05: Brothers in Arms

This podcast contains information and details relating to suicide. We urge anyone struggling with their emotions to contact Lifeline on thirteen eleven fourteen thirteen eleven fourteen or visit them at lifeline dot org dot au.

We also warn listeners that this episode contains graphic content.

A twenty four year old devoted mother of two fleeing a violent relationship as a mom bags packed car running, her daughters strapped into the backseat.

Mom told me that she needed to go back inside to grab something.

Panic.

Amy is dead, Sir amys dead?

Eight confusion About five minutes they said, no, it's a suicide.

One hundred percent. This is Emergercy.

What do you think is really the honest truth about Amy?

The Truth about Amy?

Episode five.

I'm Liam Bartlett.

And I'm Alison Sandy.

Can I mate? Here are going You must be Gareth Price? How are you? Gareth? It's going on, Liam Bartlett L seven new Spotlight.

Yeah good, it's going on.

We're in Oldbury, not far from Serpentine, at a small white farmhouse set back about ten meters from the main road. Parked in front of the double car garage is Gareth's white ut looking a bit disheveled in a gray sleeveless shirt and tracksuit pants.

His hair is a.

Rye and his hands dirt stained. We know he's been out with Josh Bryden for most of the day before arriving home. Bridon was also there the day Amy died, but says he left before it happened. Gareth appears a bit erratic and hyperactive, not unlike Anna described him to be at the inquest, and strides up to Liam, who has his hand out, which he shakes firmly.

Well, we're just doing a story about Amy Wensley. Yeah, we're wondering if you could answer a few questions for us please.

Gareth's face is a grimace. He's the same age Amy would have been had she lived thirty four, exactly the same age. They were born the same day, both six years younger than David Simmons. This isn't Gareth's first rodeo. He's been interviewed by police many times, not just about this,

Do you think it was a suicide that he was?

I was there.

Will return to his interview with Liam later, but firstly, here's some background. Gareth Edward toll Price was born eleventh of February nineteen ninety. His friendship with Simmons came about through their mutual love of hunting. He says they met through his younger brother, Richard. Gareth can't remember the exact time, but it was around the time Kay was born and when he was still married to Chill mckerny, who became

But before we get to that, let's return to the night of twenty sixth of June twenty fourteen and the statement that Gareth made to police. We'll start with the moment the car was packed and the kids were in the back seat and Amy went back inside.

Simo then started the car so the heater was on for the kids. Simo shouted to Amy. The kids said hurry up, they want to go to Nana's. Amy shouted back something like wait a minute. I then heard a loud crack. I looked at Simo and said, what's she breaking now. Simo turned off the car and walks into the house. I followed him in and he opened the door of the bedroom. Before I could get to the bedroom, Simo began screaming, oh fuck, oh fuck. He rang past

I don't know why I did that.

I grabbed hold of a towel from the floor and threw it over Amy's head. I then went outside to where Simo was on the patio, still freaking out. Neither of us had a phone, so I jumped in the car with Simo and drove up the road to the servo.

To ring for the ambulance and police. We then went back to the house.

Simo dropped me off and took the kids to Pinjara, where their Nana lives.

I waited by the gates. I didn't go back up to the house.

About fifteen minutes later, Simo's dad came down and said, what's going on. I said, she shot herself. He said, yeah, I see that. Who's put a towel on her head? I said I did. He then asked who moved the gun. I said I did. He said, I've unloaded it.

On August six, fourteen, just a little over a month later, Gareth provides another statement to wa police. We pick up at the same time as before.

Amy was not saying anything while putting stuff in the car. I could tell she was angry, and I know that she was crying. I saw Amy make about four trips backwards and forwards putting things in the car.

The kids were asking if they could stay with Simo.

Price says he then saw Simo take Neya inside, where he spoke to Amy.

He was only inside for a short time before coming back out, maybe thirty seconds. He told the girls they have to go with Amy. Simo put the girls in the car. Simo also put some teddies in the car for the girls. Simo yelled out to Amy while she was inside to hurry up.

Amy yelled back something like just give me a minute. Josh had left by this point, he had to go.

About the time Simo put the teddies in the car, Simo was kneeling down at the car talking to the kids. Simo started the car to put the heater on as the kids were cold. Music was on in the car also. I can't recall what the music was. It may have been the radio. I then heard a crack, like a thud. It sounded like someone breaking something. Simo started walking toward the gate that leads to the door to Endo the house.

I was behind Simo.

As I got to the door, Simo came running out, saying fuck, fuck, fuck, with his hands up to his face. I went inside and I could smell gunpowder. I went to Simo's bedroom and pushed the door open. It was kind of stuck. Amy was behind the door. I went in the room and flung the gun away from Amy. I touched the gun down near the butt. The gun was on Amy with the barrel pointing up toward her head, the butt near her foot on the floor. The gun was a four to ten side by side shotgun. It's

I think Simo was in a bit of shock.

Really.

I waited there on the side of the road to direct the ambulance. Simo left and took the kids to Pinjarra to Amy's mum's house. I was out in the front for ages. I don't know how many minutes, maybe twenty Simo's dad came down and asked me what happened. I said, she's dead, mate, she shot herself.

The rest of the conversation is very similar to the previous statement. Four years later, cold case detectives again come knocking and Gareth makes another statement, but unfortunately we don't have a copy of that. He was also questioned vigorously at the coronial inquest in twenty twenty one. One point raised by Gareth then that he doesn't seem to mention elsewhere, were claims that his wife, Rachel, told him that Amy

Was it Amy that told you that?

No, it wasn't. I think it was Simo.

And that's the only time that you can think of that Amy has ever talked about hurting herself or depression or.

It was it was that day with Rachel, Yes.

And Rachel had actually spent the previous night at Amy and simmons place.

We just stayed in the shed because there was another room in there.

He says he didn't notice anything out of the ordinary with Amy. Then the next morning, Gareth heads to work and when he returns, Amy is not home yet. When she does come home, she and Simmons argue.

Do you remember what started the argument?

I think it was because Simo was just no. She hated his drinking, like she just didn't like him drinking.

They also argue about him having lost his phone and Amy wanting to look at Josh Brydon's phone instead. Gareth goes off on a bit of a tangent at this point.

And I'm like, yes, whatever, all right, I'm like, yes, I just knocked off work, like let's just do something. They had guns out we were shooting some birds and we had yes out there shooting birds and stuff like that. Simo nailed at twenty two with that sorry at twenty seven, one of the parrots with a bloody.

The deputy coroner interjects.

Twenty eight. I think they're.

Called twenty that's the one twenty eight with the rifle like that and bloody then, yes, that was before Amy got there then, because we got all the guns there, because we wanted to have it be like just a big shooting, like let's shoot at Clay targets in the whole lot, like, let's go shooting.

Mss Tyler directs Gareth back to the argument between Simmons and Amy.

Amy just punched straight in the head twice and head butted him straight up, and then got a mirror and went to hit him with a mirror, and Simo who's got her by both arms and placed her to the floor and said cut it out.

Enough is enough?

Like that?

Yeah, where was this?

This was in the hallway kitchen, Like.

Do you remember getting up and grabbing the mirror?

Yes, I got up, and I'm pretty sure I put it back in the spot where she bloody took it from.

Okay, why did you do that?

Because that's where it belongs, on the bloody wall, not on the ground.

All right.

Were they still on the ground at that point?

No?

I said cut it all out. You're being bloody stupid. What are you fighting for?

Did they listen?

They both got up. Then she just started packing the car up.

What was Amy like at that point? Was she angry. Was she sad?

Yes, she was crying. I said, do you want some help? And she said like no.

He says. After that, Amy flips the lizard tank up and he helped Josh catch the lizards while Amy packed the car and Simmons talked to the kids.

Do you know how many trips Amy would have done?

She done a fair few, about maybe three trips, I reckon, I counted for about three trips, and she yes. Because I opened the door for her, I said, do you want another hand?

Are you right?

And you can't remember exactly what she packed into the car.

No, No, she was packing her kid's cloth, her clothes. She was packing the stuff into the car into the boot.

Was she running back and forth or walking?

Or she was like powe walking. I guess you know, when you're angering you just you just storm off.

Seemed to be in a hurry.

Yes, just packing her stuff and going to get out of there.

Yes, what happened after that? So she's in the house.

Yes, we heard a thud and then I said, what's she breaking now? And bloody? And then I smelt it. It was gunpowder.

Gareth says at this point, he's outside having a smoke and Simmons is with the kids.

Then he's come through the gate, gone inside. I heard a thud and he just came running straight out, punching the shed and he like just broke down and just I'm like, as he's run past me, like what's wrong? He goes, is she alive?

Bro?

He goes, is she alive?

The deputy coroner tries to ascertain where Gareth is when Simmons goes inside.

So you had followed him into the house, yes, I was right behind him, like pretty much.

And then he runs back past you out of the house.

Yes, started punching into the shed and just starts crying and screaming and stuff.

Do you know how long David would have been inside without you?

Shit?

Probably like seconds. It would have been seconds you were right behind him, yes, seconds like this time.

Gareth says, the gun was pretty much positioned between her legs.

The rifle was on her. She was like she was only a little, small, little lady like woman. Well, I walked in there and I was like, yes, rip the gun off, and then just covered her face up, then went back out and Simo said what do we do?

What do we do? And I was like, bro, we've got to call somebody.

Gareth has asked if he noticed the missing door handle.

Yes, actually no, not until like after you just told me.

When I walked in there, I left the bloody I left it open, yes, because like when I walked in, I just like ram the door, and I suppose that's how her body moves.

So you used a bit of force, did you.

Because it was stuck. I couldn't get in. I was like just fully opened.

It was that the first or second time you went in.

First time I went in there, and I've just like get in there, like I've just pushed it straight open.

So after David had run out, you were obviously right behind him to go in. Yes, you didn't realize at that point she had shot herself.

No, I thought she was breaking something. But as soon as he said is she alive?

That's when I didn't say that to you before he went in.

No, he goes as he was coming like what can you do? All right, I'll see what I can do. Can't move. I just went in there and bloody, like, holy shit, I can't help you.

Neither had a phone. Gareth says he went back into Amy and patted her down for her phone.

So when you patted her down looking for her phone.

You didn't find the phone.

Do you think you would have moved her leg or anything?

Well, no, I just checked her pockets.

You pat checked, yes, because well we needed to call somebody, all right.

Gareth is asked about why they didn't go to the big house to use the phone there. He says Simmons told him his dad was out.

David wouldn't have a key, no, he reckons, he's a little Yes, yes, no, he doesn't have a key. I don't think he had a key. He might know where he stashed it or something, but I don't know why he didn't go up to the top of the house.

So they go to the service station to make the triple zero call. Gareth is with Simmons when he makes that call. The coroner refers to a second call made by Simmons.

Do you know who he called?

Well, no, because I went because after he spoke to the got a hold of the coppers.

I just went back into the car, did you Yes.

Because we know from the service station owner that David asked if he could use the phone another time, and he said yes, And David then went out the front and called someone and I'm sure that the service station owner said that you were with him when he did that. You can't remember.

No, I don't remember that the second person he called.

There is mention in one of your interviews about David trying to call his dad. Do you remember anything about that.

Well, he might have called him, Yes, he might have called Bert, Yes, because I know he didn't.

I'm pretty sure he didn't speak to him.

When I was on the phone with him, hear him talk to his dad.

No, I was like, pretty looking too busy, Just zone it out.

Gareth Is then questioned about evidence provided by Nea, who was six at the time and talked to a child interviewer about the event shortly after.

Her memory is not too good of what occurred, but she did mention something about us stop at the rubbish bins. Do you know what that's about. No, he didn't stop at any rubbish bins anywhere.

No.

No.

Nea also mentioned something about David using a gun to shoot at a bird while they were waiting in the car or a tree.

Yes.

Can you tell me what you remember about that and shot it? Can you tell me what time that was?

No, I know it was the afternoon.

With the kids in the car.

At this point, yes, when he shot the bird, Yes, yes, all right.

Because of Neya's age at the time, not much weight was given to this evidence. Gareth proceeds to provide more details about the discussion he had with Robert or Bert as he calls him at the front gate. After seeing Amy's dead body for the first time.

He goes, what's going on? Did Simo do it?

So?

He said that, yes, straight up. He goes, did Simo do it? I was like, no, bro, no, no, no, and bloody, where did he go? I said, he's taking the kids to Nancy's, dropping them off to their nanas.

So at that point, as far as you know, had Bert already gone inside the house?

Yes, he goes, because I said, I think she shot Amy shot herself. And he goes, I've already seen that, And he goes, did he cover her up?

I said no, I covered her face up.

Do you remember Bert saying something about unloading the gun?

He when I was actually talking the other day when I was here on Tuesday or Monday when I was yeah, Tuesday, when I was here, But he said there was two guns there, bloody, the twelve gage shot gun was already loaded. You were saying, oh, I heard you were talking about that was on Tuesday, and that was the first time I actually heard that, and that was that day. So no, I didn't know about the other gun.

Okay, there was just a few different guns in the bedroom, that's all.

Yes, because we're going out shooting.

Did Bert leave while you were waiting at the front gate? Yes, but you don't know where Bert went or what he was doing.

No.

Gareth then talks about the ambulance and police turning up, followed by Nancy and Simmons. He says Nancy was accusing Simmons of killing Amy.

It's worth noting that at this point the detectives haven't arrived, they didn't hear Nancy shouting at David Simmons, and they weren't interested in hearing about the circumstances of Amy's life while they were there. Nancy wasn't questioned until major crime became involved, after Amy's death was determined as suicide and forensics were called off. Also at the inquest, Gareth was asked to clarify some of the discrepancies, starting with the tawl.

You say in the statement it was morone or red in color. Well, the photo seem to show it's blue blue, but I know that boys aren't always great with colors.

Is it possible?

I'm assuming it's the same towel that someone hasn't switched a red towel and put in a blue Would that be fair?

No?

What how I put on her? That's the tow I put on her.

Hey Council, representing the family. Peter Ward asked about a jacket, as that's what.

Robert recalls a jacket. Yes, I've heard that. Yes, it is definitely a towel.

Yes.

Despite being questioned extensively, many of Gareth's answers were still quite vague.

You must be Gareth Price. How are you? Gareth?

Now back to Liam's interview with Gareth.

We're wondering if you could answer a few questions for us please, Yes, depends, okay on what and what was the question.

You want to ask?

Well, we just want to find out the truth about what happened that day, Gareth.

Oh, okay. Have you usually got the statements and the reports about it?

Have you? I've read the stuff that you you said in the coroner's court.

Yeah, and I've read the rubbish.

No, you're right mate, You're right.

At this point, Gareth is picking up bits of paper on the ground.

I've read the stuff that you you said to the police, but there are still, as you know, there are still huge question marks about the actual result, you know, because the coroner said it was an open finding.

Yeah, I reckon those every few years. It's got to be brought back up in four years or something, and that's what I say.

Well, it's still an open case as far as the police are concerned.

That's what they said.

Yeah, so you know there's a million dollar reward for information. Yeah whatever, do you intend to take advantage of that? What for for yourself?

It's a suicide?

Do you think it was a suicide?

Exactly was?

I was there.

So in David, David Simmons, you're your friend. Did he have anything to do with it? Gareth, Uh.

No, he didn't.

I it was it was side. She shot herself. That's what happened there, really, no, she did there with fourteen shot gun. She blew her head off her shoulders.

Gareth is re enacting what Amy looked like when he found her and indicates the shotgun was pointing up under her chin.

Yeah, it wasn't it wasn't there, Gareth it wasn't like that. It was on the side of the head. You should know that if you've been living it for the past ten years. So you've got that one wrong. Is there anything else you've got wrong over the years?

I'm a literate. I can't ready which he sounded a right, yeah, sweets.

These players leave?

You want us to leave? Now? Why? Why are you uncomfortable talking about it?

You want to chat?

Why? Cup coffee?

Some biscuits the coffee?

Yeah, sure, yeah, I'm just way out of the house, a bit of a mess.

Well will you talk to us more?

Well, what do you want to know?

I'll tell you I'm dating into wanting here.

Well, Gareth, all I want to know is the truth. That's all I want to know. Because you know her family have been absolutely destroyed by this, and you would be too if it was your partner or your daughter or your wife.

I understand that, sir, And it's.

Just a it's a shocking, shocking way to go.

You've used people, got a lot of people in high places that saw a lot of stuff out, and they've been doing their tests and there all their reshirts and I know they've done all of what they've done.

So they haven't done it properly, and you know that's their fault. But you can help them. You can help us. I'm helping you, but you can help usk by telling the truth.

Is the truth, sir, It is the truth.

Who was first in that bedroom? Was it David or you?

You asked what was that? Bane?

Is likely? So what's that noise there? You read the statements, but he's all read statements.

But it doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense.

When that, when that kind of stuff happens, you don't. No one does understand. As bad as shocking, as bad as it is, it's not good to see your best face missing your head, blowing off shoulders, and there's not a good.

Thing to see.

It is shocking.

I actually walked in there, the gun off a lap and put a tower over where her face was made.

So the gun was on a lap, it was off her lap.

I did. I told her. I told her all the copper is this, all the sergeants and everybody.

I told him all.

But how would it be on a lap if the recoiled from the shotgun was that way?

Excuse me, sir, Have you seen the picture? Have you seen the drawing? Actually drew up a picture. Actually you've seen in the house the house of Look, I'll show you that will take you there exactly where it was if he wants to. That's what I'm talking about. Was right there, like in the corner of the room. I pushed the door open and all I've seen in the body was on the floor.

Mate, Why did you move the gun? Well?

I didn't want to see my best mod's friend with her without her face blowing off.

But David said he saw it first.

He was he is, is ye alive?

Yeah?

Seems you're alive.

I haven't a sp I know now I'm like, oh, ship, what do you what? We use it to that if you just walking something? Well what we used to like? What would you even in a situation? What would you people? What would you do?

Sir? It would be very confirmed.

What would you do in that situation? You please tell me what would you do if that happened to you? If your situation?

What would you do?

Please tell me?

It's a great question because it would be a terrible, terrible situation.

Please I elaborate.

Would you like tell me to but Gareth? But Gareth? After that? After that? Why did you take the wheely bin down to the end of the road and what was in that ben?

I don't know, sir, I didn't take it. Who've been down to the road?

I think you were seeing taking the bin down? No, I did not Who who took the bend down there?

I don't know, sir.

So did you go?

I actually waited at the bottom of the hill. I actually waited the bottom mills.

Sir, you went, You went with him to the roadhouse. Didn't you to make the crow?

Yes, we did. We both both the girls in the gata.

And did you get to the shop before that or after that?

Actually he took the girls back to north, then took the girls wait at the bottom of the hill. Then Bert come down and drive away. He goes, where is such and such? I said, his buddy taking the girls to Nancy. True, taking him to Nancy, And probably maybe half an hour later someone that they came rocking up as she was Sergeant Comfortable Larry. I don't I don't know whose offside it was. It was kind of Sargeant Larry's and somebody else is there. But first the same

She's dead.

Like we might judge it that with no problems, go for it. So I started at the bottom of the hill. Ye, And how was that?

So? So you just said to the policeman she's dead.

And then and the first is the ambulance driver, sorry, the ambulance drivers, because that was no, she's dead, mate, we might judge that. I'm not where were her face was a gargling the bubbles of blood where her face was?

I I don't know, honestly, that's what happened.

There.

Did you ever see your mate David be violent towards her?

No?

Actually nah, because.

But everybody gets come on, No, what are you trying to get get out of when you're trying to says different things?

But no, I just want you to tell the truth and not not protect just protect your mate.

Take my mate. I am he's dead, sir, I am, he's dead.

I exactly.

And now I wouldn't protecting if you don't know, I wouldn't. That's say that's a different thing. Would ever say I didn't do it? I didn't do just whatever, mate, Sorry, I'll get a bit. It's a hard subject to talk about, it.

Is, and I appreciate you answering some questions. It's good of you. So what do I go for?

Forget help? Because this is pretty understort on me as well. This is hard point.

It's hard to live with one of my wife because I don't know even how to go forwards after this, you know, So.

What do I do about this?

Now?

Do you need counseling?

Do you think we went to gownsling everything? Oh well, we can't really help you be able to give allways, all the scripture, medication and whatnot, just to give you whatever.

You'll be right.

I don't know saying something best but the head blowing off? No one will say that, sir.

Did David tell you why the doorknob to that bedroom was missing on the inside?

I don't even know. I don't even know.

Very strange, isn't it.

Well, ship that's opening with ten years ago? Now, how long has it been?

It's almost ten years?

Yeah, so it's over ten years a long time now.

You don't forget those sorts of things stuff?

Well, no, you don't know.

I don't.

Yeah, it's pretty fall on half he's had a good.

Day or pretty hard to get around it, isn't it. But yeah, yeah, we're just as you can imagine we're just trying to help the investigation and try to find the truth. Yeah, I understand that, and so you're obviously large part of that because you know you're a key to the whole story.

Yeah.

So have you ever thought about taking up that one million dollar reward and telling telling police, going back to police and telling them exactly what happened?

No, because the truth of the truth, Sir, the truth, the truth and always comes out.

And I made a lot. He does and he's all know that.

He's only the truth comes out.

We would like it or not.

It does, it will eventually, it does it, and I'm glad.

I'm actually I'm going to be there when it does, honestly, because I'm pointing back at yourself.

I told you so, Gareth. Why would a young mum like Amy? You knew Amy?

Yeah, I actually do not have what will still?

Yeah, yeah, she probably considered you a friend.

Actually, good mate. They actually they give me accommodation when when I can't even afford to pay my own power stuff like So she treated you well, Amy and Simo both they both David Sims and Amy, they both treated us both both populy ate, really good.

Give was someone to stay.

He always looked after us and were at fishing camp and hunt like, you know, just having fun, living life together. We hunting campen living, that's what you do together, mate.

So the least you can do is honor her graciousness by telling your truth. So, how does a young mum with two little girls that she loved is allegedly allegedly come on?

She shot herself? She shot herself thirty.

How does a young mum like that leave two of them in a car running with their bags packed to go to her mother's house. She goes into the house to get some more things, Your mate, David Simmons, goes back into the house. Next thing, she's found dead from a shotgun blast? How does that happen?

Twelve? Gage?

I poured ten?

How does that happen?

Yeah?

It is?

Yeah, Well you tell me, you're you know, you tell me because you were right there. Yeah, I told you, But you're not believing me, sir. I'm telling you everything I know, You're not still believing me. So I don't know what more he is on me to say, is.

Do you reckon? If the forensics had it turned up that night, if the detectives had have done their job. Do you reckon? There'd be a different answer, sir?

Can you answer the question yourself?

Do you think there'd be a different answer if the forensics did their job.

No, it wouldn't have been a different answer, sir, one hundred percent. No, it wouldn't have been as I know.

That for a fact.

What do you think David's own father told the ambulance operator he thought he son did it.

Because he's a map.

No, he didn't do it.

He didn't do it. Sorry, yeah, did ask me to you? Oh?

Mate?

I wanted to. I wanted the punish of men thinking in the first place. Mate, Because now, because Simili is a good buddy man, he is a good man, he wouldn't have done in the first place. But I know that for one hundred he wouldn't have done it. I'm telling you sorry, he would have done it. He would not have done it.

What do you mean he's a good man. He's assaulted the police officer. I spent nine months in jail for it. He's not a good man.

No, he's on drugs.

Made people drugs set people in. Drugs are dumb, mate, you know that.

Well, he might have been on drugs that day.

No, Well, no, he wasn't. I don't know. We had a few beers, mate, We had a few beers.

Honestly, how many he's a few games?

Well, I don't know. When you go over the mates, did you catch your beers?

You were with him all day?

I want to work.

How many beers I went to work?

I wouldn't, actually, I know I wouldn't, Big Pavement.

I was working three jobs, mate.

I was living in jail at album, I was working night shift the Cannon, Bubble Marcus Bony and Mute at night time. And I was on Big pavment during the days. So a boddy paying my rent, mate, right, that's what's going on. That's what's having a mate. And because my body egg sorry mate, ship, I was working tho jobs mate, you know what I mean. And he was working. He was working with his dad and stuff like, and both all the kids were hanging out to get no one big family mate.

They will be worried. But obviously she's But I don't know.

She must have got angry about something, mate.

She could have shot us all mate, but she didn't. She shot herself.

Oh, come on, she done it. She didn't even like shooting, you know that?

Liam is referring to the evidence provided by Brydon. We'll hear from him next episode.

David bought it. The fourteen was hers and the twenty two pick one was her gun. She had two guns, mate, she had two guns.

She loves shooting.

She loves skinning stuff.

Mate.

She loved or she loved hunting, pigs love camp I love fish and mate.

She did.

She loved all that honestly, she loved all that stuff. Mate.

Oh yeah, Gareth, two biomechanical experts, Yeah, both told the corner's court that the evidence was that someone else shot her.

Yeah, I heard this too. I actually did hear this as well.

But she's only a small woman.

The evidence proves what it's proven, and that's what it is.

Well, the evidence is that she had a right hand under a bottom.

Were you there, sir? Did you say the body? Were you there, sir?

What are you saying that's wrong?

Were you there, sir?

Are you saying that's right?

Were you there?

Did you say the body where it was?

Did you see her, her reathless corpse in the in the corner?

Did you say it?

No?

You didn't, did you There's a big day to day, But.

Yeah, I then flat out, Yeah, trying to make it live in the staffe and just a lot's going on, and this is a lot happening.

Well, I'm glad you're busy. Glad you're busy. Yeah, I got to So who was first in that room? You were, David?

Honestly true?

I said, what was that fun?

The next minute he went walking and he's opened the door and he came running out start of funding into this shed as you come around?

Is he alive?

Is she?

Is?

She alive? And I walked in there and I had to gin the door open.

Next minute I was saying, her sets like a corner right, yeah, corner of the last see sure that mate? And she was on the floor obviously here on the lab. Mate. Oh yeah, I said it was my I was a bud coming out of a blue mate. I don't know what more you're gonna say, but that's what that's what it was. I don't know's I'm getting old?

Hed? Sorry, are you on drugs now, Gareth?

Actually no, I'm not.

I'm sure.

Uh had a couple of beers today. Yeah, she held me intoxicated. You are drunk now, yes, I am, Uh that is I am compisicated.

I didn't mean having a crack at anything else of it. Ah, Nah, something a bit harder. Nah, you sure, I'm sure you seem pretty agitated.

Uh hortative on my day date.

So mutually diagnosedes that that's this is what I'm so always antsy and health is shitty and stuff. Even asked my doctors if you want to.

Believe me, I'm taking you on your word. You haven't got the shakes and the dis from having too many pipes.

Nah.

Okay, so you're comfortable. You're comfortable that you're gonna have to live with that as well.

We'll actually, we all got to live with this, sir. We actually, we will have to live with this.

It's got just to ask who actually to deal with it.

That's all the friends of her other side of the family, the daughters, they're the one who made a suffer in the most because they lost the mom and anybody dad, because because that made Simo lost yourself. But he's not he's not such same, he's not the same. Mate, he's gone since Mate, our Thames and that mates, simples. I don't know if you know similar and be able to give back to the reality again. Mate, that's on the

Well, you know some people, some people might think that your mate is a very lucky man.

Oh yeah, there this nine seven or ABC or ten seven seven.

Yeah, spotlight, spot Light and we're gonna have a podcast as well, Gareth. Oh here no around Australia. Oh yeah, Well it's good of you to at least front up and have a chat to us. So I appreciate that. Do you have trouble sleeping at night?

My life good, wife is good?

Life is good.

Well, if you're above the ground is good, isn't it if you're not not like if you're not you know or something, I don't know, you not like Amy? I know? Well there, yeah, but you can't help everyone to theirselves. Actually, we're all I love in the world for her. But no, I wouldn't even go to a funeral getting an invited to a ferneral But so I understand that.

Well A Kurna said it could also be homicide. So that's what an open finding is. They can't work out whether it's suicidal homicide.

Was the homicide?

Was it?

What's a homicide?

What do you think?

I don't know.

It's a murder, Gareth. Well, you know, if you if you are protecting your mate, it's a pretty low thing to do.

You know that.

When you special speak and you're asking the same question about me as well. Late, that's all.

Right, ask you the same question you ask. I'm happy to ask.

Eventually you will pop up.

This is true because a few days after this interview with Gareth, David Simmons is due to front court again, charged once again with assaulting a public officer. You'll hear that interview in a future episode.

He made him actually at a bit of a disagreement. She was living me for a little while. Yeah, and you know, just negative, negative energy doesn't go well. I don't like negative energy. It's not good for anybody. Leave nicely.

Okay, So you're not mates anymore.

We're still amaze.

I've got one hundred Yeah, he's my brother and whatever. But he didn't kill Amy. He did not shoot Amy. She shot herself one hundred percent.

I know that for a fact.

Yeah, it's pretty pretty incredible, though, isn't it. You want me to believe that it is free story. So you want me to believe that a mom puts her kids in the car to take them to her mum's place to escape the partner's behavior, which is pretty which is pretty average. Excuse me, I'm wait for it, wait for it. I'm painting your picture. And you know better than anyone,

You all open the door for us, we look at hand. We lost for help, Amy, what was this last pisonde? Open the door for her? I opened the door for she's getting Yeah, she'll just come out with bags and clothes and chuck them in the boot of the car.

She was, Yeah, it took them loads of clothes because she wanted to go go it.

Yeah, well, no one stop is doll cars the Semos plays don't drive stupid because it's a steep it's a steep driveway and.

You might look and crashing or something did stop her, didn't She don't stop herself. So yeah, so she just happened to go back inside. Yeah no, and commits suicide.

Yes, sir, it was a fourteenth bunch of darting at her self. At his honest truth, what was the fourteenth shot gun?

It's about as believable as me going around the back of your place now and finding fairies at the bottom of your pick.

Oh you perform a fairy Tell me about it?

Huh. I just want you to tell the truth. You know, it's about time you told the truth.

I told the truth.

Set.

When you watch Gareth during this interview, he appears to believe what he's saying. He believes his mate, but that doesn't mean he's right. Gareth also says Simo and Amy had a great relationship despite witnessing their very violent fight. Like everyone else connected to Amy's death, he's visibly haunted by what happened that night.

It's pretty clear that this has affected you as well.

Hey it is, Yeah, it has really I.

Mean you you are, you know, genuinely upset about it?

Yeah, I am.

I am actually genuinely upset. Yeah.

It's a problem with these things, isn't it. When these stories sort of go off the rails, they affect everybody involved. And I guess the only resolution is if we can somehow get to the truth.

Is spot on, And I think we're doing all the best part with what we can do and just trying to get down the bottom. And that's what I want to and that's what I hope before they get to and I will actually like at the end one day.

But apparently I.

Heard like every four years and this can be an interquesting or something like that.

And I don't think that's right. But the police investigation is open, so I hopefully they can whenever they can do extra things.

Because I heard because they have so mans and and they don't have so many charge like so many terms for them trying to prove it or something like, because it actually does get quiet much, you know, so how many more times do you reckon mis be the rest of my life? We can go on an investigation, Miller until it gets sort of like, is that what you're saying.

Well, unless they find new information to it happens new evidence, and yeah it sounds good. Yeah, I mean I mean who knows. I mean you might be able to help or or you or you might be part of the problem. I mean you might get arrested again.

Oh yeah, you see when it happens.

So how many times you've been arrested twice?

You probably get my record on the paper there. I haven't got out.

I'm asking you to be honest.

Honestly, I don't really know. I've been arrested.

For being complicit for aiding in a bedding. Bedding Well what they thought suspected at the time. Oh well no, what was murdered?

No, only being locked up? Well I've had a motivated a bush one time.

No, I'm talking about Amy.

Oh yeah that was the forty eight hours. Yeah, they've got to do their job. Is you going to do a job. I understand that I ain't gonna.

Sweet as do your job. It's all good, no problem here. Yeah, I've got nothing, so buddy, yeah, broblems take care.

Thanks for having a chat.

FI.

As you've heard in this podcast, Larry Blandford reckons Gareth was schooled in his answers.

But now when you look at it, it's actually really sad.

Allison shows him the interview I did with Gareth and this is what he had to say.

Yeah, well, Gareth, I believe is a sucked in victim's You know, he's taken a stand which.

Has been in the jar before and he seems to be in that world right, So.

Yeah, well he shouldn't be that because he's.

Not that bad a bloke.

Larry says, Gareth has wasted his life.

Do you see that much with people? Or is Gareth kind of the saddest case?

I think for what for what I've seen on your laptop, he would be Yeah, for sure. Now I haven't seen him for a few years, but it's not pleasant for what he's gone through and he's taken a hard stand on it.

Is it a case that you think this is really affected him as well?

Oh, the whole incident has definitely affected him. It's probably affected his whole family.

Yeah.

Well, when someone's down, well everybody around him is not.

He's not jumping for joy, are they?

No, he didn't fuck it, He didn't do it.

After ten years, Gareth appears convinced he's right about his mate.

Almost no, because Simi is a good buddy man.

He is a good man. He wouldn't have done in the first place. But I know that for one hundred percent he wouldn't have done it. I'm telling you, sorry, no, he would have done it. He wouldn't have done it.

Big enough to do that. Family need to let it go next week, Joshua Brighton.

I don't need to keep going through this ship Keith Betting through that day mm hmm Lisser c so detion.

We both know for now.

You mek.

T.

If you knew Amy and have information, any information about her death, we'd love to hear from you. Just email us at the Truth about Amy at seven dot com dot au. That's s e v E N The Truth about Amy at seven dot com dot Au, or visit our website sevenews dot com dot au forward slash the Truth about Amy. You can also send us an anonymous tip at www dot the Truth about Amy dot com.