Hi, this is Billie Jean King. This is Mary and Bartoli. I'm Matt's Belander. This is Mary Carillo. This is Pam Shriver. This is Yannick Noah and you're listening to the tennis podcast. Well hello and welcome to the tennis podcast where it's 10 past 2 AM and we are on the whiskey. Whiskey bought for us. Almost specifically bought for David by Pam Shriver. Hello Pam. So this podcast is brought to you not only in partnership with AO Travel but also with Pam Shriver Scotch.
So we'll see how this goes. Our women's final lineup is set. 19 year old Coco Gough against future world number one come Monday she will be the world's number one player arena sabilecka. What is Saturday night in New York? That is going to be what a Thursday night in New York it has been David. Yeah it really has been a lot actually today hasn't it and and I didn't necessarily think it would go like that particularly because of the way the first sets of both matches went. Actually
I was really worried about how it was all going to go. Obviously there was a non tennis moment that will come on to as well 45th moments actually. The interrupted play in the Gough MOOC of a match but actually in many ways the second match is the one that I'm just glad became a real tussle because it was it was going horribly wrong from a sabilecka point of view and I don't feel as though keys can
leave that court would too many regrets. Obviously she would have loved to get out of the line but she played hard and she played well and she just lost to somebody who's better in those men. I thought well let's lead with that match shall we love 6776 for arena sabilecka I know in lots of ways Coco Gough reaching the final is the bigger story and we'll cover that in lots of detail but we've just watched sabilecka come back from the most horrible of starts against
Madison Keys and we're kind of still reeling from it and hour ago we were still on Arthur Ash Stadium watching arena sabilecka celebrate what she thought was match points when she got to 7 in the match die break we're we're kind of still in that moment we're still buzzing from all of it so let's kind of capitalize on that and look back on one of one of the most
wild semi finals I've ever seen. Yeah I think that's that's very true and one of the most impressive mental performances that I've ever seen from a player to be quite honest because arena sabilecka has so much grand slam semi final baggage I know that she's one one before
and won the Australian Open but it still feels like this is a hurdle that she hadn't properly sort of overcome you know in a really tight match before she beat Magdalene in straight setting January and she came out against a player in Madison Keys who was timing the ball so
sweetly playing about as well as she can about as well as anyone can really it was awesome for Madison Keys same time sabilecka was off and she drops that first set six love and honestly I had absolutely no idea what was going to happen in this match from this point onwards I felt like
Madison Keys could fall off I felt like sabilecka could carry on playing as she was I felt like a turn around was possible and that was what happened and there was almost this sense of well if you'd never have the lead you can't blow a lead because that's been sabilecka's problem in semi
final she's been in winning positions and not been able to get over the line so in that sense in this weird way losing that first set six love was maybe a little bit helpful because she never had the lead in this match even when she you know we've started to get it together in the second set
Keys was still in a position to serve for the match sabilecka then played a great 12 points in a row to win them I'm sure we'll come on to Madison Keys I think she'll have some regrets about that period of the match but once sabilecka won that tie break in the second set I thought okay now
there's is another test for sabilecka because she's now in a position where maybe she can win this match and she falls behind again in the third set down a break but then kind of like okay that's maybe better than being in a winning position in that third set because of what's happened before
and from that point onwards from a break down in the third set I thought sabilecka was absolutely awesome she stepped up she played big powerful tennis she played world number one tennis and it was great to see and it feels like a really big moment in her career to be honest that she's
that she's overcome some of that baggage yeah I had the same feelings about the the mental fortitude of that performance and a very specific type of mental fortitude we're not talking about Nadal Esk mental fortitude where it's like as soon as a point is finished it's it's gone it's
is disappeared from his mind and he's refocused on the next one I mean some of her body language after that first set was extraordinarily bad she got she got a warning from sportsman like conduct didn't she she tossed her racket sort of it not quite into the stands but in the direction
of her team there was all sorts of demonstrations towards them she was complaining about how well Madison Keys was playing so when some sent me final how dare she play this well was pretty much the gist of it it was you know it was not world number one type stuff and it certainly wasn't
the type of stuff that made you think don't worry she's gonna put that first set behind her and she's gonna play like it never happened and she didn't play like it never happened you know it's not like suddenly she turned it on and it was forgotten she it it never felt easy for a rena
sabre linker tonight it always felt on the edge and yet even so she kept going for it and and I think that's an incredible testament to her she might have the odd kind of tantrum really I mean it was funny like she stamps a feet like a toddler it's so funny and then she chucked her
racket up in the air as you say nearly then it ends up down the sort of side like down a sort of back alley yeah which is funny I was just thinking when you were saying the the the the scoreline of love six might have actually helped her I was thinking how's that
sentence ever been used before like I mean it's and I agree with you because I remember saying it at the time at the time could it's a boy it's not a strategy you have is it but it may end up being the one the thing that happened well I also worried about it take away sabre linker and
all of her semifinal baggage I worried about that school line from a Madison Keys point of view because several lots and lots of X tennis players top level X tennis players will say that actually it's a bit of a disaster losing a set six love we're winning a set six sorry
winning a set I mean also losing a different way winning a set six loves actually one of the worst school loans to win from because you know depending on how mentally strong you are I know I find this extremely relatable you're thinking oh my god it can only go downhill from here
right I can't keep it up the chances of this being a six love six love are minuscule therefore something's got to give way here and I totally understand that mindset and look let's come on to talk about where the Madison Keys will and should have regrets but it it definitely wasn't as
simple as Madison Keys winning a first set six love and freezing because because the only way is down from there that is not the story of this match I know I mean look I haven't spoken to it yet and I'm sure she'll have she'll be sad and she'll be disappointed and maybe she will
have regrets but I don't I don't feel that she should be beating herself up about it I thought she played way better than she's played in years I mean obviously she's got to a semi-finity and she really went for it and she went toe-to-toe with the ball number one who's hidden the ball
that hard and she was out hitting her her strike is so pure it's a joke when she really is on and she and it was when I was watching it I was thinking if this is Coco Gough she's rolling these balls high up to keys to try to stop this and I'm thinking I never thought I would ever think that
Sabalinka should stop trying to out hit somebody and actually try to slow ball them but that's what keys was doing to her she was winning the toe-to-toe showdown which is an incredible sight because there were some actually extended rallies it wasn't just all unforced errors but so to
me I ended up really enjoying the match because I feel that you kind of got them both you've got them both playing she went off to this great lead and then Sabalinka just reeled her in and then found a form when it really mattered so it sort of felt about right it was the match I wanted to
see from Madison Keys I wanted to see her involved you know close contest with a top player and her to live with her and stay with her and she did do that I think she played a bad game when she served for the match Sabalinka nailed some returns which helped but keys let that go I think that
game that was a loose game and she hadn't it felt quite over to me the match it was drifting in that second set towards keys serving it out and when she didn't the whole thing changed and then it was a really good good tussle I thought Sabalinka was the better player in the third set overall
but keys was staying with her despite having gone off court and had a lot of strapping put on her leg in between the second and third sets I thought Madison Keys was great tonight and actually you know you sort of apologize to her last night I feel like I owe Madison Keys a bit of an
apology tonight because I didn't think she she'd do that tonight I thought this would be more one sided for Arena Sabalinka and I thought Keys was exceptional and has been all tournament and it was a absolutely thrilling contest and for Sabalinka the point you made about how she got
that warning and how she let some of her emotions out I thought very interesting quote she gave on the court afterwards sort of referring back to some of the previous semi-finals where she said she said I spoke to a team and said she needed to let those emotions out because otherwise quote I would eat myself from the inside and I couldn't have all line wasn't it in the moment incredible language and said in a sort of quite I don't know she was in a sort of slightly giddy mood wasn't she
in that in that encore interview but that was a absolutely killer line and I can't honestly remember exactly how she was sort of outwardly emoting in all those grandstand semi-finals that she's lost but interesting that she feels like just getting it out of her system rather than bottling it up
was was maybe one of the keys today and you know she never over that was there was not intentional she never overstepped the line there but just shows that I think she's been thinking about those other semi-finals and trying to try to learn from them and she did that tonight
the match reminded me of Sabelinka Rebeccaner not as high quality not as high quality they're absolutely not but in terms of I had sort of written it off is they're both they're such similar players it'll just be about you know we know we know those matchups you've got two big hitters
up against one another one is more consistent in the other boom done and it wasn't like that at all and I'd totally forgotten I can't actually remember the last time I watched Madison Keys live in in the stadium but I had forgotten what a pure hitter she is it's such a different
big hit to arena sabbelencher and that was my impression of the Australian open final that sabbelencher played with Rebeccaner in their Indian Wells semi-final final final yeah as well that there's strikes when you when you see them up close the strikes are actually
really really different it's it's there's so much more not to take anything away from the incredible muscle of the the sabbelencher strike but the purity of the Madison Keys strike is really beautiful and I'm so pleased that she gave a good account of herself today how much
of a comfort it'll be I don't know I think she shrugs off disappointment far better and far differently than she used to when she reached that Australian open semi-final last year she talked about was she put into words something that so many tennis players express at some point in their
careers about that process of trying to find a way for your whole happiness and your whole self-esteem not to depend on your tennis results and she talked then about having found that in her life so I'm sure she'll be fine in the end but I'm sure it hurts a lot right now I do feel like she's
I don't know whether she's had therapy or what sort of help she's had but I think she's had to learn as you say to come to terms with the results not necessarily matching the hype including her own you know her expectations and it's it's not easy for a teenager to come along like that
with that much talent and that much expectation and constantly be reminded that you haven't delivered on it in quite the way people thought you were and they're sort of imposing there and and I'm one of the ones guilty I would have imposed my expectations on her as a
gentle member of the media she wouldn't know that necessarily but the the whole she would know about you know the kind of relentless pressure and expectation they feel that even if they're not reading it they feel it him and her in Gregor Dimitrov they are centering that way
and I think that she's probably learned to live her happy life because of it I noticed she said that it's quite nice that nobody's taking any notice of it it's all about Coco Gough and it's also about a little bit about Jessica Beguele and there are she's not the one anymore
says she can kind of distance herself from it and she's clearly happier as a result and she's probably playing better now as a result being just be interesting to see whether there's anything more down the pipe for her and that's it isn't it that that I'm so pleased that all
sounds so healthy for medicine keys but at the same time you've got the sense that Sabolenka's will was bigger tonight she she she couldn't have handled it right she'd have been a mess for several days exactly and and she went out and and got it and and and that sounds like such a sort of
flippant thing to say from a from a tennis match so I'm sure was you know one and last and I'm sure with a lot of tactical battles as well but Will and desire and sort of champions mentality comes into it as well and Sabolenka's shown and proved that she's got that and medicine keys
as great as she was was just missing that that little age yeah I think this is such a brutal sport I do think you have to be basically mentally unhinged to be the most successful at it to be at the very very top and that leads to a tension for podcasters for example doesn't it because
we want the best for tennis players we want their best performances and we want to see fangs out there and and yet you know see this discussion and many others quite often that you sort of deep down know that that means rooting for something quite dark yeah actually it's far healthier to be
how medicine keys is and yet I'm thinking oh but what a shame you didn't have just a tiny bit more fang but the the fat I agree yeah it's just it's a bit of a discord when you're when you think about them because I care I do care about their mental health and their happiness as human
beings but yes it's also great to see the champions somebody like Sabolenka I kind of feel like her her happiness is wrapped up in whether she wins or not to some to quite a large degree I think that that that piece is is I often only comes when she's over the line hmm can we talk just
before we move on to the first the semi finals could we just devote a tiny bit more attention to Sabolenka celebrating it and she reached Levin in the tie break describe it well my experience of it was leaning over to Matt and going look at all these chumps with their phone out filming
thinking this is match point and it turns out that the world number one was also one of those chumps and I'd very excitedly celebrated the fact that a game earlier I'd realized that it was going to be a ten point tie break because I always forget as well and I and I've often gone into
them as a commentator and fortunately somebody has just referenced it not telling me and I've just been like oh I'd completely forgotten that so yes I'd remember it's always very proud of myself and I and then they announced it at the start of the tie break at the very clearly announced
it everybody in the stadium must know really Sabolenka absolutely must know and then they get to what was it six three something like that yeah and she she she wins the point and she throws the racket on the ground in celebration yeah it wasn't something you could style out no no no
and it went on for a few seconds because she turned her back on the court and went to celebrate with her team so she wasn't she wasn't seeing any of the indicators that might make her realize and this all goes to what we've already discussed which is her mental strength but
just to come back from that without blinking and also because I feel like she was like she's slightly self-deprecating in those moments she's humorous and she saw the funny side she was able to bless her she was able to say the funny side when the team is saying no no you haven't
finished yet and she didn't blink she was amazing she won it twice it was a lovely it was such a great moment I will I'll I just know it's one of those moments I'll remember it is to come it'll really stand out what what will probably stand out to me from Coco Gough 6475 victory over
Caroline and Mukover is the last half hour and in particular the last game of this match I think that'll live long in my memory which is probably giving the match too much credit because large portions of it were truly horrific but you know the first has there ever been a greater
contrast between the first half hour of a match and the last half hour of a match I honestly don't think I have ever seen one it was so deflating the first seven games I mean that Coco Gough played nicely Caroline and Mukover was absolutely appalling I mean I don't know
whether it was nerves or or what but you know this player of such beautiful timing couldn't time the ball she couldn't get it in it was like when Cameron Noria's a bad day you know it's just terrible Cameron Noria catching strays always from taking it always but I mean you're right when
she I mean obviously there was the big pilaver in the middle but I mean when she found a timing at the end and started to really sink her teeth into the match and fight and that's when it was that it's absolute peak because you've got them both just pulling at the rope and trying to yank it
off each other it it was truly one of the weirdest tennis matches that I've seen I mean three three acts act one just a total horror show I mean there were there were seven winners between them and 29 unforced errors in the first set and I think that's a generous 29 I'd agree yeah it's
six one set no it was it was because Coco Gough didn't play for at least yeah it was five one and he had her own little period in there he lost her forehand you wouldn't know that I'd come and I mean Coco Gough's forehand broke down in that first set after she was five one up and suddenly
all mucava had to do was find the court which she was having big trouble doing but when she started doing it Gough responded with a series of unforced errors and it was so awkward and so bad and so terrible Mary Carillo said she'd never seen her major semi-final that bad first set quality wise it
was so bad and Gough was just rolling it wasn't she's yeah to into into entire series right which wasn't a bad tactic like she was she was yeah looping that forehand really targeting the mucava backhand and the mucava forehand was all over the place to begin with as well it was I cannot
stress enough how bad it was I think the horror of mucava's performance infected Coco Gough because she had no rhythm her mind must have been swirling with well the same things are mind was swirling with with like is this tennis like this it just must have been such
a different match to the one that she prepared for Carillo in a mucava the more experienced player in in that scenario and on that stage of all of all and look we previewed this match last night and we were all absolutely on an eye for edge about this one in which way it would go there
were lots of difference in our areas but one that I haven't he hadn't even countenanced was carolina mucava freezing like that for a set hmm I think I mentioned non-stibber will done finally my commentary wow yeah and I look at I couldn't see because we're a long way away I couldn't see the
face of mucava to be able to judge what what's going on out she doesn't give much away in that in that respect so yeah but it was that haunting in terms of how bad it was and then at one love in the second set at which point by the way I marked this down it was 3214 series to eight winners
and I would say the 32 was ungenerous at the age was generous not a great ratio at that point there was a cuffuffle a cuff a cuffuffle whose nature did not really become clear for quite a long time and actually a lot of the clarity was provided by Molly McCell we have the
telegraph he went and did some up close reporting on this there were three protesters in the stand they were wearing t-shirts that border were words end fossil fuels so very similar to the just a royal protesters that have been very prominent in the UK recently in over the summer over
made at major sporting events two of those protesters were removed without too much fuss there was a stoppage to play but you know sort of unremarkable amount of fuss but one of them glued his bare feet to the floor which meant that security the NYPD and medics had to be involved in the
extraction process and as I say the exact details of all of that did did only sort of became clear filtered through over the course of a 45 minute period 45 minute stoppage in the match we were seeing shots of both players and their teams backstage while while you're seeing sort of stuff
come through on social media about what's going on with these protesters the USDA eventually released a statement explaining why it took so much time they said the fanning question of fixed himself to the floor and due to the nature of the action medical professionals NYPD and security personnel
were needed in order to resolve the issue and this isn't this is another one where there's a huge amount of tension here because it was horrible to see that it was it was absolutely not what any of us want to see in a grand slam semi-fine or at any time during a major sporting event I felt for
the spectators I felt for the players hugely I mean just terrible for the players and their teams and everybody I felt for us it's cost us an hour of sleep I'll miss that tomorrow dreadful don't want to see it but equally there is a climate crisis the world is ending we've had
evidence of that the last four days here in New York and you know that if you're looking hard nothing you absolutely that hard there is evidence of it everywhere you look and these people were peacefully trying to do something about that and I you know I'm not going to go
out there and do it but I'm I'm also not going to come down on them like a ton of bricks for peaceful protest about something that is worthy of peaceful protest because protest by definition has to be disruptive in order to be effective that's that is the point if
it weren't disruptive it would be pointless yeah I couldn't agree more and it was great to hear yet again Coco Gough say that she believes in climate change and the problems that it's causing and she understands that people need to protest or want to protest and she doesn't have any
problem with that she says yes I wish it wasn't during my match as it happens tonight because obviously I'm trying to win a tennis match and it's not ideal but I think you something that's perfectly captain I've got nothing else to add oh okay should we go back to the
unforesterated to win a ratio then because that was a treat the only thing I would say and I don't know how how hard to be on the US open for this but the speed that it took for them to act seemed insufficient to me just just as a lay person watching Brad Gill but turning around pointing at people
the get the match being interrupted and it seemed to take a long time now for all I know the protestor who actually glued his feet to the floor may have already done that and therefore there may have been nothing that anybody could have done to get him out but the video footage we
saw they got the other two out and this gentleman they they didn't but it did seem to take a long time versus what I remember at Wimbledon and the communication at Wimbledon being this is likely to happen we're expecting it to happen we're doing we're beefing up security but the chances are
it will still probably happen yeah and I can get that sense that there was a preparedness in quite the same way no it was interesting look I was watching on the ESPN feed and as soon as I heard it was protestors my assumption was that it was just a boil or something similar because we
also assumed to that I'm expecting there to be something from climate activists at major sporting events now certainly an attempt at something and yet the tone of the coverage and I could be wrong about this indicated to me that it just wasn't on their radar at all as something that
might happen so maybe it's just been less prominent here in the US I I don't know but yeah you know I I know that it at Wimbledon and other major sporting events over this summer it was a massive topic of discussion doing doing what can be done to prevent those protests but ultimately
I'm not sure you can police people bringing t shirts and glue no and I mean it was sporting event like this 24,000 people I mean it is an enormous it's hard to it's hard to describe the humanity out there the number of people you're mixing with in a tennis stadium this isn't a football ground with
with a hundred meter pitch and the stadium's round or the or an NFL stadium it's but it's just such an enormous number of people but I did I did I'm sure they will be looking at it and try to try to improve that situation because look again you've you've highlighted the
the competing emotions we have when looking at protesters and the feelings we have about it but you know what if it wasn't protest is what if it's some something else I don't know whether the reaction would have been much much quicker I mean there is an incredible security presence
but all they were doing is was sitting there enchanting right and and gluing their feet to the to the ground so it's hard to judge whether they would not act quicker or more drastically if I think they probably would exactly yeah so anyway back to that winner an unforestation
era ratio which at that point was in a sorry sorry state look things didn't improve enough to rescue that that ratio at the end of the match and things it wasn't like they came out they came back out after that 45 minute delay and it was a brand new tennis match straight away
it wasn't as simple as that but it was given the opportunity to evolve into something at first decent and then at the end briefly sensational yeah I mean we've been we've been waiting for a memorable high quality match in this tournament to be quite honest we've been waiting a long time
and we didn't get a full match of it but we got half an hour of the most compelling dramatic high quality thrilling tennis there and Mary Crillo said as soon as they came back out that she liked the sound of the match better I thought that was a really good way of of putting it because they
were both suddenly striking them all a bit a bit with you know with more intent a bit more cleanly and as you said it wasn't brilliant straight away but it evolved into something absolutely epic and that period of the match the last few games was Mukava playing her very best stuff and
I thought that would be good enough to beat Coco Gough I thought that she would have too many ways to win points and I was wrong because Coco Gough stood up to it in the most the most fantastic way I mean Mukava started coming forward and making volleys that she'd been missing and Coco Gough
responded by trying to lengthen the rallies there was this incredible 40 shot rally where I think I made my debut on Czech radio because I was I was sat next to Czech radio guys I have been all tournament and I had a physical reaction to the rally I couldn't be quiet it was like
impressed an ejector button he let that far off his seat with a yelp and then I was in the same time we had David over our shoulder actually commentating on it and making it even more dramatic and intense it was it was a sort of out of body experience yeah it was it it was a special
time wasn't it those it was just locked in a bit of magic yeah as final game as match points were coming and going for Coco Gough and Mukava there was there was four end errors on some of the match points there was a couple of outstanding Mukava dry volleys it was like how could someone
play the tennis she played at the start of the match and then play that tennis match point down I love about sports and love about tennis is the way people can sometimes just get over whatever's the thing they're meant to just boom they're on it so good she um she's told ESPN
after the match Coco Gough that she's sure that this ground slam final will be different to the last one that she played at the Friends Open she said first time around I put too much pressure on the moment I don't think I believed in myself then I believe in myself now great line and I
think she will I think she she knows herself more as a tennis player now I think probably the new coaching set up has helped a little with that but she's experienced she's her her rolling these forehands down the line is such a clever way of hiding her weakness and hurting a powerful opponent
I can see that happening time and time again to her in the Sabalinka was that a prediction David I haven't made a prediction yet but I can I have made a prediction about what I think she will do I haven't told you what I think will happen when she does it score wise well we will have more time
on tomorrow night's podcast yes we will to preview the women's final Coco Gough in her second grand slam final it's a belter on paper against her in the Sabalinka in her second grand slam final yeah it's hard to believe that isn't it it's she because she's been consistent this year yeah
so yes she's world number one but it is still new it's it's it's the perfect final isn't it's so great it it it has storyline wise it's mouthful and the crowd without exception everybody will turn up knowing exactly what they want they will want Coco Gough to win had it
bit I mean bless Keza if she'd have won this title all good luck to her but in terms of the occasion we saw it when she played Stevens the crowd don't really know what to do they might pick a favorite but they're all a lot of them are Americans and there are two Americans here you have
absolutely the player they're gonna root for Sabalinka is she's she makes a brilliant villain because she's not really a villain she's just loveable really in a way yes pantomime villain exactly and but it all works I think for the occasion I hope I hope they as always they both
settle and play the way they can I'm quite confident in that final being good I don't know why I would say that after tonight ask me again when it's fine love to someone in the first I mean that I agree with you but and the beauty of tonight is that both of those two
matches turned into something good even though they started like say it absolutely dog shit yeah dog right we have a few minutes to preview the men's semi-finals tomorrow or later on the day today depending on how you look at it before we do that I'm gonna remind you about the incredible
competition that we are running in association with our partners for this US open AO travel if you didn't already know AO travel operate the travel program for the first grand slam of the year the Australian open in Melbourne in January AO travel offer packages where they take care of everything your flights your premium accommodation tickets the tournament behind the scenes experiences and that includes the all new AO travel lounge and it is to celebrate the launch of that very AO travel
lounge that we are offering an incredible prize to one lucky tennis podcast listener and a friend who will win an AO travel premium lounge package to the Australian open in January they'll be going in style to return economy flights to Melbourne tickets to world labor arena over the middle weekend
of the open for two people three nights accommodation at the five star Pullman on the park hotel in Melbourne as well as two day access to the luxurious AO travel lounge you enter via the link provided in your show notes you have until Monday the 18th of September at 11.59 pm New York time to enter
terms and conditions apply and most importantly good luck yeah middle weekend tickets to go into the Australian open what a brilliant few days that is American Andrew was it the the open and in fact might be returning to the open because he said he would try and come back if Coco got
freeched the final he will be he's got his ticket oh yeah he bought it but he's boy is ticket in advance oh and he was gonna he was gonna sell it if Coco got wasn't in the vine that's the all sorts of planning that's and takes he lose some money that's a man that's familiar with
ticket master he was on out Twitter today just doing an amazing belting job but I was going to say is that Andrew always gets the Labor Day middle weekend package to the US open which obviously different Grand Slam but he swears by the the middle weekend package being the thing to have I know you're not into quarter final I was going to say it's good that those tickets aren't called to final stuff what a flash quarter final what do you make of the middle weekend great yeah that's great great
good time I like it too yeah coming for the finals also good actually yeah you've nailed it yeah you've nailed the USA it's all good don't you listen to that um men's singles semi finals tomorrow what's gonna happen I think that both gonna be fun I think vague that's vague David I think Ben Shelton
is gonna bring it and he's gonna hurt Chaukiewicz for a set he's gonna rock him or in a meaningful way I think he's I think he's gonna win a set no at least a set I think he's gonna win it I think you might rock him for the first set and then Chaukiewicz will take over I yeah I think you'll
rock him but not in a meaningful way I think you'll rock him twice Jacović and five if you think I think Jacović and four I think I will finalize that view when I do my newsletter prediction which needs to be extremely soon David at three A.M. when planning to go to bed pretty soon
I think I think they might both be straight sets I mean I get everything wrong so that's great news for those two semi finals extremely possible well cool yeah I mean it's probably the most lightest in our history really given the way those two plan for the worst hope for the best
yes that we are brits after all maybe I'm not sure maybe I don't feel like a Brit the way I'm so optimistic for amazing classics but I do think they're gonna be fun though even well the beauty is because these these two matches feature players who are such shot makers and then
remember they may not be that much of a shot maker but he's brilliant on the run and stuff like that and he's got his personality there's no duds there it it does feel a bit to me like a Wimbledon situation where I wish they were the other way around yeah wouldn't that be good so you
would like to see Medvedev Jacović yes Shelton Alchrist who's whipping up a showtime yeah a thousand times yes if they could arrange that tomorrow I just I want to see Medvedev even if it is disastrous I want to see him try something different and fun against Alchrist because his game
doesn't work and he is a tactician isn't he that's his thing should he he's he caught there's the ahead of the quarter final with Rublev that video was circulating the intercut video of him and Rublev or obviously best mates going back a long way with Medvedev saying his nickname among all
the other players is the chess master and explaining why it's that's because I'm such a master tactician everyone says I'm I'm just such a chess player out there and Rublev goes no no no octopus is brilliant but like yeah you're a chess master do something chessy tomorrow and it could
absolutely fail but you've tried I think you will that's I think that's what he will try my question if you Catherine is should he try disrupt her what I mean is should he find something to get pissed off about and just go the whole pantomime people in the crowd umpire I'd love to see it but
I don't think he ever goes on the court consciously looking to be sure to be okay with it if he did no because it needs to be organic okay that's why we love him isn't it I'm afraid I agree with you just quickly before we have one final little treat for you in terms of men's semi-final preview
I will give you some more detail on what's going on in the wheelchair events tomorrow because they're progressing as well as the junior events but we have our men's doubles semi-finalists it will be once again for the third time in a row Raji Ram and Joe Salisbury they will take on Rohan
Bapana and Matt Ebtan very well done Bapana and Ebtan but you did beat Pierre Ruga Baranick Lamon yeah Rohan Bapana I believe is the oldest man ever to reach a grand slam final is that right he's he's overtaken Daniel Nestor's right he's got he's got a great beard
and that's for a while and we were watching Stefan Uday earlier in the men's wheelchair doubles semi-final which he and partner Takashi Sanada won overall for hewitt and Gordon read 75s and six how old is Stefan Uday Matt we looked it up because well he looked quite old so we wanted to check 52
fantastic he's into the final incredible that's something else but yeah I promised you an extra little men's semi-final preview treat in particular for the first semi-final David over to you yeah this is a conversation I got to have I got to meet Brian Shelton at Wimbledon the father of
Ben Shelton and and over the past year I've I've really just generally been interested in this story because Ben came on on our radar really properly I know a lot of you who really follow the circuit will have known more about him last year for us and certainly for me it was really at the
Australian Open this year when he reached the court of finals I got a chance of a little chat with him at that time he had never left the country until he went to Australia and I found that absolutely fascinating and I was given the chance to meet Brian his dad who was a former
80-be player he was just outside the world's top 50 he was a very good grass court player and somebody I remember from the 90s so of course I wanted to meet him when I had the chance and the interesting thing was that he had recently given up a very high-profile and interesting job
as coach of the Florida Gators University team in order to travel with his son and that was a surprise I'm all never because it was such a great job but it's his son and and so I had a chat with him and we I put to him the visual that we had of Ben in Indian Wells thrown in the
American football the entire length of the field and asking whether that was the where the serve had come from and he said you know he he used to be a quarterback you know he wanted to be a football player for quite a long time and he was really quite a good quarterback and that's that is where the
serve comes from but he eventually concentrated on tennis and he was talking about how from that Australian Open he then decided to just really stamp that passport and go to Europe and plot around the Clay Court Circuit and hardly win any matches certainly not win any
back-to-back matches at all between the Australian Open and here in New York which but he said it was an education for him and and and they wouldn't do it again next year they would probably prioritize grass a little bit more and it was just a really interesting conversation and Brian had a real
effect on me and particularly towards the end of the interview I I've just thought about what he's had to say a lot since then and we thought we'd just play a few minutes of of it for you start him with me asking why in his junior years Ben didn't play much tennis
yeah well we wanted Ben at home well with the family and so we kind of forego playing the international events and chasing points and ITF rankings and those things to really focus in on his development first as a person you know we want him in regular school which he did all the way
through today many of the the top tennis players have gone through online schooling as kids and we wanted him to really understand what it felt like to be part of something that's at home and and my wife Lisa and I we really wanted to have an impact on him every single day and so it's
hard to do that when your kids living somewhere else or traveling around the world and so for us that was really important that he had just a solid foundation and base and a lot of different skills and going to college was also something that was you know a reality and we really wanted him
to experience that being part of a team and understanding that you know you're not the most important person all the time and you got to learn how to share and work with others and just developing so many character traits that we think are really really important and I think
that'll those things will serve him well and hopefully you'll have a long career and a fruitful one but I'll always be able to keep things in perspective based on the foundation that we've kind of been able to set for him you're able now to have an influence on him day to day on the road as well
because you're here dad and a son on the road all the time together is is that ever tricky I think it will be I think it will be tricky at times and I think it's really really important that we understand you know how to work well together and and continue to to you know be on the same page
there you know he needs that time where he can go have dinner with his friends and and enjoy some time without mom or dad around you know because he's 20 years old and he's got to learn and experience things on his own and so it's finding the time to to put my coach hat on and understand
that there's work to be done and and we're going to work well together on the court because we have a long history of doing that so far but also understanding when it's time for me to kind of not talk about tennis or not be around and and give him the space that he needs to be able to grow
and develop and and just be a normal 20 year old you know and and moving forward from there so you know I think that we'll we'll be able to find that balance something that we have mutual respect for one another and I think that that's something that we both value and something that
I'm going to be just very aware of as we move forward. There's a final question and there's there's only so much crystal ball gazing we can do successfully and other things being equal injuries come into a player's development but if those things are equal if he doesn't suffer bad injuries
in terms of timeline what how long do you think it will take for him to to reach his physical potential or at least to develop and to be fully ready for for the rigors of the circuit in the way that maybe one day will be how long do you think it will take.
You know it's hard to put a timetable on on development and maturity and growth and those things and you know I think if we continue to learn from each each match each day each practice and continue to grow in that way then he's going to continue to move in the right direction and
one thing I know for sure is that I'll never put limitations on what he can accomplish you know I learned that a you know a few years back and realized that he's just so different than I am and the limitations that I put on myself I certainly would not want to put on him because he
doesn't put any limitations on himself you know I think he sees himself as being one of the best players in the world ultimately and so I think that that's certainly something that he can accomplish and you know we're not we're not in any rush you know the most important thing is that he just
continues to get better each day and as he has the right mindset then I think he'll be consistent with the results that he has and so it's about developing that mindset developing his body developing his game and his skills and just letting it kind of just run a natural course with the work that he puts in. Sorry Brian I just found that fascinating that you talk about limitations that you put on yourself but you're keen not to put on him that suggests that you're quite different or that
that you've maybe almost learning from him. Yeah absolutely I think the things that I thought years ago were weaknesses I realized were strengths you know Ben Ben was one of those kids that when he went to a tournament at a young age and came home and after losing in a quarter finals I'd
ask him what do you need to do to get better Ben to be able to win that match the next time and he would say dad I just need to grow and get stronger once I do that I'll have a lot of like success out there against guys like that I'll continue to beat them I kept thinking to myself that's not
the right attitude but now I look back and I realized that he had an internal confidence that I didn't have at the same age or the same stage and I really needed to continue to help him just to grow that confidence in himself and build his self-esteem which was already pretty strong and realize that man this is a different guy that I'm talking to right now than myself I wish I had that
mentality or that attitude when I was coming through at his age. Wood a lovely chap and such a fascinating insight and gives you faith that it might be possible to be a top tennis player and a well-adjusted human being at the same time. Yeah I think as a father myself I can really relate to what he's saying I'm trying to wrestle with not imposing my experiences exclusively on my young son because he's very different to me and I find it fascinating and seeing their interaction
together with Brian and the coaching box and the freedom that Ben Shelton plays with and the the charisma he has he just loves it and he loves performing and showing you how incredible he is athletically and not holding that back and watching what he does tomorrow will be so fascinating because he's playing the ultimate he's playing it in words of Simon Briggs today he's playing the ultimate winning machine in Novak Djokovic and is there a way to disrupt that with that kind of
hootspour and power, raw power it's going to be fascinating. Matt Roberts thinks no. I love it when David says hoots but though. It's good. Right let's get to bed folks it's eight minutes past three we have some very important stuff to say first though we have to say hello to Willow, our lovely lovely mascot hello Willow we have to say hello to Zenya hello Zenya we were a six love set away from getting some points today no biggie. David has a say hello to Maisie.
Right Maisie I turned 50 today and you your your little face was there on my phone. Oh so nice and Matt and Darwin. Yep no points. Not a Scotty point. Billy Jean is sponsored by Billy Jean King and Alana Klos we have top folks and executive producers you know them well they're Jamie Hanna and Drew and we have late night shout outs Matt. For Aaron Farquhiss in Los Angeles. Oh hello Aaron like. Aaron Crickstein. Yeah. From 1991. Jamie Connors.
And other years. Yes but that's the one we all remember from when it used to rain and there wasn't a roof and so they'd play that match all the time. There must be other Ternus Aaron's I think of Aaron as quite an athletic name. It is a good athletic name yes and I can't think of any. What's an unappletic name. Clive. More played. Thank you Aaron. There's no arguing with us. Clive. Owen. Oh in. Clive. Not an athlete. Clive the glide Drexler.
Basketball player from 1992. Clive Wood. Clive Wood. Clive. Clive. Clive. Clive Jordan. All right Derek. I think you definitely answered it. Thank you Aaron. We have Debbie Thorne. I thought we were saying Derek. I've just realised it wasn't Clive actually. It's Clive the glide Drexler. It was Clive. Is that enough I didn't know. So you're right I'm right. I'm out of whiskey. Debbie. Debbie Thorpe. All right. Do you know Debbie Thorpe? That's an athletic surname. Yes.
In Thorpe the Thorpeedo. Yeah. The one with a big feet who used to be really good at swimming. Yeah. Yeah. 16 feet. They've always got big feet. I obviously I noticed that because I've got the same size feet which was really cool. Yeah. For me. I think swimming is do you have big hands. I mean Michael Phelps has got big hands and feet doesn't he? Yeah. Anyway Debbie. Right Debbie. Debbie McGee. I think I'm going to tell you to play Debbie.
Debbie. Debbie Jevons. Debbie Jevons. Debbie Jevons. The new Wimbledon chairman. Yeah. Debbie Goye. Thank you Debbie. Thanks Debbie. Speaking of Michael Phelps there's an M Phelps in the junior tournament here. I was very confused because Michael Phelps was here yesterday. There's an L Samson of her. Yeah. I noticed that. And an M. Yes. It's a fake Samson of her. And she's doing really well so she might be a problem. Thank you Debbie. And finally we have Sam Wood.
Right Sam. Hello Sam. Sam says that the highlight of her tennis year so far was chatting with Catherine and David on center course. I remember she went well. We on Tech Bengtchit. Oh yes. I do too. It was so nice to meet you Sam. Lovely to meet you. I was wearing a tennis podcast t-shirts. Yes. That was lovely. Thank you Sam. Like Claire Wood. Yeah. And like Sam. Stoça. Stoça. She's here isn't she doing. Come on Tread. Yeah. Oh that's a lovely one to end on. Thank you Sam.
Thank you to all of our friends of the tennis podcast. If you'd like to become a friend, if you're worried about post US Open withdrawal symptoms, friends of the tennis podcast has got you covered with all of our boco. We'll be doing a review show and a Q&A show next week. We've got all sorts of other stuff planned. We still have tennis relived shows to bring you for 2023. There's all sorts coming your way and the way to get access to it is by becoming a friend and supporting us year
round in what we do. The link to do that is in our show notes as is the link to subscribe to the newsletter, the link to enter the competition. All the good stuff is in the show notes. Folks, thanks for listening. Can I just say a quick thank you as well please? You just did. To you. Yes. To Matt. For giving me my best ever US Open birthday in 20 years. They took me out to lunch. They spoiled me rotten. They brought all my favourite colleagues together but from Pam because she
couldn't make it but she bought me a lovely bottle of whiskey. She was on air. She could make. And taking me to an NFL game on Monday and I cannot wait. It's the coolest present imaginable. And I just wanted to say a huge thank you to you both. You're very welcome. Very welcome. You're worth it. I am going to an NFL game on Monday. Men go. They'll headline there. Men bending over. Can't wait. They'll be content. Yes. Yeah. Bokko. I'll be excited. You. Speak to you tomorrow.