swims around the ocean. But imagine if we I said, you know, I'm having dolphin for dinner, people would be like fucking hysterical. You go, well, it's just another thing in the ocean, and yeah, I know, but it's cute and smart and so all right, so if it's ugly and dumb, we can eat it. But
if it's cute and smart, you know. And I'm not recommending anything, but it is just funny the stories that we like. Whatever we do, we rationalize it.
Well, no one ever made a show about a tuna called Flipper or something exactly.
That's my point. That's my You know, there is a book this I think it was called Tubby Tubby Tuna. Oh No, maybe I'm wrong, I do. I think there was, but yeah, you're right. It's like, do you know that people overseas are horror fired that Australians eat kangaroo?
Yeah? Absolutely, Look I lived in Germany for a little while and they were really horrified at the thought that we would and that we had to cull them, and so even worse than eating them was killing them and not eating them. Yeah. No, they're very horrified because they're so cute.
Yeah, exactly. We were going to do more, but we're going to let you off the hook because that was a solid.
Seventy minutes and go as always, banging on forever about things.
Always good mate. I've got a question or two to ask you off air, so stick around. But for now, mate, we we appreciate you. Thank you so much for everything you do. I know that I don't know if you enjoy it or not. I think you do a little bit.
Wouldn't do it if I didn't.
I think you tolerate it more than celebrate it. But you just feel sorry for me and Tiff. Thanks mate, We appreciate you. Thanks for everything that you've done this year and maybe I have a great Chrissy with the fam and a great new year here.
Yeah, same to you. Guys, Thanks Mate, Thanks DEEV, Thanks boys, No talk for you.