My next guest is a veteran music and pop culture journalist who hosts the popular Torrey Show. He's back to discuss the case of Luigi Mangioni, the alleged killer of United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson. We're also gonna touch on Sean Dinny Combs just the second as well. You know how that involves, whether or not that involves rapper jay Z. We'll get into all of that. The one and only Torrey is here with me right now. What's going on, man? How are you? How's everything?
I'm good? Tell him about my show Rap Latte on YouTube. We talk about hip hop every day. We keep it real Rap Latte. I mean that's right, every day, right? Is it five days week?
Well, we're gonna we're ramping up to five days a week, but we're we're on like four days now.
But it's you know, business, we're doing it out here. That's right. You deserve it.
You deserve it. But that's not what you're here to talk about today. Because I'm here thinking there's a lot of things you could have talked to me about. I couldn't believe when my staff reached out to me and said Torre wants to come back on the show because I had the audacity, to unmitigated goal to call this good Luis g man GIONI.
I said, if that.
Is him, he is guilty of cold blooded murder, shooting Brian Thompson, a former CEO of United Healthcare. I mean shooting him in the back, murdering him. This is not somebody that should be celebrated. And I'm hearing for that reason, Torrey wanted to come on the shore.
And talk to me about it. What could the possibility I talk about? I felt like you were.
Kind of scolding us the masses for seeing value in Luigi and what he did. I felt like, not only you, but there was a lot of high level media people, Chris Cuomo, actually Banfield, Sarah Haynes of The View, I could go on and on, Gail King, who were scolding us, saying we should not root for this person, we should not respect this person.
He's like you already think what's wrong with that blooded murderer? He's a cold blood furderer, is he not.
I think that that is accurate, But I also think that we have to We cannot have a conversation about Louis without talking about what Brian Thompson and United health Hair kept doing and the murder's plural that they have been responsible for for many, many years.
And I'm not even talk about the uninsured.
I'm talking about the insured who they turn their back on, they betray, and I also deny claims from a third of their claims.
Right, So we're talking about.
People who are getting who need life saving help, and United health Care is not there for them, saying like, well, you know that person has cancer. If we don't give them help, they're gonna die and then we won't have to pay their bills.
This is a large part of how they make their money.
So we cannot have any conversation about Luigi unless we're also talking about the thousands and thousands of deaths that Brian and United Healthcare are on the hook for. So now from that perspective, things are a lot different, Right. It's not just one person committed cold blooded murder, which he did. He laid he laid in wait for him, he decided to kill it me clear. I mean it's a political murder, right, He's trying to make a political
statement about this company. Come off harmful, Come on to American.
Come on to our rant. You gotta be kid, you got it? What are you gonna really say that?
Listen? Listen.
First of all, let me say this.
I saw D L.
Hughgley on social media talking about this, and I took it and I reposted it because I wanted everybody to see what he had to say. Under no circumstances. Am I absolving any healthcare CEO who has engaged.
In such practices of they all have, which they are. That's that's where I was going with this.
They all have because we live in a capitalistic society and people trying to get as much money as they can, so they're trying to get as much as your money and give you the least in return. We lament that with every practically every business right now. I think that's right.
But I don't think anybody. I don't think anybody anything different.
But it's different when Coca Cola is watering down the Coca Cola little bit to give you ninety five percent Coca Cola instead of one hundred, versus a healthcare company say we're going to deny your claims so that we can make more money.
I t I totally, But listen to what I'm saying, I get that, But my point to you is this, this was some middle class dude or well to do who who wasn't from Who wasn't some impoveriaged dude, some member of a disadvantised community.
I know.
Matter.
Here my point, Here my point, and then I'll give you an opportunity to respond. My point is he wasn't that dude. So when he's speaking to such things, we don't know how much how close he is to a situation like this. How does this hit him home. I'm saying there are some people out there who just want to murder and find any excuse that they could get away with Torrey to do it.
That's the point that I made.
Do you do you do you think that white people had no place during slavery to be abolitionists even though they were not slaves?
Of course not.
Do you think that men don't have a to argue for women to have the right to choose what they do with their bodies?
Of course right?
I mean like you don't have to be you don't have to be specifically within the group to fight for the political rights of that To say that said Luigi came from money, so he can't have no we have no idea what he went through. His back surgery and his back issues were clearly a very deep part of his identity. He had a photograph of his X ray of his back on his Instagram page right right on. That's one of his bio photographs. So that is clearly a huge part of his identity and how he sees himself.
He went through an insane personal situation that we don't even know the depths of with his back and his back surgery and clearly dealing with insurance companies as part of this. This is a class warfare issue, but it's not the rich against the poor. It's the people against the corporations that damage our lives. And even though he even though he has money, he still is dealing with a situation from the healthcare people that he's so enraged
that he does something. Most of us look at that and say, I wouldn't have done it, but I understand, and that's the core of the issue.
He is but a player in this.
When you see the country respond over forty percent supportively to what he did, what we have to say is not you shouldn't feel that way, but why does everyone agree with what he did.
Well, time out, time out.
First of all, forty one percent, ain't everybody that's number one, number two.
No, that's forty one.
Now, that's forty one percent of under thirtyty Okay, that's forty one percent.
You're right, forty one tremendous about him.
Agreement totally set total seventeen percent forty one percent under the age of thirty thirty to thirty nine yearld that apply for.
Twenty not seventeen. It's not seventeen. I'll tell you that right now in the real world. It's not seventeen per Well, that's what they put out there. They more than that. That's what they put out there. But I got it.
Just for the purposes of this discussion, we'll go with that for the moment. All I'm trying to say to you is this, I don't disagree with your premis. I'm I'm for that, But in the same breath, what I'm saying is, considering the time, in the visit of times that we live in, you don't think it's dangerous for people to be out there applauding somebody being murdered. Now, I understand that you're saying that they're not necessarily applauding that it's the system taking advantage of the little guy.
You're a health insurance agency, your corporate America, and you're abusing the American citizen.
I got that part.
Shit, I'm one of them.
My point to you is this.
I still can't sit up there when I see a man get shot in the back, gunned down and gunned down in the streets, shot in the back, murdered, wife's a widower, children, no longer a father, and think that that's a course for celebration. I'm saying, is there not something to be concerned about that in our society?
I think that you are not yet understanding the moral stakes that were actually seeing. Let's say you saw somebody murder a serial killer, would you say, oh my god, he was a son and a father. No, thank god, somebody took him off the earth.
Right.
There is no serial killer that you could name who is responsible for more deaths than United Healthcare. So now Luigi took it on himself to bring pain to the head of United Healthcare because he saw them as serial killers. And if you see them as legalized serial killers, which they are allowed to betray their customers to make a buck.
Well, then the moral stakes are completely different. He didn't just murder a person walking down the street.
He murdered the tip of the spear to send a message to the entire industry.
And so you're okay with that? What if the mindset is that's just the first one. What about the people that had you know, posts out there with the faces and names of other healthcare CEOs and they had Brian Thompson's face when they with an X over it like one down and these others to go? Is that okay?
What's not okay is for the conversation to become about the rage that we have towards CEOs, as if that is the central part of the conversation. The central part of the conversation is how the healthcare industry is allowed to betray its customers and allow them to die and be in pain and be sick so that they can make a buck. We need far greater regulation on the healthcare system. That is the core issue in this conversation.
And if we miss that, then we miss an opportunity to make change in an incredibly important industry in our country.
Well, first of all, let me say this, I completely agree with you that's an issue that we shouldn't miss. I'm not arguing with that. I'm just talking about the danger that exists from the other side. Because listen, healthcare is one issue. There's plenty of things that we can look at in the system that exists within the United States where regulations need to be altered to some degree, things need to be addressed. The system continuously takes it
vantage of the American citizen, et cetera, et cetera. There's an abundance of things that we can look at. But our answer to it, if it's going to be violent, and that's okay, what kind of society is let's say that. Does it say that we have laying down the pipe for us?
What we're not saying that we live in a civilized or a peaceful American society?
Right? We are a wash in guns and violence.
We just add a female school shooter like we're breaking new grounds. We have DEI and school shooting now, like we have school shooters that are constant.
We have all kinds of violence.
Don't get me even started on state sponsored violence, the police and the military and the sort of things that we're allowed. I mean, we are constantly dealing with things in a violent way. So we are not a peaceful or civilized society by any stretch. Obviously, I do not think that everybody should handle their disagreement with the healthcare industry in this way. But this conversation cannot evolve into that young man should not have killed somebody. Obviously he
should not have killed somebody. But even more important, the health care industry must be rained in and the way that it is allowed to behave legally in a completely immoral way.
That is the core of this conversation.
Completely in moral way. So, in other words, in the society that we're living in right now, when you're trying to listen, I agree with you, and the way you broke it down, I agree with you. There's no disagreement here. I'm just making the argument that could be an issue. No matter where you turn to, you're isolating the issue of health care, because obviously that's.
A very profound thing.
Once health obviously, your livelihood, your quality of life, et cetera, et cetera. It's all affected.
By your health.
I don't give it damn how much money you have. If your health ain't good, you ain't good. You can't enjoy the fruits of your labor. I understand that part, but other people with that mindset it might translate to anything far removed from health care. Just because they feel like they're getting taken advantage of by the system, that may be a for them to engage in such heinous acts. And we can't ignore that either.
Don't focus in this conversation. Don't just focus on Luigi did x. Oh my god, what does that mean to society? Okay, there is a reason why he engaged in that. And when you see millions of people across the country celebrating somebody for bringing pain like that to the healthcare industry, you have to say, why is it that so many people agree with his action and are cheering on his action. That's where I am That's what I am motivated by. Why are people feeling that way? Rather than telling them
they shouldn't feel that way. I think media has a responsibility to report the truth and to speak truth to power. And when we are reporting the truth, we have to say, why are all these people so happy that this happened? We cannot say you guys should not feel that way. And like when you we wag our finger at the people and say you should not feel that way. We are completely missing what is really going on.
I don't think we're missing what's going on. I get your point, and I think it's valid. I just think that you're pointing people like myself, Gail King and others were pointing to the celebration or the I'm going to say, the celebration, that kind of vibe that was out there when a person was murdered, and I think that ultimately that's the scary part because it provides justification for such a haintous act. I get what you're saying. Though you're
not wrong. I'm not trying to say that you're wrong, and you are right. As media members, we do need to look into why people feeling that way. That is just as important as what happened. But I also think that we can't minimize the word celebration in terms of how it came across in the eyes of some people that were disseminating that kind of message to the masters.
I'm happy it happened. I don't care that this guy was murdered.
This is what United Healthcare CEO was doing. Guess what if it happens to somebody, Oh's good. That was the attitude, and I don't know if that's good for our society, bro, I just don't.
I mean, there's there is an anti corporate mood in the country for a reason, because our country is shaped by what the wealthy and what the corporations want. There's a very low correlation between what the masses want and what d C does, and a very high correlation because what the corporations want and what right and what the court what DC does. People are angry about that. People are angry about this massive wealth gap that we have.
People are completely.
Missing the point when they say, Brian Tubson came from humble background, which he did public school, Iowa farmer father. But he became part of the extreme wealth class. And did he remember that he came from a working class or a lower middle class background when he became extremely wealthy, did he did he think about that when people had claims and couldn't pay them and he and IT couldn't pay for their health care and he refused their claims,
did he think about that? I mean, he's not. The New York Times tried to call him a working class hero. He is a working class trader. Like we need to talk about that.
I don't recall anybody calling him a working class hero. That's news to me.
I missed the Brett the New York Times.
I missed that one, Brett Stevens, Brett Stevens, New York Times.
All right, that's one individual of the New York Times. Everybody's got their opinion. I get that part, Tore. I appreciate it, man, I can't.
I listen.
I can't argue your point. You're absolutely right, especially me being in the media along with the rest of us.
You are absolutely right that there should be a spotlight placed on the dissent that people feel, to discuss that people feel as to why this stuff happened, getting to the biggest issue about really really being against corporate America and what it's done to the American citizens, particularly with the new administration coming in the office of what people are anticipating may happen for those, you know, for the wealthy amongst them. Absolutely right, There's no doubt about that,
So I can't knock it. I was just saying, look, you're out in the streets. You know a dude got murdered. Now, that ain't a reason to celebrate. That's all I was trying to see but I got your point. I got your point. And I've been in a situation as you have, where most of our life, he found a situation where corporate America hasn't been there for us at all. We didn't go out and shoot anybody. That's all I'm saying. That's all I'm saying. I get your point. You're not wrong,
You're not wrong. I'm just saying, we didn't go out there and shoot somebody in the back and gun him down.
That's not you know.
I don't know.
I don't know where you got in the back. I haven't seen the full footage. I don't think it was in the back. I don't know why. I don't know why we keep going back to the well. I guess I guess that's where he was when he got shut.
I'm I'm only assuming that because I saw him point in the gun, and then while the guy was walking and his back was turned, and I saw a report that said.
No, I don't, but I don't. I don't.
I don't think that that batters as far as the relationship to it doesn't. The healthcare industry and the way that all these people feel, I've never seen in my life such a stark divide between the way the media class is discussing something and the way the people feel.
And we saw such a stark divide that I felt I had to speak about it on social media, and you know, with folks like you to be like, you know, y'all, y'all, y'all need to understand because when it was Maga, when Maga rose up, media said we need to understand who these people are, right, we also wagged our finger at them, but we went to their coffee shops to try to figure out who they are.
And right now, as millions of people are cheering Luigi on, we.
Need to go into their coffee shops it is and figure out who they are, why they feel that way.
So let the audience know where you're gonna be talking about this further, because I know you ain't gonna get off this subject.
I mean, you know you can catch be on rapt on YouTube. I'm on my TikTok Toret show. Uh, We're gonna talk about on my podcast Tore Show, and you know I'll be back here with Steven A.
Smith next week.
I appreciate you man, Thanks a lot, bro, thanks a lot, so much. Appreciate the education thanks a lot, all right.
Man, thank you. M m mmmmmmmmm
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