The Hardest Part Comes After the Exit

Adam Mopsick: You see a lot of people get started, but they think of it as like, okay, I'm just going from project to project as opposed to thinking about it of I'm building a business. Right? And what does that require? Kory Mitchell: So that's Adam Mopsick. He started a construction business out of his car in Miami in 1996. 25 years later, he sold the private equity for life-changing money. So this episode's about identity, reinvention, recalibration, but more specifically it's about winning. Welcome to The Turn. I'm Kory Mitchell of Iconic Founders Group. If you're running a blue collar business and you're wondering about what your business is worth or selling it, we have answers that you don't find in a textbook, because I've literally been in your shoes. I had no idea who to call or turn to. So now at Iconic Founders, we support the blue collar industry and founders just like you. So if you're interested and you have a business that's doing over 2 million in profit, send us a note at theturn@iconicfounders.com, because I love it when the good guys win. Take us back to 1996. I mean, you start a business in your twenties. What led you to that moment? Adam Mopsick: I worked for a couple of years for a general contracting company doing custom homes in Miami. I was a superintendent and I wasn't making a lot of money and I was presented with an opportunity to renovate other apartments and things that I felt like I could make as much money in six months as I was making in a year basically on salary. And I figured why not? I already had my license and I wasn't ready, but at that age, you don't know what you don't know. So I had certain goals for each year. My first year I wanted to make a hundred thousand dollars or whatever it was, a certain amount of money and then it's like, well the next year you're like, okay, I want to save X dollars and then I wanted to do this. I want to hire some employees. And it just goes, I figured that when you don't have a lot to lose, certainly it's a lot easier to make some of those choices. I didn't a lot of responsibilities, I didn't have a lot of debt. I figured I could always go back and get a job if I needed to and never had to. Kory Mitchell: What got you into the construction industry to begin with? Did you grow up in the business? Adam Mopsick: I used to work on job sites as a laborer, I always liked that kind of work and I was attracted to just not working at a desk kind of job. But I studied business in college and had an uncle who was in the industry and needed some help and upon graduation, so at one point I thought I was going to go to law school and just started working right into the construction industry and I found it to be an industry that it was, you could see all these different people, you could do really well just by working hard and I always just was kind of drawn to that, whether you're laying tile or painting or doing whatever, you see guys out there working hard and working Saturdays and making more money and I don't know, there was something about it that I really liked. Kory Mitchell: So you start your business, what kind of company is it, first of all, and what does that first year look like? Adam Mopsick: Let's be clear, there was no company, right? It's me. And it was learning how to ... I was writing checks by hand from my car, and that time it was the mid-nineties, so we barely had email. And I remember my first year I realized, I'm like, wow, if I save $5,000 on this stucco contract that I'm buying out, I just made an extra five grand. And once that started to click, you're like, there's something to this. I was literally working from my bedroom and by myself. The real decisions come when you start to take on overhead and take on expenses and then it really feels more like a business, right? Okay, I'm kind of in this. But there were things that I learned. You learn about accounting, you learn about how to negotiate contracts for yourself, you learn about just, there's a whole spectrum of things you learn from being an entrepreneur in business for yourself that you really can't learn any other way. Building your brand, protecting your reputation, building relationships, finding new work, doing sales, hiring people, all of that is really hard to do no matter at any scale. It's almost like you can give somebody the playbook and a lot of people don't want to do all of those different things or you find people who complement what you're not good at or you don't enjoy, right? So that's another part of it saying, look, some people are really good at operations, they don't want to deal with business development, I don't know. But when you figure out what it is that you do well, you can unlock different aspects of your growth. Kory Mitchell: So I mean it sounds to me like there's actually an advantage of figuring it out on your own. What do you feel like you missed by doing it on your own? Adam Mopsick: If you're just starting a GC business, you see a lot of people get started, but they think of it as like, okay, I'm just going from projects to project, as opposed to thinking about it of I'm building a business and what does that require? And thinking about org charts and thinking about what it is to grow an actual business that I didn't really discover until I was a little bit older. And I think there was probably a good portion early in my career where my head was down and I was a little bit not exposed to some of these other things and now looking back, I think I didn't discover YPO until I was in my forties. And so much of the exposure to those things, at some point you get a little further on in your career, you realize how much you didn't know. Kory Mitchell: So walk us through the trajectory of your business. So you start this thing, you're a one-man band, 1996, walk us through the next 20 years of your career and what does it look like? You're adding offices, you're adding services. Adam Mopsick: So we really started hiring people and grew the GC business. And look, people are often looking for a way to find things cheaper in the construction industry, so they're willing to give new companies and younger companies a try depending on the type of project, but whether it's building multiple houses or then we started getting into building through some relationships, building office interiors. So downtown Miami was in the early two thousands, was going through a huge growth. It's going through another one now, but where there were lots of office towers being built, we got into building out corporate interiors and then you fall into that niche where you're just known for a certain thing and then it became restaurants and retail and hospitality and that GC business really grew for that market sector. That's what it really became known for. And the recession came in 2008. For us it was probably really about 2009 and it was just like everything dried up and so just kind of had an idea of started doing this owner representation. We had someone who worked for us who had mentioned it to me and I was like, would people even pay for that? And it turns out they would and approached a couple of people. I knew designers who, architects who had clients that you think somebody would be willing to pay for someone to manage the project as an ownership. And this was when it was really just a way to make some extra revenue during the recession. One thing led to another and then I got a call from a big condo association and before you know it, I realized in that business model that you get paid a flat monthly fee, there's less risk. You really get paid for understanding the process and managing it well, being organized and holding everybody accountable. And I really enjoyed that part of the process and still do of being able to just solve problems, manage teams, manage projects. So that was probably 2009, 10 and really just started growing the business from there within a few years. Just I remember realizing I was just building spreadsheets and realizing as long as we add projects before they burn off, the process just grows. Then I see a lot of owners reps who get stuck at a certain number of people. And that's when I really stepped back and looked at it from a business standpoint, said okay how do we grow this as a business and setting up the visions and having an HR department and having specialized marketing and really just thinking about it in terms of a business which you don't see a lot of owners, rep businesses scale in that way. And we really from let's say 2015, 16 for the next probably six to eight years, I don't think we had many quarters that weren't higher than the quarter before from a revenue standpoint. And keeping up with that in this growth period became very rewarding, but time-consuming and heavy lifting and it's like almost again, you don't know what you don't know until you're in it, but it's something I'm still very proud of and I know the team that we built with is very proud of and it was just a cool experience to go for a growth ride up until an exit. Kory Mitchell: I've built some spreadsheets like that before where I show my nice linear growth and I just keep adding 4% growth every year. It's one thing to say that how do you actually do it? Adam Mopsick: If a client is paying you to run and manage a project, you cannot be the one who's saying you're selling that work and then provide them someone else to do the work who doesn't provide it in the same level that you would. Then you're not staffing it properly, you're not doing right by that client. So the hard part becomes finding and building and training a team and attracting a team who you believe can actually do things as well or maybe better even than you can as maybe a principal founder. And that's the hard part. And ultimately where we were able to really unlock the growth was setting up different divisions and with leadership who was really capable in those divisions. So we started, built a high-end residential team and then we were servicing hospitality and ground up towers, condo associations, private schools, and if you can build these divisions and each one is its own mini business profit center and manage them and then being real honest with the clients of like, hey, I'm here introducing my business. I'm not going to be the one managing and running your project, but we have a capable team and I'm always here and they're going to run this for you. You don't want to bait and switch anybody by telling them you're going to run it and not doing it. And look, a lot of people who grew up in the construction industry, were not trained to be managers of people. They manage projects. We invested a lot into teaching people how to become better managers. It's training them to be good project managers and also to be managers of people and working well in an organization as a team and then project teams as well. You want other referrals within the industry and that also became a part of growth when you're in the owner representation space, which means you're really managing projects on behalf of owners. There's different reputations of different types of firms. You don't want to be in there just making a mess or pushing paper or beating up on the professionals. You want to build a team and you want other professionals in the industry to say, look, if I'm going to work with someone, this is the team I want to work with. They're helpful. They actually manage the project in a productive positive way. Kory Mitchell: What was the point for you where you were like, this is more than just me, this feels like a real business. How did that happen for you and then what did you do next? Adam Mopsick: When I always talk to people who are starting a business or small business, I think it's hiring those first few employees is a big key. Thinking about it, I'm going to pay X dollars and I'm going to make that much less as opposed to thinking about it of like, this is going to free me up to do so much more. And in any stage of any business, those are kind of the decisions you make looking at growing a business and hiring staff as more of a profit center than an expense. This is how I'm going to be able to do more and grow more. What's amazing about the construction industry is that in an industry worth investing a career in, which is kind of where I've even come to now where I've had opportunities to do other things, it's a massive industry. I think over $3 trillion or something spent in the country and quality of service is terrible generally. I mean, most people, clients have a bad experience and you start thinking about what that is. You can find yourself in a place where you can stand out by offering better service and operating with integrity. And it's like you just kind of can elevate to the top of the industry in a service standpoint. And those are the things that I think really where it's an industry where it's staying in and trying to do things a different way, there's just so much opportunity in it and so much opportunity for growth and that I always found exciting and still do at this point. Kory Mitchell: Yeah, isn't that amazing? Things that you and I think take for granted, it's like, oh, doing right by your customer communicating, it's like some of these basic blocking and tackling things are actually differentiators, the things that we think are just table stakes for you, you're saying just doing some of the most basic things sets you apart from the competition. Adam Mopsick: And you say that, so now I sit on a board for a trade services company through a private equity company, and part of the thing when I talk to either other young people coming up in the industry or other business owners is how are you differentiating yourself? A lot of competition you can do it by if you consider yourself to be a best in class firm or everything you do is from your marketing, from your branding, from the way you manage your accounting, the way you communicate with your clients, just what are you willing to accept the people in your team? Do they communicate well? It takes more effort. But then I think what happens is then you attract the type of people who are interested in doing that type of work and then it becomes like a flywheel. Kory Mitchell: Becomes part of your culture. Adam Mopsick: That's what it is. It is your culture. And you can't differentiate by paying people more or charging less or whatever. At the end of the day, it's about if you want to track rate people, I think culture is what you can build as a differentiator and it's just the way you conduct yourself in the industry and it takes more work, but doesn't always necessarily cost more. It's about building a brand and building a reputation. And I think that was one of the keys to growth and success. Kory Mitchell: I love this so much because what you're really talking about is value, right? You're offering a real value service. And I tell clients all the time, I help them think through, well, what does the next two, three years look like? And so often younger businesses think, well, low bid, that's my strategy. I'm going, well, if low bid is your strategy, you don't have a sales strategy. What you're talking about is actually offering real value and then charging for it. Adam Mopsick: Yeah. And operating with integrity. And when I look now, so now I've shifted from the GC space to the owner's rep world. Really sold both businesses. And in the owner's rep. When I look for contractors to hire, I want to hire firms that, look, these jobs are long, two, three, sometimes longer years. We're going to disagree. We're going to make mistakes both sides, and we want to be able to have an intelligent professional disagreement and then come back and work together. And I mean, it happened yesterday. I'm in a meeting with an architect and a contractor and they're getting defensive like, guys, look, I don't really care whose fault this is. We're going to all have stuff. Let's work together. It's about building a team, a project team, and then figuring out how we're going to grow together. And that's what I think frustrates a lot of clients in the industry is like finger pointing and then they don't know how to unravel who's at fault. And these jobs are complex and they take a long time. So personalities and how you want to work with businesses who conduct themselves with that similar level of integrity and the rest of it, you can all work out. Kory Mitchell: So I mean I live in Colorado where it's super dry climate, and one of the biggest challenges I had with my business is keeping my guys hydrated. For me personally, I literally drink all of my water with an electrolyte and one of the things that makes me more interested in drinking water is putting a flavored sugar-free electrolyte in it. And Salt of the Earth, it's awesome. You take a packet, throw it in your water and you're good to go. 15% discount for all of our listeners. Click the link in the show notes and you'll get a discount on us. My favorite one in this is not the orange, it's the grapefruit. It's what I'm drinking right now. It's Himalayan salt. I recommend it to businesses that I work with because hydration is one of the first parts of safety in a project-based business, particularly in places that have really, really hot climates or places like Colorado where I live. I can legitimately tell you that this tastes better than the rest of them. This is better. One of the things I've always struggled with, and I've seen this in a million businesses, is the guys that are really good at running work usually aren't that great at sales. How did that work in your business? Did you have do-or-sellers or did you have a separation between the sales team and the people that executed on the work? Adam Mopsick: I'll say this, if there was anything in the business that I would consider, I don't know if it's a bottleneck or a benefit or however you want to do it. I personally met with every single client coming in the door that was part of the business development process. If there was ever an issue with a project, I did never want to be coming in as a principal and first meeting that client for the first time. I want to have a discussion with them, first of all, make sure they're the right fit for us. Then kind of interviewing them and understanding that, setting their expectations, figuring out curating the right team internally for personality and who's going to work well with them. You have all different types of people who work for you, who's going to work well with that client for whatever reason. I think that was one of the keys to success for our business was the funnel that we built essentially for demand of different sectors. And we had periods of time where the growth was, I would joke, I'd go out for lunch, I said, I'm going to go back to the office and I'm going to have three new emails for new work. And it was always that way. And certain growth spurts within the city, like '21 in Miami, it was crazy. And there were other periods of time like that. Then also you would have where the team, just you call them seller/doers. I think just by doing such a great job, they were then selling because people wanted to work with them and then that becomes an easier way to then assign them to those projects. But then in the same thing, it goes back to the beginning of the funnel. I still meet with them and then kind of assign it down. That's the way we did it at some point of growth, if we were going to grow maybe to another next level, maybe it becomes unsustainable. But that's how we were doing it during our growth phase. Kory Mitchell: So by the end where you start thinking about selling the company, how many people did you have? Adam Mopsick: So we probably, in the owner's rep side, I don't know, we in the maybe 50 or 60, we then acquired an engineering company which did site inspections and lender pay app reviews and that type of business. I think we're probably maybe close, I don't know, over 80 or so and had some concepts of really how to kind of meld those businesses together. We had prior, let's say maybe 21 or so had some requests from firms who were looking to have a foothold in the South Florida market, which to me still is the strongest market in the entire country. One of the best markets I think in the world. I mean it's really incredible. So we were very fortunate to be in a great market. We were the biggest firm in the market. We had I think a really good reputation, which just created some buzz and we had unsolicited offers. And so we're talking just to a couple different, never really ran a full sales process cause I didn't want that kind of out in public and just started talking to a firm that felt like it was a good fit for us and just one thing led to another. There were different, I don't know if, I imagine some of your question is why would you think to do that? And I think about that all the time. Kory Mitchell: Lots of people would say, hey, if you don't hire an investment bank, you're not creating a bidding environment where they're driving the price up. You don't really know what the business is really worth. You decide to go that route as opposed to running a full process. Adam Mopsick: I don't know. And I know more now than I knew then and maybe I might handle things a little bit differently now. But look, it's a professional services company, things can change, market conditions can change, key people can leave. And I don't know, it felt like the timing was right and it just felt like a good fit of the type of firm there. It was a private equity backed other kind of operator. Again, I have seen more now than I knew then. So I think there maybe were different types of buyers now that I think might've suited us better. But in the end it was about getting something done that felt good and felt right. And look, part of it for me was I've had few of these career transitions. I was about 50 years old and I was just thinking if I was going to do this and have some form of a non-compete and maybe have a chance to restart something in the future and be young enough to do it, that led to my decision as well. I didn't want to wait another 10 or 15 years and kind of ride the wave. And again, where we were in the market cycle where Miami was in its growth period, it just felt like the right time for where I was as a professional. Kory Mitchell: Any parts of the process that were particularly tough to get through? Adam Mopsick: I would say that the whole process of taking it from let's say the first phone call through the actual exit was probably one of the hardest things I've ever done professionally. Kory Mitchell: Tell us why. Adam Mopsick: First of all, you're running your business and you're growing your business and you're trying to run it better now than you've ever run it because you have interest and you're sharing your books and you really want to tighten up your processes and make sure it's running as well as it can. It you have buyers who are asking for a lot of information and due diligence and you want to be transparent and provide them that stuff and that takes a lot of time and effort. So you're cleaning up the books where we used to look, our CFO and I at the time, or we maybe would look at things like monthly or maybe quarterly, sometimes we were looking at them like weekly, right? We're really very diligent on focusing on our performance and making sure that we're doing things as well as we can. And look, I like the control of that process. I wasn't going to just turn it over to an investment banker and in that sense, I'm glad I did and I had a lot of great resources that I mentioned through IPO and I would double check, Hey, am I doing this right or what would you do differently? And just kind of reinforcing No, no, I think feel like I'm handling this as well as I can handle it. And so it was very rewarding. I learned a ton. I'm really glad to have gone through it, but it was very hard. I am not going to say that it was a simple thing and I don't know that I'd recommend it for everybody depending upon what you're good at and what you'd like to do. Maybe some people it's easier for them to hand that off to a professional. I did enjoy it. Kory Mitchell: Yeah, I mean I've seen diligence kill a lot of deals. There's so many entrepreneurs that are running a small business and the diligence can just be crushing. And so, one of the things when I'm helping someone through the process, I always recommend bringing in someone to help through the diligence process, literally helping to quarterback the documents and things like that. Who handled that from your team? Adam Mopsick: We had a few people inside who, again, I give them tremendous credit, the team and they stretched and they helped organize a lot of the paperwork and did extra effort and couldn't have done it without them internal team, but we didn't have to bring in somebody from the outside. We were able to kind of do it internally. Super complicated of a business, but in the end it's still a lot of requests and it's a lot of time. Kory Mitchell: You're doing all these meetings and you're doing all this diligence. Were you able to keep the business on the tracks? Adam Mopsick: Well, we're also going through a major growth period. So I come back to, I don't know if you're aware, post COVID, south Florida became this just massive destination for a lot of wealthy people, a lot of different types of businesses. And there was just a massive increase and obviously costs were going crazy all over the country. And so we just had a ton of people moving here. I think hundreds of thousands of people moving to the state each year. And then that hasn't stopped. And so the business more than doubled I think from the time we first started having that conversation until we actually exited. So the business was growing at the same time. Kory Mitchell: Did you get more money? Adam Mopsick: We did. Kory Mitchell: Yeah. Usually what you see is the other direction, right? The founder gets distracted by the process, they take their eye off the ball because they're the primary salesperson, the EBITDA or the revenue goes down or both. And the deal gets buyer's like, what the heck happened? Well, of course I know what happened. I took my eye off the ball. So I spent six, nine months of my life distracted by a process. You actually went the other direction where the business grew. Adam Mopsick: I can totally see how that can happen. And I also, I feel very fortunate that we're just in certain market conditions that allowed for that growth. And again, that hasn't stopped. So it's not like it was just a blip. I mean, Miami has just been on this trajectory just up and continues that way. So I was fortunate in that respect. Kory Mitchell: Do you regret selling now that the market's just kept cranking up into the right? Adam Mopsick: No, I think it was a life stage decision and I don't regret selling. I think in retrospect maybe there could have been a different type of buyer who maybe would've made us a platform company and had a chance to then grow with another level of capital and brain power and just different way of thinking about how to grow the business. And I think that's something that I would've liked to do. Look, I consider myself more of a business person first and then happens to be in the construction industry where other people may look at it. I'm a contractor first and I'm running a business. And so I love talking about the business side and the growth of business and just, I don't know, it is something that I'm drawn to. And so that part of it was exciting for me, just learning about the process of what it would take to sell a business. Kory Mitchell: So you closed the deal, does that mean you have a job and you work for somebody else? Adam Mopsick: I was there for less than a year, wasn't the right fit for me. So I transitioned out and it's different not having a team. I was so connected to my business for so long other than my family, it was the most important thing to me. Your identity's tied up in it. That was hard for a period of time. So the first year I was there, it's been now a couple of years that I've been out and now I'm targeting the end of non-compete and like, okay, now what happens next? Looking at different industries, talking to people in construction tech and how's AI going to transform the industry and what are some of the next areas of opportunity in the construction industry, which I still see as a massive growth growth industry. It's like there's so much here. And so it's nice to sit and take things from a different perspective when you don't have to be so deep in the weeds. Kory Mitchell: I want go back to your comment that it's hard. I think a lot of people would say, oh, what was me? The guy sells for millions of dollars. What's hard about getting rich? Adam Mopsick: First of all, it's identity. You do something hard with other people, it's part of a team. And you feel that, I mean I think you see it with any team or whether it's athletics or anything, you do something together that's hard and then that ends and there's some kind of a feeling of like, oh, now that it's a let-down after that. And then not having that part of your identity, which is just so something so important to you from one day to the next, not there anymore and not being surrounded by a team every day. That's something that has been very difficult and figuring out, okay, now you're in this next phase of life and what does that transition look like? Spend a few months of say, now I'm going to fish, I'm going to play paddle, I'm going to do these other things. But I mean depending, for some type of people, I know that that's hard to do. At some point you're looking for the next thing. And so that's kind of where I am now, I started sitting on boards and now I started doing some other, getting back in the industry and doing other types of work, which has been actually really rewarding to work on projects, doing some other general contracting work or things that just are not in violation of my non-compete, that it's allowed me to go back and touch projects again with some really great clients and some really interesting projects. And that's been really rewarding as well. So when you go back from running a business back to running projects, it's been a cool transition for me. Kory Mitchell: It's interesting listening to you talk. You had this moment of sadness, you can hear it in your voice, you miss your team. And then you talk about giving advice to these new teams on the board work. Is that being around the teams on this board work? Is that starting to refill the cup? Adam Mopsick: I don't know if it fills the cup completely because I'm starting to get the itch about doing something else, but it definitely is. It helps. And it's been really interesting to look at it from a different perspective, like a well-run private equity company and the way that they think about business looking at say, okay, here's where we want to be in let's say five, seven years, and now let's work backwards and make all the right decisions. Is sometimes if you're running your own business, you're really going month to month or year to year as opposed to looking at that seven years down the road and saying, where do we need to be and how do we get there if we don't? So setting the right KPIs, and really that's been good education for me. Kory Mitchell: Sort of the difference between being able to work on the business instead of just working in the business all the time. Adam Mopsick: Yeah. And really understanding what is it that, let's say a buyer, a sophisticated organized buyer, is looking for What are the types of firms that they are looking for on an acquisition so that if you're looking to build a business in that way, you are setting it up for something to be appealing to a buyer. Kory Mitchell: What are some of the things that you've seen now from the other side that maybe it surprised you? Adam Mopsick: Well, buyers, I know the private equity groups that I've seen, they want able recurring revenue. And I didn't build a GC business or an owner's rep business with the intent to sell, but realize early on that an owner's rep business that bills monthly with the proper termination clauses and protections of risk, it's not like a complete recurring revenue like subscription model because, but it's pretty much as close as you're going to get right? In the construction industry, it just bills on the first of the month and that business trades at a higher multiple than let's say a GC business, which doesn't have the same recurring revenue type of a situation. And there's a lot more risk. And so just looking at it that way. But look, these guys will look for portable toilets and dumpsters and anything that bills monthly. So when you're looking at a trade services company, service-oriented business will trade at a much higher multiple than a new construction business. And when you think of it that way, okay, well why they service contracts, it's recurring, it's predictable revenue, it's not as volatile. And it makes you think about even if you're going to build any other type of businesses, to have some of that mix of predictable recurring revenue alongside maybe some of the higher margin opportunities that are not as predictable. Kory Mitchell: That's unbelievably good advice. Everyone listening should take note because it's so true. I'm just curious, can you identify one place in your life or in your business where you would call it the turning point for you? Adam Mopsick: I've had two different transitions, I would say, of these key moments of transitions. So when I was 24, I quit my job. I moved, broke up with my girlfriend at the time who is now my wife, and got a dog. You have these major life moments where you just completely change. And then there's the recession where you're forced to retool because there's no business. And now you have to create and do different things. And now I'm in this another life transition, and I think it's important to just look, sometimes you don't realize them when you're in those moments of just recognizing these moments of opportunity to just either reinvent yourself or kind, maybe stop doing things that maybe weren't working for you and think about doing things in a different way. And I think those points in your life are really refreshing if they're important, important to recognize them in the moment and then reflecting on them and say, okay, what could you do better and how can you use that to really improve your next phase? Kory Mitchell: Yeah, I mean, look, it feels to me like your energy's great. I think you're clearly in a great head-space and you're going to do something awesome in your next chapter. So I appreciate you making time in your schedule to share. Adam Mopsick: Thanks, Kory, nice to talk to you. Kory Mitchell: So Adam stayed on for less than a year. It just wasn't the right fit. So now he's spending some time figuring out what's next. He's mentoring founders, he's advising, he's coaching, but his non-compete is almost up and he's starting to get the itch. So if you take one thing from Adam's story, it's that the exit isn't the end, it's just the beginning. He got the money, the validation, then he had to answer the hardest part. Now what? When you sell, you don't just lose the company, you lose a part of your identity, your team, your purpose. That's the part nobody tells you about winning. I know what it feels like. You spend your whole life working in a business and then all of a sudden it's gone. But the reality is, it doesn't have to be the end. I'm Kory Mitchell. Thanks for listening to The Turn, a podcast by Iconic Founders Group. Make sure you follow and subscribe to The Turn wherever you get your podcasts. And follow us at iconicfounders.com. We help founders like Adam sell the businesses they care about and protect the legacies they've built. Let's win.