Five Theatre Girls: How Five "Normal" Women Took to the National Theatre's Largest Stage

Five Theatre Girls: How Five "Normal" Women Took to the National Theatre's Largest Stage

[00:00:00] Kristin: Hello and welcome to the Second Chapter Podcast. I'm your host, Kristin Duffy, and I am full of cold, as I think you can hear. It is that wonderful time of year when, I don't know, I tend to get a cough or a cold that lasts an unbelievable amount of time. Fortunately, this episode was recorded before that, so you won't have to listen to it the whole time, but I thought I should explain why my voice sounds so gorgeous.

[00:00:24] Enough about me. For this week's episode, I had the pleasure of speaking with five women from Doncaster. They're now calling themselves the Five Theater Girls. They were part of the Odyssey, the underworld at the National Theater of Great Britain, which was a culmination of a project that has brought amazing change to all of their lives after 35.

[00:00:43] The Odyssey was the National Theatre's nationwide multi venue production to celebrate the fifth anniversary of Public Acts, which is the National's national program to create extraordinary acts of theatre and community. I read about this project and I was so amazed. There was a quote from one of the women in the article I read and I just thought, I need to hear more about their story.

[00:01:06] So, basically the production was told over five parts. The Odyssey, the production was told over five parts with each episode of Odysseus's journey created and performed by local artists and communities from four partner organizations. And I'm mentioning all this because the women talk about it quite a bit.

[00:01:22] Like you all know what they're talking about. Um, you might not. So basically these five women from Doncaster all took part in the public Acts program through its partnership with Caste Theater and Doncaster and their work with local community groups.

[00:01:36] You'll hear them speak quite a bit about the Don Cast Chalk Circle, which was presented in Doncaster in partnership with cast theater in August, 2022. The 14th and 15th of April this year, the second episode of The Odyssey, The Cyclops, took place in Caste in Doncaster. And then in August, the fifth and final episode, The Odyssey, The Underworld, brought together 160 people from across the nation.

[00:02:01] Onto the Olivier stage, which is the largest at the National Theatre. Now for people who aren't from Great Britain, I just have to say that the National Theatre is, , it's such a treasure. Um, the idea of appearing as an actor on stage at the National is. For me, it's a dream beyond even the West End.

[00:02:21] So the fact that these women got the chance to do it blew my mind. I had to hear more because they are not professional actors by trade. So this is why the change was so major. The company that performed the final episode of the odyssey, the fifth and final episode of the odyssey, the underworld was six professional actors, musicians, and performance groups, 68 freelance artists working across the nation, as well as community members, including these wonderful women, what these women got from this project was Not only the chance to appear on this major stage, but friendships that they cannot stop speaking about during this episode.

[00:03:01] And I think their story is really amazing. So I hope you enjoy.

[00:03:05] Sharon: we're like, wow, we're going to do a play and a really amazing play. And other places all over the country are doing their episodes of this play.

[00:03:13] And then we're all going to come together and do something remarkable. And I think that faith that Public Acts had in us started to make us realize that actually we should have a bit of faith in ourselves too.

[00:03:23] Kristin: Welcome all of you to the second chapteR podcast. I'm really excited to speak with you. First of all I've said a little bit in the intro about what Public Acts is and what you've all been up to, but I would love to go around and first have you introduce yourselves and we'll talk a little bit about how you got involved. Sandra, nice to meet you. Can you tell me, just say hello, really, so we can recognize your voice.

[00:03:43] Sandra: Hello. I'm Sandra. I am probably one of the oldest members of the team. I'm 80 next year and CAST has made it special to me.

[00:03:54] Kristin: wElcome Sandra. Ruth, can you introduce yourself to everyone.

[00:03:57] Ruth: Hi I'm Ruth Christopher and what can I say? I just happen to be at the right place at the right time when public arts found me.

[00:04:06] Kristin: Sharon, can you just say hello to everyone so we recognize your voice?

[00:04:10] Sharon: Hi, I'm Sharon. .

[00:04:12] changing lives and that's how I became involved in public act, supporting the women that I work with, but then just got completely hooked. And now the theatre's just become a massive part of my life.

[00:04:23] Kristin: Kristin, can we go back to you, please?

[00:04:27] Christine: Hello, my name's Kristin.

[00:04:29] Kristin: And you're a retired nurse.

[00:04:30] Christine: I am a retired nurse, yeah. living in Doncaster now, so nice to be here.

[00:04:34]

[00:04:34] Kristin: Nice to meet you, Kristin. It's nice to have you on the podcast.

[00:04:38] Christine: Thank you.

[00:04:39] Kristin: Sally.

[00:04:39] Sally: Yeah, I'm Sally originally I was a nursery nurse for about 25 years, and then I was working with the homeless for another 12 years, and now I'm a volunteer at our church, lots of things for the community, and at the Doncaster Arts, a place called The Point, where I met [00:05:00] James Blakey.

[00:05:02] Kristin: I would love to go back to you, Sandra, tell me a little bit about public acts, first of all.

[00:05:08] Sandra: First of all, I became a widow three years ago and anybody at my age, you think you're going to be pensioner, staying at home. And then I was introduced to the cast team at a meeting. And this has altered my life 100%. I have been. On a stage which I never thought I would be able to do. The challenges have been hard sometimes.

[00:05:38] Memory, learning to dance again. But the team and the relationship and the family that I have now got has been something I will never ever forget. ever forget. It's been a dream, and these girls that are with us now, they are like my extended family. And as a retired nurse, I like people, but this has been something.

[00:06:03] This has been something. I'd like to tell the people who are pensioners that don't sit at home. If you can get out, there are things in Doncaster that we people can do. I've been made to feel a 16 year old again, as I say, I know you asked for a quote, and there is a quote from the Doncaster Chalk Circle, which I was so proud to be involved with, and the last line says no force on earth can stop me.

[00:06:31] I kick off my shoes and feel the earth beneath my feet. That's like me. I've kicked off my shoes and it's the stage I've felt between my feet and the warmth when you have an applaud and a standing ovation. You've got to do it to be able to feel that. And these girls have stood by me, they've helped me.

[00:06:52] I used to think, oh you're too old to do this, but you're never to do old. If you want to do it, you go out and do it. Go out and do it. I'm 18 next year and I'm hoping to be in another show, and the show after if they love me.

[00:07:06] Kristin: I'm sure they will. It sounds like the family is tight.

[00:07:10] Sandra: Very tight.

[00:07:11] Kristin: Christine, you are also a retired nurse. So I'm interested because I feel like a lot of people I talked to started out as nurses. This might've been your calling, but do you feel like maybe you found a second calling .

[00:07:23] Christine: During the latter part of my nursing career, which was all in London I went to a sort of amateur dramatics group and did a little bit of acting and what have you in small sort of stages and theatres above pubs in London and that kind of thing. And then I retired on lockdown day, funnily enough that's about, what, in 2020.

[00:07:44] I moved up to Doncaster because I'm much closer to my mum here, but so it's very different from London. So I moved up to a city that I didn't know very well. and tried to make a life for myself during COVID. So it was extremely difficult uh, until I saw on the internet an advert for.

[00:08:01] It was a group on a Friday afternoon at The Point, which is where Sally was saying that she was working creative direction. So I started to go to this group and it was just a group of people who were acting together and up at The Point, which is not far from where we are at Cass Theatre now.

[00:08:17] And from then on we met James Blakey and he encouraged us to try out for the new play, which was the Doncaster Chalk Circle. And it's gone from there really. To say that I've acted in small fringe theaters in London and what have you, and then I come up to Doncaster and CAST in Doncaster, gives me the chance to be on the Olivier stage in London.

[00:08:38] I mean , it's strange. It was really weird. Really strange. So I go back down to London, everybody's saying, oh, it's great to see you back. You're on the Olivier stage. And I said yeah. It's amazing. I come all the way to Doncaster to get that opportunity, so it's been a bit of a dream for me.

[00:08:53] Kristin: Maybe I need to move because I'm an actor myself and I have to say the dream, of course, is to be at the National Theatre

[00:09:00] Christine: it was weird. It was really weird. And another thing is that we've worked with professional actors during the Don Castro in Chalk Circle and during Cyclops and the Underworld. And one of the actors came to see our play, The Underworld in London, and she was in Don Castro in Chalk Circle with us.

[00:09:18] And she said to me afterwards, she said to me, the thing is, Kristin, you're there as a sort of an amateur actor at the moment with. Everybody else, everybody knows. And she said, you have been on the stage that I will never ever get on. And I said I said, you can't say that you never know. And she said, no, she said, not many people get on the Olivier stage.

[00:09:38] She said, and I'm a professional actor and I know that I will never ever get on there. So it just, it's a bit mind blowing really.

[00:09:44] Kristin: I like to think never say never.

[00:09:46] Christine: Oh I never say never. Yeah. I never even thought about it and I was on it. So yeah you just got to throw caution to the wind and go for it, but it's made a big difference to my life and it's.

[00:09:55] It's filled a huge void, not nursing anymore. [00:10:00] Now I'm fine now. I don't, to be honest with you, I don't miss nursing now. I'm quite happy with what I do now. I'm very happy to be retired. But it's just bizarre that you come to a city a long way from London and then get invited back to London.

[00:10:13] Kristin: RUth, I would like to know a little bit more about how you became involved with all of this.

[00:10:18] Ruth: Yeah I can say a bit about myself about how I I get involved with National Theatre. I was lost on the earth and from nowhere National Theatre just came to use Changing Lives and Sharon just said to me if I would like to stay after I walk, you understand, then at that time.

[00:10:37] I just feel like at that time in my personal life, , my life was just falling apart again at that time. Then I said to myself, why don't you stay after work? Because when you go back home now, your pillow will be soaked of tears.

[00:10:52] That's what I said to myself, even though I didn't tell Sharon. But she said, oh, the girls can, the girls is welcome, not just you. I said, oh, really? So this is how it all started. I don't know what I'm into, but for the fact that I don't get home after work, then jump on my bed and cry all my eye out, then the pillow is soaked.

[00:11:11] But I was like, yeah, I'll stay behind then. And this is when it all began.

[00:11:17] Kristin: It's very personal, but can I ask you what was going on that was making you feel like your life was falling apart?

[00:11:22] Ruth: yeah, when I fled from my... I lived in London for 20 years before I never knew domestic abuse. I didn't know what that word is, I didn't know what it means. But for the fact that I never grew up with a mother or father. So in my head is, I'm going to have my own little family one day.

[00:11:41] So my ex has really been abusive towards me. So I thought it's normal thing in every relationship. You just have to keep bearing it. So when I found myself in Sheffield, from Sheffield to Doncaster. So after then, I never go into any relationship. I was like, okay, I'm going to give it a go.

[00:11:59] So it happened at that time that the one that I gave it a go, even though I was so scared, so at that time my house become like a place that I, when I finish work, I'm scared to go back home. Because when I go back home, I just... Cry and say, why is this happening to me again?

[00:12:15] And I just look at myself. Who am I? Am I a bad person? Why is he? Why is it? What is it with me? Why people always say you are good. You are nice, but why can't. This is why? This is all that was in my mind. Then, so this was what I was going through when the national theater came, get in touch with Sharon, which I dunno, Sharon just said, oh, there is this going on.

[00:12:41] But for the father after work, the girls can come, and this is why I said to myself, what's the point of going home? And just cry and cry and in the morning just have the painkiller and come to work and pretend as if all is good. Yeah, this is all when it started, and when I get back home the first day, I slept like a newborn baby.

[00:13:01] I didn't cry. Because... The bit that we were doing, the movement, this is all we were singing then in my head when I get to bed I just said, oh this is different, I'm gonna stay next week. Like Sandra said, sometimes there's a bit of challenge because I know during Chalk Circle, I had COVID twice, so that's another barrier at that time too, but still, I didn't give up. And when I came back, the welcome from Annabelle, James, and all the ladies in in center was really just make me go, it's really, I miss all this, I miss all this, I miss all this.

[00:13:40] reached the limits. When I get involved with it changing life, but when I national tier now come in, so it's like the level just go is I just keep growing. This is how I see myself now that I just keep growing in confidence and empower me.

[00:13:58] Things that I could do before, things that I couldn't say before because I'm always full of you. You can do it.

[00:14:06] Kristin: And Sandra mentioned the same, that. It was unexpected, such an unexpected change to, to now be able to do something like this, that you completely didn't expect.

[00:14:16] Ruth: I can't believe myself. When Sandra was talking, it's yes, that's true. It's dreams come true. People often say dreams come true. Not when you win a lottery.

[00:14:28] The joy that this has brought into my life and the life of my children, the way I look at people, the way I see people now, so it's not just the acting, the fun, the joy that you get, the happiness that you get. Even with my,

[00:14:46]

[00:14:46] when I stand or when I sit down with my body structures now, it's totally different.

[00:14:52] Kristin: The movement and the learning that you've gone through, I'm sure is amazing. I'm going to jump to Sally because I want to hear a little bit about how Sally came [00:15:00] to this and I want to hear because you mentioned James Blakely first. So if you could talk a little bit about James Blakey as well.

[00:15:07] Sally: Oh, wow. Was working as, and I still do work at The Points for a group called Creative Directions, which is aimed for people that are socially isolated or have some learning difficulty, perhaps, or emotional problems quite a few mental issues, and it's always, just always been a lovely, beautiful group where people completely accepted.

[00:15:32] It's not about what it's, it is an art group, but it's not about achieving it. It was about just having a go at something that you've never done before. And so we had, good numbers. And then we We were told that if we were interested, we could come along to the drama group on a Friday.

[00:15:52] And being the volunteer, they said, would you mind being the volunteer? So I said, yeah, no problem. So I made tea, brought bits and pieces up, helped anybody that needed anything, that kind of thing. And then as the week He said, Oh no, we need more people for this bit, join in. And I absolutely loved it.

[00:16:12] I believe how much I enjoyed it. And you know it was the first time in my miserable life that I actually felt a real joy.

[00:16:24] I had no idea how much I needed to do something like that. It also has been a little niggle in the back of my mind. Where I'd work before, people used to say, you should do that, Sally. You'd be really good. You'd be good at acting. You should try it now. No, I don't think so.

[00:16:40] And I did, and he went round everybody and had a word then he just said, would you be interested in... I was like, I actually really would. And I tend not to, even though I'm quite an outgoing person, I don't volunteer for things quickly. I tend to hand back and just see to make sure that I'll be competent but I had no hesitation whatsoever.

[00:17:04] Best thing I've done for myself. years and it came at a time that was just right for where I was in my recovery. God is good. For once in my life, the ducks were all in a row. And and it was just such an incredible young man. He astounded us

[00:17:25] Kristin: Remember that people who are listening don't know about James Blakey. So tell me a little bit about him

[00:17:30] Sally: Yeah he's a director from the National Theatre. Now he's got, maybe one of the other girls can help me out here, but he's got a specific title within the National Theatre, and I don't know, like an associate director or something like that. .

[00:17:46] As far as I could see at that point, it was his baby. I thought it was, that he'd orchestrated this and piloted this idea and then I realized then what a scale of a project it was

[00:18:02] how did he have that vision of thinking you could get so many people literally from all walks of life with everyone, a lot of people with challenges, me included. I discovered so much about myself. that I'm, I don't think I ever would have discovered to be honest, but he had that ability to draw you out.

[00:18:24] We first did the magic of, no, we did that We Begin Again, which was like a podcast song and there was a professional artist singing on that beautiful song. So we did that because it was in lockdown and then we

[00:18:37] A production with James. So he was our main director for that. And it was called The Magic of Wild Heather.

[00:18:45] So that was our first sort of performance together. It went down really well. And then we did Chalk Circle. And it was absolutely a fantastic experience. In the church we use a phrase, when you have a burden for something, that means say, I'd say, I've got a burden to help.

[00:19:04] Migrants. I've got a burden to help the older people. He seemed to have a burden that he was good to get, didn't matter who you were. He would draw out the best of you, so

[00:19:15] you could appreciate that. And that is such a gift, and it is a gift that he kept giving, and he kept giving. And he kept giving, from my observations as a,

[00:19:28] No experience at all about this kind of work. I was like why has he asked me to do that? Why has he asked that person to do it? It's not going to work. I can't see it work. It was so wrong. He nailed everybody's character to the part that they played., you hear all sorts of, talk about directors, but this gentleman, I thought, Oh gosh, it's the same age as one of my sons. And I'm proud of my [00:20:00] sons and I felt that same, wow, what it was achieving and how he was doing the work with so many of us.

[00:20:08] That was some production it's taught me so much about myself. It's opened me eyes. And this has given me an opportunity to find out another reality for me that I didn't think I would discover. Three or four years ago, there's no way I would have been able to take this on.

[00:20:27] No way. I was still struggled with life, although I'd got a good recovery in regards that I'm a recovered alcoholic. And I say recovered because I've recovered from a helpless state of mind and body. I'll always be an alcoholic. And I had long periods of sobriety.

[00:20:49] But this time round, did the work again, got my program back in my life and it was totally different. I'd been a terrible insomniac from being a little girl before anything bad, my parents dying and lots of life stuff.

[00:21:05] I could never sleep. I'd have four or five nights without any sleep, anyway, long story short, so that was, so I'd got this new recovery. I slept every night from the first day that I did this particular work, and I've slept every night since.

[00:21:22] That's nearly three years now.

[00:21:23] Kristin: Ruth said the same thing to go home for the first time and actually just, have that kind of peace of soul that you could sleep. I think that's really saying something. Peace of mind. Yeah. Peace of mind to be able to sleep and probably also, from my own experience, a little bit of exhaustion of body and mind after a hard day of rehearsals and bringing out.

[00:21:44] All the things that happen in a rehearsal movement and emotion and joy and all of it that, that, sometimes I think a good night's sleep just after a few hours of good hard work in a theater is definitely something. Sharon, I want to ask you, because I know you were working on Public Acts, you weren't meant to be, you just all of a sudden were part of it.

[00:22:04] Sharon: I was first approached by Public Acts to do workshops in Changing Lives but we didn't have any capacity to do that in our working day. so my role is Senior BME Worker and I was Senior Child Care Worker before that and I'm really quite guarded about the work we do in the fact that people often jump on the work that we do to as tick box exercises because they want to reach different members of the community and I spoke to James.

[00:22:29] Initially, and it was. Like, I'm really passionate about the work I do, and he sold it to me as Public Acts the initiative of building community and a theatre that's accessible for all, extraordinary acts of theatre and community, that absolutely sold me, I was like, that sounds really good.

[00:22:47] Spoke to Emily Blunt, who was talking about Radical Acts of Joy, and I'm like, this is sounding really quite amazing, but still didn't have much trust, but I'd worked up such a great relationship with Nick, the community partner from CAST, that my trust really was in her. So we started our workshops, and they went exceptionally well, and there were, it's, everything's quite challenging, so we just worked through them, and then we did DCC, which was absolutely remarkable, and...

[00:23:11] It doesn't surprise me that I enjoy being on stage, because I'm already confident. But what surprised me, what shocked me is my life's been quite challenging. I have a lot of care responsibilities, I've experienced some quite just trauma if I'm really honest. But being on the stage for DCC was the first time I could ever remember not having my phone turned on.

[00:23:30] So I wasn't accessible. There was nobody that could get hold of me. I wasn't able to be needed, which felt quite, Bizarre really, but also what's really good was the caring responsibilities I had. They were all so excited for me and other people in my family stepped up and said, no, you go and do this for yourself.

[00:23:48] We'll take care of that. I didn't expect that. I didn't expect everyone to just be joining this journey with me, all my family and friends. And that took me by surprise. And so the theater experience for me has been fantastic. I love the theater. It's been absolutely life changing, but it's my life that it's changed.

[00:24:05] It's given me the space to, to have some thoughts, to think about healing. I've carried things with me for 10 years and the friendships that I've made who haven't been on that journey with me. So I've had different perspectives and people that have actually validated my feelings and said different things than I've ever heard.

[00:24:21] It's okay to be an unapologetically you and that's absolutely precious and the girls, these, who we're with now, this is lifelong friends and the experiences, the theatre's fantastic. I love being on the stage. It's absolutely my home but the experience and the life changing events comes from these women

[00:24:41] Kristin: I think it's really interesting what you said, because I think as we get older, we don't expect to be making new friends. Maybe you expect someday I might need to be in a care home and there's going to be people there, or maybe you join some sort of, group, and I say this, as we go through life. So even when you get into your working career, [00:25:00] Oh, I might have work friends or, Oh, after work, what am I going to do? I'm not going to have, anyway, new friendship groups, I think are rare. The older we

[00:25:07] Sharon: I'm very different, Kristin, very different. When I'm, I've just turned 50, so you have all that life experience, so there's no time for any bullshit, like we've already done all that, so you just. Totally honest with each other, but really kind and respectful and it's just somebody can be honest to your face, but then really have your back.

[00:25:25] know that person can honestly say something to you, but if somebody else says something, you've got a gang. There's a gang of women, strong women, ready to get rid of that person you're not welcome here. 16.

[00:25:40] When we got on those dorms in London, oh my goodness, it was like we were teenagers and students running up and down the halls, filling kettles in our nighties, we actually got told could we be quiet and we actually got moved off the quiet coach at the train because we were being too noisy. It was just

[00:25:57] Kristin: hold on.

[00:25:58] Why were you in the quiet coach in the train to begin

[00:26:01] with? Because

[00:26:02] Sharon: Because

[00:26:02] yes, they booked the tickets and we do like to sing and record ourselves on the train and the station and in the tube and anywhere else, anywhere we can have a moment and sing. But, when your life changes after a certain age, you expect lots of changes when you're younger.

[00:26:17] It just, it fetches something really special that I think Sandra says, you cannot... speak about unless you experience it and it changes your life and absolutely for the better and you don't expect it and it hits you like a bus and you just have to really cling on and see where you're going to be taken but in my case it's been for some unbelievable healing and I've never been happier than I am right now and I'm still sad about all the loss and everything I've experienced but it's okay to be happy too.

[00:26:45] Kristin: I think that's an important thing too, because I talked podcast who have been through various degrees of trauma, various situations in their life. And I think that's something we do need to learn. And maybe I haven't heard it phrased quite that way before that, we will, you'll always be sad about things that have happened in your life, but finding something new like this and knowing that it's okay to coexist with happiness.

[00:27:12] Is something that maybe these life changes that I'm so passionate about, that I love to talk about on the podcast, maybe that's why they're so important because they teach us to coexist with everything we've experienced in our lives.

[00:27:25] Sharon: I

[00:27:25] it's finding peace and finding balance because nobody gets to 50 year old without carrying something with them. It doesn't matter what journey you're on, you're all on a journey with your own issues. And that's, it's just acceptance and I feel like specifically, I have never been in, because we were strangers.

[00:27:43] Not all of us, but we were strangers and these friendships are forever and there's nothing coming between us because we just get through it. There's no pettiness, we could have a full on row, all five of us screaming at each other and we'd still get over it the next day because our friendships are that important.

[00:27:58] So the theatre and the acting... It's phenomenal. It's the most amazing experience public house has been all over the country So it's a national initiative. And so we've met loads of new people, but you carry Doncaster with you. It's quite remarkable

[00:28:13] Kristin: I'm talking to five of you, but obviously it wasn't just the five of you, as you mentioned, it was all over the country and once the Odyssey came onto the national theater stage, it was 160 people on stage. Does anybody wanna speak to the feeling of standing on a stage with 160 people?

[00:28:29] That's outrageous

[00:28:32] Sandra: Standing on that stage and listening to that ovation with all these people around, we felt as one, and it was such a proud moment. And the friendship that developed, we were all like one big family. It was really unbelievable. I don't think any of us will experience that again.

[00:28:51] It was as you say, there was a lot of us, there were 150, not only just the actors, there was the stage hands, everybody that, that helped us in the background. It was such a wonderful experience, something that I shall always remember. How long, I don't know, but as I say for me. I shall never forget it.

[00:29:14] It's given me a new outlook.

[00:29:16] Kristin: Christine, I'll ask you because you mentioned doing other theater in a smaller way before do you ever feel any, I hate the word regret, but I'm going to use it anyway. Like you missed your calling at some point.

[00:29:30] Christine: My calling for acting or my calling

[00:29:33] Kristin: Yeah. You're calling for the stage. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:29:35] Christine: Oh, okay.

[00:29:36] Kristin: You wish it was something you had done earlier or do you feel like this was just the right time in your life?

[00:29:41] Christine: I was born and grew up in Lincolnshire, so just a little way from here not too far. And I remember as a teenager, I, all I wanted to do was. Being an actress, because actress was the word in those days and it never quite happened but I didn't pursue it too much because I knew coming from a small [00:30:00] town that it wasn't going to happen.

[00:30:02] There was no stage schools around where I was and, it was all watching people on television. It was all dreams, really. I went into nursing and went to London and I have no regrets about my nursing career whatsoever. 38 years an NHS nurse completely in London I loved every minute of it. But as far as acting's concerned, now that I've retired from the nursing and gone back to hopefully a lot more acting, I feel that I've got so much experience from my nursing that I carry into my acting. From people that I met in nursing patients and nurses and the way that they were, all sorts of different people, but also the way that nursing makes you feel the responsibilities that you have.

[00:30:51] The importance of of standards, the importance of respect, good communication. And my sort of mantra of fail to prepare, prepare to fail, which, and when you're in the NHS for all that time and you're doing it and doing your best, you think that you're doing that. And I personally, when we got down to London to be on the stage at the Olivier, , I couldn't understand how they could get it all right with 160 people, but they did.

[00:31:21] fail to prepare, prepare to fail, just was incredible there. Everything was thought of, every single concern that we might have had had been thought about. Every single person who was down there was helping us at every stage. And I just, it was just a phenomenal experience from the acting side of things, being at the the National Theatre.

[00:31:44] But no, I don't have any regrets about being a nurse and my second calling being acting, because I think if it had been the other way around who knows? It's very difficult to be a successful actor. Who knows whether I'd ever have made it or whatever the way I've done it. I now actually really enjoy it because I've got all that behind me and I am now retired and I can just do what I want when I want.

[00:32:07] I'd like to think that maybe somebody, instead of when they wrote Calendar Girls, somebody would write Five Theatre Girls and have the story of us because it would be wonderful

[00:32:17] Kristin: Oh, don't give me any ideas.

[00:32:19] Christine: no, to

[00:32:20] portray.

[00:32:21] The amount of stuff that we've gone through as a group of five people, absolutely different stuff. And in any other circumstance, we would never have met. We would never have known each other and we would never have become good friends that we are.

[00:32:34] Kristin: I interviewed a couple of women from a punk garage band but it was part of a project that was to get women who never expected to be in a punk band or in a band and had never

[00:32:46] picked up instruments . hearing you all speak is so similar because they've gone on to perform on the stage.

[00:32:52] They've now cut a couple of the groups from it, have cut albums and they speak with the same passion about, they love to be on the stage. They love that these personalities came out that they never expected, but they also have made friends that they never expected to meet. And they never would have if it wasn't for the project,

[00:33:10] Unglamorous

[00:33:10] Christine: it girls? Yeah. A punk band girls. Hey, should we go for that one? No, but let's be five theater girls. We're good at that.

[00:33:17] Kristin: Does anybody else have the same experience as Kristin, or maybe a different one in finding maybe life experience, how it's influenced your acting, or that you wish you'd done it sooner?

[00:33:28] Sally: I've noticed that we do pretty much have quite a lot in common. We've either worked in the caring field. We've had that caring feel, and I think that it brings a bit more maturity to situations when you've got people that are working in the caring people that want to do service to others.

[00:33:48] And I always thought that I would've loved to have been an actress when I was really little. I thought it'd be great. And then after that, I think I wanted to be a nun, and then I didn't realize that you couldn't have babies.

[00:34:00] Then I thought, no, that's not a good idea. But I did love working with children and babies and things like that. I've noticed that's what we all have in common, that nurturing. And I think that goes a long way when you're putting on a production because you don't really want an awful lot of self seeking, self centered behavior.

[00:34:23] You especially when a big show, you want people that care about the end thing. The, that nurturing feeling. I felt a burden to do a really good job for James and Madeline and everybody that, and Emily, everyone that had been in and for the National Theatre. I felt that, like that responsibility more than I did, to be honest, more than I did about the excitement of what I was doing.

[00:34:52] it's really important that we do this right. Some of us, we'd not had any experience. at all. And it was [00:35:00] quite frightening in the very first, and then in time, it was more like a desire to do well overcame the fears.

[00:35:10] That's what it felt like to me towards the end. But yeah, I don't necessarily regret, because I think you're where you are supposed to be in life. And, but I do think that's a, if you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you've always got. If you're not prepared to take a risk and have a go and have a...

[00:35:35] a real sort of a strength from your life experiences. If you don't keep your strength from your life experiences, what's the point?

[00:35:44] So I don't have regrets. I certainly wouldn't have said no to any opportunities that came along, but they weren't coming along. So it's meant to be. I'm right where I need to be. I'm 62 and I've trotted off to the National Theatre and like Sandra, who'd have thunk it? Not me. Not in a million years.

[00:36:05] And my kids think it's hilarious. Oh my goodness, they think it's hilarious. That they take the mickey out of me. Honestly, they think I was going to go all lovey darling. And yeah, they find it all very funny, but quietly proud. They were proud.

[00:36:23] Kristin: One of my passions is obviously telling stories of women over 35 and then some but I think it stemmed partially because I became an actor as a second career. And I noticed how often our stories, our being Obviously, even amongst all of us on this screen, a big age range, but they become less and less.

[00:36:44] They become less important. They don't get told. And it's so interesting what you've said about bringing life experience, bringing that nurturing, Christine said, I couldn't have done it in the same way. And Sally, you said, all that nurturing is a commonality. And I think the big shame is.

[00:37:02] Whether it's acting, whether it's our real life stories, so much of what we bring is because of our life experience. And, people that aren't listening to these stories are missing out because the richness comes in all of this experience we've had.

[00:37:17] And to not talk about that or not get the opportunity to channel that somewhere is a real shame to me. That's just my statement. It's not a question.

[00:37:25] Sharon: Kristin, can I just say something? I've just realized that this is about the Odyssey, and I'm looking at the screen now, and we did DCC together, and then quite a lot

[00:37:36] Kristin: DCC being

[00:37:37] Sharon: Doncaster and York Circle.

[00:37:38] yeah, and then quite a lot of us, quite a lot of people from that show, auditioned to be in the Cyclops, and we are the five

[00:37:47] Christine: women

[00:37:47] Sharon: that were chosen, plus Luella, we're missing Luella for the Cyclops

[00:37:52] so I'm looking at the screen now and it's us five and I think when we got told that we've been chosen for the Cyclops, all of us looked at each other and were like, are you joking? This is who they've chosen? in this phenomenal play and they were so right, they chose so well.

[00:38:08] We supported each other, things went wrong, there was some chaos bits, there was some some resentment, so we had to deal with some negative thoughts and just supported each other through that because some people were very upset that they hadn't been chosen, so that was something that we had to deal with.

[00:38:26] But we honestly, all of us, when we looked at the women that had been chosen were like Wow. I don't think we'd have all chosen ourselves or chose that selection. But, I think the Cyclops was our, I'm not, I'm maybe not speaking for everyone, but the time that we realized that we had been chosen, we were actually actors, and we were going to do a play.

[00:38:46] DCC was a massive musical number, and it was really fun, and it was very supported. The Cyclops was different direction, more lines, more responsibility. And we're like, wow, we're going to do a play and a really amazing play. And other places all over the country are doing their episodes of this play.

[00:39:04] And then we're all going to come together and do something remarkable. And I think that faith that Public Acts had in us started to make us realize that actually we should have a bit of faith in ourselves too.

[00:39:14]

[00:39:15] Kristin: And

[00:39:15] that's amazing. Ruth, I haven't heard from you for a while

[00:39:18] I wanted to ask a little bit about that feeling, I know that you've, you've mentioned the joy and like feeling better about life but was that the moment that you felt like an actor?

[00:39:29] Ruth: was a moment that I feel like I'm alive. so this is what life is really about. So it's not just your breathing. Because I think one thing with me is from when I was growing up, no father, no mother, nobody. You didn't know, I didn't know who I am.

[00:39:48] So I just, I always see myself like that, so I just, now, I just say no. I've got family. I've got more than that I didn't have. I've got [00:40:00] father. I've got sisters. I've got brother. This is how I see everyone around me. I remember one of the questions you asked before.

[00:40:09] The girls asked me, I think after check cycle, Mommy, what do you think she's interviewing me. Mommy, would you have done this for your day job? Instead of working for Change Your Life? I said, Mercy, that's an interesting question. Yes, because I feel more confident.

[00:40:29] I can talk. But you can't talk before, Mommy. I said, that's different. She said, and after Cyclops, the same thing again. She came back to me. Mommy, would you want to give up your job and do this? I said, Mercy, I wish I'm rich. She said, what do you mean by you wish I reach? I said because I need to pay the bills.

[00:40:48] So I wish I'm retired. Just I'm jealous with Kristin and Sandra and Sally. I wish I'm retired. Then I know that this is what I want to do. I want to go deep, more into I wish I've known this earlier on. when I watch a movie now, the way I look at the movie when I'm watching is totally different.

[00:41:10] I'm really happy and I'm super proud to be part of this production. Yeah, I just love every moment when I flash back. I love every moment and I just hope if anybody is out there that feel like just give it a go.

[00:41:27] And wherever you are, don't lock yourself up. It's really good to go out. If you don't go out, you don't know what you're missing. Ask questions. Ask for places to go.

[00:41:37] I just love every moment of it. Give me time to really know who I am, what I'm capable of doing, what I can do, and how I can even... impact this into, in my community. Because me doing this a lot, I've got a friend who was like, how can you be coming home nine o'clock from rehearsal?

[00:42:02] From work you go to rehearsal, how can you be coming? But I'm glad she came to watch one of the shows and she said to me it's all worth it. All the rehearsals are worth it. And now one of her daughters is coming to cast now every Saturday. Mommy, I want to do what Grace's mommy's doing, mommy. I want to become an actress, mommy.

[00:42:22] And I, yeah, I was so happy that I can, the young one can see some of this because I just see myself like, if I don't, even my girls, they wouldn't have Just go to school and come back now. But this is my girls. I said, mommy, I wanna do this. Mommy, I wanna do this. It's really nice, I feel happy. Mommy was fun.

[00:42:44] Today, when we go to cast

[00:42:45] Kristin: And they can obviously see, like you said, it's in you. So when you are experiencing that and it's in you,

[00:42:51] Ruth: I think that's

[00:42:51] it. We when we believe that in us, then it just, Bring it out. So it just it's that belief

[00:43:00] Kristin: so Sharon, I want to direct this toward you because I know that the Odyssey was the culmination of this massive project, but it seems like everyone's raring to go, this is not something that's going to end with this at all. What comes next? I

[00:43:17] Sharon: already started. Some of us, apart from Ruth, sorry Ruth, because she's far too young have started on a project with Leeds Theatre, Leeds Playhouse Theatre for performers, over 50. So it's a performance ensemble and we've just started rehearsals for that. That's great. But more excitingly maybe more excitingly.

[00:43:34] exciting, Kristin, is we went to see a Scratch performance, I think it's called, last week in cast and we've decided we are going to write our own sketch show from the 11 people that went to London and just try and share our experiences because it's absolutely hilarious. The story I'd just like to quickly share because it was the funniest one of the entire performance.

[00:43:58] The entire 10 days was on our first performance. The lights went down, we were all massively overwhelmed. It was just absolutely, there's no feeling compared to it. And myself and Sally and one of our male performers, Mike. So Mike was in between me and Sally and he just put his arms out and he. Put his arms around us and he gave us a good squeeze, but I'm obviously a lot taller than Sally.

[00:44:20] So he put his arm on Sally's shoulder, but he just grabbed my boob and gave it a good old shake. And then the lights went up and I just looked at his mortified face and said, That's not my shoulder, Mike. But that joke, the women were just like, is it just Sharon that's going to have a grab, or do we all get a turn?

[00:44:39] Or just that humour between such a tight group. Because it could have, in any other situation, that wouldn't have been funny. But it was just our relationship made that absolutely hilarious. There was no intent. Mike's wonderful, we're very close. But the look on his face. I just went, that's not my shoulder, Mike.

[00:44:59] And he's I [00:45:00] know. He just was destroyed. So we all could have a real good laugh about that. And we still do now. . So there was lots of funny moments like that, that I think we would be, I think it would be great for us to put in a sketch. The only problem is they may only be funny to us.

[00:45:14] The audience might not understand them, but we're going to have a go.

[00:45:18]

[00:45:18] Kristin: When you said that about the sketches, both my arms shot up in the air with joy.

[00:45:22] with just pure joy at hearing that this is your plan because I think it's amazing. And I think it's just another testimony to the fact that we never have to stop being creative and that throughout our lives, no matter what stage we're in, you can find something new.

[00:45:37] And obviously this project has given you all so many different things, friendship new experiences, joy of being on the stage and now writing about it as well.

[00:45:49] Sharon: And it doesn't, Kristin, it will never stop because there's so many of us that have started this journey together. We have, people that we've performed with are directors in other local theatre companies, so we're ready to go and see them in plays. People are acting all over in lots of different things.

[00:46:04] And because we all know each other, those opportunities are presenting, and we're so heavily supported by cast. So anything that comes our way they're happy to promote for us. And I didn't even start my working career until I was 40, and the last 10 years have been a challenge. I honestly, my life right now is not a challenge.

[00:46:23] It really isn't and it's quite unusual for me to be able to say that. We just, there's so much opportunity. It's not, it's never going to stop. It can't possibly stop because it's just going to roll. We're going to be 95 and doing an over 90s performance outside cast because it'll have been closed down because of funding.

[00:46:40] But

[00:46:40] Kristin: Oh, I hate that you even had to say that.

[00:46:42] Sharon: But

[00:46:42] we'll It can't possi it's not going to stop. It can't.

[00:46:45] Kristin: Christine is itching

[00:46:46] to say

[00:46:46] something.

[00:46:48] Christine: I've got to say that don't worry about cast being closed down because there's no funding. We will be keeping it open because we're going to be writing, we're going to be doing all sorts of stuff and we're going to be the ones that will be keeping it open. They'll probably change it from the word cast to five theatre girls.

[00:47:04] That's what they'll be calling it. It'll be brilliant. It'll be absolutely brilliant.

[00:47:08] Kristin: You, you are all brilliant and I love that you've had this opportunity inadvertently. Everybody's almost given me a little quote. Whether it was from something that they live by or something, in life or something from one of the plays. But I want to make sure I didn't miss anybody that really wanted to give me a quote today.

[00:47:25] Sharon: My quote would be, it's not always a shoulder. Sometimes it's a breast.

[00:47:31] Kristin: Sometimes it's just your

[00:47:32] Sharon: Sometimes it's just a boob. Sometimes you have to double pad. If you're laughing a lot, you just do. ?

[00:47:38] Christine: earlier on, when I was talking about the nursing giving me experience. with patients, so therefore it helps a lot in the theatre. I just remember one small incident where I was in a play in London, doing just a very small play, and I was being a teacher in a classroom.

[00:48:00] And afterwards, a professional actor came up to me and he said to me, he said, it was great. He said, it was lovely. But he said, I can tell you now, I have never ever seen anybody play a school teacher so well. You are absolutely brilliant. And I thought to myself that's only because I'd been doing a lot of lecturing in nursing and that's why, what I was saying about the experience that you bring with you.

[00:48:21] From nursing, that's what I'd been doing. I'd been doing some lecturing at a university for the hospital. And that just shows you, it's your other experiences in life that you can bring to the theatre and you actually make yourself an actor, a proper actor,

[00:48:35] Kristin: and I would even translate that for everybody who's listening who doesn't want to be an actor , I think these experiences in our lives lead to They just make us better at everything. I don't mean we're great at everything, because I think so often what I talk about is change.

[00:48:50] Whatever you did, it leads to you being better at the next thing. It leads to possibility. And maybe, one thing doesn't have anything to do with the other. But like you said, giving a lecture as a nurse made you a better actor because you could imagine what it was like to be a teacher.

[00:49:04] It's all life experience. And I do think. From career to career or life change to life change. We can bring all of those experiences to just make the next thing a little bit more rich.

[00:49:14] Christine: Yeah. I think that people, I think he said to me at the time, you played that with real feeling. And I thought I didn't, I played it with reality because that's what I do. So it, it may have been real feeling to him as if I'd learned to. act and do that. But in fact, it wasn't. It was a real life value.

[00:49:31] It was something that I'd been doing. So it's just a point.

[00:49:35] Kristin: Yeah. And I think it's an important one because there is a real fear of change, but the one thing I've noticed throughout my life, no matter where I've lived, I've lived in different cities, countries, no matter the jobs I've been in, it's still me. I'm just doing, or I'm somewhere else, but I'm still the same person and I'm learning as I go.

[00:49:54] And I hope, like you said about, the theater girls at 90 or doing things until you're 95 or whatever [00:50:00] it is. I hope I'm learning every single step of the way and challenging myself. And I really appreciate chatting with all of you who are clearly doing that.

[00:50:09] Sharon: Thank you. We are.

[00:50:10] Kristin: Thank you all.

[00:50:11] Sharon: are. Oh,

[00:50:12] Christine: Thank you

[00:50:12] Kristin: I went, I had. I have to say, thank you all so much for joining me and you've inspired me. Keep doing what you're doing and I can't wait to get the opportunity to actually see you doing it.

[00:50:22] Sharon: Thanks a lot, Kristin. Bye.

[00:50:24] Christine: Bye.

[00:50:24] Kristin: care. Bye.

[00:50:25] Sally: Bye

[00:50:26] Kristin: bye.