My name is Will and I'm Garon, and unlike mulderin Scully.
We both want to believe.
So we've embarked in a journey of discovery.
We've talked to people deeply entrenched in the spiritual and metaphysical world.
We've thrown ourselves into weird and wonderful experiences. I even joined a coven of witches.
And wait, you joined a coven yep.
All on the interest of finding something, anything, that will prove that there's something beyond this physical.
Three dimensional world we all live in.
This is the Skeptic Metaphysicians. This episode of The Skeptic Metaphysicians was recorded live at the Edgar Casey AAR. Our guest today has been a consulting astrologer and teacher for over forty years. She's a graduate of Noel Till's master's course, where she achieved highest honors. She has a thriving international practice and it's frequently published in The Mountain Astrologer.
And if that's not enough, she's often called.
A lecture here at the AAR and a bunch of other venues, including Astrology University and Kepler College.
Well, we're excited to welcome to the show Kathy Rose. Kathy, thanks so much for being with us today.
Happy to be here and chat with you guys in my favorite location at the are.
It's one of our favorites.
We love it here too.
Yeah, so let's just dive right into it.
For those who are uninitiated astrology, you always think of you look, you pick up your newspaper and you look at your horoscope, and today is going to be this kind of day whatever. But astrology so much more than just that, right.
Yeah, the astrology you get in the newspaper is actually the worst kind, and I would highly recommend you run the opposite direction.
How do you do about explain a lot, Yeah.
Because it's often fatalistic. It's often going to tell you how your day will be. And the astrology I practice is very different from that. I think that we obviously we all have a birth chart, but your birth chart is an imprint at the time you were born from the planetary frequencies. But that imprint is designed to help us understand what we are here to develop, what we are here to consolidate or heal or release.
You know.
Now, I'm a proponent of reincarnation in past lives, and so we bring with us unhealed things from other lifetimes or where we need to have resolution, and the birch chart shows that. So we're not stuck with what some might feel or limiting patterns in the birth chart. We're here actually to resolve those and make those grow. So and one other thing. I don't think planets do things.
I think people do things. So if you read something like today is going to be a very difficult day because of this planetary configuration, I advise people get into their Maverick spirit, let it go and take charge and create the day you want. Don't the planets are going to make your day a certain way. Makes sense?
Yes, So it's not like a predetermined like if you're a cancer, this is how you're going to be here. So I like that we have a little bit more wiggle room just before I'm going to interrupt you, or actually I'm going to stop it from interrupting me.
One more question about the charts.
I've heard people say how I'm getting my chart done. In my head, I imagine like all these pages of all this stuff, what is it just really simply what does a birth chart or an astrological chart look like?
It can be one page, So we take the time, date and place of birth. Now the computer calculates the positions of the planets. But I have silver hair, you know, I started doing this before we have the computer programs that would do that, and I would have to do all the math myself, which would take hours and hours.
Wow.
But it's one page. It's a wheel with the planets on it that are showing you that imprint from the planets at the day of birth. But you know, when you do an astrological consultation, I don't do readings. I do consultations. And there's a difference. Oh, then I will have three pages of information in front of me from which I am interpreting and helping the client.
Such a key distinction.
You're not a reader, You're a consultant.
That is absolutely.
Key because I think in this day and age of dime store magicians everywhere, right that the word reading is always like, oh, I'm going to get psychic reading with strologies really means in this space we feel it's a science. Right, So there is like you mentioned, doing maths for hours on end, there is a science to this. So consultation and bringing it back to what you said earlier, where
it's a lot more than just your personality profile. It's also a way to dive into your challenges and your conflicts and what you need to look at to improve yourself and having a consultation to help you guide through that.
That's a huge distinction. So I'm glad that you brought that up.
Yeah, it is a huge distinction, because a consultation is a conversation, right, we get to interact and it's a jam session. Also, I like to say that every consultation I do is a jam session because you cannot look at a horoscope and know how a person is living that chart. And if anybody tells you so, like they look at your chart and say you will never have children or you are this way, they are doing you a big disservice because we don't know how you are
living those energies. Two people could have the same chart and live them on opposite ends of the spectrum, and that's a profound thought, right, it get to decide, and you know, two people may have the same chart, but they're not the same souls. They don't have the same soul history, and they have free will as to how they express.
It, and that kind of explains a lot when people say, well, we have to say birthdays, How are we completely different? So there's a lot more to it than just your planetary.
Profile, I guess, lack of a better word.
Yeah, well, but it does seem like there is a lot to the planetary profile. And I've heard of like your sun sign, and I know there's different types of signs, but I am not well versed in astrology at all, So what is this? Is there a moon sign, and if so, how is that different than the sun sign? Like, can you explain that a little bit?
Yeah? In this is why you want to steer away from the sun signed forecasts in the newspaper, because they're only taking one little, tiny part. There are ten planets that we consider, and we consider the Moon a planet, even though it's not a planet. We know that, but we call it that. And each one of the planets has a specific need profile. So your mercury in your chart, for example, the sign in which you find mercury suggests how you need to communicate, how you need to think,
how you need to process information. Venus will show how you need to connect with people, how you need to be social. So the sign describes those needs Mars shows how you need to take action, what motivates you. So I'm looking at the need profile of the person. In fact, recently I gave a big webinar through Astrology University one of the venues where I teach advanced astrology, and the topic was mindfully interpreting children's charts. And I do a
lot of children's charts. But I think it would be a horrible thing if you had a consultation from an astrologer to help you understand your children, and that astrologer told you exactly only the personality of the child, Because what you really want is that comparison, what is your need profile as a parent, and how is it alike or different from the need profile of your child, Because what you want to do is a parent, is to understand that child so that you can raise them and adjust,
you know, to what their need profile is. For example, if you have a very very macho, assertive father who is sports oriented, you know, and and is competitive, and maybe that father has a son who is very gentle, who isn't competitive, who may not speak up it assertively in the same way, maybe artistic, may be spiritual, maybe musical, who knows, you know, the father has to understand the need profile of the son. And that's just one example.
Yeah, so it's great because then those types of consultations you get a takeaway. It's not just here's what your personality is. Well, I already knew that, so it's just confirmation. So this way you're able to have a takeaway as a parent so that you can now help raise your child in the right way.
That's a we're going to talk sounds like a roadmap sort of sort of. I mean, would you say the roadmap.
It's a life purpose. It helps to understand life purpose. Okay, and life purpose is not your life purpose is to start a school. Your life purpose is to be a doctor. Life purpose is what are you here to heal, resolve, or learn, you know, as a soul, So it's more inward. If your life purpose is to learn you are indeed lovable and you don't need to earn love. You don't need to please people in order to feel lovable. That's a valid life purpose and that shows up in the chart.
People who have been told you're only going to get love if you act a certain way, You're only going to get love if you do me a favor You're only going to get approval if you buy me a gift. You know, then there can be a very deep life
purpose issue of learning I'm inherently lovable. I deserve love simply because I am breathing, And that could be very much part of the life purpose for or a soul who has certain signatures to learn that, and that may be coming from other lifetimes or early childhood issues where love was contingent on or dependent on certain behaviors, you know. So we're looking at it differently because I'm a humanistic, therapeutic modern astrologer, not a fatalistic, rigid approach, which is all around us.
Actually, oh yeah, so you get you get your chart and you have all of these different takeaways on different traits that you have. I'm thinking, like, just I cook a lot, and so it brings to mind a recipe. So you have the recipe, and depending on how you interpret the recipe, you know, you might use more sugar than that guy. So you can have the same recipe, but depending on what you do your work, you can have totally different flavors.
Case in point, she follows a recipe, I follow the same recipe and it's a completely different.
Dishes is a guideline, and that's why one of those intuitive cooks where you know, and that's how I approach astrology. So rather than following rigid rules, and I'm throwing things in and modifying it. And again, would you like for someone to tell you your personality? I wouldn't. I wouldn't. I tend to rebel against that and say, I get
to choose my personality. You can tell me my need profiles, you can tell me my you know, the potential life purpose issues, but don't lock me in, don't categorize me or pigeonhole me. And that's what a lot of astrology used unwisely will do. Will pigeonhole you.
And that makes so much sense because our daughter, I don't think she is like her.
She's Scorpio sun science scorpio.
Sun sign Scorpio right, So that's you know, from my understand I don't, like I said, I'm not well versed in astrology, but a very kind of hard personality can be vengeful, fiteful, and she's not like that. She's a gentle soul, beautiful.
Now as a lifelong Gemini.
Though I do like it when people tell me in my personality because I haven't figured it out yet, so it's always nice to know, uh.
What it is every day I suppose I take every day.
Yes, let's go back to address what you said about Scorpio. I think it's a shame that what often happens is you hear about the shadow side. So if you think about the spectrum of expression and that you can tip it positively to the highest version of that energy, or you can express the shadow and we get a face all of those and we do have choice. Yeah, the shadow side of Scorpio can be vengeful, can be grudge holding,
can be intense, can be secretive. But the positive side of Scorpio, which is my sign, so I'm going to defend it, yes, can be profound and a secret of mysteries can be Somebody who needs a mission to accomplish, can be somebody who needs to point passionate emotional energy in a certain direction. Can be phenomenally loyal. But Scorpio needs a mission to accomplish, needs to have focused and there are all kinds of other layers that need to happen there too.
I like that. I mean, that's that's just how she is. You tell her to do something, you and she'll get it done. But if you don't give her that mission, she's all over the place.
But back to Kathy's point, where now knowing that now we can help her because then we can always give her a mission to accomplish it in order to move forward in her life.
And that's a wonderful tool to have.
And they'll keep us from getting frustrated when she doesn't just automatically do things that we would expect her to do.
Right. Yeah, But as a Scorpio, it's a fixed sign. So when I teach beginning astrology, which I will be doing at the AAR in September, we're going to be teaching that beginning Astrology course, I'm going to be talking about the fact that the fixed signs, which are Taurus, Leo, Scorpio Aquarius, have as part of their life purpose the need to learn how to re lease control because fixed signs. Now, I don't know for your daughter how many planets she
has in that particular modality. You know, she may have a son in Scorpio and then the rest of her planets are in a completely different modality. But if you have a horoscope that has a lot of planets in
the fixed modality. One of the life purpose issues is to learn the correct use of will, because will can be focused in a way where you are trying to force things to happen, make things happen, where you're rigidly attached to outcomes, where you're afraid if you don't have control, and the fixed signs like your Scorpio daughter, part of her mission is to learn use the focus, but then release and surrender and let it flow. Not be so attached that you are forcing or making things happen.
Right, I think we need to talk offline because I think we need a consultation.
I think we do.
I mean just that alone. It helps me.
Anyway, really put a lot of things into perspectives, things I've noticed in our daughter and how to move that forward. That's it's been incredibly helpful. And I don't even know how many planets she has in Scorpio.
This sounds very complicated.
It is very comple is but see when I do a consultation, I don't use jargon. So you know, if you don't know anything about astrology and you get a consult or a reading where somebody is saying planet sign house aspect, planet sign house aspect, your moon is in Taurres, your son is in Scorpio. You have these square to this planet, your that planet. You're just going to zone out and go, what the heck this?
I use different thing in different terms, but yes that's correct.
Yes, so I don't use jargon in a consultation or maybe just a tiny bit, but the need of a Gemini. Gemini is much more flexible again depending on the whole chart, much more mutable, much more changeable. And Scorpio the fixed sign. You have to approach change more carefully. If somebody forces change on me before I'm ready, I'm going to push back. But a Gemini is like change, Okay, good, Yes, I do love change.
You do.
So I'm cancer, So how does cancer feel about change?
Oh?
Oh I got a face.
No, I'm trouble cancer in a Gemini. And again this is why you can't go only on sun sign. You have to look at the end. You have to what I'm doing when I'm doing a consultation is I'm synthesizing hundreds of bits of data into statements. So you're putting it all together magically, which is it's an art form really, but cancer cancer is a water sign and it's a cardinal modality. So there's a lot of restlessness and movement.
But cancer needs to nurture, needs to care. Cancer is coming from an emotional place like scorpios coming from an emotional base. Gemini is coming from an air sign, which is intellectual information oriented. Let's talk it through, let's think about it, let's gather more information. You know. So cancer is oriented to wanting emotional security.
So yeah, nailed it.
So you said in your consultations you don't use a lot of jargon, but there is a term that I have been hearing a lot lately and it inspires fear that I don't know why.
In fact, we're about to here shortly, right.
Yes, mercury retrograde.
What does that mean? I have?
Okay, as soon as we had social media and we had free marketing for astrologers. See I started my practice back in nineteen eighty three, when the only marketing I had was word of mouth or collect the addresses, send out a newsletter by snail mail. Yeah, but then social media came along and tappity tappity tap, You're able to post whatever you want post and share it and have free marketing. And what happened astrologers sees a marketing moment
to scare people to create fear, which sells. Mercury retrograde is a cycle that happens four times a year for three weeks at a time. Okay, so mercury looks like it's going backward by degree and sign, it's not really, it's the it's how it looks from Earth's perspective. But the bottom line, you will read all over the place on social media, mercury retrograde means there will be delays, there will be problems with technology. You can just expect it. And I've been on a campaign for the last twenty
years to try to correct that. So I have a meme I put out that says my advice for mercury retrograde. Release your fear of mercury retrograde. It's a very productive cycle. It just makes information. It's a little bit more internalized during mercury retrograde. It's a time to check your data. It's a time to negotiate, organize, get things clear. It is nothing to be afraid of unless you believe it. So this is where the self fulfilling prophecy comes in.
If you have been trained to believe mercury retrograde means your computer is going to break. If you've been trained to believe mercury retrograde means if you're taking a flight, your flight will be delayed. It probably will because you will get to be right. Because self fulfilling prophecy is be mindful what you tell yourself because you get to be right. I believe mercury retrograde is wonderful. You do have to learn to be flexible during a retrograde mercury.
If you're traveling during retrograde mercury, I say, pack your flexibility, take it along with you on the trip, and just flow because things always work out. So I'd like to correct that your very reaction what you have been programmed to believe on mercury retrograde. But guess what, it's a marketing moment. It works.
Because everybody says that. I mean even me. I'm like, oh, it's bad. I don't know what it is.
You have told your subconscious it's going to be bad, and your subconscious goes, Okay, you get to be right about.
That, right right.
But not to downplay there are it does have every every phase does have some effect on someone. It's just how you decide to to react to it. Like, for example, for me, I've noticed over time that during Murcury retrograde, I have a more difficult time expressing my thoughts in a coherent way.
I turned into a blithering idiot. So during those times.
During Mercury retrograde, I know, okay, I'm not going to get into any debates. I'm not going to get into any intellectual conversations where I need to show my strengths, which is my.
Mental capacities.
I'm just gonna take a break and just allow this energies to pass through, and then once Mercury leads a retrogate phase, I can go back to my fierce debating skills and things like that.
Right now, is that mental as well? Or is that does it actually have an effect?
Okay, so three things I hope I can remember all three that I want to comment about. This number one, when we receive a cycle like this, we are receiving the frequencies from the planets. So yes, you know, during a Mercury retrograde or a specific transit that might be happening in your chart, you're actually receiving the frequencies of that planet with Mercury's communication, energy and data and all that.
And as a Gemini, your ruling planet is mercury. So yeah, it could be that you react or respond powerfully to mercury retrogrades. However, I would issue you a challenge. Okay, are you reacting that way because you've been told mercury retrograde's coming up and you've experienced it in the past, Therefore you believe it will happen again. What if I gave you misinformation and I told you mercury retrograde was at a different time when it's really not happening. Would
that happen because you expect it? I mean, this is a very real and profound and deep thing to think about, right, What if you were never told mercury might do that? What if you weren't told the cycle was happening, would you still experience it?
It's interesting because for me it seemed to be a pattern, and then when I was told, oh, it's because mercury retrograde, I went, aha, Now it could be that I grabbed onto it, but maybe it's not.
I don't got it to your point. I'm not sure.
I don't think it's really effective me because I had no idea what it was. All of a sudden, I'm like, oh, something bad was happening that one. But I like what you said about it being a time of productivity, and I'm thinking, okay, So maybe you see turmoil in your business, like all this stuff is happening and you think, oh, marcuar retrograde. But it's showing you the things that need to be changed, so you're like, Okay, this is happening. This has happening, so I need to make these changes.
So it's a difficult time, but actually with the result of that is going to be something that's going to make your business run better exactly.
And the other thing is if the degrees and sign in which mercury is retrograde hits planets in your chart, If you have planets at those same degrees and signs, then you get extra productivity. This one that's coming up in a few days, mercury will begin to retrograde at four degrees virgo and retrograde back into LEO, and then
it'll go direct at twenty one leo. So people with planets between twenty one leo and four virgo are going to receive this transit directly to their chart and have a period of time that can be extra productive with extra insights, with extra clarity, unless they believe everything just falls apart during mercury retrograde, so I might as well surrender.
You know. It's this consciousness of blame the planets, and I rebel against that with every fiber of my being, because if astrology affects my life so that I don't get to choose my state of mind, I'm not going to engage with it. I get to choose how I respond. I get to choose my reaction. If astrology takes away that choice, I don't it's not worthy of even engaging in that.
I like that. That's such a different take on it, and that, for some reason reminded me of it. Was it was it Nancy Reagan who had an astrologer that supposed she wouldn't do anything like she met with this astrologer.
Every day or every week or something.
Do that currently?
Well, that's true, but.
I think so then in that and her case or someone like that's case, would they be just going by the sun sign?
The more predictive, it's very complicated. That's called electional astrology. Electional astrologies when you elect a time to do something, and it's a very big part of astrology. It's not my favorite part of my art form here because there are a lot of astrologers who won't leave the house unless the planets are in the right position. They won't send an email unless the moon is doing something positive. And I never do that.
I had.
I had to have hip surgery a few months ago to fix the first hip replacement. Many people are having to have this done. It's called a hip revision. And you know, there were a lot of astrologers who said, oh, do not have surgery. This year's planets are bad. You will have a problem. And I said, no, I won't because I'm going to bless my surgery and I'm going to have all my friends send good energy for the
surgery and it has to happen. And I didn't even look at the chart for the day I planned surgery. And I'm an astrologery, this is my field. I went, it's all clear. My intuition tells me it's fine. I'm in the flow. It's working perfectly, and the surgery was perfect. So there is something to say about honoring your instinct, honoring your connection with the divine and if something is in the flow, you don't have to look at the planets. If you have the green light inside you that says
go do it. You're in the flow. Please do it. Because as soon as you stop to measure, you take out that little you know, measuring stick in astrology, you calculate all the degrees you know. Then you're living by measurement and you step out a flow. Yeah right, wow.
So that astrology can be used as either a way to open your horizons or if it's not used correctly, it can be very limiting.
Yes, So when I do a consultation, what I'm talking about is here the life purpose is life purpose issues suggested by your natal chart. And then here are the cycles, the developmental waves of energy happening now, and we calculate those in various ways. One way is transits, which are where the planets are now and how they compare to your chart. Another is a technical term called solar arcs,
which is developmental movement of the planets. But the bottom line is my job is to educate the client on the kinds of energyes, the kinds of frequencies, and the timing of those energies in their developmental waves. So that they can use it better and make better choices. It's very different if you go through a Saturn transit versus a Uranus transit. Saturn is heavier, It requires commitment and hard work, and you know, not giving up Uranus is
delightfully adventurous and requires change. So my job is to communicate that and to find out what's currently going on in the person's life, and then to advance that strategically by looking at the planetary patterns.
Makes sense, It makes perfect sense, Kathy.
I could literally sit here and talk to you for hours, because this is fascinating and it sounds like we're going to have a chance because you're coming to the eggrocacyari here in September.
Tell us a little bit about that. What are you doing here? When are you doing it? That kind of thing.
Teaching a beginner's course is always quite challenging because of the very thing you said, which is an overwhelming amount of information. But early September, there's going to be a Friday section, a Friday evening section, and then all day Saturday and the half day Sunday, and I'm going to teach people how to understand the building blocks in astrology, how to look at their own horoscope and start to
get a sense of how they can apply it. You know, you can't teach everything in that timeframe, but people are going to walk away understanding the frequencies of the signs, the frequencies of the planets, the need profile that goes with that, and they're going to be able to apply it to their own chart to start getting a basis. And it is so much more powerful to learn it that way than to do astrology by Google search. Absolutely,
my moon is in Taurus. What does that mean? And then google, well, it's like my daughter's son is Scorpio. What does that mean? It means she's vengeful, it means she's secretive. Oh that's I can't even begin to tell you how frustrated I get with that kind of information
because it is one dimensional. It's shallow, it's negative, it's limiting, it's you know, so I try to teach the whole spectrum and this concept of choice and this concept of take this frequency, take this energetic imprint you have, live it to the highest level and resolve the tension that maybe in your chart, and grow and develop and learn.
That sounds like a great course and you've taught us so much in this little amount of time that we've had with you today. So if someone can't wait till some time, how would be the best way for them to reach out and get in touch with you?
They can contact me by email Rosstrology at yatoo yahoo dot com. Although right now my consultation schedule is almost full for twenty four and I'm going to be booking for twenty five soon. Wow, So to get on it. Yeah, so there's a weight period, you know. But I've been doing this for forty two years and now finally I'm at the place where I've got a big client base internationally.
I'm literally in a day to day basis. We'll talk to people all over the world, I hop, you know, through the world, and it's it's so much fun talk to Australia one hour, and then the next hour you're talking to somebody in Scotland, then after that in Brazil. That's wonderfully fun.
Yeah, I can only imagine.
Well, Kathy, thank you so much for spending your time with us today. We've learned, like Karen said, a lot, Kathy, thank you so much for coming on the show with us today.
It was very nice to meet you guys. Likewise, likewise, thanks a lot for the great conversation.
Oh yes, thank you, thank you, and a huge thank you to you.
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