Roland Garros Day 1 - Rafael Nadal and the final farewell

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well hello and welcome to the tennis podcast on day one of Roland Garros 2025 it is a quarter to ten in the evening play is still going on on court philippe chatrier and we myself kathar mitica david law and matt roberts are in our usual spot, just in the shadow of court Philippe Châtelet. There are people milling about around us. There's still an extraordinary amount of daylight in the air because it...

It's just that time of day and I'm clad mercifully in a free t-shirt because apparently I packed terribly for this trip and there's barely been a single moment where I've felt the appropriate temperature.

had one of the 15,000 free t-shirts distributed to the crowd in Philippe Chatrier earlier to honor the 14-time French Open champion Rafael Nadal and while I mocked the journalists that were that were wearing their orange t-shirts here i am wearing matt's orange t-shirt because i packed terribly for this trip and it's keeping me from being cold it is with nadal's retirement ceremony where we are going to start tonight But first, I should

I should update the people on the big saga. So many people will be tuning in purely for the latest installment of Will Matt get stood up by Amanda Anasimova for three days in a row? i'm gonna do a tease please know that an update is coming later in the show now Rafael Nadal, 14 time French Open champion, of course exited here last year in his final competitive Roland Garros in the first round after that.

horror draw, drawing the then second seed, Alexander Zverev, putting on a decent show, but in the end exiting Philippe Châtry in that shaft of sunlight with just a wave, having... informed the tournament organizers that he didn't want any kind of ceremony in that moment, of course.

After he played his final competitive match in doubles at the Davis Cup finals in Malaga last year, there was a ceremony to honor Rafael Nadal. Matt and I were there. I thought it was quite nice. I shed a tear. I thought it was fine.

Spanish people felt very differently about that and in fact they are you know quotes have still been coming out today there was an interview with Alejandro Davidovich Fikina in Clay magazine this week where he was criticizing the ceremony said it was sad and not fitting of a legend a reminder at the time carlos moya was variously quoted depending on your

spanish translation is calling the um the malaga ceremony shabby tacky or stingy and uncle tony said it should have been a more dynamic ceremony so a tough scene for malaga and the itf

the big question today I guess is did the FFT and Roland Garros get this one right I watched on a screen David and Matt you watched in the stadium from the press seats up in the gods. One of you was clad in orange, one of you not. No need to go into details. Did they get it right? Personally, I think overall yes. Did I agree with every decision that they made in the ceremony? No.

I think there was quite a long time when Nadal was standing on his own in the middle of the court, like he was in Malaga, which seemed to be the big criticism of that. He had a lectern this time. Yes, and it just felt like weeds.

we'd seen that bit before we'd had that Nadal obviously had written a speech that he you know he had stuff that he wanted to say and in French in English and in Spanish so they obviously allowed him the time to do that personally I thought that was just a little bit too much of

Nadal on his own there in the middle but I also thought they there were some great moments within the ceremony as a whole and the whole thing had gravitas and a sense of occasion you know the t-shirts were It looked amazing inside Philip Chattray. Most were in sort of orange clay-coloured T-shirts. Some were in white as well and they spelled out Rafa at the top of the stadium. I thought it looked impressive. I think it's come out really well in the images as well.

And then there were these little moments throughout that I thought were, you know, the kind of iconic moments that I hoped for in a ceremony. You know, Mark Moroy, the MC here, introducing Nadal in the way he always used to introduce him onto court. Listen!

the years that he won Roland Garros a favorite event of every Roland Garros for me I thought we'd heard it for the last time last year I was thrilled that we got it today it gives me goosebumps every time There was of course the absolute epic moment where Onto the screen appeared backstage the other members of the Big Four, Rocha Federer, Novak Djokovic and Andy Murray and I gasped at that moment when they were all standing there ready to come on. I thought that was an iconic moment and then

They revealed that there was like an extra thing that they'd done for Nadal, which I was hoping that they would do. I said it yesterday. He's already got his statue here. I just wanted there to be something else. There's already a piece de rafa naval. It's very hard. You don't want to disrespect the musketeers and rename the trophy. Things have already got a name. It's hard to rename stuff.

And what they came up with was unveiling a plaque on the court which they swept away the clay to unveil it. And it was Rafael Nadal's footprint. the trophy and the number 14 to signal how many times he's won this tournament and I think it's very hard to know what to do But I'm glad they did something. I think it's pretty cool. There's a permanence to it. Nadal's achievements here are kind of immortal and there's an immortality to that.

being part of the court here at Roland Garros. So I liked that moment as well. So I thought in that sense there were these real highs in among a ceremony that at times Felt like maybe we've seen this before.

And also there were the moments when Nadal teared up, talking about Uncle Tony, his iconic grandmothers in their 90s got great cheers as well, which I really, really enjoyed. Things like that. So personally... I think being in the stadium probably did help I know there was a lot of criticism of

commentators on the broadcast you know talking over it and maybe missing some of the moments but I think it worked in the stadium and I think there was a lot of people in that stadium who I think were pretty emotional and pretty pleased to be here.

David? Yeah, I share most of what Nat feels about it and I think... The thing is, he explained in his press comments afterwards how uncomfortable he usually feels when he's the center of attention if it's not for hitting a ball.

He says I am still quite shy and there were moments where I looked at him and I thought oh dear he just wants this over because he's even when he's getting this absolute standing ovation because it goes on and on and on and on he didn't know what to do with himself really he's just a little a little self-conscious i think

but equally I think he felt it was important to do it and he said as much in his press conference, I'm glad that I had the chance to do this and it was the right time. Everything about him was him at peace. with his decision and feeling that I want to do this because I want to sort of show my appreciation to a lot of people, all the people that had been working backstage with him, drivers and people that had organized things for him over the last 20 years.

the crowd, the French public with whom he's not always had the easiest relationship because they got Rafa fatigue, frankly, for a number of years. They didn't necessarily appreciate him for a period as much as perhaps he would have hoped but they fell in love with him at the end and and you know it's a relationship that he's clearly just just wanted to give them respect back hence him speaking in French which isn't his most comfortable language

But what struck me more than anything, and I've seen this throughout decades of working with players on the Champions Tour, they're most at ease with each other. And the moment that Federer came out, particularly Federer, I think Murray as well, and to an extent Djokovic. I don't think he and Djokovic will ever be really close, but there's an appreciation of what each other has meant to one another.

I still feel like you suddenly saw the real man there. The man who's sort of just comfortable with his peers and they breathe that rarefied air of having won more than anybody else in the men's game ever. I liked the touches and I thought it was pretty cool, even if it did seem to go on forever. Maybe it's the difference of having been in the stadium and not.

It was obviously a highly in demand event and we, the tennis podcast, were only given two tickets to be in the press seats to watch it. So I watched it down in the media center. And look, I agree with all the takes. I found those moments that you described just as impactful. I audibly gasp. at the at the reveal of Federer, Murray and Djokovic and I knew they were going to be there but the way they did it with the video messages that glitz

And then the cut to them all standing there backstage. It was masterful. That was absolutely beautifully done and iconic. And I loved the moments with them walking onto court and the embrace.

feel like they should have done that right at the start cut all of the stuff with him stood there in the middle at Electon like he was giving a keynote address yeah I agree with you on this and that was the majority of it I know we'll remember the moments but there was 30 minutes there of nadal stood there delivering a load of thank yous which were lovely but like

I thought this was about us appreciating him or the tournament appreciating him and him standing there thanking all the people close to him that presumably he's thanked quite previously in private, you know, over the years.

I thought that was a real misfire especially given the fact that him standing alone in the middle of the court was what was so roundly criticized about or one of the elements that was so roundly criticized about malaga so look i'm sure in the fullness of time we'll just remember the moment And they really were great. The t-shirts, the visuals, that worked. The interpretive dance didn't. Not sure anyone will remember that in the fullness of time.

There was a great moment when the camera cut to Nadal watching the interpretive dance and the director obviously went, no, cut away from that. His face isn't quite doing what we want it to do. But yeah, I feel like... I don't know I'm still for the moment remembering the the 30 minutes of Nadal delivering a speech on his own in the middle with a random lectern that I thought was a bit odd.

I agree with that. I just have to think that Nadal wanted to speak. I can't imagine that they, as you said, David, he's not all that comfortable doing it. I can't imagine they forced him to do it. No and there was a afterwards you could see him chatting not quite backstage but in sort of holding pen.

area with Amelie Maresmo and she was anxiously checking like was it okay was that what you wanted and I'm sure he wouldn't have said no it was crap but you know he was reassuring her that He loved it and it was exactly what he...

what he wanted there was a gorgeous clip that came out that for me was better than anything during the during the actual ceremony but because of how wonderful this clip was of rafa with his son getting his son to give each of the big three the fellow big four members a high five and it was you just I mean that's just absolute gold isn't it it was so so special I also thought Hannah came up with a great suggestion for what the ceremony could have been, which was... all of his

opponents that he's beaten at Ronan Garros, giving him a guard of honour onto the court. I wouldn't. really enjoyed that and she said like people he's beaten twice having to run to the back and extend the guard of honor you know you have to be in it a number of times you've been beaten and then robin sodeling walks out or is sort of carried out on a throne by some greased up

Gladiator type people. Yeah. Look... I realized it was a very special thing to have been here for and if Raf is happy then fine. More than fine. Lovely. I did just have, and we'll come on to talk about the press conference, which David was in, and which sounds like it was, you know, I listened into... big chunks of it and it sounds like it was absolutely brilliant but I didn't pay attention to all of it because it coincided with kind of the best part of the day

tennis wise the part of the day where it finally felt like round one of a slam like oh there's lots happening and i don't quite have enough screens i was waiting for that feeling all day and part of it was the slightly soft launch order of play today part of it was the rain but you know it took it took a while to heat up today and finally we got that and everybody's bandwidth was being occupied by Rafael Nadal and it just didn't quite feel right that to me and I don't

If we've learned anything over the last few months and years, it's that I'm not sure there is a perfect way to do these retirement ceremonies. for either the player or for the tournament or for the crowds. There's no perfect solution, so I don't want to criticize them too hard, but with the benefit of hindsight, I wonder if yesterday... might have been the day for it. Yannick Noah Day, kind of unofficially Kids Day, cheap tickets, the t-shirt thing would have...

Imagine you come on a cheap ticket on Kids' Day and you get the Nadal ceremony. It could have been absolutely center stage yesterday. And I know the answer to why it wasn't yesterday. It was probably TV. you know the tv broadcast of the tournament didn't start till today and i'm sure all the broadcasters wanted to show that although the coverage i was watching they cut away from it quite a lot So maybe not, maybe I'm wrong about that.

do just wonder if yesterday would have been a more appropriate setting for it but it does sound like it was a

Barnstorming press conference David. Yeah, I wasn't expecting it to be, to feel about it like I did. It was one of those where you mentioned how many tickets we got.

to go in the stadium we had one between the three of us to actually be able to attend this press conference i was the lucky one to be able to do that i was about four rows back it was rammed and my word it was hot in there um but He very quickly made you forget about all that because he was just so open and so at ease and so kind of comfortable and content to be there and chat really and answer questions and make jokes I mean there was one great line I don't quite know what brought it up

But he said, you know, I hadn't heard from Andy Murray for quite some time. Some months, in fact. And then the night that Arsenal played Real Madrid. I got a text from Andy Murray one second after the match finished when Arsenal had beaten Real Madrid and it said, I Rafa, just wanted to check in on you and see how you're doing.

He said for the first, for about five seconds, I thought, oh, it's nice to hear from him. Oh, he's doing that. The British, he said. The British humour. And, you know, it was just things like that just lovely little moments in the press currency was some very significant ones you know sometimes You ask a player to pick out greatest moment of their career and they really struggle or they don't want to well you know he was asked which one of the 14

Ronan Garras is what you remember and he was very specific he said 2006 was maybe the most emotional and if you think that's when he was still a teenager that was his second one and it's because he'd had the foot problem which kept him out of the Australian Open. It sounds like that was a real worry for him back then. Real lots of doubts and of course he beat Federer in the final that year. He said the best I ever played was 2008.

but the most i ever suffered was 2022 the the last one he ever wanted the zombie foot yeah yeah um i i i he was asked about retirement and then he said nothing will i ever match the adrenaline but kind of that's okay it doesn't mean I can't be happy and I asked him Do you think you'll need to find a way to engage your competitive spirit again in your life because that characterized your career so much?

And he said, to be honest, for the first six months of this year, or five months of this year, I just I didn't have any competitiveness. I would play golf and I didn't feel competitive and I didn't like it. I felt really strange, you know, it wasn't a nice feeling to me. But the good news is I've got it again, he said. And, you know, look, he said, I think a life without goals is not something I want to live. But, you know, it'll never be the same, but I've got the competitive spirit.

back whether I'm playing golf or whatever I'm doing I mean obviously I'm curious as to whether he will Maybe want to become a Davis Cup captain one day or something like that. But he did seem really content to me. How soon before Andy Murray and Rafael Nadal are seen on a golf course together being overly competitive?

stunned we haven't had that content already actually yeah he did say something didn't he to Federer Murray and Djokovic during the ceremony which was kind of along the lines of our legacy in this sport is set Let's like continue to try and do good things in the sport and like continue to try and contribute to the sport Murray's already already gone back into the sport after retiring and been a coach and you know we're still kind of

Federer's obviously got the Labour Cup. But I think I don't know maybe I'd expect a little bit more from Federer in terms of you know when he said that line about I'll love you and I'll never leave you I thought maybe we would

He meant exclusively the Labour Cup and its promotion. We didn't realise at the time. It does appear so at the moment. But I just think maybe with Nadal, maybe... at this point now and having said that like maybe we're gonna get something more from there's an exhibition coming between those two oh yeah I think it's already

yeah it feels like already ready to go yeah um just just last couple of things on on Andy Murray number one I'm really glad that it that he is justifiably being included in all these types of ceremonies. There is a world in which these ceremonies are big three. yeah there's a lot of people who would think that it should be I said that to David coming out I was like I'm really glad that Murray was included in this because

If you lived through that era, it was a big fall. It was. That is the hill that Matt Roberts will die on. Absolutely. Because he didn't win anything, you know, they won 20-something each. He won what three? Yeah, but that's like what I'm saying like over the course of the career like there was a period there the peak golden period golden period where it was for Murray was winning you know

as many slams as Federer in that period pretty much. Federer wasn't winning loads of slams in that period. He won a lot before Djokovic obviously reached his peak and he then had that late surge at the end of his career. Mario was constantly there. He was competing with them. He was their rival. He was playing them in the biggest tournaments repeatedly and the fact that The fact that Nadal, Federer and Djokovic all talk about him in the way that they do.

says it all. You could tell they all wanted him there. They wanted him there. They respected him. And look, I don't mean for Stan Mavrinka to catch any strays here, but that's exactly why it's not a big five in my book. Because it didn't feel weird that Stan Mavrinka wasn't there. But I think maybe they could have done it as the three. You know, the big three is a thing too. That is a hill I will die on too. That is also a thing.

But to me, Big Five was never a thing, but Big Four absolutely was. And I'm really pleased that Murray was there, especially as he and Nadal have the history in terms of

I think they kind of were friendly, especially early on in their career. I really think Mario is an important guy for Nadal. I agree. It was important that Mario was there. It's unquestionably... right I think that he was there I would have rioted if he wasn't but I do think it's really plausible that he wasn't so well done everybody for him being involved And it also meant we got to see the incredibly awkward body language between Andy Murray and Novak Djokovic.

We were supposed to get Djokovic's press conference today. He's delayed until tomorrow. I don't know how honest he's going to be about the ending of that. beautiful friendship yeah I was I was more confident that he would be honest before I heard the answer that Matt let me hear from his Geneva press conference in which he very diplomatically sort of said we've just gone our separate ways but it but actually even even within what he said there I did think that doesn't sound completely

I don't want us to use the word amicable. I don't think there's necessarily been a massive fallout. That hasn't gone quite as everybody thought it was going to go. It certainly didn't look like a deepened friendship today, did it? No. It was funny because when they were first showing up on the screen, that moment where they were revealed, I was just so obsessed with it. I wasn't actually reading too much into it, but then when I actually looked at the photos,

They're leaning away from one another. The body language experts will have a good day with that. It's like when, you know, on... like dating analysis shows or you know when people's feet are pointing away If you're sitting on a date and your feet are pointing away from them, apparently you're not interested. Neither of them are interested in one another. No friendships are being deepened today.

When was the appropriate time for this and all of that because I had similar sort of conflicting thoughts like I found myself simultaneously thinking I'm such a day one slam person I want to be in the moment I want to be experiencing the buzz I don't really like it when something takes me out of that but then I also thought Do I not have an hour of my day or longer to like

celebrate Rafael Nadal and pay tribute to Rafael Nadal like he is the most historic player this tournament has ever seen like and I'm complaining a little bit of the ceremonies going on like I don't know I just kind of thought we do we are so guilty of like constantly sort of moving on to the next thing that part of me thought I really do want to

I really do want to celebrate this moment and this history and if that takes an hour then okay it's going to take an hour. But it could have taken an hour yesterday. I don't think it would have felt as impactful if it was before the tournament personally I think maybe there was a world where they didn't used to have a night session did they on the air but they didn't used to have it on the Sunday they've reintroduced that it felt like it should have been the last thing of the day

throwing a big party right if I found that maybe they look in I feel like they tried to do both but I think there was room to give this the space All due respect, I take your point. I don't think it's about your day though. I think it's about a sort of slight... disrespect to the tournament and the players that were happening and starting. As I'm saying, maybe they could have scheduled it differently. But I think complaining that it went on too long or whatever is a bit like...

In the grand scheme of things, it's not gone on. I mean, I would say... My complaint about it going on too long is that it just felt like it was going on a bit too long. If it was banger after banger and it went all that long. I think Nadal was saying what he wanted to say. Yeah, fair enough. I think trying to cut Nadal short. If he didn't want that he wanted to say what he wanted to say. So you think if he had three hours worth of speech to say he should have been allowed that?

Yeah, but I mean, he's not going to have three hours worth of speech. He's going to have 25 minutes. I don't know. I do take the point. I just think... 14 years maybe has earned it? Yeah. Like we will never see this again. I am all for him having a big ceremony and it taking up all the time in the world. I just think that could be done differently. It's not that I don't have oxygen to give two hours of my day to 14-time Roland Garros champion Rafael Nadal.

I'm wearing the t-shirt now. What more do you want from me? I watched the interpretive dance. We've got photos of the t-shirt. Okay.

Well, having complained about the fact that Rafael Nadal occupied so much of today, we should probably talk about some of the tennis that happened today. We'll do that in part two. We'll speak to you then. Welcome to Money Moves brought to you by Amazon Business The WNBA is in a facilities arms race, with more than half of the league's 13 teams having either announced plans to build new practice facilities or upgraded existing facilities within the last three years.

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Welcome back to part two of the tennis podcast on day one of Roland Garros where the Philippe Chatrier court was opened by the world number one and favorite for the women's title arena. Sabalenka, she dropped just one game to Camilla Rakimovas. 6-1, 6-love. It took one hour.

And at first glance this scoreline I thought, oh, Sabalenka's doing Sabalenka things, you know, in early rounds of slams. And then I saw a comment on the barge that flagged the fact that actually... she's not necessarily somebody that dishes out score lines this one-sided in early rounds of slams typically and so I checked the record and this is

the most one she's only had any school line this one-sided once in the last 12 months and bizarrely that was against madison keys at indian wells before that The last time she was dishing out bagels and breadsticks was during the Australian Swing in 2024 when she won the titles in Brisbane and Melbourne. Now look, this is one match, this is one data point.

We'll see how we go in a few rounds time. But if she keeps dishing out these type of performances, I don't think we should necessarily just go, oh, well, it's early rounds. It doesn't mean anything because that was, That was all business from Marina Sabalenka today. Yeah, and that's what she wants. She wants to stamp her number one. footprint on this tournament she showed it in the press conference she loves this and she's ready for everybody I mean let's not forget she might have

been going all the way and playing against Schvantek last year had it not been for falling ill in that match against Andreeva. You know, she's not as good maybe on clay as she is on the other surfaces, but I actually think that a similar level is in her and I think she's she's maybe she's maybe getting better as a world number one i know she lost to keys and if she'd have

somehow beaten keys in that australian open as well and being on that run that would have probably felt quite fitting really for her status generally all credit to keys but now this is exactly what she wants and i think yeah it's going to take something special to stop her. Xingqin Wen was next on to Philippe Chatre. She wasn't wasn't particularly troubled by anastasia pavlyuchenkova former finalists here four and three for zheng juman i didn't

I didn't see big chunks of this match. I dipped in and out and what I was struck by every time I looked at the screen was the aura of Jing Chin Wen. She looked to me like she had the demeanor and the gait of a defending champion. Like in her mind, that Olympic gold medal, that was the last time that she was on Chatrier.

She was stood on a podium with gold around her neck. It looked to me like she was channeling that into some serious confidence. And I've always, I've always when I've seen her in person I remember the first time feeling it was at the United Cup in Perth last year where I was in the same hotel as her and I would see her at breakfast and every time I'd see her up close I'd be like wow she is

she's a different breed you know like she's she's not like us mere mortals she is some athlete with and not just a sort of physical stature something about the the poise and the presence and the aura and I feel like she had that to a greater degree than I've really ever seen before on Chatier Today. Now, again, it's one data point. I don't know what it necessarily means, but it really was striking to me.

interesting yeah like you'd like to think that winning the gold medal would have would have that effect but you know might not have been that surprising if it had gone the other way you know like the buzz that the stadium had today for that match was absolutely nothing compared to the Olympic final. It was in one of those early slots on the day. It could have felt like a huge come down.

from the last time she was on Chatres. I think it's pretty impressive that she did carry this off against a dangerous opponent. I watched quite a bit of this and Jung won 11 on the first 12 points, I think. I came out playing really, really well and I thought maybe it was going to be extremely one-sided, but Pavlikchenkova did have her moments in this match.

When she and she just finds her range Pavlyuchenkova she's so dangerous because she does hit the ball so big and so flat Which is a serious problem, and she got that first set back level Back at four all but then

This was then the theme of the match. As soon as Pavlyoshenkova would break back or get it level, Zheung would step it up and Pavlyoshenkova would lose. It happened at the end of that first set, it happened twice in the second set as well, that Zheung would go and break up, it would get back and then she'd just break again. So yeah, like a really impressive start from Jung against someone I thought could have been a dangerous opponent, but she handled it really, really well.

There was a moment this evening when Matt and I were debating whether the podcast was going to end up being titled Are we overestimating Jasmine Paulini?

because the fourth seed the rome champion last year's finalist was in serious trouble out on longland this evening she was down a break in the deciding set against trainers yuan yui who was playing out of her mind and seemed to have that sort of slow heart rate thing going on where she was just tough as nails and in the big moment And Paolini just produced this tidal wave surge to win the final four games and clinch the match.

this diminutive little thing producing so much energy you know just bending this match to her will in those final four games with the Longland crowd going nuts. It was a pretty incredible thing. She could have lost this.

she really could have lost this match and a lot of people tend to look at men's tennis comebacks at grand slams maybe from two sets love down as the more impressive feet but actually It's those sort of... comebacks that I think really require some attention because you've got so little time left you know she's coming to this tournament as the Rome champion as one of the we've finally put her in a mix and here she is

heading towards the exit on day one of the tournament and she's got so little time to sort something out how you don't panic and end up just making it worse I don't know but that's not her is it it's digging Make every ball, make her play and find that energy, find that little something that she has. Jasmine Paolini and all credit to her. I don't like to be biased, but I'm really happy that she's still in the tournament. Yeah, it was like a power surge. It was.

He was unbelievable out there. On the same court, Alina Svitolina was the first winner of the tournament. She was scheduled first on Longland today to Breadstick. against Zeynep Sonmez. David, you were there for first ball on Longland, of course. I sat two rows behind the coach of the Turkish player and he was getting very excited when she got a game.

But the truth is you saw the levels there. I mean she hit the ball well but Svitolina hits the ball well and has a real plan as to how she's going to break you down and she looked good. David is just drawn to Long Glen. It's absolutely fascinating. You're just like in its gravitational pull, correct? You know like there was there was discussion about the order of pie like is it

Is that a good enough order of play on Longland for day one? Where's our really fun Frenchman with the crowd? David was considering, maybe I'll just wait. Until I have a perfect first long run experience when he was like No, I'm going to go for first ball in the front row and watch Svitolina because that sounds great too. When the older play for tomorrow came out, I was obviously focusing on the predictably egregious sexism of it and Dave was like,

What are you talking about, Art of Faces on Long Legs? Shut up. I'm going to spend the whole day in order to get my seat at the end of the day. It's so great.

i'll tell you who else is great victoria mboko i know we we knew this matt fatterman's been telling us this but we kind of got a taste of of her for the first time today and and we were not disappointed she beat lulusan 6176 and she now plays ava lease who we will also talk about in in a moment but first some some flowers for Victoria Mboko who is I'm so invested now, David. Yeah, well, I could tell by the WhatsApp group. There are lots of exclamation marks after backhand winners.

And that was when I was on my way to the court. Because you were watching in the media center there on the TV. And I got there and she was already 6-1. And it was about 2-2 in the second set against Lulu's son. Suddenly Lulu Sun started to play well, and I'm standing on sort of back balcony looking over there at the court and there was about a 12-minute game at 2-3 down from Boku where she's in a 10-juice game and she fought off about five break points in that game.

And she did it with everything, you know, because Lulison was playing so well. She did it with guts, she did it with persistence and consistency and tenacity. But she also did it with just massive power.

huge hitting and There was there was a moment where actually when she got some to match point where she just puts the hammer down on the serve and then she hit an inside out backhand winner just a cold winner you know this is a player with a with a serve that has a sound to it you know it's one of those that you just you're aware that that is just proper power And she was great in the press conference room as well, I thought. We were both in there, Katherine. Yeah.

I've developed two new favourite players on day one of Roland Garros 2025, and unfortunately they're playing one another in round two. Bit of a disaster for me, because Mboko is playing Ava Lees, who... Everyone's dark horse seemingly on the women's side Peyton Stearns today. Incredible win for Overlease. Peyton Stearns obviously hasn't been the same since she was doorstepped by David. It's the end of a very funny bit, isn't it? A couple of weeks ago we had...

Ghost of Geralitis commenting on our YouTube show persistently that Peyton Stearns is gonna win the French Open. Laughed it off as absolutely insane. She then goes and beats. Keyes, Asarco and Svitolina in final set tie breaks in Rome and has this sort of historic run there to the semi-finals. Incredible! Ben David doorsteps her like Peyton Stearns is just we're just thinking and talking about Peyton Stearns all the time and I go out and watch her first round match

which is 6-2-2 down to Ava Lees, who's a really, really good player. And Stearns just didn't have it today. Like, just the game was, nothing like it was in run error-ridden her attitude probably wasn't wasn't what she needed like a morning person to me I know a fellow one of those when I see one. I kind of just thought like Benton's was ready for a competitive contest any time of the day. I just wasn't there. Lise was clever. She was really changing the direction so well on her shots.

Not allowing the pattern of a forehand to forehand exchange to develop because Stearns definitely would have would have benefited from those, but at least is, is really clever in those rallies and absolutely deserve to win a match that was largely played in pretty driving rain as well you know it was wet this morning I thought it was going to get postponed at various points but yeah an impressive win for Lees and

the conclusion of one of my favorite bits that we've had in recent times with Peyton Stone's. Matt, you've followed Lisa a little more closely than I have in recent times because she was on your fantasy team, of course, and she scored you some very big, very unexpected points. Yeah, and I picked her to be on my fantasy team because,

I liked watching her play and she beat the Samova at Wimbledon qualifying last year. We watched that and we were really impressed by her. She then had that incredible run in Australia getting to the fourth round as a lucky loser. But yes, regrettable for me that Peyton Stearns remains at my fantasy team and they release. It does not.

How good can she be in your opinion? Because I'm suddenly invested in her being a really big deal. I want her to... be as big a deal as possible she's at a career high of 59 in the world right now that was her first Roland Garros main draw win like she's 23 we're not talking like late bloomer territory here but she's she's not a teenager and actually

That age I find particularly interesting because if you're 23 now, you were 18 when COVID hit there or thereabouts. And I do wonder if there's a data study to be done on that age group of... players who were disrupted at such a formative critical transitional stage of their career and

Avelisse not only had COVID hit as we all did in 2020 but that was also the year we learned today via a piece that our German colleague Yannick Schneider did with her for Eurosport and that we asked her about in the press conference. It was also the year she was diagnosed with an autoimmune condition called spondyloarthritis which causes chronic lower back pain and an inflammation and she she said you know i asked her about it in the press conference today and

could not have been a better conversation like i i could have i could have talked to her about it all afternoon really because um yeah i've got my own lower back issues um and uh yeah she said it's taken a a few years really the past five years to learn how to calibrate her training and her pain management because of this condition and she said she's had a great doctor with her throughout like the same doctor she said she was a kid and she said if it wasn't for that doctor she you know she

she could have been at risk of really kind of mentally spiraling about it. She said he really reassured me that if we do this right, then it doesn't need to hold you back. But doing it right is a big part of her life. There are periods when... she she has no choice but to rest you know she's constantly having to assess where the boundary is and where the trade-off is between a training session that could improve her form or a technique, but could also cost her in the longer run.

She's brilliant. How good can she be? Well, I think the autoimmune disorder is an important element of that conversation. I think there's absolutely no doubt about it that it is to some degree holding her back or gonna hold her back like she can't as you said she can't train in the same ways that a lot of these top players are training. She's finally learning ways to bring the absolute best out of herself that she spoke about.

if she does push it when she gets these flare-ups and then she can't do anything for five or six days and you know she's done so incredibly well to reach a point now I think where she where she can manage it And from here, I definitely think she can be even higher than she's currently got to.

I think there are some limitations in her game. Her serve is not particularly big, it's quite attackable. And the forehand... you know there's just a lot of better forehands on the tour so she's got a good backhand but then i was talking to yannick schneider about this And he said, well, we used to say the same about Angelic Cup. Can't really serve. And has a bit of a weakness on the forehand. And I think there are, it's a different game generally.

I think the sort of example of Angelique Kerber just as a reminder like never write, never like properly write someone off and Stearns lease absolutely is coming into the best portion of her career right now.

Yannick said that he thinks if she can just be a consistent top 50 player pushing up towards around 30 he sees that as that would be a real achievement for her career given given everything that she kind of has to has to experience and some of those limitations but there are great parts to her game too and I'd absolutely love it if she can be that that consistent in every draw you know just a release is in the draw and is

is going to beat some players along the way. That would be great because As you said, within half of them all. yeah and she's fantastic in press conferences you do she if there's an important issue she will she will speak on it and she will say something really interesting on it as well so if we can just get Avalice to be that player then that would be fantastic I think for the sport yeah agreed

Ukrainian parents and realized that until... Speak so many languages. So many languages. English completely fluently. uh speaking of ukrainians by the way manta kostik got taken apart earlier by the czech teenage qualifier Sara Bailick. She hasn't come into press yet Kostiuk and I will be seeking out the quotes when she does because I do wonder if there was something going on here.

fit to me from what i saw of this match but she looked anguished and exhausted so I do wonder if there's a story there but Sara Bailick was Unreal. She's got some chutzpah about her, one of those.

low center of gravity, incredible angles, she's a lefty, just gets low into the court and drives through the ball and you're like... where's that come from um so uh yeah i i don't want to take anything away from her but i do wonder if there's a bit of a story there because it was so one-sided and cost it looked in sort of state of despair at points during this match Donna Vekic needed a big reset after losing the second set, a Pam Shriver reset.

uh to come back and i'm winning three against anna blink of a good win for donna vecch there who's had a a tough few weeks and months then schneider looked to be in a spot of bothering really weird match against um the qualified anastasia sobolieva 7662 she won schneider despite seemingly turning her ankle quite badly at the end of the first set and then kind of improving from that point onwards.

Yeah, it was a very strange match because she was 5 love up in the first set. Like, she never should have been in. that situation where she was, you know, in a first set tie break, she just... I think when it goes, it goes.

for Schneider. I think we saw that against Paulini in Rome, where she just suddenly couldn't find the court, couldn't make a ball, and that kind of happened again here. I think maybe a little bit of scar tissue has formed from... from that row match but yes she's then Suddenly down in that first set and rolls her ankle, gets her foot.

stuck in the clay all her weight goes on it she's yeah it's a really horrible fall she's immediately in tears at the net has a long medical time out gets it taped first three points after the restart and I was thinking oh god no she can't move but actually she then broke back and came alive in the tie break had an absolutely stunning forehand pass on the run at one stage and

in that and yeah maybe a little bit like we talked about yesterday it was kind of like the injury got her out of that of that sort of bad moment she was in when she lost six games in a row and then she maybe freed up a bit and played a lot better after as you said I would be worried about what it might be tomorrow that ankle I mean that was a bad that was a bad role definitely affected her so

a bit worried about the rest of her tournament, but an impressive win nonetheless. Petra Kvitova, the last really notable women's result to bring in. She lost in three sets. to Victoria Golubich kind of same pattern as Most of her matches since coming back decent start and then a real physical fade from her so she's she's still struggling for For fitness on her comeback trail that is it for the women's matches today. We'll be back part three with the men's and with a look ahead to tomorrow

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welcome back to part three of the tennis podcast on day one of roland garros and let's be honest it was it was slightly slim pickings on the men's side today wasn't it yeah it was i mean to be honest to some degree all the way around i feel today it was it was a soft launch it was yeah it was um and i think that that just happens sometimes doesn't it i mean what i don't know what were your

Can you think of one that really stands out on the men's side? Because I must admit, I only really watched the women's matches and the Nadal ceremony today, really.

Elmer Moller and Tommy Paul was fun. It got not that fun pretty quickly. and suddenly felt really inevitable very quickly 6 7 6 2 6 3 6 1 this for Tommy Paul over on Simone Mathieu the first first match of the day over there and they had about

eight different kinds of weather throughout the course of this match. It was so windy. There was rain, there was intermittent sunshine it was quite cold at times there was it was really a lot going on and it was a very unusual match in that there was a significant Forehand deficit.

to backhand on both sides of the net it's not unheard of in men's tennis that a player has a stronger backhand than forehand but pretty unusual to have both players with such a strong imbalance in favour of the backhand and there were some great backhands today really ugly forehands. Tommy Paul seemed quite amused by Amma Muller's backhand, the way he was moving around.

the forehand to be able to hit inside out backhands. I just don't think you've seen that before. Yeah, I think that was what made the first set so interesting because it forced Tommy Paul to change what he usually does because Tommy Paul is usually one of the players who I think backs himself in backhand rallies. He's got a lovely backhand that he leans on. He hits it very flat, his forehand technique.

Is a bit susceptible to Tommy Paul, but was today yeah and but it forced him to change what he was doing he was getting himself involved in forehand to forehand exchanges which he doesn't normally want to be doing but because I think he was a little bit intimidated at times by the Mahler backhand the The thing that really stands out to me on that shot, the Mahler backhand, is his ability to punish balls with no pace.

normally players put away balls with no pace with their forehand you know that's the that's the stroke where I can generate the racket head speed and just thrash a winner away with the forehand but Moller does it off the backhand and he's much more comfortable doing it if it's just there to be here it just puts all of his body into it and puts it away

It's really impressive how he generates pace off no pace on the backhand. It was a fun first set, went to a tie-break pool, had a mini-break, Moller got it back and won the set on a forehand, in fact. But it was kind of like... He only really had that set in him to be able to trouble a really really top player like Paul and I think by the end Moller had some injury problems as well in it and it did become a lot less

But for a set, I agree with you, I really enjoyed that first one. I went over there after watching the first set of Lee's Stearns.

The Tommy Paul truck saga has definitively reached its conclusion. He confirmed today that he has got the truck back. And I don't think he suffered any repercussions. He insists that it was all a misunderstanding. He said he missed, he switched bank. He's now with Goldman Sachs, there's some detail. And he forgot to switch his auto pay on the truck payment. and he therefore missed three payments and he only discovered the truck had been Toad repossessed, essentially, temporarily repossessed.

because he was checking his cameras on his house to see if he had any packages delivered for his fitness trainer who lives around the corner to go and collect for him so they didn't get nicked and he went to check his camera and he was like... There's no packages but there's also no truck. So that was some nice detail. Still totally in the dark about why multi-millionaire seven times over, career prize money today, $11.5 million plus endorsements, Tommy Paul.

was paying for a Ford truck in installments. presumably paying significant interest on it truly baffling we know we know that it was a forward effort 1.50 that was a busy day today but I found time you found time in a day for Rafa and the Dalmat I found time in my day to

go on the ford website and see how much one of these might set me back you pimped it up on the forward yeah well i thought what is the maximum this can possibly have cost multi-millionaire tommy paul okay so the most expensive version of that car was a raptor Now that costs in the most soup time. version, including an ash cup with lighter, a cover, a unique set of 17 inch forged aluminium beadlock capable wheels. and a 5.2 litre supercharged v8 engine that'll set you back 115 950

Look, it's not a cheap car. I'd be needing to put that on credit. Just a bit. But I wouldn't expect Tommy Paul to be doing that. Or should we be worried about his solvency? he's got it under control it's bad i mean he he doesn't seem worried but i am on his behalf there are he thinks the saga is over but for me questions Questions remain. Yeah, so many questions. I hear this story and I think I really hope that someone else in Tommy Paul's life is organizing his anti-doping.

Yeah. Because otherwise he's missing tests, isn't he? Right? I just hope, I mean, presumably he has because he hasn't, to my knowledge, you know, well, he certainly hasn't got a doping ban or anything, but I just hope there's people. I'm not sure you can afford people now. I was going to say maybe he's got PA, but...

Yeah. Lorenzo Mazzetti beat Yannick Hanfman on Chatrier today. 7-5, 6-2. Six Love, described by David as a dissection, which I love. He's an artist, Ms Mazzetti. He's one of the few players that can win. match without any sort of jeopardy and it's still hugely enjoyable because he's just so fun to watch such a glorious sight when he's got time. The thing is when he plays maybe Sinner and Alcraz he doesn't have that all that time but what a player.

I'm sad, he's changed kit. Yeah, it was quite short-lived, the toga kit. It's fine, this new kit, but it's just a kit, isn't it? It's just not what it was. uh lorenzo sonnigan ben shelton is ongoing right now and will probably be so for many hours we could be on for a post midnight finish on the first day of the tournament folks Thomas Mahatch is retired so lots of things just don't change.

In fact, his opponent walked past us a few moments ago, poor old Thomas Mahatch, did hit a jump forehand winner in the opening set.

He's given us something. Hope he's okay. And David asked about highlights. I wasn't expecting my men's highlight of the day to be Mpeshi Perry car. Yeah, but actually... No, you weren't. You said earlier there's only two matches happening at the moment because it was raining at the time and one of them's in Pesci Perry car. It's definitely time to go to lunch. Yeah, I stand by it. And yet...

Vibes I'm a bit gutted actually because I kept planning to get out there for one of the six five Changeovers and then something happened Nadal's ceremony and all sorts of things were going on and I couldn't make it It was five love down in in the third set tie break be a crucial moment of the match five love down and Pescipericart and he came back to win it he then he had two aces bad forehand from Bergs in the net

Great pass from a Pesci Perry car probably shouldn't have been allowed to hit it Bergs probably should have put the volley away then two Massive serves massive forehands to get to set point from Pesci Perry car and then a double fault from Berg

so it's like there was a classic two things going on bergs really letting it slip and pesciperi car just absolutely hitting the top top notes of his game and there were scenes like the crowd was so into it it was the best scenes of the day David wasn't there Charlie Akoshe put it well, it was just less linear than a normal Mbessi-Perry car match it had.

It had moments that even when he went to serve out of the match, you thought, okay, this is over. But it actually got broken. And then he broke again. You know, it just had those twists and turns that you don't always get. You're rubbing it in now.

I bring good news about tomorrow, David. Tomorrow is going to make up for it for you. This is what tomorrow looks like on Chatres starting at midday local time. Rebecca Shrumkova. against Iga Svyontek, the defending champion. Then it is Naomi Osaka against Paola Badosa. Then, once the women are out of the way, enter Rashad Gasquet and Terence Atman.

I think I can find something else to do during that. I mean, I don't mean to be mean, but... There's probably going to be a Gasco ceremony after the Nadal ceremony, isn't there? Yeah. Which is entirely fitting. And then in the night session, it's Arta Rindeknesh. Will he do a scorpion kick and then get his feet out and then retire? That's what he did last year, wasn't it? Scorpion kick.

blisters retirement mm-hmm and they ever fall it got involved in tremendous aggro with Taylor leading to have a safe flight home yeah so I somehow doubt that will happen against Sinner but it is like the small point on this is obviously Sinner receives an amazing reception back in Rome

expected really receive such a good reception here in France against a Frenchman well they were they want a villain out there and and make a thing of Yannick's and I don't think so like it's I think for most people,

It's hard to hate Yannick Sinner And I think he'll probably just win quite easily and there won't be that much for the crowd to get into but It's a small element of the match that is intriguing to me. We're all black again Yannick lean into it be johnny cash uh long len tomorrow starts with jessica boothas monero against emma navarro then uh zepieri what's his first name g i'm gonna go giovanni r as julio

Julio Zepieri against Carlos Alcaraz. Alcaraz starting his campaign on Longland. That's not unheard of. I remember Nadal once started as defending champion. on Longland. I think he'd rather play Long Land Day session. I think you'd rather play anywhere day session than chaturay night session. Right in front of me.

Third on is potentially Caroline Garcia's last French Open match. She takes on Bernardo Pera. And then finally on Long Then Tomorrow, David, it is Nicolas Jarry against Arta Fies. I cannot wait. Mathieu tomorrow, Caspar Rude taking on Albert Ramos Vinyalas. Daniel Altmaier against Taylor Fritz. Katie Bolter against Simone. Claude Carroll.

It's spelled differently. You get it. Katie Bolter against Carol Monnet, the French qualifier and then finally madison keys and the aussie qualified darius savile court 14 is where you find elena rabackina tomorrow also stanford rinka former champion is third on court 14 tomorrow

Hugo and bear is there that could be a vibe against Chris O'Connell although you're going back isn't a vibe here is he what he tries to be I remember watching him against Sona go on long last year and he was really trying to do the sort of fist pumps and get the crowd going back

He really didn't look very comfortable doing it. And before you know it, Sonigo's kind of taken over that vibe himself because that's the type of fella he is. Court 7 tomorrow is where you find Holger Runa. I wonder if you'll post a helpful match. to that court online for his fans. Hugo Gaston is first on court seven tomorrow and he's taking on a fellow Frenchman which I reckon he's

pretty unhappy about, right? The French don't want to be playing other French here. They want the crowd entirely on their side. And of course, Gaston. No, I've got that wrong. It's Mutay that can potentially face Djokovic in round two, isn't it? Need that match to happen. Krejcikova, former champion Barbara Krejcikova also.

On court 7 tomorrow. Doubt she's happy about that court assignment either. And Sitsa Passa so I was out on court 6. Wow. Which, you know, maybe isn't that surprising in the moment, but I'd be... shocked if he's played many matches here away from Chatrier and Longland in the last few years. Potentially former finalist Sit-to-Pass is going to be on court six whilst Terence Atman and Richard Gasquet are on Chatrier.

Erad Akarnu is first on court eight tomorrow. Daniel Collins is also on court eight. Tomorrow is a proper Grand Slam day, isn't it? Grand Slam round one day. it's gonna feel like it tomorrow can't wait definitely is for david uh folks we have a mascot

for today's show. That mascot is Clara who is owned by Steph, Theo and Max. Clara is a two-year-old rescue from Louisiana. She was adopted as a puppy and she's now a big sister to human baby Maxine. Max loves Clara and Clara tries to keep her anxieties in check on behalf of her. Everyone is looking forward to our home tournament, the City Open. We'd love to see the pod in Washington. I would like to come to Washington as well. The humidity does concern me.

It looks like a wonderful city. Maybe I'll visit outside of tournament time. absolutely lovely i would i wonder let us know steph whether you've done one of those dog dna tests Although I do, I actually do have doubts over their accuracy. But I would like to know what a dog DNA test would say about Clara's heritage. I reckon there's

Maybe a bit of Labrador in there. Possibly a bit of Beagle. David's looking at me blankly. But a whole lot of loveliness, Steph. Clara is... She's just dictionary definition of dog, I would say. Lovely stuff. There you go You're both looking at me like I'm an alien. Just enjoying hearing about Clark. More dogs. Hello to Phoebe. Hello to Maisie. Hello to Roger. Hello to our executive producers and top folks, not dogs. Greg, Chris and Jeff.

And over to Matt for shoutouts. I think what I might have been doing is figuring out how I'm going to pronounce this first shoutout. We have had... Jasper before Jasper van den Drescher oh my alley pronunciation wise from a small town near Bruges in Belgium So we'll assume that's a Flemish name. And Jasper says that he thoroughly enjoyed tennis relive.

on the 2005 australian open that we did back in january for friends i enjoyed that too yeah the saffin backhand yeah serena williams winning the title it's a good one thank you jasper jaspers jasper is an excellent name isn't it don't think there are tennis jaspers will you settle for yes but a young that's all i was thinking of Please accept Jesper de Jong with our apologies Jasper and thank you.

We've also got Dorinda. Hello, Dorinda. Hi, Dorinda. Dorinda Bonanno. That's a good name. Who is originally from Melbourne, but now lives in Connecticut. Great. Are you going to do it, Catherine? That we've driven through Connecticut. Dorinda says, you keep mentioning driving through Connecticut. Until I have another Connecticut-based experience, Dorinda, that is what I'll be mentioning.

Well, Dorinda's provided us with a fact. Okay. Did you know that Connecticut is home to the first hamburger, Polaroid camera, helicopter and colour television? Just saying. Gotta love the fact that Dorinda's coming around facts. And they're better than ours. I can't I'll give it that. Can't argue with that. Dorinda doesn't need to hear the story about me being refused use of the toilets in a Connecticut Dunkin Donuts again. Thank you, Dorinda. And finally, we have Yolanda Baron.

Hello Yolanda. Hi Yolanda. Who was born in Barcelona, grew up in Mexico City and now lives in New Jersey. Yolanda says like Yolanda Ramirez twice a finalist at the French Open and also a doubles champion here in the 60s. Brilliant. And Yolanda came to our New York live show last year. I was just going to say, shout out New Jersey folk to hopefully come to our New York live show this year. August 21st, save the date. Details coming soon.

Please come back Yolanda, we've got a bigger boat this time. And Yolanda says that she later met us, Catherine, at the US Open after the match between Junqin Wen and Amanda Anisimova. Matt was very disappointed that Anisimova had lost.

I think I remember that moment actually definitely checks out Yolanda thank you you've done our work for us which is most lovely and I actually have one additional shout out if I may bend the rules that shout out is for Chrissy Hunter hello Chrissy and Chrissy is the mum of the wonderful Vicky Spreadbury, who we work with every day now. and has genuinely changed our lives and Vicky's mum Chrissy is feeling a bit under the weather at the moment and she listens to the show so we wanted to send her

Best wishes and deepest thanks for bringing Vicky into the world. You have got a diamond of a daughter there, Chrissy. Honestly, a diamond. I know you know that, but... There it is. Yeah. Genuinely changed our lives this year. I can't believe there was A time that we did a tennis podcast without Vicky. Just the best.

Yeah. Get well soon, Chrissie. Get well soon. Get well soon, Chrissie. The Tennis Podcast is proudly part of the Athletic Podcast Network and there is one last bit of business today something that the listeners have been hanging on for for the past hour the final installment of the big saga

Matt Roberts versus Amanda Anisimova reached its conclusion today folks. This is the moment you have all been waiting for. I can't do an interview with you and not talk about your backhand. The listeners to our show know that it's my favourite shot in the sport. I've always wondered, like, how does it feel to hit that shot?

Yeah, I mean, it feels good. It's one of my favorite shots, back and down the line. So, yeah, I try and use it, try and go for it. So, yeah, I mean, it's one of my weapons, so it definitely feels good when it's on. Heads up trading card collectors. It's easier than ever to get your cards graded with grading by PSA now on eBay listings. All you got to do is find the card you want, add grading and make your purchase.

Yeah, just like that. Plus, for a limited time, shipping from PSA to you is free. It's the easy way to build an epic collection. Learn more at eBay.com slash PSA. Hey, this is Paige DeSorbo from Giggly Squad and this episode is brought to you by Nordstrom. Summer's here and with weekend getaways, celebrations, and more on your calendar, Nordstrom has everything you need for your best dress season ever. From playful prints and breezy fabrics to 70s inspired looks and bright handbags,

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