The Things We Do... - Interview with Sophia McGregor

I'm not trying to train people, but it does. You realize even when people are tech experts and stuff, and I've talked to people who worked in tech departments and stuff, a lot of them don't know. The moment they're in front of a mic, they're used to micing other people up. At the moment they sit in front of something themselves, they're like, I don't know what I'm doing. I'm like, you've done this for like 30 years. But no one knows what they're doing.

I guess mics that I'm familiar with, the idea is to hide them and not see them. Yeah, I know. Acting one of them. I'm like, someone's not doing their job right. Yeah, it's like, you know, it's like boom and shot and you're like, this should not be right. This is the Things We Do podcast, a podcast about film life, television culture, mental health and all of that fun jazzy stuff. Today I've got my special guest and friend, Sophia McGregor. Hello. Hi. Hello.

I feel like when I said that so tightly, it didn't feel natural. But your name, I love it. Everything about it is like, where did McGregor come from particularly? Well, McGregor, it's, I mean, it's, that's my clan. We're Scottish. I just, I mean, our ancestors are, you know, Irish, Scottish, British sort of, you know, amalgamation. We've done a little bit of ancestry with my family. Oh nice. Yeah, but we love McGregor. We love our last name. I think it reflects our family really nicely.

And we look like McGregor's, so that works. I know you're very distinctly like red, strawberry, sort of like blonde. Yeah. You know, that sort of auburn almost as well. I imagine it's like very seasonal when your hair can kind of be more auburn. Yes, I think it's also, yeah, we're from Queensland. So our hair always throws like that, the brighter colours during the sun, like the sunny months as well. Yeah. How long have you lived in Sydney now? I'd say four and a half years, something like that.

We came down in 2019. Oh, okay. Whatever that is. Yeah. Yeah. But it's felt not that long because of COVID. It's felt like maybe two years. Oh my god. Yeah, I know, I looked at my calendar the other day and I was like, I've done so much in like four years, but it does not feel like time has passed. No. Actually. Yeah. There was two years there where I felt very stagnant and I wasn't moving.

And then this year actually feels like such a refreshing push forward into where I want to go from like not moving anywhere for ages. Yeah, right. Yeah. That's awesome though. I like it. I'm going to first ask you off the bat of the question, the biggest question that everyone in their ears probably are curious about. I'm going to get you to tell everyone in the audience who you are and what you do. Well, who I am, I am 25 years old and I am an identical twin.

That's a big part of who I am, my best friend, Molly. I was raised by a single mum. Wow. I'm a Queenslander. I think in Sydney it's important to say that because there's a lot of Sydney sliders here and they think they're in a little bit of a bubble. And I'm an actor. Which you know, all around like that's so cool. And your sister, your twin is also an actor. Yeah, we both originally when we were in grade nine or something that we decided, oh, we want to be actors.

And then that's why I moved to Sydney just to kind of further along our careers. And then Molly was like, do you know what? I'm a little bored. It was just before COVID started becoming a problem. And she's like, oh, well, maybe I'll apply for afters, the Australian Film and Television Radio School. And she did that and she got in and now she's in her third year. She's about to graduate with a BA in production. That is so cool. It's awesome.

That is, I think because we already had so much experience with acting, it really, she had a lot of stuff behind her when she joined, like started the course. Yeah. And so she's just excelled. That's awesome. She's great. She's really, she's a fantastic director, assistant director. Yeah, she can do it all.

Those are all the fundamental skills and I feel like something that, especially when you do acting and you sort of move into those roles particularly is very beneficial because it's like the basic principles, I guess we learn as kids is how to act. And then like, you know, whether it's drama class or anything like that, and then, you know, you just build like, you know, drawing and, you know, and arts and crafts and stuff like that. So I feel like, yeah, it's just a natural progression. It is.

And I think there's people in her class, or she's talked about people in her class who have had trouble directing actors. It's something that they teach and is a part of their syllabus. But Molly found it very easy. And I think it's because she had the perspective of what it means to be an actor in that space, especially a film space where you're not coming in with a lot of rehearsal. It's literally you're just sitting there and you're waiting for that direction.

And if it doesn't come, or if it doesn't hit the way the actor needs it to, then you're not going to get what they want the filmmakers. Yeah. Yeah. And it comes down to like, it's a layer effect. It comes down to casting. It comes down to like, you know, clear communication and also clear vision. A lot of the time, like, yeah, and just being good at communicating.

Yeah. I think filmmakers, directors, they're probably just generalizing on the quieter side and or maybe just not as aware of how to communicate or as confident in that space. Whereas actors are probably the complete opposite generally, at least in that space. They're confident within their role to express themselves wherever they need to go. If that's really big or if they need to be really emotional, they're present and ready for that.

Whereas directors have been focused for so long on the pre-production, on all of this clerical stuff, on their vision, how they're going to get it done. By the time they get there, sometimes they can forget that they need to emotionally connect to people in order to portray the actual feeling. Otherwise, it's just words on a page. And then you can get them rambling, which can just, all it does is just confuse everyone. It doesn't help. So just need to be clear and concise.

It's interesting as well because I feel like whenever I've directed something, it's sort of gone either way. I think sometimes you can get a bad result if you under rehearse and then sometimes I think you can get a bad result if you over rehearse because then you lose any sense of — There's a sweet spot. There's a real sweet — Just when the actors get comfortable, you do one more take and then move on. Hopefully that's it.

Yeah, no. I've been on a few sets where people are trying to do 12 takes and stuff. I'm like, you are burning people out. This comes to a point where you're not going to get a different version of what's happening. It depends on what genre you're doing. But if the scene and the actors are great at improv and you can make something new consistently, then 12 takes would be great. But generally, you're sticking to some sort of dramatic script.

There's something that you're building to and if the actors having to build to that consistently can be draining. You're talking about natural experience right there. A little bit. Yes. I mean, like when — because how old were you when you started acting? Molly and I were in grade five. My mom put us in a theater. It was a local theater in Harvey Bay where we used to live. And we do classes weekly. And then that would build to like showcases every semester or something. That's awesome.

Yeah. And so we started with theater up until grade eight. And then that's when we moved to Brisbane for our rest of schooling. And that's when we had that move also was us deciding that we want to be more serious about it. And then our father, who we have a semi relationship with, he just happens to be an agent. And I think we were getting more older and more ready for that sort of space. And that's when we moved into more filmmaking side of things, right? And then theater side of stuff.

Yeah. I mean, that's awesome, though. I mean, downside a little bit of the estranged father. He's fine. We've closed that off. He is who he is. That sounds like a can of worms. Well, it's not. Yeah. I mean, the can of worms is that not everyone's perfect, including the people who brought you into this world. But I'm an adult now and I have a great mom who raised me. Yeah. Which, you know, like single mom, you know, with two kids. Yeah. Molly and I were never wanting.

So it's not like I have a strained relationship where I was like, oh, he didn't give me something. I'm like, he's just a guy. He did his best. That's all I can ask for, really. I mean, they do the best kind of, you know, relation. But it also sounds like your mom was very much an advocate to make sure that you two had a very like, you know, happy and comfortable life as well as doing the things that you wanted to do and love doing.

Yeah. Because I mean, like that, especially when you're a single mom, that can be a challenge. You know, you say you're not wanting, but that's also like, as any parent, you want what's best for your kids. Yeah. And when the decision for us to go and start doing theatre was from my sister and I being fairly shy, Molly more than me. She was one of those kids who would just cry really easily.

I wasn't far off, but I think with twins, you always have like the yin and yang situation where one is essentially taking the brunt of being stronger for the other person. But I think at that point in life, she was just very emotionally vulnerable. So mom was like, we need to kind of help with their confidence a bit. She put us in there.

And it was very important, I think, just even if we weren't going to be actors, I think it really helped with this communication and finding something that you feel comfortable in. Because Molly and I, we did instruments like she did violin for years, I did drums, like we had creative outlets, but they didn't really give us that full freedom that we needed because they are, you know, there are limitations. You've got to do this in this the right way.

Or I think with acting, it's all about expression and doing it however you think is right. Yeah. Which I think is what we were missing. Yeah. It's very interesting you say that as well, because I feel like, yeah, it's such an expressionism, possibly also why I should have love it and hate it. But I mean, also, I think it's one of those things that when you do train in it, and I used to do acting in Australian theatre for young people and stuff like that.

So I did a lot of community theatre growing up. But I think one of the things I really liked was, I remember particularly in drama school was presenting, was just kind of doing what I'm doing now. Those are the things I loved because it was talking to people and it was, you know, and getting reactions from audience, which I always think is quite fun. And I always liked, you know, being like the narrator and stuff. And that's, I can't remember the Australian play for the life of me.

It's very famous Australian play where this writer goes and tries to direct a play in a prison or like, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not cosy, is it? I think it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's based the players, Cosentino, some opera. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I love that because yeah, Cosy's great because Barry Otto's in it. And I know Barry, he like lives in my suburbs. Oh really? Yeah. It's, and he's just the sweetest man. And yeah, he's a great Australian actor as well.

And that movie that's based off the play is so good. And I think it's one of the only things that has continuously like held up because it was made in the nineties or something. Yeah. It's got Tony Collette in it. It's got David Wenham in it, I think. Yeah. Like all these amazing Australian actors and Barry Otto, of course, doing an amazing performance as well. Yeah. And it's a great, great, like fun thing to do, especially with like, you know, in performance. So we got to do that.

It's like all different character characters in it. Yeah. And I think it just kind of like, you have a lot of things to play with, especially like I played the guy who was the, you know, the writer and director.

And I think even then it was sort of reacting because normally in drama class, I get a lot of the quirky characters as well, but they were like, one of my friends was like, no, play the straight character because everyone around you then gets to be completely bonkers and you're great acting across from everyone being the straight person. I was like, all right, cool. And it was just the most surreal thing.

Because I remember we did, we, because I went to Sydney secondary college and it was split into two schools. We did it in Lycart High School, which was, and then we had to go and perform it again at Blackwater Bay, which was where year 11 and 12 were. So we did this performance at the big school in front of year 11 and 12 kids. It was terrifying. And you were younger. We were younger at the time. So we were in year nine.

So it was like one of the most, you know, cause you know, anyone who doesn't know Australian sort of like social things, everyone says, you're not in a shithead. But it's, it was kind of one of those things that you went on stage and I remember everyone was terrified. Like we were all like, Oh God, are they going to think we suck? That would be so scary. I would hate to perform solely for older kids.

Yeah. It's like, and also like these are some kids who are planning to do this for their careers and are judging people who have not even established themselves as knowing what they want to do entirely. So it was like this dread of pressure and we were all sweating and like, Oh man, it was, it was an interesting experience. But I do think that that really taught me the fun side as well of just performing people you don't know, people with a lot more experience than you potentially.

And throwing yourself in the deep end. Like you know, I think that's the joy of like the arts is you always get to throw yourself into these scenarios. And I think it's also good doing that when you're in school, because that's the time in your life when you're starting to retreat more, especially high school, you're retreating, you're retreating and then your drama class, you're at theater school, whatever it is, is pushing you in the opposite direction, which is really good.

Cause if that's your only outlet during the week of being able to express yourself or like just speak louder than a normal voice, you know, like just to yell or scream. That's really important to get that out. Because otherwise you're just bottling it and bottling it.

I think it's, I think it's also like, you know, cause you hit the nail on the head as well with that as well, because you know, young teenager, you as well as you and Molly, like, you know, and you talk about like, you know, being shy and what was your teenage years like? Was it, was it very like, focus a lot on, you know, you know, interest in sex and life and everything, or was it still very focused on like drama? It's weird.

Molly and I, we watch, we consume a lot of TV and film and everything. So we've seen all of the coming of age movies. I love them. I'll watch them still now. And I, we've always been very like not adult, but very, and I don't like to say we're mature for our age or anything, but we, I think, I don't know what it was, but we, we didn't, we weren't reaching for all of those things that other teenagers, really archetypal teenagers are. I don't drink now.

I barely drunk any alcohol when I was in high school. Like I did, I didn't even, I barely experimented. I maybe had a little bit of alcohol and was like, do you know what? This actually tastes gross. I'm not going to drink it. And then you have people saying, well, if we keep drinking it, it starts to taste still good or you're going to get whatever, fearless way. And I was like, I'm actually good.

Yeah. I don't know what that says about me or whatever, but I did, I definitely wasn't looking for any sort of like, I don't know, heightened energy. I was really happy with where I was, at least in like the social aspect for, to an extent. I would say I was, I'm, I was still, I was shy in high school or at least quiet. Molly was, could make friends way easier than I could.

I don't know why that was, but, um, cause we were very similar in most ways, but mum put us in different classes when we were in primary school, um, which meant we made our own friends. And so we actually didn't hang out with each other at lunchtimes. We had our own groups. We would do our own thing. And, and then when it went to high school, because we were so similar, that's when we started, you know, maybe being a class or two together.

And then we'd spend our lunchtimes together because Molly would make friends easier. And I would just be like, that person's my friend now too. And all my long-term friends were Molly's friends first. Um, yeah. And yeah, that's just, cause I think I, as a person, I just don't throw all my eggs in the basket for new people. Yeah. I'll hold it back a bit. Whereas I think Molly is so lovely and open.

She'll be more welcoming to new people, which is more, I think it puts other people at ease quicker. Yeah. Um, yeah. And so I think that meant that like, by, by the time I got to year 12, that's when you kind of lose a lot of those friends that you had when you were in grade nine, you know, you, you start to think about who you want to be more, which means other people start, or you start distancing yourself from people.

And so when it got to year 12, I had like one friend and it was, I was kind of sad and depressed, but, um, I, I, I mean, I, I didn't mind it because I didn't want to be like close with all those people I went through with, you know, you, and then when you leave high school, you don't talk to any of them. Maybe one or two. And now it's been, oh gosh, I graduated in 2014. Can you do that math quickly? That is eight years. Eight years. It's been eight years.

Yep. One of my best friends who actually didn't go to the same school for a majority of that time. She's still my best friend. Um, well, two of them are, um, they both live in Queensland though. So we, our relationships are like still there and still very present, but they're distant and they're different because we're, you know, it's all online at the moment. Um, but other than that, it's yeah. Like maybe on Instagram and that's it.

Yeah. I mean, it's, it's the handful of people like, I, you know, and it's funny, I feel like I'm like you as well.

I can put too many of my eggs in one basket and you know, trust people blindly, but it also, um, I do wear my heart on my sleeve, which you know, is a detriment as well because it can, um, from experience, you know, burn bridges and, or, you know, cause I think there's a good thing about being nurturing and caring and everything, but there's also a good thing about being reserved and not going, okay, I'm not going to rush into new people.

I'm not going to be like, Oh, here is my open floor plan and tell you everything about myself. Well, I think I've just in the past, you know, when you, I think you're similar to me in the way that if you like a subject and you, and someone's open to listening to you, you talk and talk and talk and talk and talk. And maybe, maybe then you leave that situation and you go, why did I say that one thing?

Why did I give them all that information about myself when I don't think they actually deserved it? Um, or maybe they didn't even want it. Um, and I go, Oh, I don't think that person was really the right person to give all that information to about me. And now they know all that and I feel kind of weird about it.

Um, so I think when I, and that happened a lot when I like the year after I graduated, I was like, I'm, I don't know if these people actually either like me that much or if they're the right people that deserve all of this, all of me. And then once I started realizing that, and in most cases I was right, I was like, you know what, I'm actually gonna, you know, step back a bit and just let, let the right people in or at least think about it more.

Yeah. I mean, like, I think, um, I'll let you open the water bottle. So you can have a simple, we make more noise. I love the subtlety of your like down here. Um, yeah, I, I, it's interesting as well, because I feel like with people and, and, and the way people function, um, especially for me, I think it was like, I got very excited and, and it's something about my, like, um, the way my brain's, why, which was like, I have intention deficit hyperactivity disorder, which is fine.

It's mouthful, but, um, generally a lot of people assume that, you know, they, what they find odd about it is the hyperactivity side and the excited side. They don't know what to do when someone's really passionate about something. So a lot of the time when someone would be like, Oh, Marty, you've watched that film. What did you think? And I'll be like, someone's talking to me about a film that I love. Yes. I'm going to tell them everything about the film.

And then you'd realize halfway through the conversation, they're like, well, that's a lot of information. I really don't care anymore. I just wanted to know if you liked it or not. Like that's all I cared about. And I started to realize like a lot of people didn't like it things the way I saw it. And I was like, Oh God, am I like really just annoying people with all this information that I love? It's hard. It's so hard. Cause it makes you feel like, Oh gosh, I've, I don't know.

It just puts a lot of your personality on someone else really quickly. And I know exactly what you mean. I, I think my personally has personality has changed because of how many times that happened when I was younger. And maybe for like the detriment, I think that person who like has that passion is a great person and should be like, uh, congratulated for how much they care about something.

And the more you kind of beat yourself down for those things, the more you're going to feel shit about yourself. And do you know what, like who cares in the end, like those people, they're going to literally walk out of that situation and forget about it. Like it's not going to impact them. It's only impacting you because you care so much about how other people feel about you and how you, how you make them feel.

And that's, it's hard, but I'm, I'm also trying to like be kind to, to, kinder to myself in those situations because like, why not? Like why can't, like, why can't you just express how, how much you love something? A hundred percent. I mean, it's also, it's one of those things that I think society is massively changing, but it's sort of one of those things that I think is such a, you know, should be switched from a negative 10 to a positive 10.

Because I, you know, when I meet people who are interesting, I often call them weird or strange. And I always mean that in a positive way, because it's better to be weird and different than it is to be like the sheep that everyone's the same. Because I find people when we go through like life and stuff like that, and everyone watches the same shows. And it's like, particularly when people binge watch stuff and they're like, I remember the first time like Stranger Things and stuff came out.

I refused to watch it because I didn't want to have conversations like everyone else. I was just like, I'm going to leave this for a year, give not, I'm very bad with like people telling me to watch shows. I just watch them in my own time, but it's the same with books. Like if you tell me to watch or read something really specific and you go, you'll love this, it'll take me ages till I actually get around to it. Cause it's the hype.

But I think, um, that's why I try not to over hype things for people. I try not to get too disappointed because I always go into it with my own reflection and go, this is good. I enjoyed it. You might not, or you know, like anything like that. But I mean, also at the same time, um, you know, I, I think it's being, you know, 30 now, I stopped giving a shit about like so many people's opinions.

Um, in, you know, in good ways when there were sort of like, cause I knew a lot of people and I, you know, my partner had described it very, um, very accurately, which is fair with the friends, you know, people who come in and out of your life and, you know, and this whole like idea of, you know, close friends who then don't become close friends or, you know, like situations and circumstances change.

And we define ourselves entirely based on, you know, I guess how many people we have on socials and, you know, like stuff like that, which we were talking about before we started recording, which I think is a bit silly because it's how many people are actually in our life as you know, like, and how many people actually remember, you know, like that today is actually my birthday and they've not just looked on Facebook and gone, oh shit, it's your birthday.

Like it's people who are actually just sort of very, you know, aware, a bit more self aware and they put the effort in and you put the effort in back to them. That's how you develop actually good foundations. Um, but yeah, when I go out to people and I go, I like this thing. And then I hope that even in, you know, like if I'm at work, um, it's sometimes very strange because people will talk to me about things and I'm very quiet at work.

I'm the most quiet person at work and everyone tells me about their life, what they're doing. And I'm like, this is the place where I just want to switch my brain off. Look at my phone. I'm not trying to be rude, but I just don't care. But then I remember being that person and doing the exact same thing, you know, and feeling the exact same way to other people. It's a very hard thing as an adult to do and, but it's self preservation as well.

Like would you, would you say like, you're very good at being honest now about like when you need, you know, like you don't need someone obsessing in front of you or getting too excited? I think so. I mean, to be honest, I haven't often been on the receiving end of that. In the past, you should be the one who's, you know, talking my mouth off to someone about something. Um, I love your honesty there. That's a better, I can't, I can't picture it.

Um, but, uh, I think, yeah, I think I am more reserved now and I, cause I go, I don't know, I think I got a lot of feedback in high school that maybe I was, I mean, you can do easy comparisons to my sister, so maybe I was the bitchy one, but that was just me not talking, you know, or holding myself back. And, um, that affected me a little bit. And I was aware of that for many, many years.

And I think it's gotten to the point where me being aware of that has made me more, um, shy, which isn't a bad thing. I'm fine with being more shy, but it just means that in situations like at work and stuff, I won't be the first person to talk. Um, which I'm okay with for now. And I think being asked questions is, I don't mind that being, being, um, involved in a conversation I love, but maybe when it's something's put on me, um, too quickly, I'll go red.

I'll get too blushed and be like, Oh gosh. Um, I have people staring at me, but that's only in my personal life. It's not when I'm acting, when I'm acting, I'm very, you know, open and different. Which is cool and interesting because I mean, like that's, that's the unique position you're in. Um, but I mean, like, it's interesting that you say that, but you're going to assume you're bitchy and, or, you know, I would say that's past tense.

I don't think that's any more now, but I think that affected how I have kind of evolved over the years. Yeah. I think it's interesting though, because I would, you know, from face value and stuff and you know, correct me if I'm very wrong. Um, but I think, you know, you remind me a lot of elements of me as well, very similar because it's sort of like reserved, but also, you know, warm and kind. You just kind of got to like get to know, like one of my closest friends is the exact same way.

Like she is just, when we met first thing, we didn't have a lot to say to each other. And then over the years, like now she's like one of my closest friends and we talk all the time, but it's sort of like, yeah, it was like chipping away. The layers of just like, okay, let you a little bit in now, let you a little bit in there and a little bit in there and sort of like slowly, you know, unraveled. But I think so. Yeah. I get that.

If we were some type of animal, we'd be something that was trepidatious. Yeah. You know, switching you things like a cat or something. That's yeah. Yeah. Um, but I mean, like it's interesting because you have that juxtaposition of your sister. Um, and you did that. She's not outgoing though. Like she's not like, she's not like, woo, like she's not that, but I think just comparatively, she's more, um, you know, able to let herself go in those, you know, situations.

I love how high in the defense you went on. Like, I just don't, if she were to hear this, she's going to be like, what are you talking about saying that I'm some sort of like life of the party? Like she's, she's definitely just more open, I would say in new situations.

I mean, like, but did that affect you as well, because, you know, like you must've gotten so much, you know, good and bad scenarios due to the fact that being, you know, twins and stuff, and especially being female, was there a lot of comments at school about, you know, inappropriate stuff that was thrown at you or was it very much very, you know, PC? Um, there was weird things that like every now and then someone would be like, do you guys wear the same underwear? Do you share underwear?

And we'd be like, what are you talking about? No. Um, but, uh, other than that, not really. Like I think mum was really smart in putting us in different classes because that let us be our own people for those younger years, which was really important. I think if I, or my, if I was to ever have twins, I would do the exact same.

Yeah. It's so important because we spend so much time together having that separation in order to be, to be alone in social situations is so important because that's how everyone else lives their lives. They go to school by themselves. They sit in a class by themselves, but for the most part, I'll sit beside my sister in nearly every situation. And having that separation is so important to evolve as a person.

So I don't think we had any of that, like kind of weird comments, especially when you're younger. I don't know. I think we went to, we did a diploma at New York film Academy at village Racho studios on the Gold Coast in 2015. So the year after we graduated high school and we were in, we weren't in classes together, but we were in the same cohort together. And so we were called the twins, which I'd never been called before.

Wow. Just because we hadn't been in that sort of situation where we'd be together so often. And I didn't really like that. The people who were saying it, of course, were our friends, our peers, like they had no, they were like, they didn't think of anything of it. But I just remember being like, I don't like being called the twins. It means that we're, we're something different or we're something other or we're something, twins can be often portrayed in film and TV as gimmicks.

They are the butt of some sort of joke about just being almost in a way how like little people are in that sort of like circus or freaky vibe where it's like, that's not really what the reality is. It's just weird. And so when I, when we started getting called the twins, I was like, ah, I'd rather not. And that's when I would like, I started getting a nickname instead. They call me Fi or Fia. And I think that is where my, cause I was always just called Sophia when I was younger.

And I think it was me trying to be like, Hey, you could call me this instead. Or like, like I'm an individual who has like, who can have a nickname rather than just be like, Oh, they're both the twins. Like where are the twins? The twins are over there. Like weird. Oh my God. I mean, like, yeah, cause I'm really glad about that because you do see a lot of the time in, in movies and stuff and it's portrayed horribly, especially in the late 90s. It's just lazy. It's so lazy.

If the amount of people when I was like an actor, like just doing auditions and stuff when I was young, a little bit younger, who were like, Oh, I have this great idea. You and your sister, you're creepy. We have you standing side by side in matching dresses. Am I? Okay. No. It's the most unoriginal, um, shining sort of gimmick and it's boring. Even in the shining. I mean, I've read the book. They're actually not twins. They're just sisters in the film.

They hired two twins who actually look more fraternal than me. They don't even look identical. So the whole concept is just, but I always know what I love about that. And particularly is because visually you do remember it because of the similar outfits, but I, you know, I didn't look at their faces in the film. To be honest, I just looked at the fact that they were identical same outfits. One's a little bit taller than the other. Oh, sorry. There you go.

One's a little bit wider face, but you know, I pick up on that stuff. Yeah, you're an actor. But I mean, like, you know, it's interesting that you say that as well, because I think, you know, like memory, like my memory thinks of the parent trap, you know, but with Lindsay Lohan playing herself. Both characters. Yeah. There's not a lot of examples of twins acting. Yeah. There's been some more interesting stuff.

I saw a trailer a few weeks ago of there's those musicians, Tegan and Sarah, who are identical twins. Yes. And they've got a TV show or a film or something about their lives. And though their characters play by identical twins, I was like, oh, that's really refreshing. Yeah. Those actual real twins. Usually it's one actor who's in some sort of split screen, which I think is kind of like, yeah, they're great actors.

But there are so many good actors who are also twins who could have done those roles. Yeah. And it's a bit lazy. I think I also agree with you in terms of horror and or, you know, like romance films and stuff. And it just tends to be that the twins don't, they're the same person, just copy and paste and then hope that that. Yeah. Well, I think for one, an actor would be like, oh, yeah, I get to like be two different people.

That's so much interesting sort of juicy work as an actor that you get to do. So much good research, so much character building. I can see that. And you also have the perspective of the production being in producers being like, we get to just to pay one person or we are paying two people. So usually they're going to pick the one if it's a good actor. So I fully understand that sort of stuff. I just think we are now in like, we've seen all that sort of stuff.

There's only room for something more original in you. And the only way to do that is to just hire two twins. Yeah. But we've already seen all that stuff. A good twin thing, but again, it's one actor is Mark Ruffalo in I Know This Much To Be True. Yes. It's like a limited series and it was the first time I've ever seen like twins portrayed so beautifully and genuinely about how they really, how you really are with the other person. And it's, it's a really hard, I only watched it by myself.

I couldn't, I don't think I could watch it with Molly because it's, it's quite a harrowing of a series, but it's, it's really important to show like how beautiful that relationship is rather than just focusing on the physical, what it looks like from an outside point of view, you know, just, oh, look, they look identical. That's so weird. They're the same person. It's like, no. Yeah. I think that's also, I remember like a lot of conversations.

I don't know if this was just in high school, but it was always about dating and everyone be like, oh, are you going to date twins and stuff? Weird. It's so weird. Like I can understand, the only way I can understand that, and I have, we've seen it before. We'll real people do do that. It's only because there's a shared understanding of what it means to be a twin. That's, that's the only way I can see where that works.

It's like, okay, those two people understand what it means to be us and how close we are is how close those two are together. And I think there's something there that would make it easier for you to connect with the individual of those two. Like being like, oh, we understand each other because we've both had these very similar experiences.

I can understand how that could happen and then happen for both of the twins in both of the sets, but it's still weird when I, in that movie with Amanda Bones, when she's in London, there's Peach and Pear or something and they're identical twin girls and they're like sub characters. Their little happy ending is they meet twin boys who have an equally silly name and they're like, oh, we're in love. Because they're also freaks who are identical twins.

It's so laughable and weird because usually you'd want someone who's your own, like with Molly, like I want mine, my other significant other, you know, very separate to whatever Molly wants. Like maybe we have similar like people that we find attractive, but we have very separate ideas of like who that's going to be for each other.

Yeah. It's pretty sibling situation as well, but yeah, it would be very kind of like, I imagine people put you into categories and being like, oh, your sister's dating this person, so therefore you must like the same person. Yeah, which isn't true. No. I think everyone that Molly's dated, I wouldn't date. But you know what? She's broke, like she's not with anyone right now, so I think she has realized that too. It's just the long process, isn't it?

Yeah. But I mean, like, you know, I feel like that's also really good because I mean, yeah, we fall into these traps, especially, you know, situational now and we are breaking away from them the older we get, especially with like, you know, not having tropes as much and people having individual personalities, which is astonishing because, you know, like it's what, only taken us 20 years?

Well, it's just funny that people can live their lives never having to defend who they are and that they have a personality. Whereas my whole life I've had to defend the fact that I have a personality. I am a person who is separate from another person. Yeah. Yeah. Not so much now that I'm adult, because like you said, I'm not in those situations where people would just randomly ask you those questions.

But you know, when you're in high school, when you're like studying, you are constantly in situations where you're meeting new people who ask these kind of silly or weird questions where they're like, Oh, are you and your sister like identical in every way? The answer is no. Like, like you're looking at me right now. I'm I'm not connected to my sister. So no. Does your hair fall the exact same way? Yeah, like, like, it's so tiring. Yeah, go. Oh, like, no. And that's it.

When I was younger, I tried to give like witty answers, but now I don't care because it's like, just like ask me something interesting. But if you like, you know, that's when people fall, you know, out of and I mean, it's very frankly, people just become very boring. Because if you can't ask anything original or you know, then what's the point? Like, you know, ask questions that are immediate to the person in front of you and matter. At least.

I mean, it's hard because not everyone's around twins all the time. So it can be very easy to ask questions that we've heard before. But I think as long as you're sincere, then there's no problem. If it's something I've heard before. Fine. If you're actually being kind and answering something from a place of like, you actually want to know all like you're honest about it, then sure, I'll answer your question. But if it's just you being like, oh, do you guys know, read each other's thoughts?

And you say it without an intention, which is like, it's like half a joke. Yeah. But it's a joke that that person has heard someone else say before. And so they think it's funny. It's just weird. You know what I'm watching at the moment? I started watching today was the midwitch cuckoos, which is on Stan. It's got Keeley Hawes in it, who's amazing. I love and I watched her like, since I was growing up, one of my favorite actors, but I watched it.

And you automatically made me think of it, which is all creepy children. Like the entire village is just creepy, like three to five year olds. But then it's just kind of like, I remember the book, which was written by John Wyndham was about all the good kids looked the same. Like the whole point of the book was they all had blonde hair. They all had blue eyes, didn't matter who the parents were. They all came out the same.

And that was a creepy thing about it because they were alien esque and they had telepathic powers and everything. But this was written in the fifties and they've updated it now to where the kids kind of look similar, but they don't, but they all have weird glowing eyes. And I kind of think it loses what was weird about the actual, you know, book, which was all the kids did look the same. They had, they weren't just like identical twins. They were all born from different parents.

And therefore it was just a really weird anomaly that they all have to have blonde hair and blue eyes. And that's cool. I think like, I'm not saying that being twin is like annoying or weird. I think it's, I love looking like Molly. I think she's beautiful, you know, like I, and I think it's really interesting as well. It's rare. That's the thing.

That's why people love it because it's, it's not something that happens that often where, where you, where you have people who look so similar to each other, which is why it's really cool to see that. I mean, portrayed in TV. Yeah, I think and portrayed accurately. That would be so hard to do though. The writer, like the, whoever, like the production company, they were probably like, how could we possibly have 50 children looking exactly the same without doing CGI? And that's just so much money.

I, it was, there is a 50s version, which is called Village of the Damned if anyone wants to iTunes it. It's like, it only works because it's black and white.

You can get around a lot of logistical errors, but because we're at like modern television and also just, I feel like we're going into this era with like, you know, the whole premise as well as a, is very absurd, but it basically that like the premise is that a tall town go to sleep overnight and every the next 12 hours, every woman wakes up who is, um, you know, like at birth, like, and the point is if you were born a woman at birth and you,

and you're a child at an age, you can have a kid like you were, you are now suddenly pregnant. That's horrifying. It's so horrifying because like I'm two episodes deep and all these women just like the moment they were about to go and, you know, and trigger warning if this is for anyone, but they were about to go and get abortions and they suddenly, the child within them controlled them and made them leave. And I was like, what the shit? It like, it's so weird.

I don't know if I could watch that. It's so weird. It's unsettling. And I feel like, um, I was reading and, um, you know, uh, like blog about it or something and today and someone was like, basically there's no like the autonomy in this, in this show is basically out the window. No one has any rights. These poor women. Yeah, I know. I was like just feeling sorry for every woman in this town was just going, cause half the husband's like, no, we'll keep the child. It's fine.

I'm like, don't say that. Let's get rid of these creepy situation. It just sounds awful. Yeah. It's stressful. Yeah. I know. Cause there were like a couple, I think it was really good because they had a couple of like 16 year old looking girls who were suddenly pregnant and 15 year olds. And I'm like, Oh my God. Yeah.

Um, you know, and that's the, like the thing I think that works about, especially about like modern modern television now is I do think it's a detriment is when it's too politically correct. Like we've moved into such a PC. Um, you know, have you seen, cause I talk about it all the time, but cancel culture is a huge thing that I find very baffling to this day.

Um, because it's used either very aggressively, like through, you know, Twitter where, you know, trolls are going, Oh, I hate women and stuff. And then getting blown up and they should be like, you know, like publicly displayed and going, you're an awful human being.

And then the other side of the coin is just people, um, you know, uh, trying to cancel things that are 50, 60 years old, that don't have this, you know, should have a plaque notice at the beginning of it saying this was made in an era where this was acceptable. Please ignore if you don't feel comfortable watching certain scenes, please mute them. I think they did that with Gone with the Wind. They did.

Yeah. Yeah. Which I think is important because you know, you get to those scenes or stuff now and you go, Oh gosh, that's really, that's crazy. And then you're pulled out of it because you're now having conversation with the person next year with like, Jesus, like what are we watching right now? Um, so I get that with old stuff and old movies and things like that. Um, I think who was it recently? Was it Ian McKellen or someone?

He said something really poetic that I can't remember about saying the word isn't cancel culture. It's something else. Yeah, I do vaguely remember this. I come up with what he says. Whatever it was, I agreed with him, but I think I personally, I mean, I don't put that sort of information out onto my social media, like my personal view on that. Um, just because it's ever changing. I agree. The information that you get is changing.

You never get a full picture of what these people, these, like if they're celebrities, if they're actors, you never get all the information. What you do get is something that's already been filtered down. Um, if it's something straight from the source, then you can have your own opinion. Um, if they've tweeted something that's straight from the source, essentially, if it's a piece of art that is now resurfaced, whether that be comedy or, um, I don't know, something else that they've written.

Um, you can have your own opinion and be like, Oh, I don't agree with their views or whatever. Or I think that's really harsh or that's racist or that's sexist or that's homophobic or transphobic or whatever. Um, but I just, I think cause I know I'm growing so much and I've always been a fairly open person with in most areas. My mom's queer. So I, you know, I've never really had a space where I felt like I've had to grow.

Um, of course I'm continually growing in lots of areas, but I don't feel like I was ever uninformed. Yeah. But I think there are a lot of people who start their adult life uninformed about a lot of issues and like, who am I to judge? I think we're in like, there's so much social media out there and there's so much information that you push out there when you're immature, when you're young, when you don't have the information, when you are speaking without thinking. Um, yeah.

And like, unless it's some sort of rape allegation or something like that, like something really harsh. Um, I don't think people should be quote canceled. I think it's if you know that person, sure have some sort of opinion about if you want to stay their friend. Um, for example, like Shia LaBeouf, I've always loved him as an actor. Um, ever since I was younger, I followed his career. I watched even Stevens when he was on Disney or Nickelodeon. I loved that show.

I was obsessed with transformers when I was younger, just because he was in it. I don't like transformers that much. I was like, um, but he was so good at that kind of sticky comedy stuff. And um, and I watched a lot of his films as he got older as well. Honey Boy, which only came out like a few years ago, which he wrote just based off his life. I loved, but I also loved it because FKA Twigs was in it. He's my favorite artist, my favorite singer.

And then when she came out saying a year after that film that they were in a relationship together, that she was abused, um, like domestic abuse situation was happening with him, um, when they were together. Um, and she was very earnest about it and she was as open as she could be. I went, okay, how do I, I love them both as artists, but I care more about how I would feel if I continued absorbing his content, knowing that he is walking around in his personal life doing this sort of stuff.

It's really conflicting and I don't know how I feel about it. And I'm don't have an opinion because I, I don't know if I should, I don't know if I should care about this because these people aren't in my life, but they are in my life through the things that I can shoot. Yes. Yeah, so if someone would be like, Hey, do you want to go and see a Shia LaBeouf movie? Um, he's a star. I'd be like, actually I'm good. I don't, I don't think I want to watch that.

Um, just because he's kind of tainted a bit in my eyes because of who he has now kind of obviously come to be through like, just like, you know, what she said, but maybe if he was a minor character and I was really excited for all the other characters in the film, maybe I'd see that film.

I think it's just about personal decision making and really like being sincere about how you feel and how it would make you feel to consume that content with people in it that have done questionable things or are like actual abusers. Yeah. And I think, I think what's really interesting and I remember, uh, John Bethanol spoke to Shia LaBeouf about this as well.

They had, you know, he didn't, John Bethanol does a podcast about issues and talks a lot about like the stigma around stuff and they've been friends for a while now. And I think there's a very real conversation where he admits his faults and his flaws and his situations with previous partners where he's like, I did do these things.

And I'm, you know, I realized that, you know, this was not okay and this was a problem and, you know, it's a very kind of real conversation because it's like a friend of him going, yeah, this isn't okay, but it's good that you're making the step forward. Which is fine. And I think that's great that he's doing that, but, um, but then you also go like, oh, as a, as a woman, if I heard my ex who abused me say that they're on a healing journey, that wouldn't really make me feel any better.

And them getting positive attention may actually make me quite angry as well. So I, I like, I know about that podcast. I purposely chose not to watch it, even though I love John, what's his last name? John Bethanol. Bethanol. I think he's a great actor as well. Um, just cause I was like, I'm good. I understand what he's probably going to say and that he's on some sort of journey of like writing his wrongs or whatever, but he can do that without me knowing about it.

And that would be fine because I don't need to know everything about every actor. They can live lives that I don't know about and that would be fine. I mean, it's, it's, it's generally like Kevin Spacey as well. And I think that's an actor who's, you know, I absolutely adored growing up as a kid. So it was great. And then, yeah, just now it's like, well, why do you have to be in like half my favorite films?

Which I can enjoy the film still, but I definitely like, you know, baby driver, I haven't touched him like. But it kind of depends on what movie it is, how much of a role that person has in the film. I love baby driver, but I remember watching it after all the stuff came out about him and being a little bit annoyed that I had to watch him so much on screen. Like I love, and I mean, Ansel Elgort has had things said about him as well, but it's all about, I think what those things are.

Are they verified and all that sort of stuff? You have to make your own personal decision about how you feel about that in order to, it's just, it can be very stressful. All you want to do is watch a movie, but now you have to have some sort of in a, in a monologue about how you feel about this sort of subject and this sort of subject before you can just sit down and enjoy something, which can be stressful. And I don't really participate in a lot of it.

Not that I don't care about it, but I think it's on a case by case basis. And I don't think canceled is the right word. I think it's right that the public knows about all these issues and it's fantastic that the victims of these men have come forward. But then it's also like people like Lea Michele. I watched Glee when I was younger. I watched Spring Awakening, Bootleg, which was the Broadway musical that she was on before Glee consistently when I was growing up.

It's one of my favorite musicals and she's an amazing performer. And she's had over the past few years, some things said about her that she was giving a lot of micro aggressions on set of Glee. And from what I've seen with her in interviews, she's a very passionate person and she has her opinion about things, which I think could be hard on set with a lot of different actors and a lot of different points of view coming into one place to do something. So I can see that happening easily.

What is a micro aggression as serious as a rape or a sexual assault allegation? And should that mean that that person isn't essentially bullied online for years? It's just, I think if that were to happen to me, I would, I'd be, I just feel like horrible and just so, like I just worry about people's mental health. Like it's really, like it has to be a case by case basis because we can't put everyone in the same box because I don't know.

I just feel like it could easily turn into something where that person is suicidal. Because it's not like you're a singular person having an opinion on the internet, but so is everyone else. And once everyone else has that opinion on the internet, suddenly it's a million people saying you're a horrible person, which is terrifying. If one person doesn't like me, I feel horrible for a month.

Like I could not even fathom how that would feel to be so ridiculed for whatever the thing, the mistake is that you made. And I think it, yeah, it would just, I just feel so sorry for some of the people. And then I don't feel sorry at all for others because like, and that's, that's it.

I think it very much, you walk the fine line as well, and I agree with that as well, because I don't, I would be completely dishonest if I hadn't said that people have tried to, like, have said things about me or written things to me that were like, affected me greatly and whether or they were based on any sort of form of facts or anything, or they were just a massive personal grudge that they didn't like me.

And I think it has taught me to be very sort of resilient, especially because, you know, like not everyone's going to like you, especially not everyone in the industry is going to like you. And some people were just very willing to, you know, I guess, not understand everyone's perspectives, especially. But I think it's interesting because the people who had said so, you know, the people who I know, who had said horrible things about me, we were all close friends at certain points in my life.

And that's what I think hurt the most for me, because it didn't come from outward sources, it came from people I knew. And that's where it was like, well, how much of this is real? How much of this am I second guessing myself? Is it right? Is it wrong? And knowing that, you know, I see a therapist and, you know, and everything, and I think it has taught me to discover more about myself. Like, obviously, I'd be lying if I didn't say I've discovered more positives about myself because of it.

But I definitely had gone to the other side of it's like, okay, well, as a human, how can I make sure it's clear and concise to make sure there is no misconstrued ideas about anything and that this person isn't going to get the wrong end of the stick the next person I meet? Like, how do I, how do I clear out the groundwork from the ground up and, you know, and not get, you know, someone saying this again about me? And you know, that's what I was always thinking about as well.

Yeah, I think that's important. But that's also a lot. Yeah. And you have like, you just have to be kind to yourself because you're, everyone is imperfect. And no matter what situation you're going into, you can try to be as better of a person as you can be, but you're going to make mistakes. And it's just, I just know me being an actor, I'd love to be as successful as any of the people that we have mentioned.

They're in the films I love, they're in the musicals, they're in the theater that I love. They have a huge platform and they are also just very basic human beings. You know, they are no different to each other. I'm no different to them. And I think if I was in that situation, I would be so terrified of making a mistake. And the only way to not do that is to do what you said, just say, fuck it.

Try to be a good human being, but just also, like, you just can't be so, so worried all the time about what other people think. Because then I just know personally, I have so much anxiety around that already. It's so hard to not think that for myself that I just couldn't, I just, I can't fathom how they do it, honestly, how they can have a public life and also be a normal person. Yeah. You know, the one thing I keep saying as well is I'd hate to be famous. I would absolutely hate to be famous.

It's already bad enough, like saying, you know, a voice on things and, you know, wanting to get your opinions out there. And the moment, the moment everyone, you know, wants to stop me in the street, I'm just like, I'm out, I'm done. No one, you know, like you all leave me alone, lovely as it is. Because at the end of the day, no one really knows you. They see you through these lenses and they don't know, you know, like the Charles interpretations that you've had to deal with.

Like they don't know that you've had a family loss. They don't know that you've, you know, like, oh, that you've had a breakup or you've had a divorce or, you know, like anything like this, no one knows. And what they go is just, you're the bad person. You're the good person, black and white. But it's like that thing of, you know, I think, you know, especially, especially with like a lot of the situations I find are never resolved. Like and, and that's life.

Unfortunately, there's a- Or maybe they are. And we don't have that information because it's not as newsworthy as they've done something wrong. Exactly. Because it's tabloid. And they just know if they've kissed and made up or if they've quietly had some really nice messages back and forth. Because also they're probably not going to share that with anyone because of how much media coverage the event got.

Yeah. So who, and then it goes back to what I was saying, like who are we to say, who are we to care? They're just people who are living their lives over there, probably not in Australia as well. So it's just, it's just so much thought that's going to things that aren't about my life. Yeah. That are so, like it's so much unnecessary anxiety that I don't need.

Yeah. I mean, like I want to talk about your own mental health as well, but you know, and how you, you cope, because we did talk a bit about social media and how you've really reduced it, especially with just not adding randoms to Facebook. But I mean, like, you know, I think, do you see yourself as a little bit more of a, you know, showing only very select bits and pieces now because of that, you know, joint Instagram and that, you know, and the Facebook profile?

Well, yeah. So Molly and I share an Instagram. I don't think, yeah, I have friends who aren't actors who share a lot more than my other friends who are actors do on their socials. And that's just because my Instagram is not just my personal life. That's what you see, but it's also an image of, of who I am as an actor, you know? So I'm not going to put content on there that I wouldn't be comfortable with a casting agent or someone who could hire me to see. That doesn't mean I'm not casual.

I'm very casual, but I'm also not putting stuff on my public Instagram that could, you know, that could just be, I don't know, deemed as unprofessional, even though I'm not, that I'm not technically with, like working with whoever this person is. I don't want them to see me for something that I'm not because they've only got some minuscule taste of something. I don't know what that thing would be, but yeah, I wouldn't post too much personal stuff.

That close friends section on stories is really useful if you, if I want to post some funny video, but I look horrible and I don't really, I'm not comfortable with the public seeing me in my pajamas or in my bedroom. I don't post any, I don't show my bedroom. I maybe, maybe would show my face, but I wouldn't really show that publicly.

Just because I know that if I hopefully were to get more successful, I don't want people having photos of that intimate part of my life, which I do worry about because you see other people who have become successful and there are photos of them that I don't think they probably would want people to see. And it's just because they've had an active social media when they were younger.

When I wanted to become an actor, there was one point where I went, oh my God, what if I become really famous suddenly and people can have access to my Facebook and they see these horrible photos that I've been tagged in. So I spent like a good month just like trying to untag myself from these photos from grade nine, where I was on some school trip and I look just like, I don't look great.

Or maybe I'm in a photo with alcohol that now that I don't drink any alcohol, it just seems very uncomfortable for me to be in that photo. So there was a time where I was like, Jesus, how do I get rid of all of this horrible, uncomfortable, like just cringy like school year content from my social media? Because I don't want that coming up if someone Googles my name, which now thankfully it doesn't. Oh, thank God. Yeah. I didn't think it ever would anyway, because they're so old.

It's like 2010 to 2015 that those photos existed on Facebook or in my tag section on Facebook. But I was just, yeah, probably irrationally worried about it. I'm definitely irrationally worried about it. But it was something I thought about just because I didn't want to have that presence where people had access to photos that I hadn't already filtered.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's interesting as well, because I think I'm the same with Facebook, let's say with Instagram, it's an appalling way of self monetization. But I mean, like, you know, with Facebook, I just generally, as we were saying, post only specifically things that I'm working on a movie trailers. Like there's nothing really like being like, oh, my life's on here. And I don't feel the need. No, it's not the platform for it anyway, not for people our age. No. God, we sound so old.

Yeah. I think it's funny. I think you and I both have had the experience of what it was like when you're on Facebook and that was the main thing. You're posting, you know, random things, you're essentially putting tweets on your page. And then Instagram happened and then everything moved to Instagram very slowly where you're using both platforms at the same time for many years. And then now Facebook is an app that's on there and I'll get a ram notification for something I don't care about.

I click the notification, I get out a notification and that's all that happens on the app. I'll use the messenger app constantly. But some of my friends don't use that either. They'll just use Instagram to private message people. So it really depends on who. But yeah, it's not something like I'm the same. I'll use it to post. Like recently I did a short film and I was consistently on there just literally trying to get the information out that there was a crowdfunding.

And just because there are people on there who aren't on Instagram that are older or that are relatives or that are people that perhaps don't know that where I have an Instagram or Molly has an Instagram that could need that information. Yeah, but it's only for that. I mean, and that doesn't limit you as well. And I think for me, whenever I use Instagram, especially with the close friends things, I'm like, but I just like scroll away and use it for any stupid things.

But I think it goes back to the handful of just promoting, like if I'm doing a short film or I'm trying to raise funding or I'm posting something I worked on, it's very nice but oh God, you get lost in the noise sometimes as well. On Facebook, on Instagram, there's a lot of noise. Yeah, I think it's, I'm no expert with that stuff. And I'm also very happy to just be an actor and not have to deal with the filmmaking side of things and trying to get things to have traction.

Or just for people to know that this really fun thing that I am passionate about exists. I don't have to deal with that because all I'm dealing with is did I do a good performance? Do I like my performance in the, I don't know, that's the extent of how much I care about it. If it were to go to like a short film or something, it would go to a film festival, I would love to promote that sort of stuff.

So, I don't have to deal with the follower aspect of trying to promote some content on Instagram, which is very hard. I've touched on a little bit because the short film I did last, my sister wrote and directed it. So, I was a huge part of helping it however much I could with that. And so I could see how how dis-tricky it was to manage social media while you're just trying to also make something.

It's just another added thing on top of you trying to actually make a film, which is already so difficult. But now you also have to be a social media manager, which is another really hard job that is so hard to manage when you're also trying to do your normal job at the same time. It's impossible. There was plans before we shot it to be like, oh, when we're on set, we can make a TikTok. We'll have the time to do that.

But in reality, you're shooting on location and it's freezing cold and it's 12am in the morning and you don't remember that TikTok exists, let alone being able to make one. So, I'm very happy that I don't have to deal with that. I mean, yeah, it's sometimes why I desperately eventually should get a personal assistant at some point. It's like the most useful. It would be very handy. It's like, you know, because I get the question of, you know, how do you run a podcast and you do all those things?

And I'm like, I literally, you know, I sit upstairs and edit and you don't sleep. I don't sleep. I am just like injecting myself with caffeine. But I do think that, you know, with all the things that I do have done, and especially this year in particular, because it's all skyrocketing again, last year seemed to be easy to keep everything within a schedule and schedule it all out. But this year, it's just like a madhouse. Everything kind of comes up. Everyone realizes things are so last minute.

It goes back to how it was before, like in 2019, where, you know, everything's just steamrolling. And it's overwhelming sometimes. I definitely feel like, you know, as you were saying in the beginning, it's like, you know, all compressed into such a short amount of time, but also feels really long. I feel like I've forgotten how to be a human. I would say it's worth doing nothing, but doing a lot of things at the same time can be very, can be just as stressful as not having anything to do.

Because I've gotten like half a dozen messages from people just going, I'm lost. Like you know, they'll get stressed or they'll get overloaded with information. You're like, when's the sweet spot of making sure that people know what the hell's going on in their lives? When, you know, when filming, when's the, you know, location, um, recce's, when it wins meetings happening, but it's nuts. Like people just have no time to kind of juggle all that things.

And I think cause the, generally what you're doing is creating something from a creative space. Yes. You're using all of your brain. You, you're using the, the side that's, you know, literally making something very physical. You have schedules to write, you have all that sort of stuff. And then you have to actually make something creative that you're passionate about that you actually like.

And you utilizing both of those things at the same time is so, it can just be so overwhelming because how do you balance that? How do you go, Oh, I, I, I want to be as honest and creative and open as possible, but at the same time, I'm remembering that I need to put this schedule or I need to write this thing by this point, or I can't do that thing that I really want.

But it's a back and forth that I think people who are like us, who are doing all of the jobs because that's the only way that you can make content or make the things you want to make. You have to be the producer and the director, or you have to be the writer and the director or something like that. You have to be the actor and do production design. That stuff happens a lot. And it's just about how you can juggle those things and do your best in both of those venues, which is so different.

Yeah. And it's very hard. You kind of hit a lot of like, I want to say walls along the way, but it does come, you know, when, when you pull it off and, and when it does come together, it's like, Oh yes, I did that. But the journey along can sometimes feel like the most arduous. And then we get to a point where we don't do it.

It's like, I remember this teacher at after said this, he was like, you get to a point where you just, you, you've burnt out, you've, you've broken down, you know, you've built this thing and then suddenly you don't get calls for three weeks, three, four weeks. You suddenly wonder why no one wants you again. And then you had a call and you're like, let's do it all again. Yeah. Like, I don't think that's going to change either.

Cause I've heard a lot of actors talk about that same feeling, even very successful actors, just being like, I don't know where my next job is. And that scares me. It also makes me feel very comforted that that is just something that's also part of being an actor. Maybe or a creative, you're consistently, um, dealing with the fact that maybe you don't know where your next job is. Yeah. And it's almost reassuring that that is just something that comes with the job.

And that's not a reflection of you being unsuccessful, you being untalented. It's literally the job description. It's part of the list of things that you have to do to be an actor or to be a filmmaker or a podcaster or whatever. Yeah, it's just, it's the mission that you've got to, you've got to deal with.

I mean, like what's your thought as well on just like, you know, money versus art, like, you know, because there's that lot, you know, like I know a lot of people, especially people our age, not everyone is, you know, going to earn buckets. Um, and generally a lot of my favorite term is just exposure at the moment, which if anyone wants to type what is exposure online, there is a joke website that just says, we'll pay you an exposure. That's a great website.

But, um, you know, I think a lot of the time, and I know that even being 30, there's some times where I'm like, Oh, I can't pay the cost. You know, I have to, you know, everyone's doing me a massive favor coming in, doing a day shoot or a couple of days shoot or nothing. They get fed, but I'm going to make sure it's the best food that they've gotten.

It's such a, I think a very difficult balance because ideal in an ideal world, we'd have like millions of dollars backing it and everyone being paid equal rates. Well, I think in that situation, it's about being aware of who you've cast, who's on your crew. And I know that some people, um, if you want them there, you will have to pay them. Oh God, which is fine.

You know, it's just being aware of those things, but also knowing like that person is so generous with their time that they'll do it for free is also amazing. Yeah. So I think on that side of things, just being aware of who you have hired will make a huge difference because you don't want to let someone down. Um, because that will ruin your relationship with that person in the future. Oh God. Yeah. Um, I think personally, I don't really do student films anymore. Um, my sister is a student.

I will, we'll do her films. Okay. Tick that box. Because of, because I know her, because I know how good she is and I know what type of set she runs. Um, but for the most part, um, there's no way of knowing what that set would be like if it's a student film. Sometimes they're great. Sometimes they're not, but you won't be getting paid for that time. So I probably won't do it. Um, just because it actually is an exposure.

Those, those films probably aren't your best work because the situation on set isn't great. And maybe because the script isn't that great either. Um, or not as good as maybe you thought it was. Yeah. That happened, has happened a lot to me. And also you may not see that film.

A lot of the times things happen, things happen in posts in these student sort of worlds where you don't get a final product or you get something that you don't like or hasn't been edited that great because that's another part of the student filmmaking process that sometimes gets forgotten is the editing room and how important that is to how film is finalized. Um, which has happened a lot. So I don't use any of that stuff on a show reel ever in the past.

It's never, I've watched it and been like, Oh, I don't like that for this or that reason. Um, so I'm not going to use it. Um, so it's not really that useful for exposure. And I think I have an agent. My dad is still my agent in, I'm in his agency. Um, and I get a fair amount of auditions. I wish there was more.

I'm, but I don't think doing things like short films, doing those types of short films, the ones where you're in, they're in some sort of assessment or curriculum base, they're not going to help. If it's a short film that a filmmaker who is independent has made, I'm very keen on that because they have the skill and they have the passion. They've done all that training that they need and they're making this because they are really passionate about it.

And essentially no one's forcing them to make it in order to get some sort of good grade. Um, you know, there's a lot of pressure about doing good enough to get a good mark at some of the filmmaking skills as well, which can sometimes dampen their creative or their, their drive to get the best sort of product for that. And also there's limitation in time. Usually there's, you have about a week to do a film. Um, like you have a week shoot block for these, um, these film schools.

So and that's not sometimes, usually that's not really enough time. You kind of want maybe one or two more days. Like a week and a half would be great, but that they don't get that. Which can make the set go so much quicker than it should be. And you're running through some shots that you really should be taking more time on. Um, yeah. So all those things come into play when I'm thinking about like what I'm going to be giving my time to.

Money wise, like I said, I've been raised by a single mom, so we've always been poor. When I decided I wanted to be an actor, money didn't come into play. I know it has with other people, but you know, you're coming from different backgrounds. I've very, I'm very comfortable not, I'd be fine with just having enough money to live. Yeah, no, right. Um, if I don't have that, it can be very stressful and very, um, just very depressing. And so yes, I want to have enough money to live.

I have my boring quote, everyday job that I do. Um, at the moment I work five days a week, but it's casual. Um, so I can call, I can call in sick or I can say, I need this time off in, um, a few weeks because I'm shooting something. Um, so it's really important to be in a place where you have the flexibility and there's openness and communication between you and that, um, and the employer that you're working for.

Yeah. Um, and usually like I work retail, um, there's an understanding that this is not the end game job for you. Um, as long as you're clear with that, they are very happy with you having another life outside of whatever that job is. Um, yeah. And at the moment I'm very comfortable with having my other job and also doing auditions and doing other work. And that's great.

The idea is I get successful enough that I can do a film and then I can have that time off living off the money from that film, which is what most actors do. Um, and then film something else, you know, just until I die, which I mean is the only way to really do it. And well, I mean, that's what being an actor is. It's you're, you're living other people's lives. It's hard to live your own life when you're doing that. And it's about balance. It's about being aware.

I think I wish I had more monetary skills and understanding. I'm still learning. Um, I wish they taught more in high school. Um, about that sort of stuff, about how you can just live your life and have the money to do the things you want to do. Um, I failed math in high school.

You know, I was not good at it, but I think that understanding about how you can, um, I mean, not get loans, but like how, how you can, what's the word I'm thinking of how you can live your life and the money that's coming into your account, how do you put some of that into savings? How do you do this? How do you that in order to, um, live comfortably, I think that's something that's really lacking in the educational system that I would have really loved.

Um, because I've had to learn that on my own. My mom's not, um, like she's good at it. She obviously raised us, um, by herself, so she understands money. But, um, I think she would also, also benefited when she was younger as well, cause she was a creative, she did musical theater, went before we were in the picture. Um, so again, she wasn't thinking about having some sort of high paying professional job in business, whatever business is. Um, yeah.

I mean, yeah, it's, it's definitely one of those things that because I've worked, you know, and often a lot of the times put money into passion projects and stuff like that. I don't know the biggest amount of like savings and probably never will, which is fine. But, um, like it is one of those things that, you know, I, I know my parents were, you know, my dad was a freelancer.

My mom is the one who has the stable job and therefore it's just like she was the predominant income and with, when it came to the overtime and money, mom was the one who had all of it. Like dad would like, cause he paid tax and stuff in a different way because of freelance career, it was just completely different. Like it was just a very, like he's like, I don't have super like, cause I don't have a career that's built up over time.

And I think it's just about deciding whether you are okay with that or not. Um, I think I am. I think I, I do stress about money every now and then, but I'm young enough that that's okay. Yeah. I know that we have a lot of pressures as we get older. Um, as to the goals that we've hit in life, do we have a house that we own? Um, I don't know. Do we have two houses that we own? Whatever. Um, what are the goals that our society has decided are the right things that you have to hit at certain ages?

I think that's kind of bullshit, but I also think the pressure is still there no matter what. Um, and I, I would definitely like to have a owner home. That would be great. Um, I've got no concept though at where I am right now of how to do that. But I think that's fine cause I don't need one right now. Um, I'm more worried about how I can be the best I can at being an actor and how I can create a professional and a healthy career in that realm.

And then, then I, then I'm fine with starting to worry about those other like things. Yeah. Then you have a list. You've got, I'm, I'm going to use this as a perfect point to wrap this up, but I mean, I also just loved that everything that you've just said, cause it's like, yeah, it's so, it's so true to not, you know, and just the way we live as well. Cause I think, yeah, a lot of, a lot of people are age just intently worry about where they'll be and I'm still making it up as it go along.

That's the reality of it. And you know, like there's not much of an age difference between you and me and you do both in very similar positions where we're still trying to work it all out. And people are like, oh, I need to be, you know, ideally like I would love to own a place like you and, you know, and have that, but I don't think it's going to happen in my lifetime and cause the housing crisis, the markets and everything.

And I just think unless I'm by a shack, which is still probably going to cost like $600,000 as you know, it's just very unachievable dream. And I guess it's also the lesson that I remember mom and dad taught me. It was like, don't loans be very careful with loans and be very careful with debt. And that was like the grain that they were like, cause they were like, this can burn you very quickly and you can get like black marks and everything.

I was like, Oh my God, you know, the level of stress that I was like, I don't need this. And I'm, I think I was about 15. I was like, so, you know, it still affects me like 15 years later.

It's still like a traumatic experience, but you know, I think the success as well, because you know, you and I enjoy our careers, the success happens also, you know, internally we enjoy what we do and that I think is going to fulfill us long-term than just having all the wealth that everyone's, you know, like money, money doesn't buy anything really, like in terms of happiness buys you food and clothes, but as long as I'm surrounded by like my family, all the people that I love and I have a roof

over my head, which growing up, I, I, there was a little, you know, we always, we, mom always had us in a, like, we're always living in a nice house somewhere, but it was still, I was aware of how hard that was for her at some point. So I'm very aware of the, how great just having a home is, you know, having a place or a sanctuary where you can be comfortable. So as long as I have that, I'm fine. I love that so much. Um, Sophia, where can people stalk you on the internet?

Where can they find you just so they have some socials? Yeah. Well, I'm on Instagram. I share it with my sister. Um, it is called Molly underscore and Sophia, something like that. Glad you remembered that. Um, Molly underscore and underscore Sophia. I think that's it. Okay. Um, yeah, that's my main platform. Yeah. Um, that's what you'll see the most from Molly and myself. Um, yeah, I just got a tech talk, but I don't know if I'm going to post anything on it. So really it's just Instagram.

And if they want to hire me, you could go through my agent agency, triple eight as well. There you go. Go on, go and hire her. But, um, Sophia, it was an absolute pleasure chatting to you. Thank you so much for coming on. And if you want to go and check out more episodes of the things we do, you can check them out on Apple and Spotify. I'll be speaking with another guest next week and I'll speak to you all later. Goodbye.