Get out everyone.
Sam Wood here and it's hung over Sam, which I wasn't sure if I should tell you or not tell you. It's not terribly professional, and this is really going to make me sound bad.
But it's also a Thursday.
I had one of my two of my very close friends' weddings last night. I don't normally drink anything during the week, but there was champagne and wine flowing at a simply spectacular wedding in Country Victoria. That station I went to last night and it was absolutely wonderful. So feeling a little bit seedy today, but still very excited to be here in the Shito because we had some very very
special guests. They're known as the Psychology Sisters, and they're going to talk to us about the importance of self confidence, increasing your self esteem, and actually really getting into self worth, which is one of those things that we don't talk about enough, we often probably don't understand enough, and it
is super super important. And then after that we're going to talk about spring fresh produce because spring is here and we want to eat well foods that taste delicious and save a little bit of money.
This is the Wood life.
I'm Sam Wood.
Let's get into it.
So today on the wood Life, we are uncovering a really interesting topic and something that perhaps gets swept under the rag a little bit or not talked about enough, and that is confidence and self esteem. And what's better than one expert on the matter when you can have two experts on the matter. And we are thrilled to be joined by the psychology sisters, Kat and Amy. Now I'll just get this right. Cat, you are a psychologist, and Amy you are a psychotherapist and counsel are and
together you are the psychology Sisters. And I can't wait to get into this interesting topic with you. And thanks for joining us today.
Thank you, Sam. Yes, you did so well, absolutely correct.
We're here to talk about confidence and self esteem. And I'm a relatively naturally confident person, I feel, and I think I've definitely done things through my life that have absolutely helped me gain confidence and continue to build that. But my brother and sister, who are both younger than me, definitely don't have the same sort of natural confidence that I have. And my sister sort of tongue in cheek, says that I got all the confidence in the family
and there was none left for her. And my brother, which is a bit of a bit of a she's sort of joking, but she definitely doesn't have the same confidence to meet new people and put herself out there that I potentially do. So how much of confidence do you feel is something that you're born with and how much of it is something that you can actually work on and develop?
Great questions, Sam, I think you're absolutely so spot on with the differences in siblings. That is such a common characteristic trait that can show up quite differently among siblings, and it kind of creates a question of nature versus nurture, right, how much is this a biological or personality trait versus how much is learned? And I think both both can be true. I think absolutely we can be born, you know,
with more extraversion than others. We can be born with you know, maybe more risk taking behaviors than others, which can come across as confidence, but we can also learn it.
Confidence is absolutely it is really heavily impacted by our environment, the way that our parents or care givers spoke to us, the way that our teachers coaches spoke to us, the way that our friends spoke to us, the way in which the world works the way in which we see you know, who's good and who's not good or perfection really can impact on our ability and the way that
we see ourselves and value ourselves. So I would say both, Sam, I'd say both biological personality traite, but also confidence can absolutely be learned.
Let's go, let's go sort of beneath the surface a little bit. What's actually happening to our brains when we're when we're experiencing confidence versus sort of when we're not. Is there something happening to our actual brain function when that's happening.
Yeah.
Absolutely, that's a really really good question, Sam. I think this can be best explained or described when we think back to evolutionary processes. So, for example, when we feel threatened in some way, and I think confidence is most threatened when we talk about social threats, so threat of embarrassment, rejection, failure, shame. We have our survival system that activates flight fall freeze.
So we fight with ourselves. Okay, we criticize, we suppress parts of ourselves that we learn aren't say, accepted, approved of. These mechanisms are designed to keep us in line or fix things about ourselves, to keep us safe. So that we belong here, so that we're accepted as humans. Our most primitive survival mechanism is to make sure that we
are connected, that we are belonging. So sometimes we might flee into shame and isolation as a way to avoid discomfort things that we're not good at, or things that we fear that we might fail at and form. We might start to mold ourselves into being whatever somebody else wants us to be, or whatever we perceive that we need to be in order to feel safe in the sense of belonging or to avoid things like embarrassment or rejection.
And so we can start to understand that these adaptive mechanisms that initially, you know, were there to keep us safe from saber tooth tigers actually become really unhelpful when say, we don't like the way we look and address, or we don't like, you know, photos of ourselves, or we don't think that we're the right weight, shape size.
It's really interesting to go back to such a primitive origin.
Amy.
I've got a teenage daughter who I think that that age in particular, you know, she's seventeen years old, but she will analyze what's going to happen to within each of our life so much so that it paralyzes her a lot, you know, Like she'll think about going out, and then she's almost played out the whole scenario in her head of who's going to be there and what are they going to think? And what am I going
to wear? And who else is going to you know, so much so that she's almost exhausted herself or lived it as a worst case scenario in her head rather than.
Just go What a brilliant survival mechanism she has, Like this is the wisdom of her organ trying to create a sense of certainty and predictability that you know, there is this really big event and there are social risks and social threat and so this is her wise, beautiful brain trying to keep her safe by anticipating all of the what ifs what could happen. But then, like we were saying, sometimes these adaptive protective parts of us actually
end up being blockages. And what I mean by blockages is sometimes they do such a great job at protecting us that we may not try to do things or put ourselves in situations because the risk or the fear of failure or embarrassment or judgment seems far too threatening or far too scary.
Yeah, I mean I'm guilty of it. I mean guilty. Maybe it isn't the right word, but I'm definitely restricted by it in a networking sense.
You know.
Obviously a big part of my job is to get out there and made as many different people as I can, and I'd do some public speaking, or we'll go to various business events or fitness events. And even now, after you know, so many years of experience doing what I do, I still find myself huddled in the corner of these big events with a thousand people, talking to the four people I know in my little safe place. I love to talk to you guys a little bit too about imposter syndrome.
You know.
It's one of those things that as I was growing my twenty eight business and getting more of a public profile, I probably every month would have a sinking feeling in my stomach that this wasn't real. It was all too good to be true. I didn't belong here, and it was all probably going to end tomorrow. Why do we do that to ourselves?
Great question, Sam, I think one that a lot of people can relate to. I know you're not alone in that feeling. I think really coming off the back of what Aims was talking about with you know, imposter syndrome is quite adaptive. Imposterive syndrome is that protective mechanism coming up again. That's saying, hey, you've got ninety nine compliments, but if there's one critical piece of feedback or one mistake that we've made, we're going to focus on that.
And that's something we call the negativity bias, and that's something that we all have because our brain is not wide for happiness and risk taking. It's wide for safety. So whenever there's a threat, right, our brain will do this thing where it's like, well, this feels too scary. You know, this big thing feels scary, and I don't know if I feel deserving of this, so let's try
and not do this. I bet maybe starting up your business there was probably a lot of that self talk of this feels too scary or there's a lot of risk here and it's safer to stay in my shell. Imposter syndrome is you know, really the function of it is to really self reflect and it creates insight because as humans, the function of the negativity bias and imposter
syndrome is to do better, be better. Really, if you were really self confident and really over confident, you probably wouldn't grow, You wouldn't develop, you wouldn't look into your business or yourself or whatever it may be that you're passionate about, and then think about what can I do better? How can I be better? So I think there is a function of imposter syndrome of we really looking to ourselves and really think, Okay, I want to do better
and be better. But it can get to a point where it is quite dysfunctional and not helpful, when it's crippling you or overwhelming you. So essentially it is about that middle ground of always self reflecting and wanting to do better, but also knowing that you are deserving of where you are. You've worked really really hard to get where you were, and if you're not experiencing imposters syndrome, you're probably not growing. It's really common, no matter how
successful you are, to experience it. It's not a sign that you shouldn't be doing it. It's a sign that you are outside your comfort zone and it feels really scary, but it doesn't necessarily mean to stop. I think it's a really normal experience to feel.
I love that. I love that. You know, I've never viewed it as having a positive purpose, And I totally understand exactly what you're saying. It's both and it's a fine line. But I think because I never do stop and reflect or stop and congratulate myself, perhaps it brought when it did come on, it came and more. You sort of extreme in extreme manner. So enough about me,
let's stop talking about me. So a lot of my twenty eight is a lot of our listeners are on a wellness journey, and it's you know, whether it's trying to get fitter or stronger, or lose the weight that they've never been able to lose, or whatever it might be. And I do little coaching groups with a lot of them, and something that I see far more often than I sort of expected to, I think from people that are having,
in my eyes, a wonderful deal of success. You know, they're losing lots of weight, they're fitter and stronger and healthier than they ever have been, but it's just not how they see themselves. How do these people start to change their mindset and sort of shift that way they're feeling about confidence and self esteem, to be able to accept these compliments and be able to be prouder of how far they've come, rather than continually just focusing on how far they've got to go.
Oh, that is such a great question, and I think absolutely, Sam, we are talking about something a little bit different than confidence here. Confidence and self worse are not the same things. And what you're talking about in terms of no matter what external achievements I seem to gain, something still doesn't
feel enough. That is more in that self worse realm. Now, so much of body image and physical appearance based lacks around confidence have very little to do with what our actual physical body looks like, and so much to do with the messages and the meaning and the worth and value we attribute to our body and our body image. So no one is born hating their body. These are messages we learn, and essentially that voice that says, okay, once I lose five kilos, then I'll be enough. My
biggest tip. I wish it was simple, it's not. It would be self compassion. And this often seems to be used as something that is quite fluffy. It's not. I guess if we're going back to our nervous system. Self compassion relies on our safety system, you know, it helps us to feel soothed and safe. And going back to evolutionary theory, it's that care system that we use to give love to others, to our children. Essentially, self compassion
is flipping this on our elves. It's what we already give to others, but it's being able to do that to ourselves. And if we break down the meaning of compassion com means wiz and passion means suffer, So compassion
literally means to suffer with. So if we are able to really acknowledge and recognize our experience rather than beating ourselves up and criticizing ourselves, if we're able to acknowledge that this is really hard and validate that, then we feel less overwhelmed, We feel less anxious, It reduces fear of failure. We're more able to cope with the discomfort. It helps with burnout because we're able to set boundaries for ourselves, we have better work life balance, and it's contagious.
When we model this to our children, to people around us, we help others be less criticizing and more compassionate towards themselves too, and I think women in general are pretty bad at doing this right, because we're raised to feel value and worth based on putting others first. Okay, we see being self compassionate as being selfish, and we think that, you know, we have this limited supply of compassion, but actually it's additive. So the more compassion you give to yourself,
the more will be available for others. Okay, and sometimes logistically there are time limitations, and that's a very real resource. But what I love about self compassion is we never run out of emotional support like warmth and kindness and patience and care. That's always going to be available to us. We just have to give ourselves permission to access that for ourself, and that is like a continual process. So it's an everyday practice of starting to access this part.
So what are the simplest, quickest things that someone could start doing from tomorrow? From a practical sense, I think.
Having really reflect on how you speak to yourself is really important here, Like Aims was saying self compassion not self compassionate, you're probably talking to yourself quite negatively. So I guess a really practical strategy is, you know, we here to write nice things about yourself and think positive. But how can you do that when you've been at war with yourself for many years. You can't suddenly change
the way you think about yourself overnight. So something that I ask for or do with clients is write down the thoughts you have about yourself, and how can we instead of going straight to positive, how can we actually go to a mutual statement. So instead of I hate my thighs, instead of going to I love my thighs. Your brain is clever out. Your brain's not going to believe that. Your brain's are going to be like, okay, great,
I'll flick that switch. That neural pathways now change. We need to create statements that we actually believe but aren't as negative or intense as something like I hate this part of myself. So something like you know, if that's how you feel, I hate this body part. Instead of that, could we maybe have a statement of, you know what, this body part really helps me run, or this body part helps me diegets food, this body part is really helpful, and you know what, your brain will perceive that as oh,
that actually is fact. So then what will happen is we'll create a new neural pathway. The next time we think about that body part or we practice that. As Ames was saying, we won't go straight into that. Really it's not negative. They're protective. They're very protective thoughts, right, it'll go to that logic. You know what, although I still feel this way about my body part, I'm acknowledging there's a positive or a neutral part to this that it helps me in some way. So I think that
that's a trap we can get caught in. Is I noticed this with clients with their body image, that I should love myself and that's actually not the case at all. It would be great to get there, but it's a journey, it's a relationship, you know, and it's slowly taking those
baby steps. So neutralizing, you know, statements like that, focusing on the function of your body, the strengths that you have that are true, your brain is going to be much better able to get there and believe that than going straight to everything's perfect and I love everythingout myself.
You said too, Amy, It's not an easy process, which I think is a really important thing for people to understand, particularly if this is how you've been for a long long time, you said, Kat, You've been at war with yourself for a long time. It's not a click your finger turn things around youb I love that neutralizing things before you flip it to a love or a positive side of the coin.
How long can it take?
Absolutely, it is a process, and I say it needs to be an everyday commitment, and everyday commitment to yourself and every day practice starting to really recognize and acknowledge this part of yourself that really believes in you, that knows that you are so deserving of love and that you are good enough. Starting to acknowledge every day what that part does for you. Kat was speaking about neural pathways and neural circuits. A lot of our inner critic
is subconscious. It is that we will be triggered by something and then we have an automatic response. Those protective parts of us, like shame and guilt, they will come out without us even knowing. So it's an everyday practice of becoming more and more conscious of these parts. And this is where I think mindfulness can be really helpful.
So practicing being with yourself moment to moment, without judgment of what comes up for you, So paying attention to how you feel in your body, paying attention to your physiology, is really important because how we feel in our body in terms of you were mentioning your daughter experiencing anxiety around events. When we have a lot of nervous energy or anxiety about something, we're perceiving that through the lens of threat. Okay, So when I'm anxious about something, my
perception of it is that it's bad, it's dangerous. You know. I want to keep myself safe from potential embarrassment, humiliation, that type of thing. When I'm calm, when I'm present, I'm viewing the situation or the world through the lens of optimism, I feel much less overwhelmed and much more confident in my capacity to cope. Okay, So being mindful as an everyday practice, being present with yourself and attuned to yourself as an everyday practice is going to be
really really helpful. And rather than getting you there faster in terms of self acceptance and self love and that type of thing, what that will do is broaden our capacity to cope with the process as we move through it.
I love that, Yeah, I really love that.
It's you know, I often say to people, would you say that to your.
Friend or family member? That God?
Now, like, so, why are you saying to yourself, you know, like I'm sure you've you've said that to your to your clients many times. It's like, why you would never say that to your sister or your daughter or your best friend, and yet you have no trouble whatsoever talking like that to yourself. And it's it's but sometimes I think they sort of suppress it or but you know, if it's written down in front of you, this is
what you were saying to yourself today. That's not good language to be using to yourself on it, like you say, on a consistent basis.
It's quite confronting when people do this, because you're right, they don't acknowledge that they speak to themselves like that. When we get clients to do this, they'll be quite
confronted with how they do speak to themselves. Often get clients to write a letter to themselves and their body, and that's a really confronting experience because they talk to their body like they're angry at it, like it's done something wrong, and it's actually, you know, a task like that is really helpful and being like wow, you know, because we're not aware of our thoughts every day that we have, we have it's so unconscious how we live our life, so to actually bring it to awareness is
really confronting. And that's a really great tools to write down how do you speak to yourself? Because when we have a thought, it creates a feeling, and that feeling creates behavior, and if we're not thinking about ourselves constructively, that the cycle continues. So yeah, I think writing it down five minutes a day, stacking it onto another habit like working out. You know, we prioritize our physical health
so much. We go to the gym, we eat really well, but when it comes to our mental health, we just hope that it's all good all the time without putting in a lot of effort. We need to think of our mental health really holistically, like with our physical health, put the time into it. Five minutes a day is
more than enough. And you know, whatever that be, journaling, going to therapy, talking to a friend, writing down your sorts, caring for your nervous system, breath, mindfulness like whatever that looks like for you, sleep, good food, like these are all wonderful things we can do for our mental health. It's prioritizing that it's really important too.
It's essentially just like nourishment like everyday nourishment, like you wouldn't not eat for a whole day or a whole week. Our mental health is just as important as physical hunger.
Yeah, we would, we.
Would not eat for a week. We need to need to feed our emotional state as well, you know, our mental health. It's so so true if there was one two hip for our listeners that you we can leave them with today to do it, to just start doing every single day, what would it be?
I have a something that does sometimes help, and you know it is actually how you talk to yourself is often how would you talk to your younger self? Or often when we bring our younger self into it, it creates a sense of compassion as aims for saying of this self compassion because we are our own harshest critics. So every time you have a thought about I don't like this about myself or I'm really annoyed that I did that or messed up, would you say the same
thing to younger you? You know, our childline version of ourself is very vulnerable and needs a lot of support. But but really what's changed except a few years. I find that a really helpful strategy is the next time you're kind of in the mirror and really being quite
self critical, what would you say to younger you? Would you say the same things or would you say something quite different, Because that part of yourself deserves the same compassion and love and support is what you would give you a child, right, So I find that really helpful. And now it's a big trend on TikTok is putting
a picture of your younger self on the mirror. I don't know if you guys have heard that before, but I think that's an amazing idea because it puts that in the front of mind of how would I talk to younger me? And I think that can really shift the way that we speak to ourselves. Oh well, I.
Love that's Yeah, Let's get out the old photo album and then pick a little doozy out of the photo and give that up on our mirror and do that. I think that's a wonderful exercise. To Lebo, this is with Hungover Sam has come on today, and I thought we were going to be a bit it was going to be a bit more lighthearted, but it's been deep and it's been really powerful, and I can't thank both of you enough for your time today. Thank you so much.
Where can people find you if they want to follow you and get some more tips from you or catch up with what you're doing.
Girls.
Oh, it's been an absolute pleasure.
We're on Instagram at the Psychology Sisters. We have a podcast this Psychology Sisters always have an online psycho practice which only and I both work out called Eat Psycho Pretty, and that's on Instagram as well.
Thank you both so much.
I hope if you are listening and you do struggle from a self worth, self compassion, self confidence perspective, that you just you take that on board you start to, as I said, shift the balance a little bit, spend a little bit less time working out and a little bit more time working out on your mind. Next up, we're going to get a bit of a spring in our step as we're going to talk about seasonal and spring foods. So a little while ago we spoke about
winter foods as we were in winter. We're now not in winter anymore, and so I love that this question has come through from Jill.
I was listening to one of your earlier episodes about what we should be eating during the winter, and I wonder, just as we're heading into spring. What foods would you recommend we start eating at the moment.
That's such a good question you, and I'm so glad you brought it up, particularly right now, And yes we did. We spoke about winter. The principle doesn't change. The season has changed, but the principles to why you should stay seasonal don't change. And to be honest, there's too many reasons to do this and no reasons not to do this. The food tastes better, it's more accessible, and it's more affordable.
And we've all noticed it. You know, you go to buy a fruit and it's not in season, it's expensive and it typically tastes a bit like crap. Whereas if you're buying the food that particular fruit when it's in season, there's an abundance of them everywhere with it be the supermarket or the markets or whatever it might be. They're much cheaper and the flavor just hits you when you
buy it into them. So now in spring. So I've got a comprehensive list in front of me, which I won't go through alphabetically because we'll be here all day. But from a fruit and vege perspective, we've got blueberries, honey, jew mangoes, oranges, watermelon, pineapple. They're all coming into season from a fruit perspective, and then from vegetables, we've got our snow peas, our cabbage, our Brussels sprouts, our broccoli, our spring onion, our mushrooms. They're all coming into peak
season now September to November. And then even our herbs and spices. When you're flavoring your foods, flavor them seasonally too, so at the moment, go for your basil, chili deal, chibes, coriy ander, garlic and ginger, and you can't go wrong. I really felt today we got into the nitty gritty
of a really important topic. As always, thank you for sending you questions through There's always a link in the show notes you can send me a voice question at any time and I'll be back on Monday for another motivational moment. Have a great weekend.
I'll see you soon.