Ted Lasso | S3 Ep12 Part6 "So Long, Farewell"

So yeah , so I was not a wrestler in high school , but I did go to Polytechnic , preparatory , country Day School and so part of the whole intramurals thing there was that intramural thing . There was the blue team and the gray team , so when we had our big color wars week , pretty much everybody did all the sports .

It was like the Olympics in your grade and every grade was doing it , so it's like a big thing throughout the school . So anyway , we had to do wrestling and I was one skinny summoner gun .

So all my buddies who I walked around with and seemed like the same size as were all in their weight classes and I was in the weight class with the decidedly smaller guys , but they actually weren't smaller than me . I was actually now allowed to be with guys who were my actual size and I pinned a guy in seven seconds . That is my claim to fame .

That was one time in my life that I was like let me make myself clear , it's too much work , I'm not doing it .

Yeah , all of you . Yeah , and the coach and the sport , or he Greco's and Romans , all of them , All of it .

It's a beautiful , wonderful , weird , weird sport wrestling is , and I guarantee you now there are some extremely rich tech pros in Silicon Valley who have some sort of drill sergeant person or whatever screaming at them to keep running in their sweats and trash bags . I am sure that they're spending $10,000 a session or like over many to make somebody do that .

Yeah , no , I know like , that's what they do now .

Good times were had by all except the guy who got pinned .

It's one of the saddest words because , like when I came in last in any of my swim meets , like everybody was already out of the water Nobody cares , like it was almost an afterthought that I was coming in , there's somebody still a laugh behind somebody else , but in wrestling it's like there was one guy who won and one guy who got his ass kicked .

And now actually there's girl sports too . So feminism women can also be ashamed in front of their parents .

I mean , I remember I said I was quick pinned once . So quick pin definition is where , at least where I grew up , was was inside of a minute , not inside of seven second coach , which is like basically you're still , I'm guessing you never let go of his hand at the handshake before you start and just hold him down and gank him .

But wow , coach , wow , that is a . I don't know if I've ever seen a seven second pin and I wrestled , for that's a lot , that's no joke .

But yeah , wrestling is an amazing sport and only yeah , I understand the crazy element to it . It was really what took me out of it . I wrestled and played hockey . They're both winter sports and I couldn't choose . For a long time I loved them both for you know very , very different reasons .

But in the end I remember thinking whenever I when you get on the ice as a hockey player , you do these little chop steps and I know that the the king of butter cups is listening to this and we'll totally get this

. You do these little chop steps to get up speed . Like you go from the rubberized floor , you're walking with your skates and you step over this . It's always like a kick a trized , torn up plastic threshold where the board area is . Like you close the boards , there's always this torn to pieces sort of plastic threshold .

You step over that because you don't want to get like . Usually the plastic catches dirt and things like that . You just don't want any of that in your skates because you don't want to lose an edge while you're playing . So you step over that , you get onto the ice and then you do these little chop steps where you kind of get up and you get up to speed .

And then when you're at speed and the wind is going through your mask and you're like , oh yeah , I couldn't run this . You know , it's just like , feels so good . And every time I take a little time off from playing hockey , I remember , oh my God , these moments of like . Once you get back , I'm like I'm home , I'm home , it feels like being home .

I haven't even I'm not even have a puck on my stick yet and I'm already like this is , this is where I belong . Whereas with wrestling you wake up in the morning and then you go to this thing called the weigh in and you're invariably a pound and a half or two pounds overweight . You got to wrestle it . For me it was 140 .

In high school , and I was like my natural weight was probably 160 . You know what I mean Like , but I was like 0% body . You have no fat on you at all and you have to get down and you have , like you have , like you know , an hour and a half to like basically burn that off . So what coach was referring to was people you know you would get .

In our case it would be getting a shower room .

You put on your this like sort of running suit , was insulated running suit , and it had like a terry cloth inner sort of thing , or cotton inner , and almost like a water resistant outer kind of thing , and then you'd put plastic bags over you , put a hole in a plastic bag , put it over you , and then you get a , a hose , like a , like a , like a hose ,

that , like a garden hose , what . And you just start . You just you turn on the water as hot as it could in the room and you stand in the middle of the room with all the steam and you would just start doing what do you call it ? A skipping rope , yeah , skipping rope . Yeah , with the , with the hose that's heavy hose , yeah .

And then you'd go check in , way in , and the guy would go , yep , okay , you made it . And then you would go to the at least in our school you'd go , and then you'd eat 40 pounds of food .

You're so hungry and so depleted and then you had to wrestle that day later on after school and then you do it all over again the next match and I remember being like I think the first one's better , I think the I'm home sensation is a little more welcoming .

But yeah , no , no , it takes , takes all kinds and they're both absolutely amazing sports and I never , never , fail to be amazed when I see really , really legitimately skilled wrestlers . So I wish , wish you luck , wish your son all the luck and it'll be .

I get the sense they don't , or maybe just at his school , it's not where they are , but that they don't do as much like of the cutting weight .

You know by that , those kinds of margins at this point , and I feel like I had heard some stuff over the years where they were like , yeah , just because they're well , not no longer only boys , but just because they're boys doesn't mean that we should like have them yo-yoing their weight through high school .

So I think that's not a thing , cause I asked like , oh , what weight class would they have you in ? And it was very close to his normal weight and I thought , huh , that's not how I remember it . But good , oh good , yeah , I don't want you to do it on healthy things , but yeah , sorry anyway .

There was also a thing where just unless you were actually wrestling all year and a couple of the guys on the team works , they were extraordinary , but otherwise it was just you would like lose five pounds once you actually started working out all the time , and then that would be your weight for the season .

Okay , and so it was like maybe a couple of pounds here or there , but basically , once you were in shape , you were staying where you were .

And you're like so what are we doing ?

I'm really glad you did that for a period .

Wow , wrestling is great , cutting weight is bad . Yeah , I'm glad to see that , that that more for way , because that that did seem like I can't .

The worst the worst , the worst wrestlers on her team would have folded me like a pancake , oh , really , instantly . And I was , and I was a good wrestler , yeah , where I was . But it is like it's a religion in the gotcher , it's like soccer in Brazil kind of thing . But the but .

You would see that you would think , oh man , I just did two days at football like I'm in great shape , right . And then you wrestling coach would be like are you like ?

There's a very , very simple thing called spins , or some people call table spins there's all different names for them where you have a partner and he goes on all fours on the ground , and so it's hands and knees , and then you put your chest on top of his back and you start to use him as a table and you spin around , use your arm and use and , and he

will throw up an arm from time to time to make you reverse direction . So he's got to keep his balance when he's underneath you . But you're spinning around as fast , as hard as you can , and you come off like two days in football or soccer or whatever your fall sport is . You do that for 40 seconds and you and you want to die .

And then the coach will blow the whistle three minutes later and you're , you're , you're , you're drenched . So you're drenched , the dude underneath you , drenched . Then you switch . So you are , you want to die , you're having fun .

Now you're the table and now you got to throw an arm up and you're trying to make your and you're like wait , I'm seven minutes into practice and I've never been this tired , and so that's how . That's how it begins Anyway , the sport one , one for real , like legitimate fringe benefit of being a wrestler .

And I can't say this is one man's opinion , but I've seen it in many places over the years and I don't think kids fight in the way that we used to fight once upon a time , like getting fist fights and things like that . You never see if you know what to grapple on any level .

He went to pit , anyway , I can't remember his name right now , but you're talking about how , in practice , the defense was the dominant unit and the in the offense kind of was like getting up to a level of being like hey , like you're not just going to push us around .

So anyway , he gets into it , one of the defensive guys who happens to forget that he was like this , like all world wrestler , and so the defensive guy is all like chirping , blah , blah , blah .

He gets flipped onto his back , gets up like basically talking out of the airhole of his helmet , rips his helmet off to be like I'll kick your ass and in the confusion of all that , gets knocked like out . And they both tell the story of the documentary and the defensive guy is like yeah , he was a smart one , he kept his helmet on .

I was the idiot who got knocked out , I forgot he was a state champion or blah . But whatever he was in , is it Hilgenberg ? No , it's the guy . Oh , damn it , it's the guy who played for pit .

Now I'm going to drive myself crazy , but I will look it up , okay , yeah , the other one , quickly and then I swear we can talk about this fictional place of AFC Richmond is that they're the same guy who they used to call Mongo , showed up to practice and told Buddy Ryan like , oh yeah , I'm in great shape After they drafted them , and so they had them

running wind sprints and Buddy Ryan's killing them first day

of practice . So after it he's , you know , head over garbage can , if you know , you know . And he said Buddy Ryan , oh , when he said how great a shape he is , he goes yeah , I got this new black lab and we just been going on these long runs , I've been going on these long runs with my dog , blah , blah , blah .

So he said Buddy Ryan comes up behind him when his head's over this garbage can and goes holy shit , seven to six , we should have drafted the dog . I fucking screamed . I was like what an asshole . And you could just feel that like coach energy , where you're like I hate you so much right now . I hate you , hate you , hate you .

We should have drafted the dog .

You were telling us about where he was going on , about how he , like , keeps the records of the fights at practice and all this kind of stuff .

So I came across the clip and so he's doing this interview and the guys talking to him and oh , sometimes fights break out of practice , which they do , and if you run into football practices like eventually somebody's going to get sick of somebody else hitting them , because that's not a normal thing humans should do , and so but Coach Prime was saying he likes to

see that which on his face . Just that I was like I like to see it too . I get it right . I got like , but he was saying like he doesn't break it up and he lets them fight . And he like kind of tracks the records and whatever . And I was like , oh no , that's not what I mean .

My thing about it is , if you show me somebody who's ready to get into a scrap , I'm like , okay , you have passion . Okay , now my job is to teach you how to take that feeling and aim it at the other team .

That's right , redirect it , as we're going to kick your ass , but not we're going to kick your ass in the parking lot Like we are going to kick your ass in this game , because this is how I did our fight .

So I was like kind of disappointed because I've heard other coaches talk about that before and like it's not bad for guys to get fired in practice or whatever . But I was really disappointed that he like that it was more like a tough man , competition or something and I was like really Like I don't know .

Anyway , I was very disappointed that that was his take on it . So , yeah , I thought it was terrific , yeah , it was terrific .

But yeah , I was very disappointed because my , I promise you , I've been in situations where I'm like that's fine . Like you break it up and you're like all right , nobody's is anybody hurt . No , okay , great , fine , no one's in trouble , just knock it off . And then talk to them about like look , yeah , you should get fired up , you should get pissed off .

Get tired of this shit . I'm all for it , but directed into the sport , not like let's keep a running side record of who kicked who's ass , what's that ?

Ultimately , as you know , as we watch these two idiots skulk away from Kelsey .

Like I've seen clips and stories , this guy was brilliant , like would go toe to toe with Jerry Rice , who's already been the greatest receiver ever , if not the greatest football player ever in practice and it was like epic battles . But I think he doesn't get the difference .

He's not getting the difference between personality and culture right and so he thinks he's creating this competitive culture , but really he's creating cult of personality where it's like we got swagger and we wear our sun I don't care , wear the sunglasses , do all the things Like that's all great , but that's not the culture .

the same thing . He was like just a crazy autistic lunatic . You know , he's like thinking in places no one else ever visits , but they say . They said to him one time , like you know , serazik , like how did you come up with this ? And he was like this is a direct call .

He's like I'm thinking about it a lot and it's like dude , nobody knows , yeah , no , no , we can't do that . He was under the impression like if more people just spent the time thinking you know it's like . It's like coach prime like- 100% . It's great that you think that you have all this belief in the people and you want them to have .

Swag is one of my least favorite terms ever for anyone . You know what I'm not a fan . Right right , I love confidence . Swag is a whole other thing for me , but it's like , dude , there is literally no one on the planet .

Even your best player couldn't even begin to approach the skill level where you functioned at a that was your median skill level is so far past anyone , certainly in the college ranks , oh my God . But you go to the pros today and who you're gonna say who has the- Nobody Right now .

He's like we just gotta believe in yourself and look good and feel good , feel good to play good , and it's like okay , great Like I saw those things . I'm slow , yeah right , but I have different muscle fibers than you do . Like I just do right and not being able to appreciate that part or even that there's a different way to like .

Not all the toughest people I knew In fact most of the toughest people I knew weren't down for like , getting in fights every two minutes . I remember having a friend , my friend Dwayne Callender . I still think about this at least a couple of times a year . We were , like we were in elementary school , but I forget whatever .

There was another guy in our class who's named Marwim's in case at some point he bumps into this but he was not a quiet guy Like he was always in a fight with someone Like I remember one of our teachers saying to him one day like do you ever notice that everybody starts with you ? Like kind of like , come on , man , get yourself together .

But anyway , this guy is chirping . My friend Dwayne , he really was a bookworm , like he plays sports with us or whatever , but he was happy enough to sit and read his book quietly and just leave him for the long . Jerry's chirp and chirp and chirp , and I forget what Jerry said .

Dwayne's sitting at a desk reading as everybody's coming in for lunch and Jerry crossed whatever line he crossed . Dwayne calmly put his book down , got up , body slammed . Jerry sat back down , picked his book back up and continued reading .

Do the lines migrate based on the child or do they migrate based on the situation ? You know , it's like all these different things , but for that guy on that day the line was crossed . He handled it immediately , and then Bob's your uncle . That's the place .

And number two is definitely we did not say that in my house , but that is because I had seven uncles on just my dad's side , so it's always a possibility that Bob could be an uncle .

I don't remember how it came up , but I said something about , oh , my brother , brian , and this woman was like oh , that's so funny . I actually worked with a guy whose name is Brian Chambers and I was like oh , what do you do ? And she was like I'm a physical therapist and masseuse . And I was like oh , that's my uncle , that is my uncle Brian .

That you , you do know my uncle Brian . Oh , that's wild , is a masseuse . That is who that is , you know it , that is funny , and actually there was one other time in college I worked with a bunny of mine Like we'd been to high school together . I got him a job at catering .

He was a cyclist , like into bicycling , racing and shit , not like motorbikes , but like actual bikes . Got it , got it , yeah , yeah yeah , and I said one time I requested off one weekend and my boss was pretending to give me shit . She was like , oh what , you need the whole weekend off . As I'm going back home , my uncle Matt's in town .

I gotta go say hi to him . And my buddy was like , oh , that's really funny . There's a bike racer whose name is Matt Chambers . And I was like , yeah , no , that's my uncle , that's him . And he was like your uncle is Matt Chambers .

And I was like you know who my uncle is , Cause he's like went to the Olympics back in the 80s and was like oh yeah , or he might have been like a the Matt Chambers . See , that's the fucking thing you don't like . Who knows about guys who were almost in the Olympics in the 80s for bicycling , except apparently my buddy Mike .

So yeah , when you have that many relatives every once in a while they're like hey hey , I actually do know that person you're related to .

We are now coming off the low light of the sort of Jamie and Roy emotional massacre scene . Jamie and Roy emotional massacre scene .

It is the moment in this , as much I actually did want Roy and Katie to end up together , so there was disappointment . They even I was like all right , I got it , you did your thing , do your thing , tell your story .

But that moment outside , with the two of them then launching right into a debate as to whether or not Jamie got to have a kebab , sort of made me go . Maybe this is for the best , maybe , you know , maybe this is the arrangement as God intended it . Because what , like ? You two just had a fist fight .

Both went to see the woman you love to declare your love and say to her choose , she kicked your asses out and now you're gonna go have a kebab together . So you know what You're kind of . Maybe you two are meant to be together . You ever think of that .

And Nate says , oh , my fucking God , startled immediately , so we're off to a really great start . Ted says basically , you know like , oh , sorry , was here late and me to startle you , blah , blah , blah . And then Nate starts in and he says listen , ted . And he says I know it's okay . He says no , no , please , can you just let me say it , I'm sorry .

And then he starts sobbing and he says I'm so sorry . And he says Ted says oh , buddy , it's in place of the 60 page letter , the apology that Nate was trying to say . He got down to the core of it , which is he was an asshole and he feels really bad about it . He's really , really sorry .

We both know what I did , we both know I was a dick . I'm really sorry .

But this scene , I mean for me , absolutely drilled it and it's one of the things early on that you know , when I do it effectively my life goes better .

That I learned about marriage but really about relationships , is stop worrying about what she said and listen to what she's saying and I remember like sharing that as like an insight with friends of mine , like , all right , you want to know something . I went down this road before most of y'all .

Here's one right and what Nate's saying and that's why I love the way you frame that what Nate's saying is the 60 page letter . What Nate's saying is oh my God , you were the person who remembered my fucking name .

You were the person who first took my crumpled up play that I was too scared to show anyone and basically launched me in the direction of becoming a primarily gaffer and I can't believe what I did to you . It's so hard for me to even articulate how bad I feel , that all I can say is I'm sorry before I am a puddle , and it just really .

I was really with Nate in this moment . Like I just like that level of like I fucked up , like I don't even know how to fully articulate how much I fucked up and how bad I feel about the fucking up right now and I thought that , yeah , I thought it was just delivered brilliantly .

I'm sure I don't know if you've ever been fully aware that you were in the wrong , but in those situations , do you ? Is it may a culpa , or is it like rationalization , or like like how do you ? Because , okay , the reason I ask is because we've been pretty harsh about the Nate redemption line , but I really enjoyed that . This is like a complete show .

Don't tell , less is more , a little more of this . And I don't think we would have had the , the reactions we had about the actual trajectory of the arc , because I bought this . I was like I know what this is like . I liked that . He was like , please , just let me say it Like he needed to say it . The same way , you want to get punched .

So , boss , just tell me from your perspective how this moment later with you .

So I I think people who act like assholes I think I've mentioned on the show before uh , ben Affleck versus Matt Damon , and most people think like , oh , matt Damon is such a good guy and Ben Affleck Well , yeah , like he's fucked up . My impression is that if you fucked up , ben fucked up you'd be like oh shit , sorry , I really fucked that up .

I'm going to fix it , I'm going to do better in the future , and Matt would be like oh come on , I'm such a good guy .

I think that a major issue and this is actually something that I was thinking about over the weekend that I would like to discuss in our next Wayne episode , because I think it's more uh , uh , directly related to that .

But this idea of just because you wanted to help doesn't mean that you did , and just because you were trying to do good doesn't mean that you did , and so what you really really need to do is listen to other people when they say , like I know you tried to do this the right way and you didn't . You fucked it up .

It's um God , I know that I've said this before and it's uh embarrassing every single time , but accounting has been great for my mental health , because one of the things that you do you spend all months doing your job .

You're recording on a daily basis transactions and everything else , and you say here , here are what the records look like , and then later in the next month , you go back and review all of the shit that you did and find all of the mistakes and correct them .

So there's this whole thing where , like , you spend every day doing as well as you can and then at the end of that you're like , so how bad did I fuck everything up ? Like , what do I need to make up for ? What do I need to make better ?

It would be like , it would be like I probably fucked up page one . Oh , they've been . Oh , now I have to do the entire month over again . Like , oh , my God , like I would . It would be an oversight too .

The way ADHD works is like it would just be like some absolute , but it would compound , and if I did it a day , one or something and then I added everything , whatever , I can't even imagine . But when you're saying that , I'm like getting breaking out into a cold sweat thinking , thank God , I don't know if to do that .

They told me like it was like the example they used as like well , you'd never want to be anything like an accountant , but it was like . It was like if you could put accountant somewhere and figure out where the opposite of that is , you should run that way .

I didn't jump , I didn't drive into that fire hydrant on purpose , but I did drive into that fire hydrant . So we're going to have to address that , aren't we ? And I think people get so stuck on .

I was just trying to move it to the right side of the street but you drove it into a fucking hydrant Like this , but it didn't undo the accident and so yeah , but the idea of like having a job where that's so built in that like yep , I fuck up , I fuck up .

I was more like exactly what you were saying , really had a hard time apologizing and it's something that has hurt me quite a bit in my life and I didn't have any good sort of mentorship around that . So when I see it in my children or I see it in people I work with or you know , I always go back to like okay , like let's .

There's so many little speeches that I have for these moments because they're so common . They happen all the time , and I always talk about what's the difference between what's right and what's real , like , yes , it would have been right if they , if this is the way it worked out in a fair world .

But , yes , it would have worked out , but it didn't work out that way . Now you'd face with what's real and what's real is now . This is your situation . And then I always use the phrase now , who do you want to be knowing this ? Because you get to decide , yeah , yeah , who do you want to be coming out of this ? I don't .

I try not to focus on the event , because people get really mucked up in the event , in the details .

You know , something happened with one of our , with a blog that I was running , where we got fucked by this corporate entity and we we didn't get fucked like completely fucked and we pulled everybody in . We said okay , who do we want ?

Like I've always had a hard time pinpointing , like , what wisdom is in a practical sense , like in somebody's life , like when do you start ? When does it start being not just experience ? Maybe it's when you can apply it , or something I don't really know .

Like wisdom is something I've always sort of striven for and something I've always respected in other people , because you can sense it . When someone's like a weathered veteran , you're like man , they just she knows what she's doing , you know , like she's like man , she's just there's a wisdom about her which which is different than just playing experience .

But there was this thing , this element of Ted's , ted's journey with Nate , where he just never , ever , ever , ever changed his position . Everybody pushed him , everybody was on him , but he had this inner knowing and he was like , no , like I know what this is . No one outside of me is going to tell me what this is .

I'm not going to compromise my position on this . I'm not going to change my character around it . You know , it's like . It's like damn the torpedoes . Maybe I'll be wrong , maybe I'll be , maybe he's the Wicked Witch of the West or Darth Vader , and I'll be proven wrong . I you know , he just had this feeling about Nate and he stuck to his principles .

And this is the . It's not a reward , but this is the . You know there's never . There's never a parade waiting for you . There's never . It's funny . I know lots of parents of autistic children and we always talk about how you never get this like final celebration when the kid is oh , the kid made it through , whatever .

And then everybody gathers around and goes , look what you did , great job . Like you don't have these moments . But this is as close to that as you get with Ted , where you say , where he gets to have this one tiny little moment in time where he can look back on his side of it at least and know like , yeah , he was right and and he never compromised .

And I remember saying , oh my God , that , in all of its plaidness or whatever that would be called , those are the Richmond colors and he looks ridiculous in it and he doesn't fit in that . And he puts on the black and he's like , yeah , I think I like this version of me better .

Right , this version of me doesn't deserve to get spit at , and and I think it's it's relevant that that's happening here . I don't think that would be a coincidence , but I I think so .

The Darth Vader thing brought that to me , but in this moment , the reason that I think that I think it really stood out to me is this is Nate being fully human and , in a way , one of the things that Ted does , and you know , we got to see I just say the same thing , right when it was like oh , don't you worry about me .

You know you go do that and you go go . Y'all don't need to worry about my problems . But you robbed me of an opportunity to love you . I was actually coaching someone last week and maybe these ideas all came together

for this reason . And she's , you know , black woman mom , you know , been married for years , she's got teenagers , the whole deal , and she just fucking does right , Like , and it's , she's amazing . She's amazing .

She never says she's amazing , but she's amazing and is going through some things right now and was needing to get together for like a trip that they're going on . And I was like your kids and husband can help .

And , based on everything I know about our family , I was like and would help , Like , sure , we all can be shit sometimes , but there's no way your family would be like , no , fuck you , that's your job , right . So I was like , and the phrase I used is as we're made to come together .

For me now , as I'm thinking about all this is , I said let them love you . Right , Because I'm big on , love is a verb and so , in a way , Ted , apologizing and forgiving are both loving things . You're very in touch with the fact that your forgiving shows your love , but let him love you .

Let him say I'm sorry , I didn't want to hurt you or , as opposed to , I didn't want to hurt you Ultimately . I know hurting you was wrong and it was not the best of me . It's not who I want to be . That's why I'm back here now . That's why I wrote 60 page letter that you may or may not ever actually lay eyes on .

But let him love , Let him be a full human being , Let him express that peace . And I could see where Ted feels like no big deal , don't need to go down that road , but it's like no , no need to go down that road . Like I'm a person and I'm expressing something that's very important to me and that's weighed on my heart .

Obviously , every point that I can't even say three full words before I'm like balling , and so that was the other piece that I loved about this scene love , love , love , love love but that I loved about this scene was how incredibly loving it was and for the breakdown and the hug and for Ted to just say , oh , buddy , you know what I mean ?

He could have gone into a whole Ted-ish speech , right , I had this friend and he went to the carnival and right , but he just , yeah , I got it , I got you , we're good and we needed that moment . I don't think . I don't .

I think he would have done Nate a real disservice and their relationship a real disservice if he really had been able to like brush it away .

I used to be fucking terrible at it , not just that I wouldn't acknowledge it , but that I would like fully shirk responsibility , or like lie about it , or like I used to be bet shit and just pretend that whatever it was that was bad , I hadn't done .

Because in part , I was concerned that if I had screwed something up , then not that people wouldn't love me , but like you need to be this level of good in order to be taken care of Like you need to get up to that level in order to be good enough for people to love you , and at some point I was like oh , that's fucked up , don't ?

But I think that there is a lot of value in when it's somebody that you care deeply about , even if you didn't mean to hurt their feelings , even if you think that what you did shouldn't have hurt their feelings , you can say like I know that your feelings are hurt and I feel badly . I wish they weren't .

If I could change things , I would make it so that your feelings weren't hurt . I don't like that you are hurt and I would like that to be different .

And even when you think like I didn't really fuck up that bad , like acknowledging that they are upset is a valuable good thing , like part of this is that Ted was sad and Nate is sad , that he made Ted sad , even if Nate was like , well , I did these things . For these reasons , bubble , you did something that hurt somebody .

It's okay to just acknowledge that you're sad , that they are hurt .

And then you brought in Roy and you put him in charge of blah , blah , blah and you said he could run training and like it's like no , no , no , no , no , no , like all those things might hurt your feelings . That did not mean it was okay for you to say to a newspaper reporter , guess what ? Right , yes , and I would .

And so when I look back , that was sort of my like , my , my ongoing gaffe that I had to learn to like , even when I was like , well , hold on a second . That was my reaction to a thing that happened . The story didn't start with what I did .

I have taught myself to just not go there for even for now , even if I apologize to you now and we deal with that . And having fully dealt with that , then I say now I do need to point out that I'd appreciate it if you didn't do this but to meld those and kind of like backtrack off the apology cause while you started it .

It's always a mistake , it just is .

You do need to take responsibility for whatever actions you did that you feel you should apologize for . I should also say , like these things are always tricky , it depends on who you're dealing with and what they're upset about and what you're upset about and getting through the discussion on that .

If you find yourself always saying , well , I didn't do anything that bad and people are pissed off at you , you maybe might want to reevaluate slightly , a little bit , if maybe your gauge is off . That's like the Rayland Givens If you meet an asshole in the morning , you met an asshole . If you meet assholes all day , you're an asshole .

I'm sorry that ended up hurting you guys .

Now there's a conversation I'd like to have about what happened right , and I think that that serves well . Last thing because I am really waiting to see how you're going to drive Castleton crazy is that they have an understanding of each other that also allows for so few words .

Yes , Right , when they're looking up there , I mean , there's some conversation around it , but I know why they're looking at the wall . They each know why they're looking at the wall , right , ted , isn't like what are you staring at Watching paint dry there ? But he knows why , right ?

And so I think too , when we really get to know one another and take the time to know one another , that can also shape some of these conversations .

Quickly , I will share that actually a really good friend of mine needed me to write something . This was years ago now and really it was on me and it was something I wanted to do . But I was dealing with my own stuff , and those who've listened to all these here seasons of the Ted Cast know that before we started any of this , I had lost my cousin .

I was just like really fucking struggling and I couldn't think . I know that sounds like wait , what do you mean ? You couldn't think . What do you mean ? What I am telling you ? I was staring at words I had written and I could not process the words so that I could do the next thing I was supposed to do .

And they got super mad at me , which I get the frustration .

But I really was trying and instead of acknowledging well , you're failing , the fact that you're trying doesn't make you're failing any more of a problem in my plan , they essentially and I think they described it this way attacked me as like not giving effort and caring about the thing , and they were pretty , it was stated strongly , let's put it that way and it

was so intense and we had such a relationship before that that I actually didn't get outwardly pissed , which is actually the worst . I was like you don't want to go to that , but with this one I was just like I am done , like I can't ever talk to you again . So I guess that's that then .

And we like someone I was in very close contact with all the time and we didn't speak for months and even at one point they needed something like specific from me and they contacted me for it and it literally was like the answer to your question is boom and like sent that back and just so I know they received that .

We're like , oh boy , but I say all that to say they came back later and , having done some work on their own , and blah , blah , blah , I said you know , that is not how I want to behave blah , blah , blah . And instantly actually this is not the one that I told multiple times , but this was a working and instantly I was like okay and it's .

That was when it really struck me how much both apologizing and forgiving can be acts of love . Because I was like we've been through a ton . You've done a thousand great things that I couldn't possibly even figure out how to repay . You did this thing that crossed my lines . You've apologized , we're moving on . I see you work on Monday .

I feel like it wasn't literally work on Monday , but you know what I mean , and so it doesn't have to be love , though .

I mean , when I'm telling my kids or I'm telling coworkers or whatever you know , it's coach will attest to how many people , how many calls , I get a day and I just go all right . Well , what do you want to be like ? You know what the facts are , you know , oh , but they're the one . Yeah , okay , yeah , yes , yes . Will they change ? No , okay .

So it's either beholden on you to change or it'll be just , you know nothing's gonna happen . So , whatever those those situations are and like boss says , very , very wisely , situationally , you have to address , you know , the elements of whatever the people are , the situation and all the different elements . But you know and judge it on those particular merits .

But in general , you know , you can , sort of , I think . I think we as a society appreciate accountability in that way and the absence of accountability , especially in places where we've taken it for granted for most of our lives .

This is what I talk about , the all the foundational structures of society that have eroded to the point where you're like , seriously like , like my doctor's- lying .

And you're just like , oh my God , maybe it never did happen , but at least we were bosses nodding , but at least we were diluted enough to think , okay , well , you know , the wheels of society are rolling on and I can think about other things . I never wanted to be this aware of all the shitheads that are destroying everything .

And so you know , it's all part of it's all part of this , this grand tapestry where you have to say take every situation , decide who you're going to be inside of it . And I'm assuming boss is going to talk about Ted here . So go ahead , boss , take it away .

I think also there is something about millennials being the first generation to not become more conservative , but also we're the first generation where , when we got out of college and that , of course , is not a specific time , but roughly when we left what is supposed to be our childhoods we had three or four once in a lifetime recessions , like we immediately got

hit with thing after thing after thing . So there's sometimes , when even people a little bit older than me talk about institutions , feeling I'm like all those bitches were gone by the time I was an adult , like yeah we had . We had none of the first election that I got to vote in . They were like we don't know who's president .

It's maybe Bush , it's maybe Gore , we'll , we'll figure it out and let you know , like just straight out of the gate , nothing . But what I was going to say is the idea of Ted getting a little bit of a reward for always standing by , like , always being there , always being ready to forgive Nate . Yes , absolutely , I totally agree with that .

I think again , my only issue with that is that Ted is not there alone and that means that he was asking other people to also deal with Nate and Nate's shitty behavior . And then Ted was standing back waiting , knowing that Nate was going to come around . But there was a little bit of like he was being shitty to Will and he was being shitty to Colin .

And there is a line in You're the Worst where somebody warns Jimmy that if he and Gretchen get married it's going to be terrible , and this guy says you'll destroy each other , and Jimmy says there's no way . I'd rather go out .

I think that that is a level of like I'm going to pick her and I am going to like suffer whatever it is that this relationship requires because I care about her so much .

But there's also an insulation for other people that you can walk away at any point , Like I'm going to dedicate myself to her and she might be terrible to me and I can fucking live with that .

But I think you need to be very , very careful when you decide to do that that you aren't accidentally making other people privy to that , because you need to make sure that you're protecting them from it .

You're right , there's a proverbial pitfall there and I don't want to my , I don't want my appraisal of Ted's steadfastness in his , in his sort of conviction about Nate . That's not an excusal of his inactivity with regard to Nate's shittiness as he got shittier and shittier . Yeah , I'm not saying that , I'm not saying like . I think it's like .

Real people are very malleable In my experience again , one person's experience Because society has waned or ebbed or at least that's my perspective , because of the Gordon Gecko years and because of greed is good and because we can sort of either term spin instead of lie , things like that , it has become very easy to do the wrong thing and very difficult to do the

right thing . In a , in a , in sort of a holding pattern with other people , you'll constantly get affirmation about okay , this is fine , and boss , you and I will definitely disagree about this , like when I talk about you know , I really hate , you know , just just casual deceit and white lies , and oh , you know we're going to .

You know I'm feeling sick , so I'm not going to come in . It's just like for me .

I'm like it's just so , and those types of things will be constantly okayed by society and your peers and your coworkers and your family , and it's like , yeah , totally fine , you know , and so for me , I think it's very , very difficult to sort of have the support to do that what Ted did in this case , and say like , okay , I just believe this is true , but

I don't want to miss the point that this is a moment between two people .

I know that this is a team and I know that this , this is like a whole thing , but I don't want to gloss over the fact that , like , what's happening between these two people is something that's like fundamentally only understood by these two people in this particular case , and I think it's easy to miss that .

Jamie didn't have a dad or you know good dad around . You know that's something that helps Sam and me make better choices . So I'm gonna right , but I do think , okay , then you also have to do the heavy lifting part of going . Hey , sam , can I see you in my office ?

I'm about to do the single thing you don't want me to do in this world , Like you'd rather me firebomb the place where you live than do what I'm about to say .

And I'm gonna explain why I'm gonna do it and I'm gonna understand that you may not like it , but I'm gonna face you and I'm gonna own it and I'm gonna acknowledge openly that it impacts somebody other than me . And I will say as much as I thought yes , bringing Jamie back , like I got all those pieces .

I think you did a really good job of articulating part of where there was an imbalance , like so much of this seems so well balanced . Oh yeah , I'm gonna wait and I was like you know , it's like a kitten or a baby and they'll come to you when they're ready and it all sounds great . But it's like , yeah , well , he wasn't fucking torturing you , Yep .

Yep , no , yeah , absolutely and so I , yeah , so I guess I stand by the decision in terms of , as I watch the show and , like I would want to be , that , I would want to be the version of me that would allow me to say to Jamie you know what , come in , you know things are gonna have to be different , or whatever conversation they had , but I would hope

that I could also have the courage to stand up , at the very least , in front of the whole team . But I would think one on one with Sam , given the conversation we had , and say , look , this is what I'm doing .

I'm not asking you to like it , but I am saying I think it's best for the team and I am saying that it's in line with who I am as a coach and is why I need to do it . And I hope you'll trust me and Sam . And guess what ?

Sam might go upstairs and tell Rebecca , trade me , yeah , yeah , and you got to live with that , and he kind of skirts having to deal with that part , and I'm hearing you on that . I'm hearing you on that .

Like no , I was like , god damn y'all , you don't never see a pretty flower or nothing .

Not ideal , not leave it to be ever . And so now sometimes she and I will joke or we're like oh , we , like I've said in here , like I have a checking account , like I fucking made it , I'm doing great with my life .

I know shop at Aldi , but for fun and not a necessity like when I was a child Anyway so I do this is not to extend more sympathy to white men , because God knows they don't fucking need it . But I do think that there is an element of when you compare your life to what you think it should have been versus what you actually have managed to do .

You're always going to be disappointed , like every single time , because whatever it is that you thought you were supposed to do , whatever it is that you have done , you feel like you should have done more . I was supposed to be this by this age . I was supposed to have done this . I was supposed to have gone here .

It's like , well , fucking , do you have a house ? Then you're great , then you're good , you're doing okay .

I've seen some other stuff about him otherwise , but he talks about what you just said , and what he talks about is the fact that when we imagine that that life that we kind of like that it's and I'm adding the vision board imagery that it's kind of a vision board , like it's an image . But life isn't ever an image . It happens in time .

So you never are going to be in this still idyllic image . And no one had ever said it to . Maybe I wasn't ready to hear it , but as far as I can think of , no one had ever said it to me quite that way . That you know , because I had some of these images and they're not my life right now , but that's because I lived an actual life .

I think I lived an actual life where something went right , something didn't go so right , you know , whatever , and being able to live in that in a comfortable way , not like settling for it .

But Stoics have a thing called Amor Fati , which is like , literally a love like love your fate , like lover of fate , and it's a powerful idea , like it's not just like I will accept what is or I will tolerate what is ? it's . I will love what is , which is incredibly powerful .

It has helped me in the ways that I'm able to work on it , because you go , like this is , but , yeah , that sense of like life was supposed to be a certain way . It's not that way .

I would imagine seriously that for an average white American male you can help me out here that there was an image of like running shit and of being at the top of certain ladders , even if you didn't think of it that way , and having you know most of the rest of the country . Go , yeah about that .

It's got to get fucking old , like , even if on some level , you're like , yeah , yeah , yeah , no good point . Like there's got to be parties . It's like , yeah , yeah , but I didn't do all the work .

I didn't live my life and watch the men who were men when I was a boy be that so that I could grow up and not be that because that was fucked up in the first place . Like that's what I imagined . And now what ? Yes , and I think there's a lot of that in the world .

And she was like well , you , you right now , could do this , this , this or this , but 20 year old , you could not get that shit done . So you can't be mad that she wasn't you , because she was who she was , so you could be who you are now . Like those are two different things , and I think that that's always a really good point too .

Like when you come up with these ideas when you're a child , then you grew up and you're like oh , that's not how shit runs . I can't be that , because I was wrong about what I thought I was was going to happen .

She fucking did it , and she became um , not in my brains , not giving it to me , but the person who looks at the slide and tells you the person's got this or they don't have that . Damn it . The words , it'll come to me . Radiologists , no , but that's in the ballpark , it's a anyway . Uh , look to the slide .

They'd like , ah , anyway , I'll come up with the word in a minute . But they became a doctor , like they lab coat the whole deal . You've got cancer , you've got this , you don't got that , you're going to live , you not so much . The whole deal . And they found they were 100% miserable .

So miserable that they went to a doctor's visit depressed , and their doctor said you are to go home , you are not to stop at your office . I am actively forbidding you because of the state you are in . I am forbidding you from stopping at your office to get your things .

Like that's how horrible it had been and one of the things we got to was how long are you going to be captive to the decision-making prowess of a five year old Right ? And once we got , to that .

This is what we're coming up to and this is what made his face with here in this moment he is , you know , he's written a 60 page paper about it and really , you know this is him deciding to be who he needs to be in this moment and there's a lot of character there and , in the same way that it's generous of spirit for him to take ownership of it and

be accountable , it's also it would have been very , very selfish and would have been old Ted and not good Ted , had Ted been like no , no , no , no , you don't need to say it Like , because that's again that's carrying water for him , that he needs to carry , that's and that you wouldn't be respecting .

And it's not lost on me that Nate is surprised by Ted in a way that is incredibly similar to his father coming into the room , that he has a reconciliation . That's very similar again . And I wonder if he could have gotten to the 60 page paper if he and his dad hadn't had their talk and they hadn't played their little board game .

Like I think he had a lot going on . Doesn't excuse it Like we're talking about earlier , but that's some shit . Like when Ted said to him what do I need to learn here ? Ted , you ain't got to learn shit .

You was running a team and one of the great players in your franchise is history , not to mention now a personal friend of yours who you watched fix your new captain in a frigging evening . You , you're this is the part where you apologize for having him on the sideline .

Like you didn't do shit , like Nate had to go deal with some of that to even be able to have this moment . And yeah , it's , it's , it's hard work , man , but once you do it it's humongous .

I do think that even the fact that he yelled you know , I'm losing the phrase right now , but whether it was holy fucking shit or whatever he yelled , even that was very similar to what he yelled because he had to apologize to his dad because he had cursed .

So that's why it's kind of stuck in my head that he said you know , oh , my fucking God , or whatever , cause he like realized who he was talking to . So anyway , this one punched me right in the feels , I guess , is what I'm trying to say .

It is a beautiful moment between these two . It is the end of a very , very long road , a road sometimes that had landmines on it , but we , we finally get to this place of accountability and connection . There's nobody here . It's not performative . It is a moment that is unique to the two of them and something that was a long time coming .

And so , you know , ted is at first a little bit surprised by the power and force of the hug , and he does this thing that I really liked , where he , he accepts the hug and you know he's a little bit surprised by it , and then he kind of just puts his head on Nate's head in the moment , which is like a very paternal and sort of .

It's just this accepting , it's like an extra acceptance . It's like you feel that and if you're Nate and you go in there for that hug and there's like you know , you can feel like the sort of standoffishness . But then , like that second additive B is almost an exclamation point about like yes , man , we are good .

Like you know , I'm here with you , I'm in this moment with you .

Is Ted's ability to accept this apology to catch himself after his initial like eh , you don't have to , whatever tied to the work he did with Dr Sharon , because guess what , man , sometimes people do things that hurt us and it has nothing to do with us . It's always that moment where somebody says like , oh , whatever it was , it wasn't .

You know , whatever thing we're talking about , it wasn't personal and it always sounds a little bit crazy . But when you think about it , sometimes it's not personal , but that's just this person they are . You know what I mean .

They're going to get halfway across that river and they're going to sting you and it's because that's their nature and or that's the state they're in right now and because people hurt you or leave you . That doesn't have to be a reflection on who you are or even what you meant to them .

You know , yes , you know , my dad didn't commit suicide , which puts me , you know , behind behind boss , in the pain Olympics Two times . I'm like Jesus Christ , you're like the . You're like the goddamn Edwin Moses of trauma over here . No , I'm kidding , that's fucking awful . I love that .

I love you enough and you know , I love you enough that I could do that and you can laugh . Oh , 100% .

That's what it came down to Like at the end of the day , as I've like put together everybody's stories , like he was a certain way and that was the fucking way he was gonna be , and his answer to that was yeah , and you should put up with it . And my mom's answer to that was I don't fucking think so . So that was the end of that .

Love them both , adore them both , made my peace with everybody . But that's reality and for a good chunk of my adult life , I was really pissed at him Wait , wait , wait , wait , coach , coach .

But you had to make your peace because you recognized what was real . This is what is happening . It's not a fantasy world , this is it . I have to contend with what is actually the cards that I've been dealt and I love that you did that and it takes a lot of character and but that distinction is very murky to a lot of people .

I don't know why that's such a . It's such a strange diving board that people will not jump off of because they want to focus on what should have happened or what should have you know .

I know I'm going down a bad fucking road Back up . You are not living in reality . Stop , stop , stop . Why are you so ? Why all the shoulds ? What's ? What are we trying to like , make work here ? But , no , yeah , absolutely , but I was . You know , my thought before I did that work was he didn't care enough about me .

If he had cared about me , it would have been . I would have been worth the effort of whatever had to be fun .

So when you know , when Ted finally tells that story of his father reading the book again didn't lose my dad that way , but that's a really cool moment when you go yeah , there's all this shit I get mad about all the time . But there was this fucking time that blah , blah , blah .

And now that I'm on the topic , really I mean it's like I have a lot of good fucking memories of this person I was so pissed at . There's a really beautiful piece to us . Anyway sorry , that kind of went .

If it's somehow getting them to make it up to you , getting them to have made the pain never happen , well , the pain happens . Like you can't . You can't wish the pain away , so you have to process through , and that is accepting . They did what they did . It doesn't have this reflection on me . This is what it means .

They're fallible the same way that I am . And everybody fucks up sometimes .

It's like , essentially and fundamentally , what he does , and what I would say about what you just shared is that is a way of liberating yourself .

So I could still , with the friend I was telling you about who blasted me over the professional thing , and they weren't wrong , like the thing needed to move and I wasn't moving it , but they were wrong to like scream at me and accuse me , orlando Bishop , who you know well of not caring about the project .

Like if there's anything that's like just not a real thing that anybody would say about me is like , oh , I was working on this project with Orlando , but he just didn't give a fuck , and he just like that's never the problem , ever , and so it hurt , but like I couldn't like to spend the rest of my days going . How could you say that to me ?

Because sometimes we get upset and we say shit , or we feel away , or you remind me of my fucking uncle or whatever it is , and you know , and that's it Like , and that's it , and you know , and I do think there's such power for you . That's where the whole like you apologize for them piece Are you ? You know , you forgive for them ?

I mean , you forgive for yourself , not for them , and I do think we did a good job of sort of parsing that a bit . But that's the part where that absolutely resonates with me

. If you cannot release , I don't want that pain to have happened You're stuck and you're gonna stay stuck , and that's it .

We get this beautiful moment where these guys hug and then Ted pulls back and then he says you know what's funny , like which I like , because now he's gonna take some of the air out of this moment . He's still the mentor , he's still like he's also has in that he is doing his farewell tour .

He has like a little bit of luxury of like building some nostalgia into the moment because he knows he's out . You know , he's not gonna have to deal with Nate on a daily basis Now . It's just generosity of spirit at this point , right , right . And what does he say here , coach , you know what's funny .

But if I can have a chuckle with you now , I'm like helping you experience that we're good , right , like it's different than , yes , I forgive you . You know , I accept your apology , but yeah , that moment , I thought that moment was great and true and you know , obviously a bit of a seed that gets planted for us .

He's like yeah , and then he just he says so , we're already in the clear , you were already in the clear , you know . And Nate's like okay , and Nate is still very emotional . And then Ted like just kind of stares at him in this way , like I don't know , it's such a God , I it's a look .

I think about a lot weirdly when I think about this episode , cause I'm like wow , it is very supportive and there's a kindness of it , like it's like are you good ? But I'm also like looking at you in a way where I'm telling you you're good , or I don't know , boss , what do you think about this ? You had something to say .

The first time I went home to New York and I was on the train and some trains go over the bridge and some trains go below ground in New York when you're going from Brooklyn to Manhattan or vice versa , and the first time I was on a train going over the bridge , I looked over and I was like , oh , we're like thinking , like I'm gonna see the like , not

I'm gonna see the towels , but I'm gonna see what happened . You know what I mean . Like , somehow , I was like looking toward it and I realized , like you can't actually see a thing that's not there anymore .

But I did Like it was like when they say , like you know , people lose a leg and then they have like phantom itching or phantom pain , like it was a bit like that . And so I find this also resonated , this moment of like huh , like it's gone , like this thing we were talking about it is actually gone , but it's not , and I don't know .

I've always found that fascinating those of you who have seen any of my other storytelling when I jump around in time like a lunatic which you would never guess based on our conversations here . But no , I remember when I first came up with the thought like huh , so a story is a collection of moments . But what if a moment is a collection of stories ?

And I still that's still like at the heart of like a lot of my storytelling and how I see things and how I think about things . Like what if a moment is a collection of stories ? And for me that that was this right .

Like that was Ted showing up and that's a mighty fine sports drink and Nate , like the whole team touching the sign and Nate looking like he wants to either fire , bomb the place or throw up or both . Like it's all there in this moment at looking at our now bare wall . And I just thought it was very well executed .

Now I get a little freaked out by it because I think , as much as I like to applaud the concept of belief when we're talking about coaching and teamwork and things like that , I tend to get very scared of the concept of belief in other realms and I think it can be , can get real dicey .

But in this moment it is beautiful and it's a powerful moment between them . And once it's done we get a little sort of Nate trying to compose himself and they just have this little beat and Ted says that's it , good night Nate , good night Ted . And music kicks in and we're on to the next scene .

We're gonna leave it there for today , with all of our love to the king of the Butter Cups who just slammed the over on how many episodes it was gonna take .

I know it's crazy , we could get into the next episode right away , but I really like the next scene and I wanna sort of I wanna cook into that a little bit more than we probably will be able to have time for today . Coach , where do people find you ? If they wanna find you , I wanna say this time around .

So , although you can still find me at Twitter , both places is Dumbly underscore chambers and also writing at the Antagonist , which is antagonistblogcom .