That's good. That's good. Now I can hear you. Now, I can hear you. Okay, I was you you were you were really light lowered, so it was hard to hear. This is all the stuff here. I'm supposed to get out of the way ahead of time, but I never do. I always Uh, I'm always late for everything and last minute on the fly. Adoptability and flexibility. That's the Marine Corps policy. And uh, and I'm very flexible about being late. I guess that's not a good thing. Yeah, my MS was anti tank and then it was a
bold fuel two m U s's didn't excel to either one of them. So, uh, well, can you explain a little bit about uh, those two jobs and what it was like to be a part of them. Well, I went in the Marine Corps. Let me let me back it up. I went in the Marine Corps, went to boot camp, went to infantry school, so that's where I became an anti tanker and then uh, and then I went to reserves and and I would do reserve duty up in the university. I took a semester off of college to go in the Marine
Corps. So I always wanted to be a marine and you know, and I'm very patriotic and all that, and uh and I wanted to see how tough I was. So I went in a Marine Corps. But I didn't want to do I didn't want to do active duty. That wasn't for me. So I went to anti tank. I went to Anti tank school in Campbell June and then uh and then I was doing that when I was in college. When I went back to college in Delaware, I was a bulk fueller because I lived in Florida. So there I was anti tank. That
I was with an anti tank you know which. Then I ended up being
transferred because that was in Miami and I lived in West Palm Beach. Uh. So I ended up being transferred to Anglico Unit and uh and I was there for I do like two meetings you like you do one weekend a month and two weeks every summer, and so like I would do my one weekend and my two weekends of my one weekend a month with with with the so for two weekends for two months in the summer, and then I'd go back up to Delaware University of Delaware I went to college and I would do the
rest of the year is a bulk Fueller. So I had a lot of moss. But basically I couldn't fit in the unif in any addressed uniforms because you know, as I got them custom fit, so I did never I never had it, and I was always so I always had I always was off to the side basically, and they're like, you know, he's not here for the whole year, he's not gonna be here for the two weeks
summer duty, so we'll just let him slot it out. Basically, Hey, it happens, man, But uh, I also want to ask you, so being in a basic training for the Marines is not for being very hardcore, but it's also I know, after being in basic, it is one of the funniest places. You're not allowed to laugh. Do you have any stories from basic that you remember that were really funny or anything? Yeah?
The uh yeah, well in boot camp, that's the thing. In the Marine Corps, at least back in the day, you weren't allowed to talk to anybody, so you you were always had to be you always had to be shut up or or you're getting yelled at, you know, you're getting yelled at, or you were just in solitude because you weren't allowed to talk and you were can and the entire day was spent doing from the minute you woke up, you know, and they're banging the garbage cans to wake
you up until uh, until you until maybe an hour before bedtime. You were on the go, so you were never talking to anybody, so you didn't have you didn't know if anybody was funny. But but the drill instructors were funny. They you know, they weren't trying to be funny, but like you know, they would see somebody would allow the that's is this is a funny part too. You had to shine your boots. You had to make your boots shiny, which is ridiculous if you think about it, because
it would just give you a way to the enemy. But it's just uh and and you know, you know, because you don't have shiny boots in the field. But uh, anyway, you had to shine your boots and shine your your belt buckle. It was just basically to just teach you organization and stuff and uh. But they were people that didn't shine their boots real
well. They would go, what are you shining out with a hershey bar, which is amusing or they would go, or they like, you know those little strings you have hanging off your shirt sometimes like they're called Irish pennants. Yeah, but uh, the little strings that hang off, you know, on all clothing that uh it's they go, what are you going?
They see one on you, you know, because you had to be you know, locked and you know, locked and cocked and I forget all expressions, but you got to be all you know, so you had to you you gotta be your boots shined, your your camouflage pressed. You know, you know you had iron your camouflage. You had to make sure you were squared away and and see if you had one of those little strings hanging off
your shirt, they'd be like, what are you going? Repelling? They always have something real quippi to say if you have like a decision to make. But if you start laughing and they yell at you even more, what do you think that's funny? No, sir, recruit does not think this is funny. Sir. Oh yeah, I remember if you had like a choice to make in front of you and you chose the wrong one, immediately you'ld hear something like dang training, you had a fifty to fifty chance,
you got it one hundred percent wrong. That was just the constant thing from certain mptis that were walking around our building with an EMPI. So for the Air Force, we call them military training instructors. I believe you guys called them a drill instructors. Yeah, d's yeah, okay, same but different. But yeah. So I also heard that after college you did some stand up comedy for a while. Can you tell us a little bit about that. No, I didn't just end up until about till before COVID, until
about twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen, twenty sixteen. Maybe I forget when I started. I didn't do a whole lot of it though, But but but I did well, I you know, like I always had My audiences were always laughing, you know, so I thought I did well. You know, I never I never really bombed, you know, which is lucky.
Ain't nothing wrong with that. I mean it's a nice little experience. Yeah, I'm you know, like I had no problem with bombing, you know, like you know, but I just wanted to see, you know, how funny I if I could, if I could make audiences laugh, you know. So I did it all with with jokes. Now, with wrestling stories. You know, yeah that's fair, and people would be like and people would be like trying to, you know, telling me to you know,
write write material like you know, wrestling material. You know, I tell stories, and I'm like, but I want to I want to be known for I want to write jokes. I want I want to get over for my comedy and in the wrestling, I'll just throw in some jokes at the end, you know, or somewhere through it, I'll throw some wrestling stuff in. But uh yeah, yeah, it's uh, it was. It was a unique experience and you know, I did it at about twenty
times, I guess something like that. Like that's pretty cool honestly that you were able to try to branch out like that and try to keep your other skills from the past, uh away from it, you know, yeah, you know, but like it got boring like after like I remember right there at three nights someplace, and by the third night, I was like,
I'm poired of doing the same material. You know, but you know, because there's no there's no ad libbing, you know, there's no way you know, I mean there is ad I mean you can add lib but I wasn't about to take a chance, you know, that inexperience. I wasn't gonna just start riffing on the crowd, you know. I just didn't have the I didn't have the skill set yet for that for so, you know, so not that you can add live. Of course you can add lib. I mean it's it's comedy. But uh, but I was happy with
my performances, you know, all right, that's fair. So I also wanted to ask you about, so you are a member of MENSA, correct sir, Yes, So I wanted to ask about what is the application process like for that? And how did you know that you wanted to be a part of it. Well, it's not that I wanted to be a part of it so much is that is that I would brag because my IQ was high enough to be in MENSA. So I would brag on TV that I
was a member of MENSA. And one day to MENSA people called me up and they said, hey, we can't seem to find you in our records. You know, you said you remember MENSA And I'm like and I'm like well, and they're like, well, I go, how do they go? Would you like to be a member? I'm like, sure, they go, they go, do you have any records of year old scores? And I'm like, yeah, I got them somewhere, so I dug them up and send them to them and they did, Fine, pay your dues
and you're a member. Interesting, so you kind of basically I haven't paid my dues in about two years. So I'm just I'm so, I'm not am I'm a member in poor standing, I guess. But it's like, there's no reason because I have no interest in doing anything. I have no use for the thing except to say I'm in Mensa, which I could. You know I've done that, you know. Now, I don't have any reason to sam in mensa, you know what I mean, Like I'm not
bragging on TV or anything like that, you know. So you know, so there's really no reason for me to stay in MENSA because I didn't. I never partook of their their class, their seminars or there. You know there what you remall? What am I trying to think of? Yeah, their meetings and stuff like that. Yeah, all right, that makes sense.
So you kind of schmoozed your way in a little bit. Just no, no, they they offered me, they said, look, if you if you can prove that you're You can either take a test now and see what your IQ is, or you can show us the records, you know, and we'd love to have you a member. And I'm like sure, and and so I figured, if I took the test now, after all the you know, this was ten years ago probably or fifteen years ago when
I became a member, I go. I figured, if I took a test, then, after all the brain cells I'd killed, there was probably no way I'd passed the IQ test. So so I said, I'll dick up the old records. I can't blame you there, you know, time passing and everything. But so let's get into the early years of your wrestling career. So I understand that you were trained at the Monster Factory. How was that experience for you? And who was in there with you at the
time? Nobody you ever heard of except maybe Ray Otey the Yeah No, I went to the Monster Factory. After about a month, Larry Sharp said, I taught you everything you need to know. You need to go out there in front of people and learn. So the next eight months I spent trying to get booked in territories because there's a bunch of territories. Still then there's like Puerto Rico and and uh Kansas City and Continental and uh carrying in
the Tennis in Tennessee, and there's Memphis and Tennessee to Memphis Territory. There's Portland, there's Vancouver, Calgary. So there's a bunch of places. So I'd send them my tape, my VHS tape. You know, that's how long ago this was. And every three weeks I send him a new tape and you know, and uh try and get booked and uh. But I'd still go to the school to Monster Factory to practice you know, moves and stuff. But basically, you know, after a month, I pretty much
picked up, you know, how to do it. You know, it's just a matter of getting in front of people and learning how to and how to you know, work with work with an audience. You know, absolutely. So I have to ask, what was your favorite territory that you would travel to at that point? Portland? Portland was the best. I had so much fun there two years I spent there, two of the best years of my life. Interesting, So, how was working with r BR there?
I understand that he was a big deal out there as well. Yeah, he was cool. I liked r he and then he went off to Mexico and then he kept trying to get me into Mexico, and uh but it never worked out. And then I got the e CW and because he was trying to get me into Mexico after I left New York, when I quit New York as Johnny Polo and uh but it never worked out. But I'm glad it didn't know because I wouldn't ended up in ECW otherwise. That's
very true. ECW was a pivotal in your career, honestly. And uh, something that my uncle who really runs the channel wanted to ask about was so he understood that when you were Scotty the body that you had a finishing move called the body line. He hasn't seen it. What exactly was the body line? There's no such thing as the body line. Really, I didn't have a finish called the body line. Interesting, all right, I'm not sure where that came from then, but yeah, I'm not sure.
To be honest, it is this audio or I mean, is this video too or just audio? It's video currently, but it'll mostly just be audio for listeners. But either way, Yeah, so next on the questions. So I understand that the creation of the character of Raven, it was partly due to the movie The Crow. And you started thinking about, you know, the character Eric Draven, it was well, no, it wasn't about the It wasn't about the movie Crow the Crow at all. I just was
looking for a name for the character I was creating. And then and I thought that I was just trying to think of different stuff, and I thought of the Crow was asking what's that guy's name, Eric Draven? Draven Raven, quote the Raven evermore? And then I had my name in catch rereads right right. So along with that, I wanted to ask about, are you actually a fan of Edgar Allan Poe or was just the quote the Raven the only thing that he wanted to take from his works? Quote The Raven's
all I wanted to take them His works makes perfect sense, honestly. And UH also wanted to ask, I'm not a real I'm not a fiction reader. I haven't read fiction, and other things I go, well, I guess comic books are gonna would be fiction, but yeah, I haven't read book books. And probably since I got in the back when I first got into business. It was the last time I probably read a fiction book, you know. Okay, so, uh, what kind of comics are you
into? I'm curious now, Well, I haven't read it. I don't read comics anymore either. I got out of that like ten fifteen years ago, when when the DC universe changed to the new fifty two. It just turned the crap and I was like, this is a good time to jump out, because the comics are addictive. Man. Every Wednesday I was at
the comic book store getting new comics that spend eighty bucks a week. You know, it just got ridiculous, Like I have a collection of thirty thousand comics that just because I buy some bought and read so many, you know. But but I got to the point where I no time for TV or no time for to read you know, books, nonfiction, and I had a lot of interest so at the time, so I finally said I'm gonna quit cold turkey and just quit reading comics at that point, Yeah, that
makes sense. It does get expensive after a while, although I do like though, I do have found that now I'm watching a bunch of anime cartoons. Though, because it gives you to it gives me the comic book fix, I guess without having to uh, without having to read. Really, what's your favorite anime? Undead unluck? I haven't watched that many of them, but I've you know, I've read I've watched a half a dozen, I guess or a dozen. Ain't nothing wrong with that. It's a nice
past time, not hurting anybody. But uh, So back on the topic of wrestling. So the fall of GFW, So did you see that coming or was it a shock to you? Globul Yes, sir, yeah, no, and yeah I saw it coming. Yeah. Yeah. They Joe Betesino claimed he had fifty million dollars to budget, but he only had like three million or something, and that's a big difference. So that didn't go I knew that was going out of business pretty quick, all right, that
makes Honestly, I don't know. I don't know if Joe was totally had fifty million or if he made that up, you know what I mean. Like I imagine they told him that and he bought it and then uh and I mean he not he bought it fit monetarily, but he brought into it, I guess, and then uh, but they turned out I only had a three million dollar budget or something like that, and so they didn't have
the money to uh. Plus they're running on after the four o'clock afternoon on ESPN, which is which is great per se, but it's not exposure in the way you need to draw an audience to, you know, to pay for a ticket to gum to see the show, you know, right right, So, uh, let's get into your ECW career for a little bit here. So one thing that has stuck out in my UH group that's a
part of this podcast is about the Blue Dust promo. Were you expecting that whole scenario to come up behind you or was that reaction blue Dust promo where Stevie Richards was trying to get you into vala or escort and you turn around then you see him on the playground, just covered in frosting and everything. Do you remember that? Yeah? Yeah, but I don't remember how I remember him covered in frosting. But that's all I remember I remember the promo
at all. Okay, so, yeah, you guys are on the playground and you gave a little speech to Stevie about the whole situation with Beulah and everything, and then Stevie's like reassuring you, like, pas, I got you the next big thing. You turn around and then there's blue dust sitting there, just in frosting and like with a doll covering his private parts, and he's quoting some porno at the time, And yeah, they were just wondering if your reaction at the time was genuine or was it did you already
know what was going to happen? I knew it was good that woy what was my reaction? Uh, just how you were stoic and everything. We're all just kind of wondering about like, were you like biting your tongue trying not to laugh and trying to keep composure or were you Yeah? Probably, But I mean I never really had to. I never really broke character except like once once or twice, and that was It took like a long time.
Brian Lee got me. Brian Lee's funny and he made me break character once in a in the what was the building, the temple Lulu Temple building, and and I had Stevie dress up as Baron von Stevie and the meani is uh es. They had a bald skin cap on and it wouldn't fit on his head, so it kept sliding up like it kept like flying.
It was gonna pop off and fly away. And Mini was Colonel Demeani like Colonel de Beer's and uh, and Minie kept saying, and STEVEE kept saying, we have the claw and uh and then something about it, I will take care of you. Meet Colonel Demeanor something. I forget what he said, but but it was funny. But it wouldn't have made me break character, except that Brian Lee was in my corner and Brian Lee's like I was sitting in the corner. But so Brian Lee's his head was right at my
head level. The way the building was, it was on a slope so that he was standing tall, so like so his mouth was like right at my ear height. And He's gone, that's some funny shit, man, why aren't you laughing? That's some funny shit. And I started, I'd start to laugh, So I would, I would, I would start to I knew I was gonna laugh, so I put my chin down and hit my face, and my body had to do something with the laughter that I'm
trying not to laugh. So my shoulders went up and down, dry heaving, like popping up and down, and then immediately I would pop. I would sit up straight, hold a mean face, look into the crowd for as long as I could, and then I'd bend my head down again, and and my shoulders would go up and down. And uh, that was the first time I ever broke character. Is raven. But usually I'm py Like I would break character easy if I had to stare in somebody's eyes.
So I just stare at their forehead, you know, I just stare at their forehead because if I look in their eyes, I'm just it's the whole premise is gonna the whole proceedings are just ridiculous. So it's gonna make me laugh. But uh, but as long as I don't look people in the eye, I can I can stop off laughter pretty well. Okay, that
makes sense. So is that way? Also, if they make a face at me, I can't see it, you know what I mean, Like if they're gone, they're rolling their eyes or whatever, you know, I can't see it. You know, I'm just looking at their forehead. Okay, that makes sense. It also, I've heard it can also be like an intimidation tactic if you just look at the forehead instead of the rest of the face, so that honestly goes in with the character very well. I
will say. Uh. So a friend of mine was asking from uh that I've served with here. He was asking, what was the scariest bump that you think you took in ecw Well, what I remember this bump? I thought I broke my neck on it. Not because I I was in a lot of pain. I was in a lot of pain, but I dreamer.
Paul drove me on a on a air hockey table, but it had a wooden board across the top of it to protect it from the fans, you know what I mean, when people's getting crap wanted during the matches and uh, And all of a sudden, I heard a crack like as he Poul drove me, I heard a crack, But that was really his fat ass breaking the wooden The wooden plant woodn't covering, but I didn't know that, and so and I heard it, and then my neck, My neck
got real sore because part of my head got caught, I guess or something, and so my neck went tight. And I saw him reaching up. So I'm laying on the ground and I'm reaching up on top of the air hockey table. To try and see if there's a crack in it to make sure that. I'm like, it's got to be a crack on the table. It's not my neck. Better not be my neck. And I'm reaching around like a cartoon character, you know, trying to reach up there.
And uh. And then we went to the emergency room because my neck was really stiff. And then they said there was no breaks. So I was like, oh, thank goodness, Okay, I'm glad that you made it out of there without any kind of breaks or anything. So another question asked by a friend of mine, my uncle Tim, So what was it like to work with new Jack? I never really worked with him. They kept
us apart, like I don't know why. I mean, I guess I know why, because they didn't want to They didn't want to job him out, and they didn't want to beat me either, you know what I mean. So they hang on a second. Okay, my dog is we having thunderstorms and she's already she's already all upset because the last night, the fire the fireworks just you know, scared the shit out of her. And uh, and today there the thundercracker, the thunder booms are terrifyinger. So she
was been laying by my side. She always comes to daddy when she's scared. But she just got up and walked away. So she's doing better now, I guess, okay, fair enough, but uh yeah, she's a pitbull. But she's not a tough guy at all. She's a she's a little she's a little wis the but I like it that way. I don't want a dog that's gonna attack anybody anyway. Anyway, So new Jack, so yeah, no me Nujack got along, but we never we never really worked together. In fact, there was I think we had some sort of
issue or something about something in the back, like a minor issue. And then we were both doing a run in and the same thing. And then we run in and uh, I don't think we were supposed to touch each other. But it's not that we weren't to touch each other. We just shouldn't have been anywhere near each other because it was a big schmasity running like a lot of people. And then we came up on each other and I'm like, hit me, and then he just he just threw a working punch.
I threw a working punch back, and obviously whatever issue we had was gone, you know, so we had no we had no issues. That's good to hear. Uh. Did you ever find him to be as unhinged as a lot of people talk about or did you just get along with him and have a fine time with him? I got along with him. I didn't like what he did to certain you know, certain things like when he
attacked dancing with Dudley, you know what I mean. But that's you know, that's his issue with that's their issue, you know what I mean. And it's not my place, you know, but I felt Banford dances with Dudley. Yeah, it's fair. Uh, it's kind of unfortunate some of the things that new Jack had done, but that's uh, you know, his stuffy Yeah. Yeah, it's not my job to play superhero and intervene. You know, I'm not office. I wasn't, you know, So
yeah whatever, Yea. I never had a problem with him, is what I'm saying. The one time I thought I might, it was just I figured, if he's gonna hit me, I'll let him hit me first, you know what I mean, Just in case he this is something that he thinks is more of an issue than it wasn't a big deal, I don't think, but it was something that irritated him. And I'm like, well,
I'll see you. And I guess we'd always had there's always a little tension between us because we didn't work together, you know, and and we're both very mouthy, you know, we're both very opinionated and uh and so I was like, I was like, so I opened my I said, all right, hit me, and he goes and he threw a working punch.
I'm like, there's no heat, you know, fair enough, he probably would have took the opportunity and just swung if they're actually that's what I'm saying, if there if there wasn't heat, if there was real heat, and after that, we were totally fine after that, you know, fair enough. So uh. I also, do you want to ask about the
Beulah and Tommy storyline? Was there any kind of inspiration or did that just all come out of like Paul's head or no, and it all came out of my head actually the uh, well not all of it, but the whole Okay, here's how it happened, is is I was in Uh, I was down at the Super Bowl. I forget which one, and uh, we were into a club and I ran into a Ron Gant, a baseball player for for the Braves's a friend of mine from Atlanta, and he had a girl with him who was Beulah and Teresa, and uh, because
uh this Teresa, this is Raven. Raven wrestles and he goes Teresa, and Teresa goes, I'd like to get back into wrestling, and I'm like, really, you were in it before he goes, yes, she goes. I worked as Pillman's sister in Calgary. I was like, oh cool. I was like, all right, I said, send me some pictures. So she sent them some sexy pictures. So I passed him on to Paul, and Paul's like, all right, I'm going to give her to
you. And I'm like, I don't need a valet because but I always liked having valets before, and I know how to work on a valet really well. But I didn't think it fit the Raven character at the time, but it actually totally did. So he was totally right about that. I was wrong. And and then I came up with the whole backstory that was all because somebody, because I figured we needed something to get this get get this thing hot and we had to tie her in and get her over quickly.
So I just made up the whole thing we went to summer camp, and after we went to summer camp together that uh, I made that up first because I knew I wondered if I was gonna get over quick, which I was. That's what I was supposed to do, is get over and get Tommy over. That was my job then that uh, you know, to have something psychologically driven is always going to get you more heat than just
attacking a guy. So that's why I came up with summer camp and you know, and then I tied her storyline into the summer camp and uh, and the rest is you know what it was, all right, that's actually really cool. I didn't realize that you came up with almost all of it. That's incredible. This is a backstory, fair enough, all right, So moving on to uh your w c Oh. Here's here's the thing that pisses me off though, is his dreamer and and Paulie try to take credit
for Buella McGillicuddy. But I came up with that because, uh, because I wanted the weirdest name you could have, like, you know, so you definitely think she's an ugly chick, you know. And uh, and same with Kimona. I named Kimona want to lay It like it was some from somebody they make it up, but I got it from some old jokes where like it's, uh, did you did you like he goes? You read the beat the you read the book, Uh, Tiger's Revenge by Claude
Balls or under the Bleachers by Seymour Butts. So there was a whole bunch of jokes like that, and one of them was the Hawaiian prostitute by Kimona want to Lay It. That's how I came up with That's how I came up with that for a And so that's why when Paully and Dreamer claimed that they came up with Kimona, I'm like, you couldn't have because you didn't know that stupid joke. You know, that came from a stupid joke that
I did. Somebody told me when I was four years or eight years old, you know, and it just stuck in the back of my head somewhere. For holding the mattress, holding the mattress by mister completely that's uh. I haven't heard some of these, but I know exactly what you're talking about. Yeah, everybody does. Yeah. So moving on to your WCW time for a little bit. I do want to ask about So how were your relationships backstage? Who did you hang with and did you have any problems with
anybody backstage there? Uh? No, I didn't have any problems on anybody backstage. I hung out with Saturn and Canyon. Me and Saturn hung out all the time. You know, we go way back. You know, we went back they you know, I mean now we go way back. I mean at the time, we didn't really hang in ECW at all. But then once we got together as a part as partners, you know, then we were we were inseparable. Okay. Kind of nice that you were
close with Saturn and Kenya at the time. You know, ken you were alive, were alive today, do you think that he would have been able to be an agent or a trainer of some sort. I don't know if you would have got the opportunity really, yeah, I don't know. The you know, it's it's you know, there's only one company now, so I mean, well, no, I guess there's two companies now. I mean, for the longest time, there's only one company, one real company,
you know what I mean. Yeah, And and Kenyon I don't think left w W on the greatest of terms, but maybe it would have been in a W you know. Yeah. Maybe I've heard that he was close with the Young Bucks at one point, so that's definitely. Oh yeah, that's right. I forgot he was totally close with them. Yeah, he definitely would have ended up there, I guess. But he was just is uh is is uh what do you wanna call it? What's it called?
Uh? Manic depression, his manic depression behaviors. Manic depression was just so rough on him. And and he just he was he was miserable, you know what I mean. He just wasn't happy. And and you know, and I I'm I actually was happy for him when he took his own life because he was so miserable that he had, you know that I didn't feel I didn't feel like he wasted a life, you know what I mean. I figured I felt like his chemical imbalance was so bad that that was the
only thing that was going to make him happy. You know what I mean. It is not being alive, you know, which is why I make somebody suffer. And my point is is why should somebody suffer just to suffer? You know? Yeah, he tried a lot of different medications and then he wouldn't stick on him, and then by the time he was ready to stay on him, they weren't working and he just he'd had it. You
know. Yeah, very unfortunate what happened. But I hear you. You know, it's a certain point where it's like, are we really going to make this guy live just to suffer? Right? Right? That's my point. You know, it's like it's like I don't tell a firm believer in doctor Kuvorkian, you know what I mean, Like, you know, it should be the law. I mean, why should you You're allowed to put your dog to sleep if if the dog suffering, but you can't put a
human being asleep? Right? You know, it's up. It's that Judeo Christian, Judeo Christian mentality that comes goes way back. You know, you can't take your own life because it's a sin or whatever. You know, it stems from all that. Yeah, I hear that. I mean, it's amazing how many laws we have based off of religion and everything. So I do hear that but I do also want to ask about your experiences with
some of the older vets that were in the WCW locker room. So do you ever interact with Hogan or Flair or Sting or any of those guys and what was it like with them? Now, because I was in a different level, you know, they were all right above me, you know, so they all hung with top guys, always hung with each other, you know, and and then I hung with the guys in my level, Canyon and Saturn and Jericho guys like that. You know. Okay, that's interesting.
They were kept in like a different room or something like that. Well then the main event guys, Yeah, they had they most of them trade locker, got private lockers, you know what I mean, like Hogan and Flaring them, you know, and Sting so the you know, so they'd be in their locker room, you know what I mean. But it's not it's not like they weren't They weren't unfriendly. You know, they were friendly. You know if you say, you know, you say hi, they
say hi. You know, you had a conversation. Whenever you had a conversation with them, you know, they it's not like they snubbed it. Or anything like that. It's just you know, top top guys. You're working with top guys. So they're you know, just in middle guys working middle guys, underneath guys to work with underneath guys. And so that's why they're all They all kind of pooled together, you know what I mean. You stick with the group that you're good, that you're in a dance with,
you know what I mean. Okay, I see, so like like you know, like you know, and and if like if you're in the locker room, you know, like like uh, underneath guys, like enhancement guys all stuck together because they really they weren't really like a part of their full time production. So they weren't so they weren't really like included in the group, you know what I mean, unless they knew somebody really well from outside there you know that company. You know what I'm saying. That makes
sense. Yeah, So they were always off to their you know side. Plus they're coming in and then they're just taking the you know, the they're trying to take that trying to stay out of people's way anyway because they want to, you know, they don't want to put a bad impression. The middle of the card guys, you know, basically have the main locker room and then the and then the and then the private locker rooms are the top guys. So, but everybody interacted with everybody though, I mean, nobody
was like snobby or anything like that. It was nothing like that. Okay, that's fair. So do you feel that it was different between ECWWCW and WWE's locker rooms or was it all basically the same. It always breaks down this because it's who you work with, you know. It's like, you know, like, uh, you're gonna talk more to the guys you're working with because you're talking about your angles and your matches and your stuff like that, so you're gonna spend more time with them, you know, I mean
obviously you know. Yeah, that's fair. So did you notice any kind of major differences with the creative process between the three major companies from the nineties. Yeah, they PAULI E. CW was doing anything to anything to make money. They're trying to keep all the angles hot. W CW they were trying to keep the main event super hot at the expense of everything else.
It was WWE. But Paul had to load the card up because his you know, just having a main event guy that was super over wasn't gonna draw on his level, and you know, to the to the extent that it would, you know, and you know you have you got to treat Austin differently, you know, and in the way if you have an Austin character, you know, and he's drawing your money. But Austin wasn't gonna draw for you know, if Austin would have went to E c W, he
still couldn't have drawn like he drew. He could have drawn Arenas because it just wasn't made for Arenas yet, you know what I mean, Like fifteen thousand people, the audience wasn't wasn't there for it. You know. So maybe if Austin, maybe Austin could have Austin probably could have still drawn fifteen thousand three c W if you went back there. But it's it's harder because you're a small company. You're too big to be small, but you're too
small to be big. Yeah, it was just that awkward in between. I guess we could call it growing pains. Goldilocks. It wasn't Goldielocks, it was it was a Goldilocks is an ugly brother Bob Bob locks bigel in Los interesting way to put it. So, uh, let's talk a little bit about uh w w W so with the most recent scandals that Vince McMahon has been uh you know, I guess found out about do you with your experiences with the man? Do you think any of it is true? Or
what do you think is happening? Man? I'm not I don't know what is the story is. I mean, I'm not gonna no, I really don't want to talk about him because of you know, legal reasons, because uh just I can't for legal reasons. But uh but I you know, and plus I don't really follow it. I don't follow wrestling anymore. I stopped following it a long time ago. You know. It just I loved
it when I did it. I loved it before I did it. I loved it when I did it, But now it's just, you know, I love when I do and I still do it when i'm you know, like you know, But I missed the last couple of years because I had met both my knees replaced and my shoulder replaced. So I've missed the last three years basically, and I'm old. I'm fifty nine now, so I'll be sixty this year. So you know, I'm getting past the point where I want to work, you know. But uh, the but I got
other interests, you know what I mean. I don't want to you know. It's like there's so much wrestling on and and you have to watch so much of the show just to get to the good part. You know. It's just not I just don't have any interest, you know. It's also it's also I'm a complete itst like if I watched one show, I'd have to watch all the shows, you know what I mean. And I definitely don't have the time for that. You know, I barely have the time
for to watch all the TV I want to watch as it is. Yeah, I hear that. So, yeah, we don't have to talk about that necessarily. So. I had watched a short documentary about you on YouTube, and towards the end of it they talked a little bit about your w WE career and as you were getting ready to depart WWE that there were plans that they were going to release PJ Piloco, and in the YouTube documentary claimed that there's rumor that you had claimed, Well, if you're going to fire
him, you got to fire me too? Was this true? Or is that just no idea? What's talking about? Okay, fair enough, that's kind of what I expected it. I'm not sure why I was in that, but yeah, it was towards the end of it. So also, did I say this too? Who'd I say this to? Supposedly, I'm not entirely sure. It was just in the documentary. No, I mean it was in w CW w cw wwe run apparently, no idea? What's
talking about? Fair enough? So between the characters that you have played, you've played a few of them, Between Johnny Polo, Scotty Flamingo, Scotti, the body Raven, which one do you feel is the closest to you as a person? Raven's on my Raven is me in the inside, the side. I don't show anybody the tortured, poetic painful pain uh poetic type. Tortured poetic type. I guess I don't know. It's uh not me if you if you know me, if you know me, I'm a funny
guy on the surface, you know what I mean? Like, but inside that's where all the uh, all that non all that pain sits, you know, or it has that for years. I've dealt with a lot of it, though, so I mean, I'm so it's not like I'm dealing with it now anymore. You know, I'm pretty much content, you know, as close as content the content as I can get right now. But
yeah, those were the issues I had internally. Okay, that's understandable, and I'm really intrigued about that you were able to turn that into a character. I'm actually very impressed by that, honestly, thank you. And something else that I did want to ask you about was, so, did you ever pull in uh major ribs on anybody from backstage or anything or where you never really want to prank anyone. I was never really wanted to prank anyone.
But uh, I'll tell you this last story the because we only got a few more minutes, I think, right right the there's this one rib that the grappler told me about that I loved that I would never do to
somebody because it's too painful. But so he was sitting there, the grappler was sitting in a chair and his old timer comes up to him, and he was a green guy and he and he was sitting in a chair and the green and the veteran goes, uh, hey, grappler, let me see how strong your neck is. And he started pushing down on the back
of his head. And so the grappler's trying to show me how tough he is, and he's fighting and he's fighting it, and then the guy just moves his hand and the grappler's head goes flying back, smashes into a into a cement wall, and knocks him out. So it's it's funny if it wasn't so mean, you know what I mean, it's too painful. You can't do it to anybody, but it's but it's the concept is funny.
So at one time I was in the locker room and somebody was sitting with a chair right in front of a locker and those were really in the locker doors were really flimsy and they had a lot of gift to them. So I figured I could do it with this person, because you know he bank smashes into that it's it's just gonna be like a cookie sheet. You know, it's not gonna hurt him, but it's gonna be funny. So I
do that. I go, let me see I strong your neck as kid, So I pushed down and then he you know, he goes, ah, fights it. I slipped my hand away. His head goes smashing back into the thing. He starts going ah. He goes, oh, you bastard, Let's get somebody else. So then we got somebody else to come in the locker room and sit there, and I went and did the same thing we did it to him. He's like, oh, let's get somebody
else. We got like eight people that day. It's great funny but all right, So, as we're coming to the end of our time together, so I'd like to ask you, so as we do on Wrestle Magic, do you have any recommendations for the audience recommendations? But uh, I recommend
Yeah, I give recommendations every week on my podcast. At the end of the show, I give a recommendation, and uh, and I've exhausted all the ones that now I can't think of any because I've gone through all the ones that the main ones, and so it's like to the point where I just at the last minute I think of something. But uh, trying to think of some shows I streamed that I loved. Well, if you're into anime, undebt un luck is tremendous. It's, uh, you're gonna watch
it on the Hulu channel or I think or Disney. Yeah, Disney carries the Hulu stuff, so you get it on both of those. But Undebt on Luck is really entertaining. Okay, sounds like an interesting animal to get into. So h come to the end here. Would you like to let the audience know where they can reach you, sir? There's really no way
to get you know. I mean, I I go on social media just as much as I go on social media as I go on Twitter or x and all I do is I spend about literally less than five minutes on it, check in people who see d me or or if anybody had it, you know whatever, you know, just checking to see what people have to say. But usually it's you know, I'm not in the limelight anymore, so I don't expect to see anything, you know what I mean. But so I really don't go on social media other than that, I haven't been
on Facebook in a hundred years. I never really went on Facebook. I'm not into social media because really what it is is it's fame for people who aren't famous. That's kind of what social media is to me in my opinion, but so I'm not big on that. But you can always tune into the Raven Effect podcast that comes out every Monday. It's really entertaining. It's a it's but it's not. We don't talk about wrestling almost at all.
We're wrestling adjacent in the sense that we're adjacent only because I'm a wrestler and that's what I did for thirty years, but thirty plus years. But yeah, but we talk about everything, but that what wrestling. So it's entertaining. Uh So if you if you find me entertaining, that's if you find me entertaining, then tune into my podcast. If you don't find me entertaining,
well then you basically just wasted an hour listening to this. So there, all right, greatly appreciate it. So all right, everybody, this has been an interview with Raven As always do something nice for somebody you never know who needs it. And uh just a quick message to my audience members, really appreciate all of you guys listening. I'll be honest, though, I'm gonna be taking a little bit of a hiatus. It's been a little
over a year. I've been working a lot and I think it's just time for me to take a break, stop being you know, podcast guys, stop being sergeant for a little while, and just time to go and be uh maverick for a little bit. Thank you all for listening, please keep saying, and then what a great episode to have for if you taking a hiatus to close on a shit show like me, it's perfect. I don't think it's been a shit show or anything like that. I think it's been
No, I'm kidding, I'm saying I'm the shit show. I was kidding. No, it's been great and I really greatly appreciate it. So thank you for your time. Mister. You're welcome. Oh no, thank you for serving as well. Oh you're welcoming fan too. Thank you for serving. Tell me complete ingreciating with each other. Uh, very good, Thank you man, Thank you, good night. Thanks for listening to the WWE
podcast. Don't forget to subscribe on your favorite podcast app so you don't miss a show, or head to WWE podcast dot com and for all of these shows add free head over to Patreon dot com slash WWE podcast. Until then, we'll see you next time.