Zach Plesac / Michael Jacobs

I'm talking about no Taiwanese baseball teams offering a contract to forty seven year old Manny Ramirez after he announced he likes to play there in I know it's just Manny being Manny, but we already live in a fantasy world. Eighty two game baseball season, Basketball at Disney World, Brady to Tampa Bay, a primetime specialist, celebrities cutting their own hair. There's already a glitch in the matrix. Let's just go full acid trip. Let Manny play, Let, Manny play Let,

Manny play. I'm gonna assume you're chanting with me, but even if you're not, I'm talking to fleets and sports industry professionals about what they're doing in quarantine, hoping to figure out if the fame is competing as much as I miss watching it. This is the No Sports report to become a professional athlete. The amount of dedicated work and focus training required is something most people could never do. I say this while eating a large bag of nacho cheese.

Dorito's years of work go into achieving a dream that, in less than one percent of cases actually does happen. And if you're one of the chosen few live it up, the work is paid off. But what if you can't live it up because right now it can't pay off? What if you're stuck in a global pandemic, unable to participate in your first opening day, moving city to city and quarantine because you're a rookie pitcher who rightfully hasn't

bought a house yet. And even though you had one of the most impressive starting pitture debuts in Cleveland, Indians history, taking them out at a rainy Fenway Park against David Price in two thousand nineteen, well that has nothing to do with coronavirus. And your story is still delayed in

finding its fairy tale end. And sure, some people might think you have the best pickoff move in the majors, and you added an off speed pitt during the spring, and you're a dark horse favorite for a starting rotation spot. But what's it all worth if you can't actually celebrate the winds? These are all questions for today's guest, Zach Pleisach. We talked about being a pandemic nomad, his surreal first

major League appearance, and the stuff your grandma collects. And I chat with Michael Jacobs, the director of Quimby's new series about Donald Sterling in the two thousand fourteen Los Angeles Clippers black Ball. All of this on the new episode of The No Sports Report. How from exactly that to accept press one? Hello Zach, Hey, buddy, I've noticed you've been moving around a little bit during quarantine. You're staying safe, obviously, but I want to know where you're

currently hunkered down. I'm right now currently in northwest Indiana. I started off obviously in Florida, was in Cincinnati, and my family staring north this Indiana. So I had a send some time with them before I really head out here, you know, to get ready for the season that's gonna be coming up Staine hopefully. Yeah, So before that, who are you with my agent? See now that's the thing I had heard you were living with your agent, and I realized I need a new agent mine. I would

never let me live with her, let alone. She sent me just an edible arrangement for Christmas. I mean, I'm gonna I'm in the wrong situation. Man. That's maybe she doesn't have the extra room fit. Maybe I don't know. I feel I feel jipped. Uh. You've been able to also see your teammate and your friend Mike Clevinger, which is more than most players have been able to do. So how have you been able to stay active and

fit and healthy getting ready for this new season? Yeah, I mean at first it was we were down in Florida together, so it was nice outside. It was, you know, nice enough to be out and about. Obviously can't go in any public places, but we you know, had the outside ability to play catch in the street and you know, around some sprints or do some band work in the driveway. So I mean, at first, it was super limited to activity that was basically just like in her house and home.

Idem Um. I had some weighted balls and some bands that I had, you know, just from spring training and things that I took with me to continue to train, and we were just using those things and really just playing catch, but weight listening kind of slowed down, which it normally would at that point of the year anyway,

because we've been getting into the season. Um. But you know, like there still has to be a point of keeping that strength and making sure that you know, as we're moving forward, we're not regressing and work at least we get a positive direction sure, and and beyond working out, staying fit getting ready for baseball. While you're traveling doing these things, have you been able to watch TV shows or do any of the things these normal humans like

me are doing. Yeah, I mean I've definitely been spending more time like with my family, and I've been watching a lot more TV um on my computer at least. Uh, you know, I've really been I've kind of been bounced around. It's like as soon as I kind of like get like settled in somewhere, like about time for me to make a different move, you know. So I'm just kind

of staying a lot of my COEs. I don't have a house yet for myself, so that's really the next step for me, somewhere where I can actually punker down and get all my stuff, you know, packed in and have like a home base. But you know, at first is you know, I was with my friend and I'm with my agent and with my family, and you know, so I was trying to figure out what's gonna work best for everybody, you know. So, yeah, you are different than most people I've spoken to for the podcast because

you've actually been having to move to different places. What has it been like traveling during this time. Yeah, I mean it's when I'm traveling, I'm just in the car. You know, It's I'm not like staying overnight anywhere, like you know, really coming in contact with anyone until I'm

getting gas out of my car. You know. It's really the only time so um, when I'm When I was in Cincinnati traveling there, you know, my agent had a great set up with a gym and uh, you know, trainer and play this stuff to get my work in. And yeah, I mean there's just like a blessing from to be able to have that and make the most

of it there. And I have you know, the prisoners to have a gym here at home, and me and my training together down in Florida's as good as it gets to because you know, we're pushing each other and we're you know, become a scientists on our body, I guess, so to speak, based on you know, mechanics and try to just reach our full potential and get the most

out of ourselves. Yeah. I mean, I know it's kind of a cheap comparison, but I guess people that I know who have had to drive kind of far places say it does have a bit of like a walking dead vibe. Is like, no traffic on any freeways, the streets seemed pretty quiet. I mean, I guess I was wondering, was it much quicker for you than normal? Oh? Yeah, yeah, actually that yeah, now that you say that, driving up from I'm you know, staying from the Panhandle of Florida

to Cincinnati. You drive to Louisville, and I remember just going through that city at Louisville and it was an absolute ghost town of like the city of downtown. So that's not like dang, No one is really outside right now. Even on the roads, they're pretty open. I could say. Now, I feel like they're getting more um, I guess rush. Yeah, it seems people are starting to go outside at least

a little bit. Now, I know, you have a brother that you're staying with that was a high school senior, younger brother, so did a bump him out to have his graduation cut short and not have a prom and and all the things you and I now barely remember, probably but meant a lot to us at the time. Yeah, he was definitely bummed at first. You know, this season taken away from him his senior year high school, of

his friends. I mean, that's probably one of the most memorable kinds of your life, you know, So for him it was it was hard at first, but you know, you know, we just kind of gotta keep our heads straight, you know, just you know, he knew that he's got

to look forward to what's next in his life. He's got to take care of some things and looking to go to place somewhere, and you know what he has to do in order to do that, and just kind of with everything, you know, he's got to reorganize and a justice like everyone has to do eventually, you know, just adjust of what kind of gets done your way. So this is just something he realized he has been battling with. It's unfortunate, but yeah, he's he's good now.

He was. He was definitely bummed before and he was playing sports. Is that what I'm under the impression his season was cut out? Yeah, he was a senior. He was I mean a picture. I'm sorry, he was a picture in the baseball team and they were about to start their season, I think top five. They were ranked in the state and had a lot of buzz going their way, had other good arms on their team and

some other good players. So um, there was definitely some buzz before the season for their squad going into this this year. So yeah, I didn't even think of that really. I guess I just weirdly focused on prom but it is true. I mean he didn't even really get to see you know, the scouts didn't really get to come out all those things too. Yeah, I know, right, So now I think even I don't even think Scots are allowed to come watch guys during the squortancing time anyway.

So it's like, yeah, crazy for those guys who are looking to go go play or get recruited or even you know, have a chance to get drafted, because it's kind of difficult. It's like you got to do it all over our phones now videos. Yeah, how hectic was it for you. You don't have your own place yet, you're looking into doing that. Obviously you're kind of new to the league. How hectic was it for you one day to be completely president focused on spring training and

then the next trying to figure out where you're gonna stay. Yeah, it's kind of like that's how it's been the past couple of years, Like trying to figure out where you're gonna stay, where you're gonna be. Everything, he's kind of up in the air. It's kinda gotta just whatever. You know, it's kind of blown your way. But um, you know, I didn't even have a place set up yet for the season. During spring training, I was kind of waiting to see where everything is playing out and you know,

just moving along. I just had to see what's been going to be a good situation for me to get my training in and keep my mental good, you know, everything just being a good spot. So because I wasn't even looking forward, I have to it's my responsibility as starting pitcher for the Fluting Indians to prepare and keep myself ready for when we do have to go play. You know, it's not like we were I wasn't off during this time so I was moving around from with

my teammate to my agent to my family. I was in Cleveland for a little bit and then I'm back home. Um yeah, and I'm just, you know, do what I gotta do to make the best of what we got. Uh. I guess too, Like I don't mean to to pour salt in the wound here, but you know it was gonna be your first pro opening day. Uh. Did you have sort of that whole process planned out in your head to walk out the call of your name, the whole thing. I mean, how big of a bummer is

it to not have that? Yeah, for sure, I had. I had all that stuff ready. Uh it was. It was a bummer. I mean I wasn't sore set to make the team, you know. So it was definitely competition to the end. But looking looking forward to opening day, man, that's something you know, I dream about, um and hopefully you know, in the future sometime I'm able to experience it. But for now, you know, my opening days whenever we

get our first game this year? Yeah, well, you you had a great strong eight and six under four e r a season. I know you said it was a battle to make roster, but you were obviously a favor to do. So, uh, you found your groove right away kind of coming in and and that's not easy to do obviously. Does this kind of does the pouse and play? Does it mess with your flow at all? No, honestly, Like, I don't think it has it all. Uh. I really think,

you know, I've done as much as I could. I mean in the grand scheme of a season and in terms of reading guys swings and doing all that and understanding the league and what's going on, like that's part of it. Definitely we're gonna have to, you know, adjust as you play when we get going again. But you know, I feel like I've done everything and been blessed with the resources around me to be able to continue to train and just stay on top of my craft. You know,

it's just more than work to me. It's something that you know, I've carried with me every day. So um, I wake up and get ready to work. So I think, you know, in the end, it's it's a bummer our games got pushed back, but you know, I think I'm really ready to play right now. So your major League debut was at the Storied, and I guess intimidating Fenway Park. Mookie Betts was the first batter you faced. You had a like a four hour rain delay. You still went

five and a third innings. You gave up only one run. If any picture conservative survived this pandemic, it is clearly you. Is there a way you could go through? How difficult that day was for you? Yeah, that day was one I'll never forget. Just steven from the night before. But my agent has set up a fake dinner at Morn's and they catered us really nice. They must my agent must told him that I was pitching the next day and they were just pitching me good luck and being

really cool. Had a great dinner, welcome to the next morning, and wanted just to get my mind off the game as much as I could and just enjoy the day and the experience of my my family. But I couldn't really hang out with my mom a whole bunch because she was stressed me out, probably just being stressed out herself. So I hang out with my brother and my agent.

We got some pasta for lunch, and then my agent actually got me these white pair of lebrons that it just came out at fourteen lows and Tom at the shoe. So we were walking up and down Boston and it was kind of raining out, so was it being a day, you know, So we're just trying to find stuff to do and like make it right. But he gives me these shoes. He's all white, you know. I take them into the into my warm up and I'm running on

the warning track. I got them all muddy, and I'm like, you know, this is when I can trash these shoes I just got Today. We're in the babies like we can. That's like, what are you supposed to do? You know, getting near this tomorrow? I didn't really know. It's so lost, just like being so president, you know. So ends up getting a gift from my agent. Took him in and got loose. Uh. Yeah, it came all the way to

the game time. You know, it's probably missing out and that wasn't really raining, but it wasn't not raining, so like it was a question in the air if we're gonna play, waiting to see if the weather was gonna hold up, and so uh this kind of waiting game. I had to do a bunch of paperwork before the game, and like signing to your contract getting transferred over from trip to the big leagues, and I had to Puy.

I had never met before like big league. Uh you know obviously our big league staff and other athletic trainers and pubbies ever met, and so that was all new. Everything is super new. You've never been the friend way before, so I was new too, So everything was just so new to me. I was just trying to absorb it.

One of my warm ups, I'm just nervous as hall of hell, and my family and friends are standing behind like the guy I'm playing catch with, so that's the only thing I see when I'm playing catch, you know. So it was like welcoming, but at the same time, it's just you know, you don't want to overthrow one and then throwing the bleachers and everyone's watching. You know. That's like how I felt um going in you know.

The first inning. Well, I was warming up next to David christ To, who you know, is as great as they get. You know, I was even watching some with him, trying to throw like him as a righty, but I know he's left seeing just being in that moment just throwing next to him too. It's almost a real So I get to the first ending. I throw my first pitch to Mookie Best and I yank get hard on

the glove side. The ball felt like a tennis ball for real, and um, the next pitch is supposed to be down in a way and I missed like kind of up and in just trying to throw a strike, you know, I'm feeling like I'm throwing a golf ball. And then he rolls over the third thankfully, and I saw if I don't think he swings at that, it

might have been a ball. And I don't know if I was gonna strike after that, so shout out to move to back, getting me see that first out, and then uh, ever's next that bat struck him out and that was my first strike out is the third guy set out, so you know, it's rain delay after that. So like an hour waiting around and running a bike, you know, text with my family, listen to music, trying to stay like cool and just kind of playing the

waiting game to see what was going on. And luckily, you know, the stash were I mean, they trusted me enough to go back out there, even in the rain delay. So I went back out and got through five and me and they're coming back late that game and winning, so overall is a really good day. When I got taken out of again, there's a letter from David Probace, just a saying, you know, like I wish it would have been a better day for you, Good luck, sy and yeah as long in my career, and it's just

really cool. It was just like one of those things like I'm actually here at the clash saxt uh. When you when you look back at it, is it like an out of body experience where you're sort of watching over you still remember, I mean obviously you know the details. Does it feel like you did it? Or does it feel like it was someone else? Uh? No, I mean

it's definitely a moment that I won't forget. It felt like an out of body experience, I guess, But I mean I definitely can have vivid memories of throwing on the foul line and even getting on the mound and just being warming up in between anything. I knew exactly where I was. I could still see it, so it's something that would be stuff in my head first rest of my life. Did you end up with clean lebrons?

Are you still have those dirty ones? Yeah? Honestly I got them cleaned up and they were good to go. So I'm just getting another pair of those shoes, the same pair after I had wrecked them. So okay, good. I was gonna say, someone's gotta take care of you there. During the off season, you added a curveball to your arsenal. Like I said, you're coming off a very strong season. Uh. In any other staff, you're you're kind of building up to be, you know, a two or three option almost immediately.

But the Cleveland staff is stacked. How do you feel about your chances of making the team slash starting rotation are now? Well, I mean there's there's no promises. With how deep our staff, this is blessing for real. I mean, if there's not a lot of things like you should they have a deep pitching staff. So I mean that's definitely advantage we have. We have a lot of great guys. I mean, I feel really confident where I'm at with all my pitches and mentally physically, I'm in a great

spot to pitch into big league. So, um, you know, isn't new who makes the decisions. So I just do my part and prepare myself as well as I can. Right. Well, that's great? Uh, you and I are both big tattoo guys. I have a bit less than you. I'm more of a pick and shoes spots dude, but you have great work on your sleeve and chest. Uh. With social distancing becoming a bit of the norm, I've asked this a couple of guys already. Do you see, like, how does

tattooing go on? Like? Does do people have to be tested and then you're you're safe to go get a tattoo from that guy? What does it look like post pandemic? Yeah, tattoo artists are pretty much closed through July, so they're on backburners right now. I don't think people can get private apparently specially private sessions and put those guys out of business. So I think right now in a lot of states, it kind of depends. But um, yeah, I do have a lot of tattoos and it looks like

it won't be getting anymore for a little bit. But yeah, I wonder if the future once everything's like, oh, I wonder if private is the way to go just but I mean I do think like if I'm going to be that close to someone for a few hours, in some cases, it's like I need to know that they've tested net ative, it would be it would be a whole thing. Yeah, I agree. So I mean who knows,

uh well, moving forward to keep it positive? Is there anything you think that we've adapted to during this time of the pandemic that you think should stick around for when everything works out and we're back out in the wild. I think I hope no one's scared from everything that's going on, you know. I think it's becoming more aware

of how to do your part more. You know, I think we as people need to start taking you know, responsibility for things that we do and how it can affect not only us in our future, but our generations to come. So, I mean, I think this is definitely just woke into the grand audience of all everyone. I mean, hopefully, you know, move forward, people just kind of learn how to do their thing and you know, kind of have a little more awareness to what good health is and

how we can just better our whole planet. That's right, it's just a little bit of a rain delay, right, We'll come back, stay stay stay warm, all right. So I usually end these podcasts with a little bit of some suggestions things that can help you during the pandemic, so I wanted to give you a couple of them and see what you think. All right, First, theme parks

have obviously been closed. They are one of the most I think damaged industries because you just imagine, you know, tens of thousands of people in one spot, and so they've been closed during the outbreak. Now whether or not they can reopen still up in the air. But Disneyland and Disney World is known for a very specific food and its recipe has always been a mystery until now. With everyone stuck at home and no chance of visiting the parks, they've released the coveted doll Whip soft serve.

Do you know about the doll whip. I've definitely had it before, I'm not Why don't you tell me what they're about? Okay, So it is people for years have been obsessed with it. They serve it only near this weird tiki room that has like talking birds in it, and even when you've tried to do it at home, it never tastes the same, and people are like, oh,

I gotta go get the doll whip at Disneyland. So they totally like just out of nowhere, went to the Disney blog and the Disney app and just posted the recipe, which is just three ingredients, vanilla ice cream, pineapple juice, and frozen pineapple chunks. That's it. That's it, that's all. That's it. I'm gonna go. I have to make a trip to the grocery store. I think it's see how

mine will compare. They have to add sugar or something has to I feel like they're lying, but people can the suggestion just go over, bring a little Disneyland to your house, make some It's all viewable on the Disney Parks app. Great for a hot day. Um now, my other one is for you and your friends, teammates who want to catch up or whatever it is. It is

a zoom poker game. So this this is a way to play poker, which, by the way, today I saw a photo of a casino that is trying some things out in Florida, and I will tell you it was a poker table and around the whole poker table was fiberglass and you can just put your hands in little holes in the fiberglass, like it's like your baby was just born and you want to touch it. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I mean, but maybe I don't know, don't know if I trust it, but it

looks weird. But I think an easy way is to just get on Zoom online handful of great online poker sites. You can download those apps and then set up a private table, send invites to your friends, and then use a second screen like an iPad to set up the zoom and then you're like calling each other all in the same room. You're just sitting there. And if you wanted to involve money, which is illegal, I do not

at all suggest it. It would be easy to set up a venmo to collect the money, but I'm not encouraging that's I mean, it sounds like a lot of tablet different in your room. But I mean still as long as you're not catching your hand, I mean, it doesn't matter when their money agreed. Lastly, Uh, now, I know we all have we all have different families, uh, and we we've all grown up in different areas across the globe. But I do think that we all have

or had similar grandparents. Okay, so grandparents are kind of one species. Their house smells like a mix of mothballs and cinnamon sticks. They always have worthers in their pocket. We know these lovable creatures. But the one thing I missed most about my grandparents are there chat keys. Do you know what chat keys are? Okay, they're like the little things around their house that are like insanely breakable

and appear to be worth a bunch of money. Like my grandma had this crystal candy dish, and she had a curial cabinet filled with humble statues which are basically just these porcelain figures of like young boys and leader hose in opening a mailbox or like playing hop scotch. Do you know what I'm talking about? I don't know. I don't think I do. Man, do you Grandma? Grandma? Did they have like like weird things. They collected it all like penguin statues or mugs. They have some collections.

See now those are I can't get into all that right now. Well those are chos. So that's okay. You don't even need to get into it. You just need to know that those are chat keys. So when we when we reopen as a nation, I am suggesting that you take advantage of this with a store in Indiana.

You can even do it there. The store is going to be called zach Plesack's knickknacks, okay, Nicknack, and you specialize in like ornate desk clocks that don't tell the right time or never could, or like commemorative spoons that celebrate stuff like NASA re launches and very fancy plates that look like Saddam Hussein owned them. Like it's just all the things grandparents have. I don't know if that's older.

I'm kind of new. Two ways, honestly, my Adam make them like con join it started collaboration, right, Yeah, that doesn't make sense for you, like a drip collaboration like a streetwear thing. Yeah, I get it. Well it's a real look and don't touch type of store, so I understand. But but I I let you have that. But for now, I just want to thank you for coming on the show and I want you to stay healthy and I can't wait to see you out on the field. I for one to have you in the starting rotation, so

I'm thrilled to get baseball back out there. Let's go, man. I appreciate you, and uh yeah go try Thanks for having me. After this break, my chat with Michael Jacobs, director of black Ball, the new Quimby documentary about the

controversy over former Clippers owner Donald Sterling. Right now, Feeding America is working tirelessly to ensure our most vulnerable populations, like students who are out of school, the elderly individuals whose jobs are impacted, and low income families continue to have access to food and other needed resources during the

COVID nineteen pandemic. The Feeding America Food Bank Network is committed to serving communities and people facing hunger in America, and their greatest need is donations and support of local food banks. This podcast is committed to donating a portion of the proceeds from the show to Feeding America, and we hope that you can join us in this effort to find out how you can help Feeding America dot org backslash COVID nineteen. Now here's my chat with Black

Ball director Michael Jacobs. Michael, how's it going, ma'am good? How are you? I'm good. Well. First, I wanted to congratulate you on the release of the documentary. It is called black Bald. You can find it currently. I think in its first few chapters on Quimby, I assume there is not a better time in the universe ever to release a basketball documentary. Uh, did you have to rush

it out after the success of the Last Dance? We did. Yeah, Originally we were slated to aar in June, and once the Last Dance rushed their you know schedule up, and once it became the cultural phenomena that it that it was going to be, um, you know, we had to get our our film series done much more quickly than we had anticipated. So we were really you know, making last minute changes and tweaks and um delivering you know, down to the wire here about a week and a

half ago. Oh, I'm sure that's very easy to do in the pandemic, right right. I can't speak enough about the team of people working on this, you know, across all different facets, from the producers down to these post vendors. Um, it was. It was an extremely difficult set of circumstances on an extremely tight timeline, and they just did such

a phenomenal job. Well, people who don't know it tells the story of the Wild two thousand fourteen season, in particular the playoff run of the l A Clippers, where the garbage person we know is Donald Sterling was outed for being a racist with a tape conversation my first question. I am a die hard Clippers fan since I was about seven years old. Uh, why would you voluntarily start watching this team so many hours when you had the

choice not to? Right exactly, this was such a wolful basketball team, and you know, in a weird way, that's what made you know part of this story. You know. Obviously, of course Donald Sterling and his I love how you described him as the garbage man, this awful human being, um, who was in control of this team for too long, who made horrible decision after horrible decision, both personally and

from a basketball perspective. He basically ran this team into the ground until things just sort of despite himself, turned you know around. But that's what makes our story, you know, all the more interesting, is that, like, this was a huge turnaround, and that you know, by two thousand fourteen, not only did he have a team of of you know, really competitive, top quality players, but they were storming into

the playoffs. And so you know, it was important to us to make sure we go into that backstory to remind audiences that, like, hey, the Clippers weren't always like this. In fact, you people have probably knew much about them, um, and if you knew stuff about them. You you know, you knew that they were one of the worst franchises in professional sports. So the turnaround was so important to make sure that we you know, captured along with um,

you know, setting the table for the quick Uh and Painful. Um, you know Demise after his tape came out. Quick and Painful is the other team name for the Clippers. Uh did you where are you? Where are you originally from? I grew up in Boulder, Colorado, And um, I went to high school in Denver, UM, So I'm a Colorado guy.

So I grew up a Nuggets fan. UM. And you know, we had a you know, we also have not had great teams, and you know, there were eras there, especially when I was in you know, middle school and really up until high school, we were we were all so not a laughing stock in the same way the Clippers were. But it was hard to feel the competitive team. But then that the can be Ma Tumbo years came along, and you know we had a little, a little playoff run there and then of course now we're back in

the mix. Yeah, you had to sit through the Lofonso Ellis years. I you've you you understand the plight, you know, the plate. It's funny because it's kind of mentioned in the documentary a little bit like if you're a Clippers fan, you you knew what you were ignoring, you knew what

you were willing to do. And I actually am on record doing it because the Rolling Stone magazine had me write an article in the first year of Lob City about how excited I was, which was very nice of them, And in there I even say in a sentence, let's forget that our owners are racist. Like I actually used that sentence. And I guess did you run into that when you talked to fans that we were just woefully ignorant to how far it went? Number one, because I

just assume all rich white guys are racist. Uh? And did we know it was? Did anyone know it was this much? I mean, that's such a good question, And I mean it's kind of a question, you know. I think everybody you know, who's a who's a fan of professional sports should ask themselves, you know, once in a while, is what am I supporting here? And what am I

sticking my head in the sand about, you know? And I think, as you point out, like it was a little bit of a probably more than an open secret with Donald Sterling, right, And there were there was some very publicized transgressions prior to this tape, you know, and there was the anti discrimination settlement and there was Elgin Baylor's lawsuits. So there were these moments, um that we're on record that we're shameful, and it probably did make

it hard for fans to be fans. And you know, I think it's fans we we turn away from a lot of stuff. And I think that's probably the other really important part of this documentary is setting it in in America, and because I think it just it forced the heads in the sand to look up and look

around again, you know. And because we had an African American president, because we had the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement as a response to the shooting of Trayvon mart you know, because we had athletes, a new generation of athletes led by Dwyane Wade and in our case, Chris Paul and then of course Lebron James starting to be more aware and politically active. And so as a result of that, I think stands you know, we're just

forced to start to pay attention again. Um. And for the better, right, But yeah, I mean I think we're all a little bit complicit when it comes to these things and and the sports we love and the ways that we want to and and of course we're it's not like you, as a fan, we're ever rooting for Donald Sterling, right, You're rooting for players and and this team, and so it's complicated. Yeah, it's very much, very much. So you spoke to Chris Paul J. J Reddick, DeAndre

Jordan's post career Matt Barnes, which is my favorite Matt Barnes. Uh, Doc Doc Rivers. They all agreed to help with this story. I assume they've talked about it in their opinion maybe quote unquote enough. How did you get them to agree

to doing the doc? Yeah? So, um, my producer Sam Widows, Um, you know, he had a relationship with Doc Rivers and and he heard Doc Rivers tell this story about the first time that the players had this you know, confrontational meeting with him after the tape came out, and then he convinced Doc to you know, put a little sizzle tape together and you know, once you know, he and my other producing partner, Chris Gary, you know, showed me

the tape. I was like, if we have access to doc, you know, hopefully the rest of the guys will follow. And so, you know, Will Packer and his producing team were able to get Chris Paul to agree to sit down with us, and then Chris was really helpful and instrumental in getting some of the other players to agree

to sit with us. And so he kind of, you know, once once he had had you know, once he um got for an interview and had a good experience, and we just sort of gave him the space to share his side of the story for the first time and just be good listeners. Um. He went on on a limb for us and reached out to DeAndre and JJ and said, I really think you guys should should sit down and and share this story. And and here's you know, an opportunity for the first time ever to just be

given full control of the microphone about what happened. UM. So it just kind of, you know, the stars just kind of aligned. And like I said, that great producers who came together and just worked all the angles to get all these folks to sit down with us over a pretty tight timeline. And um, and then you know, once people started talking about this. I think it was almost a sense of relief that they were able to sort of share for the first time ever what they

went through. And you know, obviously there is the lack of participation on Blake Griffin's behalf. Is it just that he I mean, he's sort of talked to death about it.

Is that what the feeling you got was, Yeah, we reached out to him, um, but he had um he had just done Ramona Shellburn's um great podcast for ESPN, The Sterling Affairs, and so I he had communicated back to us that he had said enough, and so we just sort of left it there and and that's when we were able to get Matt Barns and like you said, that post career Matt Barnes retirement, Matt Barnes was permission to speak freely, which was which was awesome because he's

just such an awesome personality and had such a different and interesting perspective, right because this is a guy who's faced some pretty intense you know, racism throughout his life, and he comes from a biracial background, and so he had a really really um interesting perspective to share about, you know, his experience both in life prior to this tape and then you know how the tape made him

feel in his reaction to it. Sure, Uh, you have some appearances and expertise from some talking heads, from Bob Iger to Remember Brown to the mayor of l A. Uh, you got you got a big plethora of people. Did you get any interaction or reach out to Shelly Sterling or Vista Viana we're sort of the juicier aspects of this story going to be involved at any point. Well, we thought about it um, you know, and for a little while there we were, you know, in earnest considering

it um. But at the end of the day, you know, Donald Sterling and said enough, you know, he had said his piece and he had made clear you know, who he was, and you know, so it didn't feel like it was going to add too much to the story. And then I think more importantly, we had just gotten so much really deep and personal storytelling on behalf of the players. You know, they really shared with us, you know, some some of these more uncomfortable experiences you know, in

their lives about race again that that pregated the tape. Um. But then also just some of the ways that they've made them feel that they've never expressed before, and so we got a little bit of protective of that, and it just felt a little it didn't feel right to go out to the Sterling camp and get them in. And then we felt like, you know, I knew, of course that Donald was going to be plenty present in

this film, right between the archival that tape itself. Um so there's really gonna be no mystery or curiosity about who this guy as it was. Um So, you know, we just sort of let it be and said, let's focus on, you know, making this just about the players and giving them full control of the microphone because they had never been given the opportunity to, you know, have that you know chance prior. Yeah, and I don't want to spoil a bunch for people, so I'll tell you.

I am a lifelong Clippers fanatic, and I feel like I've heard or read everything about it, but I learned a bunch of new things. One of them was that Donald Sterling didn't want to sign JJ Reddick because he was too expensive for a white player. I had never

heard that. It's nuts, right, I mean, it was one of those things that on set we were like, what's like it just added that extra layer of you know, this guy, you know, Donald's clear warped understanding of of of race and this idea of the ownership of others right as an owner. Um, it just it made it all the more creepy. It made it all the more layered and complicated. His whole view of race at large,

just added this other dimensionality. When j J and Doc started telling us that, it was like, you know, A didn't really make sense of it, and I still don't

get it. Was it because he's he's threatened by paying a white player this much that he feels like, you know, it's a different experience than what he what he pays as African American players, Or is it that this guy is so twisted up around the actual around race that you know, just paying this amount of money to a white player, you know, seems wrong on some fundamental level.

It's just just really messed up a lot of layers. Uh. I noticed quickly as a big film school guy, you have these subjects looking directly at the camera, which means you obviously have an influence of Errol Morris. Was was the eye contact important for you? It was? Yeah? I mean I think both as um you know, as an interview technique, and really a desire to have a conversation right as the as the person you know, engaging in

these conversations and and you know, having these conversations. I kind of wanted us to just be able to have those conversations directly and be able to look into each other's eyes and and you know, read each other's expressions, especially around sensitive subject her, and then yes, you have the I guess the benefit of that is that when the audience goes to watch it, then the subjects looking directly at the audience, So there's this feeling of direct intimacy.

So I felt like the right tool for the project. Released in the newly launched content provider Quimby. Your episodes are going to be under ten minute intervals, right, and they recently were only available on your phone. They've changed out to the television. I've heard. Was it a challenge putting this heavy, racially intense show into those kind of parameters?

It was, yeah, I mean, just in general, the challenge of of, you know, a story like this is making sure that it can hold together as sort of a ninety minute feature length documentary. Would that's about you know, this moment in time and these issues around race in

America and this basketball and professional athletes story. But then also we really need to make sure that you could chop it up into these twelve chapters, all under ten minutes, and make sure that there was a really satisfying beginning, middle, and end um to each of the episodes. And like you said, doing that alongside these you know, conversations about about race and culture and and America it provided a

really unique challenge. UM. But my editor, big shout out to Clayton Warfolk just such a fantastic job of making sure that we were able to include all those necessary ingredients, the contextual ingredients about you know, America and um and these real intimate conversations alongside you know, making sure that we stayed true our core narrative, you know, and our really strong pre built narrative about what happened over these

five days. What was the for you most kind of crushing or cringe worthy moment you stumbled on for this story in series? I would say, I mean there were a lot right when you're dealing McDonald Sterling, there's a lot of cringe um, and you know, Sterling provided endless cringe and I think, um, once we got ahold of that white party footage, it was the because it's so raw, right, it's just um, you know, it's it's not well shot by home video footage, right, so it's almost it's just sloppy,

it's poor framing. But as a result of that, you know, it's just this raw capture of this little world, right of Sterling's little world of all these people, um, you know, at this private party at his house where he's showcasing his players. And I used the word showcasing because that's the way that they described it, that they felt like

they were sort of trophies to be showcased. And you can see the players faces and they're just so uncomfortable as he's sort of displaying his players to to this group of people that are I assume as peers and his friends, and it's just gross and it was really uncomfortable, and it was just one of those raw moments where you just sort of get a peek at um, you know, because the tape is so sensational, right, and the tape is such an obvious crossing the line of how this

guy felt in such a lage bear cruise about who he was, um, but this footage of this party was just another dimension to that that to a certain extent, was just creepier, you know, and grosser. So that was for me, that was by far the most cringey. But there were plenty of crunching. I mean, his his interview with Anderson Cooper is a wow. You couldn't have written it. And not only that, the white Party stuff. It's like a documentary forget Out. It's like a Jordan Peel moment.

It's so weird, totally it is. It really is a get out moment. You know, it just is so so so bizarre. Would you have thought without the distraction and don't play kate me here, was this a championship team? I don't think so. I think that maybe maybe maybe they would have got past okay see, without this distraction, I could also have seen them losing in game seven. Okay see, but I don't know if anyone was going to beat tan Antonio that year, right, Yeah, No, That's

sort of how I feel. And I was at that game seven. I was also at the game five. I mean I was, I was watching your duck and thinking to myself, was I there? And then had to pretty much look at my calendar and I and I was, and I feel like I may have pushed it out of my mind the way I did my parents divorced. That's awesome though, that you've got to, you know, be at these games and sort of see that Lop City team.

I mean, such a fun team and such an interesting you know, part of the Clippers history and the Laura now you know, and in a weird way, right, it's like lob City ends, and you know the Donald Sterling stain is is behind us, and now look at the Clippers now you know it is. It is almost a little bit of a fairy tale ending, hopefully for for you Clipper fans. Well, you can blame me if I jinxed it, I'll blame everyone in your opinion. You've talked

to two players, experts, cultural analysts. You tell me, can the curse ever be lifted? I mean, if anyone can lift the curse, it's it's a man by the name of Doc Rivers. I mean, the guy is an incredible human being. You know, what a what a leader, what a coach um, what an awesome capable dude? You know who who I would never bet again. So I'm all in on doc you know, saying what curse? Yeah listen,

I'll take it from your mouth to God's ears. Has there ever been a better year to be Todd Boyd also got hey the notorious PhD. I am happy for him getting his shine and getting his you know licks and wherever he can. He is an awesome, awesome guy and such a great articulate spokesperson on behalf of pop culture and race and the intersection of hip hop and basketball. Yeah, listen, I I took his class at USC. I'm a fan.

I love seeing him and stuff, and he is clearly all over the place, uh this this year, So listen. I thank you for your documentary as a Clippers fan. Happy to have it out there. It's blackballed on Quimby. It gets released in these sort of small pockets, but they're really good and people will love it. And I just ask you one thing. How about NFL owners next? Yeah? Well, thank you man, And again I love the doc. It's

awesome and I appreciate it. Thanks. I appreciate the No Sports Report is produced and distributed by Tree Sport Media. The show was executive produced by Kelly Garner, Lisa Ammerman, Matthew Coogler and me Jensen Carr. Tom Monahan is our senior audio engineer and sound supervisor, with production and editing by Jasper Leek additional production help from Tim Shower, June Rosen, and Hailey Mandelberg. Our theme music is composed by Spilkis.

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