Welcome to the solid verbal. I'll that for me. I'm a man, I'm forty.
I've heard so many players say, well, I want to be happy.
You want to be happy for dake Edo State? Is that?
Whoo whoo? And no, Dan and Tye, welcome back to the solid verbal. Boys and girls. My name is Ty hilden Brandt. Thatat man over there on the other side of the line, his name is Dan Rubinstein in New York City. Sir, how are you?
I'm Dan Rubinstein. As far as you know, I'm good. Ty. Life is good. It's uh god, I'm five weeks out.
WHOA, Yeah, he was gonna say it, Bliss. Are there any nerves you're getting nervous? No, Ty, things are coming together pretty nicely. So I got my suits and I need to go get a new shirt. I'm gonna get a nice new fitted dress shirts. But uh no, Ty, the draft of this week. So I'm very excited that we're having Josh Norris on from NBC and rhotal Worlds.
Let you know has sprung. Tie life is just grand.
A fantastic follow in the Twitter sphere. If you're into such things, don't forget you can't follow us. It's solid verbal. But our guest of Vanna this evening is at Josh Norris will bring him on momentarily to talk about all things NFL Draft. What are you doing for the draft? You got anything special planned?
Ty, I'm glad you asked. We here at espanation dot com. It's a website. Are doing a four to five hour depending on how long the draft lasts. We're doing a big live draft party, so okay, we are. It's a giant set all of Espianation, the studio here in New York. We're gonna be doing some fun things. We're gonna have multiple desks and sets and it's gonna get very strange. We're gonna have a pizza topping draft at a certain point. Do you know what knock I think it's called knocker ball.
No, I never never heard of that in my life.
That is, it's those big puffy ball suits that you just run into each other.
Well okay, yeah, not sumo suits, but they're like the big the thing. It's called knockerball. Okay, So we're gonna have fun with those.
I think. Jeff Schwartz former Oregon Duck and New York Giant and Minnesota Viking great friend of the show. He was on the scheme Theme Month last year. I think he's going to just hurt people. I was going to say he will.
He will win the knocker Ball contest.
So he is. I mean, he was a little bit beat up throughout his career, but he is fully healthy right now. Yeah.
No, even at like hash strength, I would think he would still be able to run roughly through the office.
Yeah, he was here last week and six seven, three thirty is very real. It is a very tangible thing. So we're gonna have fun with that. We're going to have all sorts of fun. So I would strongly recommend espionation dot com, YouTube dot com, slash Espienation, Facebook dot com, slash espionation if I can get in some. I have
no shame for those plugs. But I really think people listening to this, because there will be a college and NFL component with it being the Draft, will really enjoy how it is going to be the literal polar opposite, maybe not literal of like ESPN, Fox, NFL Network Coleridge.
I will have to check that out. Please do thank you to everyone out there who who tuned in, and specifically those of you who waited two weeks to get our last show. As you've now heard, we put a little bit of extra elbow grease into that one. When a little bit different with our format, it's not gonna be thank you and you too. I was really excited
about the way it turned out. I know it might not have been everyone's cup of tea, but as you saw last year with our Verbie show, we try to mix and match a little bit here in the off season to keep ourselves young and creative and to.
Keep ourselves young.
Yeah, oh man, that ship a sale tie, but we hope you enjoyed it. We got a lot of really positive feedback, so thank you for that. We do have some other plans for that format in the near term here as the off season plods forward, so stay tuned for that and uh and much much more.
Ty you. It was. It was a fun ride. People liked it. They did you like to say, keep it balanced, but it was like ninety nine point three percent of people same to respond positively.
Well that's good, good, Yeah, I'm glad I liked it all right. Today's show is brought to you by our good friends over at stamps dot com. Dan Love It Stamps dot com. It saves you time and money m M, which you can use to grow your business. We've used it to grow our business here at the Cliverbal. You can mail any letter, any package using just your computer and the printer, and the mailman just you know, picks it up like any other mail item you might have
out there. Avoid the hassle of the post office. Mail everything from postcards, envelopes, the packages domestic or international. Just go out there and create a Stamps account in minutes online, no equipment to least the long term anything. It's a good deal. They bring all the services of the United States Postal Service right to your fingertips. Buy in print official US postage for any letter package, again, any class of mail with just your computer and your printer. They
make it easy. They'll even send you a digital scale, dan.
Ty, let me tell you something. I was at the post office on Saturday. Yeah, it was on Saturday. I had to wait forever to send some packages to Chicago for the wedding, and I couldn't help but think there had to be a better way to ext what my life. I went on Twitter while I was in line and said I'm in a long line, asked me any questions about appetizers or street fighter too. Got some real good questions, Ty. If you have any questions, I'm happy to answer right now.
But short of that, Stamps dot Com would have saved me an entire hour of my life that I would have spent napping.
You can get the Digital Scale. They'll help you decide the best class of mail based on your needs, but there's no need to lease any expensive stuff. Again. We use stamps dot Com because it makes life easier and you can accomplish the same basic stuff that you could if you went to the post office. Right now you can jump in on the action as well. You can enjoy Stamps with our special offer. It's a four week free trial plus postage and get the digital Scale. Get
all that, no long term commitments. Just go to stamps dot com, click on the microphone at the top of the homepage. Type in the code Solid Solid that is Stamps dot Com.
Do it.
Your promo code is solid. Never go to the post office again. All right, Dan, We are joined now by Josh Norris from NBC and Roto World. Gonna talk some NFL draft which, as you know, is coming up at the later part of this week. Thursday, Friday, Saturday, so a little bit of football for the fans out there to imbibe. Josh, how are you?
Is an absolute honor, Guys, I really appreciate it. I'm great. How are y'all?
We are? We are doing quite well.
I got to ask you a very pointed question here as we jump right in and talk about the NFL Draft. I know you've been covering this from all angles. I wake up on a Saturday morning, I see that you've charted all like five hundred ninety two of the Sean Kaiser's throws and why they were or weren't a good thing. Why are there so many bad picks?
Ooh? I think that's a good question. I would say a big part of it is the lack of cohesiveness between the decision makers in terms of scout and GMS in the front office versus coaches. I think a lot of time we look at the NFL and kind of put it on a pedestal, as you know, organizations that run smoothly. Yet there are thirty two different ones, and we know absolutely that many of them do not. I mean you see that in the turnover every single year.
And then I think the part of that is also, once there is turnover, the owner goes in like the opposite direction of what the former head coach was, and then that head coach wants to change the entire roster to fit his style. And the lack of patience. I mean, I'm not going to say it shouldn't happen, but I think it absolutely plays into the development of these players once they get in the lead.
It's just amazing because pretty much from the end of the college football season straight through now till like early May because they're doing the draft later, this is all you hear about. It's a constant character study into each of these prospects, and yet it seems more often than not there are more misses than hits.
Yeah, And I mean even if you look in the first round, like I kind of ask myself this, whenever the first round is complete, like thirty percent of these guys are going to fail. You know they're going to be busted, and at the time everyone is mostly pleased with first rounders. Then even in my head, I'm like, okay, which maybe ten of these is not going to make it, And at times it's tough to get to ten. And
that happens. I mean, Look, I actually think one of the favorite we my favorite part of the draft is seeing which prospect that rank in like the top fifty, top twenty five, whatever to somehow fall to Day three, rounds four and five and then ultimately end up as quality players. I think that's the funnest part of the draft for me.
Josh, where is the biggest chasm between who college football fans are positive is excellent and what NFL people think and or in the other direction, who NFL type scouts, gms, whoever, writers, draft and analysts think is just wonderful and college fans are like, really him, where's that chasm?
Yeah, so let's go with that second one. I'm not going to say that college fans think he's bad, but I mean he didn't even start for his collegiate program during his final season for most of it. And I would go with Alvin Kamara. The NFL really really likes Alvin Kamara, really likes Alvin Kamara. In fact, a number of teams are contemplating Joe Mixon versus Alvin Kamara in their head. And if they don't want to deal with the Joe Mixon situation, which many of them won't, then
I think that they pivot over to Alvin Kamara. I mean, this is someone who obviously showed a lot during when he had his opportunities and absolutely fits the NFL game in terms of being a passing down back, but also possibly can be more than that. We just don't know. I don't think he's ever touched the ball more than eighteen times in a game ever, at least during his collegiate career. On the opposite side of that, it's always
a fun question. I would say the easy answer is someone who is highly productive at the college level and then gets questioned on that productivity if it can translate to the NFL. And I think that every year there's a few of those, and this year I would point to Derek Barnett. I really would dang at Tennessee. Derek Barnett to me, I really like it. Let me start by saying that I really like him.
I don't have to say that, but I'm.
Not sure if he can consistently beat athletic left tackles immediately off the snap in terms of his explosion in terms of off the three steps. I think he has got great bend for his size, and I think his motor is outstanding. I think frequently he took advantage of heavy footage offensive blindman in college football, and we even know that like thirty two NFL teams aren't played at their tackle play and then you extrapolate that down to the college level and it's it's really really poor. Again.
I like Derek Barnette, but in terms of someone who was one of the most productive Edussiers we've ever seen come into the draft, I still think he goes top fifteen, but I wouldn't rank him there.
I love the fact that Tennessee players are both overrated and underrated. I like that is a that is a very wrong plain.
I think it's very much Jones.
Absolutely. One is when you are looking, you know at that same transition from college to pro which position And I don't know if it's this year specific, but trend wise, would you say, you know, this type of blank position never would have been evaluated this way five, ten, fifteen years ago, But because of the way both the college game and NFL game have gone, we're seeing a new type of blank be taken. Seriously, Is there a position
that has evolved in the way it's been evaluated. I guess in a dramatic sense.
Absolutely, and I think it's the third corner spot or the fifth defensive back spot on an NFL team. There are a number of corners that are being looked at as solely slot corners, and that might have a negative connotation to it, but it shouldn't. In fact, one is Colorado's j Adobe A Woozier, who I think has a strong chance of ending up in Round one, and he might solely be a slot guy, and that's perfectly fine.
The Tennessee Titans are very interested in JUDOBEI Woozy, especially if they trade out of eighteen, to keep that in mind. And even you know, fifth like a third safety spot, right and so act as your third defensive back. And those guys are just on the field sixty percent of the time, you know. And and to go back one question as well, it makes things even more interesting for a guy like Jr. Bill Peppers. So for me, even though he didn't technically play the spot, I think block
corner might be his best position. He's certainly not going to be an off ball linebacker. But this whole safety talk, it's difficult because the projection, we haven't really seen him in that area, and the NFL kind of relies on things they've seen in the past. So to me, slock corner might be his best position in the NFL.
You mentioned you're brill Pepper is now some breaking news or developing news about him testing positive for a diluted sample. What does that mean and what is his status now as he moves into the NFL. Do people like him or not? Well?
I think the people who are most happy about this are Ruben Foster's party, that's for sure, because he's not alone anymore. You know what's interesting, and this is this isn't football talk. This is just kind of talking about the process. I think it's interesting that Ruben Foster and even prospects in the last two years have kind of taken a hold of their narrative in terms of gotten ahead of a story like this. But to grip Peppers didn't.
I think the first prospect in the last three years that actually had this kind of news broken via a media source and wasn't a part of it because that I mean, we used to hear all the time about these drug tests being failed to combine, but we haven't in the last two years unless the prospect admitted to it, like Ruben Foster did this week. Okay, So I think that in the first round Peppers has a small or shallow pool in terms of teams that might be super interested.
I would throw at the Tampa Tampa Bay Buccaneers. They need a slot corner and they need a safety. Again, I think a big part of it is we just don't know how successful he will be at his position that he's projected to because he played a different one during his final you know, games at Michigan, and I
think that's always a difficult proposition. And I'm not sure, especially in this type of corner class and defensive back class at fifteen, will really feel that comfortable with him in the first round.
Let me shift gears a little bit. You've got Christian McCaffrey as your eleventh best overall player at least on the last set of rankings that I saw. He is not a prototypical running back, if only because he's smaller at like five to eleven round two hundred pounds, right, you tend to think that he can be a primary back in the NFL. Why do you feel that way?
And I guarantee you you guys will back me up on this or I might be wrong, who knows, but I think people will will look at that size that he just mentioned and say, well, he's just a passing down back. He's just a back heet to cap As touches. But then if we I mean generally we talk about these college teams and college prospects projecting to the NFL, and like so often this like quote unquote mythical pro
style offense comes up. I mean, you don't get more pro style than Stanford's often, especially in the running game. You know, he has to run behind power, he has to run up behind multiple titan sets, multiple fullbacks at times. I mean, all this guy did was run between the tackles twenty plus times a game, entered vision and patience, and picked up difficult yards, and then was extremely special when used out in space or getting to the second
or third level. Man, I love Christian McCaffrey. The more you watch, the more you realize he really can be a primary piece of a passing offense and a running offense. And that's why I have him as a top running deck.
Like you said, well, and to Dan's previous question, it does feel like the league has changed a little bit, right, It's gone more passing. If you can catch balls out of the backfield, that makes you a little bit more valuable as an asset. And it feels like the league has changed in such a way that Christian McCaffrey now fits in better this fite his smaller stature than he might have, say ten years ago.
Look Like, at the very least, you're getting like a theoretic At the very least, they're getting like a CGA proside a Shane vere right, a guy that you can put in the backfield and then motion out as well. But again, I mean theoretics might have been a running back, you know, like anytime he's asked to run the ball,
he struggles. So you in an offense that might have already some dynamic personnel groupings, either with twelve personnel or whatever, that they can really dictate matchups to the defense, adding a guy a Christian McCaffrey, where theoretically you could start with two in line tight end and McCaffrey and single back, and then have your quarterback back up in the shotguns both of those tight ends split out wide along with
Christian McCaffrey. That changes the entire dynamic of what the offense is presenting to the defense, and I think that's what something McCaffrey offers.
The other story that I know a lot of college are interested in is which quarterback goes first slash how many quarterbacks go in the first round. The four big names are Deshaun Kaiser, Mitch Trubisky, Mitchell Mitchell, Mitchell Trubisky, excuse me, Deshaun Watson, and Patrick Mahomes the second. If we're being specific here, I gotta be honest, in my heart of hearts, I don't truly feel like any of these guys are truly transcendent enough to justify a first round pick. But that's just me.
So Dan knows this. This will be the second straight year where I don't think a first round quarterback exists in the draft. Now, I was obviously wrong with Dak Prescott last year. I was obviously wrong. I mean the entire enough I was, but I was wrong with them. I didn't like here at golf last there were many questions that people just didn't bring up. Okay, so let
me fast forward to this year. I am not confident at this moment to decide between Deshaun Watson and Mitchard Trudisky as the first quarterback off the board, but I think both go in the top ten. I think the Bears at three more and more beat writers are linking the two, and I think it makes sense even with the Mike Lennon signing, because that contract can be whittled
down to a one year deal basically. And then Ryan Pace gets, you know, his dream of adding a quarterback to the future and not having to rely on Mike Lennon. And then I think the Bills at ten are absolutely mirroring the blueprint that the Eagles set out last year in terms of their billionaire owner traveling to college campuses to watch twenty one and twenty two year old throw passes against there. That just doesn't happen, you know, a
billionaire inner just doesn't do that. So answer your question, I think Kayser's the best one. I really do. I think I think twenty fifteen to Sean Kaiser is the best quarterback tape out there. Now I can't tell you what happened in twenty sixteen, but again, I think twenty fifteen to Sean Kaiser is the best one out there. And but with that said, I wouldn't surprised if he's the fifth quarterback off the board, or if he's a sixth quarterback off the board behind Davis Webb and Nacan Peterman.
And I know I'm taking up a bunch of time, but I quickly want to mention Patrick Mahones and how I have no idea how anyone is confident in his evaluation, either positively or negatively, because we have no comparison of success for him in the NFL. And I just don't know what to do with the guy.
Honestly, it seems this year that offensive line is a position group in which nobody's truly impressed with, at least the depth, especially at tackle Cam Robinson. I know a lot of people like a lot and for good reason. Ryan Ramsick has come on Garrett Bowles from Utah. Is this a thing that has happened because of bad talent this year or is it just become easier to skip offensive lineman because we're better at evaluating what an NFL first round offensive lineman must be well.
On a bigger picture. My buddy Eric Soner actually made this connection. And Dan, this will be close to your heart. But I wonder if some offensive tackles type are now just playing defensive line like the Tyson Jackson effect. Eric Armstead. Eric Armstead is an outstanding example of that. You know, someone who was considered a top tackle prospect or recruits
and wanted to play defensive line. I mean, you see these guys that are six seven, two hundred and eighty pounds two hundred and ninety pounds that theoretically could play tackle, but they're playing defensive line, and then you're seeing fewer and fewer athletes at the offensive line spot. This is the least athletic offensive line pass we've seen in a long time. I really like Garret Boles. I think Garibles
can come in and play right away. But I wouldn't, you know, dismiss anyone that has an opposite opinion because it's going to be twenty five years old as a rookie, only played one year at Utah, you know, and actually I would say he's a better run blocker than he is past protector. It's difficult. I still think they go early because we saw what Matt Khalil and ry Riley Reef and Russell Okuon got paid in the NFL. Like I said, not every team is comfortable with their with
their starters. Look, I still think at least one goes in the top twenty and maybe a couple, but it's it's certainly not a position of strength in this class at all.
Is the NFL at a point at least with conventional wisdom, that they're willing to roll the dice on potential with guys? It just seems this year, especially with like a one year starter Malik Hooker, I don't believe has started for more than a year obviously, Mitch Mitchell Trubisky, you mentioned
Garrett Bowls, marsha On Latimore, Marshaun Lattimore. Absolutely. Is it a situation where we are sort of not considering what the NFL does when they look at these guys that multiple years of starting and developing and proving themselves against different types of players may not be as value when perhaps they don't you know, they haven't been hit as much. Alvin Kamara hasn't been hit as much, whereas Christian McCaffrey
has six thousand touches. Is are we underestimating how the NFL approaches this?
Yeah, and John Allen has you know, four years of work and right Alvin Cooks has three years of work and three shorter operations to go along with it. I mean, there are questions in so many different directions of the groups you mentioned that, there's there's a sample size of some of them. There's the medical red flags of others. There's I mean, the age question with others. I mean,
it's it's a look. Anytime you talk about potential and feeling and everything like that, it's it's difficult to understand if it's about athleticism, if it's about potential, it's I struggle coming up with those terms. To me, all that I care about is how someone succeeds on the field. I don't even care about the negatives. It's just like where they went in the field and if that work. In the NFL, yeah, I mean, and even a number
have don't have a full athletic profile. I mean, Leonard Fournette is one, and easy Coe Elliott was one last year, Corey Davis as well. There's just a ton of questions and I think that just discussed and this isn't answer your question at all, but this is just how you know, on the Monday or Tuesday before the draft, we have no clue what's going to happen starting pick number two.
All right, So Josh Norris you're hired as a GM of Team X, the new Raiders, let's say whenever they eventually moved to Las Vegas.
In twenty suburban Connecticut.
Yeah, you are the new GM of whatever team. What is your evaluation process? Take inside the Josh Norris radar map. How do you balance in game stuff versus workouts versus you know this aspirational P word potential?
Okay, how much time do you have? So let's okay, there's a few different ways. I really love how the Packers handled the visits process. They bring in for their top thirty prospects who are most likely seventh rounders or
undrafted free agents. They treat it as recruiting basically, And I mean if you just think about it, like, if you're a late round guy coming out of who knows where, Middle Tennessee State, Dungstown State, whatever, and one team is showing you more love than another, you are absolutely more likely to find with them once the draft is over in that one hour window than a team that you know, you haven't heard of since they came and visited your your your practice in the fall. So I love how
the Packers handled handled the visits. I absolutely employ Jack Whitman of three sigma athlete who does great work on composite course. I think athleticism at certain positions is vital. I think it's vital at edge and defensive linemen because those are some of the true one one matchups on the field. And if you have an athletic advantage, then it really I mean, it's key. It gives you a
leg up. But also we can eliminate the non NFL athletes at their specific positions and stay away from them, and look, I more than anything, focus on where a player succeeds, like I've said before, because everyone can go out there and watch a game and see where a guy fails and see the negatives. That's the easiest thing.
But in order to allow your team to win and help your team to win, get to put these players, these prospects in an area where they succeed and so finding the positives is the only thing that matters to that end.
I guess next logical question, if you're again still the GM, you haven't been fired yet, what is the deepest What is the deepest position out there in this year's draft class?
Where is it the shallowest, the deepest tight end and It's an interesting one to discuss because tight end is the slowest developing position in the NFL, even more than quarterback it is.
I mean, so many of these players once they get to the NFL, failed to help their first team in their first contract. I mean, we see so many, you know, produce on their second deals and when they're second or thirteen Martella's Bennett, Gary Varnage, Jared Cook, the Lany Walker.
I mean, the list goes on and on and on, and everyone talks about the two top tight ends in this class, and I will too, and OJ Howard and David and Joku, and I think those guys are plugging play in line or if you want to detach them as well. But I would be a bit nervous to take them super early just because of how slow developing it is, although we've seen both do everything that you want as a tight end spot. Then after that you have all your different types. I mean, I love Evan Ingram.
I'm sure you guys too do too. I love George kill Kittle out of Iowa. Heck, I'll throw out Eric Stylert out of Drake as a as a third day pass catching tight end who might go in like the third to fourth round another years. Titan is absolutely the deepest spot this year and the weakest again. I would
go to offensive Lindman, an offensive tackle. In fact, I think you'll see some third round picks spit on a guy like Julian Davenport out of Bucknow, gyland Ware out of I believe Alabama's state, and Brad Seaton out of Villanova. These guys have gotten a ton of of looks during the prospect visits and workouts and all that stuff, and I think teams will see them as swing tackles early on and hopefully develop them into starting tackles down the line.
I guess the classic dilemma now, it's right up there. I guess, with chicken versus the egg, what should the Browns do?
Yeah, well, so much more informed people than me say that Jimmy Garoppolo will not be traded, and I'm not sure I would trade for him anyway, So we ruled that out.
Okay.
I do not like any of these so and I don't like Aj mcperrin either as prospects. So we're kind of screwed at quarterback if we're being perfectly honest. So we continue to load up I love how they handled the offensive line because rather than pairing, you know, a young quarterback with a great wide receiver, I think now pairing them with offense a great offensive line is a
much better approach. I think you absolutely go Miles Garrett at one, and then you find another player who can you know, instantly impact, who's not, you know, a year away from starting on the field, whether it be Oj Howard who I just discussed to run more twelve personnel, whether it be Christian mccaffor he if he's on the roster or if he's on the board. I'm not sure if they would even take a running back at twelve.
But more importantly, I would find some cohesiveness between Hugh Jackson, who's absolutely an old school football mind, versus this apparent come or or I guess mythical forward thinking analytics department that takes everything into consideration and maybe they don't connect them decision. I think we saw that last year with a Cody Casler situation.
So I'm of the mind, and this might be just mad, but I love doing the deep dives on what certain teams take and where value is, and I'm of the mind that offensive skill players are not necessarily worth first round value, especially if you're a team trying to improve.
So if somebody is of a similar mind, who is available in the second or third round, like second or third round wide receiver, running back, tight end that you feel like you know even though they're not, Dalvin Cook, Christian McCaffrey, Corey Davis, Mike Williams, Guys like that that you feel like the drop off isn't particularly steep and can contribute pretty close to right away.
Well, I'm so glad I get to talk about Kaywan Taylor. I love Taywan Taylor. Taywan Taylor reminds me a lot of in the right coming out of Baylor. Sure, I probably have the best ever kind to write a bit too much because he certainly didn't hit his stride in
the NFL. But if you go back and watch his game there, and he's awesome, Teywan, you know, creates separation early in his route, he sustains it, he wins after the catch, and despite being under six feet tall, Bill e'sn't try to go up and get it and win in those contested situations. I wouldn't be surprised if he, you know, a third round pick but I think Jewan Taylor is awesome. Carlos Henderson is a really really fun player.
If you're looking for someone that essentially could be used in a similar fashion as Tyreek Hale during the rookie year, I would throw out Carlos Henderson from Who's in attack when he is a stud after the catch, just like wait, little movement puts one foot in the dirt and gets up field immediately. Was easily the best in that area last season in all of college football. And again I would throw Evan Ingram like I'm not sure if every NFL team will know how to use him, because the
NFL can be done at times. Thought to me, if you just put him in the slot as a as a big slot receiver, and I even think he's a better blocker than people getting credit for, and Evan Ingram will be there in around two most likely.
Are we getting any closer? And I know some teams are able to do this, and some teams have struggled to figuring out what to do with tweener types like I mean, you mentioned Jabrill Peppers on defense that he's sort of a jack of many trades but not necessarily a master of one. Offensively. We've seen players recently. You know, my heart is with d' Anthony Thomas, and he's never
really found a consistent role. This year, we have a player like Curtis Samuel who has sort of succeeded in the slot, running certain kind of routes and succeeded with certain kind of carries. Are we any closer to finding roles and finding appropriate value for these types of players.
I really think it's all about the landing spot. I really do. I mean, because theoretically someone like Cordarol Patterson should find a role in the NFL, and he just like didn't outside of you know, as a kick returner with the Ministera Vikings. It's tough. And Curtis Samuel is a good example, because teams are looking at him as a slot receiver. A number of teams are looking at him as a running back. I think he's certainly more comfortable with the ball in his hands, but I think
his future is kind of in the slot. I don't know if I have a great answer for you. I really don't. I but it certainly seems like and I can't give you a list of all of them up the top my head that with with with so much turnover at offensive coordinator at head coach, that only a certain number of these offenses are willing to keep a role player like that, even though the NFL is made up of role players. And I'll have the like, I think we kind of obsessed over air back guys that
succeed in space. I mean, I'll throw out like, I mean there's some Josh Ferguson love last year, which was absolutely crazy. I mean, it's the same way we obsessed over like sec safeties that are in the box and
just pay people really hard. You know. It's those are the two things that that drafts Witter fall in love with and and so we might not realize that, Look, these guys can only dress five wide receivers on a Sunday and three running backs, And does a team really want to use one of those spots on someone that sure might be able to help on special teams, but might also limit them if someone goes down with an injury as well?
Josh, which Patriot League player do you see as a sure thing the next level?
Oh no, no, no, I did I said a name earlier. Isn't Eric, isn't Drake? In the Patriot League.
Drake is not in the Patriot League, Sir, I don't know what they're They're not in the Patriot League. Okay, Actually there is a player I want to know about who does play in the Northeast, just because I like watching him play a lot and he seems like he could be a top fifteen, top twenty type pick. I also have a soft spot for Temple because I just like shouting the world word owls a lot. Hassan Radick is somebody who if people have watched college football, especially
when Temple's played against better teams, he's really shined. What is it about his game specifically that you feel like, even from you know, a school that doesn't have a rich football background, he can succeed pretty greatly in the NFL.
What funny is a few years ago, I really like to hear Whitehead more than anyone else, and I think I think their projection is very similar in that well. First of all, Hassan Reddick's story is incredible and his transition is incredible. I mean, he came and you guys know this came on to Temple as like a corner slash safety. In fact, I asked him about this as a Senior Bowl. He practiced a few times with Robbie Anderson at corner and at safety, and obviously Robbie Anderson
is now a receiver for the Jets. But then he went over and gained a bunch of weight and rushed up the edge. And also and when he does pass rush when he has been he's super athletic. I wouldn't say that would be his primary move, but he can certainly help the team in that way. And then he plays off the ball as well. I would say is easy.
Transition is like that off ball linebacker spot. A team might use him as an Anthony Barr type player, or if they want to put him on the line, maybe a Julian Peterson type player, or they can just pick him on the inside like Jamie Collins if they want to. I know there's like a bunch of big names I just mentioned that like are really really good players. But I think Assan Reddick is a really really good player.
I want to transition this quickly to another prospect who I don't think is receiving enough love, who is kind of in that storrygain Dion Jordan Mole sure along with along with Julian Peterson and that's Tyas Bowser out of Houston. I really think Tyas Bowser ends up in the first round, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's in the teams as well.
What's your favorite draft buzzword? You know because you hear like football IQ and arm talent. I think it was Mike Mayock, the legendary Mike Mayock, who wants to use loose hips.
Do you have any go.
To phrase that you like?
There was a time when people were compequking uh prospects during like weigh in, and they were talking about their bubble and by their bubble, that's their belly and and and and like their ad region and but to me, that's thinking it a bit fard guy, like I don't need to know about someone's bubble.
The bubble, okay, on the bubble. Give us some sleepers in this year's draft, some names. You know you've already thrown a few out there, But who are some others that you think fall into the sleeper category because of injury or a small school, or coaching, or luck or a whole variety of different factors.
So I'm actually still remembering a question that you asked a few questions ago, and I do want to mention this will apply to one of my names. If I'm building a team, the most important part to me is is past protecting with five, it's blocking with five, it's past rushing with four, it's winning the turnover gferential, and then it's creating big plays. All right, So if we're talking about someone that can create big plays, Tarik Cohen out of North Carolina A and C is like a
super super fun prospect. I think he's five six or five seven and one hundred and seventy pounds, so who even knows if he's going to get drafted. But if you watch him, like he doesn't care which way the zone is, He's just going to run away from everyone and evade. It's like if you growing up by played NFL Fever. Do you remember that game for the Xbox with the back controller with Peyton Manning on the cover.
I think and my buddy and I I would play as Michael Vick and run all the way back to my own end zone and then just juke everyone and then then the one hundred yards to the other end zone. And that's like how Karik Cohen plays football. So maybe he did the same thing growing up. I would also
throw in Elijah Maguire from louising A Lafayette. If there's going to be a prospect who I would suggest drafting in the fifth of the same around that Mike turn into this year's Jordan Howard, it would be Elijah Maguire. He's a runner and receiver type. I think he can be in the field in all situations. And I'll end on Davier Woods out of Louisiana Tech. Zavier Woods is a really really good prospect lined up wherever Louisiana Tech
needs him do. He's a he's a very good athlete as well, and and he he is absolutely someone who I could see winding up in the third round, even though some people don't believe he can find that spot in quickly. Just because we all these other Michigan guys are being discussed, you know, Jake Budd and Jabil Peppers. I actually think Chrits Chris Wormley is the best Michigan prospect in this class and deserves we drafted in the top thirty two.
Josh, Which Ninja Turtle or Ninja Turtle character do you think is most NFL ready? Given they're both physical and mental makeup.
I would probably say Raphael, because Rafael is the most He's the most confident in his ability. You know, I think, I know I understand Leonard as the leader whatever, right, I think we all agree that Leonardo was not the death Okay. I think Donna Tello might get in his head a little bit, and I understand everything will be well thought off, but at times he can be a
bit soft. I think if Michelangelo was going to be in the NFL, he'd be like Pat McAfee or someone like a punter, right, yes, and then I really do I could see Rafael being like demonte Casey this year, like the corner on the outside who just wants to come up and be depressive and packer you down your throat. So I would say Rafaieol definitely, even though it's the locker room might not love him.
See. I was going to go rock Steady early on, but I think rock Steady is better built for an NFL era that is sort of by gone at this point. I might go Bebop. I could see Bebop being a gronk type where there's just a certain inherent aggression to a warthog over the metal. I don't know, ty, do you have a thought.
I'm just wondering if Josh knew that question was coming in advance.
He did not. He wond percent to not.
So.
There are many pictures of There are many picture of me growing up dressing as an Ninja Turtle. I have never thought about this question. Maybe I've dreamt about it, my two worlds coming together, but yeah, I was surprised at myself having one at the ready right then.
I like it. I'm I'm looking at the cast of characters right now. Krag does not look mobile enough in that suit.
I don't know these people you're talking about right now, Like I only knew the four obviously, Splinter Krank was, I didn't. I don't remember any others.
Krag was the brain inside of the large robot.
Guys, can I ask you this question?
Please?
Okay, I'm not talking. I'm not talking Power Rangers or Ninja Turtles or something like that. But like, what secondary show with like Superpowers did you like the most, Because for me, you remember like beatle Boards, like I was a big fan of Beatleborgs.
I'm looking at it and I've always ever.
Watched after you never watched beetle boys.
I didn't watch Beetleborgs. I was going to answer Captain Planet.
Yeah, but I think that's a little bit is.
That too mainstream?
More high profile than I'm looking for here?
Yeah, that's the only one that keeps coming to mind for me is ThunderCats. But I don't know if that qualify.
That's definitely mainstream.
I think, yeah, I'm younger than y'all.
I get Beetleborgs. I mean he didn't throw dig I have you heard of digim'd?
Man?
All right, I think this is this is a natural ending place, ty. I think we got an all pertinent information. All right.
Again, follow him conveniently named on Twitter at Josh Norris. That's Josh and r R I as follow his draft coverage with Roto World and NBC Sports. Josh, it's great to have you on the show at long last, and we'll certainly have to do it again sometime soon.
Absolutely, guys, I really do appreciate it.
Have a good one, all right, Dan Again, that's Josh Norris, NBC Sports, Roto World of very affable gentleman. I appreciate having them on.
Oh, Josh, which is great. Did you see that he went through the full I know rich Eisend runs the forty. I want to say Josh went through a number of the combine events this year. How I watched him tie? Not great? No, actually, you know what, all things considered, I saw him do the forty. I saw him do some shuttle stuff. I would say he did better than I thought he would as just you know, an average, just like you or I, you know, twenty nine thirty one. I don't know how old he is, your old male.
I thought he did pretty good all things considered. You know, doing it cold is especially difficult. Is there a specific event tie that you feel like you could punch above your weight class in the in the combine?
Uh? Probably some sort of throwing drill. Okay, yeah, I could do a nice football. You throw a nice ball.
I do.
Yeah, we did it. You remember we did this a while ago?
That true? I know we did. I'm just yeah, I think did I throw it farther than you?
No?
No, no, no, you had and I had the punt.
I don't remember which. I think you might have.
You might have beaten me on the punt. I should really go back and look at it. It's terrible footage. I'm pretty sure though.
Yeah.
It's definitely like standard definition or a cut blow. And I'm pretty sure that the throwing was my was my strongest one, so I could if there were any it would be throwing any kind of throwing drill.
Physically, I'm going to be below average pretty much everywhere. I'm an okay athlete, but I just in terms of what other people that are like six one hundred and seventy four pounds can do, I'm not going to be there, but Tie, I feel like I would ace the sort of interview portion of the combine, Right, I am. I can bs with the best of them, Tie, I can. I am aware. I am aware that you want to hear, Like you want to ask me about the n K. Sure, let's talk about the NK. Tie, you want to talk
about the Cincinnati Reds. I'm with you. I'm ready to go. Uh So, Yeah, I'm a natural leader, I'm ambitious. I think I'm great. I wouldn't be in this league if I didn't think I were great.
Also, so also, any kind of classroom event would probably be more our speed. You know, the wonderlick, the things that really have nothing to do with athletic prowess, right, those are the things that we would do best in.
Yeah, I think that's true. I think I really could, you know, look somebody square in the eye, a firm handshake, and I could really tell, you know, an assistant GM what he or she wants to hear. I'm right there, Ty, I would start off by saying, excuse me, mister Norris, since he's the new GM of the Raiders. These days, it might get a little difficult to stay informed. It doesn't have to be, thanks to the Texture app. Oh shoot, good call Texture app. Now listen.
Texture has been a friend of the verbal for a long time. Go and check it out at texture dot com slash solid. You get a fourteen day free trial. I'm not saying you have to do it, but just go and check it out. If you like to read stuff, if you're into fine works of literary arts as we are, and magazines and what not, please go to texture dot com slash solid and at least see what they're all about.
They've got over two hundred magazines at the ready. They offer access to in depth interviews and articles from the convenience of your phone or tablet. All right, so it's a little bit like Netflix, but only for publications.
Don't have a million of them laying around.
Subscribe to Texture it's normally nine ninety nine a month, but if you sign up now, you can get it for free for fourteen days. You can have all those publications delivered to you digitally, save yourself the paper and the mess. They've also got daily recommendations and exclusive interactive features. They make it easy to enjoy the articles that you want to read because they're searchable.
Searchable, Yeah, which.
You've got If you've got like ten magazines on the end table, you can't type something into a search bar and find what you're looking for.
You got a page through yep. You know.
It's a laborious process to do that. Dan Texture makes it searchable so you can find what you like. You can check out old issues, bonus video content, everything from Sports Illustrated to Esquire and Forbes.
It's all available.
Was one of Apple's twenty sixteen iPad Apps of the Year. Texture Texture dot Com slash solid fourteen day free trial if you go to texture dot com slash Solid t e x t U r E dot com slash solid ty.
I have a question. I think I know the answer to this question, but it just struck me that this is basically out of college. And you can make your jokes about how you know getting paid in bag man, you know, top players getting paid in colleges, recruits, whatever, but this is this is the first job, right, This is the first out of college, entering the workforce job for everybody that's going to be drafted, presumably right, right.
So my question to you, ty is I think I know the answer, but that your current mystery day job is you've been there for a long time, correct, indeed, indeed you happened so you never had a different Did you have a different job out of college or is this the right? Straight out of college? You've progressed through your mystery day job. This is my first full time job I've had. I've had numerous other jobs in the
summertime and whatnot, but yeah, full time, full time. Yes, at any point early on, because I had a different career path than you. At any point early on, were you like the young throw to do errands? Like did you have a ton of like dumb busy work that you had to do? And I don't want to get you in trouble with your job, but I'm saying, did you have like typical first early twenty two years old out of college. Did you have those like typical busy work nonsense situations?
I wouldn't simplify it to the degree, okay, any of it falls into that category. I would just say that as a lot of people find when you jump into the workforce right out of college, you find yourself doing a lot of what I would consider junior level work. So it's a lot of stuff like that, never anything I would consider busy work.
Do you when you look back on that time, do you feel like you did a good job, not at your actual job, but of being a new fresh face in the workforce. Did you wear your shirts ironed? Did you pack yourself some lunch? Did you were you always showing up on time? Did you ever cut out early?
I think I was doing my part. Yeah, I'm not much of a rule breaker as it relates to my steady source of income. No, I usually try to look presentable.
I had so much dumb like I had. So my first job was a paid internship for a production company, So I was picking up lunches for like the entire office. It was a production company movies and TV and actually some some theater stuff. But I had so much just grunt work. Tie I was delivering scripts. I took the father of one of the main producers at the company.
I took him on errands, one of which included buying him, well, going with him to buy a jockstrap oh wow, at a at a sporting good store because he lived in Mexico and could not get jockstraps in Mexico. I had to do a lot tye And it kind of bums me out that you never had to live that life, because it was not that fun. I delivered a script to Kyle Gass of TENACIOUSD.
Though.
Oh yeah, it was that I met Chris Hardwick. Okay, it's not all that interesting, but yeah it was. It was kind of a bummer of like a six months hun I left and got another job. But yeah, so it's just interesting when I think back on it, which is what what three four years ago now. Yeah, I think about that these soon to be NFL players, this is their first full time gig and they're not going to have to do any of that stuff.
Interesting.
Yeah, probably never, No, I think they'll probably seventy five percent of them will actually have a job that is like the NCAA commercial says in something other than sports.
Trying to start a podcast in exactly twenty Yeah.
That's exactly right. But yeah, different tie, different life.
All right, Well, fun show. We will be back next Wednesday. M hm. This again is a little bit of an early drop this week because the draft starts on Thursday night. You need some time to download and digest what Josh had to say. But do throw him a follow at Josh Norris on Twitter and look for his draft coverage again with Rotal World and NBC Sports dand best of luck on your live show. I'll watch.
Yeah, I appreciate that. Should we tease who are having on the show next week, we can, Okay, I won't say her name, and we're gonna go out on this tie and what we'll sign off, all right, But she's a current Supreme Court justice, so that's all I can say. It's all I can say.
Ty on that note for that guy over there, Dan Rubinstein, my name is Ty Hildebrand. Thanks again for tuning in. Subscribe at iTunes dot com, slash Solid Verbal, Catch you on next week and stay summer peace,