Ghosts of Cornwall Moors: From Haunted Inns to Bigfoot Myths

So it's going to be more more like my sort of missing 411 cases and someone is having a raving party . It's going to be more like my sort of missing 411 cases and someone is having a raving party . It's like two in the afternoon . So hopefully you don't hear that .

If you do , apologies , but yeah , so it's going to be a bit more informal Still , looking at all the spooky sort of spooky locations and stories associated with them . Um , but it's going to be more about that rather than stories itself . Um , but , yeah , I hope you enjoyed the new format .

Um , but as I said last week , though , um , in my first misinformed one uh case files episode back , you are now stuck with me for the uh blow on call . So , um , yeah , I hope you like the new format . Um , but yeah , speaking of misinformed one episodes , have you listened to the absolute craziness of last week's episode ?

If you haven't , um , I very much suggest going back and listening to it . Um , no , it's about Alaska . So obviously my last episode before I went off on hiatus was about Alaska . But there's just so much stuff and so much strange stuff happening in the state of Alaska that I thought why not make it a two-parter .

So that's what last week's episode episode was obviously back , um , back to scheduled episodes . Um , so that's what last week's was . We talked about all aliens , big planes going missing , um , wild men , bigfoot owls , all sorts I don't know what you're thinking owls , that's not too spooky , but go back and listen . Um , so , yeah .

So if you haven't listened to that , go back and listen . But uh , yeah , uh . Let's get straight into today's episode . Um , so , as you heard in the new intro , um , we are investigating the ominous bodmin moor in cornwall in the uk . Um , which , if you haven't been , is an amazing place . Um , I last went to cornwall .

It was a couple of years ago now , um my 30th , I think . Um , and yeah , me and mark , we've got a sleeper train from l to Penzance . Um , so you get on it at like half 10 at night . You have your own beds . We had our own bedroom . Um , so good . Obviously , the only bad part about that trip itself was I lost my drone in the sea on my birthday .

Yeah , not not the happiest of birthdays , but yeah , it was a lovely place . Um , but yeah , I think what I love so much about cornwall and most of the uk , I suppose is its age and um , you know the pubs there . The history is just amazing .

Um , and there are so many legends , myths and ghost stories that come out of Cornwall and especially Bodmin Moor , and I think the reason for this is that the history goes back so far and even going there today , you still get like that feeling that it's a really old place , like a lot of history , that feeling that it's a really old place , like a lot of

history . Um , now , before we get into the meat the juicy meat sorry , vegans out there um , of today's episode . Um , it's time for a podcast trailer . Um , and it's really strange because these guys they have great podcasts . I listen to it on the regular . Um , and they were due . I was due to promote the podcast with the trailer um back in January .

Then obviously I didn't come back . So I think they were . They were .

They had a bit of a shock when I tagged them in something on Instagram and I was like , oh , this is who , uh , this is who the trailer is going to be , but anyway , rambling , talking absolute shit , um , so , yes , it's going to be , but anyway , rambling , talking absolute shit , um , so yeah , so it's a trailer , but a podcast call , and it's the let's talk

about podcast with Liam and Billy , where each week , they talk about all kinds of different topics , um , such as aliens , ghosts , how to survive a zombie apocalypse . That's one of their first ones , but it's one of my favorites , um , and yeah .

Every Sunday we'll have a brand new episode and we'll even let you guys decide on some of those episodes or what happens in them . So far , we've spoken about ghosts , aliens , zombies and even a talking mongoose . Can't beat a talking mongoose . Follow and subscribe to let's Talk About .

tiktok , um , and I post a lot of behind the scenes stuff , uh , about each episode and just you know . So , um , like photos . It's like TikTok's a bit more silly . I just do stupid stuff on TikTok , to be honest , like everybody .

Um , but yeah , if you want more behind-the-scenes information about each of the locations that I talk about , then , yeah , go follow me on Instagram and remember to like and comment and not comment . What's the word I'm looking for ? Rate , if you haven't rated the podcast and you really enjoy it , then please .

If you leave me a review podcast and you really enjoy it , um , then please . If you leave me a review , five stars only , please . Um , I mean , rate it what you want , but hopefully it'll be five stars , because I think it's . I mean , I'm biased , but I think it's not too bad .

Um , but yeah , if you do that on the podcast platforms that you listen to , like spotify and apple . That would be lovely . Thank you very much . I thank you in advance . Um , right now , all the housekeeping out of the way , let's get into the spooky history of bodmin and bodmin mall . So it'll come as no surprise that the history is very , very rich .

At one time , almost a whole moor would have been forest land , but from around 10,000 BC , so a long , long time ago , small groups of people who wanted the land hunting and gathering began clearing the area so that animals would be encouraged to graze and so make hunting easier .

Now , over time , the trend of life became more and more settled and people set up homes in groups , hunting and farming the land , and even structures such as stone circles and other structures were built .

Now there are many sort of stone , stone circles , stone structures in cornwall , including one very famous one which we've done a story on , of course , is stonehenge . Um , now it might sound small , but the moor itself is around 80 square miles of land , which makes the reports of what spooky things happen here even more impressive .

Now , its location is very important also in helping create the mysterious atmosphere . It is one of the warmest and wettest areas of Cornwall and mists and fogs roll in over its medium to low sloping hills .

Many accounts from people who have stayed at the Jamaica Inn , which we will be talking about later , which , basically , if you don't know about it , what rock have you been living under ? Um ? But the jamaica inn is basically a really old smugglers pub .

They used to think the smugglers used to stay there , um , on the moors , um , and obviously it's still there to this day . Um , it's on my bucket list . I really want to go um , but yeah , it's basically in the middle of the moors and people have woken up to eerie fogs around them at the inn and the surrounding moor .

So just picture the scene you're on a solo hike across the moors and it starts to drizzle , and before you have the chance to find shelter , the clouds roll in and a thick fog appears and all you can think about are the horror stories of ghosts and the terrible beast above them all . You'd be shitting it , like I would be .

I mean , I'd be loving it as well , but freaking it . And that is in part to myths and legends of the area . So let's take a look at one of them . So , since 1983 , there have been over 60 reported sightings of a big cat on bodmin moor . This , still taken from some video footage , shows an animal which is some three and a half feet in length .

Now again , this is a picture that I will have on my instagram . So a little plug for that . Go check it out . Um , and despite an inconclusive inquiry by the government , many locals remain convinced that there is one or more big cats at large on the moors .

Now , in november 1999 , a squadron of cornish raf reserves spent a night on the moors trying to track the beast within the late with its I can't get my words out with the latest high-tech military night vision equipment . Now , unfortunately , bad weather apparently hampered their operation .

Um , I mean , you think they probably go back again , but who knows who , who knows what they found ? The government would probably keep it from us anyway . But yeah , like I say , you can see some of these images of apparent beast of Bob Bimmore on my social media . I always remember when I was younger . If you're in the UK you'll know Centre Park as well .

If you're listening , anywhere else in the world , center parks are basically sort of little holiday parks in the uk , but they tend to be in like all these wooded and forested areas . It's dead expensive now I don't think it used to be that bad but , um , you basically get your own . It's a glorified caravan .

You get like a log cabin in the woods and it's got like all the amenities and stuff around it . Um , but I remember going to one um in sherwood forest when I was a kid , um , obviously with my fam , with the fam , um , and that's where robin hood is . The story of robin hood originates from sherwood forest , um , and it was really cool .

I remember I must have been about seven or eight , so you know really gullible um , and my dad was like , oh , there's been sightings of a big cat , we've got to go out and look for it . And I remember it was probably something that was put on by centre parks themselves .

But I remember walking and he was like , oh yeah , we have to go at night , we have to go at night , um , and I just remember , I have this memory of me and my dad walking through the trees and past everyone's log cabins with our torches , out like looking for this big cat , um , that apparently had been spotted , and there was like other families out looking

as well and stuff . It was really cool , um , but imagine if it was real , some massive jaguar jumped out fucking savage me , you'd have no spooky on radio podcast . So it's probably a good job in the end that it was probably fake .

Um , but my sort of you know what I'm saying is these stories of these , these beasts of sherwood forest or bodmin moore , they're sort of rooted in sort of english myths and legend . Um , so yeah , so that's that's my sort of experience with it . Now , on another website , I found some more information about the beast .

Now , since 1978 , like I said , more than 60 reports have baffled local police about sightings of a large cat-like creature with supposedly sharp , prominent teeth and white-yellow eyes , a cross between a domestic cat and a panther . A string of mutilated livestock has done nothing but fuel the rumours .

Now some people have reported being chased by the powerful and scary cat-like creature . Others have spotted it in the distance , not quite believe in their eyes . Grainy photographs and video footage does exist , but not enough to prove that it is real . A small boy found a large cat skull lying on the banks of the river Fowie in the late 1990s .

It was thought that this was finally evidence that the Beast of Bodmin Moor actually existed . However , the Natural History Museum , the bloody Natural History Museum confirmed that the skull did indeed belong to a leopard , but that the leopard had been imported into Britain as part of a leopard skin rug .

Another long-held hypothesis about the Bodmin Beast centres around the release or escape of big cats from private collections or zoos . It was first claimed that Mary Chipperfield , a 1970s British circus entertainer , released three Pumas into the wild following the closure of her zoo in Plymouth in 1978 . Another claim was made in 2016 by Dartmouth Zoo .

Again on my bucket list , I really want to go about a pack of pumas released back in the 1980s which would explain the existence of big cats on the moor for the last 30 years .

Now there are certain I suppose you have to sort of take it with a pinch of salt so you know if there was multiple pures or you know , like mountain lions sort of sized big cats on the moors . What are they eating ? Because there's , you know , no reports of bodies going missing , people going missing . Livestock has been mutilated , like it said .

People going missing , livestock has been mutilated , like it said . But to support a group of big cats and , I would imagine , a breeding group of big cats surely we would be seeing them more often now . But , um , and yeah , like it would not just stay on the moor , surely they would go over the whole of Cornwall . But they're not spotted there .

So I just like the idea that there's big cats on the moors . Maybe they're all male , maybe they're all female , maybe there's just a few of them , but yeah , I just imagine being out on a walk . It's very sort of American werewolf in London , isn't it ? That was quite creepy .

I think that was filmed , yorkshire Moors , I think not Bodmin , but out on the moors at night , you , maybe by yourself or someone else , the wind , the rain , the fog rolls in . It'd be pretty creepy . So I think the Beast of Poppin' more , I just like the idea of it rather than I actually believe that there is something there .

Um , but yeah , like with most of all of the websites that I use , I will put links in the show description , um , so you can have a read . Uh , for yourself . Rather , or you know or not . Just listen to me , I do have a soothing voice , I've been told .

Um , but yeah , now , just when you thought you would seek sanctuary in a local inn and that you were safe from the beast of bobby moore , you look up at the sign on the outside of the pub and realize you've just put tonight to stay . Stay at the Jamaica Inn . Big mistake , huge , big mistake , huge Fake news .

That was , I think , quite a good Donald Trump impression actually . Now let's get into a little bit of history of the inn itself . Now , the Jamaica Inn was built in 1750 as a coaching inn , the 18th century equivalent of a modern day service station for weary travellers Using the turnpike between Launceston and Bodmin .

They would stay at the inn after crossing the wild and treacherous Amoa . Now some of the travellers were a little less respectable than most and used the inn to hide away smugglers' contraband that had been brought ashore . It's estimated that half the brandy and a quarter of all tea being smuggled into the UK was landed along the Cornish and Devon coasts .

Now , the Jamaica Inn was remote and isolated , so it was the ideal stopping place on the way to Devon and beyond . Now , in 1778 , the inn was extended to include a coach house , stables and a track room attack room . What is attack room ? Creating the L-shaped main part of the building as it is today .

It's commonly thought the Jamaica Inn was so named because it was used to store rum smuggled into the country from Jamaica . Shauna would be very happy with that . I think she'd probably just stay there and just drink all the rum . She currently has a litre bottle of rum in her bedroom that she's not drunk .

She keeps texting me asking me to go drink it with her . I'll have to take her up on that at some point . Um , but yeah , anyway , enough of shauna . Um , the name is actually said to derive from the important local land owing . This is a strange one .

It is said to derive from the important local land owning trelaway family , two of whose members served as governors of jamaica in the 18th century . So maybe that's what the name was . I personally prefer the idea that it was named because they were all smuggling in the room .

Um , but yeah , according to stories , gangs of wreckers operated on the coast of cornwall during the early 19th century and it's described as a haven for smugglers . Now the wreckers entice ships to this coastline by tricking them with beacon lights which they deliberately lit on the shore . Once the ships founded on the rocky coast , they were looted by the wreckers .

So basically they sort of made themselves look like a lighthouse or sort of safe passage . But really , I think what the seabed's quite shallow , I think , or the rocks are quite treacherous . So yeah , little bastards , little bastards .

So yeah , the Jamaica Inn is well known as the setting also for I'm not French , I'm going to get this wrong Dauphine du Meroyas , that's definitely wrong novel of the same name , the Jamaica Inn , which was published in 1936 .

The young author was inspired to write her novel in 1930 , apparently after she and a friend became lost in the fog whilst out riding on the moors and were led back by their horses to safety at the inn . During the time spent recovering from her ordeal , the local rector is said to have entertained her with ghost stories and tales of smuggling .

She described the nocturnal activities of a smuggling ring based at the now celebrated inn , portraying a hidden world as a place of tense excitement and claustrophobia , of real peril and thrill . Later , the author I'm not going to try and say her name again went on to spend a long period at the inn , furthering her love of the location and fun . Fact .

I did not not know and I have not seen it , but the novel was made into a film , jamaica in , in 1939 by none other than mr hitchcock himself , and in 1983 , james seymour starred in a tv film , jamaica in um yeah , so very much history . I've been throwing a lot at you there , so let's get into some more of those old modern encounters Now .

As well as all the shady deals and happenings at the inn in the 1700s , there was also a murder , and it is said that many years ago a stranger stood at the bar enjoying a tankard of ale . Upon being summoned outside , he left the half-finished ale and stepped out into the night , and that was the last time he was ever seen alive .

Now , the next morning , his corpse was found on the bleak moor , but the manner of his death and the identity of the assailant still remains a mystery . Previous landlords , upon hearing footsteps or report hearing footsteps tramping along the passage to the bar , believe it is the dead man's spirits returning to finish his drink in 1911 and many times since .

I've got to say from my research , there's been many reports concerning a strange man who had been seen by many people sitting on the wall outside the inn . He neither spoke nor moved , nor acknowledged a greeting , but his appearance this appearance was uncannily like the murdered stranger .

Could this be the dead man's ghost , and what strange compulsion drove it to return to the same spot so often ? But this is just one of the ghosts said to haunt the inn . The inn was used as a temperance house during the early 1900s , but there has always been some kind of unexplained presence throughout the years .

Most haunted has been here and described it in as one of the spookiest places they ever investigated , and this was most haunted when they were actually good . I've seen the episode so many times .

It was like in the early days , um , when they weren't trying to fake everything , um , but on a moonlit night you might hear the sound of horses , hooves and the metal rims of carriages in the courtyard outside the inn .

But yeah , so what makes this report really strange is that these people , when they hear the sound of the carriage in the courtyard , they hear it as like on gravel . Um , they hear they hear it as like on gravel , um , but what's which ? Which is interesting ? Because it's now stone . So , modern day , the car park is stone , whereas it used to be gravel .

So these people , why would they ? How would they pick up on that ? Like ? That's what I think is quite good about that those reports is they wouldn't know it used to be gravel . They would just think , oh , there was a carriage out last night on the stones . But yeah any attempt at locating the sound will be left to disappointment .

It's been reported on many occasions that pacing footsteps have also been heard in the corridors , outside of rooms , and upon investigating , no one has ever been seen there . Another report is that of a man in a hat and a cloak who appears from nowhere and then shoots off through solid doors .

Many managers of the Jamaica Inn have reported hearing the sounds of a foreign language in several locations . Could this be the sound of the old Cornish language ? Who knows ? Could be , could be . But yeah , I just think this is such a cool place I really really want to visit there .

I mean , you have to take these paces with a bit of a pinch of salt because obviously now with , like , dark tourism and , um , you know , ghosts being very on the fleek right now , um , these places obviously benefit from people being like oh , was it haunted ? So they sort of put out these stories more and more often .

Um , but I think I would definitely like to visit there sometime in the winter . Be really moody , do you know what I mean ? I won't stay there by myself , mark will have to come with me .

But yeah , I just think it'd be a really cool place to go and , um , it's like leslie smith , I think , from most haunted she it's very eccentric , but she said you know where there's history , there's ghosts , and did you make it in ? Definitely has a lot of history . Um , yeah , so maybe there are a lot of ghosts who I think .

What would most affect me if I was staying there would be the atmosphere Like when the sun sets over the moors the idea that darkness is not even the dark is not safe .

And even though the lights of the Jamaican Inn would be welcoming and soothing , I just think it would be , knowing that others have had experiences there would mean that it's not a safe space . And now , surrounded by the darkness and the more there's , there's like no escape for the night .

You're very isolated even in the modern day and to me that , I think , is what would scare me the most . And like Danny Robbins says on Uncanny , which is another great podcast slash TV show , that this could sort of almost prime me for a paranormal experience . So , yeah , very creepy place .

I will definitely go there at some point and again , I've got a link to the history that you make it in in the show notes if you want to have a little read . Now our final stop on this Bodmin Moor road trip is Bodmin Jail , a place where even prisoners feared being locked up , but not for the reasons you might think .

Now , nestled on the edge of Bodmin Moor , you'll discover a place full of intrigue , wonder and mystery . Built during the reign of King George III in 1779 , bodmin Jail was a milestone in prison design , with individual cells , segregated male and female areas and even hot water . It formed the new ideal for prisoners throughout england .

Now , from 1887 , the royal navy occupied an entire wing of the jail and after the last civilian prisoners left in 1923 , it was used to house the crown jewels during World War I , before becoming a nightclub and casino in the 1930s . That sounds like a right rave-up , doesn't it ? Where you going for a night out ? Bodmin jail Party Dancing to all you know ?

Art deco crap , like , what , like , what's that ? Like Great Gatsby ? But at Bodmin jail I certainly wouldn't be invited . As with most old prisons , bodmin jail envelops a dark history within its formidable walls . Over the years , 55 executions took place within its again formidable walls For such crimes such as rape , murder and stealing .

For such crimes such as rape , murder and stealing . Most of these executions were viewed by the public , and thousands would travel specially to witness the hangings . The last person taken to the gallows was William Hampton , who , in July 1909 , paid the ultimate price for taking the life of his 17 year old girlfriend .

He was also the last man to be hung in cornwall . So let's , let's just digest that a little bit , shall we , and talk about some public hangings . I just don't know whether I go to one or not . If it was someone I really hated , maybe , I don't know , I don't know .

I mean , no , actually screw it I probably would totally be one of the people they're watching . Um , the next statistic , though , is insane .

Now , in 1844 and this flabbergasted me I was shooketh to my core and I still don't fully trust the source , but apparently , in 1844 , a crowd of over 250 000 people gathered to watch the execution of the lightfoot brothers , who were convicted for the brutal robbery and murder of a local well-known timber merchant . I just think that's insane .

Like Taylor Swift , right , can't stand the woman , but she's been playing Wembley for like the last week . That's about 80,000 people and that's like to see Taylor Swift now triple those . And that's in a big Taylor Swift now triple those . And that's in a big stadium like triple that number and that's like . So I just find I know this is the olden days .

There were no big TVs , you know , with the gallows on it so you could see from far back . You know you're right at the back , you're not going to see anything . What's the point in going you're not going to see anything . What's the point in going You're not going to see anything ? Mob mentality , I suppose .

But yeah , so when these 250,000 people came to witness the death of these two brothers , such was the clamour to watch the executions unfold . Apparently , train carriages carrying around 1,100 people had stopped on the railway that ran alongside the jail . Um , so , yeah , like , literally , that's how far out these , these crowds went .

Literally trains couldn't go along the lines . Um , but , but I just I find it crazy , but many of the souls that lost their lives on the noose remain apparently in the jail .

The spirit of Matthew Weeks is said to have been seen on several occasions as he wanders around the jail pleading his innocence after being accused of murdering his lover , poor Charlotte Diamond spelled D-Y-M-O-N-T . That's D-Y-M-O-N-T , now another famous ghost of Bodmin Dole , as they're known , jail I think that's what it translates , as is that of Selina Wadge .

This is actually a tragic tale , so I shouldn't laugh and would make a cracking Netflix documentary if it happened in this day and age . So , netflix , are you listening ? Yeah , get on it . Listen to what I've got to say .

So , apparently , the story goes that Selina was in love with a man named James Westwood and she had two sons , and the youngest with learning difficulties , and it's thought that she was so in love with a man named James Westwood and she had two sons , and the youngest with learning difficulties , and it's thought that she was so in love with James and he wanted

her youngest son dead . Now , blinded by love , she threw her youngest son , who was only a few years old , down a well . Why is it always a well ? Now , james the bastard gaslit poor Selina .

I mean , I know she did kill her son , but you know , once she had been caught by the authorities , james stated that he had nothing to do with the murder , claiming he had nothing against the boy . That is the first ever documented case of someone being gaslit . What a little twat .

At her subsequent trial , the jury found selena guilty , although they recommend recommended leniency , on the grounds that she had taken good care of her children well , certainly , one of them at least , um and that , in their opinion , the murder had not been premeditated . But but the judge , mr Justice Denham , first name Justice , disagreed and sentenced her to death .

On Thursday , the 15th of August 1878 , a sobbing Selina was led from the condemned cell of Bodmin Jail , clutching a white handkerchief , mounting the scaffold , she uttered her last words Lord , deliver me from this miserable world . And at precisely 8am , the executioner pulled the lever , the trap , and sent her plummeting to her death .

Now , this is quite interesting and I don't know which , which method is better . I don't know , I mean , neither is nice , but , um , they developed this new method of hanging people called the marwood method . So they , they , uh , yeah , they trialed it in bodmin jail , um , and it was a new type of hanging .

So instead of the person dying by being hung and sort of dying through strangulation , like standing on a bucket and kicking it out from underneath someone , they tried a new method where they would be dropped from a high window and fall roughly 10 feet where their neck would snap .

So I suppose it's a quicker death still painful , um , but I think it's probably a better way to go , rather than there's like tales of , and again , this is from most haunted historian , but if you really loved someone and they were being hung , the best thing you could do is like pulled down on them , they die quicker , um , and this where I suppose they drop

from a height , then the neck snaps straight away . Um , but yeah , selena's body was still clutching the white handkerchief , apparently , when she was dead . She was left dangling for an hour before being cut down and buried within the prison grounds .

Her ghost , though , still wants the prison , where she tries to reach out to small children , who often inquire about the crying lady in the long dress . Another phenomenon is that pregnant women tend to become very emotional on Bodmin Jail's third and fourth floors and this is apparently where Selina projects her feelings of guilt and remorse onto them .

So the moral of the story and I stand with Selena on this is just don't trust men . Coming from among myself , I know we're bastards , um , but yeah , so I think it's such a cool place , um , and I definitely , cause I've been , and I definitely because I've been , like I said , I've been to Cornwall .

I've not really been Bobbin Bobbin more in the area itself , though , so it's definitely somewhere I really , really , really want to go . Um , I just think so much history there and , like I said before , where there's history , there's ghosts . So what did you think of Bob Marne ? Do you think it's creepy ? Do you think it's spooky ? Do you think it's haunted ?

Is this place haunted ? Um , yeah , I think there's definitely something there , definitely something there . But yeah , right now , like I previously teased you earlier in the episode , there is no film club this week , as I recently had an amazing conversation with Jason from Odd and Untold . We spoke about ghosts , bigfoot and UFOs .

So yeah , here it is , as promised , and I can tell you are all dying to hear about what we spoke about . So enjoy , right . So , first guest speaker since I came back everyone . So , like I said earlier , you might have heard me speak about him , his podcast and stuff like that before earlier .

You might have heard me speak about him , his podcast and stuff like that before . But yeah , we've got Jason on today from Odd and Untold . He's just going to tell us a little bit about himself and his podcast and all his journey , all that sort of stuff , and then we've got some good things to talk about later . So yeah , so introduce Jason .

So how are you doing , buddy ?

But I'm back now yeah , yeah for the long call , I think good , good , I've batch made about six , seven months worth of episodes . Oh , did you yeah so this , this should be out . Um well , we'll be out in like sept September , when people are listening to it now . So yeah , so we're recording a bit . I'm actually pretty organized at the moment .

It's like I waited to the last minute and I was like I don't want to talk about this week , I doesn't have time , so I get it . It's tough . Podcasting is tough .

but yeah , I've definitely been there editing up to the right at the last minute before I need to publish , um , but yeah , so for anyone who hasn't uh , I mean , I do speak about you and your podcast a fair bit , I've got to say but for anyone who hasn't um , uh , doesn't know anything about you , about Odd and Untold , do you want to let everybody know what

you're all about ? What makes you tick that sort of stuff ?

Because when I started the podcast , how do I set myself apart and just so many people out there talk about and much better than I can , and it's not even a slight against people , it's just like there are people out there who are much more informed and educated about the Patterson Gimlin footage or the Roswell UFO crash or Rendlesham UFO or , uh , the Loch Ness

monster or any of these phenomenon that are out there .

Mothman , you know that I didn't want to sort of rehash things that have been talked about to death yeah anyway , um , and for me , I mean , and that's always been my interest in the paranormal is sort of the the lesser known , the weirder stuff that's out there , uh , because that doesn't get as much attention .

You know , people think bigfoot , you think paranormal , you know the patterson gimlin footage and that's you know , but there's so many other stories out there that don't really get told . Uh , and that's really what I like focusing on . Uh , same thing with ufo , same thing with ghosts or just any any sort of unknown phenomenon .

Uh , and , like I said , the the vast majority of what I do is like in that paranormal , supernatural realm , but every now and then I do like .

A few weeks ago I did centralia , which is like this little ghost town in pennsylvania yeah , there's nothing supernatural about it , it's just they have a coal fire that's been burning under it since like 1963 it's insane , it's insane . I listened to that one yeah , and they think it's going to burn for another 250 , 300 years .

And this is burning and they just evacuated the town . And here's this town in america that's just got a fire underneath it and they're just like , oh well , we just won't have anybody live there and it's just still burning .

So it's just this weird story and that's kind of cool and kind of creepy , but not paranormal per se yeah , it's a bit of a catch-22 sometimes , isn't it ?

It's all about , like you know , you type in the conjuring house and it comes up because there's , because there's so many people talking about it , you've probably got a bit of a better chance of sort of placing somewhere in that if someone's you know looking at that sort of thing , whereas someone might not know , you know someone might not be searching for these

lesser known topics , but I , I like , like all the episodes you do , to be honest , but it's just , you got to do what interests you yeah , and that's really the the path I decided to take , because I I'm not doing this for views , I'm not doing this for money and I know there are some people out there who do do that and that's great .

I mean , you see people who have these channels and they're just you got to pump out content constantly and , like we were just saying , like just getting one episode out a week is very difficult .

And again , I do touch on these things . You , you can't not talk about bigfoot and not mention the patterson gimlin footage , you know you can't talk about ufos and not mention certain bigger events . It's going to come up , but I'm not going to dedicate like a whole episode to a certain big topic that I'm just not well versed in .

I'd rather have you know guests . A guest can come on and do that . I'd be happy with that , but I myself I'm not going to talk about you know , something that I you know . I'm kind of a jack of all trades here and master of none , so no , I think you're definitely a master of something .

Um , it's not for the views , it's it's to write about it .

We would go ghost hunting here in new york city and that sort of died down because you had the ghost hunting shows coming out and then anybody who would let you in to investigate they were either charging money or they wanted to bring like 20 of their friends to watch us investigate and it just it really just wasn't my thing anymore , so I kind of pulled back

on that .

In the meantime I was doing this blog just to kind of supplement the website and have content and I was doing like book reviews and and every now and then I would just feel like this weird paranormal news story and I would blog about it and kind of give my thoughts and be like this is clearly not a ufo or this is clearly not a picture of a ghost .

And I was starting to debunk things or just talk about weird stories in the news . And again it was these esoteric , not mainstream stories that I was talking about and the blog just took off . It got really successful by no effort on my part , just for whatever reason .

It just took off , um , and it became really successful and I was getting like 30 000 hits a month and media inquiries and tons of comments and then it just it like died and I don't know what happened . I think it was a combination of google algorithms and , just you know , a shift into .

You know , people don't want to read anymore , they'd rather listen to a podcast , they'd rather watch a YouTube video . And I was in print , I was typing things up and , yeah , I think it was Google algorithm . I know my site because it was called the occult section and a lot of institutions blocked my site , I guess because it had a bad occult name yeah .

So if you worked at a university , so if you , you know , had , if you worked at a university , if you worked at a hospital , if you worked at most organizations , like if you're at work and you're trying to click on my links , you couldn't get to it . So I think google just screwed me up there .

So I kind of did this shift and so let me just do a podcast . And , um , that took some some doing of just trying to think like , well , what do I want to do on the podcast ? And I said , well , I'll just kind of stick to you know stories .

And during the pandemic I'd actually thought about writing a book um cool just because I think we all know people who are maybe not into the paranormal .

But you start talking to people at a party , you get them a little tipsy , you get them private , they open up and oh yeah , I had this weird , so I was gonna try to to get people I knew to share their stories with me , just stories that have never been told before , because you know you go to the bookstore and you again , a lot of these stories , whether

it's ghosts or Bigfoot or UFOs or whatever , they've kind of been rehashed over and over again . Because every time I see a new book , I pick it up and like , oh cool , and I start flipping through and I'm like , oh , I know , I already have this in another book . I have this in another book .

So I really wanted to get like untold stories , yeah , that people had , and getting guests on the show to sort of share their stories , which isn't always easy . Um , I actually had to scrap an entire episode .

I did a whole episode and then the person emailed me like right before it was about to publish , and she asked if I would not air the episode really okay yeah , um , and that's fine . I totally respect that . But yeah uh , that's , that's me . I really wanted to get those untold stories out there now , that's really cool .

So I think I I think it was kind of towards the tail end . There it's been . I just started my third year of it . So yeah , powering through , yeah . I'm trying .

I had to work throughout it , um , because obviously people's animals still get sick right right so so , yeah , so , but I know a lot like my partner had to work from home for at least a year and a half . Other people I know were laid off .

They got , you know , sort of severance pay or whatever , um , but I feel like everybody was at home looking for something to listen to and I sort of started mine . I think it was probably towards the end of when it was start 2021 , or maybe towards the end . I just think , oh , that would if I just got it that bit sooner . But everybody had that .

I think people are onto it now , like the podcasts are a lot more popular since . But I just think , oh God , a little bit sooner might have got a few extra listeners out of it . But yeah , it's um , it's a labor of love .

For me it's best not to like put that pressure on myself of how many listeners do I get , or how many subscribers , or like I know some people are obsessed with stats like that and I I try not to be , because if I do , it can be discouraging , because I have some episodes that I'll publish that get 6,000 views and then other ones just sit at like 50 views

and I can never bump those and I'm like I don't understand why this one episode got like a hundred times more than this one and you can kill yourself just trying to think about that and racking your brain and trying to figure out the numbers and I just I have not found a pattern yet . It's just , that's how it works .

And I think you know if you're going to do like what we do , you kind of have to be okay with that and just say like I'm gonna do this because it makes me happy , and if other people want to come along for the ride , awesome , you're welcome .

But you know , if you put that much pressure on yourself , it becomes a job , it becomes like a second job and then it's not fun and I want to keep this fun for me .

Yeah , so I never I must have watched about about 15 20 of his documentaries on youtube , bought them on amazon they're called the bigfoot ones um , and then I was like I was like , oh , I knew we were doing this like sort of chat . I was like , is there any episodes I haven't listened to ? So I sort of went back and there was the first ever episode .

I was like I know that name . It's like I know that name , um , but yeah , he's a cool guy and it's like I didn't had no idea that you'd had that sort of episode of him yeah , I mean I had when I still had the blog .

There was just this , you know , everything was like finding bigfoot or ghost hunters or ghost adventures , and it was all this like garbage tv stuff where it was all sensational and then at the end of the end of the night it's like oh well , we didn't find anything you know , but every commercial break is like what was that ?

oh my god , you know and and seth's movies really just present a more realistic and measured look at these things . And yeah , yeah , you're talking about Bigfoot , you're talking about ghosts , but he's very smart about how he approaches it and just very , uh , open-minded and and like the antithesis of sensational .

You know , he's just very , you know he presents people's stories and you know , you watch the documentary and if you want to believe these people , you can , and if not , people you can , and if not , you don't have to . Um , so I had been speaking to him just because I was blogging about his movies .

I would do reviews and he'd repost them and he'd reach out to me privately and just hey , I appreciate you know the review and blah , blah , blah . And when I was first starting the up , you know the , the podcast , I was like I'm gonna ask him I'm gonna ask him if he'll just be my first guest like you got to shoot your shot .

You know , yeah , yeah , yeah and uh , I reached out to him and I said all right , well , this is a busy dude . I mean he's putting out like four documentaries , like feature-length documentaries , a year he's doing like podcasts . He does tv like uh , youtube series like busy dude .

So I was like , if I ask him , he's probably gonna say yes , because I know him a little bit , but he's probably gonna be like yeah , you know , like eight months from now we'll do this yeah and I reached out to him and he was just so . He was like oh yeah , like how's wednesday ?

And I'm like holy shit , like okay , um , and yeah , for anybody going back and like listening or watching those episodes . I'm just kind of like a deer in headlights because it was literally my first podcast , um , and he just he was such a great guest , I mean talked for like two hours .

I had to split it up into two different episodes because it went so long , and not that I'm complaining , I mean he just had so many good stories to tell and just such a gracious guest and a cool guy and yeah , I love his movies and I just figured , like you know , let me ask him and get him on the show . Oh yeah .

I know I don't want to do your show , or no , I'm too busy at least I asked you know . But if I never asked , I would have felt like oh man , I should you know , I should have taken my shot yeah , because I mean it's sort of similar to what you said , but I I like his sort of .

. They're looking to bring in viewers and bring in , you know , and seth just presents his witnesses and here's the story . And yeah , like you said , like breathtaking shots of you know wherever they're filming , whether it's alaska or the adirondacks or whatever it's , it's just you know there's .

There's nothing there to lead you to , like you watch finding bigfoot or you watch ghost adventures or ghost hunters . They're always trying to tell you that this was definitely paranormal , that was definitely a ghost who knocked on the door , that was definitely bigfoot who snapped that twig in the forest . Like , how do you know ?

You know , set just presents witnesses and it's up to the viewer really to be like , do I believe this person ?

I'm not saying make this stuff up , but certain events I was watching because one of my first episodes for Missing 411 back is the second part of Alaska and I was watching I think it's called Missing in Alaska . It's like I think it was just one series but there was basically this plane that went missing and they were trying to find out .

So they went to the last known location of it . It's high up in the mountains in Alaska . They got their EMF readers and stuff out Like , oh , it's spiked , it's spiked . So they were like , oh , let's take the drone up .

So they take the drone up and then all of a sudden the drone's gone missing and I'm like they haven't even got , because I've had drones before . So I sort of they're not even looking at a screen to see who someone's not flying it . I'm like the drone's going up but they just got to see him .

I was like something dodgy going on there and then at the end of the episode they're on like another mountain , so miles away , like tens , 15 , 20 miles away , and they see they're attracted to like this flashing light . They think is a ufo , so they start to follow it up the mountain . Ufo , so they start to follow it up the mountain and it's their drone .

I'm like that's not how drones work , I don't know . Like so it's like they're trying to create something out of nothing , and it's just it's . Up until that point they sort of had me . I was like , okay , this is quite good , it's quite factual , it's just telling stories about things that have happened .

And I was like but yes , I think you're making that up and they have to .

So each week it's like a little something that like , oh , maybe that was a ghost , or maybe that was bigfoot , or maybe that was a ufo . And then next week you tune in because maybe next week they get something even better yeah um , but people don't realize how much fakery goes on on these shows and I I know it firsthand .

I've investigated places that have come back to me and said , oh yeah , ghost Hunters was in last week and they faked everything on that episode . Or producers who have reached out to me and said , oh , do you want to come on and tell some stories ? And oh , yeah , sure , well , can you say this and this ? No , well , no , that's not my story .

Yeah , but we want to jazz it up a little bit . And we want to jazz it up a little bit and we want , like , no , I'm not . So I I've turned down lots of appearances because they wanted me to come on and lie , essentially because you know , oh , I I heard footsteps upstairs one time . That's not a really good story for tv .

You know , they want doors slamming and things floating through the air and voices and they want something sensational so that people watching are entertained , because if they're not entertained they're not going to watch , and most experiences are very fleeting , they're very , they're not all that exciting . Yeah , you really think about it , it's .

You know , I saw a light in the sky .

When I've investigated I mean , I'm not sure about yourself if you've had any sort of experiences like , like , like me , but the fact that when I'm investigating a place on ghost hunts and not a lot happens , maybe a couple of things throughout the night , I'm like , okay , that that to me is better than , oh , there's knocking constantly or there's someone's like , oh

, there's a shadow , or it was . It was sort of a similar situation years and years ago , probably about 15 years ago . I was part of a small ghost hunting group , um , and we went to this location and they were like , oh , but we , we want to be there , we don't . I mean , they were probably saying stuff like you know , we don't trust you in our .

I think , yes , we want someone there at all times to to supervise . And then it turned into there's five of them and we're trying to do like a little call out and stuff like this , and we were hearing like taps and stuff and I was like I think I think they're fucking with us , like , I , like , and literally I I can't remember .

I can't remember Cause it was so long ago we either heard something falling down the stairs like a rock , but I noticed that you could actually throw something over . It was like a mezzanine , oh okay , and I was like they've just thrown that .

On the last one I went on a couple of months ago but like the figures caught on like the DSLR and stuff , and when it was just me and my partner with the camera there was no one else around and we got some like intelligent responses because I got like a rem pod for christmas . Now I've tested that in my flat at work .

Most places I've put it on and there's nothing . And even when I first got to this location there was nothing . But we sort of got this figure on this camera and then we're asking questions and it's just the first time it went off . I shit myself . I was like it's going off , it's going off .

I was like let's go because it's not done that in other places and I was like , okay , that's quite interesting . But that's really all that happened that night .

And maybe , maybe , if you're lucky , you hear a knock , you hear a footstep you hear a voice maybe , but even then , like most of our investigations were dead , like nothing , nothing would happen .

We had a few where there was like little things , but again you're talking over the span of eight hours or nine hours , two seconds of something where you're like , oh , what was that ? and then it's it , that's it for the night , and you have to then go home and edit , like all that footage down , yeah , and that's what the tv shows do .

So , and you have to then go home and edit all that footage down and that's what the TV shows do .

So even if you want to believe that that stuff's real which please don't , it's not real but you still have to remember that they're editing all that stuff down into a one-hour episode and even then a lot of these places will do two different investigations per episode a lot of these places will do like two different investigations per episode .

So you're talking like 20 minutes per episode that they're actually showing you where an actual investigation takes eight to ten hours , that you're ghost hunting , yeah , and then you've got to figure out what you found in those eight hours , and most of the times it was nothing yeah , so that's what .

They've just closed the door , yeah , so you've got to want to be there and I just think you've experienced .

I've experienced things where it's just there was this one place we went and you'd think on the surface , you'd think on the surface that this would be a properly haunted location , but it was like this underground bunker that was made for the cold war , which is made for the prime minister to go to um , if you know there was if russia dropped a nuke on us ,

and it's underground , it's dark and nothing was happening right and and the and the um , the people that that were running it were in sort of a smaller group and we were doing like table tipping and we were sort of getting intelligent responses , but it was about possibility of a spirit being there that's , you know , related to someone around the table .

So we're getting responses from it , we're tipping a little bit and this woman running it behind us is like , oh yes , it's the ghost of the , the girl that was murdered here , and we're like but no , we're not . I don't think it is . I think we're asking it like is it someone come with us this tonight ?

I was like , yes , it was murdered by , like the , the dad who didn't let it out of wedlock , and she's buried some of my no , so I just think people have their own agenda sometimes .

Every light in the sky is now that that . Is that a UFO ? Is that a UFO ? Because you want to see it , yeah , and your brain kind of convinces yourself that that's what it is . And you really have to go in trying to debunk this stuff and being like what could that have been ?

And and that's why we always like having the place empty , because we know , like if we're in a building and you hear footsteps upstairs and all of us are in the basement and you know no one else is in the building , that's something . Because then you're like who's up there walking ?

But if you got 20 people watching you and they're like , oh well , my whole family needs to be here , my friends want to come over and they're going to have some beers and we're going to hang out in the basement and we're going to play music . Like how can you investigate , um , because it's going to get contaminated .

And it's the same thing with people who are just too eager , because then every little sound , every time the house settles , every time a mouse runs through the walls , that's a ghost , that's a ghost , that's a ghost and that's .

And then they make up these , like you said , elaborate stories of that's a little girl whose father was abusive and he killed her and then he went and killed himself and then , yeah , how do you know all this ? Like it's , it was , it was a tap on on a piece of wood , like it could have been literally anything . You don't know what that is .

I mean one thing that I would love to do , which I'm going to try and do at some point , is sort of come across to america , um , and I just I want to maybe go into the woods , like on a trail , you know , like not just walk randomly trying to find something , but , um , I've said it before on the , on the podcast , like the obviously bigfoot's a big thing

over in the us , which is something we don't really have over here . Um , and yeah , I think , like the , the forest , the woods are like so much bigger in the us than the uk . It's just a different , different scale . So I think at some point I'd love to sort of do a little road trip , maybe through yosemite or something like that .

Um , but yeah , so you , you sort of obviously ghosts . I realize actually how much I sound like my dad . Like it's actually really depressing like he was down this weekend . I just literally it's actually really depressing thinking about how much I sound like it when I'm speaking like in a professional way .

Yeah , we turn into our parents yeah god don't , don't , um , but yeah , sort of uh , your sort of focus has shifted as well , hasn't it ? Because we've spoken before about from sort of ghosts and stuff to more bigfoot and more ufos , that sort of thing yeah , definitely .

So , yeah , we did the ghost hunting thing because that that was kind of where my interest was back then in 2005 , 2006 , when I first kind of started this um , but in more recent years it's just , uh , for a lot of the reasons we talked about that the ghost hunting just didn't really appeal to me as much anymore .

Again , a lot of If it was a business or a famous location that I wanted to charge exorbitant amounts of money to go in and investigate . And I'm like we're bringing all our equipment that we paid for , batteries that we paid for , we got to drive there , we got to bring all our own food .

Plus , we have to pay you $800 to spend six hours here , ridiculous , to do the private stuff that was becoming excuse me , that was becoming difficult because we would show up and and some , like you mentioned earlier , somebody said , well , we want someone to be here to you know , we're not going to turn our house over to four strangers from the internet .

Totally fine , but like , keep it to like one person . And then they'd agree to that . And then we'd show up and it was like , oh well , you know , my husband wants to stay and and his brother and his wife are going to stay , and they brought their three kids , but we're just going to hang out in the basement and be quiet . And they're like , okay .

And then , 10 minutes into the investigation that they got the tv on , they're playing music , they're laughing , they're drinking and it . It just turned me off to the whole thing yeah . I've always been into Bigfoot but again , being in the city , I don't really have that opportunity . Uh to really .

You know , if I want to go deep into the woods , I got to drive a long way uh , so these days I tend to go up to the Adirondack mountains in Adirondack Park , which is I , the Southern . Southern tip of the park is about three and a half hours away from me driving .

And then usually when we get up there , like we go deep into the park , so like even once I'm up there , then it's usually like another hour , hour and a half driving into the park , and then that's the trailhead , and then it's .

You know , a two hour hike to where we're going , you know , because we for the most part , we try to go pretty remote , you know , and it's , it's on trails , but most times we go in we don't really see other people . You know , we're always worried , like , oh , I hope we get that campsite , I hope we get that lean too .

And we've never had a problem like there's no , there's just nobody ever there . You know , we just walk in and like , okay , it's ours , um , and it's great and it's . It's just , it's eye-opening too . And I think , you know I always encourage people .

If you've never been out in the woods , it's very easy for skeptics who've never been out there to just be like , oh , there's no such thing as bigfoot . Bigfoot , you know , we would have found it by now .

And it's like no , like the guy you're with walks 20 feet away to take a whiz and you can't see him anymore like there there could be an eight foot tall creature watching you and you just never know it . Like the woods get thick and there's nothing out there , there's nobody out there . You could walk for miles and just not see any sign that humans exist .

You won't see any litter . You don't see a lot of places we go that like there's not even airplanes going overhead , like you'll just go hours without seeing an airplane . Yeah , um , so you can get to some really remote places and and that's you know when .

I just think it's just a type of primate or you know , an ancient type of mammal that we just we don't , we don't know what it is , we never see . We're not because it hides , because it , because it's easily hidden by the environment .

It lives in Um cause , like we've spoken about before , like people thinking they're like a ray gun and they're like interdimensional beings that can manipulate the electromagnetic field . I'm like no , I don't think so . Believe what you want to believe . I'm not going to say no to you , but but no , I don't think so .

For what you want to believe , I'm not going to say no to you , but but no , I don't think so , for me anyway yeah , no , I , I'm right there with you .

You don't see them , and they're all over the place . There's tons . I mean you see deer tracks all over the place . But I mean I've been in the Adirondacks many times for days on end , deep in the woods , never seen a bear , never seen a deer . So they seen a bear never seen a deer ?

Uh , so they must not exist , apparently not because I haven't seen them , you know , um , but it's , it's just so . Yeah , if you take something that's an even smaller population than bear or deer and it's smarter and it knows how to avoid people , it's going to avoid people . So , yeah , I , I do believe it , you know .

And again , yeah , people do believe that these are extraterrestrial pets or they're interdimensional beings . They come through portals , I don't know , and there are some weird things about some Bigfoot stories that defy explanation . But I don't think I say it on my show a lot . I don't like explaining one unknown with another unknown .

So you sort of know where does Bigfoot come from ? Oh , it must come from portals . Well then you have to assume that portals exist . Yeah , and that's a whole other phenomenon that you have to then accept exists , or UFOs , or you know , whatever it is , if you just say it's an undiscovered primate . Like we know there's primates on planet Earth .

We know that even the mountain gorilla wasn't confirmed to exist until like the late 1800s , which a little over 100 years ago like , yeah , you go back 150 years and you talk about mountain gorillas . People can be like what are you talking about ? They don't exist .

And now we have them in zoos and you know , and every kid on the planet knows , what a gorilla is . So you have to be real careful about that . Um , not saying they don't come through portals , but for me , there's no evidence yet there's no evidence and you know , the simplest explanation is usually the correct one .

So one of the episodes coming out , um , is about Alaska and um , I mean , alaska is just on another level and like on you know , um small town monsters episodes , they talk about it a much more apparently aggressive sort of that's the word I'm looking for sort of not breed of big , different breed of bigfoot , but sort of different strain almost , or yeah they're

a bit more aggressive subspecies or something . Yeah , um , but like on a completely different level . But , um , obviously it's , it's so vast as well , alaska . But yeah , I talk about this plane that goes missing , um , just vanishes into thin air . It's never been found . It's been 80 odd years since it went missing .

40 people on board just gone , never , never found again . But I like it because it lets me put that tinfoil hat on . So then people are like oh well , you know , it could be , could be black holes , it could be like a portal where ufos are coming through , because there's been .

When it was went missing there was a spike in ufo , um sightings in the area and it's like are they unintentionally going through a wormhole ? And sort of bigfoot plays into that a little bit as well on some of them and it's just like .

oh it must have flown into a black hole , and and then we can sleep better at night , because it's it that is almost more comforting than it's just so deep in the woods or so deep in the wilderness , and we just can't get to it yeah and we just don't know . Like people , human beings just don't like saying I don't know .

They don't like not having an answer , so they will sometimes make one up just to make themselves feel better and say , oh , it must have flown into a black hole , or ufo must have , you know , captured it and taken it to another planet , or yeah , possibly like who knows you know , in like 500 years maybe we'll have the answer , but exactly , exactly , but for

now it's like it probably just , you know , crashed in alaska . Yeah , people don't realize how big alaska is but I mean it's like half the mass of the entire continental united states and that doesn't really show up on maps . You know , maps will just show like , oh , here's alaska , you know , here's the us , and then here's alaska and it's just very small .

but if you look at how big alaska is , it is enormous and it's mostly uninhabited . And again , people sitting in cities and with modern conveniences and skeptics can all say , oh , we would have found it , we would have found it , we would have found Bigfoot , we would have you know .

But these areas are so vast it really is like looking for a needle in a haystack , because where is this ? Plane could have gone down anywhere in a 50 mile radius and now you gotta search 50 miles in a radio . That that's a lot of space that people don't really appreciate how big that is yeah , it's dangerous as well .

And it's like , well , yeah , this person's like 35 000 feet up the mountain and you want rescuers to then , like people who are not mountaineers , to go up there and drag the body down . Like they just leave it there because it is way too dangerous to send a search and rescue team to just get a body .

And it's just like when you climb the mountain you just kind of sign that disclaimer Like if I die , they're going to leave me there , they're not getting my remains , it's too dangerous . And it's the same thing with these planes that crash in Alaska or the Pacific Northwest .

You know it's too rugged , it's too vast , you're going to put 100 people in danger to try and find it as well . Try to find , to try and find .

And that's why people latch on to these sort of stories and things like the missing 411 , because they think , well , what aren't we being told by the government and some of them I sort of agree on . There's like in one of my previous episodes talking about the girl she went missing .

She said she was being really smart , so she was on like a trail and at the checkpoint she was signing her name and a guy's name as well . Oh yeah , so if anybody was tracking her , that they'd think she wasn't by herself .

I was like smart , um , but she went missing for about 12 days and said she was hunted by four wild men and she said she's seen like the helicopters above . But she didn't give her position away . She was .

She said she's seen them , they were tracking her , um , and she made it out , tried to tell her story and apparently obviously you're going off anecdotal evidence . But the police were like we don't , you're not getting your story out , we don't , we don't want people knowing about it , and it's in sort of situations like that .

I'm like well , why do you know that there's a group of families of generations inbreeding living in the woods ? Not inbreeding is bad like . Is it like wrong turn ? Do you know what I mean ?

There's those stories of , uh , the , the people who live in the woods and like here , like in new jersey , and the pine barons they have , like the pineys , and uh , inondacks , there's just all these parks , there's that rumor of like oh , maybe there's , like you know , like wild people who live in the woods , feral people or inbred people or whatever you want to

call them , that , will you know , want to kidnap you and track you , and I don't see any evidence of that . And you know , I think , a woman who's lost in the woods for 12 days . She's probably without food , probably without water , without sleep .

She's probably starting to hallucinate or imagine things and again the brain starts filling things in and you're walking through the woods and you hear something walking with you .

It could be a deer , it could be a bear , it could be a mountain lion stalking you and you just think , think , oh , it's these men who are trying to get me yeah , dehydrates it exactly , exactly . You're dehydrated , you're hungry , you're tired , you're sleep deprived , you're cold .

Your body is just kind of going into shock and of course , your mind is going to start playing tricks on you , not saying it's impossible , but how probable is it ? Because you go out into some of these areas and you're like no one could . There's no food out here . It's not like these guys who you know . There's a whole family of .

You know this cult of men who track women down in the woods and kidnap them . It's like there's no deli down the block that they can go and get milk and bread . And like they're , they're in the woods . And , like I said , it's hard living , to sustain yourself living in the woods . You got to find clean water , you got to find shelter .

I mean we would find these shelters , and you go off trail and it is not easy . I mean , sometimes just being on trail is tough , much less going off trail . And to think about human beings . Just you know , again , animals are built for this . So you have a mountain lion , you have a bear , you have coyotes .

They're meant to run through brush and up and down hills like we people are not , so to say , like these men were chasing me . They're not going to get you because running through the brush , you're going to run on that trail and you're going to have a good clip .

And then as soon as you go off trail , you're just kind of trail and you're going to have a good clip . And then as soon as you go off trail , you're just kind of stopping and you're getting pricked by thorns and branches in your face , like it's not easy maneuvering . So I don't know what to make of stories like that .

Again , you hate to discount somebody outright and say , no , you were just imagining it . But at the same time , how likely is it that there's these men who just live in the woods and their whole purpose is to just kidnap women ?

I don't know whether it's like you say , people like to come to their own sort of conclusions of whether , okay , I do believe that one . I think I sort of 80 believe that story but there's something not quite right about it . Or , and I just think the american wilderness just lends itself to the mind being able to run away with itself .

So it's like , oh , you know why is this child all of a sudden just been snatched from underneath , it's gone into the bush for a second Right , right , and then it's never seen again . It's like people don't want to say , okay , lion took it , took it , took , took the chance . But to people I . That's why I find it interesting . I'm just .

I think that's why people like them is because they want to think there's something else behind it yeah that that's much more sexy and interesting to say yeah it was bigfoot , or it's this weird cult that lives in the woods , or they were abducted by aliens , or a portal opened up and swallowed them .

I mean , you look at the missing 411 stuff and I watch it all the time . I watch David Politis's YouTube channel and I do think that there are some legitimate concerns there . There are some of these disappearances that are very there's weird stuff happening .

Um , one of the more fascinating things for me is , like when someone or the remains are found in an area that have been searched like numerous times . So it's like why wasn't that found yesterday when we were here ? But these remains , like this person died like three days ago , but we were here yesterday and it wasn't here . So there are some really weird ones .

But at the same time , you have to remember like not every scenario is going to be exactly the same . So they say , oh well , if a mountain lion took this kid , we would have seen blood . We would have seen this .

Not necessarily , you know , if this thing grabbed this kid and ran with it really quick , I mean , there could be blood 10 feet off the trail when the kid first started bleeding , and this is really morbid to talk about children bleeding or whatever , but we're here for it .

They're not going to look for a single drop of blood , and if they are , they may miss it . That , that's a very easy thing to miss . You're out in the woods and everything is just these shades of brown and orange and green , and so , yeah , is it unlikely ? Of course , is it impossible ?

No , so all of these things are possible , and just because we don't have the answers doesn't mean there's some grand conspiracy going on . Yeah . I do think some of the disappearances are weird and are worth looking into and will make you scratch your head .

But again , not every mystery means UFOs or Bigfoot or you know it could just be a mystery , and one day we may have the answer to that mystery . And it doesn't have to be a mystery like what you know , and one day we may have the answer to that mystery .

And it doesn't have to be a paranormal explanation , it could just be oh , this is what happened and now we understand that . So I don't know . I love listening to the stories . I love and I do like that David doesn't ever come out and say it was Bigfoot , it was UFOs . I mean , he kind of hints towards that sometimes .

Uh , but for the most part you you listen to the story and you can just make up your own mind yeah , uh , yeah , I agree with you on that one , because that's kind of why I like him as well .

you need , I think , when you're investigating that sort of thing yeah , and he's actually mentioned that too .

You know , like I said , sometimes he will allude to certain things ufos or bigfoot but he doesn't ever come out right out and say it and uh , I , I do appreciate that .

He's kind of got a system of like categorizing what constitutes missing 411 versus what doesn't because , plenty of people go missing and you know like they had mental health issues or they were involved in criminal activity , or very clear cases of why this person went missing . And then there's other ones where it's why did this hunter go missing ? Why ?

How did this hunter end up lost and then dead ? And then we find his body , like where we've searched three times before like yeah , so there are some weird things to it , but again , weird doesn't necessarily mean paranormal .

I can see you've got your little ufo top on today . Oh yeah , it's ufo I'm bigfoot as well .

Windsor Mountain in New Hampshire ?

Um , but I don't know if you've ever seen a film called the fourth kind oh yeah yeah , and they talk about the owls , don't they ? Yeah , she has had . I'll have to send you photos .

She's had this owl outside her window , oh god , for like the last month , every single night oh really it just sits outside her window staring in and , um , she's been like she's's put the kids to bed , gone to the campfire and then walked back to the cabin by herself .

Or she's just been to that local shop or something and walking up the pathway and the owl is waiting for her Wow , and it's just watching her . And I was like , oh my God , it's aliens . I was like I've not told her that , but yeah , I don't think she's seen the film . But I was like , oh my god , it's aliens .

I was like I was , I've not told her that , but yeah , I don't think she's seen the film . But I was like , um , I'll have to send her a link to it when she gets home and I'm like because that's a creepy film .

Then I was watching a little bit of people talking about , you know , skinwalkers , aliens , that sort of thing , and what is the connection with owls ? Why do people think that ? I was like it's just strange , it's just strange . And then when my sister sent me these photos , my mum was like , yeah , it's been staring at her for months , wow , and I'm just like .

I was like she needs to check her arms for like , signs of like implants injection points because it's crazy . But I mean , yeah , I couldn't , I couldn't tell her before she got home .

Yeah , and I don't necessarily mean paranormal , but you will hear things , you will see things that you just you don't know . Nature's weird . I mean , there was one time we hiked really far in and uh , like real far , we didn't see anybody . Just just nobody on the trail , no , really desolate campsite .

And I remember we we went to bed early cause it was a really rough hike and we were just laying in our tent .

We were each had our own tent and we're kind of talking to each other through the tents and I see like a flashlight outside and I hear like two women talking and I'm like , oh , dude , like someone's coming up the trail , and two women talking and I'm like , oh , dude , like someone's coming up the trail .

He's like , oh , we're gonna have to share the campsite with them . You know , because it's dark , you know , at that point you can't be like , oh , this is our site , you have to share it because it's in the dark . In the morning you can be like , yeah , you got to move out .

This is like where we're here first , and then I'm listening and I'm listening and like I peek my head out the tent and there's nothing and I was just hello , hello , but it's like clearly , like you could see lights .

Like through the tent you can see lights moving and you hear two women talking , like from a distance you couldn't really hear words , but you could definitely hear like women talking , and then there was just nothing so that just gave me shivers , I was like yeah , and it's like was that paranormal ? Was that just an animal ? Was that paranormal ?

Was that just an animal ? Was that like who knows ? But just you spend enough time out there and like weird stuff will happen and owls are the freakiest things to hear out there . Yeah . And you , just you , thank God once you realize it is an owl , because they can sound unearthly .

I did um , where this ranger went out looking for someone who's gone missing or something they've been sent out and they said that they heard in the middle of the night people talking and they followed people who had a flashlight and there was a few people walking through the woods and then they they basically vanished , couldn't find them .

Right , right and um , obviously this is people putting an answer to something which you don't know . But she , she thought it was like a plane went down in that area like 80 years before , killed a lot of people , and that's basically what she said . She thought she saw was these people walking through the woods , but I think I'd just cry .

I don't know what I'd do if I was by myself ? I don't know what I'd do , but um , but yeah , uh , zoom is about to kick us off again so okay , if we got anything you want to say before we um before we leave it .

I cut it off really short as well , because I just I'm really awkward in these situations . I've not done it , um , a bit out of practice , let's say . But , yeah , always great to speak with Jason , always great to to hear from him . So hope you all enjoyed it . And yeah , thank you for tuning into this episode of the Spooky Outro Radio podcast .

Hope you enjoyed the sort of spine , tingling tales and eerie atmosphere brought you today from lovely Bodmin bodmin moore . Um , like I said , if you loved what you heard , be sure to leave a review on your favorite podcast platform . So , yeah , your feedback will help us reach more , more people .

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And , like I said , you can find us on Instagram and TikTok at Spooky Island Radio , and if you have any creepy stories or suggestions or you've been to any of the places that I've spoken about in this episode , feel free to reach out to us via email at spookyislandradio radio , at outlookcom . And yeah , we'd love to hear from you now .

Once again , thank you for listening . Remember , the night is dark and full of terrors , so stay safe and keep the lights on . And until next time . This is Andy signing off from the spooky island radio podcast Over and out .