You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from news Talks B.
And my first panelist, where would you go with? Let's go? I was going to say age before beauty, but that just gets me into trouble. That's an easy one, but let's just go with age and beauty. Of course it's Pete wolf Camp from the Resident Builder and here on news Talks a baptew.
More of one less than the other. I think as time moves on, more.
Of that means yes, I guess that's inevitably. Hey, by the way, I did enjoy you've actually come dressed for theme because I have. I got dressed up, especially the Hiver's CROSI I am, and they're not in sports mode, so you're ac accident waiting to happen.
None of their Hivers bright orange they were.
Are they your first pair?
No? No, In fact, these I don't know how many pairs I've had. I've had one pair that I like so much that I actually tried to retread them. That being a combination of sort of thrift and dutchness and and things like that couldn't actually work that well.
To be thrift in dutchness, you being of Dutch descent which wait to get away with that's right, and also joining me as editor of the New Zealand Gardener magazine. Joe McCarroll, God, Joe, how are you going?
I am tickety booth?
Tickety booth? Where does tickety boo come from? I've been looking at some of these expressions we take for granted, and I don't know. I just sometimes think, where.
Does tickety booths love?
It's very English, isn't it.
It's just tickety boo origin story like down the mines when the children were coming back from their fourteen hours.
Sho oh no, if the clock got to fourteen hours and your shift was up, then.
It was tickety booth tickety bo Oh my goodness. Hopefully something more And isn't that? But anyway, by the way.
We'll get a text on this, won't we.
Oh yeah, we get texts all the time. By the way, you can text. You can text on nine two nine two. Right, let's get into it, shall we. So firstly I covered this because I've been doing afternoons this week. But the mood of the boardroom rankings, which were normally when I see the mood of the boardroom comes out, I'm sort of like, oh yeah, Murder of the Boardroom, And then I had a bit of a read it and actually found it quite interesting as to the perception of everyone's performances.
The thing that initially stood out to me was that, and I think he might be happy about this that Christopher Luxen wasn't racked at the top. It was Erica Stanford, but five of his team members were racked above him. And I guess as a team builder, he'd be happy with that, wouldn't he, Pete.
I suspect that he's not going to be sort of threatened or upset about that. That what he wants to do is have his ministers doing a good job. And if they're regarded by those people surveyed as doing a good job, and arguably even a better job than him, then that's great.
Yeah. I don't shortened sweet there, Pete. What do you reckon? Joe?
Oh? I mean, I could have predicted a lot of it before I read it, Like, I mean, I'm not particularly surprised that the business community are feeling pretty happy with the center right government. I think it aligns with what they're looking for. But I think it's interesting.
I mean, well, that's right because the optimism had gone from a one point eight to two last year at a five to a three point two to three. Yeah, that's right, and that's that's generally what you probably referring to.
Their Yeah, it's certainly no surprises, it's no surprises, But I mean, I think it's interesting to how we should wait these things. You know, when you look at economic activity in New Zealand, it's so strongly driven by those SMEs. And so I'm not saying this isn't a cohort, but it is a cohort, and they have got a bias because what they think is this, you know, what makes them optimistic is an economy in which they can make money, which makes sense, which is.
Also which they can employ people, create more wealth, those sorts of things downside to.
That, well it's more than one of the factors. Then they don't consider as a factor like well being, workers' rights. You know, those are not factors which would improve the outlook. In my cynical view.
You don't have workers if you don't have a business, right, So let's have business and then we'll sort out the reason.
Yeah, you know, and I see what you're saying, but I'm like you know, if let's have business, let's sort out the rest. I mean, that's kind of what we're talking about now with some of the policy that's been rolled out where it's like, just cut the red tape, and you think, oh, and I'm conflicted about it. I see the temptation to say cut the red tape, but I'm like, some of that red tape it's protecting us as well as long it's down.
Yeah, I see that. But then you look at Erica Stanford and I was watching a clip with her talking about education. Right, so they did a big review of what's going on with the how the Ministry of Education has been administering school properties. Basiclyne terribly right.
So that's actually a ripper of a store.
It's a fantastic out.
It's a shockhead. Just one and a half million to two million dollars to build a classroom.
Honestly, can we get it.
Don't get too hysterical about that figure though, You've got to kind of crunch some numbers on that.
And a classroom doesn't even have I mean, it doesn't even have a toilet, it doesn't have a kitchen.
Also, we're not talking about a classroom like you know, most of us would imagine classrooms that we sat in as children or something like that. Classrooms are not like that, And it might be reflective of the sorts of buildings that the MOE have been doing recently, often slightly more elaborate. They're part of larger complexes, they've got more amenity in them and so on. But I still think that, you know, I'm doing the numbers still on stretch at the school.
I'm on a board of trustees, right, so we've done a recent building project and I know what the numbers are, and I know what the classroom rate would be, and it's considerably less than that. Now that's not done by m o E. That's done by the diocese basically.
So e hey, no, I didn't mean done by we are digressing. I guess the thing was. I mean, I actually thought when you said no surprises, Joe, that you were talking about the rankings as well, which had what was it, Erica Stanford number one.
I think Erica Stanford's performing. Yeah, you know, I think she's a future leader of the National Party and probably a Prime Minister of New Zealand. I think she has been brilliant in her ministerial portfolio. But yeah, I mean I think there was no surprises there for me. I think the people who were judging it, they waited it as I would have expected based on the position they're experiencing life from.
There was an interesting article too, I think Matthew Houghton went to that border the mood of the boardroom and wrote a piece going because there was also the discussion between Labor and National around superannuation, and his comments were along the lines of these are the two people who should be leading the country, which I thought was fascinating as well. Who said Edmonds and Nichola Willis So I
had a debate about superannuation. And I think his reflection on being in the room and I haven't a chance to look at the debate yet, was actually, these two people should be leading the country.
And that's a good sign. It's a good sign when there are leaders in waiting, and it's a good sign when there's intelligence at the top in all parties. Yes, well maybe not all parties.
Well, I know it'll be interesting because if we have the same opinion on which parties might be struggling in
that one but the other one. Actually, the interesting thing for Luxeon Christopher Luxon was that he had key performance in and this is why I think he'd be happy with it, because they were things about, you know, selling New Zealand and branding and about ten different things, but the one he scored four point four I think out of five was his ability to build a good team and everything, which is exactly how he has pitched his
Prime ministership. So I would say he should be he should be pretty pretty happy with that, do you think, Pete.
Yeah. And it always surprised me at the lead up to the election last year that the pitch for National was not more along lines of here's our team and here's your team effectively, because I think they did bring to the table a lot of people with a hell of a lot more qualifications and ability than Labor did, and maybe that's why the election went the way that
it did. So I think in that sense, if he ends up being lower down the ranking and he's able to put a team forward, that goes, actually, here's my high performance because they're the ones actually doing the work. If I've got someone doing infrastructure, then I want my best person doing that. I don't have to do it. I have to make sure that they do it. Well, that's good leadership. I would have thought I.
Would have thought so. And it's consistent with the way he's been selling his leadership, I guess, isn't it. Joe.
He absolutely I mean, he has never made any secret that he is running the country like you would run a business. And I see some upsides to that. But in the end of country is not a business, sure actually, and I think that is where you get the downside. I mean, those KPIs, I think it would be if we had more time to really tease them and say, is this delivering a new Zealand that for vulnerable people?
And I'm not sure they are. I think they they're delivering more for people who already have more hot take.
See. I know, I think I'd probably disagree with that because I think that you can't you can't distribute tax unless you're making money and having productive economy. And I think there is I think we sort of can have hopefully a cake can eat it too. But fun facts before we get into it. There's one found fact I really loved, and it's just that an old school campaigner, guess who was one ahead of luxen By. He was on three point seven to three on three point seven
four with Studith Collins, which enjoyed that. But here's another fun fact. I actually did cover this in the afternoons. Did you know Erica Stanford, I think considered almost a music deger and I had a meeting because I might be doing as I might be doing Christmas concert with them with a particular brass band, and that's been hosted in the past by Erica Stanford, who apparently plays a mean besides heard that and actually here, I mean, she's a bit out of practice in this one, I'd say,
because she's been enough like twenty three years. It's a few years she left school. But we've got a little clip of it. I think, am we big job there? Pits change anyway. I just think it's interesting when you hear about humanized something in Parliament, and it was funny watching her suddenly go from joking around and being like, I'm going to play this thing and she's just the determination. Just a little bit of a fun fact for you there.
Let's let's move it on a bit because from someone who wasn't going to probably in the mood of the boardroom, be a superstar, perhaps not in the in the top top it was Casey Cassello. I don't think now it's it's easy. Let's not talk about the arguments so much of whether you know, smoking versus heated tobacco versus vapes. I think the problem for her is the whole argument has got lost because she has not handled this issue
at all well. And I think she's a I still think she's a massive chink in the armor of a government that might consider in many respects it's doing well. Casey Costello is not doing well as.
She Jo Gacy Costello is a hot mess. I mean, I don't think she's coming across as competent, you know. And I mean there's a lot of swirling swellings, narratives about conspiracies and that multimately not a tax breaks for you know. And I think if you were going to conspire, pick a more effective person, you know, Because yeah, I think she's she is a massive failing in the government.
Right now. I would say, well, I failed to well absolutely when I've got you here for your view, but we're all going to be on a similar page on this one. I think Joe, because she talked about this independent advice she had and she would eventually give it looked like she just.
Went she and printed something off the internet.
Now, I reckon she either just went Now where were those articles that got sent to me by a particular person. I'd love to know if it was just someone a lobbyist for the stuff, who said, hey, have a read of these, or she'd lost it and she just went, I better google this heated tobacco versus vapes and smoking and just found five or sex articles.
Even make your point, I mean, I just think the idea of going and saying I've got some research and then not being able to provide that research undermines your credibility immediately.
I think there's been a lot of you know, the record can't be found. I can't find that documentation. Like I say, it feels chaotic.
And here's the thing though, But I reckon if she was a national MP, I think she would have been shifted out in the same way we've seen already happen. Oh yeah, gone. But she's a New Zealand first MP, and I think while i've been I have sung Winston's praises as our foreign minister, and I've loved him telling off the Russians and all that sort of stuff. I hope he doesn't defend her to the detriment of the government, because I actually think she needs to be shifted on.
And I think and I understand I am singing from my own song here and perhaps agreement, but I think this is a mark of luxe and being slightly powerless. He can't act because I think he's terrified ab upsetting Winston.
I don't know if it's powerless. It's just a reflection of the fact that they are in coalition, right, and that what you do is in some way moderated by your partners.
I think those coalition should be weighted based on the proportional representation. I think those decisions should be weighted in terms of who New Zealand has voted for, and I think in that sense there's too much sway held by the two minor parties.
I guess it's about the look. It's also no coalition. I don't think could have one party say I want you to well, I don't know, because she's what is she is. Yeah, I don't know what the what the rules would be long term because we've had we had the last three years where labored enough to account to anyone except themselves. And I wonder if we still haven't worked out what coalition politics looks like, which probably asked
them what they do. In Germany they have a coalition of that's quite amazingly coupled together coalitions.
But I think you're right. I mean, the hard thing must be that people in national must know that this person is now liability to our government, which includes us and.
Two and two in the next generation. I mean, you know, these aren't decisions that are sort of meaningless in terms of the consequences. I mean, I'm genuinely quite sad to think that the movement we were making towards smoke free to New Zealand is just being squandered.
Well, yeah, thing is, it's predicated on the idea that you can ban something and I just don't think you could. I think that we are still trending downward with smoke. It still shocks me the number of people at smoke though it's like ten percent. I mean, it's a surprisingly large number of people when I don't know anyone who smokes.
We are trending downwards on smoking, but we are like strocking on vaping, and I mean that is shocking because you know.
You're not going to ban that either. I mean, that's the thing.
But it's been so rearly targeted at young people.
And it's simple things to do about it. Make it prescription.
Plane packaging, prescription only vape stores.
It's complicated. Hey, look, I think we might take quick break and we'll come back and see about how people got hot and hot under the collar about Crys Relux and daring to sell Hiss apartment and actually makes some money out of it. Well, I suspect he might have spent a fear whack of it.
Will be interested to know.
I have Okay, twenty three past three News Talk, Yes where everything.
For the Great Heisman, Zim Wogle book mon Tiger.
Was Master.
And welcome back to the Weekend Collective. This is the panel. My panelist Joe mccarell, editor of The New Zealand Garden, and Pete wolf Camp, resident builder Here on news Talk zaid b. Now just on the continue a little bit of politics. The so Christopher Luxon has moved into Premier House. He didn't sound actually that thrilled about being there today. It's like it's all right.
Ah.
And and the other news, of course, which the news one News banged on about for a while, a big headline that somebody has sold alse in Wellington and made money PABs Maybe I don't know, but the apartment was last sold for seven hundred and ninety five thousand, and I think it's been I think he made a profit of around one hundred and seventy not taking into account what he spent on it. I actually didn't think this was such a I mean, it's newsworthy, I guess because
people want to know what it was. But I'm not sure what point he was making.
Pain The headline just enormously upset me, and not upset me, just made me furious because of the nature of the headline. So the headline is luxant avoids tax.
No, that was mischievous, wasn't it. That's right?
No, no, no, there's no tax to pay on capital gain. Now, whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, that's up to you. But suggesting you know that the whole thing around tax avoidance right.
Is such a hot topic.
That's just so mischievous and nasty to be blunt, it really annoyed me.
Joe.
I think the reason people are talking about this is not because he sold the apartment. It's not because he made money on it, and frankly, even the tax situation, I mean, the brightline test is changing. He's gotten in ahead of that. But I mean, who wouldn't do that. That's just a logical thing to do. But I guess it was his reaction to it that I think is what it was. Very tone deaf. He said that thing. If we're going to criticize people for being successful, you know,
I get it, I'm rich. That may be a slight paraphrase.
I actually.
Like it didn't for me, resonated a different way, which is, at a certain point, can we give up worrying about how much money he's got right and has he acted in his own self interest in this? No, I don't believe he has. Has he made some money on a property, yeah, and in that case, good on them. Basically, I don't.
I think it's a misreading. I don't think he's being criticized for being successful. I think he's criticized for being tone deaf in a cost of living crisis, you know. I mean, he did, and it is his right to sell property that he owns, you know, but wealth is not a messed in a vacuum, you know. And I think this idea that oh, well I've made money and that's due to my entirely myself, that that's just never true. And I think, if you're making money, yeah, at a cost to other people.
I thought, Look, I think he was responding to the questions that were like, oh, you've made this money, haven't paid any tax, and he I thought he was just saying, look, yes, I have made money out of it. And actually, the funny thing that I was kind of amused by was the word that we've got a new word for wealthy and as sorted, because that was the language he used.
He said, I'm sorted.
Yeah, yes, I've worked hard, I've done well in my career and I've done well, and look I'm sorted. And I think he was pushing back against this distraction like all the prime ministers sold a house and made money out of it. It's like, well, hang on a minute. You didn't want him to you wanted him to live, and you didn't want him to take an allowance, which he could have taken, but then it ended up didn't not taking which would have been which was a political
mistake for him. But then you know, he moved into premier House and he's so he doesn't need his apartment. He could have rented it and continue to make money. Wouldn't have even been.
Wouldn't have been a story.
I just think it's interesting that he sold it in a market that's pretty flat managed to make money, which tells me.
And it's a good property location.
Well, the real estate agent hinted, he said, they've done a lot of they've done a lot to it, and Amanda Luxen had done a lot, had very good taste with what she'd done. But we never had that presented by the news. It was just like al hes sold it and made money, naughty him, and he avoids tax. It's like I thought it was just the avoidance thing just really wound me up. Well, because it is a word that describes, Yeah, it's that you've deliberately tried to
avoid tax. It's a it is a taxation related word.
Yeah, I mean, I actually agree with you on that.
I think that's more.
Of it in an egregious way. But at the same time, I just think he sold that property. He sold another property owned and he has the absolute right to do.
That, absolutely.
But that's probably five or six times the median income. You know that you've made tax free and on top of tax cuts that I think the benefit of which is felt more by people at the top of the heap, and at the same time saying we can't afford the denaed in the hospital.
There's not a theory that actually still an apartment is not going to change the numbers on them.
I absolutely agree, but I just think it is tone deaf. I think he just fails to read the room. I think he should have shown a lot more humility.
I don't know how what would he do though to show humility? Yes, I mean, if you're going to be humble, you'd be like, yes, I've made money, and yes I'm successful already. You could say he's being arrogant just by pointing out facts, you know what I mean, How could he be humble? He could lie and so I'm not as rich as people think on there are people who are much richer. That would be a false humility. I don't know if he can win this one, you see, Joe.
I do think that he probably got hopped by someone reached the point where it's like, come on, we've got I'm.
Still delighted that he said if rick In I thought, oh, naughty that was a different interview of Justin.
I think Joe, to your point where he was perhaps tone deaf, was claiming the accommodation benefit on that property at the beginning.
I think we've talked about that before. I think that was completely tone deaf.
And good onor for stepping and straight away realizing it's going to be a problem. I'm going to pay the money back, I'm going to stop claiming it. And now I suppose by moving into premier house and selling the apartment, it's all off the board, right.
Yeah, And I would have no problem with any of that. But I think if you are lucky enough to be successful and be comfortable and have money, part of that is luck and good fortune and a lot of people who have helped you on the way.
And I find it, along with a bit of luck and a little bit of good fortune, is some bloody hard work a lot. So I'm thinking, you know, there are over six hundred thousand rental properties in the country, about seventy eight percent of them are owned by people that own one or two rental properties. Now, most of those people, and I know a bunch of them, are people that have set aside money, that have scripted and saved and you know, looked after themselves so that they're
not a burden on the government going forward. I don't think we should diminish that and the hard work that those people do at all.
Oh, and I don't intend to, you know, I completely agree with you. I mean, I think there's something fundamentally wrong with the basis of our economy is selling each other secondhand houses. I mean, I think that is a flaw, but that's not the fault of people who own them.
This is great, but there's some hard lessons in that too, because you know, and look, it's like I've got a second you know, Like for me, what influences me is like my mum and dad they retired or dad sold the business years ago. They put some money into shares in New Zealand shares in nineteen eighty six. Right, they went from two dollars fifty they were down to four cents a couple of years ago. They might be back to two dollars fifty hour. Right, so that they did
the right thing. Put it into a productive asset. They put money into a buddy finance company that went ballly up. If they had a border rental property. All those years ago, they would have been so much better off. No wonder people buy rental properties.
Oh, no, wonder, that's a whole. That's almost we're moving the conversation on. We'll be talking about cgts again and we'll be in the property how so we'll have to move on, all right, But thanks kids. Hey, by the way, just quickly on the politics before we take a break. Chris Bushop is open to new tolls to fun roadst
Do you mind tolls? I don't mind them them as long as there's an option to go yes, route B. And that's where I think for the people in the wire upper right in this new road over the over the hills there, that shouldn't be told, right because that's replacing something that's broken. Yeah, and that has still been consulted on to be fair, So we don't know what's going to happen.
That would distink if they told me.
But do you mind tell new roads tolls?
I think like you to him, If it's a bypass that saves time and there is an alternate route, I think we have to pay for public infrastructure.
Drive to walk with in the new motorway. Do you want to save two dollars eighty by tootling along the old State.
No, boy, I tell you what the tolls I mean, they've got a lot of them in Europe, but you them because either run to take the scene at route or you want to go quickly for me to be But the one that did my head and was luckily I had a pass which got me a discount on it. But the return toll through the mont Blanc Tunnel from Shamo total fifty four euro. Fifty four euro. And I said, I hang on, man, I forgot this pass here, and I showed him a ski pass. He goes, are lucky,
You're lucky. You show me that's sixteen that even then sixteen euro.
That's the toll road and tall.
Wronger.
That's enormously disappointing, right, It's like.
It's like about a kilometer lost.
It's not even I.
Guess doesn't feel grand kilometer is like a ripoff. If that kilometer saved you twenty kilometers.
You'd be like, doesn't no, exactly, that's underwhelming that one, ah, right.
I don't think it's worth the two dollars eighty I paid to drive on it.
No, I got to the end of it when said it like I was hoping for more.
Oh yeah, I mean when it first opened, I remember thinking, oh, this is quite fun. Anyway, that was back in the days where I remember driving those round around some of those rough raids in my nineteen seventy one forty escort. Was always more entertaining to take the long route, to be honest, yep, that's how I learned how to do a bit of rally driving in between roder and taring.
That was great fun after at ten o'clock at night. Anyway, as we're going to be back with more, including just a good news I mean not good news, it's not news really, but hopeful news that there's been another sighting of the Mara Coopa a lot today with a sighting of Tom Phillips and god, I hope they actually catch them. But we'll be back in a minute to discuss that and other things. This is the panel on News Talk Sai'd be week in Collective. It's twenty three minutes to
four finer. That's fun, Live Religion and welcome back to the Weekend Collective. This is the panel and I'm Tim Beverage, I'm my guests Joe mccarell and Pete wolf Camp just correicktly' there's not really too much to say about this, but the fresh in quarries after there's been another tip on the Maracopa family, Tom Phillips and has three children apparently being spotted by some peak hunters and some bushmen near Maracopa,
reporting to police on Thursday. I do get optimistic, Pete, when I hear these stories reported and it's you know, a couple of days later, it's been reported now that hopefully they're closing the net and there's going to be an announcement that they have been found. But I mean, how long has it been?
What was the reward that was out a little while ago, one hundred thousand lead seemingly Yeah, so you know, if somebody knows, they obviously don't want to say, which is remarkable that you'd give up the chance to get eighty grand?
Yeah. How much would you need to sell out someone who was close to you?
Though, Joe, I'm thinking about it. I think though you're dealing with people who because I mean, my view which is based on nothing like I've got no ine info here, but I'm like, someone is supporting this family and they are doing it for ideological reasons. They're not doing it just, you know, to help out a mate or something. It's gone beyond just you know, this is someone someone's doing this for reasons of deep seated an ideology they believe.
In, possibly, and they're making it. They're doing huge damage to those kids, huge damage. I mean, it's awful, teaching them to be outcast from society and mistrust authority in all society, other members of their family. It's just I think he's just it's the It's deplorable, absolutely.
And I think we are in really one hundred percent agreement on that, and I think most of New Zealand would be right.
Let's let's move on. Hey, more happy things. This is there's quas, some inflammatory topics and in our panel is this afternoon more than half the population. So the census has been done. I mean, I guess there was a bit of a question about how well they actually collated the census and collected but let's move on from that.
But the proportion of people with no religion has increased from forty eight point two percent of the population in twenty eighteen to now more than half fifty one point six percent, so just over half of us are not religious. I would say, depends whether or not you count being a fan of Taylor Swift's religion, in which case you might reverse that number.
But I think they're looking at formal religions.
For I know, I'm just I'm being asking mischievous. Yeah, I'm doing this, but I mean in a way. That's the point I'm making is that I think even if people aren't following formal religion, they're substitu tuating it with other sorts of worship, whether they be of celebrities or whatever. But what do you make of it? Peter, You're a good Catholic bl an't you? Yeah?
Well maybe not. Good Catholics are very naughty.
He's not the Messiah.
It's a very naughty buye.
I tell you what.
My response this is what's fascinating, given that I've got some involvement in the sense with Catholic education. Is one of the things about Catholic education is, and I guess religious education in general, it's oversubscribed.
What is so?
Well?
I know, for example, at our college we had seen out about one hundred and seventy I'm sorry, we don't ever letters, right, so over subscribed. So people are still suggesting good schools or is it because they're good schools because they're Catholic schools?
Or this becomes a bit of a competition, almost, doesn't it.
Life's competition, so over it?
What do you reckon?
I mean, I think in terms of the school thing, I'm a bit more cynical about that. I think there's a lot of parents who might suddenly discover a faith when it turns out that they don't want their kid to attend the public school in their zone, and they might shout for church, you know, quite regularly over that high school period, and then perhaps you know, drift away.
But I mean that doesn't mean they're going to fill out that the census has been Catholic though? Is it because as private?
But I further your point to him, I think, you know, people are still seeking things to believe in, sure, and that's I mean Taylor Swift. I mean, that's perhaps something people might not think was a serious thing. But you know, I think people are still spiritually hungry and they want meaning. But I think in my life, our sort of feelings around.
Religion have changed.
I mean, I was raised in the Catholic Church myself, and back then it was sort of religion was almost an unqualified good. And now I think religion and that's not to say that religion isn't a good and there aren't wonderful religious people who live a life of real meaning and real faith and really contribute. But the religion is tarnished, the idea of religion is tarnished. Why because of a lot of news stories.
We've heard people doing terrible things in the people doing.
Terrible things in the name of religion, and that is not the religion itself. I just want to be really clear, but I think that in my lifetime it has been a really fundamental change.
Yep, I certainly see that. And I think, you know, the whole notions around you know, traditionality and so on, those things have changed a lot. Life like. It's a bit more ephemeral, and so people are not as wedded to those traditions. That changes things. Look, the numbers haven't dropped traumatically. They have dropped a little bit, So I'm not surprised at all.
I mean, I went through a stage of being well, I've been I went through a stage of being quite anti religious, but that was probably because of the things people are doing, which were terrorist acts in the name of religion and things like that, and so I'm more in the Christopher Hitchins school of things, but I've sort
of softened on in that respect. And that look, as long as if what you believe in informs you or inspires you to be a better person and to think about your fellow man or woman, should I say then great. I think where religion where the religious debates get a bit tricky, especially in politics, is when people bring religion into politics and say, I believe in this particular thing, and therefore I'm going to tell you that this is
the way you should be living your life. And I think that that's the thing I would push back against the most. And we see it probably, oh, we obviously see it very in I mean, who wants to be a woman in Iran? I'm sorry, but you know the choice a woman in America? Yeah, well, I mean come on, I mean, seriously, it's a free country. But there are problems with politics and religion, and I push back against that sort of stuff. I mean, fair enough, I guess.
Yeah, Look, it's a pretty important part of my life, so I'm not going to hide from that.
I mean, yeah, my kids go to a Catholic school. My wife's Catholic.
I mean that's yeah, our son goes to a Catholic school. I think that the school and the wider organization does a tremendous job. So yeah, I'm not going to back down from that.
Oh, I wasn't anticipating. That's a good point, I'm to me.
But I also appreciate the fact that for other people it's not important, and that's absolutely okay.
But well, actually, I think and this is not coming from a person who has a religious faith or all of the religious faith, but I think it's a bit of a shame because what I think that reflects is the increasing individualism. Yeah, lives we lead, and I think that limits us. I think it makes us less connected to each other. I think we achieve less if we're
just all out for ourselves. And I think although there were clearly pluses and minuses to the traditional kind of church structure, it was collective.
Yes. Actually, by the way, just you know, putting all aside whether the supernatural side be true. My favorite thing from the Christian religion is and something I because I was raised that way as well, the value of love thy neighbor, who is thy neighbor, anyone who is going to be affected by the consequence as a consequence of my actions and always, And I just think that that is such an amazing message. Regardless of that's.
True in so many different faiths, that message exists, you know, and I think that is a really profound thing. And you don't have to be religious to take that on board, to think about it, to live by that mantra.
I guess the challenge is always if you're not religious, where do you get that from?
I don't.
Yeah, well, this is that we could do. We could do, probably need to go on too Frank Frank's show to discuss things.
I guess what I'm not saying it's not possible because it is. Well, I mean, the example is the challenges from where and how readily accessible and so on. Whereas you've got all this tradition in the Christian churches anyway, around a life of service, around as you say, love your neighbor, those sorts of things are there and there to be learned.
If I was going to score a cheap point on this pete, it would be to say that, yes, the argument about you don't need religion to do good things, there is an argument to do the most horrific things. You only need to look in some of the religious text to find all the justification you need because we cherry pick. But that is such a cheap, quick point to make. But to be honest, you can think of it.
If you want to go and find the most horrendous invocations to do things nastily to people, you'll find them in religious text. And I think in the end, I think in humanity we pick and choose our own morality. But gosh, this conversation's really going to sort of unwekend
collective sort of panelis territory, but you know there it is. Yeah, anyway, but I you know, I love thy neighbor and that's why I love you guys, and I've probably we should probably move on because we've got really big issues to discuss, and just to teck because Crocs or Jandles one is a lot more dangerous than the other, and we will touch on that in just a moment, as ten minutes before the.
Story is coming up. Folks, Yep, welcome back.
To the Weekend Collective. I'm Tim Beverages. This is the panel. My guests to Joe McCarroll, and Pete wolf Camp. Now this actually was a misleading headlines, guys, but because I've got really was fascinated with a story about the amount of money that's been handled out by acc for injuries for high heels, Jandles and crocs. But it implied that Crocs were the big villain here and aligned much malign.
I've taking it personally.
Do you know the numbers on this, Joe, because it was surprising that Crocs out of two million, only sixty three thousand bucks.
Not two million dollars.
White, by the way, absolutely shocked me, yes, is that people are still wearing high heels like they are for the first half hour of a wedding and no other time.
And they are actually they're far lest common. But I think, I think, but the.
High heel eccidents are steady.
But the thing unlike the high heels themselves.
But the thing about crocs is the number of CROCS accidents I think is tripled, hasn't it.
That's the incredibly popular Here's the thing, here's the stat that everyone's missing Jandle's still costing JANDLE accidents one point three to one point four million, And it's it's funny isn't it that you can't handle the jandle of jandle slip in a quintessential part of New Zealand.
We literally cannot handle the jendle.
One point four million bucks and ladders cause how many how many dollars worth of injury ladders?
Ladders are okay, a lot more than.
That the last time I looked, seventy three million dollars a year is paid on ladders, on what falls from ladders.
Really, that's a bit of a worry because I do have quite a long.
Leaders to get at my roof frike. You imagine the carbage.
Actually, I did learn that there's there's a thing with crocs that you can go and you can put them in sport mode. In sport modes, when you take the bit that sits at the front flick, it's.
A smarts mode, then acc.
Therapy model. I could never walk.
I could never walk quickly in them. I could never walk quickly in jendles, no matter how often I wore them. I just didn't have that. Some people could do the one hundred meters I reckon in about eleven seconds in jendles. Yeah, yeah, not me.
I like a jendle, yeah, I like a jed. I did just get a pair of crocs though, just quite recently, speaking sort of trying to.
Be relevant, thinking of soft floppy things. I'm not sure well, I'm not sure whether we should do this, but I would just invite my audience to look at the latest seizure from P Diddy's estate. And I'm trying to put it one how do we put it? So if you're with the kids, they're a sort of toy for adult amusement, and they start with D and end and know and
the best thing. There were seven hundred and eighty four of them found, and the police took a photo like you know how they lay out all the guns when they have a gun stash.
All these sixties and they're standing at them like.
This is what we seized, as if it's a really big heist. But I just wondered they sell those on the police at a website and.
Well those are the old police suplus auctions.
Yeah, there we go. I mean, I don't know what excuse they could be for owning seven hundred and eighty four of them.
Job a lot.
Maybe there's a deal on TEAMO or something.
He's in jail. Long may he stay there.
Oh boy, he's I just I reckon the names that end up being pulled along with him. It's like the whole Epstein thing. It's on the same sort of scale. Anyway, Hey, thanks so much.
What maybe he'll die well, Pete not wishing it on him. I was going to say, thanks so much, guy taking an observation.
Joe McCarroll and Pete wolf Camp, We'll look forward to catch up with you again. The One Roof Radio Show is next with Calvin David some core logic joining us in just a tick. It's coming up to three minutes to four.
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