Scars That Speak: How Healing Actually Happens

Welcome to the Uproot Project podcast, where we dig deep to uncover and dismantle toxic beliefs about God, ourselves, and each other. Our goal is to replant new insights in the fertile soil of wisdom and love, fostering personal growth and transformation. Join us as we explore new ways of thinking and living in a world of complexity and diversity.

Welcome back. Welcome back. Welcome back, y'all.

Hey. Hey. Yo.

My name over here ain't

nothing over there. Party over here. Welcome back. We are ridiculous, and you already knew this. My name is Christian

Sheher. My name is Chris, he him.

My name is Whitney Sheher and a little nauseated.

Oh. This is the reality.

Y'all that's what that pause was. My face did a thing. We're just trying to bear with us. I I feel fine though.

I'll be okay.

I don't I just say

where they belong as as much as possible. I mean, but if they need to evacuate, y'all y'all just gonna get a pause.

You won't even notice.

I mean, you might Big up to our editor. Probably gonna talk about it,

but that's just the way we are.

Bonus clip. Dude, that's just the way we are.

That's just the way. That's exactly what my brain did but I didn't if that's where you were gonna go. Exciting. Yep.

You better sing it. Good

times. Good times. Mhmm.

Did y'all miss us?

RRP two part.

Is that who sings that? Mhmm. Yeah. That's the only part of the song I know. Yep. That's you know the instruments. It's part of

the Well It's

part of the same section. Things will never be the same. It's the part that's the part of the song I know. Those four little bars including the instruments. It's part

of the song I know. Oh, y'all. Okay. We're get

into this mind for this moment.

Yes. So as usual, if you are in a place where you can, you know who's not included.

Those with driving needs. Yes. Eyes required. Keep them open.

Or any other thing, like if you're operating heavy machinery.

Or generally at work and people you don't need people thinking you sleep, you know.

I mean, that's gonna be like sixty to ninety seconds. Close your eyes. That's revolutionary. Take your space. Okay? Fuck that Resist. In the words that I say all the time, fuck them people.

Resist.

Y'all remember okay. Before we go into this, do y'all remember just a few short months ago when Luigi did his big one? Oh, and that CEO left a vacant position and they posted that hoe the next day.

Oh, I do.

Yeah. That's what they gonna do. Stop giving them people your everything.

Life will go on.

Life will go on. Close your eyes at your desk Unless you're on camera, then turn the camera off and close your eyes because also fuck them people.

Okay. They could just think you went to the potty. It's fine.

That's it. So if you are in a position where you can close your eyes, please do so now. Close or lower your gaze. Get settled in your body. Feel your feet on the floor.

Alright. So today's topic is going to be vulnerability as a path to healing, how embracing vulnerability brings emotional and spiritual healing. And one of the things that we wanna just start off talking about is just overall how difficult it is. So you go down this process. I mean, that seems to be a really good place to start.

Gonna acknowledge that this is

It's hard. Hard.

Yeah. And it

Which is why healing is intentional.

You gotta do it on purpose.

You have to do it on purpose. But maybe without so much effort sometimes. Intent, not effort.

There you go.

Expound. So it's like we were talking about think we talked about this either one or two episodes ago. This idea that like living things grow. Yes. Right?

Mhmm. And

so this kind of the same way, I don't know if we were gonna talk about this this early, but here we go. The same way that like industrialization and capitalism has put on us this need to like constantly be productive. We take that and apply that to so many areas of our own humanity. We do. Right? And so, like, oh, I'm being lazy if I'm resting.

What? Fuck

that. No.

Soundly. Fuck it soundly. Okay? But but we we then also take that to our healing. Right?

It will.

It will align you with growth Yeah.

And healing. There's there used to be, when when I was back in church early on, one of the big things that we say that they only be out of a

storm

is

through.

Absolutely.

And, you know, just very simplified way of understanding what you were saying Yeah. Even now is like, you know, you have to be with yourself through the process.

Absolutely. Have

to aligned. You have to actively engage Mhmm. In the process. You can't check out.

Yeah. Yes. And And it's not even

You have to lock in.

Mhmm.

Yeah. But I think there's a we we we had some brief conversations about this previously with my relationship with food, which was the thing I thought of that needed healing. There is, I'm trying to remember exact phrase you said, you said we need to go into it with intent and not effort. Yes. And so the because of the extremes that our culture tends to make us go towards when we are attempting to heal something, first of all, usually the word in our head, my head, my head y'all, the word in my head is not healing, it is fixing.

Fixing. Yep,

and there is something wrong with me.

You better pull it out, tease it out, tease it out. Feel it, come on.

Yeah, and so that narrative of fixing doesn't just require intent, it requires effort, it requires attack, right? If I want to fix something,

then

I'm gonna go all in, right? But if you want to heal, and I'm a use an example because your got me and my knees, we got history. Okay? I have been dislocating my knees since I was 12. I am currently 38. Okay, that's over twenty five years of knees not being what they belong.

That's real.

Damn. And I've had two knee surgeries. I was diagnosed with patellofemoral arthritis, I know it's long, when I was 27.

All that means is just knee thigh.

Yeah. That's what that means. Knee thigh.

Telephone. Knee thigh.

Manee thighs. Got arthritis of the knee Oh

my gosh.

Knee thigh right There's

now science for

The knee thigh right is. That's what I got. Wow. Alright. Anyway, and so I've when just for an example, when I had my first surgery, was in high school and I was trying to get back to being in the marching band. Right? Mhmm. Because that's what I did. I'm a band nerd. Hello. I played bass clarinet

so well. She did it well. Yes. Absolutely. Alright.

She she really did

the time. Still managed to be in the middle band because I could read music and I could I could feel pretty good.

To this day, bass clarinet is my second favorite instrument.

There you go. Which is number one? Trumpet?

Absolutely. Oh,

I still remember. I feel good now. Absolutely. I knew it wasn't saxophone. Absolutely not.

I've just gone wrong.

I've warmed up to saxophone a little bit more than I used to be. Like, I don't hate it.

But I used to play saxophone.

Did you? Saxophone.

That was a they they said that so much. It was so fucking annoying.

Saxophone. Is it from The Simpsons?

It is.

Yeah. It's absolutely insane.

I didn't know where it was from when I was in school. And I just

I was like, why are y'all

saying this all the damn time? Simpsons.

Lisa's played Lisa played the saxophone.

I knew she played the saxophone, but I never watched it.

Anyway, that was Homer

Yeah.

Talking about Lisa playing

the saxophone.

Right. Yes. That makes that from what I know about Homer, makes sense. He was

trying so hard.

He was.

So when I dislocated my knee walking down the stairs, when I tell y'all my knees is they do what they do, I needed to we were going my band was going to Grand Nationals, which was a really big deal. We hadn't been in a long time. It was in Indianapolis. And is it doxing myself if I tell you where I went to school? We went to I went to a very band focused school. Yes.

Okay? But also very black and brown, so like not in the way that I think other people would necessarily

So it was it was military style. Right? But we don't people if you're in band, you're gonna you're gonna under if you're a bandner, you know what I'm about to say. We were a core style marching band. Mhmm. Okay? That we did not do what you see TSU do.

Well, because y'all had Geiger, and Geiger wasn't black.

Right. Geiger wasn't black. But he let us do more stuff than most bands with a white band director. Fair. Fair.

Anyway. They were cold. They were cold.

We were freaking amazing. There's at least four people I know who are professional musicians that were in band with me, and two of them went to Juilliard. And so like Nice. There's at least five or six of them that are now band directors. Like, they Mhmm. They will spot that life. Okay? Like, I went to school with a real amazing bander. Shout out to y'all. If you were in the band with me with Geiger, y'all are the real ones.

Mhmm.

And so it started with going to therapy, wiggle your toes. Right? And so, yes, there were times I could push myself and be more intentional about doing my exercises. Mhmm. Just that people told me when they told me to try something to be trying it regularly. But here's the thing, if you force that, you're going backwards.

Oh, yeah.

She did throw something

to me. I found something to throw. I have ChapStick today. Forced that to me. I'm gonna need this again, I'm sure for you or Chris.

Yeah. If you force that, you're going backwards. Right?

I may have to follow-up. So

Sorry. If you force it, you're going backwards. So healing, while it does take intent

Yes.

And it does take some effort, like you have to do It takes a line action. But the action gotta be aligned. It has to be aligned. Because in the beginning, I can't just jump up and try the new dual jumping jack.

Correct. I

gotta there's there's an order to this. Exactly. Right?

There is an order to it and an order that you may not intuitively perceive it to be so. The

violence in the room.

I'm doing these things today. I am excited.

Right. And

so No. That's that

that part.

Yes. Because It's on the other side of you.

Okay.

We'll get it. But the with with my knee, properly. Right? Because right after surgery, I had a you don't need to know what kind of surgery I had. Just know that my knee wouldn't bend. They put

Patellofemoral surgery.

Okay. They put it in something A knee fast. Nothing.

They put

it high. Come now. Unto me.

They put it in something that would immobilize it. So my leg was straight Yeah. To allow the healing process to take place, which seems like I want I need to walk. Why would you want my knee straight? Well, we we fix some things. So for a time

Mhmm.

It seems counterintuitive that it needs to not move. Hey. This is how we start the healing process. Be still.

Right.

That's literally it. That's it. But the issue is people are so uncomfortable with discomfort that we're trying to move through it quickly. Right? Yes.

What are you doing? What are what are you accomplishing?

You're prolonging and fate avoiding. Mhmm. I'm not the one yo. This ain't fun, love.

Right. That's

flow tree. That's flow tree. I didn't know if you were gonna catch up with me. But no, that's what happens. Right? End up making the the time to heal Prolonging it. Longer because you're not actually healing, you're trying to fix. Right. You're trying to fix. That's what's happening.

Activity is not productivity.

Not always. Come on. That's really it. Right? And so like if that action isn't aligned that's what I'm saying with effort. Align. I'm not saying you don't you do nothing. Right. Right? You take the aligned action and sometimes the aligned action is inaction. Sometimes Yeah.

Sometimes you need to be still.

Sometimes you gotta sit in the middle of the mess and figure out the lay of the land.

You

got to mobilize it. Sometimes you need to pay attention.

Yes. Like, all the time you need to pay attention.

Well, I mean Yes. Like, that needs to be your main Yes.

Presence is your main activity.

And I said that because with my knee, one of the things that I learned was like I had to reconnect my brain to the muscles that move my leg. Yes. Yep. I literally would sit there going, how do I move that muscle? Brain, think about your calf. Think about your calf. Where is your calf? Okay, try to make it twitch. That didn't do anything. Okay. That's not your calf. And so I'm literally I'm concentrating

Mhmm.

But I am intentionally reconnecting to the parts of my body, my physical body in this case, that are not operating the way that I want them to currently.

You are disconnecting disconnecting to the parts of you that are disconnected. Because they were disconnected. They were off That's what healing is. Right? Like, there

so things back online.

Right. And so there are so many things that we are disconnected from and oh, okay. Y'all, so listen. I'm reading a book. I brought it downstairs because I said, listen.

She knew. Knew. Already knew. See the outline.

I've seen the video. Okay? And I'm just gonna bring the the book. Come bring

Come do that mess in this podcast.

That part. I'm a bring it mess up in here. Bring it. And so one of the things so I'm I'm rereading because I finally got a tangible hard copy because the I've I thought I had read it via audiobook until I got the hard copy and I said, I missed so much because my hands were idle and I can't listen in anyway. Yeah. But I'm rereading Gary Zukarov's The Seat of the Soul, which is one of like Oprah's favorite books of all time.

Okay. I got an

Oprah

classic too. Go ahead.

I have several. I I fuck with Oprah. What y'all say about auntie. I get it. We don't agree with everything.

She's a billionaire. Fine.

Yeah. Yeah. Heard. But Oprah has been instrumental in so much of my spiritual deconstruction just because of her own and the way she has done that so publicly. And like the book she has read, the conversation she has had just from my youth up to now.

Mhmm. Wow.

Right? Knowing that things don't happen on whatever timeline you think. Because also time is a construct. Come on, y'all.

Yeah. We know. Mhmm. So We know what we don't know.

Right. But, like, we have these timetables that we've made up and we are like, oh, we're gonna do this by then because this is when we decided arbitrarily and now we're, like, committed to it. And it's like, no. No. No. But life has its own flow, its own healing process, its own all these things. Right? Yeah. And so reverence for life is that. The other another thing that he says, which I don't remember what pages on, I have that one Bookmark.

Oh

lord. And how that is the beginning of a spiritual journey. Yep. Because your emotions are connected to that higher self. Yeah. And so if you cannot be vulnerable enough to experience your emotions without feeling the need to change them To

Yep.

To fix them, then you are going to continue to be disconnected from yourself. And for me, these two things come together really powerfully. Right? If I can be vulnerable with myself and sit with that, then I am now in motion of risk like, having reverence for the process

Yeah.

Of life. Yeah. And what's funny for me personally, I'm in a weird y'all, I don't listen. I'm in a weird space where everything is like the best. Yeah. And I don't know what it doesn't feel temporary. Like, I'm just really having the best life. And not because of the situation circumstances like I I feel like I said this to my friend the other night. I feel like my soul and my personality have come home and the WiFi has synced up. And so with that, it's like, oh, shit.

oh, no, no, no.

This is part of the process. Oh, something's happening.

Right.

I can't wait to see what it is because I don't fucking know and I'm okay with that.

Right.

Which is that y'all let me tell you how that was a process.

Develop me.

Yeah. To get there. And I think that's what what what people try to preach when they talk about have joy or having this Yeah.

Yeah. Joy. That is what they're trying to

tell.

And that is not this is not versus happiness. It was based in situations, but it's really right. Exactly. Sorry. But the joy that they talk about is very much an abiding happiness. Yes. Yes. That there this is a disposition.

Absolutely. It's an orientation towards life.

It's an orientation towards life.

Yeah. Absolutely.

And that's not something that, like I said, comes about as a result of

Events. Mhmm.

Happy stance or osmosis. This comes as, like you said, when we put ourselves in alignment Yeah. With ourselves. And so we approach life with a a unique and particular outlook.

Yeah. That and you move in such a way. And so I think

Mhmm.

Y'all have heard pieces of my journey, right, for the last over the last year or so. It's been longer than that.

But Yeah.

But there are we are not conditioned to function that way. No. Right? Right. We are conditioned very rationally, very right?

Cerebral.

Yes. Extremely. Very five senses oriented, and which this book largely talks about. So if you go read the book, you'll like, oh, she ain't saying nothing new. No, bitch. I didn't because I wrote the same book. But, like, he talks about being a five sensory human versus a multisensory human. And the multisensory human being the part of you that connects with your intuition, with your higher self, connects to the pieces of your larger soul. Yeah. Right.

But, like,

off is not an option.

It's not an option. That's how you came in here.

Yeah. Like, it's not we're we're not gonna leave. Like, very much that way. Right? And so when I stopped doing that shit and let them come on, then it got very uncomfortable because it was like, hey, your life, wrong. Excuse me. But but look at all that I've done. Look at what I've accomplished. Like, I am basically a success on paper. What are you talking about? Like, I'm a boss bitch.

Yeah. I'm a

bad bitch. All of my pronouns minus nauseated. Like, what are y'all saying? And it was like, no, no, That that, like, low thrum that you constantly feel, we've been trying to tell you, but, you know, it was a little bit quiet. You wanna be connected. Now that you connected. Now that we you know, now that we're closer to being synced up.

Really Right.

Basically, we just wanna let you know you ain't got it. And it's that switch. Right? That requires a vulnerability in multiple ways, not just emotionally or mentally. But for me, was environmental.

Because Right.

I walked away from Everything. Steadiest income that I had. Yeah. I walked away from medical insurance during, like, the middle of a health crisis. Yeah. You know? Like, I walked away from a lot. Yeah. And it it got a

little sketchy at one point.

It was good, then it was sketch, and that was fine. But what I also learned is, oh, I can literally be good throughout any of that. Mhmm. Like I can't I had like three weeks where I was like, oh shit, am I gonna slip back into a depression? I haven't been depressed since my twenties. Yeah. And then it was like, something went, nope. And I went, oh, yeah. I forgot. I have tools for this.

Mhmm.

In such an amazing way. But at every turn and y'all know, I've been said it, I've been on a vulnerability journey.

Yeah.

None of this happens without me being vulnerable with myself, with my emotions with myself, with my guides to be like, yeah, I built this life. I worked really hard.

Right.

I worked really hard to build this life and do all the things and for you to tell me I did it wrong.

Yeah. No. There's gonna be some anger, some grief.

Yeah. Grief. Yeah. There's absolutely a grief process with that. And it's it's worth it. Well, there you have it. And I think that's the thing. I I had a I had a conversation. I might have been a little high, but I had a conversation with a friend. I might have been crying at the bar. Don't listen. Don't worry about me. Happy tears because I'd be waxing poetic. Alright. Put anything in me, I'm gonna wax poetic.

Man.

I had no clue. And I was like, and I feel like I'm only scratching the surface. And that's crazy. Yeah. Yeah. But again, it doesn't happen without scary, big, stupid, ugly vulnerability.

It doesn't happen.

It doesn't happen. That's that is the only way out is through.

Yeah. That's it. And that that is it. Like, you have to go through it and and, like, there's a trust that comes with it.

There is so much trust.

Yeah. That, like, if I decide to leave what I think is comfortable, even though it's not super comfortable, but it's a familiar Way. Discomfort. Yeah. Right? Like, I choose to leave my familiar discomfort to go on this journey of unknown, there is a trust that is sometimes shaky Mhmm. At least in my case

Yeah.

That it will be worth something else on the other side. But if you've never seen that side, how fucking do you know?

There's a there's a lack of and I just got to read what is it? Rest is Resistance by Tricia Rest is Resistance by Tricia Hershey.

Mhmm. My Hershey? Hershey. Hershey.

Yeah. Yeah. There's no h in the middle. Hershey. She talked about the fact that there are there just aren't a lot of role models of what, as Chris would call it, arrested life.

Yeah.

Like Yeah. Yeah.

A life that is healed and in pursuant in pursuit of the type of joy you're referring to that is like full alignment and it made me think of I'm pretty sure it's always Paul. He says something about, you know, whether in this or in that. Yes. I have learned that

Yes. I I talked about them in my IG stories a while back around the election.

I've learned to be content.

Yes. Yeah. And I don't

I can't remember the exact Oh, it's like Yeah. But in plenty

Flipping black. In sport.

Yeah. Yeah. And in plenty

of it's the right before that I can

do all things through Christ. That's what it's leading up. Yes.

Right. Right. That is the actual yeah.

The context.

That's the

context is that.

It's not to help you win championships.

Sorry. Championships.

Come on championships.

Championships. Tip two. Them championships. We're gonna win all the ships. No ships.

No ships left behind.

No ships. But but that that is the what you're describing. Mhmm. Right? Mhmm. That is the framework

welcome to the praise break.

Hey, you need one sometime. Take one. Take one.

Listen, for our listeners who do not know, that is an iconic piece of black church culture.

Oh my god. If you don't

try to Google it but

Is it Dottie Peoples? Is that who

it is?

Dottie Whinance.

Is it Vicky? Mhmm.

Oh, it is Vicky.

It's one of them. Mhmm. That's a good song.

Yeah. Marvin's Ex Wife.

Oh. I didn't know about the marriage. Yeah. I knew that. Yeah. Knew that. Okay.

But you said Marvin and my brain immediately translated sap. And I was like Damn. Why not? It's not right. That's what my face was like, what? Oh, no. No. There's two Marvin. What? Focus. There are two Marvin's.

I don't know why I just thought that was another

And they both bishops. Ain't

None of them are Martians. Crazy. I know. Right? Crazy.

Marvin the Martians.

Marvin the Martians.

Both

of them I'm sorry. Both of them people.

I don't even know which one of y'all I'm laughing at. Did you say you didn't know which one of us were here?

I don't know which one of y'all I'm laughing.

The answer is yes. Yes, you are.

But, yeah, it's like the point that Paul was trying to make was not about like, oh, yeah. It it it's really more about having this disposition and this connectedness. Yes. This presence Mhmm. Yeah. That no matter what is happening where I am Mhmm. I can get through this. Right.

Right.

But it's not

Because I'm aligned.

Yes. And that's the part where it's like, I I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. And so when we the way that that phrase was weaponized Mhmm. Absolutely. Right. The ways that that phrase was weaponized

That's that's when it came back to perseverance and it's like

that's was it was a because that Mhmm. Is about effort.

Mhmm. That's about effort.

That's about effort. That's about fixing. Right?

Right.

If I if I feel like I can't make it, that's my fault. I ain't got enough faith. Right? Like Look at Job.

Not believing hard enough.

Fucking Job.

Job, I literally was talking to to my friend Mel about this recently about

Job ain't even believe.

The right. The book of Job is He got time.

Job has been weaponized so deeply. And like, I said this to Mel, I was just like, my biggest issue even as a kid was this nigga lost everything. Mhmm. And they were like, but it's cool because he got new shit. Bitch, he

lost children. He didn't get the same kids back.

Right. They didn't get resurrected. We're not talking about a grief process here. Right. Right. Right. Even if, yes, you get things restored, there is still a grief process that happens. Even and even when I say I'm experiencing like this crazy joy, like that is inclusive of like Mhmm.

Grief processes. And that's what we miss from Paul's declaration is the fact that like, he is joyful. That don't mean he like is enjoying all of it. Yeah. Right? And so it's like, oh, if I feel bad, again, fixing. If I feel bad, I need to control that emotion. I need to be joy. I need to show joy. I need to people don't need to know it hurts. People don't need to know it sucks. No. And that's not. No.

That's

That's not the point.

That's real. Like yesterday, I was in traffic and I was very upset because I was like, I'm in traffic. I'm running late.

Mhmm.

45 sucks ass. I don't like this.

I hate 45.

Oh. 45 is littlest. And my way.

That's why I don't live near it. I do it on purpose.

I really trying to as well at some point in my life. I will never

I wanna get away from

45. Get away from this fucking

Get away.

Way as being any facet of my life. Sorry. Anyway, I'm all 45, upset, frustrated, and I'm like

Yeah.

Why are you frustrated? Anything you can do about it, you know, such such such this is traffic, you

know. Yeah.

And some partner was like, you're upset.

Yeah. Look at that.

You're upset.

Yes. Look at that.

You're big, you know, you got good music. Yes, fine. Yeah. You know, but you're upset.

Mhmm.

It's fine. Run through that. Send traffic. Enjoy it, but you can still be upset.

Yeah. You can be mad that traffic is

Right. Right.

Right. Right. That's annoying. Right?

Right. Yeah. And so I just what happens is I didn't wanna get more upset

Yes.

Rehearsing the thought patterns of why am I just Oh, what does that sound like?

Dear of the emotion

Right.

Not the emotion itself.

Right.

Because emotions run their course. They run their course.

Right. It was like, okay.

But we I'm

upset. That's fine. And by the time I get to work, this will be Yeah. You know, but this is is as it is. Yeah. And I'm allowed to be upset

about And that's it. Right? Like and I think even even sitting with that emotion, it is easily traced back to wanting to control. Yeah. Right? Like, if you just sit with it long enough. Right. Because again, emotions are the indicator lights. They are not the engine. Right. Right? So when your check engine light comes on, the light itself isn't the problem. Right. Your engine has something going on. Mhmm. So emotions are that. But we just

be trying to turn the lights off. Right.

Right. And it's like, no no no. Let's go

Tape over the light.

Right. You're trying to spray it with a Sharpie. Or doing just enough to get the light to go off, which I could give an allegory about this, but I or not allegory, a little story, but I don't wanna talk about Holly in that way. Okay. Understood. Yes. Holly is my car. Oh, okay. But yeah. So like this idea.

Right.

And let me let this emotion finish playing out. But we're not adding fuel to it. Right. Because you've sat with it, you know where it's coming from. You've looked at the engine. Mhmm. Right? You did a little

you did a little inspection. Right.

And so you're like, oh, this is fine. This just needs to run this course out. Yeah. Right. And once it runs out, this light will go off. Oh,

man. Exactly.

Man, I have I have so many stories. That is literally life with a toddler. Yeah.

It's literally It's

literally life.

I lost my absolute shit this week. And so my mom watches it after so I can go to the gym once a week. And typically she just goes over there eats and then we come home, right? And so I'm running through because I've gone to the gym, right? And I'm running through, I'm like, okay, it's 08:00, we can get home by 08:20.

You'll never be hungry again.

Absolutely not. She's like Boo,

what is that for you?

I'm hungry and I lost it. I was like, move. Get, you know, get in the shower.

Also, Christian's version of I lost it is not That was it. Some of y'all's parents

That was it.

Let me be to you.

What you just heard?

That's it.

Move. That was the end of it. Yes.

That's Christian losing it. That was so weird. Again. Yeah. Rage. Quiet. Listen. Quiet mandated reporter here. They're good.

That that was the extent. It was louder, but that was it. Move. Yeah. And so she walks and she's crying and I'm like, fuck. Is she hungry? She can't be hungry. She always eats so much at my mom's house. So much relative. Okay? Yeah. Like, my mom we we discussed this in in a in a bonus that y'all may get some point, but my mama had all the snacks. Okay? Yes.

And so since you will

get excited about the snacks, which

I get. I go over there and be excited. Mhmm.

Okay.

I ain't been in my mama's house in years and I swear every time I go, I'll be excited about snacks.

There's always something.

She got something to munch on.

She has something for vegan, vegetarian, there's probably a snack for you.

Absolutely. I never been over there and been snackless. Never.

Never.

I might be meal less.

I was about to say you may not have a meal to eat. But can get a vegetable in. You could get a vegetable. Get a vegetable

in. Right.

But them snacks? Yeah. That's them snack. Them snacks be it. Right? So she

want y'all to know Christopher has his eyes closed. He's dreaming of these snacks. He's dreaming of his How

you dreaming of a snack?

I'm a big boy. I love my snacks.

What can

I say?

Back it up.

Oh, no.

Back it Hey, big girl.

I know it is.

What was mine? Mine's from a different song. I don't remember what song is.

Absolutely not.

Oh, wait. Back it up and up

again. Sapphire.

Except a truck.

The

truck to get the snacks out.

Backing sapphire into this parking lot. That's what we do.

Okay. Get that

part the snacks.

But anyway, she normally eats a lot at more like, more than enough at my mom's house for me to not need to feed her when we get And so as I'm walking her to the room, she's like, what up hungry? And I

was like, Free chunking.

Go go go use the bathroom. I will go call your grandmother. Uh-huh. Because she kept at it. And I'm like, fine. So and I gave her her she has a nighttime gummy and she's chewing it and going.

Right.

Oh my god. I get my phone.

She's crying in the background. Drama for me.

She's crying in the background and I'm calling my mom and I was like, ma, did she eat? And she was like, she has some macaroni and cheese and apples. And I was like, hey, when was that? And she was like, that was at I think she said it was like five and it didn't it was like 08:30. And I was like, is that all she ate?

And she

didn't eat the whole apple. She ate like four slices of the apple. So she was I was

like, fuck, she's hungry.

Yeah. And so then I was like, why are you mad that your child is hungry? I was like, I'm not mad my child is hungry. And this is going on while I'm giving her a bath and working through this. Processing. I'm processing and I was like, I am upset because I had a plan. Now I can't fulfill my plan. My plan has been messed up. And I was like, are you really that? Because at first I was like, oh, I'm just hungry.

Yes.

And I am frustrated because she is disrupting my plan.

Mhmm.

As they do. I just want I just wanted to execute my plan. I was trying to get in bed for 09:30 because I was tired. Yeah. And like in that moment, I was like

And daddy was at work.

So where's the

father? At work.

At work. He don't get off he didn't get off till later and he wasn't gonna be home for another two hours. Right. Don't don't Just

the two of them duking it out.

Right. Right.

Yeah. Tuesday to Thursday, we gotta figure it out. And the only time it's a problem is Wednesdays because I go to the gym. Anyway, and so I'm like, and this might be moving into our next segment. That's okay. My first thought is, okay. Well, Wednesday night gym is just not gonna work. Right? This because this is this happened the week before something similar. And I was like, this is Wednesday night gym is just not gonna work.

Mhmm. That's what's

I'll have to and I told him that when he got home. I I was like, hey, this is too much. It's too much drama. Like, I feel I I feel compelled to try to control the schedule more rigidly Mhmm. Because there's so much less time available for just me at night. Yeah. Right? And he's like, well, maybe this and he gives me a couple of suggestions. And it occurred to me in that moment, I was like, I never thought about asking anybody to help me fix this. I was just ready to give it up.

Yeah. I was

like, no. No. We're not gonna give it up.

That would require vulnerability to say, hey, I'm struggling to figure this out.

Right. And so instead of me instead instead

of I heard that when she said, I don't wanna do it no more. I was like, no, we're not gonna do that.

Right. This is your you time. What the fuck are you talking about?

Right. It's my it's my it's my one night during the work week

Yeah.

That I'm not, like that I get to go do something besides just mom.

Yeah. Right? Mhmm.

Mom and as I told who did I tell mom and housewench? Oh, god. Mean, you know, laundry and I'm

so sorry.

I mean, and cooking and tidying and bathing the kids and putting them to bed. Mom and housewench, that's kinda how I be feeling. I get to do something else.

I'll be helping that.

I was like, I was also just saying, but he's not there.

It's not that he doesn't do anything. That's not what this is

about. Just trying add context to the new listeners.

That's not the point. Right. The point is not about what Chris does or doesn't do. It's about like the assignment that I have Mhmm. When I'm at home on a weeknight. Yeah. That's what it's about. Regardless of how much he does. And Chris does all the dishes before y'all get any kind of weird ideas.

Yes. There's equity here.

He does all the dishes. He'd be taking out the trash and sweeping the floors. So it's not like he ate tea. Don't you do laundry sometimes? We switch. Oh, damn. We switch.

Damn. That's why okay. Yeah. We switched. You get one task and now you a wench. Wow. That's crazy.

The point was that instead of trying to move through

Mhmm.

And like I took the emotion and was like, I need to get rid of it.

Yeah. Right.

That was my that was my thought. I need to get rid of this emotion and the way to get rid of this emotion is to stop doing the thing that I wanna do. Yeah. That's immediately where my brain went. Right?

Yeah.

And, you know, part of the reason for that and this is just this is this is a parent thing, I think, and it's probably a lot of caregiver thing, but I I can only I am the parent and I didn't feel it when I wasn't the parent. I can say that. I can say that. I feel it now and I did not feel it then.

This is new.

I'm like, I don't want to cause her damage Absolutely. Because my emotions are out of control and I'm lashing out. I don't think that's a

parent thing.

But that's what I'm That's how I feel about people. But I don't be spending enough time with other people's kids for that. No. Not kids.

People. People.

What? That's how I like being Chris.

Any any less of a bitch that you perceive me as now is because of that. Look.

Me and Chris have had this discussion, which is no bueno. However, I put so much more effort into not lashing out at Chris than I do into not lashing out in Sydney.

Yeah. Yeah.

It is it's a socialization thing. For whatever reason, my brain goes, you can yell at the tiny person, not the big one.

And yeah. And I and I will

Well, one is riskier.

And while I don't like being yelled is

riskier. Yeah. Because like Right. Like, if he leaves Yeah. Right? Now you're a single parent, both of you. You're good. Right? And now we're splitting incomes. Now we're splitting household. It's more risky. Sydney, what she gonna I'm not not don't do it. But like But what she gonna do? What's the consequence other than you've damaged her?

Right.

Which I think is huge. Wait. Yes. Massive. But like in terms of risk of like immediate survival

And pro and like yeah.

No. It's it's riskier.

It is riskier.

That's And I don't think that's a conscious thing that we talk about, but, like No. That's why, like Right. And even not only is it financially and, like, environmentally risky, it is also emotionally risky. Yes.

Y'all are

in an intimate partnership. Right? Right. And then if you lash out at him and then he leaves because somehow you are, I'm using air quotes, deficient. Right. Right? Like, or you've done something wrong, now that feeds a narrative. Right? Right. Whatever the narrative is. And so it's it's risky on all fronts.

Right. Yeah. No. I get you have you have made a valid point.

Thanks. I do that sometimes.

And I appreciate you making that point because it makes me feel like less of an asshole to my kid. But I also wanna put a similar amount of energy into treating her best.

Agreed. Both and. Both and. Yeah. So she doesn't, like, end up being an asshole. Preferably. You know? Yeah. So, like, when we She's already an Aries. Listen. We're already fighting against the the opponents.

She got two Aries in there.

I know. And I you know what?

On others on either side of it.

God really is has called you one of his strongest. Truly has. Fortunately, you're not like a painful Aries. You're not you you can get Aries y at times.

Yeah.

But you're not so obstinate that it is like Oh, he's not. Like you're not a toxic Aries.

No. Not obstinate now. Now I Chris is

not obstinate at all.

No. I used to be obstinate.

Well, that was not because you were an Aries.

I mean, you were also younger. I feel like obstinate what did they say? Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child. I think children Yeah. They be pushing boundaries all the damn time.

Right.

So you know, you may have you met Aries adults? Some of them?

Not all of y'all. Some of y'all are lovely people. I'm not saying this. I'm sure if somebody out here is an Aries and it's like, oh, she's going in. I'm not. Y'all are I have some good Aries people that I know they are not really in my circle. However except Chris.

Yeah. My yeah. My toxic trait is is is in a way controlling.

Mhmm. Alright. I got that one too.

I remember one time.

Maybe that's why don't mind.

Me and then she who

You got a strong She

will not be named.

We know.

We were trying I was trying to get out of

Oh, yeah. I remember

the story. Out of the house so

we can go

to church. Mhmm. And she's doing all this stuff and what

Wait.

Who's this?

One of the Alexis.

Got you. Her. I'm back.

And so she's doing this and then she

just She's on the computer going

She's the computer trying to shut it down. And I was just like, you know, just gonna press and hold the power button and it'll shut off.

We can go.

And now we can go. Because I've been telling you.

That nigga wanna fight. Nigga wanna go. Because listen, the way you listen, hold up. Yeah. Now I'm a Libra.

I believe in peace,

but I also believe in justice, which means inherently in my soul or maybe not in my soul. Deep in my personality, I'm a vindictive queen. And what that would have meant

And I was like.

Because also Aries and Libra are opposite signs. They're sister signs. And so what would happen? You would have did that and I promptly would have went back, got undressed

And laid back in the bed.

Absolutely. Been like, have a good time. Yeah. What you just told me is you don't wanna go no fucking weird with me ever.

Not me.

Go to church. You know what? I think you should go pray about this.

Yeah. Well, see, that was it was the thing because I got that point because I was like, you know, you don't care about me or my time because we've got to your church

Mhmm.

Where we supposed to get to. And then now when it's time to transition to my

church Yeah. I had to a

little chip on the shoulder.

I had a little chip on and that that only again, that a part of me only comes out when, again Absolutely.

I'm We feel wrong.

I feel wrong. Yeah. And so

That's true for most of us.

Alright. Let me help you.

Right. That's what we got.

Yeah. Help. Uh-huh.

Not you fixing it.

I'm a

fix But you know what? Hot bar. I just realized my country ass family, like my granny and my big mom used to say, you know what? I got a good mind to fix him. I got a good mind to fix

and it's like, no. Wait a minute.

That's literal. I thought it was just like a country thing. Wait. What? Yeah. It's like

Oh, yeah.

I got a good mind to fix him. Good. Like, if you if you're gonna do something

to to

prove a point. Yeah. Or, like, to get that person together because you have perceived that they have wronged you, you're fix them right up.

Oh. Uh-huh.

And I was just it never occurred to me that, like, oh, no. You're you're you're fixing your feeling. That's what's happening. You feel wrong and you're like, oh, I'm about to write this.

I can

I can I'm about to rebalance this motherfucking scheme?

I can solve this problem.

Yes. Yeah. But it was

This could be solved.

Probably like the one the thing I just remember, I was just like, you know, this is this is not great. Yeah. I I thought I had no

That's a but listen, I can't I can't talk because young Whitney Oh. Hey.

Young Sheldon Young Whitney.

Yay. Young everybody. Young Whitney is Yeah. Listen, very loving. Don't cross her. Don't cross listen, depending on the day, I I do pretty good these days because I see the humanity.

Yeah. Yeah. I and I have to and I've reeled that in learning how to reel it even with Sydney. Yeah. You know, there are certain, you know, certain things I I try to do and things like that and also some and I will call it parental override. Yeah. So now You're not doing what I want you to do. Yeah. It's override.

Okay. So the book.

So go ahead.

Sorry. I'm not gonna grab it. I I was about to grab it. So one of the things he talks about is Gary's in car, the scene of the soul. Of the things he talks about is like when you're a five sensory human being, you perceive power as external versus being a multisensory human being that actually understands that power is completely internal.

Oh, yeah.

Situations. It's like, no no no. Then you've perceived like a power imbalance and now I'm in a power struggle with a fucking four year old or almost four year old. How did you get there? The only way to get there is if you perceive if you're perceiving the power as external.

Yeah.

Like, she is now taking my power away Right. To have the schedule that I want.

Right.

And it's like, no no no. That power is actually internal because you made that up. And so is there another way, as you have explored, is there another way to actually get all these needs met differently?

Yeah. And I mean,

that Crazy because we

And that's the internal power.

Right. And it's crazy because we now cross into that threshold of reconciling harm from caregivers.

Yeah. Right. So when you're talking about that. Like, trying not to make our child feel whatever or induce, you know, dramatics, whatever. I'm trying to think of the right way to say this. Right? So I don't wanna scare my kid. Yeah.

That's not about the street. I fully commit to scaring Sydney about cars

in the road. Like Likewise. But like Yeah.

Knives.

Yeah. I wanna teach her to use the knives. Right.

Yes. To wield that.

But cars in the street

Cars

in in You

little, we can't see you.

That's Right.

And them people be

That has been one of my biggest arguments with Sydney.

Yeah. Same. She's she's better about it fucking street. Is when we cross the street, you hold my hand. Yes.

That's not an option. That was when we had the argument because she snatched her hand.

And she doesn't. She's done it but she's done it.

And I was like

Every time she did it to you, she did it to me.

And I was like, I'm force drunk snatcher. Listen. And so we crossed and I was like, Whitney, you gotta pull it together right now. She is three. You are not about to enter a power struggle with a three year old.

Right. And so like like, Don't

pull it in. That's the street.

Yeah. I mean, we got we got out of the street.

Okay.

But my attitude was not great.

Oh. But we made it.

And so once we got to the side, I collected my attitude.

Gotcha. I understand. I understand.

And was like, hey, man. I got down low, and then I needed help getting up. Thank god my sibling was there. But I got down low, we had a conversation Right.

Mhmm. About why we don't do that.

Why we don't do that and, like, I understand that you're upset with me right now and you totally get to do that.

You can be upset if I hold my hand while we walk

across the street. Correct. You get to be upset. I'm okay with you being mad at me. I don't love you any less.

So I mean, like, that's the part of, like, trying not to cause harm. Right.

Right.

But a lot of us have already had harms done upon us by Especially

at our big ages? I mean,

had harms, you know, imparted upon us by those who were in charge of taking care. Absolutely. And I'm sure there are lot of people who are listening who who are in the exact same situation. Absolutely. So how do we go about, like, reconciling that? I mean, especially if there's I think it's one thing when I can, like, go to Sydney and apologize for a thing. Yes. You

know? Right.

But it's like parents of 40 year olds probably ain't coming and asking for apologies.

Right. Especially when they thought they were right and

still Assuming they're still with us.

I was like, that's not my mama and I'm grateful. Right? Got other things

but Right. They may or may not.

Mhmm.

Even if they do, the harm is still It's done. Done. Right. Now, what do we

Well, how do we do it? Right? What do do? And so it's interesting. I always say that like, oh, yeah, my mom is quick to apologize. My mom's so quick to apologize. What's slower is change behavior. Mhmm. Which is led to my whole thing of like, oh, I trust what you do, not what you say.

Right.

That's I've been that way my whole life, like to the point where I used to hate words of affirmation because I'd be like, shut up.

Right. Don't believe you.

I don't believe a thing you say, do it. I have grown out of that. Thank goodness.

But Yeah. Now my mom's like that. Well, it's like that apology is is wasteful. And that she did it to the extent that she didn't apologize for anything.

That doesn't What do

you mean? She felt like

She felt like it was pointless to Oh.

Yeah. No.

And now she didn't see in maybe one or two times. She may have apologized, but I don't remember them. I'm just gonna give her that ground for that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Her philosophy on apology. Right.

Her general philosophy on apology.

General philosophy on apology was very much

They weren't worth anything.

Oh. It it yeah. They're not worth anything because.

Mhmm. I had a friend say that

to you. Yeah.

A friend who has since come back

to would have loved it especially when times when you were fucking being fucking mean to me for no reason.

Right. Like, why were you doing that? No.

Appreciated that.

That's really I had a friend say that because I'm I'm very quick to apologize. Yeah. Right? And it's not just like, oh, I wanna fix it, which I had somebody say to me once. I'm like, you just wanna fix it. I was like, no. No. I believe in taking accountability. And so for me, the first step is saying like, oh, I might not have intended that,

but I see, like Right.

I see what you're saying. I see the impact of it. I apologize. Like and then can we work from there? Because like, for me, unless you genuinely apologize

What's the point?

What's the conversation?

Yeah. Right.

No. It's

Then we just go back and forth. Ain't no time

for Exactly. I got like that at one point in my relationship with God and we would just I would be like, you know, doing the same thing over and over again or wrestling with my humanity

Yes. Yes.

In certain ways.

Yes.

And feeling like I needed to repent or ask God forgiveness. Yeah. And at some point, was like, you know what, God? I'm I don't think I'm done with this.

Right.

And I'm just I'm not

I'm gonna stop apologizing now.

Stop apologizing. Yeah. I mean, because like this whole grieving and I'm tired of it. Right. You're not tired?

Right. Do you wanna hear this again? You

don't yeah.

Yeah. You need my reheated hand prayer.

When I'm ready to let this go right. When I'm ready to let this go

We'll talk.

On the path.

Yeah. I'll come back. But right now

You know.

Yeah. Not sorry.

I'm not gonna do repeat prayers because I'm not a compulsive person. I don't need I don't need to do compulsory behavior to to function.

Yeah. Right.

So I was like, you know, this this is old.

Right. And I We're

like, how many years we've been at this? This is old

now. And I think that's it. And so, like, for me, while I value apologies Mhmm. I deeply value apologies. It it's one of those things, like, if there is no change behavior

Mhmm.

Yeah, you got two times. And that's that's old Whitney. You might got one. Okay? Because I I'm, you know, grace. Yeah. I've I've been known for being too gracious. I I went from being not gracious at all to a little too gracious sometimes. And I'm like, no, if we if

we clear, you get one. Right.

You get one and then the conversation depending on the value of the relationship, it's going to shift. Yeah.

Mhmm.

Right? Absolutely. It is either gonna go deeper and we're gonna have to get into what the fuck is really going on.

Right.

And then behavior still gotta change. At some point, it's if the behavior don't change, the relationship will because boundaries. Oh. That's one thing my mom was mom was like, you're so good with boundaries and she knows this because she's been on the receiving end of so many of them.

So that sounds like a big part of It is. Is. Setting some boundaries.

So this is and I will walk you through my journey with this because, yeah, I got two parents. I know we all do.

That's kinda how genetics work.

You know, I have two biological parents and one of them is worse than the other. And my mama is by far the least problematic of my two parents.

But

I say by far and she least problematic. And so a lot of so basically, have situations where and my my dad has passed. And so I have situations where there are things with a person like you could never talk to about because they would scapegoat God and be like, well, that's under the blood of Jesus. I don't have to apologize for these big traumatic things you should probably be in jail for. Like, things because that's under the blood of Jesus. Don't have to talk about that.

Who does that sound like?

Jesus Christ.

My daddy? I Oh, okay. Thank

you. So I was just like, him. Boy,

no. But

That's my because that's my closest point of reference. Right? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. No. I got you.

So this parent that refuses to apologize. Yeah. And then I have a parent who over apologizes but doesn't have enough fortitude to, like, change behavior.

Yeah.

And so the parent that never apologized was, I will say, the easiest and it's still the easiest to contend with mentally and emotionally. Because it's like, you are who you are. Yeah. And now that you're dead, there is no change. Right? And so, like or there's we're not changing the relationship on this side, like Yeah. On the earthly plane

this Right.

Right. And so I get to choose my relationship to you in death. Right. Because you can't rebut me. And that's my favorite part. That is my favorite part of my dad being dead. Dead dad club, d d c holding it on, holding it down. Is that like, you what you gonna do, argue?

No. Not anymore.

You gonna You wanna argue?

I can't I'm not arguing with you. You dead. You big dead. I'm not

arguing with you.

I'm happy. Wow. Leave me alone. But I will say because I'm woo woo, my dad is

for a medium that's rich. It

is literally. So we we have actually had to do a lot of work. Right?

But I

ain't gotta hear your voice and you can't bear at me And so which that was a real happy dance because like also my granny already says she's stronger than you. So There

you go.

There we go. Like my granny.

But like the boundaries when he was alive that I set with him were a lot easier because it's like, y'all remember that episode of Fresh Prince with Tyre Banks and Fresh Prince arguing? Mhmm. You ain't never gonna change. Oh, no. I'm wait. Oh, yes. I am. Oh, no. You're not. Right? That is that. And so it's like, instead of doing that stupid ass argument with you.

Mhmm.

Like, I'm just not. And so like before my dad got sick, I had gone no contact. Right. Mhmm. That was hard for my mom because they were still married and she's they still live together at some point. And then they didn't and then they did again and that was not my business because I didn't live there and no longer did my sibling. And so I was like, y'all can duke it out. I'm a be over here at my house where the bills are paid in not y'all's name. And you know who won't be here?

Him. Mhmm.

Not invited. Not invited. And literally, this was my concession. I was like, well, mama because my mama would come and spend holidays because my sibling would come home and spend holidays from college. Big gap. Yeah. Yeah. And so I remember the first year. Think this was the year after I got married. The year I got married.

time Mhmm.

About it. He was like, that actually makes me feel a lot safer because I don't I I was really trying to figure out how I was gonna handle the volatility

Yeah.

Of like y'all situation. Yeah. And I was like, you won't because I'm not I'm not doing you're not I'm not about to nigga. I ain't coming back. Right. And so I remember telling my mom, I was like, he's not welcomed here. My concession, you can take him a plate.

There you go.

But he is not welcomed here. He can't come in my space. He cannot come to my house. So at some point on Thanksgiving, my dad drove trucks. And so at some point on Thanksgiving, my mom literally is on the phone with this man, which I was like, that feel like he in my house. I can't control even though I pay the phone bill

Mhmm.

I can't control this because it's her phone. Right?

Right.

Now I could shut it off temporarily, but I'm not I'm petty or anything. Girl Right. I consider these things, but I don't do them. You know? Right. The petty is in me.

So you gotta let these thoughts pass.

You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. So Bob was just like, okay. And then she was like, yeah. Yeah. She put them on speakerphone. Me, well, I'm a go upstairs. I actually got some shedding to do up there anyway. Yeah. Yeah. Before other people come. And so then she was like she literally was just like, oh, yeah. I came back. She was like, yeah. Let me get the address from Whitney. I'm a send it to you.

Oh, no.

Absolutely not.

And I looked at her and I said, you will not be doing that. And she was like, what? And I was like, I have already made this clear with you.

He is not invited.

He is not welcomed in his home. Mhmm. And so if you wanna go, you can go.

But he can't come here.

Period. Mhmm. And then she got her feelings, that's not my business. Because this has been from this is like this is a year in progress already. Right.

Right.

This ain't new. Exactly. So why did you think because I got married, it was gonna shit was gonna change. Yeah. He was at the wedding. Cool.

Right.

He

was. You're not he both my parents walked me down the aisle. Did.

It was a

really nice picture. You know? At that point, I don't think we were no contact. We were less contact. But then he I don't know. He started being nicer when he was like, oh, you're gonna be another man's problem? Yeah. Yeah. It was my dad was a piece of work.

He said he said that to you?

No. But that was that was the energy. That was absolutely like my dad did not even call to check on me until I got married.

Oh, wow.

Like, I heard from this nigga on my birthday, which is five days after his. It's the only reason why he remembered. And so yeah. And so, like, that was easy to put down these boundaries. Right? Because it was just like, there's not anything I remember telling my mom this. Was like, I have tried everything in my power. Even after I got married, there was a period where we're like, okay. Well, we can talk. We don't have to be around each other, we're gonna we could try this reconciliation thing.

He never worked misuse. Yeah. Every opportunity to right your wrong.

That part literally calls That's my dad. And so that's did they write it about him? Anyway. Right. And so like that that was simple. Right? And I think because we we both had static.

It was it was a lot more clear and clean-cut Yeah. You to figure out how to dice it

up. Exactly. And he didn't really force the issue because at the end of the day, he felt how he felt. Right? Right. My mom Right. Is different because it's a complicated situation. Yeah. Right? It's it feels like it's less complicated the older I get. But in my early twenties you should even in my early thirties. It was really complicated because it was like, you are harmful and loving.

What do

I do with And I think that's the case for a lot of parents.

Think that's probably more the most common. Yeah. Yeah. It's that combination. It's not ambivalence.

Oh, okay.

My mom's is not ambivalent.

Oh, no. It is. I'm very concerned.

No. I'm talking about or I guess talking about having mixed feelings.

It's mixed feelings, but that's different than ambivalence.

Yeah. Mixed mixed emotions. Yes.

That's what

you meant.

Conflicting Right. Emotions. Right?

Emotions.

And so there are moments where I've had to put boundaries on particular I haven't talked about this. Topics. Particular topics Yeah. With my mom Or particular, like, okay. This is how much time we can spend together before this shit goes left. Right? Or before you start projecting.

Wow.

Or before I'm gonna get irate.

So this is a here's oh, I was gonna ask a question.

Go ahead.

So how did you figure out like what the topic was or what the time is? You know what I'm saying? Like how I'm I'm I'm I'm sure it's just like a process of a this keeps happening type thing or Yeah. Yeah.

It's it's it's when you walk away, your chest is tight. Mhmm.

Yeah. I know what you're talking about.

You know, like anything you you feel it. This is this is not a complicated thing. Yeah. When some shit sucks

Yeah.

You feel it in your body wherever you may feel it. And so if I every time like I we talk about a particular thing Yeah. You committed to not understanding Yeah. And I'm I feel like I'm like either about to lose it or yell or whatever Right. Or we get into a screaming match.

Oh, for me. Or we

get to crying, which my mom will be weaponized in tears.

The the heat rises up on the back of my neck.

You know, and for me, I can feel my shoulders crawl up. So my chest gets tight, my shoulders get

closer to my earlobes. Which they've got a distance to go.

You know, wow. Are you calling me a giraffe?

I am not. You have a great neck.

You have a graceful neck.

You can wear amazing earrings. I can't. I don't. I I can't. They'd be touching my shoulders and I hate it.

Oh, that's fair.

I hate the feeling of earrings touching my shoulders. Like, it's like they're dragging.

I kinda like it. It tickles a little. Oh. Yeah. Back when I used to wear big danglies, but I stopped wearing them because they got caught in my hair.

So I

feel Well, you ain't got to worry about that

no more. Yeah. But I don't got them

no more.

Oh, fair.

Yeah. I rid of them because they used

I got some big danglies. I don't well,

because they they touch my shoulders. I have a couple of danglies that are not that, like, long enough to touch me anyway. But yeah. And so, like, when you feel the tension or the discomfort in your own person Yeah. Yeah. Then it's like, oh, there is something here.

Right.

Sometimes that happens even and I think for me, when it really got loud was when I decided I was there were parts of myself the first round of therapy in my twenties. Right? When I was like, oh, there are some narratives that are not serving me. Mhmm. And when I look back over my

life And I

think over. This belong to my parents' doorstep.

This is

they shit.

Yeah. Right? And so it's like, no. No. No. I need a boundary around these things because you the problem. Yeah. Right? Like and while I'm sorting this out, I can't have you I cannot

I I can't have you in

my mouth. Detox myself while you're feeding me poison. Yeah. Not real. God.

Say that again.

I forget God on today.

You don't. I'll say it.

Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm not

You can't detox while somebody's feeding you poison. Yeah.

Jesus. You can't. That is exactly why

That's how you heal right

no contact with my mom Yeah. At the end of it all, until she died Mhmm. Because of the fact I was like, you know what? I'm in a very vulnerable space in my life between my twenties and 20 and thirties. And I was like, I'm still trying to figure out me right now and get myself on our and and I can't do that while you doing stuff that pulls me back into

Exactly.

A sense of self that is distorted and disjoint because Uh-huh. I'm still trying to figure out me. Yep. And I'm still trying to live by, you know, principles at the time that were being handed to me in a way that are you know, give me life Yeah. And build up my sense of self.

Right.

This is and so, yeah, it was hard. Yeah. But for me, especially at that time, what I needed to do for certain family members at the time made it clear to me that this is what needed to happen.

Mhmm. Because I

can't do that without it. You've you've positioned yourself between me and other family members in a way that made me automatically choose these people.

Mhmm. Yes.

And in doing so, I'm also choosing me.

Right.

Because I also need to be away from you to kinda get my own head right.

Correct. It's

like playing blocks with toddlers. Right? Like you trying to build a tower They just keep knocking it. And they just, you know

Knocking it over and it's just like

It's like I can't build this while you in the room. Wow. I got to close the door so I can build this tower.

Right.

Because it's gotta get built.

And if I put in my supports before you come back in, you could try to knock it over and it won't. It won't.

Right. Exactly.

So and that's that's the next part. Right?

And that's what because I was gonna talk about forgiveness and what that looks like embodied.

Oh. Forgiveness for whom?

Forgiveness for the people that have wronged you. And and and I'll get into it. But the way that we, you know, like you said, talk about forgiveness even now because it's very a literal interpretation Yeah. The Bible is. Yeah. But we have to remind ourselves even when we approach the Bible that the map is not the territory.

Come on. The map is not the territory.

I love that. There's so many things that we have written down in the past that we try to adhere richly to. That's the voice from context, the voice from the time which they're written.

Mhmm. Voice from change?

The voice from change.

Yeah. Talking about maps.

We don't understand that the landscape has changed. And even though, yes, the map is here and then we see the borders and stuff like that

All that shit can do.

You don't Right. You don't catch the hills. You don't catch the valleys. You don't catch the peaks.

Any destruction that's come since that was last captured?

Right. The hurricane There's

three ways that came through now. Slides. Right. You don't catch all of that unless because you have to walk the territory. And so while that may say forgive, you gotta walk that

out. Absolutely.

And forgiveness doesn't look like how it's described in the Bible or or on paper because

because it's a process.

It's a process. It's real life happening.

Mhmm.

And what you talked about even now about how you're able to still have a an existing relationship with your mom Mhmm. Even with, you know, you love me and you also harmed me. Yeah. How do I reconcile the two? How how can I honor both? Yeah. How can I honor both the good in you and the potential and and the potential in me that I'm still yet finding out? Yeah. And and yeah. And like you said and so you have to in you have to, like you said, bring up those boundaries.

Mhmm.

Those things in yourself that makes a relationship with with people that are still figuring out their own shit Yeah. Navigable.

Yeah. Mhmm. Yeah. So when you're talking about like walking out forgiveness

Right.

I think with when you said it's not like what the Bible describes.

It's typically Right. Right. It's not about it. It's it's

Which which would be what?

You know, releasing like how we

Throw it into the sea of forgetfulness.

Throw it into the sea of forgetfulness.

Forgetting. Okay.

Forgive and forget. And, you know, we should be all good even though you've you've harmed it. I should always have this cheery disposition every time you slander my name or or something in my face. I should always

And so I keep

this facade that that that that you're not bothering me in a way Yeah.

I am intrigued

by really offended me that I don't get to hold grudges.

Though I'm intrigued by the way that you're talking about it

Yeah.

For two reasons. One, I never thought that the bible was telling me I had the smile in your face. Me. This is didn't her. I I would agree with would agree with her. However, I was socialized to do that. Yes. Right? And so I think that's what you're describing.

Yes. I mean yeah. And and I and I imply that because when Peter talks about, you know, with Jesus talking about, you know, how many times if my brother unfit me, how many times should I give forgive him? Seven times? And, you know, Jesus is like, no, Peter. Seven times seven. Times Yeah. 70 times seven. And for for them, that just means, you know, completeness. It's not a 490 times.

Yeah. Right. And what and what

You just be like, oh, okay. I'll just.

Yeah. And it's not preached with like the doctrine of accountability. No. Because I feel like accountability is in the bible. It's preached separately from forgiveness but the two things go together. Also, there are natural natural consequences for actions. Right?

Right.

And so with forgiveness, which I I have a weird relationship with forgiveness that I'm still walking out.

Yeah.

Yeah. Because I think part of is for my personal orientation of like, I have a religion of love. Like that is it, which requires me to like see your person.

Yeah.

Right? And so like even as I say, like I've have worked through and mostly have worked through a lot of the things with my daddy post him being gone, it's that it's really humanizing him. Even though he didn't act like a human all the time, it's humanizing him and saying, this is how you got there. What it is not doing is excusing his behavior. Right?

Right. Yeah.

And I don't have regrets about like my dad died. My dad was sick and I he never he didn't even try. He didn't speak to any of us it. He literally went back to his birth family

And stayed over there.

Which was in the same city, if we can be clear.

But stayed over there.

And stayed over there and then just like got sick and died. And like my auntie let us know. Yeah. So we knew something was happening, but he got mad at her for that. Right?

Yeah.

And so it was one of those things where like, oh, this is not again, we're not gonna be able to handle that here.

Right.

You know mean? So, yeah, like, I won't be able to do this in concert with you.

Yeah.

Not in your like, not in your personage.

Yeah.

Right?

It is so I don't have any regrets. I don't like, people say that, oh my god. You're going no contact with your parent. What happens if something happens? Then they die, bitch, or I die. Like, what do you mean? Then that's the end that we can work through through it a different Yeah.

There's a there's this there's a there's an assumption Yes. That the loss of contact is greater than the potential for harm.

Right. And for me, that was not the case.

Yeah. Right.

Like, it I and then we there's a consensus in my family that when my daddy passed, we all felt relieved.

Yeah. No. We had this discussion. I remember that.

Yeah. That was an exhale.

Yeah. Like, I I ain't cried about it to this day. Yeah. Like, it literally was like, remember because I was he died before we went to Cuba. Yeah. And I was like, I'll grieve in Cuba. I'll figure it out in Cuba. And I got to Cuba and was like, there's nothing to do. I'm having a great time. It's hot as fuck. It wasn't hot. Like, that's you know, because they're like, a, I had grieved that man before he died. I grieved that man said the same

thing about my grandma. Exactly. I did cry a lot Yeah. No. No. No. Completely completely different. Yeah. But I said the same thing about my grandma. My grandma had a protracted disease. Yes. She she died of old age, I guess technically, but she had dementia.

It was a long road.

Yeah. And so she was in nursing home for A decade? Six years.

Was it not a decade? I thought she did she have dementia for a decade?

That girl, the beginning of that story is weird. She was in the nursing home for about seven years, I think. Yeah. It wasn't quite a decade. It was pushing it though. But for us, it was like, oh, she's gone. But it's like, granny kinda been gone.

Right? Like she's now physically gone. Yeah. She's But she hasn't been herself.

Right. Right. The life.

For a

long time. Yeah. So I I I understood from that perspective when you said, whew. You know? It's like, okay.

Yeah. Right. Now we can actually move forward. Right? Because like we're in this limbo. Yeah. And for me, the limbo was on my my it honestly was on my mother's making. But Yeah. It was it was just this constant limbo. And it's like now, finally, now we can actually start to close shit out.

not about to cry.

I'm okay. Sorry. She was handing me tissue. No. Know. I gotta close. But, like, there are so many things that have happened in my life that he and I were the only witnesses to that remembered.

Yeah.

He would never admit it. My mama couldn't remember. And by the time, like, my sibling was born, they were asleep half the time. Praise God.

Yeah. Missed out on that.

Right. So there's a couple where, like, people saw the immediate f like, have seen the immediate aftermath. Right? So you know I'm not lying. Oh, I know you're not lying. Same with my ex husband.

Yeah.

Yeah. People have seen the immediate aftermath, but nobody was in that moment. Nobody. Like, would admit to the fact

that the moment happened. I heard some of it. You called me once and I heard some of it. Right. Closest I got. Yeah.

And There are police reports. Terrifying.

Yeah.

Absolutely terrifying.

There are CPS reports because my granny filed one. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? It's like there are things

But you want you wanted somebody to remember.

I needed I like, I felt like if I let it go Yeah. Then that was it.

Right. And that's and that's the thing too. I was watching this movie exhibiting forgiveness and at the very beautiful movie.

It sounds beautiful. The title is

At the so it was about an artist and working through his own pain with his own father. Yeah. We actually came back into his life later on. And then think the mom died. She brought him back into his life because she was on her way out.

Got it.

And she wanted him them to

Try to reconcile.

Reconcile in some way. You know, and there's a lesson in that that you can't really force that.

And of course not.

And and there was a there was a very explosive scenes. Mhmm. The proving the point is like, look, you cannot because number one, what whatever you're trying to bring out is gonna come back at you. Yeah. Yeah. And I have to tell you truth in that moment, that scene actually accelerated her own death. But at the end, he said one very, like, remember line. He's like, look, I forgive you for what you've done to me.

Mhmm.

We're good. But I can't forget what you did to my mom.

Yeah.

And and so he was like, look, it doesn't mean like, whatever you needed from that is what you got, but the future belongs to my wife and my kid. We don't have a future right now. We don't have

That's real.

And that's what you want. I'm sorry. I can't get that to you because I can't forget what you did to my mom. Yeah. And they handed me like a a piece of his, you know, piece of our art from the museum. They they they said, hey, you know, put this in your prayer closet. Because you because he father's like, look, I'll never stop praying for you. And, you know, he's like the father turned his life around Yeah. Yeah. Trying to. But again, the damage was done.

The yeah.

And then even there was points throughout the movie that showed that he hadn't even fully processed

Yes.

The trauma that he inflicted on his

son. Mhmm.

Further proving that he's untrustworthy of a future.

Well, and that's it. That's the consequence.

Right.

Yeah. That's the consequence of the actual The natural con consequence of the future.

And so I think that that was also my thing is that I felt like their consequences weren't paid. Yeah. But then I'm like, but were they? Because consequences are not always what you think they are. No. And so Right. And, you know, I I strongly believe in karma and sometimes you gotta come back and do this shit again.

Right. And

God speak to you.

Yeah. And I had a you said another thought because that brought up some ideas around this current climate of trying to even redeem someone like Hitler. Yes. Revisionist history and all this stuff.

We don't have to do.

And it's like, we don't have to do that. Number one Yeah. I don't look. You know, people say, is Hitler in here? If you don't believe in the universe, Hitler. It's like, look. I don't care what Hitler has done.

Or it's That's between him and

That's between him and God Yeah. In the other realm. I don't need the concept of hell for God to be

just. Correct.

But Correct. Whatever he's decided on what no. That's what that's what he did. I don't need to redeem him for what he's done in this life.

Correct. I'm not

going In history, we need to always remember him as a maniac and a

Cautionary tale.

As cautionary tale. We don't need to redeem his memory. Yeah. Whatever he whoever he is with God now, that's who he is with God now. Yeah. And I'm okay with that.

But he calls

He's not here. You wreaked havoc

here and we don't need to forget it.

And we don't need to forget it. And we're forgetting it because we're not reinflicting the same kind of shit on other marginalized peoples.

Or the same ones.

Or the same ones. A

little bit of both. Little bit of both. Yeah.

But, yeah, like you said, so that forgiveness does not mean it is releasing the power of harm over

Yes.

That person's life and allowing space for healing. It is more for you.

It is literally the same you.

Solve the person

That's literally No.

It's to it's for you to have peace so that you're not held captive

Yes. By their actions.

Power of their actions.

And I think if we view Jesus's words in that light Mhmm.

You

keep yourself free. Yes. Right. It doesn't matter how much they keep yourself free.

Free.

No. But They can't put you in bondage unless you let them.

Here's the thing. That is a thing, like, I feel like I had heard at some point but could not operationalize until I had to operationalize. Right. Couldn't operationalize it because I think in order to fully understand forgiveness, there's a process you must go through with yourself. Mhmm. Right? So it's not just like, yeah, forgive other people. I don't blame myself for anything neither one of my parents did because that wasn't my business.

Mhmm. That

that was they shit. Right? Indeed. But there are the ways in which I carried that as part of my narratives or part of my beliefs or self-concept. Right? That may have caused me more damage.

Yeah. They

did. Right? Right. Right. Fortunately, not like life altering damage. Well, yes. But not in in a way that was so destructive that I haven't been able to function sometimes because trauma can have that effect on people.

Yeah. Yeah.

Of course. And I feel very privileged to have had enough protective factors.

Yeah.

For that not to be my story. Yeah. Praise God. Oh, praise God. I'm not about to go and shout, but I feel it in my spirit. I've been shouting all week. I just want y'all to know shouting and singing all week. But they're the the ways in which not only that I have held myself captive, but shit then turned around and inflicted pain on others in lesser ways, obviously. But like, it's just like, oh, no. You did that because this is how you process that and now I gotta forgive me.

Mhmm.

I have to forgive me for even the little shit that I've done. Like the little shit like that time I went off on my recent eighth grade even though he earned it.

Like Yeah. I slept a dude with with my lunch kid one time.

You know what I'm saying?

He was like was being loved.

That felt very like deserved.

Yeah. Because Christian not violent

at all. Oh, he ain't she ain't for that life.

Like looking back on it, it was not that dramatic.

He was getting on my last nerve.

Yeah. That's how it works. He was getting on my last nerve and I smacked him and then later on I found out his mama was dying from cancer and I felt

so good. And I think that is it.

Right? So fast. So this

is what I this is what I mean when

I You can't act it out from somewhere. Right?

Everyone is.

Mhmm.

Yeah. And so I think that when I talk about considering another person's humanity, it is that. It is that I don't actually know what's happening in the other part of your story. We could live in the same house, and I don't know what the fuck is happening in the other part of your story. What I do know is is that maybe your behavior is harmful and we can talk about that. Yes. Right? We can draw boundaries around that. Right. I don't have to make a judgment about you.

Yeah.

Like, that has been the journey of, like, our posthumous journey

Yes.

Of like, yeah, I can see the trauma that because my dad had a trauma traumatic childhood.

Yeah.

And so it's like, I can see that the like, and I often when I think of him, I think of him as that little boy.

Yeah. Yeah.

And that is one of those things I remember reading All About Love by Bill Hooks. Yeah. And he was the first person that came to mind and it broke my heart for who he was. And I was like, this he never knew love. Yeah. Man. He didn't know it. Mhmm. So how was he he all he had was facsimiles of love.

Right.

And they got distorted. Yeah. And it's just like, I'm tearing up, but I'm good.

But that's

But but

That's where forgiveness comes. It comes in the in in the soil of patience and understanding.

Compassion. Exactly. Compassion. And so it's like, I can and that is when I learned. Forgiveness for me looks like holding compassion for his humanity Mhmm. While also holding allowing him to be held accountable by whatever standards, gods, whomever, who are in charge. I don't it is I remember saying this to my sibling. I was like, I because I had an epiphany. This is my life. I wake up, I have epiphanies.

That's not your job.

Like, but I feared even as a kid because my mama didn't my mama like half ass held him accountable. Mhmm. Yeah. Right? Like, she wanted to do more. She's really upset about it now. But like, what what she was equipped with then there were so many other dynamics happening. Right? And so, like, I felt like at the time, if I didn't do it Nobody would. Nobody would. Right. Well, that wasn't true then. Right? Because there is I strongly believe in a higher power. God has got it.

Mhmm.

I don't have

to get it. And Right. And in a way you really can't.

You can. That's not your job. It's literally

You know? So the day

I let that me to like hold him accountable go was the day I actually started to forgive.

Yep. There you go.

Because I couldn't do that without that process. When we're talking about

trying to go to to heal, right, this is a huge part of it for a lot of people Yeah. Is dealing with past hurts, particularly from caregivers, but it can include all sorts of people. It can. Often does. And the process is gonna sound like a lot of what they already talked about. Right? But what you just said oops. Sorry about that, Gail. What you just said really makes me think of what you just said was like you had to forgive yourself for a lot of different things.

Yeah.

Right? And you have to start valuing your own humanity. Absolutely. Mhmm. And forgiving your own mistakes. Absolutely.

Right.

And we've talked about this before. You you like to talk about instead of being mad at younger Whitney or like, oh, I need to kill off this old person.

We don't do that.

We integrate. Yes. Right? We A %. We intentionally like look at that younger self and go, you are safe. Mhmm. You did the best you could with the tools that you had and these are the ones we're gonna use moving forward like that kind of energy and I think that's really important and that's a lot of I did not my childhood

Come on, child.

Childhood. Right. They were a childhood. My my child

My god. Today.

My child is just Change the word. Is not the kind of dramatic or traumatic that that Whitney or Chris have experienced. And so a lot of my focus tends to be on like dealing with the the narratives that play in my head with the way that I interact with my kid. So when I say I lost my shit and Whitney is like giving context

Yeah.

Most people wouldn't say me going move is me losing my shit.

Correct.

Right? That but for me, the elevation in my voice Yeah. The the the energy that I had behind it indicates a loss A dysregulation.

Right.

It's a disreg on my part that I was acting out on my kid. Right. And so it's a reminder and I do this with my therapist a lot. I'm getting she's reminding me, you are growing too. Yes.

Right.

And so when you do things that you don't like, that you think you wish were different, you also deserve grace. Yes. And you deserve to process all of these things because you are not a terrible person for this thing. You are not a bad mom for this thing which, whoo, that's a loud track.

Yeah. Is.

That's a

loud track. Not like bad mom, but you're not a you're not as good of a mom as you could be. Right? Yes. Like, but I mean, the I didn't say it was right. Yeah. I'm with you.

I just wanted to confirm that I disagree with that track.

Yeah. We we are affirming.

We've seen you parents.

We're amplifying the We disagree.

But again I'm learning. The things,

you

know, the the things that I saw my mom do, not saying she did absolutely everything, of course she did because humans. But that, you know, there are things that I think make a mom that my mom did or that some of my friends do that it's like, that's what moms that's what good moms do. And it's like, if I don't if I'm not doing those specific things Yeah. I need to fix it. I'm not good enough yet instead of being like, well, is there something you wanna incorporate?

we Not just ourselves, but how do we integrate new practices?

How do

we Right.

Right. How how do we wanna move intentionally? What things do we move move away from and what things do we need to move towards and not it's the energy behind it that tends to be a problem for me. It's like an obsessive fix it energy Yeah. Instead of an intentional and aligned energy. Yeah. But that intentional fix it energy hit she I mean, that sounds

she's you 12 sometimes. You know, that's how we were taught. What's funny is now that you're talking, and this is totally a sidebar, when your version of losing your shit is exactly your mom's version of losing her shit. She rarely did. She didn't. Mhmm. Like, your mom is Laura,

stop looking at your face.

That's it. He wasn't even there. He knows it. Knows it. Christian and I were there and we

were terrified because

hey, wasn't talking to us.

Spunned into silence.

She wasn't even talking

to us. She was not talking to either of Right? She wouldn't even look at us.

She wasn't even in the same room with either of us. But there was a

hole in the wall so we

could see it.

It. We could see it. And like it had it had been what it honestly at that point might have been warranted. I understand. Let me say, I understand how she got where she was.

I did. I did hear

you too. Right? You Oh,

I mean,

she he's her third recounting. Oh, yes. In the recounting. Now he has a toddler so I

get it. Damn.

And your

toddler I empathize.

Your toddler is not nearly as wild as that particular young child was. No. He was older.

So Yeah.

He was older.

He was probably about eight. Yeah. I

think so.

He was older. Oh, Wait. How much older than him are you? Seven years.

Yes. He probably was.

Yeah. We were teenagers. Yeah. We were he may have been older than him.

I think he might have been nine

or 10. Was that I was gonna say, was that when you were living with

us? Yes.

He would have been 10. Yeah. Yeah. He would have been 10.

Yeah. He's a world.

Yeah. So too old for that shit.

Yeah. Too old

too old for the shit that he was doing and not have been in the shower for an hour. So long and tried every which away. Every which away and every sweet tone. She had done all the things. All the things. All the things. Like everything a granny could do.

Because this is granny now.

This is granny.

Right.

She had done them.

If you got granny yelling at you, you ought to know

Baby, you done done something wrong. He had. He had. He was wrong. He's damn right.

Phyllis Elaine came out.

Okay. And listen.

That was Ruby.

It Her Ruby was it was wild because your mom never yelled. She doesn't yell.

My mama I cannot recall it to this day. Oh, it My mother has never yelled at me. That's never

Once she yelled at me, that was funny.

That was funny.

It was over eggs.

It it was just Are you doing something crazy? No. It wasn't even yelled.

Had a different time.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

I think they're done now. Like it

was They don't sound it was loud.

Yeah. It it wasn't like, yeah, it was just like racing. She

will she will get louder if she needs more importance, but it's not in the tone of a yell.

Right. Yeah. And like, I

You know, like, I need to get your attention.

I tend to cook eggs a little longer than she.

Come on, hard screen. She deemed that she deemed appropriate.

Right.

Hilarious. Sweet hackle about that to this.

And I was like, she's technically right.

She was. They were perfectly because he took them off immediately.

Yeah. I was like, hold on.

Me try. Because they keep cooking once you take them off.

I know. Yeah. But he was talking we were talking. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was like

She was focused. She was like, I need you to focus.

I think we're done.

Your meds.

Yes. So it's just it's funny to me how like for for me, that is so minor.

Completely

Most minor thing that can happen in a house is somebody going move

me. Right.

Oh shit. I should move. Like, let me get I like to move on. Like, let me get a move on. But like yeah. It just it it really reflects. It it it's reflective of the environment in which you were brought up and that just tickled me so because it really is, why am I still looking at your face? Right. We literally I think Christian ducked, I ran into the pantry.

I did. Yes.

We both hid. And I We did not You

because I went and she was gone

in the pantry. More closed. The pantry wasn't even that even for walking. It is

I was gonna suck

it up. I closed that door and then I let my tummy out.

Because

I said, oh. Again Mister Phyllis never yells.

It's just But

you see what I'm wild.

So it it it's less about the action and more about the deviation from your normal. Correct.

Right.

Right. And so like for me, if I'm normally talking to Sydney like this

Yes.

Or we're playing and then I

go to move Right. That's it's yeah. It's terrifying.

It was terrifying and it's like, what did I do to deserve this?

Correct.

Lot of processing going on.

Right. But that's also why I get the caveat because some people listening may have a childhood that looks closer to half of mine. Yeah. Because my mama's not

too bad. Mine. I got slapped by brushing my teeth for no reason.

Oh. He got hit in the head with books. That wasn't my parents,

but By a third grade teacher.

Yeah. See, and this is where we would have to fight. Because it's the nerve of you. The nerve. Girl, I've mitigated audacity.

Yeah. And and and it's funny is to this day, I hadn't told a soul that it happened.

He didn't think anything of

I didn't think anything of it because, oh, yeah. You know, people get you know, people beat kids all the time. That's fine.

You know?

I was

gonna say because if it's in your norm at any time

It is in my norm. Yeah. It was like

Whereas I feel like that type of I would unwarranted violence was not until, like Yeah. There was a whole timeline with my family. But Right. There was a point where, like, unwarranted violence just did It

was like a hardback spelling book, you know, it just

Wait, two hands off of the head? Oh, bitch. I would have sworn.

Yeah. No. Yeah.

Not my head. Actually, don't know. That's a lie. I wouldn't have sworn. I actually wasn't that kid. What I would have done was immediately gone up, gotten up, walked out and went to the principal's office. I would chattel tail.

You know what and you know what my thought was? Yeah. I should've sent my ass down.

Yeah. That was his thought. It was his fault. Right. His thought was that it was his fault.

Yeah. I should've sent

my Damn.

Because like another narratives though.

Yeah. Another stare another student wanted to see whatever I was pointing out. And so, yeah, I am.

So you was helping somebody?

No. I wasn't helping somebody. Oh. What happened was I had walked up to the teacher. Hey. There's this little thing in my fucking book that's, like wrong or whatever.

Mhmm.

It's like, I I think it was made like some obscenity or whatever the fuck. And and she was like, I guess she was already like, you know, on edge about something else. Mhmm. And she was like, Chris, okay. Go sit

Was she black?

What the fuck do want me to do about it? No. She was white.

See, I knew it. I'd asked it in reverse because I knew. And

I was just like, you know, she she was like, yeah. For me, it was very much I

thought she was black. Audacity. Audacity.

That energy. For you, woman.

To take your

butt head.

Yeah. And sit up. So I'm going back

On my black child. I would have had her job as a child. I took my bus driver's job. I would have had that bitch's head. Carry on.

But no. Yeah. So I you know, so okay. Alright. Fine. I don't know what you own, but I just go The

mistreatment of the night.

So then some another student asked what

you're doing.

What you show us? Oh, yeah. Wow. And then she just took the book, and that's the thing I knew. That's right on top of the head. And I was like, you know, I should have said that.

Is she alive today?

She may have been. She may be.

You know what? Let's find her.

Yeah. We'll discuss this offline.

Yeah. I was eight.

I was I was was gonna let her make it when I thought

she playing. Would like to see if she's reconciled that within herself. And if not, I would like to provide her a nudge to doing so.

Yeah. Well, I only know her last night. But anyway

We can figure it out. That's not a problem.

Okay. You know mean? I I love to support. I love to support as I'm coming out

I'm angry. I just wanna call out be vulnerable with my emotions. That story makes me angry.

I'm livid. Yeah. I'm livid.

I'm sorry.

I'm ready to fight a old bitch.

Girl, wheelchair and all.

And this is why it's important to maintain the right to fight people in wheelchairs. Word. Because not to not do so is ableist. You gotta Damn.

Equal opportunity fight. Equal opportunity fight it.

And now I'm not saying whoop them with your full strength. Make it equitable. You know what I'm saying?

I mean

Maybe you sit down. Baby. But like if you an asshole,

you can get boxed. She hit my husband at the age of eight over the head with a spelling book.

You know what? She

can get all of this energy.

But also we could just find an encyclopedia

I'm fine with that.

And return the favor.

I'm fine with that.

And I for an eye and I know Gandhi said it make the whole world blind but it's looking mighty blind in here anyway.

I mean if bitches can't see, might as well get what

you get You know

what? I think that would that would fix the aim issue.

I mean

because if she can't see, she just swipe it at the wind. That's fine. Okay. Don't really believe this y'all.

I'm I know. It's this

I'm just saying.

I'm talking bad

shit. I don't

have it. Very dark humor right now.

Yeah, is. It is. But Christian is vindictive. Y'all, she a Scorpio. I don't know if y'all knew that. Mhmm. Christian get mad vindictive. I'm a cuss. That's why I say I got a little vengeance in my soul. But Christian is actually Christian literally y'all, this is one of my favorite stories.

Asshole.

To this day To this day. She hates this man.

He could go kick asshole.

This is why you need to forgive because you got friends that will not forgive you.

Listen. He's by who go forget, yo.

There are like literally, I have to I have to be cons I have to like if I am not done with a thing or if I'm still processing a thing, I'd be like, I gotta figure out how and when I'm a tell Christian because if I tell Christian, she is gonna hate forevermore. Mhmm. Like there will be no redemption. Whereas I'm like, no. I see the humanity. We've talked it out. We've processed

this thing

and blah blah blah. Christian don't care. She'll be like, okay. She gonna do the nice nasty church lady.

Look.

You know?

I hope he has the day he deserves. Damn.

I mean, we were young.

Whatever he deserves. That's I mean, I'm thriving. I

think that's the win.

No. You having the day you deserve.

I I am. And that's Same for him.

If he ends up thriving, like, good.

What if the rest of his life cause he was a little bit older than me. He was. Yeah. So like what if the rest

of his life he's He that

much older than me. Damn.

I'm sticking with it. Keep going.

How old was he? I think we're like what? Three, four years apart? I think

it was four. Was it four? I thought it was four because I thought he was about to graduate.

He wasn't in school, baby.

Well, I mean, like like the age of you know what I'm saying? Like, the age where he was moving on.

See, this and this is

I think I remember how old he was, and I think we're both wrong.

Oh, okay.

This is why as

a three or four. You say what?

Why as a rule, I do not talk in bad light people I love to other people I love.

Yes. Because I'll hate them? Is that is that what you know? That's people will form opinions because I love you.

Right.

Right? But it's just like, no. No. We're working

We're working through that. And so I yeah. It's not that I

don't talk about their humanity.

But I I frame it in a way such that whenever you meet them, you still get to form an opinion about them for yourself.

I'm gonna But

I I I want to talk with you about how this

I'm gonna make a I'm gonna make a separation between these two things.

Yeah. I know.

Just for

I know. But I was just yeah. Yeah.

What Whitney is talking about granted, he was a person that she was with back in the day. That's not a person Briefly. Her right. That's not a person who's currently like He hasn't

been around for to interact No.

I get what you're saying.

I am able to control myself. Yeah. However, if I am of the opinion or assumption that you are currently harming someone I care about, I will not

be harming. It actually won't matter whether you say anything or not.

Right.

She picks up Oh, I won't.

Yeah. No.

That was fair. I will. That's fair. I will.