Welcome to the solid verbal. Hell that for me, I'm a man, I'm forty.
I've heard so many players say, well, I want to be happy. You want to be happy for a day?
Edith Steak is that woof woof? And Dan and Tye welcome back to the Solid Verbal Boys and girls. My name is ty Hildebrand joining me as always still over there and very cold Chicago. Lloyd Andrewwstein, how you hold up? I'm good.
I'm making pizzas I work out inside sometimes. And Gus Melson is a UCF legend. Of course, I'm great.
Gus Melson. You kind of stole my thunder there because I was going to play a breaking news sound. We'll play that in a second. Okay, okay. Solid Verbal at gmail dot com as always is the email address. Don't forget to follow along on social media Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, all the usual hotspots. We've added a twitch in there. I played a game this weekend. Felt pretty good to shake off a bit doing. Okay, we're now in year
two of Navy. Started out too, and I all got a prime like four star recruit to come to Navy and play quarterback and serve his country. Things are changing, man, Things are changing. We're working on it, but got a twitch brand, the great rebrand slash solid verbal.
Have you had Have you been fielding any offers to become a new team's head yet?
No? No, we went six and six last year, so the new offers aren't exactly too plentiful right now.
How loyal do you feel to the midshipman?
I feel like I'm madis for the long haul. I'm in it for the long haul, at least for the nice mode lolo brand. Okay, shedding that brand, man going going fresh here airing it out. I like it. Of course we do have a Patreon as well at for ballers dot com. Listen here is this is breaking news, hot off the presses. I'm not going to play the
sound if you're going out to Verballers dot com. If you look at our tears, you'll see that one of the things we're doing in the off season is reverting back to a concept, a thing, a topic list that has long been very popular in the verballer hood, and that is the off topic content. Dan. We've done a couple shows like this over the years, and it seems each time we do it gets a little bit more popular. So your recall we did what was it The Pop Punk and Emo Show with Bill Barnwell a few years back.
I mean, all of them have been with Bill, right, you have all of them. I don't think all of them.
I think we did sports video games with Bill. We did pop punk, emo, Internet things.
We did do with Bill.
Yeah, okay, well, we'll do at least one of these in the spring with Bill period.
As part of what we're doing on Patreon, we're going to be doing one of these per month. It's a Patreon only release. The release this week is going to be you and I not only deep diving our historic careers as youth and or high school athletes, but also talking about where we feel right now about youth and high school athletics.
Right of course, Oh there's so much. So there's our personal stuff, there is the general archetypes. There are just I mean that we have to dip in on what it's like now, right just to see what that world looks like in the present tense and not just what it was in like nineteen ninety six. So youth sports and everything surrounding. So we're going to talk what Okay,
so it's our own experiences. We're talking getting to and from games, teammates, snacks, practice games, facilities, equipment, you name it.
We're going every kids got their own baseball helmet. Now what is this world coming to? Yeah? Gen Z re Ballers one more time is where you can find all that info on the Patreon Dan. So we got a Tuesday show, a Thursday show, and then the off topic show is going to drop a little later on in the week for the Patreon subs and only the Patreon subs Dance. Yeah exclusive. Today's show, we are talking about
what happens if Hell freeze is over. You may be wondering why are we playing an eight bit version of Hotel California? Dan, Care to explain yourself?
I myself, I'm wondering too. The Eagles had a Hell Freezes Over tour. That's a reunion tour, like they're never going to get back together until Hell freezes over. And then they got back together and called it that. Have you seen the Eagles documentary?
By the way, I believe it's.
Just called the Eagles TI, Hi, you need to see the Eagles documentary. Why it's well, first of all, there's so much acrimony and hate in the band that it's like a It's a two part like four and a half hour documentary, and the first part is the original story of the Eagles, like how they came together and they had these common friends and this is what recording this seminal album was like, et cetera, et cetera.
And then the second part.
Is later stage Eagles And I'm not even a big Eagles fan at all. I just like wild stories about seventies and eighties rock, I guess. And the second part is like they just hated each other and kept going on tour because people kept wanting to see that. You have to watch it. Let me see where it's streaming. The Eagles documentary is streaming. It looks like Amazon.
You can watch it. Yeah, you can watch a history of the Eagles on Amazon. This is how you know it's the off season here on the solid verbal as we talk about Eagles documentaries.
But I might see the sane I might say that you don't have like well formed Don Felder thoughts.
I may have an appetite for a show like that. Right now, I think you need another topic for one of our off topic shows. Hey, maybe we'll just do a documentary episode. I'm down with that. Okay, so today's show, Hell Freezes Over. We've been doing the thing the last couple of weeks. By the way, we're totally steering into the whole cold theme right now. I was trying to harvest the day after Tomorrow, trying to find some clips out of there, because you recall there's that deep freeze
of course scene, but they're real. There's like no good sounds in there that I could yank, So I'm glad we went this direction instead. Anyway, Look, we've been looking at teams that are down and out or teams that are on the cusp for the last few weeks. Now, of course we had the Valentine's show, but that's what I'm gone Now this one we're looking at from a different perspective. We're so used to talking about teams that are low. What do they have to do to get
to the Promised Land? What about a team like Alabama, A team like Alabama, team like Clemson that has ruled the roost for ah gosh, recent memory, all of recent memory, Dan per two, has to happen, not part say, what has to happen for Hell to freeze over and for a team like Obama to come crashing down to earth, loosely connecting real world events that affect us personally to college football, vague concepts. It's what we do here, ty on the Soliverble, That's what we do. That is the
anthem of the off season. Before we do though market news. Not going forward like I usually do, but still getting.
Happy with it.
Okay, what do we have? Gus Melson is back, baby. UCF has named gust Melzon it's new head football coach. You'll recall he was fired back in December after eight seasons at Auburn. He went sixty eight and thirty five, was thirty nine and twenty seven in SEC play, obviously took Auburn to the National Championship game in his very
first season back in twenty thirteen. He emerged really just this weekend as the leading candidate to replace Josh Hypel takes over at Tennessee, and he has now officially gotten the job. Quote. I'm thrilled to be the head coach at UCF, and I truly look forward to being part of Night Nation. Thank you, Gus. So look say what you want about Gus Balazan. This is a good hire
I think for UCF. Yeah, I agree, I think this is a splash hire to go out and get Malason late in the cycle, to bring a guy down there who, look, there's an incredible amount of talent in South Florida that he can work with. We know he's got an offense that's very attractive to skill talent. And again UCF seems to find a guy who can come in and do the thing on offense. If nothing else, they will be very exciting to watch when they have the football correct.
Some mixed results in hiring assistants at Auburn, but the track record is overwhelmingly positive, even with the mediocre down years and the inconsistencies and the struggles finding and developing quarterbacks at times. Certainly there were highs to the Jarrett stinnam era and Cam Newton and you know, you look back and there were some really you know, Nick Marshall, they're promising dudes. But I think what he'll be able
to do at UCF is continue the successes. I don't know how you know, if he goes eleven and one at UCF this year, next year, whatever, I don't know how long he's going to be there. With how much turnover there is among the SEC and I guess acc coaching ranks if he's going to stay in the Southeastern footprint.
But yeah, kind of seems like a no brainer. Should be able to recruit very well, has recruiting connections across the region, and Lord knows that there are going to be transfers available from Miami, Florida State, Florida, South Carolina, Georgia, Georgia Tech, that kind of thing to help populate that roster. So I would imagine u CF is going to position
itself very well. I'm curious to see who he hires to round out that staff, But yeah, UCF is one of those jobs, one of the group of five jobs along with I suppose Houston that geographically has positioned itself
in a really nice place. Memphis. Boise State doesn't have the geography, but has the track record of winning where what you know, going to Tennessee, South Carolina schools that aren't necessarily set up infrastructure wise, roster wise to succeed, Whereas you know, inheriting, Dylan Gabriel's pretty good start, pretty good start if you're Gus Malson. So I expect impressive things from Malson and the Knights. I do as well, any other news here jumping out to you. Penn State's losing.
It looks like Tony Banks co d C. So it has been with James Franklin, Brent Prye. I think he's a secondary's coach as well or safety's coach for Penn State. Looks like he's going to Tennessee to become defensive coordinator for Josh Hipel. Just a connected world. I don't you have strong Tony Banks not oddly opinions. No, oka A State's defense has largely been good.
Yeah, kind of a bump step back this year, but nonetheless.
Yeah, So, I mean it's always a good sign. I will I will maintain this. Always a good sign to have your coaches hired away from your staff instead of having to fire them. You don't have to pay them, You get paid, and it's a good reflection on your head coach in terms of hiring practices. So that's hopefully it all works out for Tennessee. I saw Oregon's twenty twenty starting quarterback Tyler Shuck announced his entry into the
transfer portal. It certainly seemed like that job is going to be wide open, and I know I and a lot of Oregon fans had high hopes for him going into this year with Joe moorehead and it seemed like his numbers I think don't tell the full story. Times he did struggle and it didn't seem like the long term answer for Oregon. But I hope he finds a good home somewhere else, be it on the West Coast
wherever that whoever. In a lot of teams need a hopefully quality quarterback, and he is at his best equality quarterback. So hope it works out. And I think he's immediately eligible. I think he has both because of the way that eligibility has worked after the twenty twenty season and because of how quickly he graduated. I believe he has three years of eligibility remaining, so Brady White situation, if you will, which is great.
I hope it works out.
I hope he finds a place in locks in and is a good quarterback all right, But Oregon is I think decent enough in terms of depth of quarterback right now. Looks like Anthony Brown's.
Probably gonna start the season, which I hope is good.
I hope somebody who is inconsistent and tore both acls at Boston Coe, which works out surrounded by better talent. I'm hopeful. I'm hopeful that a better situation. I mean, he's gonna be surrounded by a number of talented receivers, are now experienced offensive line as Joe moorehead calling the plays, and they have a couple of blue chips behind him, including one true freshman who's pretty well regarded in Ty Thompson.
So we shall see, we shall see. I don't I don't think you're going to the playoff for winning a national championship necessarily with that quarterback room. But incremental improvement is always good.
Anthony Brown, Okay, yeah, we'll see. Let's get to our game, Dan, let's do it. Hell freezing over. So I think we have to come to an understanding here. Right out of the shoot. We've got got a handful of teams listed. We've got Alabama, Clemson, Ohio State, Oklahoma, Oregon, Notre Dame Georgia. So whats what we're asking here is what would it take for each of these programs the spiral out of control and at a minimum fall down from the pedestal
where they currently find themselves. So, like, we could start with Alabama or Clemson, since those are the two most obvious ones. But I think we have to ask first and foremost about each team what happens if the coach leaves. That's the most obvious thing. That's the low hanging fruit. We're not going to do the thing where we talk about rules and fractions because rules and fractions could obviously be an unforeseen event that affects any of these schools
in a very negative way. That's also low hanging fruit. But beyond that, I have some thoughts here on some of these teams. I know you do as well. Why don't we start with Alabama?
Should we define what we mean falling from glory and help, raising over and careening back down to ours? Like sure, from from glory to Gasparilla, glory to gain. Yeah, I'm not saying that a team is going to utterly collapse and get the death penalty. Excuse me, English, go one and eleven. But you go from winning double digit games to seven point two to eight point one games a year over a seven year spam.
It's like a Miami situation we talked about Larry Koker.
Yeah, I mean a number of all of these teams that we've listed have koreem back down to Earth at some point for reasons that I think is.
An important point that I wanted to remind everyone of. Yeah, even though it seems like there is no possible way in Alabama or a Clemson or in Ohio State is going to come back down to Earth, we have seen it time and again. It happens. It's going to happen again for all of these schools without fail. Yeah, well there's okay, so we can discuss all that here, but it will happen at some point.
It goes without saying, like you mentioned that, not only do you have to talk about coaching changes, but yes, let's get it right out of the way right now, if either one of these if any of these schools loses a coach and hires a bad coach, it can
very easily happen. I think we need to go into some more of more detail on a more granular level, like what specific to these schools could because Ohio State's context is very different from Notre Dame's context and Oklahoma, Oregon, Bama, Clemson, Georgia, whatever.
Even though you know there are some overlaps in terms of conference with say Clemson and Notre Dame this past year or Alabama and Georgia whatever, what we're gonna get specific to those schools because there are certainly Oh you start a bad quarterback.
And you became bad.
Yes, that happens to everybody, literally everybody. We're going to try and avoid the the layups, the guppies.
Of an answer as best we can. So, okay, let's that being said. Let's start with Alabama. Yeah, Alabama, your national champion, Nick Saban, greatest coach of all time, Nick Saban leaves, Nick Saban decides, well, could you give me a Nick Saban stays in the koreem as well, do you have that within you? I think so? Yeah. I mean I think it needs to be said that if Saban leaves, I don't know if a Korean's out of control, but that's probably the best chance of it happening, right, agreed,
of course? Yeah? Yeah. Obviously Bama is so well rounded at this point that you can't just point to, like you said, a bad year or two at quarterback and that being the tip of the iceberg that leads to the downfall. I think the angle here is more centered around recruiting, particularly with teams around Bama getting good enough
that it's harder for Bama to recruit. So, for example, we talked about Miami, how Alabama was moving into that South Florida territory, building a pipeline for itself, siphoning off some of that top talent. But if Florida State gets better, if they rise up, if Florida can continue itch trend, if Georgia can continue itch trend, if Miami could reclaim
the swagger. There are a lot of ifs here as a game of hypotheticals, mind you, even if Gus Melson can come in and poach a couple kids, more recruiting competition for that talent over humble cycles, I think is one way that you could start to see things trend in a different direction.
I don't think that's based in reality, because.
None of this is based in reality. But continue, No, I know.
There are certain things about Alabama that are based in reality. The things that are based in reality about.
Alabama is.
An influx of quarterbacks, slash systems, slash coaches doing interesting enough things to undermine Nick Saban's ability to coach an eleven twelve win team consistently because of innovation that Nick Saban has generally capitalized on. But he hasn't been at the forefront. He hasn't been in the forefront of running the spread. He hasn't been at the forefront of playing
up tempo, of using RPOs. You know, there was that inflection moment or moments when we were talking about the SEC banning you know how quickly teams can play, and it's saying, you know, is this what we want football to be? So I think what it is is actually innovation because I don't think anybody's going to pay closer attention to the little things that Nick Saban does because he keeps having to overhaul his staff every year and
nothing changes. They just keep winning national championships or vying for national championships. They're in that playoff conversation. They're of that caliber. So what it is is, essentially, I don't know. Tennessee and South Carolina and LSU each find their own version of Hugh Freeze's system slash Johnny Manziel slash, the combination of Steve Spurrier and Steve Garcia, Steven Garcia guys
like that. I think if we get a perfect storm of that every year, I think that's the closest thing because I don't think the recruiting is ever going to fall off. The track record is too vast and too deep that no coach is there a coach right now that could come in to the SEC and say, my track record is analogous or within arm's reach of what Nick Saban has done in terms of winning and developing NFL council.
I mean, he just signed the best class of all time, right right.
So being out recruited or seeing recruiting fall off in an appreciable way I don't think is based in reality. I think it's much more that more and more talented coaches take SEC money. Like if Ed Orizron doesn't work out, all of the sudden, lsu hires Lincoln Riley, and all of a sudden they become unbelievable killers in a way that they only were that one season with Joe Brady
and Joe Burrow. Like, I think that's where we're heading, That the conference becomes oh stacked and top heavy with coaching and quarterback and overall talent that the conference just can't help but to beat itself up. Yeah, I think side of that, Yeah, I don't see it.
I think it has to come from within the SEC too, From within the walls, coming from within the house, within the walls of the SEC is the best chance of this conflict rising up because look, for college football fans, at least to some extent, the Clemson rivalry between Clemson Alabama. Look, it's still interesting, maybe not as interesting as it used to be because they're in it every year, But that
is not going to destroy Alabama. What would really take a toll on Bama as if it found a counterbalance somewhere else in the SEC. And to be fair, everybody in the conference has ripped their hair out for the entire Nick saban Era trying to figure out how to get to be that counterbalance. No one's really done consistently yet, I think at a.
Minute, and the ones, the ones that occasionally do, are only that dangerous for blips.
A couple of years.
It's LSU for a season, or they are kind of half a team with an amazing defense, but they can't put it together consistently on offense. What they didn't cross the fifty in a national championship after beating Alabama nine to six earlier in the year. It's ole Miss imploding under Hugh Freeze. It's Georgia not quite getting over the hump teams like that where nobody's been able to put it together with any sort of consistency, with Auburn being the closest.
And they still fired their coach. You know, the the LSU, The combo of LSU and A and M in the SEC West is really interesting to me. Sure, that's really interesting to me. And I do think that Jimbo Fisher is slowly but surely going to build up A and M. We'll see what Orgeron could do. He had a tough year,
want to turn over obviously weird year with COVID. But you know, provided they can continue to build those programs, that would be some interesting competition for sure for Alabama it already is, but to see those teams take their game to another level would would help this argument. Well, isn't there also still the even teams that lose consistent consistently in the SEC, with some exceptions, generally have an appealing element to their team. Be it the Kentucky defense,
be it you know, how feisty. I suppose it an unquantifiable way. Arkansas was this year with a real quarterback and an improved defense, and Mississippi State for forever had like this kind of dangerous offense with times an NFL quarterback and Dak Prescott like there were, there are always elements. So I think if the competence floor is raised in that every week Alabama plays a team who's at least very good at one point three, things that becomes interesting.
That becomes quite interesting. Alabama is still going to win ten games a year. But if that, if that opens Alabama up to losing fifteen thirteen to Arkansas one random, weird year, that changes things, That changes the calculus. But we're talking about something that still remains five steps away. Well exactly, you know one other thing here about Bama and then we're going to move on to Clemson. And here's why I bring you.
Need to also tell me is there anything internal about Alabama that would worry you internal?
Right?
So we internally at Auburn that there was pressure and there were factions, and Alabama there's a ton of pressure to win. And so obviously if we're going to happen by now where Nick Saban didn't want to deal with the internal politics both within the athletic department and the booster community to Alabama and everything going on, he'd be gone. But he has organized all those things behind him in lockstep.
So I think that's it.
I think that's that's it in terms of internal hope because a lot of places it's not wanting to deal with the politics, relationships running sour with the AD and with whoever the chancellor, and then it's then a coach will find a way out to go.
I just don't see that for Saban. Hard to see. Yeah, he's a legend. Yeah. What I was going to say is, you know, one of I think the common themes that will have certainly with Clemson, I at least want to discuss it with Clemson and some of these other schools here the prospect of assistant coaches leaving, that's not has
it affected Bama? Not as big a deal for Bama right they are maybe by at all sheer force of will from Nick Saban and his ability to organize and create a system that's plug and play for new coaches and players and the like, that has not been something that has really slowed him down. We've had this story now for what feels like five years running about assistance leaving going elsewhere. To your point from earlier, when these guys are in demand, that obviously speaks highly of your program.
But we've seen it time and again, big time assistants are leaving. Alabama keeps getting better.
So we talk about how it could potentially and it would need a lot of different elements to go wrong for Alabama with Nick Saban. What is an Alabama team who is built to win big? They pour resources into the program, unlike many and most of all schools and college major college football. So the resources are there, the reputation is there, the NFL draft factory is there, the high profile elements to the program is there. Alabama is as big as it gets. You can't hire the wrong coach.
But is there anything specific about Alabama post Nick Saban that worries you? Because I have a couple of things. Well, yeah, primarily, nobody's Nick. That's the number one thing.
Nobody's Nick Saban, And it's very difficult to try and match that. To that point, though, we have seed some recent success with Ryan Day taking over for a legend in his own right in aben Meyer one full season, one full season, right, and I have that written down here. I do want to talk more about that. Yeah, but there is some precedent, at least here in the early going that it seems like that situation is going to
work out well. I do think it's going to have to be somebody who has familiarity with the program, who coached under Sabin. I was probably not Sarkesian at this point, but somebody like that that the Alabama brass will be comfortable with, who can establish some means of continuity going from Saban serving as that bridge to the next generation. It's going to take somebody who.
Knows maybe, yeah, And that's what we've seen across the country with some of these teams, not Notre Dame, but across the number of these teams.
There's that familiarity.
Lincoln Riley was the coordinator at Oklahoma before taking over. Same goes for Ryan Day. Mario Christobal was in that role at Oregon and so that certainly helps. And Clemson had a receivers coach in Dabo Sweeney before he took over.
So that helps.
My worry with that is the expectations at Alabama, given what Nick Saban has done, are unmatchable. I mean, Urban Meyer won how many national championships at Ohio State. One that's matchable. I mean, he had Ohio State playing on a crazy level, but they win the first college football Playoff and then don't, so the expectations for keeping the train going. I don't think anybody can possibly succeeded Alabama after Nick Saban, directly after Nick Saban, whoever it is,
is going to get fired within four years. Even if it's Dabosweeny, he's gonna get fired.
Let's move over to Dabbo. Let's talk about Clemson. So I asked this question to Larry Williams from Tiger Illustrated when I had him on the show, I think a year ago, and it was almost verbatim, like what does it take for Clemson to fall back to Earth? And he didn't really have a good answer for it, but
his answer was staff changes. If we saw staff exodus, right, So Brent vannables, if he leaves, if the offensive staff will leaves, if we've got coaches who are suddenly so in demand that they have to take these jobs, and Dabo is now looking to put in place a new cabinet, what kind of effect would that have? Now? But by now I think it's pretty well known how Dabo got his start at Clemson. He was a relatively inexperienced coach.
He got the head role, and he decided that he wanted to allot a lot of his budget to go out and get the best assistant coach is possible to help support him. That model has obviously worked. Clemson's a juggernaut now. But if at this point some of those coaches were to leave, what kind of downstream effect would
that have? Clemson is still obviously a place where people would want to go and coach, but any kind of mass turnover if Brent Vannables decides to leave and take ahead job at some point in time, you know, so much of that program is built around a really solid defense. If he leaves, what happens is that something that can be replaced. We have not seen what Dabbo can do with the like a Saban level of coaching turnovers, So that to me seems like the most obvious place to go first. Here.
What's interesting to me about Clemson is how patient are they now versus how patient were they with Tommy Bowden winning seven games every year in the two thousand and seven eight games compared to win and I had to give myself a refresher. But in twenty ten Clemson went six and seven. They lost the Minukey car Care Bowl to USF offensive coordinator of that Clemson team Billion Napier
billion fired ye Billionnapier defensive coordinator Kevin Steele. Kind of a dream staff if you were to look back on it now in terms of what those guys have done since. And certainly you can point to what Kevin Steele did at Clemson and which cost him his tenure at Clemson. It just wasn't a fit by the end of things. But the patients with an unknown, which Dabosweeney very much was when they hired him, and then in twenty ten when they have a losing record, and since then they've
only had double digit win seasons. So what does that patience look like? If they replace Dabbo with somebody who's pretty good or good or interesting or coming from across the country something like that, and they go six and seven in their third year, what are the expectations now after I mean three of the four of the last five years they've won fourteen, fourteen, fifteen and fourteen games. What does that patience look like? How is Dabo's calculus
change that program? I think the danger coming from the call in the house doesn't really exist because the acc is at a point where who is legitimately dangerous? Which grouping of teams right now could we even envision being legitimately dangerous.
It's hard to see. To me, it's hard to see.
Yeah, So yeah, I don't see an existential threat there. I think the existential threat is obviously Dabbo leaving. But even if Dabo stays there, it's that he has grown so powerful there that maybe the drive to keep hiring and maintaining the assistance and that culture there where he's become an emperor figure, not just figure figure, not just like Nick Saban has done, but he has done it in a place that essentially hasn't seen this level of
success in what thirty years. Danny Ford was good in the eighties, but they were okay with seven win seasons in the nineties and two thousands. So knowing that and knowing that he has that status, how motivated is Dabbo on the throne If he has to do what Nick Saban does, which is completely overhauling his staff every or every two or every two and a half year or something like that, that to me is the great unknown. So I think you're right on that.
The other point that I'd bring up is Clemson has had really good quarterback play in recent memory. Is that a slight against Kyle Parker It kind of is. Yeah, he hit twenty home runs and through twenty touchdown in a single year. But if you look at the track record at Clemson of quarterbacks, go back to Taj Boyd. You know, let's go back ten years, TODJ Boyd full stout, Yeah, Shaun Watson, obviously, Trevor Lawrence. They have really hit on quarterbacks.
It seems like the dj UIL is going to be fine. Sure, but if there is a year where they miss or two years where they miss, I don't know if I'm as confident in Clemson digging out from that as I would be in Alabama.
What level quarterback miss would would take them from the playoff to you know, the Minukey car care Ball if that still exists. I mean, like aus Kelly Bryant was a replacement level quarterback and he took him to the playoff. Right, So we we are talking, can can we do an exercise that we promise is not I don't think what is definitely gonna come off as insulting, Like I'm looking at this year's quarterback efficiency rankings. These are like the
most efficient quarterbacks across the country and conference games. So could Jack Plumber perdue part time starter take Clemson too the playoff? No, Max Duggan.
I mean, if you're going to throw a TCU quarterback out, I'm probably gonna say yes.
So Adrian Martinez. I think all of these answers are probably yes, just because the acc that defense Travis etn I know it was a different line this year, but I'm just if you're averaging out for talent.
Reason, consider that no quarterback at all, just like they.
Start Amari Rodgers. That's a quarterback, like an emergency quarterback. Chase Brice. Yeah, Chase Price would not have been able to take Clemson too the playoff to me, but you might have to go pretty far down this like filter Covid could take Clemson to the playoff.
I know they're so good at all the other positions, but I do feel like if you get like a year or two in there with really down quarterback play, I don't know.
To me, though, there is an element of if Clemson has the eighty fourth most productive quarterback in the nation but is still surrounded by crazy five star talent up front, receiver, running back, defense, doing everything, you know, shouldering the load. You're getting the absolute best quarterback transfer to Clemson, aren't you?
More than likely? Yeah, it's not gonna last more than a year. JT.
Daniels is going to Clemson. Whoever that that headline transfer portal quarterback is just can go to Clemson and immediately step in and succeed. So it's hard to see at Clemson quarterback issues for multiple years existing. I think it's the laziness. I think it's the attrition, and I think it's what what does Clemson look like in terms of how attractive it is? If Dabbo leaves for whatever reason.
He leads to start like a talk podcast for the Ringer could see it.
How attractive is an open Clemson job? Premium premium results these past few years, superpower results. What type of name does Clemson attract? Is it internal with Venables or Tony Elliott or are they are they taking a big swing with Lincoln Riley or whoever. I don't know why Lincoln Riley would leave Norman. He's got a very good at a home. But I don't know, all right, do you I see?
I have no idea.
I don't know, Clemson still like it's not a headline program in terms of national awareness in the way that Alabama, Ohio State are, even though the results are there. I wonder, I wonder what type of external name Clemson can attract.
To me.
It's not as obvious as one of the other schools we're talking about, so that to me.
Is an issue.
It's attrition internally and it's externally. What can they attract externally?
Let's go to Oklahoma since you mentioned Lincoln Riley. Okay, first things first, as we've been acknowledging with each of our teams here, in all cases the coach leaving will be somewhat catastrophic. Lincoln Riley going to the NFL will be really catastrophic for you think, So I do, I do explain. I think he is about as good of a candidates you're going to find who you can get him when he's young and perhaps willing to stay for like fifteen years. Yeah, it's sort of rare to find
those guys anymore. And he seems really happy there, seems to be building something there, and to lose somebody like that, in effect, you're kind of starting over, So that'd be a big deal. And I also think the way that he has put his brand on the program has been really notable. You know. The other point I have here is if he goes a year or two missing that high level quarterback play, Oklahoma is not good enough on defense. They haven't been to kind of make up the difference
for an offense that can't score right. So, I think I think that's a very obvious thing to point out. Lincoln Riley leaving going to the NFL, that's a problem. I don't know where the program goes from there. Clearly, you know a historic program that's going to attract top coaching talent. But to start over with somebody in a different mindset, that's the problem. And then you're not fully starting.
Over if you hire internal like Lincoln Riley was, if you hire you know, Alex Grinch or somebody like that.
Correct, But is Alex Grinch gonna pump out multiple Heisman Trophy winning quarterbacks.
No, it's an unsustainable pattern. But yeah, I understand what you're saying.
I think some combination of link in either leaving or missing a few years at the quarterback position, specifically at the quarterback position, since that's really where he's made his Hay. Some combination of those two things could be enough to take this program in a much, much different direction.
Oklahoma is the one I might feel the best about actually in this situation. Who the hell are you scared of in the Big Twelve right now? Unless you play Kansas State literally every week on the schedule, Who are you actually scared is going to rise up to become a superpower? I guess you could be concerned about Texas,
but kind of been there, done that. We're talking about Steve Sarkisian, who I have high hopes for given what I've seen out of recent offenses, but being an offensive coordinator is very different.
We called him seven win Steve for a resent. That's right, That's exactly right.
So Oklahoma is a place that all the resources are there. The pressure to win national championships is not there. The pressure just win the Big Twelve, be a national contender, get into the playoff, you know, ring some bells of other powers occasionally, or decent teams whatever. Oklahoma's better positioned to succeed in their conference in the long term than maybe any of these teams, just because of what their schedule looks like. It's a mess of a middle class
of flawed teams that do some things well. But right now, Iowa State's interesting. I don't know how long people think Matt Campbell's going to be an ames. I hope it's for a very long time. But that doesn't seem like a sustainable partnership because he's just going to attract that
much attention. So Oklahoma should be able to whether it's internally externally, what will help Hell to freeze over and see Oklahoma back in the I guess the depths of where they were in the Bob Stoops era, which is holidayble type games or whatever Ali Mobile, whatever the analog is. Now what that game is is basically not just missing on quarterbacks, but missing on more defensive coordinators. Lincoln Riley was also the guy who kept Mike Stoops on board
for I think almost assuredly too long. So that's an issue that if they keep having to win fifty one to forty eight games, they're going to keep losing more and more. So the defense has taken nice steps forward, but you lose Alex Grinch and you make another dut of a higher well, that's that's a pretty bad issue that's hard to overcome no matter how good. You are
detracting the nation's best quarterbacks. But I still think Oklahoma, because of how well set up they are to succeed in the Big Twelve, will attract a bigger.
Name than Clemson.
I think Clemson set up to win an acc But Clemson is dabbo, whereas Oklahoma has had you know, they've had blips of of bad runs. But we're still talking about Bob Stoop is an all time great college football coach. I think he was just inducted in the Hall of Fame. You talk Barry Switzer, you're talking now Lincoln Riley, Like there is it's very clearly a school that's going to
set up a coach to succeed. I think it's bad defensive coordinator hires and I guess Texas fully becoming a full on super how Yeah, that was the other assumption that I was going to push back. There's like nine s's at the end of that word guess, well, of course, But let's unpack that a little bit.
Yeah, I feel like we've been waiting a while for the Big Twelve. To the middle class of the Big Twelve. Let's say to rise up and make it a much deeper conference. Now, look, week in week out, there's a lot of offense generally in the Big Twelve, and we've seen strange upsets pretty much every year in that conference.
It just happens, the thing. But I can't say for sure that we've really seen that many teams from the so called middle class bubble up to the point, maybe outside of Iowa State, bubble up to the point where we start to consider them among the upper crust. I feel like the conference needs to get deeper as a whole.
At the same time, some of this stuff is going wrong for Oklahoma, you know, threats again coming from within the conference to knock them down a peg at the same time that they're struggling at quarterback and their defense is a mess. It's going to take a confluence of events like that. If Lincoln's going to be there for the foreseeable future, they're going to need some combo like that to knock them back a pig is.
Does he have that status, by the way, that first name only status, if Lincoln's going to be there.
I mean, on this show he does, because we're we're obviously boys with Lincoln Riley.
But yeah, of course, yeah, it's tough to see. But Yeah, I think it's going to down to defense, the NFL calling Lincoln Riley's name, and I'm trying to think what's specifically problematic about Oklahoma and the open market looking for a coach, because it's been a while. They went after Bob Stoops after he was a defensive coordinator at Florida.
So just I think that the ADS in a really good spot, and I think leadership has given everybody a good reason to trust the Oklahoma front office or whatever we want to call it. Yeah, I think that's what it is. I think it's some element of maybe Alex Grinch isn't ready if he's the next guy, if Lincoln Riley Lee's for wherever next year in the NFL, and it's a bad coach, but it's going to have to be a bad coach in concert with defense conference and some level of just you know, maybe losing the AD.
Maybe it's hard to see. It's hard to see that that conference just still seems so shallow at the top, Like how many times is Oklahoma State? How many times is Mike Gundy beaten the Sooners twice in fifteen years? Whatever it is, sixteen years?
You want to play a little bit of three d chess. Sure, what if the reason Lincoln Riley Lee's and the reason that Oklahoma freezes as part of hell freezing over of course continue is because of the college football playoff system. Huh? And what I mean by that is because the Big Twelve is finding itself in these odd situations where it's left out in the cold. A young, upstart, ambitious coach like Lincoln Riley just does not get the opportunity as much as he would like to play for a slash
winter national championship. Right, So, rather than deal with this goofy college system, Lincoln decides, screw it, I'm going to the NFL. I can play it out, play it off the way we're supposed to in any mature sport. Mm hmm.
And I'm leaving Oklahoma, Yeah, I mean, anybody who loses their great coach is gonna suffer likely. I'm trying to think what's unique to Oklahoma, though I'm trying to. I suppose it is that element of not garnering respect in the Big Twelve and being left out in the cold. But I internally, is there anybody upset at Oklahoma with where the Sooner stands? With so I can't they've had It's not like they've got undefeated and been left out. You lose Iowa State, you lose to Kansas State. I
mean that's that's sort of the reality. So yeah, not only is it Lincoln Riley leaving, but it's a coach coming in screwing up recruiting in concert with I think Texas becoming a superpower for ever asleep the Godzilla under the Does Godzilla sleep way down deep in the ocean?
Is that a thing? I don't know. I believe it is. So I think that's it.
But that's only one game. If Texas is a superpower, you're only going eleven and one.
And them again. Okay, I'll go to Ohio State here, so they're more interesting to me, I think so. I highlighted Ohio State on my list here as the singular most interesting team in this discussion. Ohio State, unlike the Alabama, Clemson, and Oklahoma discussions, is very different. I don't think we can say for sure that if Ryan Day leaves, they're gonna tank because we only got one full season really out of Ryan Day. It was a very good season, and what we saw from them this year was again
very good. Justin Field's a very good quarterback. We haven't seen Ryan Day with a quarterback other than Justin Field. So I think this is actually a lot more to be determined then you might think just looking at recent recent expectations, recent results. I mean, he had Dwayne Haskins as an interim if we count that. But yeah, sure, I this, like I said earlier, this is an example of a legendary coach leaving Ryan Day. Assuming from within
you're one in year two, pretty good. I think it will absolutely take the rise of someone else in the Big Ten East to counterbalance Ohio State and siphon off recruits. Now, but does that knock them to eight and four? And it doesn't knock made him four? Right, But you got to start somewhere, and I think the immediate starting point is Ohio State not winning the Big Ten Championship or Big Ten East every year. Got to start there. Now, Can Penn State get there? Maybe? Maybe can Michigan get there?
Feeling a lot less confident about that one as of late, but those would be the two obvious candidates in the East to jump up. Maybe Michigan State put something together a couple of years in the future, but in the short term, I think it's either Penn State or Michigan
to rise up and start knocking on the door. I will be very interested to see what happens this year, not because I think it's the start of any great downfall for the Buckeys, but Justin Fields is going pro and we are going to have an opportunity to see that new quarterback situation and see what Ryan Day can do. One of the other things that we've seen recently with Ohio State, Ohio State has been very, very good. Again, I can't emphasize that enough, but we've seen some deficiencies.
One of the things that Ryan Day came in and did year one was fix the defense, because defense in the last year of Urban Meyer was sort of a mess. So he came in, he fixed some things, He made them a better school. But I'm curious to see if he can continue to steer clear of those deficiencies now in the short term, because eventually, if you have enough of that, it starts to add up. I feel like
with Day, as compared to some of these others. We could talk about Mery crystal Ball in a little bit, but today especially, I don't feel like we have enough data to really make an accurate assessment on what it would take for them to freeze over.
So you almost think he there's a very slight chance and I don't think either one of us believe this, but there's a slight chance that there is some mark Helfrich Larry Kocher after the guy I do keeps it going for a stretch, but not necessarily on the level of an all time predecessor.
It's diminishing returns, right, and we've seen it time and again. Doesn't mean Ryan Day's back coach, And you're right, I don't think that. I don't think that he's going to go that route, but I think it's a bit of
an incomplete right now. He happened to take over at Ohio State maybe at the time that they were getting like the best quarterback to ever go to Ohio State, and justin fields, you can say you went about that and they were good elsewhere, produced a lot of great defensive talent, no doubt, but they were gettable on defense. This here sure watched an Indiana game. They're gettable, right, like they weren't social National championship. Watch the National Championship.
But how much you can hold that against them going against an Alabama remains me seen, but you know, they're not as bulletproof, and I just am not totally convinced that Ryan Day is just going to be on this glide path to the playoff every year. Yeah.
So there are a couple of things that are interesting to me about Ohio State because infrastructure wise, they are so well equipped. The recruiting department and just the sheer volume of people that goes into Ohio State winning is crazy impressive. They have to recruit in a way kind of nationally they I mean, you look at the footprint of this last amazing recruiting class and there's not a ton of Midwest footprint. So they have to go out there.
There has to be charisma, there has to be that effort. I think there will be, but I think the danger is in well one, Ryan Day has coached in the NFL and so I don't know what that appeal is long term. But if Ohio State keeps blitzing through the Big Ten and losing in it's close, big fashion whatever
to the powers in college football, I don't know. Maybe he's going to feel like he hit his ceiling at Ohio State and then it's it basically just takes a coach to come in and say we're going to play smash mouth football and get away from what attracted players to Ohio State, and all of a sudden, you're turning off players in Arizona or Georgia or North Carolina who want to play a very specific way. I think that's
an element to it. I'm not really worried about Ohio State playing in the Big Ten and not necessarily playing in huge games, as Michigan and Penn State are now kind of down and there's no real obvious team in the Big Ten that is shaping up.
To be a long term rival near their level.
I don't think that's a huge issue because I think, honestly, these kids just want to be developed into NFL players, and Ohio State's a great place to do that, and at a number of different or every single position.
So I'm not terribly worried about that.
It's more right now about where Ryan Day's eyes are, who Ryan Day actually is long term, because what we know about urban Meyer and Nick Saban is that they are just built differently. They are cyborgs. Nick Saban has handled things way better off the field than urban Meyer did, but to be able to maintain that level of excellence is historically incredibly rare. Ryan Day might be that guy, or he might just be, as you mentioned, a good
coach but not an all time coach. You're set up to succeed at Ohio State, but you also have to bring in that your own ability to maintain. So that to me is still a giant question mark. Is the Ryan Day element? And what does he deal look like with attrition? He inherited a lot of these guys. Now he lose Jeff Hafley, and he brought in a couple of his own guys. I think the guys from Michigan, right,
Greg Madison and Al Washington. Madison just retired. So what does Ohio State look like in terms of Ryan Day's connections and ability to attract coordinators? Because as good as Ohio State looks to be for the foreseeable future, that just means they're gonna be losing dudes for the foreseeable future. So the attrition thing seems very real, especially if you're
hiring assistants from other parts of the country. Say, that's worrisome that there is absolutely no proof at this moment that Ryan Day in year four or five can keep making incredible decisions, because as we saw with urban Meyer, he made some bad.
Well, yeah, exactly. I think the risk is always a little bit higher, clearly when you've got a newer coach.
I don't think of how State fans look fondly back at the Greg Ciano defenses all the time.
No, not all the time. Yeah, this is a big year for Day. It is a really big year for Ryan Day. And obviously, look there's a lot more to it just a quarterback position. But this is a guy who, to your earlier points, been really good at coaching quarterbacks, came in with a really good one to help lead him through years one and two. Who's the guy after Ryan Day? By the way.
That he takes like, you know, the Cincinnati Bengals job, or he takes I don't know what NFL jobs might become an open sooner or something like that.
The Texans job. I could see that being a Matt Campbell.
Jeff Haffley, you really like Jeff promising love Jeff Haffley. I don't know, Yeah, could be Matt Campbell, could be Jeff Haffley. It's interesting names.
Let's go rapid fire quick here through all right, three other schools. Let's start with your Oregon Ducks. Dan. First off, we've seen it recently. Yeah, we've seen it recently ago. Are are you confident in the crystal Ball era at this point that he's got them on the straight and narrow, that that there's a nice upward trajectory We talked earlier Tyler Schuck is transferring out Anthony Brown with at the starter.
That does not leave me feeling uber confident. But I do still feel like Oregon's done a really good job in the recruiting trail and that ye, crystal Ball is building towards something greater.
Yeah, I think all signs point to a nice run. The the issues are while they lost this year, to callan Oregon State inferior talent teams that put together a better win and took advantage of Oregon mistakes like pretty good teams do. So he has not built a killer on the field. Now, they had a ton of opt outs, whatever, But I'm not here to excuse things. At the end
of the day, you got to win your games. I think the quarterback issue should be Okay, the problem to me with Oregon and why they come back down to earth because I think He's just he's always going to recruit well, and his assistant hires have been very good. And Joe Morehead and Andy Avlos. Now we'll see with Tim de Ruder and whoever is after Joe Morehead, who I assume is not going to be terribly long for Eugene maybe another year, maybe two, just because he's from
somewhere else. I think the issue is going to be an element of being too stubborn in wanting too much control over in his case the offense, and Oregon is just is Eugene Oregon going to attract an aid list coach if Mario Christabal takes Oklahoma or Georgia or something big, if he wins big at Oregon Miami, who knows what level coach does that attract. Matt Ruhle chose Baylor over Orgon, Willie Taggart chose Oregon. They paid him well and he left right away to go back home to take a
dream job for two years. So how well can Oregon both attract Chip Kelly was an internal hire as offensive coordinator. Mike Blotti had a West Coast footprint and was an offensive coordinator at Oregon.
He was internal.
What does Oregon look like in terms of an open market coaching hire. I think it's a B plus destination in terms of how attractive it is to the best head coaches and coordinators across the country. But I don't think it's a no brainer to pick up your family and move to Eugene, Oregon. As somebody who did that, I don't think it's a no brainer. Not my family, that would have been weird. But it's a medium sized
town in central West Oregon. It's kind of far away from the hot beds of college football, especially with the Pac twelve where it is right now.
So I think that's ultimately what it is.
It's as as popular as Oregon is with some younger players and as good as they've built their reputation as a cool place to play football in practice, what are they able to attract in terms of a head coach. That's that's the worry to me as an Oregon fan. Why they go back to becoming a Holiday Bowl team is so it was a good internal hire of Mario Cristobal that seems to be working out really well.
It's just it's tough.
It's still to me, is just very tough because if you don't have somebody like that. You either need that like schematic genius like Chip Kelly was, or a guy who can attract talent and you know, players of coaches to Eugene, which Mario Christobal is. If you're just a pretty good coach, you are going to just go to pretty good bowl games at Oregon. It's hard to overcome that.
Yeah, And you know, I think back to the Chip Killy era and it was just so unique. It was so unique that it gave distinct cred to that program. People wanted to play for Oregon. Yeah, because of the uniqueness, because of the offense, and because it was so flashy.
He was pouring points on NFL defense is in La p. Carroll defenses, pouring points, beating them up.
And christ of Ball is just not that kind of coach. He's just not right. But that doesn't mean he can't have a lot of success. And it also doesn't mean that the early returns haven't been there, because I think they have so Obviously some of the schools we're talking about at the end here are a little bit more prone to spiraling out. Does not seem like Oregon's trending in that direction, but something.
No, they I mean It's a lot shakier a net right now in Eugene than it is in probably Tuscaloosa, Columbus, Clemson, Norman, much shakier net.
The other school we've got listed here is Notre Dame. It may Brian Kelly leaving is an interesting thing. It's interesting for everybody. So I'll just sort of omit it and I'll talk more about the I think structure of the program right now. There's a lot of pressure, whether they admit it or not, about Brian Kelly winning the big one. And we saw the big time win in November over Clemson at home. Backup quarterback for Clemson, James Skolsky out for Clemson, but you win that game in overtime.
That was a big deal, big deal for the program. You go in the AEC Championship game, you get drilled by Clemson, play in the playoffs, you get drilled against Alabama. M I don't know how many more situations like that are in Brian Kelly. I don't know how long it is until eventually the boosters and those in the program just get fed up with not winning that that big one. Notre Dame very much is the victim of its own expectations.
It's always been that way. Now that they're here, the expectation is that Notre Dame is going to reclaim its former glory. And I hate to break it to folks, but that is just not realistic. That's not reality. What is that a reference to?
Like?
What era?
Because as I can as I can tell right now, Notre Dame has won four straight double digit seasons for sure.
But I'm talking national championships. I'm talking national champions early nineties Notre Dame, sure, sure, late eighties like eight teams that were just giant killers and consistently in the hunt, realistically, in the hunt for national championships. If they don't get there soon, I'm very curious to see what kind of effect that has on the program over the short to medium term and if that would be enough to force Kelly out, force Kelly into a state of mind, like
what is it with these people? What do I have to do? I've built a good program. What do I have to do? Notre Dame, like you said, has been a double digit win team now pretty consistently, and they've been solid. The way that he's built this team has been rock solid, but much to the point of what you point out with Oregon, you know, there are always a few position groups or a bad coach hire away
from things feeling like they're getting out of control. I remember back a couple of years when the quarterback position was unsettled. I went four and eight one year. Remember that was a time I think fire. Yeah, that season. Notre Dame, maybe more so than any of these other schools, has been at that very questionable level recently. And you know, Kelly, to his credit, he was able to pull it together.
But I just think it underscore is the point that sometimes in these situations, when you're not a juggernaut like an Alabama or a Clemson, all it takes is a few things to start to go sideways, to give the impression that the program is caving, to give the impression that a change is needed. I don't know how likely that is, but I'm very curious to watch this season. I'm very curious to see what happens at quarterback this season because that's the face of the program. Ian Book
was there for three years. Were hateum. He was very consistent. He won a lot of games. Whether it's Jack Cohne or Tyler Buckner or somebody else, We're going to have to see now what Tommy Reese can do with a new quarterback, with Brian Kelly can do with a new quarterback. This is not a program that has a whole lot of a recent track record developing that position. Now, I think they've got depth elsewhere and they're could be very
good along the lines again this season. I hope that the skill position out wide will be better and facilitate a much better year at quarterback in the passing sense. But I think if we're talking about how does this come off the swivel, I think it could ultimately come off the swivel with Notre Dame and its own base, its own fan base, its own booster base being the ones that eventually drive the coach out force a new start.
I don't know who would take that job. We've talked about that one until we're blue in the face, and that new start maybe not being as promising as one would hope.
I mean Notre Dame fired three straight coaches, right, yeah, So not only would Brian Kelly leaving, who's done a very good job there hurt, but the track record and obviously these are different people making different decisions, but in terms of Notre Dame. Who Notre Dame attracts. Bob Davey doesn't work out. Ty Willingham doesn't work out, Charlie Weiss does not work out. There's something about Notre Dame. Maybe
it's baked into the DNA. Unofficially, Brian Kelly has a four and eight year and twenty sixteen Charlie Weiss in two thousand and seven they go three and nine. Ty Willingham as a five and seven year. Bob Davey has a five and seven year nineteen ninety nine. The big difference between Notre Dame and the rest of these schools, besides being independent, is a private parochial school. Right, It's different recruiting to Notre Dame. They've recruited some very good classes.
But when you recruit a top eighteen class one year like Brian Kelly did, I think a couple of years ago, as compared to a top five class, if that class doesn't work out, If that class doesn't pan out, that's a pretty big issue. And hasn't been able to find a quarterback and now that hasn't. When I say a quarterback, I mean a really strong quarterback. If you believe that Ian book was that that's fine, but obviously in bigger games in December January it didn't really work out with
Ian Book and Notre Dame's offense. So there's that element to things with Brian Kelly. So if Brian Kelly's there,
how does Notre Dame kareem back down to Earth. Well, it's hits in recruiting, it's saying it's top recruits, top quarterback, saying I don't necessarily want to play for a private parochial school in the middle of Indiana that hasn't developed a quarterback into an NFL caliber draft pick in quite some time, depending on what you think about Deshaun Kaiser and Jimmy Clawson in their NFL careers their Notre Dame careers. So what Notre Dame has been able to do has
been crazy impressive. But a combination of quarterback maybe some of those schools on their schedule, be at ACC schools or the traditional powers that they tend to schedule in USC and Michigan, whatever. If those teams get better and then that paired with a couple of those ACC programs, Notre Dame's on the rise. Clemson certainly is at an incredibly high level. We'll see about Miami and Florida State if all of a sudden outside of Notre Dame on
the schedule, if that element improves. And Brian Kelly is somebody who hired Brian Van Gorder to be a defensive coordinator.
True, yes, So.
Brian Kelly has a dud hire of a coordinator in him. Like maybe you learn from that, you don't make that mistake again. But Brian Kelly is capable of making an absolute dud hire of a coordinator. So that, to me is also kind of worries some in terms of minicky car care levels.
Yeah, I think it's.
I think it's it's again he corrected that emphatically with Elco and Clark Lee.
He's done a great job. And I think Marcus Freeman's another strong hire. Sure coaches are allowed to make mistakes, it's how they recover from mistakes that's really important. And I'm with you. I just the margin for air is it's just different at a place like a Notre Dame. Sure, it's just different because there are some of the variables. You've got, the high academic standards, you've got you know, what, do kids want to go to Indiana up play like.
All these things that you've mentioned I think are very, very true, and so it's a different situation. There's subtleties.
My brother went to college in Indiana. I had a great time visiting him.
Went to Purdue. It's great, all right, Final one, Georgia, we're running long over time. I'm looking.
I'm looking at Brian Kelly's coordinator hires over the years. Mike Denbrock.
I mean den Brock was a guy brought with him from Cincinnati.
Chip Loong was an improvement but didn't work out a long term. Okay, I think that's actually I think that's actually something to pay attention to me. I think you're right about Marcus Freeman. I think he will have every opportunity to uh to keep Notre Dame's recent defensive success.
Going Final Final one, Georgia, Kirby Smart takes over seemingly overnight starts to turn that program around. Now it's important to say turn around is relative, because Mark Rickt was fine. Mark Richt was decidedly above Monikey car care levels. Oh.
I like this as like a college Football Hall of Fame induction introduction.
Ladies and gentlemen. Mark Richt was fine. Place he was fine, which is also the name of Mark Rick's first album, Polite Applause Continue. But Kirby Smart comes in takes them to a different level. I'm curious to get your thoughts here, curious to get Georgia. Obviously, if Kirby Smart leaves, you know, that's the low hanging fruit. But yeah, yeah, that's the place that's that.
I mean, George is a place that's set up to succeed like crazy. I mean, Athens is a great town. The school puts a ton of resources into the program. The sec East is not you know, wall to wall killers like it's it's a place that's built to succeed in a way that many schools aren't. But it's they're a bad coach, They're probably always going to hire higher, They're always going to to bring in at least a good quarterback. They're gonna have good quarterback options in normal seasons.
George is a harder place to me. It's almost like Norman. It's a harder place. The expectations are there without recent results. So I think patience is going to be a huge issue. I mean, they were very patient with Mark Rick, who had, you know, a really good amount of success, but they're a patient until they're like, okay, this has run its course. But what do they look like now that they've gotten used to top two three recruiting classes? They make a
national championship game, That's my point. They they're winning the East, you know, most seasons of most recent years. Obviously Florida took it this year. But expectation wise, patience wise, I think there's this this sense of Kirby could be in La Gus Malsan was far more inconsistent in terms of on field results. But I think there is that element of Georgia saying we have hit our ceiling with Kirby smart, that we can't break past the Alabama glass.
And I think it would be a mistake. And then to go out and you know, take a chance with somebody new. I think there is that. I think it's a patience Hubris thing with Georgia for sure. A right, well look, Saliverboitgmail dot com right in, let us know your thoughts. Longer show than usual here, but that's okay, got a little bit into it today, that's fine. Verballers dot Com again is the Patreon, don't forget got a
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I have a I have a litany of stories, Dan that I think you will find exciting, including me on the basketball court. Oh my god, there was a there was a moment. There was a moment on the basketball court that drove me away permanently from basketball forever. And it wasn't me blowing my shoulder out about six years ago. That was different. Yeah, but back in the day, Ty Hildebrant setting up shop deep in the corner trying to pop a three. Are you giving away this content? I'm
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Ty? I'm aware, I am aware. Are you saying did I leave the girl.
At the airport? Did you ever frolic after hours on a baseball field.
No no, no, no, hold on, ty you got to tease it out. I don't know, I want to. You may want to check out our content. Yeah, all right, I like summer Catch. Thank you to one and all for playing along with us here. Stay safe wherever you may be, Try to stay warm. Hopefully hell is not freezing over on you. It's about to do so. Here like a half of Race. That'll be great for that guy over there, my good friend Dan Rubinstein, for myself, Tyle the brand, thanks so much for downloading, for listening,
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